and you're from the state where policemen are not allowed to ask a Mexican if they are illegal when having to confront them for any reason. Sorry, but I will continue to speak up. Jersey is liberal enough for me, but it isn't as bad as that, yet.
For all that my be wondering what cuteus is refering to you can see the post that abbas made concering sx below. I agree with him and my post on his thread that I made before I saw this one is and example of how I strongly believe in standing up.
FYI, cuteus, I don't have to quit my day job. as you advised below in other thread...I retired at age 38, God is good.
individuals like you, who constantly speak of God and the Christian way, but behave so "unChristianly", is why some of us have left organized religion. I see it as hypocresy, and no, I did not call YOU a hypocrit, only the behavior, there is a difference if you do know Psychology. You seem to have your own interpretation of name calling, and it never includes when you do it. Your words speak loudly of your Christianity. I end the exchange here, I like to keep my BP stable.
There is a resolution which does not require MH to get involved at all, it's actually quite simple, but perhaps requires the usage of a bit of common sense being referenced, and that is to skip the thread.
Of course those who oppose tolorance, diversity, and true freedom of speech will groan, moan, and most likely run off whining to try an suppress the exercising of these rights by others simply because they are not in agreement and are unable to simply agree to disagree.
No---I will not "skip" a thread that promotes a religious/political view that I disagree with, lest those who share those views mistakenly continue to believe that theirs are the only, and correct, views to express.
BTW--don't think I lack a sense of humor: when you read the word "levity" as it's spelled in the title of the thread...now that's funny!
Today we mourn the passing of a beloved old friend,
Mr. Common Sense.
Mr. Sense had been with us for many years. No one knows for sure
how old he was since his birth records were long ago lost in bureaucratic red tape.
He will be remembered as having cultivated such value lessons as knowing when to come in out of the rain, why the early bird gets the worm and that life isn't always fair.
Common Sense lived by simple, sound financial policies (don't spend more than you earn) and reliable Parenting strategies (adults,! not kids, are in charge).
His health began to rapidly deteriorate when well intentioned but overbearing regulations were set in place.
Reports of a six-year-old boy charged with sexual harassment for kissing a classmate; teens suspended from school for using mouthwash after lunch;and a teacher fired for reprimanding an unruly student, only worsened his condition.
Mr. Sense declined even further when schools were required to get parental consent to administer aspirin to a student; but, could not inform the parents when a student became pregnant and wanted to have an abortion.
Finally, Common Sense lost the will to live as the Ten Commandments became contraband; churches became businesses; and criminals received better treatment than their victims.
Common Sense finally gave up the ghost after a woman failed to realize that a steaming cup of coffee was hot, she spilled a bit in her lap, and was awarded a huge financial settlement.
Common Sense was preceded in death by his parents, Truth and Trust, his wife, Discretion; his daughter, Responsibility; and his son, Reason.
He is survived by two stepbrothers; My Rights and Ima Whiner. Not many attended his funeral because so few realized he was gone.
If you still remember him, pass this on; if not, join the majority and do nothing.
Actually, this was not my intention at all and despite what you may think, the thread title does genuinely reflect the true intention. But you are free to form whatever opinion you desire and correct in observing my short-sightedness or failure to predict the observed result. But then again I do not have a crystal ball or ability to read the minds of others and know their true intents.
You can also say we morn the passing of America,at least as the way we knew it,,,all due to not enough good people standing up for what s right. One example that helped bring the downward spiral of America was.....
Madalyn Murray Ohare, one person,, and was able to get prayer removed form school, How? Because most people didn't think this ONE person could achieve her goal, so they sat back and did nothing. So, she achieved getting her 1 million signatures or however many, slips my mind. God was taken out but whenever you remove something ,there is a hole and that hole doesn't stay empty, the hole gets filled with something else and it has.It was filled with everything opposite of what God stands for...hate, violence,murder and the list can go on and on.We see this in many schools across America. That's why,when those that see wrongs, don't wait for others to speak up, you may be the only one that holds up the wall.
One person CAN make a difference,,,,, Madalyn did.
"Common-sense appears to be only another name for the thoughtlessness of the unthinking. It is made of the prejudices of childhood, the idiosyncrasies of individual character and the opinion of the newspapers." W. Somerset Maugham
"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." Albert Einstein
"Common sense always speaks too late. Common sense is the guy who tells you you ought to have had your brakes relined last week before you smashed a front end this week. Common sense is the Monday morning quarterback who could have won the ball game if he had been on the team. But he never is. He's high up in the stands with a flask on his hip. Common sense is the little man in a grey suit who never makes a mistake in addition. But it's always somebody else's money he's adding up." Raymond Chandler
This is not the kind of thread that I find helpful and supportive of my predicament as an HCV patient. It touches on religion, politics, and other controversies, then implies that if you don't act on the information (by forwarding the email) you are one of the uncaring herd.
The Ten Commandments are not contraband: they are available in your Bibles and your churches and your homes. Prayer was rightly taken out of schools because it violates the separation of church and state. Students can, of course, pray privately---who would know? I'm glad that prayer has been eliminated, and so are many Christians.
Can't you see why some threads are inappropriate for a forum like this? Certain topics should not be discussed because people have strong feelings about them. You can call me a whiner, a baby--- whatever you want, but I hope this thread gets deleted by MH. It's not helpful, or appropriate!
I don't belong to "organized religion," either, fyi, I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, that is what true Christianity is about. I am far far far from being perfect, true Christianity doesn't speak of being 'perfect,' but instead it speaks of being 'forgiven,' so if you want to judge me as being someone who isn't perfect, go right ahead,,,,,I agree, wholeheartidly, and that's what led me to my savior,,but when someone like you, who thinks they ask the perfect question, give the perfect answer and everyone else who asks something is stupid,,,, because that is the impression you give people, some of whom are new to this disease, frightened to death. At times, not all times, "but at times", you are very abrasive to people and that is wrong.
I, as a Christian, can not sit back as the majority does and let you push someone further into a depressive state that they might be in. I'm not refering to Abaas, specifically, but I've notice it even in the archives, you have a very condesending tone and answer to many posts, This is wrong and if my adressing you because of it, is considered 'non Christian'or a bad representation of Christianity, then call me that if you want.
Anyone that meets me in person knows that I am very easy to get along with, but ya know the saying,,,,Don't mistake kindness for weakness,,,,my favorite.
Respectfully...if you are familiar with the teachings of Christ, tell me where, in the Bible, he advocates for public prayer. He criticized the Pharisees for conspicuous prayer, he told believers to go into a "closet" to pray, and he, himself, went away to find solitude to pray. Why are you so concerned about the lack of prayer in public schools?
Do you expect me to believe that you really thought that was levity when you posted it? You suggested that it was "sad" or something along those lines. Other than to cause dissention, what possible motive did you have? It wasn't funny at all, in my opinion. All it accomplished was to express a moral viewpoint on the state of things and since it is proximate to rocker's departure and you were one who stood up for him vehemently the innuendo was clear to me. I suggest that one doesn't have to be a mind-reader to get this connection. You may be so imbued with the spirit that you don't see things like us non-spirit filled ordinary folks but to us it was clear. And lastly, it wasn't the least bit instructive - there was nothing new here - this stuff has been stated ad nauseum in so many places and it's certainly not HCV related. I just flat out don't get it. Mike
I hope I am not overstepping here, So cal but I think what you are saying is when people say "bless you" or "I will pray for you" type of comments that is not the issue. You are referring to the out and out religious pandering that goes on I think, and I agree with you. The quote you quoted of GO's post says it all. That is pushing an agenda, not sharing your faith. Actually I see him as the worst offender. He has to get his pandering of religous politics in there under the guise of "levity" or whatever. I don't think the EXPRESSION of your belief in sharing your faith ( ie God be with you, I will pray for you, etc)is the issue at all, it's that you are pushing your religious AGENDA here that we find offensive. Please don't confuse the two.
Okay, so I'm kind of laughing at myself right now and you can laugh too. Brian Fog hit me, the star trek reference was another post on another thread here, one very delicate one about women being the means of transmission of virus. WTF?? The person posting was genuinely concerned, not so much about the having-sex-with-a-woman who had sex with another person earlier who had Hep C, or B maybe, it was confusing. He was, and rightly so, afraid he may have brought something more out of the relationship than a smile.
But another poster, when asked if transmission of this sort was possible, made a comment about "maybe in a Star Trek episode" and I thought it was a brave, although perhaps a bit insensitive time, to make a funny. And when I read your posts, well, you were kind of brave too. Sometimes, when I'm reading about religion or the arguments it can create, I gotta look up at the sky, so I can see the lightening when it strikes me.
No lightening strikes yet today!! This and the fact that I woke up, above the ground, makes this one fine day. Hope yours goes well too.
Hi all, and GrandOak, loved the post, but I have a question that I don't wanna start another thread, I hope someone can help me out w/ it.
I have always suspected a very close family member of having hypochondria. We all have. But my question is, what is the name of someone who developes the EXACT SAME SYMPTOMS as you....sx from tx/Hep C...ALL THE TIME??? We have learned to love her just the way she is, hypochondria and all, as we all have realized that it won't change due to her age especially...irritating yes, large Dr. bills , yes. Diagnosis for anything all these years? No...well none that is bad enough for her to accept. I am going bananas lately listening to her complain all the time, when I just sit there and tell her "you'll be ok", "anything I can get you", and the rest of my family has begun to have enough of it. I'm starting to get a little tired of it myself. What to do??? I live w/ her...rent thier lower level.
I just realized that I am my own "thought police." I mean, I swear a lot for a girl and I try not to on this board, because it does offend folks, so I try not to do it.
But, being a girl, I am really glad I could smile from the star trek reference, because otherwise, I would spend the whole day with a big knot in my bonnet about someone "objectifying" girls as a means of transmission of Hep C. Or Hep B. But then, I have to admit the hard truth.......girls can be a means of transmission of Hep B. Boys, too, I think. Okay, I've accepted it......now I gotta untie this big knot.
willow, mikesimon, socal, cuteus, others....I agree, wholeheartedly, just don't believe the iron minded will ever change, or allow any light in....
mekeela...we have a guy that works here...and my son was visiting work... I told him "watch this".... so, J.... hows your prostate these days??.. I walked off after five minutes, leaving my poor son ...I came back in thirty minutes and dragged him off (rescued him.).....
Oh, wow, after I read my own post, it sounded like I was accusing you of being the police. Actually, in my twisted way, I was trying to support your ideas about the thought police. I wasn't accusing anyone of being the thought police. Man, I gotta drink another cup of tea before I try to be brilliant.
I've got to tell you willows, not much surprises me here these days but your post certainly did. I found it beautiful and heartfelt. But, where is the Star Trek reference? I missed it in all of my excitement. Mike
Just checked back, things quieted down, but i'll just finish a thought.
So many people talk as if our founding fathers wanted a neutral stance concerning religion, but that is nothing but mis information being passed down by those who go along with whatever someone says "on their side," so to speak," without researching on their own. I do wish that those who are researching Mrs.OHair would take the time to research the meaning of separation of church and state,and what our founding fathers said, when they are finished checking out good old Madlyn,,,God rest her soul,,,oh no thats right, she wouldn't want me to say that, sorry Madlyn.
I'm very surprised though that everyone isn't familiar with Mrs OHair. Especially those opposed to school prayer.
SoCal, Jesus did tell followers to go into their prayer closet and pray and he also called the Pharacees (sp?) hypocrits for praying LOUDLY on the corner, but there is a time when people come together corporately and pray. A church was and is that place. I agree with you on that.
This prayer in school was a tradition, same as the Pledge of Allegiance, which the same people oppose today.
It was a minute prayer, no biggy. Jesus did not oppose corporate prayer. This would take for ever to get into and tooooo many scriptures for me to point you too and then someone would try to snag me as usual.
I would suggest that you may find interest in reading about Madlyn Murray Ohair. I hope I don't sound sarcastic, I mean it. You will find it an interesting read and plus anyone with views such as yours, would be quite interested. BTW her son went on to become a born again Christian and denounced everything she stood for. He had a hard life with her.And what went on in his house was sad. Though she stands for everything I am opposed, I do give her much credit for her pit bull tenacity. She was one tough chick. Thick Irish like me, lol
Take care , be well
You are free to believe whatever you want to believe. I do not portend to know what lies in a person's heart, soul, or mind.
But since you seem to claim this capability, might I suggest that perhaps it's a good day to buy a lottery ticket.
You're also right that it was not HCV related, which is why it was posted to the "Misc." topic rather than any of the other ones. Apparently you missed the thread which pointed out how most here seem to think all posts are, or have to be, related to HCV only. Which is suprising because MH provides several different topic areas with which to post here.
BTW, I was not "vehemently" standing up for any particular thing Rocker posted but simply his right to free speech regardless of whether I agree with what he says or not. The US Constitution's First Amendment does not claim speech to be free so long as it is inline with any particular ideology.
I have loved the Raymond chandler quote since I first read it, who would have thought Mr. Chandler was such a deep thinker. He wrote another I love.....
"There are two kinds of truth-the truth that lights the way and the truth that warms the heart. The first of these truths is science and the second is art."
Truth can wear so many hats, could we even spot it if we saw it on this board? I'm not sure I could. Levity and religion, someone posted these things are not Hep C related, well, once you get past the virusology and the side effects, there ain't sh!t in my life that is NOT related to Hep C. Perhaps I am twisted, but this damn disease touches all aspects of my life.
And I ain't afraid of none of the aspects of my life. I'd rather smile at the truth Mr. Chandler speaks of when he talks common sense.
Your post was brave, I loved it. The star trek reference was funny too, and if folks have issues around their illness, then see a damn doctor and let's all give up the idea we can "POLICE" all thoughts we may feel like expressing in a day. Even grief, I felt it in one post in this thread, even grief has about a million stages, can't control it, but my life sure is easier to live once I got past it. And random, strange, surreal thoughts like we share here, well, they keep me grounded and cleared my perspective.
I just gotta believe, life is soooo damn random, to try to control expressions from us life forms is so counter to truly living. So you all express away. I feel I am in the best of company, us being so human and random and all.
The ACLU would argue that, but I don't. I did see a few of the folks that agreed with me a few threads ago that if a thread contained a belief that differed from theirs that they would just not contribute to the conversation. Oh Well, hope you don't get pulled from tx, I never heard from you what happened with that.
Madalyn Murray O-Hair was a loud, unpleasant atheist. There probably aren't many atheists who would hold her up as a proud example of their worldview, in the same way that you would not want to be associated with Christians like the Rev. Jim (drink the Kool-aid) Jones, or the Rev. Fred Phelps, who demonstrates at the funerals of our Iraq soldiers and claims they are burning in hell.
It isn't reasonable to argue that any given "tradition" should be upheld since slavery was traditionally practiced in our country (and never condemned in the Bible, BTW).
Some of you old-timers may remember this, but we have enough newbies who I know will surely be able to laugh today. It's so good to laugh ... even for a minute. Gives those muscles a workout. Here's my Wednesday Wit:
(or Why the Cops Won't Patrol Brice Street)
I never dreamed slowly cruising through a residential neighborhood could be so incredibly dangerous! Studies have shown that motorcycling requires more decisions per second, and more sheer data processing than nearly any other common activity or sport. The reactions and accurate decision making abilities needed have been likened to the reactions of fighter pilots! The consequences of bad decisions or poor situational awareness are pretty much the same for both groups too.
Occasionally, as a rider I have caught myself starting to make bad or late decisions while riding. In flight training, my instructors called this being "behind the power curve". It is a mark of experience that when this begins to happen, the rider recognizes the situation, and more importantly, does something about it. A short break, a meal, or even a gas stop can set things right again as it gives the brain a chance to catch up. Good, accurate, and timely decisions are essential when riding a motorcycle, at least if you want to remain among the living. In short, the brain needs to keep up with the machine.
I had been banging around the roads of east Texas and as I headed back into Dallas, found myself in very heavy, high-speed traffic on the freeways. Normally, this is not a problem, I commute in these conditions daily, but suddenly I was nearly run down by a car that decided it needed my lane more than I did. This is not normally a big deal either, as it happens around here often, but usually I can accurately predict which drivers are not paying attention and avoid them before we are even close.
This one I missed seeing until it was nearly too late, and as I took evasive action I nearly broadsided another car that I was not even aware was there! Two bad decisions and insufficient situational awareness, all within seconds. I was behind the power curve. Time to get off the freeway. I hit the next exit, and as I was in an area I knew pretty well, headed through a few big residential neighborhoods as a new route home. As I turned onto the nearly empty streets I opened the visor on my full-face helmet to help get some air. I figured some slow riding through the quiet surface streets would give me time to relax, think, and regain that "edge" so frequently required when riding.
Little did I suspect, as I passed an oncoming car, a brown furry missile shot out from under it and tumbled to a stop immediately in front of me. It was a squirrel, and must have been trying to run across the road when it encountered the car. I really was not going very fast, but there was no time to brake or avoid it-it was that close. I hate to run over animals, and I really hate it on a motorcycle, but a squirrel should pose no danger to me. I barely had time to brace for the impact.
Animal lovers, never fear. Squirrels can take care of themselves! Inches before impact, the squirrel flipped to his feet. He was standing on his hind legs and facing the oncoming Valkyrie with steadfast resolve in his little beady eyes. His mouth opened, and at the last possible second, he screamed and leapt! I am pretty sure the scream was squirrel for "Banzai!" or maybe, "Die you gravy-sucking, heathen scum!" as the leap was spectacular and he flew over the windshield and impacted me squarely in the chest. Instantly he set upon me.
If I did not know better I would have sworn he brought twenty of his little buddies along for the attack. Snarling, hissing, and tearing at my clothes, he was a frenzy of activity. As I was dressed only in a light t-shirt, summer riding gloves, and jeans this was a bit of a cause for concern. This furry little tornado was doing some damage!
Picture a large man on a huge black and chrome cruiser, dressed in jeans, a t-shirt, and leather gloves puttering maybe 25mph down a quiet residential street, and in the fight of his life with a squirrel. And losing. I grabbed for him with my left hand and managed to snag his tail. With all my strength I flung the evil rodent off the left of the bike, almost running into the right curb as I recoiled from the throw. That should have done it. The matter should have ended right there. It really should have.
The squirrel could have sailed into one of the pristinely kept yards and gone on about his business, and I could have headed home. No one would have been the wiser. But this was no ordinary squirrel. This was an evil attack squirrel, of death! Somehow he caught my gloved finger with one of his little hands, and with the force of the throw swung around and with a resounding thump and an amazing impact he landed square on my back and resumed his rather anti-social and extremely distracting activities. He also managed to take my left glove with him!
The situation was not improved. Not improved at all. His attacks were continuing, and now I could not reach him. I was startled to say the least. The combination of the force of the throw, only having one hand (the throttle hand) on the handlebars, and my jerking back unfortunately put a healthy twist through my right hand and into the throttle. A healthy twist on the throttle of a Valkyrie can only have one result. Torque. This is what the Valkyrie is made for, and she is very, very good at it.
The engine roared as the front wheel left the pavement. The squirrel screamed in anger. The Valkyrie screamed in ecstasy. I screamed in... well, I just plain screamed.
Now picture a large man on a huge black and chrome cruiser, dressed in jeans, a slightly squirrel-torn t-shirt, and only one leather glove roaring at maybe 70mph and rapidly accelerating down a quiet residential street on one wheel and with a demonic squirrel on his back. The man and the squirrel are both screaming bloody murder. With the sudden acceleration I was forced to put my other hand back on the handlebars and try to get control of the bike.
This was leaving the mutant squirrel to his own devices, but I really did not want to crash into somebody's tree, house, or parked car. Also, I had not yet figured out how to release the throttle--- my brain was just simply overloaded. I did manage to mash the back brake, but it had little affect against the massive power of the big cruiser.
About this time the squirrel decided that I was not paying sufficient attention to this very serious battle (maybe he is a Scottish attack squirrel of death), and he came around my neck and got IN my full-face helmet with me. As the faceplate closed partway and he began hissing in my face I am quite sure my screaming changed tone and intensity. It seemed to have little affect on the squirrel however. The rpm's on The Dragon maxed out (I was not concerned about shifting at the moment) and her front end started to drop.
Now picture the large man on the huge black and chrome cruiser, dressed in jeans, a very ragged torn t-shirt, and wearing one leather glove, roaring at probably 80 mph, still on one wheel, with a large puffy squirrel's tail sticking out his mostly closed full-face helmet. By now the screams are probably getting a little hoarse. Finally I got the upper hand. I managed to grab his tail again, pulled him out of my helmet, and slung him to the left as hard as I could. This time it worked. Sort of. Spectacularly sort of, so to speak.
Picture the scene. You are a cop. You and your partner have pulled off on a quiet residential street and parked with your windows down to do some paperwork. Suddenly a large man on a huge black and chrome cruiser, dressed in jeans, a torn t-shirt flapping in the breeze, and wearing one leather glove, moving at probably 80 mph on one wheel, and screaming bloody murder roars by and with all his strength throws a live squirrel grenade directly into your police car. I heard screams. They weren't mine.
I managed to get the big motorcycle under directional control and dropped the front wheel to the ground. I then used maximum braking and skidded to a stop in a cloud of tire smoke at the stop sign at a busy cross street. I would have returned to fess up (and to get my glove back). I really would have. Really. But for two things.
First, the cops did not seem interested or the slightest bit concerned about me at the moment. One of them was on his back in the front yard of the house they had been parked in front of and was rapidly crabbing backwards away from the patrol car. The other was standing in the street and was training a riot shotgun on the police cruiser. So the cops were not interested in me. They often insist to "let the professionals handle it" anyway. That was one thing.
The other? Well, I swear I could see the squirrel, standing in the back window of the patrol car among shredded and flying pieces of foam and upholstery, and shaking his little fist at me. That is one dangerous squirrel. And now he has a patrol car. I took a deep breath, turned on my turn-signal, made an easy right turn, and sedately left the neighborhood.
As for my easy and slow drive home? Faced with a choice of 80 mph cars and inattentive drivers, or the evil, demonic, attack squirrel of death... I'll take my chances with the freeway. Every time. And I'll buy myself a new pair of gloves.
Thanks for the post in this thread! Actually, we have a similar person in the family (wife's side of course) Although I might show a little evilness here, belive me that distance or near proximity make no difference. Our family member is an older woman, little education, never worked outside the home, has little outside contact, has very few interests and although not a shut-in has little interest outside of her little world. I always viewed her actions and thoughts as attention getters. Where everyone else around have much wider interests and expereinces she has few and actulally revels in her maladies. It's her form of control, a way to attact attention and makes her 'special'. And it works for her. Like many other things, it's an illness.. Last thing you want to start a conversation with is 'How you doing?' Otherwise, a sweet person who would do anything for you, 'health' permitting. She'll probably outlive everyone else.
Suggestion??? Not sure. But you are not in a unique situation.
WHEW!!!! Thank you so much for the comment, I didn't think I was going to get a response...LOL...I even posted in the "continued contriversial" thread upstairs..LOL. I feel better now knowing I am not alone. It does get tough sometimes, especially when siblings are telling me to say something to her, but I know better than that!!!!!!!!!! LOLOL. I guess I just don't have as much self-control as I used to and walked away from her today when she was complaining about somethings she over heard me and my father discussing earlier...(he is so sweet, always asking me how I'm feeling etc.) just don't see him often :(
I go in for my PCR lab next Friday and doc consult on 11/3 to determine what's next. They're going to compare those results to my initial base of 72,000,000 last Jan when I started this roller coaster ride. But I doubt that they will recommend continuing current tx as Procrit dosage is very high (100,000 U)and it sounds like they're concerned about it over an extended period.
Daily Infergen injections was one of the suggestions thrown out last month during follow-up, particularily because except for the anemia and neutropenia I have not suffered many of the other sx's.
Personnally, I'm open to even taking a break for a short time if I can do so safely and it helps me recall what feeling normal is like again.
Levity with a capital L and that spells funny! I say that with the utmost respect for squirrels, I have an oak tree with many acorns this year and many squirrels. Now, I can roll on the floor, laughing every time I see one..a squirrel, not an acorn. The sun just came out and I'm still laughin...thank you.
You may be correct in an outright direct condemnation on slavery, but here's just a few places where one could say the Bible does not support slavery, unless of course your love for yourself would allow you to put yourself into slavery:
Lev 19:18 You shall not take revenge or bear any grudge against the sons of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself. I am the Lord.
Zec 8:17 And let none of you think or imagine or devise evil or injury in your hearts against his neighbor, and love no false oath, for all these things I hate, says the Lord.
Mat 22:38-40 "This is the great (most important, principal) and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as [you do] yourself. These two commandments sum up and upon them depend all the Law and the Prophets."
I do admire Lincoln. He was humble, sometimes tortured with doubt, and even suffered from depression. He was authentic, and he knew how to use words to inspire. But if he were alive today, I'll bet he would understand that good people---people of compassion who seek to be ethical and moral---can be found who do not call themselves Christians.
I think the slavery issue was addressed very well,so I hope GO answer has helped you in that area. And also you may want to remember that America had a God fearing born again President at the time who issued the Emancipation Proclamation.He was a man who openly expressed his personal relationship with God, that realtionship would be the reason IMO for the E.P. There was a man by the name of John Newton, SLAVE OWNER, worked slave ships. He had a "religius experience," too long to go into, you may want to read about him, very interesting. But anyhow God changed this mans life by showing him mercy.
He later went on to write one of the most famous hymns,,,,,,,
The first line in it shows the "change God brought in his life."
Amazing Grace how sweet he sound that saved A WRETCH LIKE ME, I once was lost but now I'm found, was blind but now I see.
Now as far as Jim Jones, any Christian knows he was not a Christian, he was a leader of a cult. People that take scripture and twist it to mislead people are not true Pastors.So I can't align myself with him, your right.
Same goes with Phelps. Jones and Phelps do not believe,preach or teach what Jesus stands for or what I believe,,,but on the other hand Madalyn murray Ohair DOES or did I should say stand for what you stand for, well as far as school prayer. I don't know if your an atheists, I have my feelings, but I won't assume.But for a minute lets pretend you are,just for argument sake. An atheist is and atheist. They don't believe in God. You may not like OHairs style, but you both share the same opinion, so though you may not want to be tied to her, you are and actually, you should like her. She accomplished something you believe in,,,,,or should I say "don't believe in."
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