Aa
Stiff fingers and joint pain
I posted this on the other forum, but will try here, too. maybe with more luck.
I have been noticing during the last few weeks that my fingers have become a little stiff. Not very much, but it is a little uncomfortable. The middle joint of my right middle finger has been hurting for about a week and is slightly swollen. It is getting a little worse every day. It feels a bit hotter to the touch, than the others. (I did NOT hit or twist this finger)
Does anyone know what this could be? It kind of sounds like the onset of RA or RA in a mild form to me??? Could that be right?
FYI, I'm seeing my doctor about it next week.
Marcia
I have been noticing during the last few weeks that my fingers have become a little stiff. Not very much, but it is a little uncomfortable. The middle joint of my right middle finger has been hurting for about a week and is slightly swollen. It is getting a little worse every day. It feels a bit hotter to the touch, than the others. (I did NOT hit or twist this finger)
Does anyone know what this could be? It kind of sounds like the onset of RA or RA in a mild form to me??? Could that be right?
FYI, I'm seeing my doctor about it next week.
Marcia
Hey, Thanks Magnum...I have alot of arthritis, fibromyalgia and joint pain My fingers at times and my knee at other times etc. One of my worst is nuropathy in my feet. I am going to try that hot and cold water. What do I have to lose? NOTHING! Anyone else out there have any good tips for me?
Thanks for the warning. Since I have been dx'ed, I stopped spraying perfume directly on my skin. I spray it on my clothes instead. Also I have changed all my personal hygiene items, creams, etc to organic ones. So I guess I'm already on the right path.
The drops of essential oils I drop into the mixture, are just a few drops into ca 1/2 liter of shea butter and coconut oil. Less than fragrance found in any body or facial cream.
Marcia
The drops of essential oils I drop into the mixture, are just a few drops into ca 1/2 liter of shea butter and coconut oil. Less than fragrance found in any body or facial cream.
Marcia
Thanks. Interesting... I 'd trade RA for gout any time.... I really hope it's that. I have had gout in one toe ca 11 years ago.
Am going to see my doc tomorrow.
Marcia
Am going to see my doc tomorrow.
Marcia
Boy you sure get the posts. I had it explained to me this way. If it attacks one joint on the extemities especially the big toe or a fiinger joint it's called pseudo-gout and will bounce from joint to joint, maybe hitting three joints at once. It is directly connected to hep C. or cirhosis. If it flairs and you have your joint scoped, like I did and, they find no crystals it is not RA. You should know by now that joint pain is part of the deal.
I have my own theory though. I think it has something to do with the capillary blood vessels ending in the joints and they cannot handle the virus or the drugs due to their sub-needle like size. I don't know about others but my veins feel a little swollen at all times. I have asked my pcp about this and he thinks I'm nuts anyway, but I think it has validity since if you can't find the crystals it defies bursitis, arthritis and RA.
Good to hear from you and I hope things are going well, as they can be.
B.T. Smith
I have my own theory though. I think it has something to do with the capillary blood vessels ending in the joints and they cannot handle the virus or the drugs due to their sub-needle like size. I don't know about others but my veins feel a little swollen at all times. I have asked my pcp about this and he thinks I'm nuts anyway, but I think it has validity since if you can't find the crystals it defies bursitis, arthritis and RA.
Good to hear from you and I hope things are going well, as they can be.
B.T. Smith
Alot of doctors today realize that Cortisone shots are not healthy with patients who have hep C. So many doctors are not using Cortisone they are using lidocaine which I believe is better for your Liver.
Yes, this might not be the best solution for many yet if the pain is so severe and if you have taken medicines such as: Nortriptyline and othere similiar to it might not work for you or you might have reactions. I am not telling anyone to get this procedure I am only suggesting this for someone who is in severe pain and has no other options. In Marcia's case she said the pain is "minimal" so this might not be the best option for her. Yet in my case I have the worst pains in my palms of hands, fingers and I have no other options.
Yes, this might not be the best solution for many yet if the pain is so severe and if you have taken medicines such as: Nortriptyline and othere similiar to it might not work for you or you might have reactions. I am not telling anyone to get this procedure I am only suggesting this for someone who is in severe pain and has no other options. In Marcia's case she said the pain is "minimal" so this might not be the best option for her. Yet in my case I have the worst pains in my palms of hands, fingers and I have no other options.
steroid injections have a downside for liver patients.
that's why I recommended massage and most folks can massage one hand with the other if the inflammation isn't too advanced.
cortisone is toxic to the liver at any age. Protocol originally was to not give shots to those under 70. (those over 70 yes, because they didn't need a liver that much longer).
Weird but those were words a doctor told me.
I make a fist with one hand, and gently use my good knuckles to massage the inflammed area of the other hand.
Several minutes of this brings all new blood and oxygen to the area. You can increased the circulation to an area threeefold this way.
The new blood feeds cells, and this alone allows inflammation (caused from waste) to be carried off.
Marcia, I'd be careful of any perfumes oils while of tx because you can get a reaction when white counts are low. I ended up in ER from 2 drops of perfume once, so just know what one persons skin may tolerate may not be true for folks on Riba with all it's skin issues and Interferon compromising your immune system makes systemic histamine reactions much more common and a genuine concern.
As to the coffee drinking. The average cup of coffee contains 300 milligrams of speed.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize 6 cups a day would be 1800 milligrams,
or about 18 dexadrine or benzadrine or nodoz tablets...to see the equivalent.
in the PDR (physicians desk Reference) this amount carries warnings which include cardiac events.
Caffiene is a drug, and it is a duiretic removing both water and essential minerals and it is NOT condusive to better health no matter how many coffee industry sponsored (or airhead inspired) websites say otherwise.
This is about the equivalent of believing the old tobacco industry slogans that smoking is healthful and recommended by doctors!! Sheesh.
mb
that's why I recommended massage and most folks can massage one hand with the other if the inflammation isn't too advanced.
cortisone is toxic to the liver at any age. Protocol originally was to not give shots to those under 70. (those over 70 yes, because they didn't need a liver that much longer).
Weird but those were words a doctor told me.
I make a fist with one hand, and gently use my good knuckles to massage the inflammed area of the other hand.
Several minutes of this brings all new blood and oxygen to the area. You can increased the circulation to an area threeefold this way.
The new blood feeds cells, and this alone allows inflammation (caused from waste) to be carried off.
Marcia, I'd be careful of any perfumes oils while of tx because you can get a reaction when white counts are low. I ended up in ER from 2 drops of perfume once, so just know what one persons skin may tolerate may not be true for folks on Riba with all it's skin issues and Interferon compromising your immune system makes systemic histamine reactions much more common and a genuine concern.
As to the coffee drinking. The average cup of coffee contains 300 milligrams of speed.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize 6 cups a day would be 1800 milligrams,
or about 18 dexadrine or benzadrine or nodoz tablets...to see the equivalent.
in the PDR (physicians desk Reference) this amount carries warnings which include cardiac events.
Caffiene is a drug, and it is a duiretic removing both water and essential minerals and it is NOT condusive to better health no matter how many coffee industry sponsored (or airhead inspired) websites say otherwise.
This is about the equivalent of believing the old tobacco industry slogans that smoking is healthful and recommended by doctors!! Sheesh.
mb
joint pain is very common with hcv, however there is usually no inflamation or joint dammage. mine has increased steadily over the years and it aint no fun, it is a drag when i have trouble playing my guitar but i pain pill and i am back in the saddle and happily plunking away
Leah, that's great it went away with tx. I'm hoping for the same!
Isobella Thank you all for the info... I've had fatigue and weakness for 5 months now, and I guess that is what is bringing it forth. I'm also getting more muscle aches than I had before. Seems like everything has gotten worse, except the fatigue and brain fogg are a bit better than 3 months ago. But none of it is painful enough to have to take anything. I think this is what the elder feel like... you know what I mean.
Palmbeach... I do NOT have much pain at all. It is just kind of uncomfortable..
I most probably have had hep c for 25 years and RA would make more sense than anything else. Also from the symptoms I have it makes more sense.
Anyways, I will have the doc evaluate what I have very soon...
Marcia
Isobella Thank you all for the info... I've had fatigue and weakness for 5 months now, and I guess that is what is bringing it forth. I'm also getting more muscle aches than I had before. Seems like everything has gotten worse, except the fatigue and brain fogg are a bit better than 3 months ago. But none of it is painful enough to have to take anything. I think this is what the elder feel like... you know what I mean.
Palmbeach... I do NOT have much pain at all. It is just kind of uncomfortable..
I most probably have had hep c for 25 years and RA would make more sense than anything else. Also from the symptoms I have it makes more sense.
Anyways, I will have the doc evaluate what I have very soon...
Marcia
I copied an article for you
The trouble with having pain, numbness, tingling, stiffness, burning, or swelling in your wrists, hands, fingers, and thumbs is that it will be too quickly labeled arthritis, bursitis, tendinitis, carpal tunnel syndrome, or peripheral neuropathy.
It may surprise you to learn that these abnormal sensations rarely originate in the fingers and hands but are almost always the effects of trigger points in muscles of the neck, chest, upper back, shoulders, upper arms, and forearms. This is called “referred pain.” Trigger points typically send their pain elsewhere. a forearm muscle that operates the fingers, are the prime cause of stiff fingers.These same trigger points contribute to the pain of tennis elbow and send pain to the second knuckles of the third and fourth fingers. Knuckle pain referred from this muscle feels just like the pain of arthritis. You may have believed for years that you suffer from arthritis and it simply may not be true.
Sometimes, the hand muscles themselves can be the unrecognized source of problems in the hand.
Hope this helps by my advice to you Marcia if your experiencing alot of pain in your fingers is to see a hand surgeon not to have surgery of course but to get trigger finger injections with cortisone shots to block the pain. I am getting shots on Wednesday I will tell you if I get alot of relief or not.
The trouble with having pain, numbness, tingling, stiffness, burning, or swelling in your wrists, hands, fingers, and thumbs is that it will be too quickly labeled arthritis, bursitis, tendinitis, carpal tunnel syndrome, or peripheral neuropathy.
It may surprise you to learn that these abnormal sensations rarely originate in the fingers and hands but are almost always the effects of trigger points in muscles of the neck, chest, upper back, shoulders, upper arms, and forearms. This is called “referred pain.” Trigger points typically send their pain elsewhere. a forearm muscle that operates the fingers, are the prime cause of stiff fingers.These same trigger points contribute to the pain of tennis elbow and send pain to the second knuckles of the third and fourth fingers. Knuckle pain referred from this muscle feels just like the pain of arthritis. You may have believed for years that you suffer from arthritis and it simply may not be true.
Sometimes, the hand muscles themselves can be the unrecognized source of problems in the hand.
Hope this helps by my advice to you Marcia if your experiencing alot of pain in your fingers is to see a hand surgeon not to have surgery of course but to get trigger finger injections with cortisone shots to block the pain. I am getting shots on Wednesday I will tell you if I get alot of relief or not.
The pain, swelling and heat in my right index finger-big joint at the bottom, is what lead to my being diagnosed with Hep C. My primary sent me to the RA doc because my RA factor was slightyly elevated.
Doing further blood work, the hep was found.
My feet are also giving me trouble. I am just now able to walk comfortably after 16 weeks of dealing with plantar fascaitis (sp). And a bone spur.
I am not taking any meds for either. I was taking an n-said, but now just use massage and whirlpool therapy. Also, very picky about the shoes I wear.
My RA doc also said that my immune system had taken a hit - I was really sick last summer, before being diagnosed-and that my body was having a sustained inflammatory response. That was the problem causing the joint pain-not RA, even tho blood levels were slighty elevated.
Looks like this is going to be a busy week for us. Your biopsy on Wednesday and my first shot on Thursday. While I am at the Mayo, I will be thinking of you-in another hospital a world away-fighting the same dragon!!!!!!!!!
Wish you the best, sister-slayer!!!!!
Doing further blood work, the hep was found.
My feet are also giving me trouble. I am just now able to walk comfortably after 16 weeks of dealing with plantar fascaitis (sp). And a bone spur.
I am not taking any meds for either. I was taking an n-said, but now just use massage and whirlpool therapy. Also, very picky about the shoes I wear.
My RA doc also said that my immune system had taken a hit - I was really sick last summer, before being diagnosed-and that my body was having a sustained inflammatory response. That was the problem causing the joint pain-not RA, even tho blood levels were slighty elevated.
Looks like this is going to be a busy week for us. Your biopsy on Wednesday and my first shot on Thursday. While I am at the Mayo, I will be thinking of you-in another hospital a world away-fighting the same dragon!!!!!!!!!
Wish you the best, sister-slayer!!!!!
Prior to tx all finger joints painful, swollen and red. Three months into tx all symptoms subsided and never returned. Good Luck ...Leah
Very interesting about the coffee. I remember seeing a study on this, just a few months ago. We discussed it on the forum. If I remember correctly, they were talking about 6 cups a day. So you're drinking a bit more than that. And obviously it has helped you. Maybe it is not so good to drink that much and you could get down to 1 liter. But come on, you quit the drugs, you quit the booze, you quit the smoking... and you are taking very good care of yourself and your health. You should be proud of yourself and not beat yourself up about a few extra cups of coffee per day. It will come in due time.
My body just doesn't like it. It's too harsh. Each time I try, I get the same reaction. So I've learned to stay away from it.
Marcia
My body just doesn't like it. It's too harsh. Each time I try, I get the same reaction. So I've learned to stay away from it.
Marcia
Rock.... it says it on the fact sheet ;-) I'm gonna 'duh' you now.... ROFL
I'm definitely getting enough vit A from my diet and those extra 200 IU.
RDA for females 19 yrs and older is 700 IU per day and Ul (upper limit) is 3000 IU
RDA for males 19 yrs and older is 900 IU per day and Ul (upper limit) is 3000 IU
Having hepatitis C, one obviously should take less... so I'll stick to the 200 IU for myself, knowing that I also get an adequate amount from my diet.
My multivitamin has NO IRON and NO VIT A.
Marcia
I'm definitely getting enough vit A from my diet and those extra 200 IU.
RDA for females 19 yrs and older is 700 IU per day and Ul (upper limit) is 3000 IU
RDA for males 19 yrs and older is 900 IU per day and Ul (upper limit) is 3000 IU
Having hepatitis C, one obviously should take less... so I'll stick to the 200 IU for myself, knowing that I also get an adequate amount from my diet.
My multivitamin has NO IRON and NO VIT A.
Marcia
Thanks about the 'warning' on the vitamins. I've been doing my research and have all the supplements I need in place.
I'm getting enough vitamin A from my food and there is 200 IU in the neptune krill oil I have. I have been monitoring my vitamin D and have 400 IU in my multivitamin.
I will start taking all my supplements a few days after my biopsy. I didn't take them since 14 days before the biopsy, 'cause some of them are blood thinning.
Marcia
I'm getting enough vitamin A from my food and there is 200 IU in the neptune krill oil I have. I have been monitoring my vitamin D and have 400 IU in my multivitamin.
I will start taking all my supplements a few days after my biopsy. I didn't take them since 14 days before the biopsy, 'cause some of them are blood thinning.
Marcia
Thanks for all the info. And yes, I am actually feeling better!
Regarding massage, for years they were saying that one should not massage rheumatism.... as they used to call it. But that somehow never sat right with me.
Yesterday I did some googling on this and found that they advise massage, after having done a study on 1000 people on the effects of massage on RA. Therapist once a week and daily self massage was the protocol. So I found a video of a physical therapist showing how to massage the hands. Very simple circular motion around the joints and down towards the end of the extremities and then the other way and stroking to make the blood flow towards the heart. Total basic massage technique.
Last night I took out some pure 1st grade shea butter I had taken with me from Mali, the elderly swear by it in West Africa. (I had already made my own mixture from it. You boil it with lime or lemon and then strain it. Then I had added virgin coconut oil and some rose and patchouli essential oils. You can use this on your face and all over the body.) Anyway, last night I massaged my hands and feet with it before going to bed. This morning I woke up and they were to my astonishment less stiff, less painful and the swelling on the joint has gone down about 50%. It does NOT feel hot to the touch anymore. So I massaged again this morning and I will keep on doing this and hope it will get even better.
And then of course I will have the doctor verify what it really is. If it gets worse, I will try to stay away from any stronger meds, as long as possible. I think the whole tox thing will be plenty for me, someone who hardly ever even takes a paracetamol.
Marcia
Regarding massage, for years they were saying that one should not massage rheumatism.... as they used to call it. But that somehow never sat right with me.
Yesterday I did some googling on this and found that they advise massage, after having done a study on 1000 people on the effects of massage on RA. Therapist once a week and daily self massage was the protocol. So I found a video of a physical therapist showing how to massage the hands. Very simple circular motion around the joints and down towards the end of the extremities and then the other way and stroking to make the blood flow towards the heart. Total basic massage technique.
Last night I took out some pure 1st grade shea butter I had taken with me from Mali, the elderly swear by it in West Africa. (I had already made my own mixture from it. You boil it with lime or lemon and then strain it. Then I had added virgin coconut oil and some rose and patchouli essential oils. You can use this on your face and all over the body.) Anyway, last night I massaged my hands and feet with it before going to bed. This morning I woke up and they were to my astonishment less stiff, less painful and the swelling on the joint has gone down about 50%. It does NOT feel hot to the touch anymore. So I massaged again this morning and I will keep on doing this and hope it will get even better.
And then of course I will have the doctor verify what it really is. If it gets worse, I will try to stay away from any stronger meds, as long as possible. I think the whole tox thing will be plenty for me, someone who hardly ever even takes a paracetamol.
Marcia
I've had some really weird joint stuff throughout tx.
sometimes sharp pain where there never was...sometimes something stiffens for a few hours then is fine.
this month my hands froze from swelling and pain...from an hour of gardening...and now they are fine.
comes with tx from all I read.
your white cell count goes down and infalmmation is more common. doesn't mean you will end up with RA permanently but does mean your autoimmune system will be out of whack until interferon levels and blood chemistry return to normal.
I use massage, and heat and icepacks. If your doc says it's ok to take an antiinflammatory do, but these and all pain meds are dependant on what stage/grade your liver is at, as to the wisdom of taking them.
From my years doing physical therapy: hydration is key, I disagree with coffee drinking it removes essential minerals crucial to cellular and cartilage maintanence.
Also, while yes vitamin A and D both can be toxic is over consummed, not having enough of either is also detremental to liver and general health. Read the research before taking anecdotal advise is my 2 cents.
Finger stiffness alone doesn't mean RA. One looks for swelling, twisting of the bone itself (like a corkscrew), clubbing and of course blood work to confirm.
Even if my ELISA or other blood work ups were to reflect some RA right now, I don't think I'd get too worried as long as I'm anticipating and end to this tx.
Also, you might want to think about Neupogen if your white count, platelets etc indicate it.
The health of your lymphic system is what determines your reactions or over reactions to joint wear and tear, so making sure you don't go too low on these could spare you a lot of infections and other sides.
Hope you feel better.
MB
sometimes sharp pain where there never was...sometimes something stiffens for a few hours then is fine.
this month my hands froze from swelling and pain...from an hour of gardening...and now they are fine.
comes with tx from all I read.
your white cell count goes down and infalmmation is more common. doesn't mean you will end up with RA permanently but does mean your autoimmune system will be out of whack until interferon levels and blood chemistry return to normal.
I use massage, and heat and icepacks. If your doc says it's ok to take an antiinflammatory do, but these and all pain meds are dependant on what stage/grade your liver is at, as to the wisdom of taking them.
From my years doing physical therapy: hydration is key, I disagree with coffee drinking it removes essential minerals crucial to cellular and cartilage maintanence.
Also, while yes vitamin A and D both can be toxic is over consummed, not having enough of either is also detremental to liver and general health. Read the research before taking anecdotal advise is my 2 cents.
Finger stiffness alone doesn't mean RA. One looks for swelling, twisting of the bone itself (like a corkscrew), clubbing and of course blood work to confirm.
Even if my ELISA or other blood work ups were to reflect some RA right now, I don't think I'd get too worried as long as I'm anticipating and end to this tx.
Also, you might want to think about Neupogen if your white count, platelets etc indicate it.
The health of your lymphic system is what determines your reactions or over reactions to joint wear and tear, so making sure you don't go too low on these could spare you a lot of infections and other sides.
Hope you feel better.
MB
BRAIN FOOD
"The greatest value of A.F.A. is not only its nutrient concentration, but its effect on the nervous system, specifically the pituitary, pineal, and hypothalamus. People taking A.F.A. have reported an overall increase in mental alertness, mental stamina, short and long term memory, problem solving, creativity, dream recall, a greater sense of well being and centeredness." Dr Gabriel Cousens, M.D., author in Body, Mind, Spirit, April 1995.
"The greatest value of A.F.A. is not only its nutrient concentration, but its effect on the nervous system, specifically the pituitary, pineal, and hypothalamus. People taking A.F.A. have reported an overall increase in mental alertness, mental stamina, short and long term memory, problem solving, creativity, dream recall, a greater sense of well being and centeredness." Dr Gabriel Cousens, M.D., author in Body, Mind, Spirit, April 1995.
Two grams of AFA provide an equal amount of beta carotene to 80 grams of carrots, 1200 grams of iceberg lettuce, four tomatoes, or four cooked eggs. Critical Review in Food and Science and Nutrition, 1991.
http://www.klamathbluegreen.com/information-about-klamath-blue-green-algae/information-about-algae-klamath-lake-blue-green-algae-afa-blue-green-algae-blue-green.html?Itemid=33
http://www.klamathbluegreen.com/information-about-klamath-blue-green-algae/information-about-algae-klamath-lake-blue-green-algae-afa-blue-green-algae-blue-green.html?Itemid=33
Carrots, raw
1.00 cup
122.00 grams
52.46 calories
Nutrient Amount DV
(%) Nutrient
Density World's Healthiest
Foods Rating
vitamin A 34317.40 IU 686.3
1.00 cup
122.00 grams
52.46 calories
Nutrient Amount DV
(%) Nutrient
Density World's Healthiest
Foods Rating
vitamin A 34317.40 IU 686.3
There is 427 IU vitamin A in it :-( Not good for the hep c liver...
i was waiting for you to notify me of this,,,,i read that too...but its a small amount compared to the amount ya get from a multiman I THINK ITS 10,000IU ...its a natural type too...how did you find the exact amout.....you are good. ...im impressed
i was waiting for you to notify me of this,,,,i read that too...but its a small amount compared to the amount ya get from a multiman I THINK ITS 10,000IU ...its a natural type too...how did you find the exact amout.....you are good. ...im impressed
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