Based on my own experience, I am becoming a believer in the power of herbs, mushrooms, acupunture etc. to alleviate some if not all of the symptoms of hepc. For me, they have been very effective although I've only been doing them for 3 weeks. My everyday life has improved which for now, is all I'm interested in. Since TX did not cure or help me, I had no choice but to pursue alternatives and I'm glad I did.
Alternatives are not going to work for everyone but for some people I believe it can help deal with every day symptoms. How will my liver look in five or ten years compared to someone not doing anything at all. Maybe better, maybe worse. Who knows. My goal was to deal with the symptoms and so far it has been a success. I was not a believer in alternative stuff so there is little chance that the good results are a placibo effect.
What the title of the book and the author's name? Travis
I should clarify that when I said it was BS I was addressing the assertion that this stuff eradicates the virus. From everything I have read it does not. As far as improving QOL and perhaps having some beneficial effect on the liver and overall health I have no knowledge or opinion. Mike
Zadaxin, a synthetic drug, is thymosin-alpha a "glandular extract." I personally would avoid the extract - I eat beef, but am squeamish about gland extracts from cows! Yuck.
It is prescribed in some countries as part of treatment for the HBV and is being investigated in the U.S. If memory serves me (that's a real **** shoot!) the info about its help against the HCV is slim or speculative at this time, but also under investigation.
There still is no shot at a cure apart from interferon + ribavirin treatment available. I've read literally hundreds of claims from homeopathic/naturopathic "doctors" and all claims for a cure are absolutely fradulent - ask Pam Anderson. Noni juice, colloidal silver, and Rife machines show up a lot not just "all natural" herbal concoctions and they are quack medicine too.
With a screwed up liver you may wish to investigate possible nutritional, vitamin, and mineral deficiencies and see about supplements to address them. Of course a balanced diet is important.
For herbs as drugs, Sho-saiko-to has some legit research showing it can help with reducing liver inflammation and may serve as an antifibrotic. It is in use in Japan to address symptoms, not cure. I don't know about dosing, availability, or anything else about this herb.
I have been sick with the hep c virus and the past few years, it has been the reason for many symptoms as we all know. I have been geting Acpuncture treatments weekly and drinking herb tea. Most all of my lifelessness is gone and I have the quality of life has returned to both me and my family. My strangth and vitality is once again avalable. So if the herbs do not help eraticate the hep c virus they can help your body it's natural amune system deal with the virus with out all the side effects of tx. So keep an open mind for those of us who don't accept the main stream except as a last resort. Good health to you!
to john My best wishes good health to you,
We do have the power to heal our selves with a little help.
I wish you well, My only point is to say every body is individual and the herbal aproach to curing Hep c is valid.
The alternative aproach is not BS, the rate of success with acpuncture in returning the quality of life is 85-95%.
Totemann: I didn't realize that the success rate at dealing with symptoms was that high using alternatives and frankly I'm a bit skeptical of those numbers. But like you, I've had some real success with it so I am beggining to believe that for many people it can help with quality of life. It sure has done wonders for me.
I was put on levaquin while on treatment and had a terrible reaction to it. I felt very sick and researched it on the internet and immediately stopped taking it. My doctor gave me bactrin instead. I don't know much about the sed rate but I do know everyday brings something new and unexpected for me.
I'm happy that you have found relief from your symptoms. Whatever works is fine with me. My point was that there are many claims that various products will cure the virus. My experience tells me these are fraudulent claims that often give people false hope and incline them to waste valuable time trying to cure themselves. If one doesn't feel that tx is right and wants to pursue other avenues I can understand that. Or if tx doesn't work for them and this approach is a way for them to get relief I'm fine with that. Believe me when I tell you that I did everything imaginable to try to cure myself and though I wasn't successful I do believe I may have felt better. At least I felt somewhat in control which is a benefit in itself. Mike
I'm not sure what this forum is about. I went in to post a question and now it says make a comment. Well, I'll comment about a problem and anyone can join in with their comments. My husband, in week 15 of ribi and interferon started to take Levaquin for a sinus infection. To make matters worse, his platelets had dropped last week, but now they are fine, but he got a call that his Sed Rate was at 99 and I thought this was odd. I have looked up what this might mean and thought it might be a problem that some others on this tx might have had. The Levaquin is said to be a very dangerous drug and I don't like the idea he is taking it while on this tx. It may have caused the Sed Rate to rise, or it may be that my husband is experiencing some type of autoimmune problem. I thought others on the list haved mentioned they have ached and been swollen. He has the most pain in his shoulders and neck area. His wrists also hurt. He has cracking in many joints. But his Sed Rate was not high before the Levaquin. It could be that the ribi/interferon is building up in him, also. I would love to hear comments about the Sed Rate being so high. Thanks, Melissa
From my perspective, to recommend any <I>treatment</I>, the treatment must be based upon responsible research where there are controls and the results are repeatable and the work is verified and reviewed. If it is valid, Johns Hopkins will be able to repeat the results, for example.
Herbal treatment is largely useless. Some of it is harmful. Some has merit.
Acupuncture suffers from many problems such as doctors cannot agree on which organ or body has too much "chi" or too little "chi" and stick needles in entirely different places in the body - too many investigations have come up short in the repeatable/verifiable department.
These issues make homeopathic/naturopathic and acupuncture largely issues of faith and a far cry from science. What tiny amount is valid does not create legitamcy for any of these treatments. I drank reishi mushroom tea (not bad tasting), but would not dare make a claim that it cured me or even helped - how the heck could I tell?
I went through cycles of feeling very poorly and times of feeling great. That is largely the nature of our disease. Anecdotes do not constitute a valid basis for recommending treatment.
My apologies in advance if my position raises hackles. I mean to attack no person, but wish to draw a line between what a person believes/experiences works for them and responsibly advocating treatment to others.
From my experience an elevated sed rate means there is inflammation going on somewhere in the body. So having a sinus infection would cause the sed rate to go up. His aches and pains in the neck/shoulder area, and the cracking of his joints sounds like arthritic changes, and has been reported I believe as one of the numerous sides of tx.
The reason you cant post a question (on the front lobby page on top left side) is cuz we only get about 6 questions/threads per day and they are all taken. So you can post them under a pre-exising one, which you did. But unless you make a bigger heading under comments (to EVERYONE) options box, it can go unnoticed.
I dont kno why your doc would order two sed rates two weeks in a row, as it is a rather non-discript type of test. Dont worry bout it. It doesnt sound like you have much faith in your doctor putting your husband on Levaquin ("a dangerous drug" said by whom???). Surely he knows your husband is on treatment for hep C and understands the implications of adding an antibiodic to his regime. If you read the package inserts with almost any drug there are scarey warnings and numerous side effects listed. Fortunately MOST people dont experience them.
PLATELETS - you said his dropped but then came up, well this is also a common thing that happens, many of us are having lower than normal RBCs, Hgb, Hct, WBCs, platelets, and neutrophils.
Just keep scrolling and reading about other people's posts here and you will learn a lot! It has surely helped me, and Im on my 16th week of tx. OHC67
I've tried all sorts of alternative stuff, spent lots of money and did not find much relief. Now I take some vitamins and Milk Thistle along with Chinese Medicines. All I can say is my symtoms have been reduced with Chinese Medicines, my "really ill" periods are not as bad they were (although not gone). I would say that if I did not have such bad symptoms I probably wouldn't bother. Do you actually have symptoms??
I am not sure that anyone checked out the article that the hepatitisfree site uses as evidence for their argument an aritle that was written about ten years ago by a respected hepatologist. Dr Davis is the former head of the liver transplant unit at the University of Florida in Gainsville. The aritcle I referenced by him was written about a year and a half ago and starts by stating how much has changed in a short 10 years in treatment and responses to same. He quotes current stats in this article. Hope someone takes the time to read it.
Amanda has been taking zadaxin for 5 weeks now. She takes it twice a week (injection). I will let you all know how it works in a few weeks. She is taking this along with daily infergen and all of her blood boosters..
I read a bit what it said about Interferon and I didnt like it at all, it was full of lies. It says "most relapse" and "few respond" garbage like that. The makers of that drug run tests all the time and they have publicly stated about 50-60% who complete treatment are successful in eradication the virus.
Also, I have a problem with a website that uses Pam Anderson as their spokesperson (however the link didnt connect with her, dammit! hahahhaahaa) and while I was there at that website, the creepy yellow eyes not being disturbing enuf, I found you can also order Viagra along with your natural herbs....omg, I gotta go lay down, my sides are hurting from laughing so hard.
If you read the entire report you quote, you will note in the Reverences at the end that they are from old studies done over 10 years ago. It is true that at that time, the recovery rate was really low, around 10% with three times a week interferon only with no riba. Current tx consists of a pegylated (time released) form of interferon once a week along with twice daily dosing of ribavirin (Peg-Intron uses weight based dosing for the riba, Pegasys uses 1200 mg a day for most) Current "cure/remission" rates are about 85% for genotypes 2 and 3, and about 50% for types 1 and 4.
Dr Gary Lee Davis, the author of the study you quote has a newer one with the new stats, as of 2001 at the following site.
I am sorrybut I agree with OHC that website Hepatitiscfree is just creepy. Just think if you can afford the Level 4 plan it will only cost you $1066.95 a month and you will only have to take 44 yes thats right 44 pills and capsules a day. Now on the other hand if you can't afford that you can go with the level one plan of only $129.95 a month and only have to take 8 pills aday. I guess it all depends on how many pills you want to take a day. Or maybe watching a bike run with Pamela will make you feel better. And by the way if Pam is thier spokesperson than why is she in the news saying that she ONLY has 10 years to live? No thank you I think even if I relapse again from tx I will wait for tested researched meds.
OHC move over I will be laying on the floor laughing with you.
I checked out this website mentioned and I don't go for it. I didn't even click in to read anything because I've seen this one before.
I take the approach, and the approach that is proven with high success rates, to listen to the medical professionals and treat my illness with proven drugs that are prescribed and meant for treatment of hepatitis C, and only for hepatitis C.
If it eases your symptoms and helps you feel better, I'm all for herbs and/or supplements. If it makes certain blood level numbers either get better or stay in check, then I understand that as well.
However, I wouldn't take most mixtures of herbs and pills or be able to handle the natural way to treat my hepatitis C. Because it is so very true that there isn't solid research done for any length of time, with proper recording and reporting of natural remedies and treatments.
I don't believe that you can rid youself of hepatitis C with natural treatments. The drugs that are used to rid ourselves of this persistant disease are very strong. They have to be brutal and unpleasant to our system in order to combat our illness.
To say the least, this is a hard fight either way you approach it.
i have lloyd wrights book and tried his products including the expensive thymus frozen liquid. he is making a killing off it but says you "wont get well without it." he is very friendly and bends over backwards to be helpful but if you disagree with him he is not friendly at all. his program is expensive and has no proof of working. some products such as milk thistle may be helpful but one size natural program does not fit all. we are vulnerable when we have a chronic disease and easily taken for a ride. some of us have wasted a lot of money.
Zadaxin is used both as monotherapy and an element of combo therapy against hep b. It is pretty far along in trial in the U.S. gainst hep c and it looks like it won't be used as monotherapy, but in combination with INF.
I'm so glad you have a doctor fighting so hard for Amanda and daring to break with the FDA party line to treat her and not give up just because one round of peg didn't work. I pray the Zadaxin helps turn things around.
Please let Amanda know people are praying for her and her family!
Thank you all for your comments. Sorry for hogging two threads, I'll use more wisdom in the future (learning as I go). I'm still learning the terminology, so forgive me for my ignorance. I am dealing with ascites (should I ask that this be drained?), as well as general fatigue, bleeding gums, etc. No apparent trouble with clotting though, as my shaving cuts seem to heal fine. With regard to the hepatitiscfree site, I suppose I was taken by the author's (Lloyd Wright) passion for alternative medicine, being that he, like myself, was disillusioned with the attitude of his traditional doctors. Being told there is nothing I can do, no treatment, etc. is not comforting. For those of you who have tried the alternatives (galen?), did the Thymus lower your viral load? Also, in order to chart my progress with different remedies, what are the numbers I should look for and which abbreviations should I make sure I know. So far, I'm realizing obviously that the viral load is something to monitor, and my platelet count. What else? BTW, I was absolutely hhorrified to learn my viral load was at 2,900,000 being that most I've seen post and discuss their own viral loads seem to be much much smaller. I'm a bit frightened and am trying to learn all I can online. I will search for another physician. Thank you all again.
My viral load has been as high as 6.8 milliom IU/ML and I have read of higher loads here on this forum. Viral load (VL) does not correlate with liver damage and people with high loads can have relatively minor evidence of liver damage whereas people with low loads can have major damage. Unless you are having symptoms of cirrhosis (ascites, varices,encephalopathy,jaundice, high bilirubin etc) the only way to know how your liver really is is by having a liver biopsy. I would advise that you consult a GI or hepatologist regarding your ascites. Draining can greatly reduce your discomfort and though it is a temporary measure it may be something that you would want to do to improve the way you feel. I question whether your bleeding gums are a direct result of hepatitis c though it could be related. I think you are wise in your decision to see a doctor. Instead of guessing about clotting time you should have a test done so you know exactly what your clotting time is. Other tests can also tell a lot about your liver health as well as your overall health. I think one trap we must guard against is attributing every syptom or health problem to hep c. Though they may be related they may have a genesis all their own and may also be candidates for treatment. Your gums, for instance. That's why it's so important to consult with a knowedgeable physician. Things can go untreated and become major problems simply because we assume they are hep c problems. And even if they are related there may be treatments available which could be of benefit. About the 2 threads - many of us have done the same thing. No problem with that until you know the limitations. Good luck and keep us posted. Pursue getting well aggressively. Don't let anyone tell you there's nothing you can do. Be your own advocate. We're all in this together. Mike
Yoyu should absolutely, positively not accept a doctor telling you there is nothing you can do. I would run away from this doctor so fast, I would probably jerk the hinges off his office door during my departure. Having this comment made to you or anyone else is like going into a bakery and the baker tells you he can't make a cake!
There are many things that can be done now a days, not just with the disease hepatitis C but other illnesses.
Go find a doctor who will speak with you about what your condition is. Have him or her run the proper testing in order to determine exactly what is going on with you as well as what are the treatments, medications available.
Only then, can you make a decision or a non decision to treat. You have to be the leader of your own journey, even with high price doctors, in order to get the results that are available.
Good luck! Study the facts, get as much information as possible and have your doctor look into all your symptoms.
Well guys, its been a long time since I posted here. I don't know why and still can't figure it out, but my computer simply would not let me into this site to post. I could (and did) read your comments, but I could not post a response!
Anyhow, I just saw the above commetns above viral load and thought I should try to respond. (We'll see if this one works)
As for high viral loads, well ... 2.9 million as posted above is low and I would personally feel so much happier if my viral load was that low. Last July, when first diagnosed, my viral load was 13,000,000. Then in November 2002 it had jumped to 24,000,000. It was so high that I assumed based upon my reading that treatment had a slim chance of curing me, so I took natural stuff, milk thistle, colostrum, adn vitamin E and tried to lose weight and eat well thinking that maybe I could at least reduce my viral load to a reasonable level ... Then I intended to take the Pegasys and get rid of this dragon.
However, in September I took another PCR and to my disbelief, my viral load is now 52,400,000. Now how's that for a big number? Still no symptoms and only mildly elevated liver enzymes.
I find no offer to sell Viagra on www.hepatitiscfree.com. You must be talking about that site from the yellow eyes comment.
If you were to actually open your eyes to what is going on, you would have read the manufacturer's own report submitted to the FDA on the results of the drug, which must of been wrapped in $100 bills to get approval.
Since you're a self proclaimed hippie chick, remember back to when you didn't trust the establishment? Remember why? Greed, lies, etc? The medical establishment wants you to buy Interferon and lots of it.
Open your eyes while they are still white!
I am living proof that the treatment outlined in the book works.
I started on the program/regimen almost two years ago. My AST was 165, my ALT was 83, viral load was the "cheap" test shown at over 850,000 iu/ml.
My latest test was AST 26, ALT 16! Had I not listened to the "doctor" and gotten vaccinated for Hep A and B, (which elevates the viral load and keeps it there for a year or more)
and started taking SSRI's (prozac, efexor, etc), I am positive I would be cleared of the virus by now. I have dropped viral load by 2,000,000 iu/ml in two months as I am now coming off the effects of the vaccines and antidepressants.
Anyone who does not believe me is welcome to email me for copies of my blood work: "masnoggin at kconline.com"
What basis in fact do you refer to Lloyd Wright's work as "bullshit"? Do you work for the Interferon pushers? Do you realize what that ineffective drug is doing to people?
God put everything we need to cure ourselves here on earth, we just don't know how to use it all yet.
I'm not waiting for big medicine to come and save me, I am curing myself naturally.
My mistake, my original numbers from 11/14/2001 were AST 76, ALT 132. I was too taken by the moment responding to the nay sayers and didn't have my records in front of me.
Also to lackalustre, how long were you on Lloyd's program? Were you taking everything? Did you take Aloe? Did you drink the teas as well? Lloyd told me that those who drink the tea get better faster, and that has been my experience too.
Did you take the Thymus correctly? I was taking it for some time before I found that you cannot drink, eat or even chew gum or brush your teeth before you take it. Then not have anything at all for at least a half hour afterwards as well. I was just following the instructions which state not to eat for two hours beforehand, to me those instructions were unclear.
And to the persons concerned about too many pills a day and glandular extracts being just icky - come on!
WE ARE TALKING ABOUT SAVING YOUR LIFE HERE PEOPLE.
I have alot to live for, we all do. Isn't it worth some inconvience? Some ickness?
Doesn't it ever cross your mind that since the almighty dollar corrupts entire industries, that the medical companies may omit, suppress, mislead, and outright kill people for market share?
I have read the actual document that was submitted to the FDA for approval of Peg/Interon, nowhere in that study were the statistics I found in this thread for cure/treatment.
And where are all these people so sucessfully treated? Where are the long term SVR documents?
The truth is, the medical community is experimenting. We have been brainwashed into thinking that people in lab coats know best, and natural therapy is best left to the witch doctors.
Everything I am taking has a studied and well documented history of effectiveness. Reishi, Vitamin C, Aloe, Thymus, Selenium, Lipoic Acid, Milk Thistle, SAMe.
My progress and setbacks are all documented, as well as others.
HepatitisCfree is not the commercial money making machine that your doctor is part of.
I believe Lloyd's story, I can see that it is working for me. It has worked for many others as well.
Don't close your mind and suffer needlessly.
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