PVC's and SCD/Vfib

[blan3556]

I have PVC's for years.I had an echo, holtor, and EKG 4 years ago.The echo showed mild regurg, the ekg normaland the holtor showed PVC's with sinus tach noted to probably be precepitated by excercise.I am a 35 year old female ingood health with no immediate family history of problems except an aunt with a pacemaker.This time my PVC's are coming in short runs or bursts.It doesn't matter what I am doing,I will get a run of fast beats with what seems like constant skipping.It will last about 5-8 minutes then stop on its own.  I can walk around during this so I am not dizzy although maybe get a little short of breath(I am an anxious person).  I have had maybe one episode a day for the last week.  Questions:1.  Is the echo and test I had 4 years earlier still good and that my heart is structurally normal and I have nothing to worry about?  Should I run and get the test all over again.Is there any chance of these beats turning into vfib, vtach, or am I at risk for sudden cardiac death at all?3.  Now that the PVC's are coming in these 5-8 minute bursts with a fast rate should I be more concerned with it turning into a fatal arrythmia?  Is this different type of fast run a problem?
4.  When should a person become concerned with these beats?  A certain amount of time or a certain amount of beats when I should run to the er?5.  Is there any lifestyle limitations are any suggestions to help with these beats.6.  My biggest fear in SCD or that these beats will start and never stop or turn into a deadly arrythmia, can you please give me some sound reassurance of this not happeneing?

[Forum-M.D.-MJM]

Hello,

1. Is the echo and test I had 4 years earlier still good and that my heart is structurally normal and I have nothing to worry about? Should I run and get the test all over again.

The best thing to do is see your doctor and see if they want to repeat them.  I would probably repeat them because it sounds like you need some reassurance.

Is there any chance of these beats turning into vfib, vtach, or am I at risk for sudden cardiac death at all?

There is always a slight chance but everyone has that chance.  We still aren't good at predicting who the high risk people and there are so few of them, it will be a difficult question.  Your risk of having normal heart PVCs degenerate into a dangerous arrhythmia is very low.

3. Now that the PVC's are coming in these 5-8 minute bursts with a fast rate should I be more concerned with it turning into a fatal arrythmia? Is this different type of fast run a problem?

It sounds like a holter or event monitor is indicated to answer these questions.

4. When should a person become concerned with these beats? A certain amount of time or a certain amount of beats when I should run to the er?

Call your doctor and have an EKG, holter, or event monitor to determine what is causing your symptoms.  If you have a sustained fast rhythm and it hasn't been proven to be panic attacks or previously diagnosed type of safe tachycardia, it is appropriate to be evaluated.  It sounds like you need to see your doctor to evaluate these symptoms.  Your questions suggest that you have a significant fear of dying and you cannot live a normal life until you are convinced you aren't goign to dye.

5. Is there any lifestyle limitations are any suggestions to help with these beats.

If you find a trigger like stress, caffeine, sleep deprivation, etc, I would change that, otherwise, no.  There is no specific limitation.
6. My biggest fear in SCD or that these beats will start and never stop or turn into a deadly arrythmia, can you please give me some sound reassurance of this not happeneing?

I think you need to see your doctor, have some tests run so you can be reassured that there isn't a problem.  I don't have the information to do that -- I would need to see the echo's, EKG, holter, etc.

I hope this helps and you make peace with this soon.  Thanks for posting.

[oneil420]

Ive had pvcs for over 5 years now and they come and go as they please and increase and decrease in quantity with no real "triggers" other then lack of sleep. I can tell you that the doc is going to say "with a normal cardiac work up and a normally structured heart your pvcs pose no threat to your mortality" I was told by my cardio i have no limitations with my pvcs, sex, exercise even caffiene isnt off limits. Yes these activities may create or bring on more pvcs but pvs dont effect everyone the same.. The only thing i can tell you that may help is your still alive! Bottom line after all those skipped bbeats you have had, all the anxiety and worry about this and  yet your heart still beats and you where able to post on this forum. Why because pvcs are not fatal or you would be dead as would i and about 94% of this forum. I know its not that easy trust me i suffered for years but you have to understand current medical science just doesnt understand anything about pvcs, they dont! they have mastered the structure and the plumbing but the electrical is just to complicated. Even other arrtythmias like svt,psvt,af,vt in patients with normal workups and structure are usually givin the same treatment bettablockers. I just dont want you out there in internet land to worry so much about death you forget to live. Dont worry about what might happen, worry about what does happen and if pvcs are the only thing thats happens to you, consider yourself lucky because it can be alot worse. ALOT worse. HOpe you get the answers you need. peace oneil

"Its better to die once then fear death a thousand times" Julias Ceaser

[blan3556]

Thanks for trying to help, but I am really having problems right now.  Instead of the doctor reassuring me I feel like they said..oh there is a problem and you are at risk so go get checked out, so it scared me.  I am worried that my heart will go into a fatal rhythm.  I am worried these palps will start and not stop.  I just ned some reassurance is all.  I get them in runs...that last like 2-8 minutes sometimes more, one after another...does anybody else have that?

[Forum-M.D.-MJM]

Blan,
The probability that something is wrong is very low, but we can never assure that nothing will happen, especially without being able to review any of your previous studies.  I can tell you that PVCs with a structurally normal heart are considered very low risk and with no need for intervention.  You last studies were 4 years ago and you are describing a change in your symptoms.  A reassesment is very reasonable at this point, although it will likely confirm the previous findings.  I hope you understand that we cannot give certain medical advice without being able to review relevant studies.  Good luck.

[tickertock]

I know just how you feel, I suffered with PVcs basically all my life , now 42, but it was  when I was 27 back in early 1992 that I had a bad episode of prolonged PVCs, it started out with what felt like a series of PVCs then BAM my heartrate took off beating at 170 bpm with PVCs occuring every few seconds with PVCs at that rate, the rate was from fright, I went directly to my doctor/cardio who is also a good friend of mine, he did an EKG right there in his office, he could plainly see the PVCs occuring at this rate. he prescribed inderal 10mg 3 x times daily, i took it before but after seeing an Ep back 87 for the same problem was told I could stop it. The rate soon returned to normal after taking the inderal but the PVCs remained for about 2 weeks, that was my  first prolonged episode, it happened again 1997, of course I always had days when I would feel a few, then in 2001 I had every feeling you could think about with PVCs, they were all caught on EKG and exercise test which actually turned out good with good exercise tolerance despite having a few PVCs during the test. I had bigeminy , trigeminy you name it I had it, lasted about 5 months non stop of course some days would be better than others( was on the verge of pursuing a ablation when they subsided). I still get the odd the one now and then, I take atenolol, cozaar & HCTZ for mild HTN which is totally controlled. It's been 5 years thank goodness since my last prolonged bout of PVCs, the longest it's been since I had them so I feel good about that, of course occasionally I'll have a day or 2 that I wonder if they are going to return, usually if I get more than 10 in a day, I'll wonder that.

One thing I've learned is that persons that have a particular arrhythmia ie PVCs will usually have same arrhythmia repeatedly and it rarely if ever progresses to anything more significant though if symptoms change it is always good to get checked again. Good luck. Hope u feel better soon.

[808dude]

Hi.  It sounds like you are having a hard time with your PVCs right now.  I'm sorry to hear that.  I know what you are going through.  I've had PVCs for about 4 years now and am currently in a 9 month stretch of constant PVCs.  By constant I mean between 3-7 PVC every minute which is like 4000-10000 a day!  I'm a 30 yr old male, 150lbs, athletic.  I've had EKGs, 24 hr holter, event monitor, and an echo done since my first symptoms years ago.  And like many here, I've heard the same thing mentioned.. PVCs are benign in a structually normal heart.  I still keep regular visits with my cardiologist just a reassurance to myself.  

Regarding the 2-8 minute runs that you have, I get those also.  In my case, I guess its more like a period of time where i feel them more, because I'm actually getting them constantly.  But like, when I lie down, or sit motionless.. that's when I feel them most.  When I'm moving around or actively doing something, I don't notice them.  But, if I took the time to stop and check, sure enough.. the PVCs are still there..

It took me a while to get used to PVCs and some days are worse than others, but if you need the assurance from a doctor again, I say get it.  It's your health, be mindful of it.  BUT, there is going to have to be a point where you start to believe what the doctors tell you.  An anxious and stressed out mind can cause all kinds of health problems too.  

Good luck!

[blan3556]

I understand what all of you are saying.  But each time I get a bout of PVC's they seem to hit differently, do I run and get the tests everytime?  I am getting these runs of like 3-8 minutes long...maybe the fast rate is caused by fear I don't know.  But I am sitting here thinking...will I even make it to the doctors to get tests?  When should I run to the hospital?  When I big hypochondriac like me hears "you may need more tests"  my mind says "see I told you that you were in trouble, you won't even make it to the doctors" and I am a mother of 6 kids who HAS to function!  I have seen a therapist, no help.  I have tried antidepressants...no help.  I am fine when not having palps, but when they come back I am out, and when a doctor says...you need more test I am in panic mode.  I actually went on Thursday last week and had a echo (the guy that took it said "I am no doctor but looks fine") I had a EKG and that guy said looks fine but a little sinus arrythmia(he wasn't the doc either, what is sinus arrythmia? he said it was fine)  I even had a PVC while having the echo and the student who had taken over said (I hope you don't have too many of those"  I freaked!  I also had a 24 hour and turned it in on Friday so no word there.  Would they have said something already if there was a danger?  I am only seeing my general prac for my results on Friday, can she handle this?  I have no insurance so I am going to a free clinic for all of this.  I did not have one of those prolongd episodes while wearing the holtor of course so does that make it all no good?  It is a free clinic so I can't just go in and say I need an event monitor...they would probably laugh.  I have no money as I am a nursing student with 6 kids so a cardiologist is out.  I need some peace of mind.  Could my echo have changed to dangerous in the last 4 years?  Is PVC's dangerous at all?

[tickertock]

WOW!! A mother of 6, I'm 42 and a father of 2 sons one nearly 21 and the other nearly 18, just thinking about them and what they might be up to will give me a PVC :-). On the other hand a trainee technician has no business whatsoever commenting during a procedure , as they are often inexperienced and have no business commenting to patient, only the the patient's doctor should advise  them of their report or unless they are instructed by the doctor to do otherwise, usually only the doctor's nurse or assistant will just call to say the test are normal or abnormal depending. hang in chances are you'll be just fine.

[808dude]

"Is PVCs dangerous at all?"

To quote the doctor that answered above these commets:

"Your risk of having normal heart PVCs degenerate into a dangerous arrhythmia is very low."

I try to think of it like.. there is always a risk of something.  Like, there is a chance I could get stuck by lightning if I go outside.  There is a chance I could get into a car accident if I drive.  Heck, there is a chance I could win the lottery!  :) Now, I'm no statistician but I'm sure the chance of all of these happening are pretty low relative to the actually happening.  But, if I let myself worry and contemplate on these things, it would be harder for me to enjoy life and make it through the day..  

Take care!

[terps1972]

Sorry to hear you're having such a hard time with your situation. I agree with what was said earlier about a technician not having any business commenting on the test as it's being performed. Don't let their stupidity upset you any more than you already are. As far as your heart is concerned, the chances of everything being just fine are so much higher than it not being fine. (almost everyone experiences PVCs- but only us lucky ones feel them!) Of course, anything could happen to any of us at any time. And I'm not just talking heart related. So please just try to trust what your Docs are telling you and get on with life. Sounds like you're getting yourself worked up and anxious which can just exacerbate things.

I have struggled with crazy flutters, arrhythmias, PVCs, PACs, SVT, IST, VTAC for years. Had all the tests. Thought my life was over- and acted as if it was. Then I got a reality check. I was diagnosed with a rare form of cancer. The PVCs, etc. were a walk in the park compared to this roller coaster ride. This is not meant to be a sob story or to minimize your feelings. I still struggle with cardiac symptoms today- that's why I still visit this site. Just please know that there are things in life that deserve all your attention and energy. PVCs just isn't one of them.

[blan3556]

I just wanted you all to know that your words are very helpful and reassuring.  All of you are right, I need to calm down.  I guess I need some tips on how to handle these when they are hitting in a run.  When I get a run I think this is it...I am a goner and what will God think of me?  Then like you said...what if I had cancer or something?  I am so sorry about your cancer diagnosis.  You seem like a nice person just to take the time to help reassure a complete stranger and I will pray for you.  I guess I need to count my blessings instead of counting my sorrows.  I just need some coping techniques and lots of reassurance.

[PikaPika88]

May be you left your heart events for too long un-treated or un-diagnosed.  It affected your body function, cells growing etc. (the cell should grow it didn't grow and the one shouldn't grow and it grows).  Like my heart now, it should beat but it didn't beat that speed and it shouldn't beat that fast then it zooms like an express train!

I begged and begged my cardio try to find and fix mine problems and he kept saying it wasn't anything wrong.  All looks fine and all are anxiety!   All reports turn out what ever possibility he said is "artefact".  Who ever call him and ask my situation that he said "anxiety, give her reassurance!"  As ER reported.  

Now I ended up need infusion, need a bag of medications, need to ***** fingers everyday for my blood glucose.......  As my mum said, anxiety wouldn't cause enlarge heart, won't cause valves damaged, won't cause heart wall motion impair, won't cause infarction and definitely won't cause abnormal structure heart!  How could I trust him anymore?  Second opinion Dr could be the tunnel of light!  Make sure it is not too late!  

[netrox]

I read one of the ECG books showing actual ECG charts.

PVC rarely causes sudden cardiac arrests but it did show one chart when a sudden cardiac arrest was triggered by just one PAC beat. It didn't just went into v-fib - it just went asystole (meaning no activity at all - it just stopped beating).

Obviously, everyone had PVC's or PAC's but the risk seems so low that we shouldn't worry too much.

I've always thought that a person would experience abnormal beats before finally going into v-fib/arrest but apparently, sometimes the heart just stops beating even without experiecning PVCs, SVT, PACs, etc before the arrest. Those kind of sudden cardiac arrests are very rare, thankfully.

Apparently, there's no way to predict if your PVCs/PACs will trigger sudden cardiac arrest just like we have no way to predict who will have a sudden cardiac arrest in people who have normal hearts.

[pjburr]

I'm not sure what I have. My heart feels like a fish out of water. As I feel my pulse during these palpatations it seems to stop beating then goes into a fast rythem then back to normal. I find myself having to take a deep breath and cough and that sometimes tends to reset it. It comes in spurts too. I could be fine for a couple of months then BAM! it comes on and last for a month or so. They are only a few seconds long and come on anytime. I could be sitting, laying down or during activity. There has been a very few times when they would come on and keep reacurring over and over again within seconds. I notice my chest feels tight before hand and a little uncomfortable, sometimes a belching gas feeling. I've noticed that I get very tired after having them as well. During ECG's on my panic trips to the hospital I noticed that my heart beat seems to slow down and speed up during rest while just sitting there, but they seem to think its normal. It first started at about 18 years of age and occurs more now than it did then. I'm now 29 years old now. I know I do suffer from anxiety not as bad as it was when I was younger. I have a lot more control over that now. I've had the holter monitor, the event monitor, stress test, echo and everything comes back normal. all though there was an EGC that printed abnormal, but my doctor and the ER doctor said he could see nothing wrong with it. I do worry because they never caught it on paper to see what it exactly is. I'm looking into buying my own event monitor so I can find out what this could be. Is there anyone else who experiences this same type of heart rythems? I wonder If my heart is being damaged by these rythems more and more everytime. Do you think so? I fear death to a degree. Right now I fear it. Later on in life when my work is done I will welcome it. Until then I hope she keeps beating. Thanks.

[joel c]

i have been suffering from 30-50(average) singular pvc beats per day for 7 days now. I've already spent one long night in emergency hooked up to the EKG. the doc took blood and examined my strip for 4 hours, said he found no couples, i was relieved. did a blood work as i said and found normal levels. sent me home. that was day 4. this is now day 7. they happen almost all day. with small pauses of much needed relief. i am a healthy 28 year old man. construction worker. don't smoke, or drink. my real concern is these pvc beats are cause by, hyperactive ventricle, is what the doc said. they are always at least 1 beat separation but i have felt clusters of 3, within 5 or 7 normal beats. I've felt these single beats before in my life but never as this. so frequent. to be honest i'm scared to my wits end about it. i still smile and go to work, but I'm very anxious.

what are the treatments, or diagnosis for pvc, as mine. I've mostly only heard of people with attacks 3-10 minutes in length, all with elevated heart rate. mine only occur when my heart rate is at sitting or walking. and it doesn't seem to trigger fast rhythm. only a longer than normal pause, which takes my breath away, followed by a good thump in my chest. then returning to normal. but all completely random of course.

is this something i will probably have to live with the rest of my life now? or can i expect these to subside as i feel healthy otherwise.

thanks for your thoughts, i know i am scattered, i have no family doctor and the walk-in Docs just let the door hit me on the ***  when i leave screaming 'Next!'

[Trakar]

I am experiencing the same exact symptoms. My PVC's started around 4 weeks ago. Did the ER thing, EKG and blood work. EKG did show I was having PVC's, blood work was fine, chest xray normal. My heart rate is normal. As you had described, my heart beats the same way. It's not a fast beating PVC; it is slow as you described, also takes my breath away, and is very unsettling as I wonder if sometimes if I will wake up in the morning. I was put on a beta blocker that has not helped. It did however bring my blood pressure down. It wasn't that high to begin with 140/88. Now it's running 117/79. I do go see a cardiologist on the 2nd of May. I want some answers as this is not normal, and I cannot live the rest of my life like this. I will not allow the Dr. to tell me it's just anxiety.