Question for all Geno 2's that relapsed

Hi there
I was just wondering if all geno 2's and 3's that relapsed on this board had blood sugar related issues like insulin resistance, diabetes, pancreas conditions, hyperglycemia etc prior to TX...??
thanks in advance for your responses

[mkeela]

Just curious as to why you ask. I am a geno 2b, (not a relapser) and still have 5 weeks of tx left. I am scared to death of relapsing, especially because my backwoods doc won't do a more sensitive PCR...only does <615. I have been on the high side glucose range...just like 125,140,100, 99 etc. My liver enzymes have never went down either. So, like I said can you let me know why you ask, and did you find a study about this or anything?? Thanks, Mequila.

[FlGuy]

I hope you are well and acclimating to your new life on tx. I'm a geno 3, blood sugar issues (high), relapsed and am in week 6 in the do-over. After a lot of thought and some discussion with docs, I don't believe BloodSugar issues, or other endocrine stuff was related to relapsing. The endocrine stuff, more likely, was related to long-tern hcv (33 yrs).  Relapsing was more about dosing, duration, liver condition - maybe through a little age thrown in there. Isn't it a little early to worry about outcomes?  A more significant question for you to ask the masses might be how many geno 2/3 took a short-course approaches and succeeded.

[scubadiver30]

Well,
I don't remember the name of study, but it was done by spanish doctors regarding the issue of glucose in blood and insulin resistance lowering the odds of SVR. My doc did an insulin resistance test be4 I started TX and he said I was OK on that department...
Just wanted to make a small survey with all geno2 & 3s relapsers as to make a small sample.
If I find the study I'll post it
saludos
scuba

[scubadiver30]

Yes I guess I'm worrying too much and I just did shot 3. :-(
But I guess is this stupid mania of finding a reason 4 everything. I wanted to know if the relapse was really linked to high sugar in blood. Hope you don't get pissed cause of my question
BTW, how old were you when you did TX and relapsed?
How's Florida these days? :-)

saludos
scuba

[brokerboy]

I relapsed in 2000 after tx with 3X weekly interferon and riba..at that time i became aware of my high blood sugar...I lowered it with diet and exercise, but i didn't start testing my blood sugar until 2005..i just finished tx for the second tiem 7 weks ago and last weeks pcr was negative...i also have a worsening Fatty liver condition..i lost 20lbs on tx, but i am still having problems lowering my blood sugar..currently taking metformin 3x daily....please keep in touch, i am intersted in your inquiry....happy friday, alan

[scubadiver30]

these are a bunch of links to the info (but it is in spanish) :-(
I would translate but I feel kinda shitty today (after my shot). It basically says that insulin resistance, age and fatty liver lower our chances for SVR. It was a study done by doctors in Seville

http://www.consumer.es/web/es/salud/2005/04/10/141067.php

http://wwwscielo.isciii.es/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S1130-01082005000500001&lng=en&nrm=iso&tlng=es

http://www.aehc.es/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=281

[scubadiver30]

See what i mean??. 3 people that relapsed have posted and they all had issues with sugar. I'm gonna start exercising and not eating anything sugary during TX and not even after TX if I reach SVR
saludos

[scubadiver30]

sorry 2 people that relapsed  
sorry about that

[NYgirl]

Scubs I think the problem is that many more 2s and 3s are relapsing than the statistics give credence to. That is what Dr. J. said he really wanted to do a proper study on.

I think FLGuy is right - the other question would be how many relapsed on SHORT COURSE and why don't they automatically have 2s and 3s doing 48 like everybody else now since they are beginning to see so many relapses.

The odds from what we can see in here are certainly NOT 80% cure rate - it's not a "lucky geno" thing. Not a bit.

Maybe a lot of them wouldn't have relapsed had they been treated with the SOC of a geno 1.  I really believe that.

[Kalio1]

I relapsed (geno 3) but I have never had high blood sugar.

[NYgirl]

She's got the same amount of time left as me!!!!!!!!!  We're almost done!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! FINALLY FINALLY FINALLY! AFter 72 weeks...she'd know if she had high blood sugar or not hahahah.

yo girl we're almost at 72!

64 for me today.  WOWOWOWOW.

[scubadiver30]

So you think I should extend to 48?. I guess if I insist my doc won't mind because he's treating geno 1's mostly anyway. Maybe I could do something like 32 weeks??? I don't want to overdo it either

[NYgirl]

I would definitely positively without DOUBT ask to extend to 48.  But remember - I am a Geno 1 who asked to go to 72 weeks.

It just seems to me that if you look at the studies - and then use your own common sense...it seems to me that the extra weeks are well worth it.  I know the studies aren't done for geno 2 but done on geno 1 but I tend to try to think of HCV in terms of one disease.  

I really really do think that if we want to increase our odds that longer is the way to go.  I mean just thinking - the longer you put the virus killing medications into you, the longer they have to hunt out any remaining virus right?

I mean that makes sense to me.  If I could go on maintenance therapy after my 72 I would probably do it. Oh I don't want to be on interferon forever (GAD hardly) but I want to STAY SVR and am willing to try whatever need be.  

And the fact to me that Dr. Jacobson talked about this whole thing and said he was seeing WAY too many relapses...it sort of confirms my own personal thoughts.

But again remember I am CRAZY and probably would do this stuff for another year if I knew it would "cure" me for sure. Of course nobody knows.

I would seriously keep asking questions about this and make a decision based on what YOUR situation warrants. Don't let me be tooooo aggressive and point you either way you know?

I cant WAIT to be done. 8 more weeks after today and I am really AFRAID to stop the meds. I now see what everybody is talking about...it's harder to stop than to start.

[LindyK]

Hey Scub!  Sounds like you are doing better.  Glad to hear it.  I've been worried about you the last couple of days!  I did shot 3 last night and all went fine.

I have been kind of concerned about the Hep C doctor I've been seeing.  Kalio urged me to get a 4 week PCR ordered by my PCP because my Hep C doctor said no, only 12 week.  I haven't told anyone but what he actually said was if you're not UND at week 12 it's not going to work anyway. So I know he won't extend no matter what! I am thinking of changing to Dr. Gitlin in Atlanta as he comes highly recommended by a couple of members of this site.  I have to have a doctor that's going to be open-minded just in case something goes awry.

Linda
Geno 3

[rochammer]

scubadiver

I am 2 that relapsed (tx 24) and have low blood sugar not high so who know if it really has any thing to do with a relapse Just completed (tx 48)2 round 3 months ago. Waiting on the results of the PCR taken on Tuesday

nygirl

Yes it seem to be hard to stop tx no matter how bad it is at least when on tx I am fighting now all I can do is sit and wait.

rock

[scubadiver30]

Maybe I should rephrase the question.. what was the BMI, weight, age, fatty liver status, TX durations and bloodsugar factors of those geno 2s and 3s who relapsed?

thanks again for your responses

[Kalio1]

Im female, 50, BMI 21, 5'11", 150 ( was 165 when I started tx first round) tx'ed 24 weeks, no fatty liver found, I have not had high blood sugar but I do have stage 3 liver damage.

Try not to worry about it too much! Try to eat a good liver friendly diet and drink your water. The odds for your geno are  much better that you clear the virus than relapse.

[Eisbein]

I was a 2a.
Tx in 2001 with Intron and Riba for 24 weeks, and relapsed.
My weight was 150 pounds, which was about 25 pounds too much. No signs of diabetes or anything, I felt healthy as an ox. Triglycerides were around 100.
I lost 15 pounds of lard on Intron and never put it back on again.
Started tx in Oct 2003 at 135 pounds and made it (but tx over 2 years).
My weight is now 130 pounds, and I am pre-diabetic. Doc wants another 8 pounds of my ribs to reverse the process, but I just can't loose the weight.
I know what could do the trick...another round of Interferon...sick joke, don't listen.
I am 5'3" and by no means fat, but there is this little tire I am supposed to loose.

Ina

[FlGuy]

Sorry if there was an irritating ring to my earlier post - wasn't meant to be.  My only point was that there may be some positive things along the course of your tx that may provide 'shortening opportunites'. We have seem some g 2/3's who took a short cut to success.  Rifleman did it in 12, Amommy less than 24 - and a few others I can't remember. Have you and doc deceided on the first pcr - week 4 or so? An eraly one may serve you well later. I was in Spain this time of year, several years ago - it was beautiful.

[FlGuy]

Sorry for the pcr question.  Just read your answer - duh.

[mkeela]

Thank you so much for answering and for the links :)

[scubadiver30]

I really do appreciate your input.
And now that I'm getting used to the meds , shoot, if I can I will go the 48 then. Is just a matter of convincing my Dr about it..Do u know if dr J has a website? or do u have somekind of info I could show to back my request for more meds being a 2? I'll post my 2 and 4 week PCR soon
Thanks a lot for your help

[anise]

Scuba/NYgirl, I asked my doctor and NP about relapses, etc. for Genotype 2's.  

My doctor and Np have worked over 13 years dealing with Hep c..  They said that the NorthWest genotype 2 is more prevalent than 1's, for some unknown reason. I suspect that many vietnam vets acquired the virus overseas, whether by vaccines or IV drugs,  and brought it to the west coast.

My NP has worked at the Vet hospitals and said to me that geno 2's are easier to clear.  When I asked her what was the relapse rate, she said she doesn't have many.  Especially when they test negative at 6 weeks, 12 weeks, 24 weeks, and 3 months post treatment.  She still claims that it is 80-92% curable and after 3 months post 99%.  I asked her if I could relapse by 6 months post.  She said she has heard of it happening, but she has never experienced it!

[GoofyDad]

Geno 3a, cirrhosis, high(ish) blood sugar. 6 mos tx and SVR. Still feeling the affects of interferon, I'm glad I didn't go any longer.

I believe the thing you want to look at is the 4 week viral load results. Und by sensitive test bodes very well, IMO. Also RIBA and anemia are you allies in this war :) Good luck!

NYG, can you help me understand what Dr J would do in a 'real' study that differs from the many studies that I've read showing quite good SVR rates for geno 2? And why on earth would they be 'begining' to see increases in relapses? That just sounds strange.

[Cindy10]

I must admit this subject has been on my mind. I was not UND at 4 weeks, but the doc says if I am at 12 weeks I will go on to the 24 weeks. He said they would not extend. So now I wonder if it will be enough. Does not seem like it would. I guess I dont have a choice but wait and see. My hubby is 3a and has been told due to the cirhosis he must do 48 weeks. So we wait and pray!

[sfbaygirl]

Can you get a PCR before week 12? What was your VL at week 4? Because you are going going 24 weeks, I would want to know when you clear exactly with a very sensitive PCR. The alternative to not doing enough tx, is having to do it over for much longer.

[Cindy10]

They wont let me do another pcr before 12 weeks, I tried.
At four weeks they did a quantative which shows <615 than they did a qualitative which goes down to <10 but it just showed detected. So I am somewhere between 10 and 615 or a least I was. I just did # 9 so I may be UND now, but I wont know.

[sfbaygirl]

I hate the not knowing! I thought I was UND at 10 weeks and found out about 20 weeks that I was inbetween 75 and 200 IU/ml. Now I am driving myself nuts, trying to figure out when I was clear. You only have a few more weeks to go to find out. That's good the sensitivity of your test is <10. We'll keep our fingers crossed.