Aa
Sleeplessness
No matter what I take, Valium 10 mg, Ativan 2 mg, I can't get to sleep a lot of times. Anyone experience severe insomnia like this on TX?
billstrong1969
billstrong1969
They have never taken triazolam off the market in the US, that I know of. I believe they did reduce the max dose from .5 to .25mg. Physical dependence is a risk with all of the benzos not just triazolam. Valium (diazepam) ,Xanax (alprazolam) ,Ativan (lorazepam), all have the same profile as halcion (triazolam), and all carry risks for psychological problems just like the abuse of any CNS drug would. And billstrong stated that he's used two other weaker benzos to no avail.
I have never heard of an increased risk of suicide on this side of the Atlantic. In Europe they were prescribing it at doses 4X higher than in the US so anything is possible when people are that drugged up. It should be noted however that many people who take sleep aids also have a history of depression and other psychological disorders which disrupt their sleep making them necessary in the first place. How would one separate their higher risk for suicide as a result of their psychoses from any possible negative effects from the triazololam ? For those of us with compromised livers, benzos like valium actually pose more risk for toxicity because of its longer half-life. Halcion half-life is extremely short at about 2 hours.
If a stronger sleeping aid is what you need to finish treatment, then the benefit far exceeds any known risks for triazolam when prescribed and used appropriately.
ML
I have never heard of an increased risk of suicide on this side of the Atlantic. In Europe they were prescribing it at doses 4X higher than in the US so anything is possible when people are that drugged up. It should be noted however that many people who take sleep aids also have a history of depression and other psychological disorders which disrupt their sleep making them necessary in the first place. How would one separate their higher risk for suicide as a result of their psychoses from any possible negative effects from the triazololam ? For those of us with compromised livers, benzos like valium actually pose more risk for toxicity because of its longer half-life. Halcion half-life is extremely short at about 2 hours.
If a stronger sleeping aid is what you need to finish treatment, then the benefit far exceeds any known risks for triazolam when prescribed and used appropriately.
ML
I agree - that stuff is controversial. I would not take it routinely. Studies show it doesn't really enhance much for athletes like they once thought.
MB, you also recommend a while back introducing estrogen into the tx mix. Where do you get this information? These things can be dangerous.
Trinity
MB, you also recommend a while back introducing estrogen into the tx mix. Where do you get this information? These things can be dangerous.
Trinity
Human growth hormones to sleep? would that make you more energized? I must be missing something here?
I take a odd tylenol pm, or ambien, 2:30 9s my wake up time also!
I take a odd tylenol pm, or ambien, 2:30 9s my wake up time also!
Didn't they take Halcion off the market for a while? Due to increased tendencies for suicide and psycotic episodes? It was then reintroduced after further study but only available in low doses. It is still outlawed in the UK. Physical dependence was also noted but that may have been with higher doses as well.
I neglected to tell you that there are other medication options. Triazolam (brand name Halcion) is a benzo at the opposite end of the spectrum from ativan,which is also a benzo.It has a short half-life so hangovers are rare especially with the lower dose. Get a few from the doc to see if they agree with you. I haven't met anybody who didn't get some positive effect on their sleep from triazolam, when all else fails. Best of luck.
ML
ML
I was on Interferon for almost 2 years and Infergen for the last 13 months. I realized right at the beginning I was going to need something to help me sleep. I tried all of the prescription sleep aids and none worked. Then one night, out of frustration, I took 4 Excedrin PM and slept like a baby! My Drs said that taking the Excedrin was not actually the best thing to take but they agreed that sleep was more important on this treatment. For the last several years I have taken it for sleep w/out any problems. The Riba always upset my stomach some but I don't think the Excedrin contributed to that. Everyone will tell you that you shouldn't do what I did and I concur, but if you want to sleep you might want to try it. I wish you luck and pleasant dreams.
Exactly my feelings Mr. Glass - you gotta do what you gotta do.
The main goal is getting through treatment successfully (although I'm not sure I would ever take human growth hormone as suggested above - that seems a bit far out there to me) I basically mean in GENERAL, as always, and with the advice from a doctor.
Without Ambien I still wouldn't be sleeping today (thyroid issue I guess). I feel like a walking pharmacy sometimes now but I do get through the day and am SVR so.......it's fine ;)
The main goal is getting through treatment successfully (although I'm not sure I would ever take human growth hormone as suggested above - that seems a bit far out there to me) I basically mean in GENERAL, as always, and with the advice from a doctor.
Without Ambien I still wouldn't be sleeping today (thyroid issue I guess). I feel like a walking pharmacy sometimes now but I do get through the day and am SVR so.......it's fine ;)
I agree with Nygirl. I tried adjusting the time that I would take RIBA several times and it made little difference in my sleep.
I am a firm believer in doing what ever it takes to make it through tx (with in reason).
Sleep Deprivation almost caused me to throw the towel in on tx. Elavil and Ambian saved me.
I am a firm believer in doing what ever it takes to make it through tx (with in reason).
Sleep Deprivation almost caused me to throw the towel in on tx. Elavil and Ambian saved me.
Taking the riba 3 in the morning 2 at night only helps until you build up the serum level and then unfortunately.....it's cranked up pretty much all the time.
I didn't sleep for all 72 weeks of treatment - the Ambien is good at knocking you out but woke up at 2am regardless. However with it I was able to fall BACK asleep (even if it was 15 times a night).
Sleep unfortunately just doesn't go hand and hand with treatment. I would advise however that you do try the ambien........you really have nothing to lose (we don't have medical marijuana in this state but even if we did I'd probably weight 300 pounds if I had tried that!)
deb
I didn't sleep for all 72 weeks of treatment - the Ambien is good at knocking you out but woke up at 2am regardless. However with it I was able to fall BACK asleep (even if it was 15 times a night).
Sleep unfortunately just doesn't go hand and hand with treatment. I would advise however that you do try the ambien........you really have nothing to lose (we don't have medical marijuana in this state but even if we did I'd probably weight 300 pounds if I had tried that!)
deb
We've corresponded a couple of times.
In addition to what Mr. Liver said (eat, sleep, mood), I'd throw in another one; exercise or at least some level of tiring physical activity long before bedtime. Your profile says you get a lost of rest, but you don't get seem to get the sleep you need. Maybe consider getting out in the nice Minnesota summer weather and get walking, running, biking to the extent that you can. I think it really helps and gets your mind off the never-ending cycle of meds and other sx's. Good luck.
In addition to what Mr. Liver said (eat, sleep, mood), I'd throw in another one; exercise or at least some level of tiring physical activity long before bedtime. Your profile says you get a lost of rest, but you don't get seem to get the sleep you need. Maybe consider getting out in the nice Minnesota summer weather and get walking, running, biking to the extent that you can. I think it really helps and gets your mind off the never-ending cycle of meds and other sx's. Good luck.
Three of the most important things you must do regularly on tx....eat, sleep, and watch your mood. Any continued problems with any side effects such as these and your tx can come to a screeching halt.
Well advanced liver disease can cause disruption of normal sleep cycles with many patients reversing their day/night schedule. I alternated between halcion and ambien.
Good luck at getting some rest.
ML
Well advanced liver disease can cause disruption of normal sleep cycles with many patients reversing their day/night schedule. I alternated between halcion and ambien.
Good luck at getting some rest.
ML
Try to stay away from the drug cocktails if at all possible. Our livers are under enough stress already with tx.
for many changing the GABA receptor reaction works better and is less addictive (ambien) For HCV'ers insomnia is common.
the reason may help: Your liver makes sam-e daytime, and meletonin at night.
since liver no workie, hence less of those chemicals at the proper time of day.
Also, the pituitary is effevted somehow by the virus (low HGH is common in HCV, much more than the general populace where it is rare)
So I take HGH injections as well as ambien (but this is hard to get unless you can document a definciency. (see my thread on HGH in this forum)
Even with both of these on board, the RIBA makes me feel like I drank 10 pots of coffee.
MY solution is two fold...1. I added remeron at night (a lild antidep. that causes deeper sleep) and 2. I take my riba early morn, and early eve WITH .05 ativan.
I'm aware of a much less agitated state when the Riba kicks in, and this small a dose should ne easier to waen off from post tx.
The trouble with the meds you are on is 1 they aren't working and 2 the higher doses of those 2 will be very rough to get off of later.
although lets dace it none of this stuff will be fun to get of of...everything has problems that way just about...
the main thing, is to try something different that might work.
I think taking early is important so riba concentration will be lower at night.
I also thin whatever sleep aide you take, you kinda have to try and get settled in to bed when you do because that initial window when things do make you drowsy is very small...and if you are busy watching something, or writing or phoning...anything, it will pass and then you are left up for hours. I think the brain makes more adrenaline when we try to stay awake to hear or watch things is why. I've noticed any startling noise or disruption just when I'm drifting off will also make my heart start pumping and then I'm up for hours....so controling ones night time environment is super important.
It may even require you sleep alone for a while, just so that your brain waves don't get hyped back into overdrive when someone else snores, or rolls over.
the reason may help: Your liver makes sam-e daytime, and meletonin at night.
since liver no workie, hence less of those chemicals at the proper time of day.
Also, the pituitary is effevted somehow by the virus (low HGH is common in HCV, much more than the general populace where it is rare)
So I take HGH injections as well as ambien (but this is hard to get unless you can document a definciency. (see my thread on HGH in this forum)
Even with both of these on board, the RIBA makes me feel like I drank 10 pots of coffee.
MY solution is two fold...1. I added remeron at night (a lild antidep. that causes deeper sleep) and 2. I take my riba early morn, and early eve WITH .05 ativan.
I'm aware of a much less agitated state when the Riba kicks in, and this small a dose should ne easier to waen off from post tx.
The trouble with the meds you are on is 1 they aren't working and 2 the higher doses of those 2 will be very rough to get off of later.
although lets dace it none of this stuff will be fun to get of of...everything has problems that way just about...
the main thing, is to try something different that might work.
I think taking early is important so riba concentration will be lower at night.
I also thin whatever sleep aide you take, you kinda have to try and get settled in to bed when you do because that initial window when things do make you drowsy is very small...and if you are busy watching something, or writing or phoning...anything, it will pass and then you are left up for hours. I think the brain makes more adrenaline when we try to stay awake to hear or watch things is why. I've noticed any startling noise or disruption just when I'm drifting off will also make my heart start pumping and then I'm up for hours....so controling ones night time environment is super important.
It may even require you sleep alone for a while, just so that your brain waves don't get hyped back into overdrive when someone else snores, or rolls over.
I hate sleep aides too and have tried everything but after a bad ambien experience i decided no more and now I sleep when I can, day or nite. I am old and retired so I do have the luxury of sleeping when the urge comes. I also take 3 ribas in the am and 2 in pm and seems alot better. Tomorrow I will do the AM injection of interferon and see how that works. Today I woke up at 9:30 AM which was the best I have done in months.
Insomnia is the biggest drag of sx.
Insomnia is the biggest drag of sx.
I'll make this simple for you. During my last treatment (and to this day), I've had terrible Insomnia, which is now under control with Medical Marijuana. The doctor prescribed it for me and I carry a card from the state of Nevada. Two normal hits and I always sleep 8 hrs. Without it, I get 5. You do the math... Good luck...
Magnum
Magnum
I went so many days without sleep that one Friday I was driving home from work so out of myself that the only thought I had was to drive to the emergency room---TO TAKE HOSTAGE A ANESTHEOLOGIST ! TO PUT ME TO SLEEP!! hee hee
I did finally get some sleep that weekend without the drastic measures !! But insomnia is definately part of this treatment.!! I started out with insomnia before treatment & it definately has gotten worse...I go through spells so my doc prescribed Lunesta..Ambien made me a little crazy-- I'm already crazy so didn't need anything to ad to it ..
I also take Seroquel to help me sleep but when I get in a "phase" nothing really works...
and it *****!
It's worse than all the nausea, & fatigue I deal with everyday...
Good luck to everyone and have a sleepy night...
Dorsey
I did finally get some sleep that weekend without the drastic measures !! But insomnia is definately part of this treatment.!! I started out with insomnia before treatment & it definately has gotten worse...I go through spells so my doc prescribed Lunesta..Ambien made me a little crazy-- I'm already crazy so didn't need anything to ad to it ..
I also take Seroquel to help me sleep but when I get in a "phase" nothing really works...
and it *****!
It's worse than all the nausea, & fatigue I deal with everyday...
Good luck to everyone and have a sleepy night...
Dorsey
I've had raging insomnia since childhood. I had to start taking sleep medication a few years ago. I take ambien cr and it helps with the increased agitation and restlessness that I've experienced from the tx. Some nights are still bad, but I would never get through without a little blue pill.
The cr works best for me because it helps me to stay asleep longer. Regular ambien puts me to sleep quickly and well, but then I'm up for the rest of the night. The cr takes longer to work because it's a smaller dose initially, but then the controlled release portion kicks in and helps to facilitate longer sleep.
The cr works best for me because it helps me to stay asleep longer. Regular ambien puts me to sleep quickly and well, but then I'm up for the rest of the night. The cr takes longer to work because it's a smaller dose initially, but then the controlled release portion kicks in and helps to facilitate longer sleep.
i have a terrible time with sleep.......i take ambien ..melatiton everything its crazy
nothing works if you get a remedy that works for you let me know ..im scared that i wont be able to sleep after treatment
i wake up every 2hours..
toss and turn
nothing works if you get a remedy that works for you let me know ..im scared that i wont be able to sleep after treatment
i wake up every 2hours..
toss and turn
Hi Bill- It's good to see you-its been awhile! I am sorry to hear of your sleeping troubles.
I have to agree with Kristina. Have you tried a sleepy time tea? I use the Lipton brand with a touch of honey or stevia. (don't mean to start a sweetner discussion) And I have been surprised at how well it works.
Hope you find some relief. Please keep us posted. :-)
Isobella
I have to agree with Kristina. Have you tried a sleepy time tea? I use the Lipton brand with a touch of honey or stevia. (don't mean to start a sweetner discussion) And I have been surprised at how well it works.
Hope you find some relief. Please keep us posted. :-)
Isobella
Insomnia is a side effect of treatment. I resisted taking Ambien when they told they would prescribe it initially when i could not sleep. I ended up going back and asking for later when i just could not sleep. It was effecting my life big time. It works very well. I now having no sleep issues. For me this was the ticket.
If I sleep 4 hrs straight that's a good night for me. I hate the tossing and turning, but I hate sleep aides more so I've learned to live with it. Not sleeping well is one of the worst side effects for me. I had to change my injection from Friday pm to Friday am because at about wk 15 I started getting so hyper after shot that I didn't sleep ANY on Friday nights. All weekend I felt draggy and tired from not sleeping. At least when I start getting hyper - I'm at work now. I understand the insomnia - it awful.
Trinity
Trinity
Hey Bill, I'm doing shot 6 in two more days. For the first 2 weeks if tx I couldn't get more than 90 minutes sleep at a time and it was really starting to do my head in.
My nurse recommended chamomile tea and suggested I take the the 3 tabs of riba in the am and 2 in the pm instead of the other way around. I finally got some zoplican from my doctor and only needed a half tab to get to sleep for 4 whole hours!!! - it was absolute heaven. I have also swapped the riba around.
You'll see a search engine on the top rhs of this page - if you enter 'insomnia' 'sleep' 'ambien' you'll get some threads from those in the States (I think zoplican is NZ). There has been a lot of talk about this sx. I slept the last 2 nights without the sleeping tabs, but I still get a deeper sleep and feel better the next day if I use them. I'm managing 6 hours in a row now, with the sleepers and without (i.e. with the tea)
I did try the chamomile tea - I was drinking it all afternoon instead of other drinks, and then mixed it with a "sleepytime" herbal tea while reading in bed; if that didn't work I took half a sleeper. I was pleasantly surprised that tea helped me heaps and appears to be calming as well.
If I only got 2 hours sleep, then another 2 etc during the night; I was forcing myself to sleep during the day to try to make up 6 hours - it was exhausting hard work - but sleep deprivation was the nasty alternative. I suggest you get hold of your doctor and let them know you simply can't manage without a decent rest. Good luck...... it does seem to affect quite a few of us, not sure why, but it's certainly debilitating so I hope you can get it sorted quickly so that you can carry on soldiering on!!!!
My nurse recommended chamomile tea and suggested I take the the 3 tabs of riba in the am and 2 in the pm instead of the other way around. I finally got some zoplican from my doctor and only needed a half tab to get to sleep for 4 whole hours!!! - it was absolute heaven. I have also swapped the riba around.
You'll see a search engine on the top rhs of this page - if you enter 'insomnia' 'sleep' 'ambien' you'll get some threads from those in the States (I think zoplican is NZ). There has been a lot of talk about this sx. I slept the last 2 nights without the sleeping tabs, but I still get a deeper sleep and feel better the next day if I use them. I'm managing 6 hours in a row now, with the sleepers and without (i.e. with the tea)
I did try the chamomile tea - I was drinking it all afternoon instead of other drinks, and then mixed it with a "sleepytime" herbal tea while reading in bed; if that didn't work I took half a sleeper. I was pleasantly surprised that tea helped me heaps and appears to be calming as well.
If I only got 2 hours sleep, then another 2 etc during the night; I was forcing myself to sleep during the day to try to make up 6 hours - it was exhausting hard work - but sleep deprivation was the nasty alternative. I suggest you get hold of your doctor and let them know you simply can't manage without a decent rest. Good luck...... it does seem to affect quite a few of us, not sure why, but it's certainly debilitating so I hope you can get it sorted quickly so that you can carry on soldiering on!!!!
Dear Bill,
I'm still early in my tx (fifth shot today), but I have quite a bit of agitation, so it can be very difficult for me to sleep, which in turn makes me even more cranky. However, as these few weeks have passed I have some nights where I do get some sleep. And I have not been getting any exercise at all and keep telling myself to get moving because it might help, but haven't been able to do it yet. No answers but lots of sympathy.
Best wishes for some sleep soon.
Wilful1
I'm still early in my tx (fifth shot today), but I have quite a bit of agitation, so it can be very difficult for me to sleep, which in turn makes me even more cranky. However, as these few weeks have passed I have some nights where I do get some sleep. And I have not been getting any exercise at all and keep telling myself to get moving because it might help, but haven't been able to do it yet. No answers but lots of sympathy.
Best wishes for some sleep soon.
Wilful1
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