Aa
interferon blood concentration levels
ive seen discussion here saying that some people wish pegintron didnt have the obvious ups and downs of levels in the blood. the assumption is that steadier levels give beter SVR. i beleive just the opposite of this.
pegasys - stays in blood most evenly of all 5-7 days, the result less general concentration, less side effects. works fine on easy cases
pegintron - stays in blood pretty evenly 3-4 days (higher temporary concentration) harder sx, better results with tough cases
infergen - totally old school, no time release agents at all. the result. blood concentrations up and down like a yo yo. the worst sx. even better SVR results but very painful.
this illustates this idea of pulsing concentration levels for better
performance. a standard technique used throughout medicine. pegasys is an example of the least pulse effect, designed for tolerability.
i beleive that pegintron gives you a 30% overdose for the first 2 days. once a week we get slightly over dosed and this is good for SVR.
infergen probably hits you the first day as an absolute double dose, and does have to be dosed more often to keep min concentration levels. and hypothetically has the best performance, as evidenced by heavy use by relapsers.
this is my allm my belief, i have never seen it in print.
but it is hard to argue against the logic and practical outcomes.
i do plan on taking advantage of these qualities in my treatment.
when i get to the last few months i plan on hitting the heavy pulse interferons. im on peg now.
i may even use pegasys in the middle as a break from sx. it will at least keep
me undetectable and hopefully kill a few virons that none of the others can get. i beleive that when you get down to your last few months, i imagine
that i will have 100 nasty tough virons left. no other virons around to impair the fight, just those last 100. i must kill all those and this is my last chance. this is the time to rotate these unique interferons, to mop up on those last few that have survived. we know that differnt interferons kill different sets of the tough ones, so why not use all the different weapons to help insure victory? i would guess that some docs might consider it meaningless overkill, but for my slim chances of success im dreaming up every trick i can get.
hopefully this has helped some to understand varying INF concentration levels as i understand them.
i also beleive that the current riba dosing has the same effect good effect, varying levels in the blood. i think the interferon rotation is a worthwile
strategy that promises real upside advantage.
back me up or shoot me down, we need feedback.
if i could fly, i think i would be a bat.
pegasys - stays in blood most evenly of all 5-7 days, the result less general concentration, less side effects. works fine on easy cases
pegintron - stays in blood pretty evenly 3-4 days (higher temporary concentration) harder sx, better results with tough cases
infergen - totally old school, no time release agents at all. the result. blood concentrations up and down like a yo yo. the worst sx. even better SVR results but very painful.
this illustates this idea of pulsing concentration levels for better
performance. a standard technique used throughout medicine. pegasys is an example of the least pulse effect, designed for tolerability.
i beleive that pegintron gives you a 30% overdose for the first 2 days. once a week we get slightly over dosed and this is good for SVR.
infergen probably hits you the first day as an absolute double dose, and does have to be dosed more often to keep min concentration levels. and hypothetically has the best performance, as evidenced by heavy use by relapsers.
this is my allm my belief, i have never seen it in print.
but it is hard to argue against the logic and practical outcomes.
i do plan on taking advantage of these qualities in my treatment.
when i get to the last few months i plan on hitting the heavy pulse interferons. im on peg now.
i may even use pegasys in the middle as a break from sx. it will at least keep
me undetectable and hopefully kill a few virons that none of the others can get. i beleive that when you get down to your last few months, i imagine
that i will have 100 nasty tough virons left. no other virons around to impair the fight, just those last 100. i must kill all those and this is my last chance. this is the time to rotate these unique interferons, to mop up on those last few that have survived. we know that differnt interferons kill different sets of the tough ones, so why not use all the different weapons to help insure victory? i would guess that some docs might consider it meaningless overkill, but for my slim chances of success im dreaming up every trick i can get.
hopefully this has helped some to understand varying INF concentration levels as i understand them.
i also beleive that the current riba dosing has the same effect good effect, varying levels in the blood. i think the interferon rotation is a worthwile
strategy that promises real upside advantage.
back me up or shoot me down, we need feedback.
if i could fly, i think i would be a bat.
Cuelworld, I had mentioned this in a post when I first started tx and got the same response because of other things going on on the forum. The correlation between the med injections and the Riba associated curves with the sx experienced run in parallel, kind of like the controllers here at mh. If you think outside the box here you will hit a dead end. Just the way it is.
Be Well
Jasper
Be Well
Jasper
at least you tacitly agree that infergen is 'stronger' and used for tougher cases.
yet no hard evidence exists to support this somewhat accepted theory. like wise
my doctor seemed to think pegintron was 'stronger' or 'better" than pegasys and likewise no evidence exists to prove this either. this is just his personal belief and it influenced mine. i do personally believe that pegasys offers the least
varying blood concentration levels and because of this alone i beleive it has the
lesser svr rate, of the 3. again, no real evidence, studies have never been done that can prove or disprove this. pulsing, overdosing and induction have been proven in medicine and this is my whole argument for the hierarchy of effectiveness. like most everything we discuss, much of it may be disproved in the future but i wanted to throw it out there as i have never seen this argument presented before (its probably in the archives, but if it is i couldnt find it). i hope your challenge and this response helped others to get a better picture. i did make an overt effort to preface everthing with "my belief" and will try even harder in the future.
yet no hard evidence exists to support this somewhat accepted theory. like wise
my doctor seemed to think pegintron was 'stronger' or 'better" than pegasys and likewise no evidence exists to prove this either. this is just his personal belief and it influenced mine. i do personally believe that pegasys offers the least
varying blood concentration levels and because of this alone i beleive it has the
lesser svr rate, of the 3. again, no real evidence, studies have never been done that can prove or disprove this. pulsing, overdosing and induction have been proven in medicine and this is my whole argument for the hierarchy of effectiveness. like most everything we discuss, much of it may be disproved in the future but i wanted to throw it out there as i have never seen this argument presented before (its probably in the archives, but if it is i couldnt find it). i hope your challenge and this response helped others to get a better picture. i did make an overt effort to preface everthing with "my belief" and will try even harder in the future.
i wish it were all this simple. but as we know tx is very complex. i would think that by now with all studies if one brand or type of interferon eas better than another, it would have shown up in a study. infergen is concensus interferon so it's stronger. but if it was so effective, why not prescribe it in the 1st place, harsher sx?
also, i have another way at looking at the issue of interferon half life. the longer it stays in your system the more sustained the attack on the virus. i'm just offering a counterpoint. i know in all the literature says they don't even know how or why the stuff works!
as for me i'm on pegasys/riba. i'm a 1a, 50 old m, 200 lbs starting vl 3 mil. i cleared between 12 and 15 weeks. good luck to you, with whatever you do!
also, i have another way at looking at the issue of interferon half life. the longer it stays in your system the more sustained the attack on the virus. i'm just offering a counterpoint. i know in all the literature says they don't even know how or why the stuff works!
as for me i'm on pegasys/riba. i'm a 1a, 50 old m, 200 lbs starting vl 3 mil. i cleared between 12 and 15 weeks. good luck to you, with whatever you do!
I could not get my redipen to work on week 50 and had no more redipens left and it was the weekend, so I stuck a diabetic syringe into the end of the redipen (the powder and the sterile water had already successfully mixed together) and drew all I could see from the redipen. Talk about bad sides. I felt horrible for about four days; usually I only feel really horrible for two days after dosing the peg.
I found out a few days later that that the 150 mcg redipen actually contains 202 mcg of interferon. By drawing the peg out with a syringe, I probably wound up getting about a 200 mcg dose. No way I would ever take extra peg again, especially since I am doing 72 weeks.
Be careful taking extra. There are people who advocate the practice on this board of taking way more than the prescribed interferon dose who also complain of horrible lingering after effects of tx.
I found out a few days later that that the 150 mcg redipen actually contains 202 mcg of interferon. By drawing the peg out with a syringe, I probably wound up getting about a 200 mcg dose. No way I would ever take extra peg again, especially since I am doing 72 weeks.
Be careful taking extra. There are people who advocate the practice on this board of taking way more than the prescribed interferon dose who also complain of horrible lingering after effects of tx.
pegasys - ... less side effects. works fine on easy cases
pegintron - ...harder sx, better results with tough cases
Based on????
'but it is hard to argue against the logic and practical outcomes.' Which practical outcomes?
pegintron - ...harder sx, better results with tough cases
Based on????
'but it is hard to argue against the logic and practical outcomes.' Which practical outcomes?
120mg (.5ml) in the redipen pre made one use syringes. i havent checked the weight tables but at 160 lbs im probably on the border for the next size up.
i dont plan on upsizing but borderline weight groups should look at both dosages.
on the INF blood concentration levels do you see any merit at all in my thinking?
i dont plan on upsizing but borderline weight groups should look at both dosages.
on the INF blood concentration levels do you see any merit at all in my thinking?
The only point of view that I have is that using PegIntron I relapsed. Using Pegasys, I've been und since week 2. But, the reason was/is not necessarily the effectivness of the interferons. And, no tacit agreement on Infergen, I have no experience there.
what an interesting event for you. youre definately a "mcgyver" with syringes. at least you might get a benefit from the one high dose. not that you need it on your
intense regime.
im sorry, i obviously didnt make myself clear. im not promoting higher doses at all, just the fact that i believe that right after your normal shot, you temporarily have a higher concentration in your blood with different NFs. as the week goes on the concentration subsides and sx become less. just an idea that may have no real meaning in
HCV treatment. the responses here suggest little interest in the concept.
this answers my question, does any one believe or agree with this? not really.
thanks for your input.
intense regime.
im sorry, i obviously didnt make myself clear. im not promoting higher doses at all, just the fact that i believe that right after your normal shot, you temporarily have a higher concentration in your blood with different NFs. as the week goes on the concentration subsides and sx become less. just an idea that may have no real meaning in
HCV treatment. the responses here suggest little interest in the concept.
this answers my question, does any one believe or agree with this? not really.
thanks for your input.
Hey, man.
I am finally gettin your drift. I still worrie a bit about someone taking you as a Doctor or med. researcher, But I am following your ideas . I can see using some of your stratagy towards end. See my post re; my biop results when you can, it tells my war plan. When talking with my G.I. N.P. I mentioned some of the new Ideas of a strong attack (i call it ) She did not know of these new ideas but she feels it good looking into. I mentioned the Arm of the clinical test that is trying new stratagies as well .She will be trying to look in to this as well.
As for me I will be blending all together here when I start the battle in 5-6 months .
Hey !!! who kidnapped the real cruell? You an Abbas getting tight or what LOL !
Hope you feeling the best possible .
Mahalo's & Aloha,
R.
I am finally gettin your drift. I still worrie a bit about someone taking you as a Doctor or med. researcher, But I am following your ideas . I can see using some of your stratagy towards end. See my post re; my biop results when you can, it tells my war plan. When talking with my G.I. N.P. I mentioned some of the new Ideas of a strong attack (i call it ) She did not know of these new ideas but she feels it good looking into. I mentioned the Arm of the clinical test that is trying new stratagies as well .She will be trying to look in to this as well.
As for me I will be blending all together here when I start the battle in 5-6 months .
Hey !!! who kidnapped the real cruell? You an Abbas getting tight or what LOL !
Hope you feeling the best possible .
Mahalo's & Aloha,
R.
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