baraclude and vitamin D

[BeachTiePurist]

Has anyone tried taking anywhere from 1000IU to 4000IU of vitamin D while on Baraclude or any other antiviral?  Vitamin D has been getting alot of press in the media about how the hormone boosts the immune system to fight of viral infection.  These news stories are related to combating the seasonal flu.  However, there are studies showing is helps the body fight off viruses in general.  First, I found studies showing those with severe liver disease, cirrhosis, having low level of vitamin D.


This study came out in June 2009, about alcoholics, hep b, and hep c patients.
http://www.wjgnet.com/1007-9327/15/3516.asp

"The study was performed on 72 Indian patients with cirrhosis (63 male, 9 female; aged < 50 years). Etiology of cirrhosis was alcoholism (n = 37), hepatitis B (n = 25) and hepatitis C (n = 10)."
"Vitamin D deficiency was highly prevalent (92%)"


This is backed by another study, out in Dec 2009.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19960254?itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum&ordinalpos=1

"Of patients, 109/118 (92.4%) had some degree of vitamin D deficiency"


So that's 92% of 190 patients across two studies from opposite ends of the world with a variety of liver disease.  In the second study it shows a correlation between the severity of liver disease (cirrhosis) and vitamin D deficiency.  

Since our immune system is dependent on vitamin D, which we need a strong one to fight off hbv, doesn't this suggest we should take this?  I looked for studies, but alot of this research seems new.  However there was a recent study related to Hep C, where patients were given 1000IU to 4000IU of vitamin D.

From Nov. 2009,
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/711902

A rapid virologic response was seen at week 4 in 44% of the vitamin D group and in 18% of the control group. At week 12, Dr. Abu-Mouch told Medscape Gastroenterology, 96% of the vitamin D group (26 of 27 patients) were HCV RNA-negative, as assessed by reverse-transcriptase polymerase chain reaction, as was 48% of the control group (15 of 31 patients), which was a significant difference (P < .001), he said.

That's also a positive for vitamin D and liver disease, but I couldn't find any studies related to HBV, other than ones showing similar deficiency correlated with increased likelihood towards cirrhosis and liver cancer.  So I was wondering if any of you had any experience with vitamin D, with or without antiviral medication, such as side effects from a possible interaction, or undetectable viral load.

[kinetix1208]

Thanks Stef for giving us a lot of information, we are praying for good results on your GcMAF Therapy.

[stef2011]

Are you still taking vitamin D supplement?
yes definitely;i stopped them only from sept 2010 to jan 2011 and had a stop in fibrosis reduction, higher alt and higher fatty liver, so definitely vitamin d is a member of the good vitamins/antioxidants

Can you tell us what brand of vitamin D3 that most likely you would recommend?
any brand is ok as long as pure and reliable source;i use an italian brand, tun bed and so,e sun and used also puritans pride but i dont know how good is the last one

vit D hiher than 40ng/ml is also necessary for gcmaf to work, vitamin d3 is the best form, vitamin d2 can be useful in case calcium rise too much but is less potent than d3

[kinetix1208]

Are you still taking vitamin D supplement? Can you tell us what brand of vitamin D3 that most likely you would recommend?

[stef2011]

updates on this old post:
never reached more than 47ng/ml no matter how much sun in the summer or vitamin D supplements at max daily dose 5000-10000iu/ml, probably cirrhosis affects vit D kinetics very badly

during summer i had an increase of creatinine, still within normal ranges 1.2 but increase of creatinine is better never happens.i linked to vit D since all other drugs have no effect on kidneys while vit D does but toxicity is only when calcium increases or vit D is over 100ng/ml, i had none of these.

anyway in september i discontinued vit D, omega3, melatonine and green tea, creatinine returned to 0.9 in 2 weeks but hbvdna returned detectable to 21iu/ml and alt from 31 to 45, back pains and cough returned both and badly

since i cannot combo with tenofovir because it increases my creatinine i decided to restart vit D at low dose 2000iu/ml daily, omega3, melatonine and green tea, to see if hbvdna returns to und and alt to 30 or lower

as to vit D supplement i will not take the natural vit D supplement anymore since these natural supplements are not checked and opted for the pharmacologic version of vit D which is deeply checked and maybe safer for kidneys

at the third day of vitamin D cough and back pain is gone already, i will check hbvdna, hbsag, alt the 21 october.

[stef2011]

today got vitamin level result and it reached 47ng/ml (test was on 04/12, not yet to 50-60 recommended level but close)
i have started supplements in jan with 5000iu vit d3 but supplements seemed very very little results and didn't reach any safe level over 30ng/ml by 3 months supplementation

so i have started 30min sunbath daily from mid march which gave 20000iu per day minimum.i have to say it is pretty hard to correct vit d deficency and requires months anyway, only sun exposure worked for me.
as to throatache, colds, flu, bone pains that i had all the time for about 10 years they complitely disappered from jan.

as to my my hbsag being low it is not possible to link it to vitamins etc but healthy diets and life styles help for sure making no harm

[stef2011]

i have stopped 1 week but i have to start again immediately because my back pains have come back and once you have got rid of them it is impossible to stand it

i will keep supplements or use little sun exposure 10-15min until i reach 70-90ng/ml, to calculate sun exposure at your location you might use this website http://nadir.nilu.no/~olaeng/fastrt/VitD_quartMEDandMED.html
it covers europe but maybe you can find the states too inside the links

as to etv slow response i don't mind since i have planned to combo with tenofovir just to be safe on the resistance issues and actually a 24 weeks und response is quite normal on etv (more than 24 weeks can become an issue)
on march i have appointments with one of the main research university in the world here in italy and i will discuss with them pros and cons of combo since they have the combo trial from 2007

i have also checked the meaning of low hbsag titter at baseline and the fact that i have normal ast/alt even if hbvdna is not und and this is more than good (actually alt/ast have got in old normal range after 4 weeks tx only and very close to normal in 2 weeks only)

300s/n hbsag titter is the level of inactive carriers (which i have been most of my life) and this is very good because that is a sign of low cccdna and that can help to get close to eradicate the virus (of course etv and tdf cannot help on this, only interferon and alinia can help to lower hbsag more, i will discuss this with the researchers)

i do suggest vitamin D supplements to anybody also because tenofovir lowers bones mineral density so supplements are indicated before or during this tx.in the end it is very difficult to say if vitamin D can help or not but i do suggest supplements at least after you have reached und state

[BeachTiePurist]

Good to know your overall health has improved.  Given the correction in your vit.D reading, do you plan on continuing to take the supplements?

Thanks for the updates.

[stef2011]

i am sorry today i got the vitamin d test paper and they gave me the wrong reading at the phone with nmol/l instead of ng/ml, so after one month i am still vitamin d moderately deficent (it takes about 3 months supplement to get normal range)

my level is now only 25.24ng/ml which is equal to 63nmol/l (the reading of the lab)

[stef2011]

results after 5 weeks vitamin d3 at 4000iu, serum level from 12,5 to 65 (normal range 50-90)

no more flu (usually i have one mild flu every two months because i travel a lot for work and gets flu after journey)

no more throatache, i always used to wake up with a mild thoatache, we though it was due to acid reflux

no more bone pains

i have tried from 1 to 2 hours sun exposure but i felt bad after that (very weak) and even got herpes one time so i do not suggest sun if it is for more than 10-15min

so i would say it boosts immune system for problems above

as regards baraclude (entecavir) i have had a very good response in first 4 weeks, almost 3 logs hbvdna decline, but after that i have had only 1 log decline, and this is very strange because i don't have a lot of virus baseline (hbvdna 580000iu/ml and hbsag about 300 s/n)

so partial response to baraclude might be due to many reasons and also interference of vitamin D, so i suggest vitamin D supplements only when hbvdna is und.

other reasons for interference might be due to daily omega3 supplements, daily green tea so this month i will stop any supplement and will take only 5-10min sun to keep optimum level

[April9903]

Thank you for the explanation. You are a very knowledgeable person. You are right. The brand I am using is called "HEXAL" and it's from Germany. I'll ask the lab which I go for my Alt/Ast test whether they can also check Vit D level in the blood. Thanks to you , I know what to ask for. I've never checked this before and if it's too low, I have to increase the dosage of course after checking with my OG. Vit D helps my liver as well so it's fine.

[stef2011]

maybe it is in german language: Internationale Einheit, english is ui (i=international U=unit) and italian ui, in every medicine i see iu or mcg, blood test is in ng/ml

did you ever check the quantity in the blood and the time needed to increase it, from other cases on the internet it looks like supplements are very very slow on this, especially on hiv/hbv/hcv and other infections where it sesms that the body uses a lot of viamin D

[April9903]

I have been taking 1200mg Calcium and 800 I.E. Vit D3 per day for my bone density.
Can you please tell me what's the difference between I.E. & IU?

[stef2011]

about respiratory infections i get them all in the last 3-4 years even if i make flu vaccine, so it is all in line with what doctors say.

i just got a bad cold this week from my sister's boyfriend and 3 mild flus from august 2009 to now, my mother which is under immuno suppressive tx for liver transplant fortunately never gets flu, so vitamin d influence on immune system is very important.from now to summer we will see if this can be reversed.

3000-4000iu of vitamin d will take about 3 months to increase vitamin d so i will take about 30min full body sun per day (30 min sun should give about 5-1000iu per day during winter in my region, P.S. glass blocks vitamin d sunrays)

[BeachTiePurist]

yikes about your vit D lvl being so low.  But it's pretty much inline with every study on Vitamin D deficiency and liver disease going hand in hand.  So you're one of the 92%.

It's good to know your coughing went away once you starting supplementing Vit D.  This follows what I've seen doctors say on television about how vit D boosts the immune system and combats respiratory viruses.

Thanks for the updates, I have been following along.  Hopefully you get some promising viral load & LFT numbers down the line.

[stef2011]

today i got my vitamin D levels, test is called 25(OH)D levels: only 12.60 ng/ml (severe deficency nromal is 50-80, just think that i took the sun the day before test...)

as research said liver illness is associated with vitamin deficency which can lead to weak immune system and bones pain.
this week i will change dosage to 2000-3000iu per day and test blood at the end of the month, i do suggest anyone to check vitamin D, test is very cheap.

[stef2011]

1 week update of vitamin d supplement 1200iu per day

i had little continuous cough from a flu i got in september, it has complitely disappeared from friday/saturday, it is probable that vit d enhanced immune system for this.

i feel better and stronger (no fatigue, almost no pain in the back bones) from friday/saturday but it is not possible to say if this is due to entecavir tx or vit D or just a coincidence, in any case this has happened this week

[BeachTiePurist]

cool, definitely let us know of any updates, good or bad.  keep my fingers crossed for you and your sister.

[stef2011]

started today with vitamin d3, my blood test result about vitamin d3 deficency will be available in 10 days.
since i am on entecavir tx it is difficult to see if vit D has any impact on immune system but if i have deficency it will help prevent liver cancer and boost immune system a little.

my sister had a visit and bood tests today, she made interferon about 20 years ago and since then she has very low hbsag, alt between 30 and 45 not more, hbvdna 240000iu/ml at the moment but usually lower, she has no liver damage so she will make no treatment.
she is the perfect candidate to let us understand if vitamin D has any effect on immune system and she will start vitamin D tomorrrow.if vitamin D works like on hcv trial we should see little help with the immune system and maybe little lower hbvdna/hbsag/alt.

it is also good to see than one year interferon made 20years ago prevented any liver damage on my sister

[stef2011]

i think i will mix very little cod liver and vitamin D3 synthetic 300iu to reach 2000iu per day.
cod liver vit A/D
1/2 teaspoon or 2.5 mL, providing 4650 IU vitamin A and 975 IU vitamin D.
1 teaspoon, providing 9500 IU vitamin A and 1950 IU vitamin D.

what do you think?anybody expert on this?

thanks

[BeachTiePurist]

From your links, I found this page.

http://www.vitamindcouncil.org/health/deficiency/am-i-vitamin-d-deficient.shtml

There is a test to check your vitamin D levels.  It's the 25-hydroxyvitamin D blood test.  25(OH)D levels should be between 50–80 ng/ml, year-round.

Also it seems they recommend vitamin D3 (cholecalciferol), the type your body produces naturally, as opposed to D2 (ergocalciferol), which is a synthetic form.

As for toxicity, this isn't the best source, but from wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypervitaminosis_D

Overdose has been observed at 1925 µg/d (77,000 IU per day). Acute overdose requires between 15,000 µg/d (600,000 IU per day) and 42,000 µg/d (1,680,000 IU per day) over a period of several days to months, with a safe intake level being 250 µg/d (10,000 IU per day).

[stef2011]

also do not consider sun to increase vit D, too much sun can suppress immune system

[stef2011]

i have checked verything about cod liver oil, it has a lot of vit A and less vit D and they work together

Vit A is toxic after about 5000-10000iu per day so i guess the maximum amount of cod liver oil has to be checked carefully, plus blood test for vit A and D to prevent overdose are also important

synthetic vitamins are somewhat more toxic so i will not take these but another source of vit D is needed, any ideas?

suggestions from somebody expert on this filed are much apreciated

[stef2011]

http://www.vitamindcouncil.org/

this website is very interesting with a lot of reference to studies and articles

[stef2011]

this is very very intersting, i can try this on a small 1000-2000iu per day with fish oil intake supplements (cod liver oil, 1 Tbs. (15 ml) provides 1,360 IU)

i have started baraclude (7th week) and have on my diet already a lot of milk with fish oil so probably i have vit D ok, i made this 1 year ago to lower colesterol and it has worked.I will change milk and take supplements of fish oil with correct vit D dosage.

i have also noticed that 4 weeks baraclude made my lymphocytes to 50% (which is maximun normal range) and 1.5log more white blood cells, i was surprised because i have checked my blood since 19y.o. every 6-12 months and never had so many lymphocytes...

do you know if you can check blood with normal tests for vitamin D and also check for overdose?

i will also make my sister start fish oil supplements, she will start tenofovir probably  next week

the use of fish oil and lectin is good for everybody, italian researchers has just discovered this week that colesterol blocks immune system in general and especially in cancer and lowering coloesterol activates immune system with regression of cancer, another good discovery is that coloesterol is needed by viruses for surface membrane, infact coloesterol medicines are on trial for HVB as well so all this might help a little antiviral therapies