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Hepatitis c

Please tell me where to go to find out where it is written that lloyd wright never had hepc, I am interested.  Thanks, Susan
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179856_tn?1333550962
Please stop trying to believe in this man.  He is a fake and a fraud. I know you think you are desperate to find an "alternative" to interferon but there just isn't any that will work. You might as well just send me the money and I'll send you a nice bottle of water and a few vitamin tablets. Please understand = this man is just trying to make money off of you.

We all wish it were not true. But it is.  
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476246_tn?1310999221
If you cannot or do not want to treat with the conventional medicines and are not looking for a cure, I would advise you to check out Dr. Zhang in New York City. He has a very good protocol, which can help keep the liver in check and delay fibrosis. In some cases he was even able to revert some of the damage. He has been asked to collaborate with Mt. Sinai and John Hopkins, to help hepatologists treat people who do not respond to conventional treatment. It is NOT a cure, but is helpful.

Being an MD and also a doctor in Traditional Chinese Medicine, he practices  Integrative Modern Chinese Medicine. He specializes in viral diseases. AND he definitely does NOT advertise that his protocol is a cure.

I have a friend who speaks very highly of him. My friend was cured through conventional Peginterferon Ribavirin treatment and also treated with the TMC with Dr. Zhang. I don't think he did it simultaneously, though. But it helped him a lot. I'm not sure about all the details, as I am friends with his wife.

I would NOT go for someone like Lloyd Wright, as he is not a medical nor herbal doctor. That should already be a warning. If you want to go through alternative treatment and take the watch and wait approach I would advise you to do it properly. With someone who has the knowledge of this complex disease.

His site is dr-zhang.com

Good luck,

Marcia

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Avatar_m_tn
I believe that was speculation from a member here based on what the poster said was an antibody negative status. It should be noted that you can be antibody negative and still have had HCV although you'd be in a minority. You can also have had Hep C and spontaneously cleared the virus many years after infection, although you'd be in a distinct minority.

I have no knowledge of what LW's Hep C status is now or what it was, but I think that's missing the point. The point as I see it is that LW's advice is often inaccurate and quite irresponsible. And the problem/trap someone new to the game will have with LW is trying to figure out which information on his site is good and which is nonsense.

My main pick with alternative practioners like LW is that they turn a blind eye toward liver damage and offer basically the same advice regardless of stage and disease progression. More responsibe alternative practioners -- Dr. Misha Cohen and Dr. Zhang for example -- do take into consideration liver sage and I believe will urge their patients to get periodic biopsies to check first if there's time to hold off on conventional treatment and equally important, to monitor how fast or slow the progression is.

Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen any of this basic, common-sense, responsible approach on LW's web site. So in my book that makes him ignorant and irresponsible at best and at worst, well, others can come up with the adjectives :)

-- Jim
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Avatar_n_tn
Wright's business partner(Melody Beattie) stated in a promo for one of her own books that she had 'begged Lioyd to have another antibody test'.He did ( apparently) and it came back negative.This particular text was quickly removed from the net.
I have not heard from an authoritive source that it is possible to be antibody negative for hepatitis C and have been infected.Quite the opposite in fact.I have observed this man's activities since 2000 and could entertain you for hours with details of  the inconsistincies,changes of story and astonishing opportunism he has exhibted.I did challenge him head to head by email long ago but he was capable only of ranting.
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476246_tn?1310999221
Thank you for bringing some substantial light on this matter. There are not many of us who have enough knowledge of the doings of this con man. I have only briefly read what he is saying and it already put me off.

Marcia
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524608_tn?1244421761
If this stuff does no damage to your liver....and it makes you feel better....take it. Just make sure that it isn't doing harm. There are a lot of things out on the market that help the liver if this is one of them...take it, you don't need the approval of anyone to do what you feel is right for yourself....

I think I read in one of your previous posts that you were a non-responder or had difficulty with the SOC...You need to stay as healthy as you can till there is something on the market that you can tolerate...so don't make excuses to anyone here, do what is right for yourself.

I am new here and I certainly appreciate that you gave information in good faith. I also appreciate that there are veteran members with knowledge and experience with all the different products on the market. We shouldn't discourage anyone from posting...I think some of the veteran members have seen the same info float on and off of this forum and, understandably get frustrated easily with such a sore subject.

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Avatar_f_tn
Yes, I agree with you, it's like telling someone, "wow!!!!! I feel great, and then someone comes along and wants to bring you down cause they're down, I am not naive nor stupid.  No the veteran members are still angry at the world for the way they were treated years ago, that's fine but don't project it onto me.  There is no excuse for emotional bullying, I don't care how bad someone's past was.  Anyway, don't want any part of this, my goal is to stay positive and be healthy.  I am well today, thank you, Susan
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Avatar_m_tn
It seems that you will not hear what you want from the members here. You will not find one member to reinforce you treating with Lloyd Wright. We do not need to keep going back and forth about this. If it makes you feel better then go treat with LW. Just remember if you ever decide to try and get "cured" of HCV with the "only" drugs that will do that (interferon & ribavirin) we will be here to help with the support. Take care
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320078_tn?1278348320
this forum is filled with people who want to help anyone in need!  new comers are not seen as a threat, and there are no clicks that i have experienced and i am fairly new here.  with that being said,  i think what the others where trying to tell you is that if there were alternative treatments, dont you think  people who have treated 3, 4 5  and 8 times would have tried them if they offered anything!  We do not want to spend our life on interferon and riba and whatever other drug may come along, but some of us have no choice but to keep trying treatment with the meds that are available.

I hope that you find a treatment that brings you SVR.

This forum will always be here to answer any questions that you may have, regarding tX, sides etc.  We only want to help.

But dont judge us, because you dont know us!

good luck to you

peace
rita


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Avatar_m_tn
No the veteran members are still angry at the world for the way they were treated years ago, that's fine but don't project it onto me.  

Not true. Quite a few of us here have also researched Oxymatrine. I know i have.
Whats out there on it. One or two chinese studies that are full of holes.
Even the control arm manage to cure 5 patients from memeory and they were taking vitamins. Not sure which ones but they are not in the Multi Vit pils I am taking.

There is no excuse for emotional bullying.
Slagging off Lloyd Wright isnt emotyional bulling its warning people that the guy is a fraud and only interested in curing his own poverty. He aint going to cure anything else.

If Oxymatrine eases the symptoms of HepC then good but i want more than that.

CS

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476246_tn?1310999221
Susan, I really do not understand why you are being so negative and upset. There were only a few out of over twenty replies to your 4 posts, which I see could have offended you in any way. On all the other replies, people are genuinely trying to give you some sound advice from their own experiences. Regarding the oxymatrine, ppl even came with all kinds of studies to support a good and healthy discussion. Some of us even went to the extend to explain to you why some of us are reacting the way we are. Saying that, you should have taken it as a kind of apology. Instead you keep on bringing this up again and again. You say you have been through treatment and should understand that ppl ON treatment might react in a certain way.

But again you are only pointing out the few disagreements instead of maybe thanking people who have genuinely answered your posts and came with sincere advice.

When you come onto a forum and post something, you always have to be prepared to get positive and negative feedback. You cannot expect ppl to agree with you on this guy who has even conned some of us who are on this forum. There are some ppl here who have had first hand bad experiences with Lloyd Wright promises. They have actually suffered as a consequence of his theories and promises, as they believed in it.

So don't feel personally attacked. People are putting their point of views out there, just as you did. And no one has insulted you or is doing any emotional bullying. Nobody has called you naive or stupid.

So please do not come and insult ppl on this forum.

The following words you wrote are SO NOT appropriate ....

'''Yes, I agree with you, it's like telling someone, "wow!!!!! I feel great, and then someone comes along and wants to bring you down cause they're down, I am not naive nor stupid.  No the veteran members are still angry at the world for the way they were treated years ago, that's fine but don't project it onto me.  There is no excuse for emotional bullying, I don't care how bad someone's past was'''''


If you are upset with certain ppl, you need to approach them directly and not just throw words like that in the air and accuse people, especially all the veterans who are here trying to help us with sound advice. These amazingly generous people don't even need to be here, as many of them have been cured and could just go on living there lives, not giving a da*n about US. But they DO and they ARE here. And I personally can only be DEEPLY GRATEFUL for that.

So try to be a bit more gracious and respectful. Coming into a forum for me is like coming into someones home. I introduce myself first and behave respectfully. I get to know the people and once I am more familiar I ask more questions.

It's like going into a pool. You do not jump before you have tested the water with your toes.

Marcia



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Avatar_f_tn
I see a pattern here.  I think it was Hector that asked for stats and previous results and Susan did not respond.  Never gave us any history or information that corresponds to failed tx.  I find that suspicious.
Trin
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476246_tn?1310999221
I find her posts very confusing, as there are so many of them with the same or almost the same headings. There are two oxymatrine posts and 3 hep c posts. It is difficult to keep track of so many posts with the same subjects being discussed at the same time
Marcia
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Avatar_f_tn
This leads me to believe that perhaps there is no validity.  But it's sure is good promo for Wright and his alternative treatments.  People who are actually seeking good sound medical advise don't usually open as many posts nor do they disagree with just about everything we have to say.  I will not believe anything else Susan posts and it's not the first time we've been accused of being "clicky" because we know a scam when we see it.  If I've stepped on some toes, oh well.
Trin
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320078_tn?1278348320
Trin ~ Hector did ask for stats and was never given a answer!
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Avatar_f_tn
I see a pattern here.  I think it was Hector that asked for stats and previous results and Susan did not respond.  Never gave us any history or information that corresponds to failed tx.  I find that suspicious.
Trin

Yep, that's correct
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476246_tn?1310999221
I'm always sooo stooooopid... Could bite myself in the ... I never think of the promo aspect... Could very well be...

Marcia
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144210_tn?1273092382
Supplements can/do help. I started HRs' liver lovers regimen back in Nov. and got good results. My LFTs' had a profound drop, I felt great and halted fibrosis progression. Diet and exercise was the first line of defense. But HR would never  recommend this as a replacement for SOC. Just as an adjunct to SOC. Nothing will cure you except Peg/Riba/Alinia. Some supps will help improve your chances of SVR. LW believes supps is a CURE! That is wrong and dangerous and irresponsible.  Look into HRs' regimen in my profile. You are on the right track but steer clear of LW!
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184420_tn?1326743408
... I never think of the promo aspect... Could very well be...



if thats what it is then it got me i just did a search on mr wright....

i am not a fan of standard tx, it didnt work for me and i blame my gastro problems on it... but this guy is sure selling alot of stuff...

but i really do believe that certain herbals can make a difference, no they cant get rid of the virus but they can help your liver... i take milk thistle and LIV 52 for the last few years, eat lots of organics, drink lots of water, my ast/alt are just about normal, and all my liver function tests are normal, ultrasound normal, etc...
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476246_tn?1310999221
I have always been pro alternative and herbal... If I can avoid taking any kind of allopathic medications, I will. I have been taking herbs and homeopathic stuff for decades. One just really needs to know how to use them, as they can be quite potent. Many  don't realize the drug and herb interactions etc. It is a very complicated science, not to take lightly. I am on a 100% organic vegetarian diet, incl all the spices I use. Filtered water, etc. Only organic creams, shampoos. Even use water based nail polish I order all the way from Canada. So I totally understand what you mean, by natural things making a difference.

The problem with mr Lloyd Wrong is that he claims that whatever he has to offer is a CURE.

For myself, I HAVE decided to do  SOC Tx and I hope it will work for me. If it doesn't, I will have to deal with that later. So at the moment no herbs for me either. I only take my krill oil in the morning and some raw organic whey protein. (thanks to gauf's posts, I was reminded that I still had a few unused ones in my cupboard)

Marcia

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338734_tn?1377163768
I am always suspicious when the people recommending an alternative treatment are also selling the product. I am particularly annoyed when someone is profiting on the ignorance of people desperate for a cure. This seems so cynical. I hope you are not the victim of self-promotional propaganda. Worse than popping someone's baloon is giving false hope. It is especially egregious if the false hope prevents them from seeking other treatments.

Brent
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Avatar_f_tn
Thanks for posting to Susan.  I was going to post and point her to your profile and you did it yourself.  

Susan, I'm going to take the approach that I believe you have not had success with treatment in the past.  Sometimes people have doctors who are inexperienced with treating Hepatitis C .. I see that far more than I care to.  And sometimes people have treated with methods that are no longer used and better ones exist.  And then there are others who have treated with current drugs, it has not worked and so they are looking to alternatives to take care of their liver and keep themselves in optimum shape until they can treat again with a different approach, newer drugs or different dosages of drugs the next time around, perhaps in better medical hands than before.

I've been reading these boards for about 10 months now and while I'm in treatment now and haven't done alternative medicine, I read the posts of those who are on that path as a way of keeping the damage to a minimum while they wait for the next medical alternative as there are NO herbal or alternative medicines that have proven to be a CURE.  It is IMPORTANT that you don't approach alternatives as a CURE but as a means to slow things down or improve your situation .. but not a CURE.

I would recommend you take a look at gauf's profile and I don't recommend lightly.  He has alot at stake himself and he's put ALOT of time and effort into researching alternatives AND he has posted his information for the benefit of many.  

Kind of hard to get your bubble bursted on someone you thought had good things to offer and find out he's actually just a shyster...kind of like dating a wonderful guy and finding out he's married.  I would pay attention to what others in the SAME boat as you have to say about Lloyd Wright...and pay attention to what they have uncovered that DOES help with alternatives...even though it does not CURE.

Good luck.

Trish
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476246_tn?1310999221
I have given up on this one.... She opened a new thread, in exactly the same manner and tone, as all the other ones.... after you posted this message... I don't think she wants to have any help and she is starting to stir up too much **** on this forum. My patience is going up the air or down the drain... And I usually have lots of it, you kind of develop that one with 5 kids.

Marcia
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233616_tn?1312790796
When I was young and dumb I really wanted to be healthy and find alternatives to modern and often toxic medicines, having seen family succoumb to chemo and cancer I was motivated to learn about all the alternative ways of regaining and/or maintaining health..
For this reason I studied herbology, became a physical therapist, became vegetarian, grew a half acre organic garden, raised my own bees for honey, milked upteen critters, feed the chickens for the good eggs, ground my own flour, baked my own bread,
and basically had a working organic farm with 500 critters throughout my 20's.
I also was liscensed and did physical therapy for both alternatives and orthopedic/stroke patients under MD care. Some was in office, some was in private homes for stroke victims...so yes I made house calls.

What I observed regarding the chiropractic/naturopathic community was that even when they learned and knew something was harmful, or ineffective, the alternatives I knew did not alter their ways. Every time I went with some concern, such as ephedrine, gotu cola, or any other element which was not just a benign placbo but a real health hazard they would look at me like I was the devil...
and go right on selling their vitamins full of dangerous elements.

Eventually, as my limited knowledge grew it became impossible to consort with alternative docs anymore because for the most part they ignored competant research, and put their patients at much higher risk overall than any other group (DO, MD) I worked with.
I found myself trying to redirect my patients to real medically trained physicians as it became apparent that no evidence would convince them they were wrong about anything.

To say that alternative doctors are not "in it for the money" the same as any other profession would be to deny what I witnessed for many long years, including the death or near death of several people under such care.

To quote one chiropractor..."if I could have afforded medical school I'd have gone".
I wonder...did he ever think about what not going was doing to the believers around him.
I say beleivers because, for some, alternative medicine is like a religion.
I say this having once been a believer, once blind, but now I see.
The fact that some belive, means if you question any of that...you are questioning their whole beleif system...which is why some get testy.
OK, I understand hope, I understand faith...what I don't understand is why even when something is said in love, not to belittle, but to educated...then why can we not do as St. Paul suggests..."come let us reason together".

At least pharmaceuticals are put through some number of years of tests to ensure safety and efficacy. No such requirements apply to the herbal/vitamin market.
The vitamin market has been much researched not only by the medical community but the agricultural department as well. So there is more knowledge and safety there.
The homeopathic/herbal/gismo machine market has had no similar scrutiny. Very limited testing yields very questionable results and/or benefit.

Look, I'm not saying their aren't some helpful herbs out their, or vitamins etc.
I'm just saying, there are a lot of people selling pond scum, or the equivalent...and convincing folks it's the fountain of youth.
Produce the science. Produce some documentation of cure, verifiable by regular laboratories and regular docs and x-rays.
If there is something valid, it should hold up to the light of day.

The truth is most treatments given by alternatives are not well researched nor in many cases are they safe.
The truth also is, most ailments remit on their own. The body itself has wonderful healing capacities so things atributed to some sugar drops are often just time and our aweinspiring immune systems having done their work.
Sometime people are helped to shrink a tumor by a better diet...and sometimes we find drugs in nature that do the same. All this is true.

However, I think it's important not to just assume any doctors know what they are talking about.  I learned for instance, that the POPping sound your spine makes when "an adjustment" is given by  a chiropractor, is merely the sound of air escaping from your disc cartilage, the same as when you pop a knuckle. This does not realighn your discs, and can do greeat damage to people with ruptured discs and or bone spurs. Yet every day people subject themselves to these treatments..and walk out feeling cured...only to be told they must return for 8 more treatments to "keep things aligned".
Come on over, I'll pop your knuckles for 40 bucks time 8...and you'll feel better because every muscle pull and sprain heals in that time frame...even when you do NOTHING. Your body heals itself. But hey...if some want to part with 320...well come on down!!

I could go on forever...but you get the idea. When people start trying to sell you thousand dollar machines and put you on hundreds of drops and pills that do not ever clear up or cure a condition....I'd say time to cut bait.

Like I said, I worked with both type docs, and learned a lot from both types. What I learned from alternatives was that they don't care about the science or what is really best for their patients. Often times they do not even suggest to them going to a doc for large lumps or changing moles, things they know may be carcinogenic.

In my capacity I told my patients to GO to a real physician and get checked...
How can I have respect for people who failed regularly to refer on conditions known to be life threatening? Answer I can't. That's just from my 15 years of exposure, and no one has to agree with me...but those tirelessly at work in labs with their microscopes trying to find any truly viable safe molecules, and doing the science to prove or disprove the voracity of any claims have my vote any day over those bottling up what grows in their garden and telling you not to worry while Rome burns.

rome burns:
If you have a life threatening illness, which HCV IS LIFE Threatening...then for gosh sakes do some homework and find out what will really work. Understand what the scienticfic method is, and why trials and proofs offer hope for hundreds of diseases that had none. If God didn't want us to use our brains, then why the heck did he give them to us? Surely not so we could just buy the newest chop-o-matic and every snake oil coming down the pike.

It's kinda like what happening is, I say this as a christian, God still heals people...I beleive that. He can do it through any and many means, he uses the surgeons hands, the devoted researcher, the tender nurse, and even the plants put here on the planet...but we still have to discover what they Do before we start taking them adhoc....or we can run the guy on TV waving his white Armani suit and saying swoosh...that fake Benny can spin his head around, he ain't healing anybody or anything...except his bank account. Which one day soon he won't take with him...
as I said, I say this as a christian...

aren't we all admonished to be aware there are wolves among the sheep...or as JC once said...."you only look to steal and snatch up widows houses".  Well??????

And as to the guys selling rife machines, or "cool lasers" for a few Thou only...they are just putting their faith in another eternal principal....that there's a sucker born every minute.

Just my opinion, no need everyone share it, or hate me for it...it is what it is and I make no apology here.
My heart truly goes out to those being bilked....but at some point we have to ackowledge this is  just part of the sad tradgedy that illness forces upon some.
It's very difficult for all of us to face our own demise....and not too unusual to be grasping at straws. Let's all just hope that reason and wisdom will prevail for all in the end.

mb  
mb
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Avatar_f_tn
The fact that there were three threads up with my discussions was not intentional, I have never approached a forum before, and do not know how this works, and I apologize for being rude.
I did not once attack the pharmaceuticals on this site, I agree with it actually, however, like I posted earlier, I did do the tx and I did not respond and believe me, if something better ever comes along, I will do it, in the meantime, I am trying to slow down this disease and feel better.  As far as LLoyd Wright, I could care less about him, I was excited about the oxy, cause of the research I've done on google and plan on going to a medical library to do some more research on it.
I appreciate all the people that were sincere and respectful, I must admit that first response was pretty distressing to me, and I was pretty much reacting back to that.  It's a shame that everyone else had to apologize for this man and he did not have the decency to step up to the plate and take responsibility for his own behavior.
I am a little curious about maybe people on this site that work for the pharmaceuticals, are promoting their tx, just as I was accused of a lloyd wright promo, my goodness, what about live and let live and allow others to make their own decisions on what works for them and be happy when one of us has a "good" day physically.
Again, I did not mean to upset anyone, and I am truly sorry that things got stirred up.  That is what happens when there is no openmindedness and respect for other's choices.  Thank you, susan
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408795_tn?1324939275
Welcome, when did you treat, I thought I saw a post of yours that said you treated 11 years ago, that is a long time and alot has changed with the interferon that is being used.  Lloyd Wright is kind of a sore subject around here, but your health and honest careing people are here and you do not have to be in a clique.  If you share about yourself honestly, I'm sure someone will chime in with honest responses.  If someone comes on this forum and praises a product, and then accuses the forum or sponsor as supporting the pharmaceutical industry that makes your post suspect.  If you focus on your health situation and you focus on your health situation, people on this forum will get to know you.  You just don't know how many people come on this forum with a hidden agenda.  Please get some help, as you may be able to get free medication from the medical industry.  If you don't want to treat with interferon, then that's your decision.  There is not any other way to cure or reach SVR if you don't treat, if you're taking oxymatrine and getting good results while you're waiting for a better tx to come around then good for you, but I read about that stuff and it has not been studied all that well.  You can check it out if you google pubmed, there's also another informative sight for research materials, I'm sure someone else with chime in soon.    God Bless
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476246_tn?1310999221
Apology accepted. Thank you for coming clean with us. If you really want to stay and participate in our discussions and ever lasting quest to learn more about this disease and treatment, I would like to welcome you back to our forum.

I also apologize to you for any unjust judgments and comments I made, but....  Well, I don't want to get into all that again. We should put it behind us.

So let's let bygones be bygones.

Marcia
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Avatar_f_tn
Thank you Marcia.  Susan
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Avatar_f_tn
I was diagnosed in 1997 and treated 3 years ago, with no response, with genotype 1b that is understandable, this is when I started Liv/52 and milk thistle and started to feel a lot better.  I live by myself and have to support myself and cannot afford to go through another round of horrifying side effects and being so weak from the treatment that I could hardly get out of bed.  I know everyone responds differently to the treatment.  That is not everyone's experience.  I was stage one, grade one, by liver biopsy then, liver enzymes in the 140's and 150's and six months ago, everything was in the normal range.  the enzymes were in the 30's the lowest they have ever been since 1997.   I eat as much organic as I can, take selenium, vitamin b complex, magnesium, olive leaf and a good multi with no iron.  I drink about a gallon of water a day, don't drink alcohol and get plenty of excercise.  I am doing the best I can to assist in my own healing.  Thank you, Susan
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408795_tn?1324939275
I'm glad you came back on here and let the forum know that you did tx and corrected me on when that was.  I really needed to hear what you had to say as I will be starting tx within the next couple of months and now I know that if I don't respond to tx , there are some supplements that can make me feel better.  True, it is not a cure, but its really your only option until something other than the current SOC comes around.  God Bless
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