Hepatitis C Community
Is the damage done by Hepatitis uniform throughout the liver?
About This Community:

This forum is for questions about medical issues and research aspects of Hepatitis C such as, questions about being newly diagnosed, questions about current treatments, information and participation in discussions about research studies and clinical trials related to Hepatitis. If you would like to communicate with other people who have been touched by Hepatitis, please visit our new Hepatitis Social/Living with Hepatitis forum

Font Size:
A
A
A
Background:
Blank
Blank
Blank
Blank Blank

Is the damage done by Hepatitis uniform throughout the liver?

I had a biopsy about six months ago that indicated that I have a Grade III Stage II infection.  I have been experiencing more significant symptoms, more in line with cirrhosis that have me very concerned.  Any thoughts on this?  If one corner of  your liver is cirrhotic will the other corner show it as well?  I need to have wrist surgery due to a motorcycle accident from two years ago, do I have enough time or should I put the hepatitis on the front burner?  I hope you are all feeling well and enjoying this long weekend as well as you can.
Peace
Dog_Lover
Related Discussions
24 Comments Post a Comment
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
I am afraid a biopsy is not an exact science. A lot depends upon where the sample was taken and how long the specimen was.  It is possible to totally miss a cirrhotic section according to an article I read on the Janis7 sight.  I direct you to that read some of the info on biopies there:

http://janis7hepc.com/biopsies.htm#stages of progression

"The onset of cirrhosis is usually silent, with few specific symptoms to identify this development in the liver. As scarring (fibrosis) and destruction continue, some of the following signs and symptoms may occur: loss of appetite, nausea and/or vomiting, weight loss, change in liver size, gallstones, itching, and jaundice. However, a large number of people live many, many years with cirrhosis without any decompensation or symptoms."

http://janis7hepc.com/biopsies1.htm#can the results of my

This is an article called "Can my biopsy be wrong?"

I don't know about the wrist surgery, but there have been a few members in the last months who had surgery while on tx.  You might talk to your GP about this.  I think a lot depends on how bad the wrist is.  Grade 3 means you have quite a bit of inflammation.  I visualize this as the virus on the move.  I have grade 1 and decided that was enough inflammation for me to start treating but many will disagree.  What are your increasing symptoms (that is why I quoted that one section from Janis with symptoms)?  I think we all try to second guess our decisions as it gets close to starting treatment, but I sure would start in your situation. However it is such a personal decison noone can decide but you.  Good luck making the decision.
frijole
Blank
107513_tn?1232290064
I was told that the liver can have different stages of damage in different areas.
I saw this first hand, while undergoing the trial for the Fibroscan..
When administered from my abdomen, my liver stiffness readings where in the range of 4-4.2... When read from in between my ribs on my right side, exactly where biopsy was taken, stiffness read at 5-5.3.. This is only a slight diffenerence in readings, but did confirm atleast to me and my doc that the area previously biopsy may have shown the greatest fibrosis.
Blank
Avatar_m_tn
Hey guy, I think friole said it very well. If i was you id stick with the stage 2 grade 3. I'm not saying you couldn't but sometimes our mind can play tricks on us by just knowing we have hep-c. Before i found out i had cirrhosis i felt fine. Right after i found out for a while i started looking for any little thing and then i would think oh no. Has to be. My hepo told me that was normal for anyone to think. Odd thing once i stoped thinking about it i noticed things wern't there. And i realised it was me looking for things. When you see your doc talk to him and i bet he will set your mind to ease. Best of luck to ya
Blank
132578_tn?1189759437
I knew for several years  that I was going to have to have my left knee replaced. After my dx , considerable time was spent weighing the options , talked with my surgeon , HCV doc , rehab docs. I was grade 2 , stage 3. The overwhelming opinion of advisiors was "do the surgery now" . Reasons were , possible treatment related complications during surgery , potential and probable extended healing time and not feeling up to puting the time and effort into the rehabilitation required for the replacement to be considered a 100 % success . Looking back , I cant imagine going through that while tx for HCV.
Your issues being in your wrist , it may not be as bad , but I can certainly see it being a real "PITA"
And as stated any number of times when referencing tx sx , "everyone is different , talk to your doc
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
Thank you ALL very-very much.  I suspect that I may have too much time on my hands and too much to worry about.  I have an internal pain pump which injects morphine into the intrathecal area of my spine.  Made a big difference but I still have considerable back pain. My Pain Specialist (non-VA) has historically prescribed oxycodone for my "breakthrough pain." that results from just moving around during the day.  This pain prescription drives a lot of physicians - who are well intended - crazy.  They are always trying to convince me that the opioids are the main reason I have any problem at all.  That's why I wondered about the possibility of having a more severe issue with my liver.  Another problem with the VA is their TEAM approach to treating hep.  OK, it's actually a great idea but has caused me some angst.  When I heard I had been denied treatment the second time (Due to my chronic depression and my other medical problems) my sister called my care giver and threatened to go straight to our Congressional delegation to address the problem.  During her tirade she may have mentioned that I had become very depressed over their decision.  Well, next time I go in I get this, "Dog_Lover, (OK, they don't really call me that.) I understand that you have relapsed on your depression and that you are not taking medication."  "We can not treat you if you are not forthcoming with us."  Darn! Hoisted on my own petard!  This is the kind of thoughtless reason I encounter up there all the time.  They have arranged to hold a meeting with me in the next couple of weeks so we can agree on a contract that will require I keep a depression log and some other tasks then they will treat in September.  As the late and great American philosopher, Rodney Dangerfield once said, "Oh I tell ya, it ain't easy bein' me!"
Peace
Dog_Lover
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
Hey Bud, would you ask your friend about the actual Soc Sec hearing?  I have been able - through kind people like yourself - to get a pretty good idea of the process and the benefits but I am still in the dark about the hearing. I hadn't pestered you for a while about this and I'm also trying to run down SusanX00, she has also gone through the Soc Sec hoops.  Thanks again and as usual, take care and be safe.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
Were you looking for me?  About the Soc. Sec. Dis.?  I tried to file by myself, for several years and got turned down 3 times.  And then, I had my doctor write a letter, I collected all of my medical records and I contacted a S.S.D.I lawyer.  Also, Soc. Sec. send me to their own doctors for a separate examination.  I had to go to a SSDI psychologist for a mental exam testing and also a SSDI regular physician for a physical.  Both of them said I was disabled (which really helped my case for their own doctors to say that). But, my lawyer pointed that out in my hearing.  Also, I brought my sister along as a witness (she's an R.N. nurse).  Do whatever you can to document your case, but I highly recommend a lawyer.  Most of them won't charge you if you don't win.  But, if you do win. they will take a portion of your back pay.  However, I ended up owing the lawyer nothing and still had $20,000 in my own backpay money.  They do the back pay all the way back to when you first apply and since it took me 3 years to get it....
Keep in mind that this is SSDI and not SSI, there is a difference.

Susan400
Blank
Avatar_m_tn
I take it yo meant me. I was talking with you the other night about ss and had called a friend of mine.
One other thing, from what you say your medical state is. You have a great chance of getting a decision at your hearing. Although the judge can request you to go to a ss doctor. If he grants it that day you should have your money in about 30 days. Alot of time its direct deposited to your bank account before you get the offical letter from ss.

The hearing last about 10 minutes as their is alot of cases they see a day. The judge will have already looked at your records. Will ask your attorny if there is anything else. Might ask you  how you feel. So nothing to worry about. The judge is likely to be discusted that ss is even having him/her see the case.
Blank
Avatar_m_tn
here is the thread we were talking about it. Just scholl down to it. about ss and ssdi

Q: veins can see through my skin - contreras 05/26/2006
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
Yes, that was me looking for you.  I'm living on Pedigree (Alpo gives me gas) and am trying to get Social Security.  My chief complaint is my back, followed by depression/anxiety, a blown-out wrist (I will have to have it fused, can't type that kind of thing) and of course Hep-C. I'm a disaster.  I have an attorney, letters written by my two Internists, my Pain Management physician and a supervisory Internist at the VA.  Along with those letters I have one from my Paychitric Mental Health Nurse Practitioner and Social Worker. They all advocate permanent total disability and inability to work. I'm still waiting for the first hearing, I was turned down the first two times representing myself now I have an attorney. How long did you have to wait for your hearing?  I REALLY appreciate your tracking me down and sharing your experiences with me.  I'm pleased you prevailed and wish you the very best.
Craig
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
It's "Major Depressive Disorder with General Anxiety Disorder."  Pretty spooky.  I have been hospitalized three times, '88 '89 '05 all for suicidal idealations.  Only reason I'm here is 'cause I'm chicken.
Blank
132578_tn?1189759437
Of course , how stupid of me. There arent many 50 something gulf wars vets , at least not yet.
I was USN 74-79 .USS Parsons DDG-33 out of Yokosuka ,Japan.
All I came away with was this disease.
Take care man , I'll look for ya.
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
No, not really.  I went through a series of personal disasters during the latter half of 2004. My wife, of eleven years left me for another man while I was going through excruciating pain with my back on Valentine's Day 2004.  My back pain cost me my job, my house, my wife, my self-esteem and forced me into bankruptcy.  I was pretty near the bottom by December when I got the discharge from Bankruptcy court. I own a gun and had given it a great deal of thought but by then I was seeing the Psychiatrists and associated care givers at the VA and I made them a promise I wouldn't harm myself. Between the VA and my sister who is currently housing me and my dogs I am pretty safe. Now on the minus side, I want Interferon treatment which the VA is afraid to give me since I'm depressed, that of course depresses me even further when I think about the impersonal nature of the denial and what it's doing to my health.  I can't seek treatment for my increased depression because that just gives the VA more ammo to deny me.  Kind of a quandary huh?  I am as close to being suicidal as I have ever been and in fact if it were not for my sister and my dogs (In case you couldn't tell from my alias I adore canines of all kinds) I would drive up into the Mt Hood National Forest with a shotgun and put an end to this charade.
Blank
132578_tn?1189759437
I hear ya. I'm really not that impressed with all this myself , but I'm also not ready to leave the void for my friends(1) and my family that my death would bring. I've never been afraid of dying , I'm more afraid of living. Are you a  gulf war vet?
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
No, I was in the USMC from '76 to '81.  I never saw combat.  What probably toasted my back was my love for long-distance running.  I was running ultra-marathon type distance non-competitively.  An ultra is anything greater than fifty kilometers of about thirty miles.  A marathon is twenty-six point two miles. I fried my back and had two back surgeries while still in the Marines.  I got out with a medical/honorable discharge. After my spinal fusion I started running again, at one point running one-hundred miles in twenty-four hours. I ran for years.  My wife/girlfriend would go out with friends have dinner and drinks downtown and I'd run home. Running was an incredible high, far better than any drug I have ever tried. You can't feel your legs after a while and you just go, hours and hours at a time ... well those days are gone for me now and that makes me even sadder.  I have drawers full of running event tee-shirts and running numbers from events photos etc. But that's over now which is why I am just not so sure if I want to live too much longer.
Semper Fidelis
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
Ain't it crazy!?!  Hep C causes deep depression.  that 's one of the presenting symptoms.  Its toxic build up and self poisoning.

  I was under deep therapy for yrs and tried out lotsa AD's and none worked.  I went thru rehab to 'get normal' and start from ground zero and that didn't work.  My liver failed, massive bleed and told I had hrs to live-that didn't work-I was REALLY depressed then.

@ 2 wks after I made it out of the hospital-no insurance so they just put me out-I was dx w/hep c.  I got it thru a transfusion in 1967 and had been mis-dx for yrs.

In May 2002, I started tx and cl's by wk 2-also in May of '02.

Now, my life stresses are massive since then-as are anyone's who's managed to reach their late 50's.  People don't realize in their 40's that they are still coasting on life's plateau and it all comes crashing down in their 50's.  It's DNA and hormonal and the lenght of the DNA tail and no one can escape it-aging and it's not nice.

B/the point is-I'm not clinically depressed, suicidally depressed, immoblized depressed.

The only thing that has changed for the better is the clearing of the hep c.  My life-to outsiders is worse than 10yrs ago b/I'm not depressed.  So to me its better.  One can live materailistic or artistic and we chose artistic-poor b/calm, one hand givin' the peace sign and the other giving a high 5. so to speak.

So until doctors realize that the disease is causing lotsa depression itself, they will keep using out dated ctiteria for treatment.  the best thing a depressed hep c patient can do for him/herself is treat the hep c agressively as a major cause of the depression.
Blank
132578_tn?1189759437
Hi new-sojurn . I am at 10/48 Peg/RBV  , HCV-1a , 30 years. Getting old is definately not for sissy's. At 49 , I cant hardly imagine doing this 20?-30? more years. I'm already tired. Pete Townsend hit the nail on the head with  "I hope I die before I get old". I think one of my biggest fears going  into treatment was that because of my age (all of our ages) , will I ever fully recover from the treatment. It's a quality of life issue that wont get answered until its too late.

Can/will you elaborate on "My life-to outsiders is worse than 10yrs ago b/I'm not depressed"? Thats an interesting point.

"and the other one is hailing a taxicab"
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
I don't know who said this the first time but youth is wasted on the young. You hit the nail on the head, it's a chicken or egg thing, does hepatitis cause my depression?  Will curing or mitigating my hepatitis mitigate my depression?  Wait till I throw this into the VA melee!!  HA! I am seeing them next Monday when I will suggest this very thing and ask them to consider trying a new strategy, common sense.  Actually, these people have nothing to lose by treating me, it's not a money issue or supply of the medicine issue I think they really care not to do any further damage.  My gripe is the manner in which this is accomplished, I don't get to participate in it. With a mouth like mine it's hard to keep quiet.  Thanks for listening and being so patient.  You guys ROCK
Blank
132578_tn?1189759437
Was your Chronic Depression dx discribed at Clinical or Bipolar?
Blank
132578_tn?1189759437
I was diagnosed in 1990 with depression and a panic disorder. I tried a few different meds , one on one psyco-babble with my shrink and finally ended of taking 150 mg of nortriptylene (pamelor) and have been taking it ever since. It pretty much keeps my monsters away. After a while , the panic attacks stopped and I was re-diagnosed with Generalized Anxiety Disorder. My insurance wouldn't pay for the sessions and the anxiety of trying to figure out how I was going to continue to pay the shrink was sending me over the edge. So , I cut the shrink loose and just continued the medication.

It's been an interesting life hasn't it? Anxiety can be such a lovely compannion.

It's really a shame that they cant come up with the right combination of meds to get your issues straightened out.
Have meds never worked?
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
dog lover - so glad ou posted your story. I am going to have a real problem keeping you and dog lover28 straight.  Now which of you worked for the US Forest Service in Oregon (wasthat 28).  I can imagine how those years of running compacted the old spine and I can see how you fell into the great funk.  I think once you get this SSI hearing under your belt, and it certainly sounds that you will qualify, life will be easier.  If the VA will not treat you for the C, can't you go to a regular physician and then get on the Committment to Care or other program to provide meds?  I am pulling for you at the hearing.

can do - Boy, you are so right about those psychosomatic illnesses.  I am an extremely healthy person, but it is amazing over the years what I think I have just because I read something somewhere.  How are you today?  Lots of grandkids this weekend?  It has been quiet here, but I may call them to come stir it up today.
Kathy
Blank
Avatar_m_tn
Yeah its funny how the mind can do that to ya, even worse when its something serious. Didnt see the grands kids much they were busy. Plus this shot just didn't like me. Feeling much better though. Hope all is well with you.
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
Took the grandkids to the ballgame last night (we have a AAA team here).  Whinny whinny whinny. I want this and I want that.... I have a problem after about 6:00 evening where I just want to be alone. So I get really frustrated with the whinning in the evenings (and I suppose all 5 & 6 year olds are the same).  Still, it was fun and I am sure we will do it again (it was $1 night)

I am sorry you had a bad shot reaction this weekend.  That sucks.
Kath
Blank
Avatar_m_tn
Wow going to a AAA ballgame on tx with a 5 and 6 year old?  I think i'll stick to the little league games. Thats about all i can handle. Hope your having a good day.
Blank
Post a Comment
To
Blank
Weight Tracker
Weight Tracker
Start Tracking Now
Hepatitis C Community Resources
RSS Expert Activity
469720_tn?1388149949
Blank
Abdominal Aortic Aneurysm-treatable... Blank
Oct 04 by Lee Kirksey, MDBlank
242532_tn?1269553979
Blank
The 3 Essentials to Ending Emotiona...
Sep 18 by Roger Gould, M.D.Blank
242532_tn?1269553979
Blank
Control Emotional Eating with this ...
Sep 04 by Roger Gould, M.D.Blank
Top Hepatitis Answerers
163305_tn?1333672171
Blank
orphanedhawk
Rural Mural, CA
Avatar_f_tn
Blank
patra_
DeLand, FL
1815939_tn?1377995399
Blank
pooh55811
Avatar_f_tn
Blank
Livelife777
96938_tn?1189803458
Blank
FlGuy
South, FL
Avatar_f_tn
Blank
susan400
FL