Transmission question

[Future]

Have two young children and a family member with Hep C. We visit as often as we can and take precautions. Last trip, in the middle of chasing kids and getting ready for dinner, I used a pair of hair sheers (the electric kind you buzz your head with) to trim around ears and side burns w/o guard....later, I found out that he (hep c positive) had used them to cut his hair 8 days earlier. I told him of my error and asked him the very last time he used them and he confirmed 8 days ago. We checked my ears closely to look for any break in skin. None visable.

Now, I made an unusual mistake and used something that could have cut him on me, it happens in life as goofy as my mistake may sound. Can you help me out with whether;

7-8 days earlier he had used, did not see or feel that I had cut myself at all( I looked VERY closely after I realized my mistake), how easy is it to transmit? Could it transmit even though I could not see any detectable blood on my ear. I am in the healthcare industry but was suprised to see that it can remain detectable in dry blood for longer periods of time than a few hours. Do you need actuall blood cut on blood cut? Also, if I have a worry (and I am STRESSED because of my young kids!) what is the quickest test I can take for a piece of mind?

Your answers are appreciated.

[pigeonca]

It is possible to contract hcv from a sharp implement that cut an infected person 7 or 8 days earlier, IF you also cut yourself.  Without a cut or scratch, however, I wouldn't worry.  

[debnevada]

really it is less than likely.  And your children are in no danger whatsoever.  My husband is hep c negative and the only precautions we take are not sharing toothbrushes or nail clippers and if i cut myself or bleed from anything i use universal precautions with the articles.

[Jakied]

Future, your risk from this 'incident' is 0.  Stop worrying about this.  Don't give it another thought and move on with your life.

[goldyn]

your fine just think of all the heads a barber cuts with a shaver, if it was as easy as that to transmit there would be alot more people infected....

[pigeonca]

I beg to differ.  I am fairly certain that I got my hcv from shared sharp implements at work, since I've never had a transfusion (that I know of) and I've never shot drugs.  It's rare to be infected this way, but it definitely can and does happen.

[pigeonca]

To continue from above - although infection is possible from scissors and razors, etc., I think your particular chance of getting hcv is nil, since you didn't cut yourself.  Don't worry, be happy.

[Future]

I do understand that the chances are slim since I saw NO visable cut, no blood and that he had used them 8 days earlier, but does it take new blood, large amount, dry blood on a cut, scratch, etc. Is it like other viruses where it would depend on viral oad exposure, where one could assume that even if there was a microscopic scratch/cut that dry blood of that age could transmit?

Also, does being able to detect the virus in dry blood a few days old (is there a study on this?) is the same as being active and able to transmit/infect from this dry blood?

[meki]

I think it is new blood in --- old or new out.

It is blood to blood - that much we know. If there are no visible cuts on you --- then you probably have nothing to worry about.

I had a child by natural birth - have a hubby who we've practiced wild sex EVERY DAY of the month... bled all over them multiple times and vice versa - at the same time (car accident) --- and stepped on nails... etc. etc. ad infinitum for 10 years... Stopped short at sharing toothbrushes... ICK!

Anyhow - neither of them - nor any other family member or friend has contracted HCV.

So I would think in your situation that I would not panic - and get screened for all HEP viruses at your next physical --- in fact ---- make a habit of it every physical you go to.

If more people in the world did that... we'd be able to stop the progression of this disease!

Meki

[Harry Potter]

I read somewhere that the Hep C virus can live in blood on surfaces for up to 4 days at room temp.  So, 7-8 days would be stretching it for it to be transmissible.

That said, I think I became infected from a deep cut (very, very deep) on a sharp section of a gas pump handle.  My finger bled for 4 days, on & off & went numb right after the puncture.  But, I guess it's hard to tell where we (most of us) got it!

[pigeonca]

The answer to how long the virus lives is here:

http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/126/5/410-b

As to whether you can be infected without a visible cut, I would say no.

[Future]

Anyone else have input?

[Future]

How soon could I be tested and is this eemingly an over reaction for the situation?

[meki]

I think you are more over-worried than you should be...

HOWEVER...  I am pro testing for HEP Screen panels.

I think it should be routine at every yearly physical --- for everyone.

About 90 days from possible point of infection.

Meki

[nygirl7]

Yeah I'd say this is an extreme case of over reaction.  Honestly part of me had to even wonder if it was a legitimate question.

[Future]

I can assure you that it is a serious question/situation to me. I would not post this to get a rise out of any on a board such as this. I appreciate the replies and will say prayers for all.

Any other input is wellcome and I intend on coming on here often to learn since either way, one of my family members has Hep C as stated above. I nee to inform him how long the virus will last too. It is shocking to do the math....how many people get haircuts a day, have clippers used on them, many do get slight cuts from the sheers and then if it lasts for up to multiple days, the next cut person could be infected.

It is scary stuff........

[meki]

Future - again --- chances are VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY  slim...

It has to be ACTIVELY BLEEDING (sucking blood back into the body to circulate) with tainted blood.

Remember this: I've been involved in a major car accident where EVERYONE was openly bleeding - and no one caught it from me.

I have had sex in just about every imaginable way (you know... after 10 years of marriage, you try just about anything... LOL!) including during menses, etc.

I have stepped on nails - cut my finger --- have held my husband's son while we were both bleeding from various incidents and....

AND....

None of them have HCV --- nor HCV antibodies.

(Keep in mind I found out I was infected last year - treated and went SVR in one year... long story... But I had been infected for 11 -12 years)

So --- I don't believe HCV is THAT --- THAT --- THAT contagious.

I believe you need to have had surgery, dental work --- or something that flays the skin open - to openly pulsing blood --- a transfusion... possibly tatoos --- or injected substance (including infected utensils or needles used for surgery, immunizations, etc.)

But I don't think it just jumps over on a whim. I think it HAS TO BE PUT INTO THE BLOODSTREAM SOMEHOW.

I DO think it is a dangerous disease... but NO ONE --- Not one person has proven to me that a scratch or cut causes transmission - or sex.. YET... (My reason for this is that my husband had a "prince Albert"(?) piercing --- and it was during my menses that it was ripped accidentally... HE DID NOT GET HCV - at all...) (Now there is too much information... LMAO! for your average person, anyhow...)

But you wanted to know... And you're not going to know unless people openly speak about their experiences.

I have yet to meet someone with HCV that has NOT had dental work - surgery - immunizations or shots at a doctor's office and/or did IV drugs.

Everyone I have talked to has had some sort of "transmissable" point of interaction that could have caused the virus to enter their bodies via the bloodstream. Not a nick or scratch... But actually INTO the BLOODSTREAM.

Our bodies are made to protect themselves.... When we get a cut --- automatically, especially on small cuts - IMMEDIATE barriers are put into place. Healing starts taking place immediately. Blood gushes OUT from a wound in an effort to clean the surrounding areas, and the passage from the cut becomes clotted - creating a barrier. So you have the "initial flush" and then a barrier - plus you have antibodies that go to work immediately, as well.  Otherwise - as humans, we would be dead at the first intrusion of dirt without antibacterial soap. LOL!

Anyhow --- you have a natural protection that starts immediately --- HCV has to get past that barrier... Which is why I do not believe HCV is a casually transmitted disease... even if the infected blood lays around for 8 days...

Yes it can live on items (hence it passes from one host to another) however --- I haven't found anyone with a simple scratch that has gotten it... That also hasn't had openly bleeding surgery, innoculations (which go below the skin surface) or IV usage (shots or drug use) or a massive bleeding issue (circulating blood).

They haven't even had any mucosal (eye) contams yet that they can document. (Think SPITTING IN THE EYE)

So - while I know HCV transmits --- and can transmit easily (with the right set of circumstances) --- I don't think that it's soooo contagious that you have to be worried about it every moment of every day.

Please don't give your relation a stigma...

It is good to take precautions however...

Because HCV lowers your body's natural defense... So your relation (the one that is HEPC positive) probably gets sick at the drop of a hat.

And probably doesn't feel very good.

Has he treated?

If he has treated ---- then your might even have a more simple answer.. He probably isn't contagious. LOL!

Anyhow - look - you're very worried about HCV --- and you have a good right to be... But remember being worried --- and being overly compulsively worried about it are 2 different things.

Go get tested... and do it yearly.

But don't panic.

And treat your relation with kindness. In fact --- give them lots of time, money and consideration - help them clean --- stay away when they seem tired...

Ask what they need...

Cause this disease can knock you on your hind end...


Meki

[Future]

Wow, great response..thanks! He has been treated twice, one with monotherapy Int and next with Ribo + Int, he is now waiting for Telepavir(sic?) by Vertex. As far as giving hime stigma, not at all, I purposely expose (bad choice of words!) to my young children because I believe that it gives him more reason to get healthier. He looks better than he has in years and is way more active than ever in the last decade. I want him around for many more and I hope one of the new drugs helps him.

Your take on transmission is appreciated and interesting. Thanks again!

[meki]

Anytime... I just wanted you to realize it isn't something that can jump off one person to another like cooties... LOL!

And I wanted you to feel more comfortable in your own skin... Because it's scary not knowing... It's scary thinking that you could be infected... or others could be.

Prevention is the best cure --- but what can you prevent against, in a disease that is handed out in the millions by hospitals? By Govt. Agencies? You are going to find more and more people are going to realize they have HEPC --- I think fairly soon.. Especially Veterans -- -because they were innoculated with the same needles as others... And it takes awhile to find out that you have it because it creeps up slowly and Hep Panels aren't the norm.

So one person with HCV --- in the very begining of the line --- will have passed his version on to the next 1000 people --- and so on - and so on...

But it isn't so contagious that you have to worry about it...

I advocate regular HEP screen panels.

Because it can happen to anyone...  (just FYI, I'm a non drinker - I can drink - just never really do or have --- If I go out with the girls, maybe... but usually I'm the designated driver... nor a drug user... I work for the Police Industry - and have lived a fairly clean life... safe sex was ALWAYS my motto - or not at all - until I was monogamously married. I know that either I obtained the virus from 2 surgeries or from a shot of Rhogam. Because I have no other risk factors and was tested at a certain point... no one close to me has HCV --- in family or otherwise... I didn't have any other possible routes of transmission.)

But learning about it --- and bringing your kids over to visit rock! And you'll learn more and more about it as you go.

HCV is not like HEPA or B... Nor is it like HIV/AIDS...

It's a completely different dragon... One I call the Shadow Dragon.

Because it stays in the shadows -- and slowly leaches life away from you.

I'm glad he's waiting for the new Teleprivir -- I've heard good things about it.

Albuferon is supposed to be another possible route.

Good Luck,

Meki