Strange appearance of nails ... - HR/ Kalio and the rest of the gang

[Tallahassee]

Good Morning, friends! I hope you will help me with your wisdom and knowledge…
I usually don’t pay big attention to my nails.  I just trim them weekly.  Usually my nails are quiet normal. Last Thursday (1/11/07) I noticed a very strange appearance of my nails: red band (~3-4 mm or ~1/8 inch) at the tip of the nail and NOW I see bluish at the base of the nail.  Also, nails were turning upwards (like spoons). On 1/11/07 it was noticeable only on right hand.  My husband teased me that I probably have a “right hand liver disease”.  I thought that it ma be from my previous Sunday extensive house cleaning. I did not take any new supplements, except SAM-e (400 mg daily from 1/04/07) and antibiotic on 1/08/07 (Lavaquin, I used it before without problems). Other drugs are Riba, Infergen, & Neupogen (sorry for all misspellings).My regular vitamins combination which I’ taking for years (B-50, N-acetylcystein (1200 per day), lecithin, Vit. C, Selenium, Dandelion, Licorice). Ah, I’m also taking Toprol (to reduce my resting pulse rate) last ~4 months.  Don’t take any other medication.

Note: the next day (1/12/07) I received in the mail Oxymatrine (anti viral and antifibrotic derived from Chinese root) and took 400 mg of it. After that day I was taking 600 mg of Oxymatrine per day.  On 1/12/07 I noticed that my left hand nails were becoming exactly the same as right hand nails.  So I cut them very short and applied some of over the counter antifungal medicine (undercylenic ? acid, 25 %).  I usually use it during swimming season and it always works like a magic, over night.

[Tallahassee]

I did not think that this is fungus but because I’m on antibiotic I did not know if “death of my friendly bacteria” contributed to the problem.  Well I applied antifungal for 2 – 3 days – it did not help. Yesterday I noticed the same “red band” on the nails of my toes, though without curling upwards.

And today (1/18/07) I have even more excitement – the base of all nail’s roots turned blue…

Ah, on ~1/13/07 I started taking ~ 8 mg of cheleted iron.  As most of us, heppers, I stay away from iron supplements, but I read that one of the side effects of iron deficiency is “spoon-like shaped” nails… Well, this did not help.  

Is it kidney or liver???  I did not think that I had cirrhosis (stage 2 on biopsy of 2005)…  Latest urine test showed 2+ protein (what ever this means).

Kalio,/ Hepatitis Researcher, you have more experience with Oxymatrine (I ordered it from Alchemist Labs, per Kalio’s recommendation).  I realize that my nails problem started the day before I began Oxymatrine, but now the base of my nails literally turned blue this probably means Silver or Arsenic poisoning (?)…

Anyway, I’m VERY worried right now.  Please help.

Thanks to all of you so much – I just LOVE this forum!

[fishdoc]

wierd nails are normal.  I have the reddish band.   And the little white half moon thingie?? I only have it on a few nails now, mid section is very white.......I am on shot 50 this week....wierd stuff happens.....don't freak out....its all normal......and it all sucks.

[chcnme]

Hi there.  I'm not Kalio or HR  (I'm interested in what they have to say - or what others with more experience on this have to say), but I just wanted to say I'm sorry your nails are doing this.  Even though it could be from a number of things unrelated to your liver, the first thing I would think about, too, if my nails were doing that would be worsening liver disease or ... something not kosher.  I'm kind of an alarmist type person, though, when it comes to "possible signs", but nonetheless if my nails were doing that and I had 2+ protein, I'd be convinced I had "signs" of something. One reason I wanted to respond to you is because last year I noticed a dent or depression-type area in one nail (ring finger) and a barely noticable vertical ridge on my left thumbnail  (both appeared about the same time.)  I was convinced it was something liver-related. Showed it to the hep doc.  He was unimpressed with my barely noticable dent and ridge  (mine was truly insignificant compared to some nail changes I've read about.)  I was grade 3 stage 2 in 2003, no treatment yet.  Only med I take is Toprol, no supplements, no vitamins, nothing but the Toprol for tachycardia.  

Anyhow, the nail changes can be scary, and I hope whatever is going on with your nails it will soon stop.  

I'm going to pull my shoes and socks off now and check my toenails :)

Wishing you the best!  Let us know how you're doing.

[willows]

There is a great site on the internet, I will try to find it for you, it has pictures of every sort of nail issue you might run into.  I started looking because I got the white band thur the middle of my nails and curved downwards on the end.  Looks weird, found a picture of it online and it explained....these nails might occur from liver disease.  Well, I guess I felt better.  But I miss having long nails.  I do grow them out when I go to see the doc, that is one of the first things he looks at.  I will see if I can find the site for you.  

Mostly, it is not a big deal, do not worry.  Just one more outward sign that we are inwardly the first line of a new epidemic.  Like I said once before, here's hoping we all get to sit in the rocking chair and tell old war stories about the days of needles, IFN and RIBA.  I will squint my aged eyes and talk about RIBA like it was a mortal enemy, scary stories to keep anyone from sharing toothbrushes or razors.  

Willow

[willows]

Here is the URL to one of the sites I was talking about.  It does not have the good pictures, but the site was more attractive and the explanations were great.

http://www.drlera.com/health_beauty/nails/nails_problems.htm

I just read more about fingernails than I ever need to again.  You can find a lot of pictures online.  Hope you find out what you need.

Willow

[Tallahassee]

Thank you, friends, for all your replays, support, web. site and more! I started my treatment in June - July 2005 and should continue through April 2007... now, I really am becoming paranoid of any unusual changes...

Well, I visited my primary Dr. today (he is an Internist by education), he just told me to continue taking Calcium and stop the rest of the stuff for a couple of weeks and see what will happen.  My bloodwork is quiet normal! Liver enzymes, metabolic panel, Hemoglobin is ~10 (!), White Blood Cells ~4000 (and I did not take my Neupogen yet, I should take it today so now I don't want to take it, but my nurse (Liver Dr.) wants me to continue on two (300 mg (or mcg?))weekly shots, even more - my platelets are 50,000 (!) the highest from my latest results were from 29,000 to 34,000 for a few months.  I'm VERY surprised with my good platelets report, because I had all reasons to expect in the area of 20,000 - 25,000 and was afraid of Dr.'s order to stop my treatment: reasons: I usually don't do my Infergen shot before blood work. Additionally, I usually do 1/2 of the shot the day before. Also, I was for last three days on my female cycle, so I lost quiet bet of blood ... sorry for all graphic details :).  Please note: I started taking Oxymatrine from 01/12/07 - one day AFTER my nail problem appeared.  I definitely don't need any iron (in normal range), but I have very high levels of B12 (>2000). I'll stop taking all my supplements for two weeks and my bloodwork again... But I hate to completely stop Oxymatrine... May be I can convince Dr. if I fax more info...

With B12 high levels... I read that sometimes people with liver disease do not metabolize it properly (?)...

Well, will see what will happen in two weeks.  I'll keep all of you updated!

I wish everybody successful treatment (and don't have any after treatment effects!)

All the best to all of you!

E

[settecasi1]

Mine got thin ans had dips or waves in them going across.

[ladybug52]

I hate to ask stupid questions but what are terry nails? I've heard people talk about them before, but I didn't know if it was a private joke or a misspelling of nails that tear easily.
Bug

[ladybug52]

I just looked up terry nails and it isn't a joke or misprint. Here's a website with a lot of pictures of nails gone bad if you're interested:
http://www.angelarose.com/Weight/Fingernails.htm

[Tallahassee]

Yes, I have "terry nails"... I never had them before.. Now I know that I have liver disease or Congestive heart failure or
Diabetes or Canser (hope not).

Thanks to everybody for your responses.
Take care of yourselfs and family!