joints

I would like to please hear from anyone who has or is experiencing joint and muscle aches pre treatment.  My joints fingers, knees, ankles, and muscles ache deeply, sometimes it's hard to be comfortable even to sleep.  I explained this to the doc and he did some blood test to determine arthritis?  That was weeks ago and he's not been very helpful.  Any info or remedies would be greatly appreciated.  Mine is a very physical job and sometimes and the end of my day it seems my legs will barely carry me.

Thanks, Robin

[Tess Marie]

Hey Robin, I too have deep joint, muscle pain. This was throughout therapy (I finished 8/22) and the pain continues now. I am now taking anti-oxidants & my Primary Doctor recommended a Glucosamine supplement called "Move Free." I have not taken enough to see any improvement. I feel that part of my problem is lack of activity, as I do not exercise enough, but obviously this is not the same with you. I am also very stiff. Hot baths seem to help, but watch out because this also dries you out, leaving dry itching skin. I wish I had the answer for you, but hopefully just knowing that someone else is experiencing the same problem is some comfort. I know at times, I felt like I was the only one with all the terrible sides. God Bless

[couchpotato]

Sorry for breaking in........ yes, my husband is taking his full dose of Riba and only 1/2 doses of the interferon, been about a month of that. Thanks for letting me know that he can still clear if this should keep up.

[GI.PA]

Your GI probably did a cryoglobulin screen which is one of the documents cause and effect Hep C arthritis things.  It is not usually positive but if it is a Rheumatologist may be a good place to start.

If it is negative, you have to take a look at OTHER factors that cause joint/muscle pain.  This means going back to your primary care and saying..."Yes..this may be Hep C related..but I understand that it is much more likely to be something non-Hep C related, so doc what can we do both from an evaluation standpoint and a treatment standpoint, while my GI is getting this Hep C thing under control".  If he/she blows this off to Hep C find another doctor.

There was a study years ago looking at depression, joint pains ect in relationship to Hep C.  They found that if your take 100 people with Hep C and 100 people without, they had the same rate of these problems.  In addition, these complaints were unlikely to go away even with viral cure, making one question if the Hep C is indeed the CAUSAL agent or a BYSTANDER.

I am not saying there is no relationship between the two but you must push the somewhat ignorent family doctor to look beyond the Hep C.  When my patient do so, they typically find out they have lupus, rhuematoid or osteoarthritis...etc and finally get treated appropriately.

Just my 2 cents..
Hopping off the soapbox now.

Gi.PA

Erin

[Bevily]

Hi Robin,
  Yes, my husband has and had what you are experiencing.  He first noticed that the balls of his feet were hurting him.  Then his knees, then his hands, then his wrists.  He saw a Rheumatologist, but all the tests showed he didn't have RA.  They kept treating him with liver-damaging drugs at that point.  He was just getting worse.  His one wrist hurt him the most.  He could hardly walk in the a.m. X-rays showed no arthritis. Anyway, I threatened him with divorce if he wouldn't go to another Dr.  He did and found the Hep C.  He has been just as swollen and achy on treatment, perhaps worse. His hands feel hot and look red.  He seems to have one area bother him for awhile and then another area.
    Crazy as some of these may sound, he found different things helped him.  He stays away from corn and red meat.  They flare him up.  He also found that a fresh pineapple, cut and he sucks on the skin, helps him the most.  Cherries helped his swelling and pain.  The fresh ones.  He also finds that milk products seem to make him worse, as does chocolate.  He also has massage machines and heating pads.  We found that when he rubs the ball of one massager on his palm that it helps.  We read this is to help arthritis in an acupuncture article.  
    These are some of the things he does, although he hasn't gotten rid of the symptoms entirely.  I hope when he goes off treatment the symptoms will be more tolerable and lessen.

[Tallblonde]

I was diagnosed with HCV two months ago, but haven't started treatment yet.  I've been experiencing the same deep joint and muscle pain you describe. I've always been a very active person, so I certainly took notice when this symptom started several months ago (getting out of the car is the worst). I have no proof that it's related to the HCV, but I firmly believe that it is.  I also experience numbness and tingling in my extremities.  My anti-smooth muscle antibody and cryoglobulin counts are both a tad high, but my GI insists that I don't have auto-immune hepatitis co-exisiting with HCV.  

I'm not sure what to make of these pre-treatment symptoms, but I know we're not the only ones having them.

Susan

[CARUU]

I have many muscle/joint symptoms, as well.  Neck and upper back pain, left foot burns, tennis elbow.  I get massages every other week for the neck, and use arnica gel to deaden the muscle pain.  It works, but has alcohol in it and so I don't know if I should be using it.  I don't eat much red meat, but I'll try to pay attention to relationship of diet to the pain.  Typing on the computer hurts my hands, forearms and elbows.  I agree that exercise helps to keep some things moving better, but it doesn't get rid of the pain and it's really hard to get motivated whil on tx.  Sometimes I feel like I'm doing good to get up and out the door to work.  Other times I'm doing well to just get off of the couch and get the mail.

[layla]

I had joint pain for a bout 7 years pre dx though I've had HCV for 28 years. It did get quit painful. I had told my GP but mothing was ever found. I was very active and chalked it up to that but it was very painfull. After dx my hep doc tested me for RA and I had a positive RA factor so he referred me to a RA doc who said I definately did not have RA but it was most likeley associated with the HCV. He'd seen that before. Weird thing is after my 2nd month on tx it just stopped. No more joint pain. Sometime now I think I can feel it slightly but nothing like before. My hep doc said I can retest my RA factor again but it is best to wait until 6 month post tx because HCV could cause this positive RA reading. By the way it was just slightly over the normal numbers. For relief the only thing that worked was aspirin. I tried tylenol and motrin but nothing worked. The dic said ok to limited aspirin. I hardly had to take any and it helped quickly. I don't know of this helps you but that was/is my story. I didn't have any muscle pain just in my joints.

Hope everyone is doing ok. I've been to sick to be on the forum lately. Lots of sx. The headache is keeping me down. Hopefully it will go away soon. It is a little better today. LL

[simpleman]

Sounds a lot like what I had-gout. Especially the hot and red part and the diet connection. Have his uric acid checked. I didn't have it before tx and hope it goes away now that I'm done. Good luck.

[slarso]

I had pain in both shouldes from over use.The problem was called adhisive capulitis or frozen sholder. The best solution was just to work it is several streches 3 times a day. The problem is inflamation (inflammation) of the capsula which covers the sholder joint. Some feel that interfurion is a anti inflamitory, it must be because one good sx for me is my sholder feels fine!

Layla,glad to hear you feel better, hope tomorrow is even better

[slarso]

I had pain in both shouldes from over use.The problem was called adhisive capulitis or frozen sholder. The best solution was just to work it is several streches 3 times a day. The problem is inflamation (inflammation) of the capsula which covers the sholder joint. Some feel that interfurion is a anti inflamitory, it must be because one good sx for me is my sholder feels fine!

Layla,glad to hear you feel better, hope tomorrow is even better

[layla]

Had problems with both my shoulders from over use to. Ended up with rotator cuff surgery on both. One 15 years ago the other just before tx. The recovery was long but they work like a charm now (though I am still doing therapy on this last one). I hadn't read about interferon being an anti inflamatory. Interesting. LL

[layla]

Had problems with both my shoulders from over use to. Ended up with rotator cuff surgery on both. One 15 years ago the other just before tx. The recovery was long but they work like a charm now (though I am still doing therapy on this last one). I hadn't read about interferon being an anti inflamatory. Interesting. LL

[layla]

whoops! lol

[lucky1]

I also had pre treatment joint and muscle pain. during treatment the shoulder pain went away. I am now 2 Mo. post treatment and the shoulder pain has returned although not as severe. The other aches and pains seem to be dissapering as well although thr post treatment recovery process is slower than I thought it would be.

I was geno 1A infected for about 30 years. 6 mill VL undetect at 8 weeks. just received 8 week post treatment pcr back still undetectable. Life is slowly getting better my hair is starting to grow back and I don't want to kick the cat anymore. I should have taken the oppertunity when I had the chance but now I like him again. Bottem line there is life after treatment and it does get better

Good luck to all and God bless
Marshall

[sugie]

Does anyone have any knowledge of Chiropractic when on TX? I had a bad neck before and the TX has seemed to make the soreness worse. Wondering if it is unrealistic to expect Chiro. ajustments, gadits like tens and wave table to help. Or could it hurt?? I was sore before I went and still sore after. Just trying to find an alternative to tylenol for aches and pains. Thanks for any info. sugie

[MajNeni]

Lucky you, lucky cat!  Congratulations.  Clear at 8 weeks post is so cool...
Maj Neni

[Sioux]

I too had muscle/joint pain pre TX. The muscle pain was like when I was little and they told me it was growing pains. I get that still, and my joints. fingers, hands, shoulders, knees and feet. My Family Doc did a rheumatoid arthritis test and it came back negative.

[Ambush]

Happy to hear your great news on your 8wk post tx test!  Also glad you and the cat are getting along :)
ambush

[tigerpants]

I found  that a 1 hour massage once per week,  helped my aches and pains so much. I also  went to the Chiro about once every month, right after my massage. By doing this I  only had to take tylenol or  Aleeve maybe once every 10 days.
I asked the massage therapist for a package deal where I would come every week at the same time,never be late  and if I had to cancel--give her one day notice. In turn she gave me a good break on the cost. Also a chiro can refer you to a massage therapist and some insurances will pay at least 70% if not more.

I did my shot on Tuesday nights and had my massage on Thursday.
It was not "relaxation massage" but  theraputic, medium to deep pressure.. I would swear by it.

April

[CARUU]

I've also been getting an upper body massage for neck, shoulder, upper back pain.  Every other week.  It feels really good and helps for a few days.  Today I have had a headache for 3 days and big trouble concentrating at work.  I just took Excedrin Tension (doc approved)and it seems to be helping.  Maybe I'll be able to actually get some work done tomorrow.

[PostToasty]

May shoulders are so bad that I can't put a belt in my pants, I have to do it before I put them on.  I can barely reach my wallet!  Other joints in muscles are starting to chime in now also, looks to be all downhill from here.  I was always very active and could do hand stands push-ups.   HAD very muscular build from lots of hard work but now that's toast.

Hep C diagnosis 3 years ago.  I'm type 1 diabetic for over 37 years and lost my health insurance just before the diagnosis.  No one will insure me as they just do not insure 50 year old diabetic's who took good care of themselves with no diabetes related complications.  So .. it a sick fricking world and now I'm a "dead man walking."

Can't afford treatment, Hep C is killing the liver, number are way to high, 10 to 200 times normal.  Thinking the Heath Leger treatment is the way to go here.  Can work one day, trashed the next.  3 days a week does not support me.  Coming to the end of the rope, hang'n by the last knot and the shoulders wouldn't let me hang long!

[mayday557]

I have to second the motion regarding  bvly's post.

Red meat can also elevate the ammonia levels (norms are
30-ish to 90-ish) which can cause encepholopathy-sp?-.
Which I have.  Its funny how diet can effect the body !

[Dora82_05]

I have had HepC since 1982 (I was given blood after birth of my son). I didn't find out til 1990 when I went to give blood for the first time. I really didn't begin aching til after my total hysterectomy in 2005. Now, I ache from my fingers to my toes. I have a deep pain mostly in my left upper leg. My neck and shoulders crunch and ache. I also noticed my feet have gotten redden and appear swollen. My blood levels have elevated since 2 years ago. The only think I could think of I did different is start taking vitamins because I refused Hormone treatments (didn't want *** cancer on top of hepc). So I quit taking the vitamins thinking that is what elevated the blood work and now I ache even worse, my attitude stinks, more tired, thinking is a joke. Don't know what's right or wrong and definitely not a doctor out there you can trust or has a care. Just a number. I know everything goes thru the liver, so we're screwed. take it, don't take it. I gave up drinking, have horrible or no appetite, scared to take vitamins. No desire to make myself eat. Everyday is a struggle and then the dr is probably gonna want me to be sick for a year or better, to what feel better. What I have been reading here on this site doesn't give me much hope. I am beginning to feel like maybe I should just take the vitamins, gloucosamine, screw the treatments, give to God and just live to the end. I am sooooo tired of trying to figure out who to trust, where to go, whats right or whats wrong. There are truly no answers. And I just cannot think clear enough about any of it anymore. I am totally frustrated and sick of it all. My heart goes out to you. I have lost alot of inner strength and desire. I know I need help making sense of everything but my trust is in the tiolet. I can totally relate to  Post Toasty. You just get soooo tired of it all. And please don't think I am by any means trying to insult anyone, I am not. More power to you for the decisions you make and I do pray for the best for you. Well, enough babbling. Just needed to vent. I am pretty pissed off at the world, and too tired to care.....

[mayday557]

Please don't hate me for saying this...but I know exactly
how you feel.  
Just the other day I posted a very similar thread.

I don't know you personally, but just keep doing what you need to do to stay
your most healthy self ~~~ on all levels.

There are times when I'm overwhelmed to the max and the
' head commitee ' just won't shut the #$%^&* up !

Don't worry about insulting any one here (at least speaking for
myself), we're a pretty crusty crew - move over Motley -.

I'm in a state of flux myself being taken off of tx and told by the
gastro-dude that I can't ever take the standard tx again.  Time for
a second opinion me thinketh.

[Dora82_05]

Thank you I needed the laugh. I like the way called it the "head committee", I loved it and your right it never shuts up. The wheels go round and round. And I loved Motley Crew:) I am truly sorry to hear about the tx. A second opinion would definitely not be a bad idea. I have had my run ins with some real winners (drs). Here's a laugh for ya, I went to an Infectious Disease dr that actually thought injecting steriods into my feet would alevate some of my symptoms. But I thought, what do I know I'm not a dr, so after about 2 trips I realized the dr was out his mind. Told my regular dr about it, and he just grinned and said yeah he had heard about that research. My regular dr was gracious enough not to comment.LOL But I understood the body language. So, just be careful:) I did finally hear some results on the Ultrasound and Blood work, he said my liver was remarkable and my blood work looked good. I have genotype 1B. So now I have a  biopsy the end of this month and we will decide the next course of action. I am going back on my vitamins and I am going to get some Gloucosamine. Get my energy level back up. Well see. Thank you for your response. Good Luck to you and God be with you also........

[mayday557]

You'd better get back on those vitamins - don't make me have to pull over and stop the car !

Real cool to hear the positives sis, and back at ya with all that is good...mayday

[Severance]

B12 shots, I have one a month.
If I'm having an okay day the B12 will give me an energy boost, if I'm not I get a sound sleep. Either way I win.  

"Research shows that unhealthy levels of essential B-vitamins like B6, B9 and B12 may contribute to poor mood and feelings related to anxiety and depression. Supplementing your diet with essential B-vitamins can have a direct effect on important neurotransmitters in the brain, such as serotonin, norepinephrine and dopamine. As well, evidence suggests that B-vitamins are important cofactors that help balance and metabolize neuro-toxic chemicals that have been linked to anxiety and depression related conditions."

Your GI can add a B12 levels test to your bloods. I'm unsure as to what it will cost you.
I do know that without it..I would have been tea partying permanently with the Mad Hatter by now. Instead of just the occasional visit.

[Dora82_05]

You two are so funny and have great advice:)  I will inquire for sure.
"head committee" "mad hatter". I have got to come up with something myself, hmmm how about Pycho winch. What do you all think? Anyway, good night and be safe......

[Isobella]

I also have joint pain.  That is actually how I was diagnosed in January.  My right pointer finger knuckle would hurt so bad and get red and swollen.  

My primary doc did an RA factor and it came back high, which got me sent to a rheumatiod doctor.  She is the one that found the HCV.  So now all blame for pain is on the HCV and she  says I don't have any type of arthritis.

Monday I was at the podiatrist with foot pain-I have bruised heels on both feet-out of the blue.  One day fine, next day can barely walk. But at least my knuckle is not hurting! :-)

They may just be right in blaming it all on the virus.

Best of luck-

Isobella

[Isobella]

Ok-I was just so excited to have someone with the same symptoms I just posted to a 5 year old thread!  :-)

Mama's tired tonight!

You guys hang in there things will get better!

Izzy

[Dora82_05]

Don't feel too bad, I just realized I did the same thing. Never noticed the date. Hope you had a good night sleep:)
Oh, and thanks for the info. I also had the RH test and was told it was border line and by coincidence the same finger. But my family has a history of Arthritis, so I never gave it another thought. My joints are feeling alittle better since getting back on the vitamins and my attitude is alittle better too. This sounds crazy but low impact Yoga seems to help alittle too. I guess the breathing helps to get the blood moving along with the relaxation. It helps to stretch the muscles out and it's not all bouncy bouncy:)
Good luck to ya.....