My PVCs suddenly stopped???

[NJJerry]

2 years ago I suddenly developed PVCs, double beats about 3-4 per minute. I saw several drs and was told the condition was benign and not to worry.  They have never gone away over 2 years and are more of an annoyance when trying to sleep than anything else.

I just travelled for 2 weeks to India, china, and Japan for work and developed extreme diarrhea.  In China they gave me some Berberine Hydrochloride pills that they said would help (they did).  Upon my return I went to my Dr. as a precaution and he prescribed 3 days of Cipro just to make sure any bacteria, parasites, etc. were killed - but my diarrhea seemed to have stopped.

OK so here is the wierd stuff.  My PVCs are gone.  Was it the Berberine? The Cipro? The heavy drinking over 2 weeks in Asia? I just noticed they stopped so not sure when it actually happened (before Cipro or after).

Any thoughts? Could I have had a low grade infection for 2 years causing the PVCs? Any other theories?

I hope they dont return once Cipro is done but right now I am pleasantly confused.  Would like some clarity or thoughts if you have any.

Thanks,

Jerry

[Healthyself2]

After my heart attack 7 years ago, I developed PVCs.  I had them when I started taking a walk.  I had them if I had a beer.  I had them if I got a bit excited about something.  I had them on my cardiologist's treadmill.  I learned to ignore them as I had larger problems.

7 years later my heart is steady as a rock.  I can drink.  I can climb 2000 feet with a 100% occluded RCA and advanced three vessel CAD, as I did today.  I can get excited!  My heart just never misses a beat.  It's as steady as an old chevy engine.

The bottom line is that the heart is a dynamic structure and it is in a constant state of change.  If it's giving you a problem one year, give it some time and treat yourself well, and perhaps in a year or so it will stabilize itself.

I would say that daily moderate long duration mildly aerobic exercise, stress reduction, vitamins supplements, and time may solve many of these problems.

[NJJerry]

I think Berberine is in Goldenseal.  The stuff I have is an OTC drug called Berberine HCL.  I am not sure if the Goldenseal is as potent or same.

[NJJerry]

I did not have any of the symptoms you described with my PVCs.  The only bad sympton is trouble falling asleep at times.

I had some strange sushi in Japan, but that's about it.  Is there a connection there?



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Just wondering if you had any upper esophagus discomfort, heartburn, or bloating type feeling for the last two years before or since the onset of your PVCs?) and if so, have you noticed a reduction of those symptoms since the berberine or cipro?

And one last question, did you consume a lot of shellfish while in Asia?

[NJJerry]

I stopped taking it since I ran out and am trying to get some more but haven't been able to find the exact type I had. The PVCs have come back to the way they were for the last couple weeks.  Once I get the Berberine HCL I will try to figure out what dose has the desired effect.

[manyana]

hi there - just wondering if you are having the same success with the berberine and pacs/pvcs as i think i will try some if you are
take care
lynne

[upbeat63]

Just wondering if you had any upper esophagus discomfort, heartburn, or bloating type feeling for the last two years before or since the onset of your PVCs?) and if so, have you noticed a reduction of those symptoms since the berberine or cipro?  

And one last question, did you consume a lot of shellfish while in Asia?

[madgeOwens]

SO Berberine =goldenseal? In the natural herbs aisle?

I wonder if you can take that while taking Inderol?

Did you get symptoms with your pvc's? IE light headed, sob, chest pressure?

[Barbarella]

Jerry,

If you go to Google there is a link about the effects of Berberine on the heart and arrhythmia.  I would have copied/pasted it for you, but am not sure if we are allowed to do that.

[NJJerry]

So 7 days after my last Berberine HCL pill my PVCs came back.  I was getting 3-5 per minute consistently for a few hours.  I took a Berberine HCL pill and after a couple hours I again have no PVCs.

Now I need to figure out how long the effect lasts from one pill and how safe this will be to take these pills regularly.

The amount I used is identified on the box as .1g (100 Mg).  Hopefully the effect lasts a few days.  If anyone is interested in the progress let me know.

Again, my PVCs are very mild and do not cause shortness of breath, etc..  they are single PVCs and never raise my pulse.

Seems like someone in the Medical field should be studying this!

[tickertock]

I think it's the Berberine that suppresses the PVCs. I think I read online there is some evidence that it can reduce PVCs and other ventricular arrhythmias.

I know I stated a few comments back that I'm against Chinese herbal treatments and also that I know some doctors that are against it also. I also know some doctors that strongly believe in it and I support it to a certain extent but only when it's done by doctors that have researched extensively and specializes in it. I think you're right, this should definitely be looked into.

[seang]

I just had a 3-4 skip beat as I was sitting at my computer and I jumped up and soon as you know it gone and back to normal. I grabbed my blood pressure and it read 140/90 then 4 mins later after I chilled out it was 130/70 .

I dont like Heart palpations and its good to now that I am not alone. Are any of you part of a group of PVC suffers , Rigth now I woudl like to join a club like that.

I dont have them to often but when I do it seems like they are huge heart wammers , very uncomfortable.

[Healthyself2]

I googled with "Berberine Hydrochloride Arrhythmia"

It looks like your on to something.  There are a few studies which have shown it to be an anti-arrhythmic in animals.

It looks like it's a potent anti-fungal also.  I believe that many of the big coming diseases are fungal such as the recent fungal eye disease.

[fearfactor]

I will say that the thing that helped my palpitations the MOST was regular exercise.  Last summer, I began a walking program that I followed 5 or 6 days a week.  My PACs and PVCs nearly disappeared.  Unfortunately, I relapsed when I went on vacation and quit exercising, started eating "bad for you" foods and drinking WAY too much caffeine.  I got afraid to exercise and have never started back consistently.  I'm 29 weeks pregnant and plan to start my exercise program back as soon as I've taken the bar exam in 5 weeks (I'm too busy studying right now) and continue it after the birth of my child.  Good luck, everyone!

[NJJerry]

My PVCs were not something brought on by anything like stress, exercise, etc...  They were extra beats that I had all day long.  Never 2 together.  They caused no problems except when tryin to sleep I might anticipate the next one and have trouble falling asleep.  I had 1 PVC every 20-30 seconds and it caused no issues.  I run 4 miles 3-4 times per week and work out with a trainer 2-3 times per week.

I know some people's PVCs come on in waves and cause issues but mine were just always there and not noticeable unless i laid down or tried to find them.  IE my running heart monitor would show the 2 quick beats a couple times/minute.  

I guess my feeling is something caused them to spontaneously start 2 years ago and something caused them to stop last week. Seems like most doctors don't really care about the "WHY's" and are just happy to say they are harmless and that we don't why. But based on my opinion, there are reasons why things happen.

[NJJerry]

That's exactly my plan. Last Berberine pill was on Thursday of last week.   My last Cipro was this AM. So far so good.
Let's see what happens.

I'll be a human guinea pig!

[ihatepvc's]

Maybe if the pvc's do come back, you can try the berberine again and if they go away for the second time you can probably assume it helps. Let us know! From what I read, it sounds pretty safe if taken at low levels.

[pbanders]

Here's what I've learned about from my experience with PVC's. They come, they go. Nobody (including the doctors) knows why. Some people swear by certain drugs, for others, the same drugs do nothing. Some people swear their PVC's are brought on by food, alcohol, caffeine, etc. For others, the very same factors have no effect.

But the best thing I've learned about PVC's is to live with them when I have them, not let them prevent me from what I want to do, or rule my life. When I don't have them, I enjoy every moment I can and accept that it's going to be temporary. Oh, and hope that despite their being considered to be begnin, I live in the hope that doctors will devote attention to understanding the causes of PVC,s and one day devise a therapy that helps reduce or eliminate them for us sufferers.

[NJJerry]

Thanks for all the notes.  Just to be clear I am not into Chinese Herbal therapy.  I was just sick in China and my colleagues gave me some pills that they say everyone takes when they travel and get stomach problems - ie parasites, bacteria, ...  I researched it online and it is not a dangerous substance but seems also to be used in Latin America for the same treatment.  The toxicity mentioned is due to high doeses of intravenous treatment.

However, what I found interesting was the notes in the attached link on the coronary effects.  I have NO IDEA if this had any effect on my PVCs but I had them constantly for 2 years without any stop.  These were minor, benign, and I could only notice them at night or when I took my pulse.

They have now been gone for at least 3 days now.  


http://www.thorne.com/altmedrev/fulltext/berb.html

"The effects of berberine on 100 individuals with ventricular tachyarrhythmias observed with 24 to 48 hour ambulatory monitoring has also been reported. The results indicate 62% of patients had 50% or greater, and 38% of patients had 90% or greater suppression of ventricular premature contractions (VPC). No severe side effects were observed; however, mild gastro-enterologic symptoms were reported by some patients.42 "

"Several mechanisms have been proposed to explain the observed effects of berberine. Zhou observed berberine works as a Ca2+ channel agonist,43 while Hua and Wang suggest the antiarrhythmic action of berberine might be due to its potassium channel blocking effects.44 Experiments on the rat fundus indicate berberine inhibits the entry of extracellular calcium into the cell.45 Evidence also suggests berberine, by reducing tyrosine hydroxylase activity, has an inhibitory effect on catecholamine biosynthesis.46"

[tickertock]

Being an on and off sufferer of PVCs, thankfully mostly off for the last 14-15 years. From what I gather they are those that develop PVCs that come and go, those that remain about the same and get less symptomatic and those that same to experience a dramatic increase in PVCs with age , others same to have a decrease with age, so far it sames like I'm one those that experience a decrease with age, as in 4 years my PVCs are few and far between going from 1000s daily to practically zero overnight, just a few odd thumps now and then.

I think the general agreement within the medical community that with a normal cardiac evalutaion PVCs pose little to no risk regardless of frequency or change in sensation.Apparently the main problem is being aware of them.I personally (my opinion only) and I know several doctors that are very opposed to Chinese herbal therapy, you have to be very aware of what you are taken.

[Fran71]

Jerry that's great!!! PVCs can come for no reason but they also leave us just as suddenly. Great story!

Gary, good luck with your tests!!! PVCs are usually benign so it's very very likely yours are too. Tests are taken as a precaution. Once you have the results you'll feel great knowing you're OK. Keep us posted.

Fran

[Gary-Fisher]

i wish my pvc's would go stop and go away. :(

hopefully my holter and my upcoming stress test will show they are benign.

i always wonder tho..what if they arent benign? is that a sign of heart disease or somethin?

[mrbh]

Toxicology report from the Nation Institutes of Health (NIH).

http://ntp-server.niehs.nih.gov/index.cfm?objectid=03DF056E-FBF9-C136-80EFBE7CA947E684

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Berberine is a component of Goldenseal, a toxic herb. Be sure to read the line about V-TACH from administration of this stuff.

Bad!

[oneil420]

I have taken cipro since my palps started(crohns disease), I did feel better but still had the occassional palp but everyone is different. My palps come and go i can go weeks without noticing one then bam get 1or 2 a minute for hours.But it doednt suprise me since they first started out of the blue. Keep us updated and hope you can finally have some relief..

[NJJerry]

Thanks.

Very strange.  I could never take my pulse for more than 30 seconds without getting the double beat and now they are gone.  I hope that they don't return but we shall see.  I'm wondering if they will return once the Penicillin is stopped and its effect wears off.  I'll let you know.  I haven't taken an antibiotic since the PVCs started 2 years ago so it is the most likely change.

The Berberine HCL is a substance that is supposed to act on parasites, fungus, etc... and is used to cure diahrrea caused by such as in Montezumas revenge type afflictions.  It is mainly a Chinese medication and was given to me by my Chinese colleagues.