chinese medicine

I would like to no if anyone has tryed chinese medicine for hepatitis c.

[cuteus]

hep c can only be erradicated by your immune system or by the present protocol of antivirals and interferon. no ancient chinese secret for hcv yet, don't get fooled by moneymakers.

[snook_man]

No sorry, though not as poplular, or high of SVR, there is other treatments that have shown promise.. Most only claim SVR of about 20%, while tradition chemo cocktail claims about 60% for geno 1's. The thing with alternatives, is many protocols have been used to address progression of liver damage more, and not really a cure.. Depending on where you stand as far as biopsy, and health, should play the determining factor in which approach you set forth.. There are many books, many Dr's and many studies, on alternative medicine.  Talk it over with your HCV Dr, and see where they stand..
As far as alittle reading material, check out this site, for perspectives on both approaches..
http://www.hepcchallenge.org/manual/sitemap.htm

Excellent resource, and baseline for many supplements we should all be taking.. There are options, as with everything in life, and personnal choice and health play the major factor. Best of luck..

[cuteus]

no PROVEN and peer reviewed methods but the existing interferons to effectively eliminate the virus, in addition to your system. anything else seem to be in preliminary stages.

[raining]

I have been taking Chinese Medicines for over a year now. Whilst I am aware they will NOT "cure" me, they have helped my symtoms (symptoms) and are worth every penny. I regularly had ALTs of over 500 and felt awful all the time. My ALTs are now normal and I feel like a human being. My stools are normal colour instead of pale and I no longer have so much pain in my liver. I cannot treat with Interferon at this time for various reasons... Saying all this I have mild damage - if I had higher stages of damage I don't think I would completely trust Chinses Medicines except to reduce the symtoms (symptoms).

[genedog]

me chinese me pay joke me went pee pee in your coke- joking its not worth the money

[Califia]

My God, that was offensive.  I know that the conventional wisdom around here is to ignore outrageous remarks, but I was raised to believe that silence equals complicity.   That's vicious racism, Genedog, "pure" and simple-minded.   All of us here,  whether of Asian extraction or not,  deserve an apology for that bit of ugliness.
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joh8:  I've been a patient ot Traditional Chinese Medicine for 15 years and have also studied it with some seriousness.  I have nothing but admiration for its sophistication and subtlety, and much gratitude for its positive effects on my body and psyche.

I credit TCM -- as so does my consulting hepatologist , Robert Gish -- with halting fibrosis progression for 13 years until Western treatment improved enough for me to try it again.   The lack of progression is probably due to the anti-inflammatory effect of the herbal protocol.   Viral eradication is not possible with Chinese medicine, as many people have already stated.    

The two systems of medicine are philosophically and clinically very different and don't always converge in their end goals.

Misha Cohen, OMD,  "The Hepatitis C Help Book"   (St. Martin's Press) describes in depth the TCM protocol for managing HCV.

[DonL]

Genedog--that was pretty offensive. Go someplace else with that kind of post.

I used acupuncture while on tx. It helped keep me calm, seemed to increase my energy, and seemed to help some specifically bad sx. That said, I agree with those who feel it can help, but not eradicate the virus.

[Califia]

You ever cooked with Chinese tonic herbs?   There are a lot of great medicinal recipes in "Between Heaven and Earth: A Guide to Chinese Medicine" by Harriet Beinfield and Efrem Korngold.   Have to play a little, of course, to make things truly palatable.

[DonL]

I haven't. I have used some of the Chinese herbs, but lately my cooking is much more Mediterranean than Asian so I have kind of ignored them. I am drinking white tea now, thanks to various posts here.

[aaapattie]

I certainly am not holding up for genedog.  A mistake was made and that little ditty shouldn't have been said.  BUT ...

I must point out that those of us raised in very rural areas that have not seen any people in our lives that wasn't white redneck hillbillies, don't have any idea of what we are really saying when we talk like that.  I was totally shocked when I went to 'the city' to go to college and found out those remarks were offensive to some.  Of course that was many, many ... MANY moons ago and times are changing.

But because of my experience, I made sure to expose my son to all the nationalities I could.  One of my best experiences as a mom was talking to my son (then eight years old) about the little boy who was playing with him in the swimming pool at a hotel.  My son didn't know who I was talking about.  I said, "You know ... the black boy."  And my wonderful son said, "What do you mean black????"  He had never noticed any difference in people.  People were people.  I was very proud of both of us.

But ... do let all of us on here continue to help one another with issues ... both physical and social.  I'm betting genedog has learned a lot today!

:-)

P.

[Califia]

Btw, had I been recently diagnosed, & had your geno, I would have done exactly the same thing you did--gone straight to the hard stuff.  In fact, I _did_ do the same thing by treating in 1990 only 6 months after diagnosis.   I can't say I'm grateful for having had to manage HCV for so long--that New Agey I'm definitely not--but the one good that came out of  it has been the immersion in Chinese medicine, not for it's own sake but the change in perspective that has come with it.    It has definitely gentled me, turned me into a gardener, and expanded my thinking and perceptions --even my emotions--in ways I never would have thought possible.  Those sharp little needles and forest floor scrapings have carried quite a wallop!

[Califia]

Thanks for sharing that.   And you're exactly right--this is how we expand our horizons, sometimes by inserting big foot in open mouth.  

[joh8]

You no if i ask my doctor about chinese medicine you no what he going to say,any medical doctor will be against it because it will not make him any money.This interferon has bad side effects and it is a 50/50 cure.I must try something that will not interfere with my job,i no i am at stage3 but i have to work to live.

[honey1616]

I would say that most people are still working on tx. I know there is some cases that people do not and sometimes due to other situation but for the most part,,,,we all are carrying on with our normal lifestyle,  Its not easy some days because you may not feel up to par and tire more easily but it is doable!
Good Luck to you!

[cuteus]

at stage three, I don't know if you have time to play with unproven methods of erradication, the next stage could be severe liver damage, and you might not be able to work then at all. Do you want to chance this?  Many of us on tx are stil working, maybe the type of interferon you take will make a difference. If you treat you have a 50% chance to get a cure, if you don't you have 0%, which is a better odd?

[Califia]

I totally agree with Cuteus and others--TREAT CONVENTIONALLY!    At Stage 3 you do not have the luxury not to.    If you want to start TCM as an adjunct therapy WHILE ON TX, see http://www.docmisha.com for a list of licensed practitioners trained in a very good HCV/chemotherapy protocol.    Hope this helps.

[joh8]

The doctor i was going to told me i was at stage 3 and said i needed treatment and whanted me to start right away.Well i did not like this because i could barely understand him his english was very bad,so i looked up on the A.M.A. site and found another doctor and he told me my platelet were so low that i might not be a candidate for treatment,so this first doctor was going to give me treatment and it could have killed me.So with doctors i do not trust and that is why i am turning to chinese medicine.I am going to try it because it will not kill me.To me doctors are just after the money, you no i feel good i eat good and have no pain at all dose that sound like a man with stage 3 hepatitis c.

[cuteus]

there are some members here that are treating with low platelet count, they are doing ok, with close monitoring by their dr.
  chinese alternatives can kill you, by keeping you from killing the virus and letting hcv progress to end stage, namely, by not doing the effective treatment.
Most of us here know about bad drs, heck, I'm on my fourth GI, since diagnosis. You can't let your anger for conventional medicine put your health in jeopardy, those bad drs you saw won't care when your health deteriorates, they won't have to suffer through it, you will.
alternatives can be a great compliment to the effective methods of virus killling.  If you had low platelets, I am surprised they did a biopsy, many here said their dr won't do one wih the low count. Just goes to show how many different approaches there seem to be.
I only am on stage 1 and was scare to progress further; on stage 3,  you would not see me at no chinese dr's door.  
These meds are not cheap, but neither are the alternatives, these alternatives practitioners are making money from the believers and selling them pieces of the Brooklyn bridge, you don't think they are being philantropical?
whatever you decide, I  wish you the best.

[joh8]

Why did you go through 4 G.I. you did not trust them or you were looking for a different way out.As i asked before how can someone be at stage 3 and feel as good as i do,i eat good i have no pain i sleep good it would seem to me if you are at stage 3 you would be pretty sick.I just do not have trust in doctors maybe i will have to go through 4 or 5 doctors to find one i can trust.

[cuteus]

that is a good question, about feeling well if on stage 3, could you post that one in its own thread above, when they open, for others to see and respond? I do remember someone posting that they had normal liver enzymes and felt ok, only to find out htrough abiopsy that cirrhosis had set in.

I counted again, and it was 3 GIs. First one was too layback, would not do a genotype, viral load or biopsy as long as my enzymes were normal, I could not trust him, even though he made me feel good with his "don't worry" attitude.n The 2nd, left it up to me to treat or not, did a complete work up and waited for me to choose meds, when I said go for it.  her office management people messed up my appointments and after an ugly scene I went to the 3rd. That one is not perfect, but It was the most comfortable of the three, and finally listened to my request for extension of treatment(tx). So that is where I am, and I question them a lot, and requests tests they don't order, etc. I am in charge of my health and they are there to monitor me, that is basically it.
I did look online for alternatives and asked at different forums. these meds I am taking, are the only way out of Hcv, for now. I don't want to get older and sicker.
Feeling so so for a year is worth it for me, if I get rid of the darn thing. it looks promising so far, on wk 70 of 72 of Tx.

Please post your question again in the above threads, to get more responses than mine.
Funny thing that my enzymes were always normal, but I had arthritis like symptoms that kept me at the dr's office, now I know it was hep c. Not ruining my liver too much, but playing in my other playgrounds(like the joints).
hang around with us, we will support whatever you decide. some of us are more blunt than others when we write, but it is because we are scared for you.