A Glass Of Wine With Dinner

[Magnum]

My oh my... this is very interesting. As most of you know, I had a liver transplant and am now undetectable. I was treated in Las Vegas for 14 years by a doctor who treated me through all my treatment nightmares and was instrumental in warning me when to get on the transplant list when I was near death. I am still in touch with him, as he wants to know my progress.

A couple of weeks ago, I saw my transplant doctor at UCLA Medical Center in L.A. and asked if I could have a glass of wine with dinner. He said "no". The interesting point here is that my Hepatologist in Vegas today when we spoke, said "yes". His explanation was "Why not? Now that you have a perfectly good working liver, you should be just fine enjoying your glass of wine with dinner, as long as you don't overdo it". Being Italian, and following in the footsteps of my heritage, all my relatives had a glass of wine with dinner. In fact, my mother did as well, and lived to be 95. My uncle is 94, aunt is 82 and grandmother died at 92.

So, I would like to hear from anyone here who has asked this question to their doctor and let us know what he said. By the way, my grandfather was an exception. He drank a quart of whiskey every adult day of his life and lived to be 92. When I went to his cremation, that fire would not go out...

Magnum                                                                            

[tanya24]

Hi Magnum,

I must admit, that was one of the first things I thought about, when I got my lab results showing UND a couple of weeks ago! I've never had a drinking problem, but I sure do miss my occasional "glasses" of wine or champagne (and in further years back..cosmos), especially at social events or dinners when my friends and family all partake. I have not had a drink of alcohol for several years now, (since my bilirubin was high, I was upgraded to stage 2/3, and I started to just feel sick every time I would ingest "any" alcohol.) I am currently in my 7th week of my 12 week Harvoni treatment.

That being said, I asked my hepatologist at my last appt., when I might be able to have my some wine or champagne again. She told me that I should probably wait until about a year after I finish my treatment to give my liver its best chance of healing. She said, after that, I could probably have a glass or two, of wine or champagne only, "occasionally." She said, she wouldn't recommend more than that, since there is no clear timeline as to when or how fast the liver regenerates itself.  Hope that helps!

Blessings, Tanya

[Mattsmom218]

My hepatologist said it was ok to have an occasional glass of wine. I'm not having any alcohol while on tx.

[Livelife777]

Magnum
An occasional drink, why not!
You know yourself better then anyone.  If you can drink once in a while without going to the dark side then enjoy.  If, you could be headed back
to the party days I would say Whoooaaa!
Only YOU know the answer.
......Kim

[dontworry_behappy1]

That is the funniest joke I've heard him tell.   If not... that's the greatest free advertisement scam for a liquor store.   Very creative thinking.

[Stronglady14]

Why is everyone going thru all this sounds like he already made up his mind. He is one has to live with the results.

[jules2551]

"While in the motel room, I was watching TV. It was a Sunday and there was nothing on but religious programs, so I turned it off and looked around for something to read. On the night stand, there was a Gideon’s bible. I’ve heard of them but never read one. Out of curiosity, I opened it. Inside the front cover, someone wrote in very neatly “if you have a drinking problem, call 921-1256". So I did. It was the liquor store just down the street... "

Oh Magnum, I am still laughing here!  You have been through hell and back and life is just too damn short.  If you want an occasional glass of wine...enjoy!  Cheers!

Jules

[susan400]

Magnum, if you lurking on this thread still (without responding), I apologize if I attacked you. That certainly was not my intention. I consider you my friend.  I am just worried about it affecting your treatment drugs. I really don't care if you decide to drink an occasional glass of wine AFTER Tx.  But, just look at what happened to me. I wasn't not drinking any all through my treatment and in fact gave up alcohol 19 yrs ago.  But, even though I went undetected on week 4 of the Sovaldi/Peg/Riba, was undetected week 8 and was undetected on 1 week post treatment... I still relapsed.  I don't want you to relapse on your Harvoni, plain and simple...     Take care.  Merry Christmas, Susan400

[Ekkiemom]

Hi OM
IMHO I believe that everyone knows what the truth is in each of us, purely from a common sense point of view.  That being said, brings me back to personal choices, where we are at maturity wise, where we are at in our sobriety, if we are just making the motions still romancing our addictions (if struggling w/any addiction) or walking the walk. Ultimately it comes down to the individual to make that decision. I'm stage 3-4 Fib and  had virus 30+ and haven't felt this good in I can't even remember how long. I'm not willing to take a chance with alcohol, above that I don't desire it......sorry so wordy, I get like that but I just want to get my point across, hope I was not too harsh.....
Time to go
Peace and Blessings my friend
Namaste........deb

[OMECO]

And then I asked two other hepatologists. One said: No alcoholic drinks anymore, the other one said: Max. One drink a day. I'm fibrose fade 3. What is the truth?

[OMECO]

I'm in a trial of Gilead at the moment and asked the hepatologist if I could have a glass of wine with my Christmasdinner. He said: Ok, but take care that it's a good glass of wine

[hepcandme]

I told a dear friend about this question posted by a someone in my support group. She is an alcoholic but has been sober for 5 years

My friend thought it was "mean" for you to post this comment to your fellow heppers who cannot Ever have a drink again. It was something that I hadn't thought of, really, although it did seem an odd post

She also thought it sounded like classic alcoholism as well but she is in recovery so she kinda looks at things through that lens

I am certain that you were not trying to be mean, Magnum

A healthy, happy holiday to you and fingers crossed on SVR!!

[Rbeth]

Oh gosh, I knew that ;-) that would be like the hunters who went home ....
Da Da Dum!!


Btw, how are your headaches? And eyes?

Ran

[Magnum]

I didn't mean I will not respond anymore to this forum, I mean to this "A Glass Of Wine With Dinner". post...

Magnum

[Rbeth]

I can hear that you're off this thread. I can also feel your feeling of being attacked, though, for sure, you're well loved on these pages. I hope you will still steal a look here.

This might sound very off to you and the community I care about & pray for & feel so connected with, because.... of our liver commonality..... BUT, honestly, I wasn't even thinking about your liver, the moment I saw your post & response to mine, to all.....
Magnum, I was(am) overly concerned about your predisposition to being a full blown alcoholic again... Perhaps, you are someone who is "cured" of addiction, maybe the only one I've ever met, I kinda doubt that. So while I throw no stones, & obviously care about your liver, I am just asking you to dig deep, look underneath social parameters and please surrender again.

With much care,
Randy

[orphanedhawk]

You make some good points. I feel after the whole transplant experience, both prior and after, I no longer will live my life in fear. Being told I had ESLD was probably the scariest thing that's ever happened to me. But having faced my mortality, I am no longer afraid.

It certainly has been proven that stress is not good for anyone's healthy.
And I do believe in following one's intuition about what is right. I don't believe in one size fits all whether it's clothing or health care.

I know post transplant because of the immune suppression meds we are supposed to be more susceptible to disease. However, I don't get sick. When I feel a cold coming on, I take the day off and it disappears. Hopefully that won't change.

I'm over 5 years post tp and no, I'm not about to stop toking because of something Hector's doctor said. Since my transplant, I've traveled to the Caribbean and Thailand and I never take any precautions other than using common sense, like before my transplant.

One thing doctors consider in Thailand that I haven't heard much here, is quality of life.
Live and enjoy !

[Magnum]

This is why I enjoy this forum. Different opinions from different folks. I know we're all here to help, advise and instruct those who are in some sort of a problem.

After all I've been through, I think I know what to do. Period. As for destroying the gift I received of a perfectly working liver, I will take extremely good care of it. But as for a glass of wine occasionally, what's the point of having gone through all the suffering and agony if one can't enjoy an occasional glass of wine? After all, those words came right out of the mouth of Hepatologist who has been in practice for 32 years.

I appreciate all your feedbacks. That's why were here, but for some, it's extremely traumatic to think that a glass of wine will destroy all that's been done. Don't you think I ponder on this? Anyway I wish everyone a very Merry Christmas and a healthy New Year. Since I’ve made my point and my statement, I will not respond anymore to this post...

Magnum

[Dee1956]

Dear Magnum, you got a lot of great answers to your question.
I am glad you are doing so well.
When I was treating I could barely eat much less think about having a drink.
I am glad to hear these new treatments are so much easier
Cheers
D

[patra_]

Hepcand me said just what I was thinking.......

   Your Liver..yout Life...your Decision.  

I truly don't think any of us are ostrasizing you, just trying to persuade you not to take a chance on something which, in the long run, and in other than great moderation can hurt your new liver, and thereby, hurt you!

If we didn't care about you, we wouldn't care what you did.  That said, if you add a 'glass of wine with dinner' 'once in a while' please limit it to that.  The problem we see, is that one leads to two, then every day, and before long it can grow to be enough to damage your new liver..

Having said all that, I agree with can-do-man one must enjoy life, but I also agree with hepcandme, I'll stick to my purified water, for my own peace of mind, so back to where I started,,,,Your Liver, your Life, your Decision.

Take care and beat this Dragon, whatever you do!    : -).   Pat

[dontworry_behappy1]

You listen to what Hector says about smoking pot but not about drinking alcohol?   You come here and asked people who have had hepatitis C, cirrhosis, liver fibrosis and treating hep c if drinking is ok.   If you believe your doctor then why are you asking?  I remember you saying your doctor told you "it's not the end of the world".   Did he then say go have a drink?   I doubt it. I can't even imagin a doctor telling a transplant patient to even drink one glass of wine.  Expecially a transplant patient with active Hepatitis C, with a recent liver transplant and on treatment to boot.    I'm with everyone else except for cando who is just stirring the pot..... This seems to be obsessively important to drink.   It's not to us.   I was a social drinker for years and years and years.
My health is more important than any amount of alcohol.  
  
How about honoring the person who gave you that healthy liver and showing others you mean it by having a toast........with sparkling grape juice.  

Magnum I think your asking for approval from the wrong people.  Go ask people in a bar if you should drink.

Happy Holidays

[can-do-man]

Want to add to the above there is some good benefit to having one glass of wine a day. Just not the rot gut stuff...:)

[can-do-man]

"I get the feeling that I’m being ostracized for even mentioning that I could have a glass of wine with dinner."

You won't from me. One must enjoy life and I find it hard a single glass of wine with dinner is going to do any harm as long as it doesn't effect your meds. Remember you had the TP to continue living so a little enjoyment is a good thing.

[Magnum]

Point well taken. You stated something important. You smoke cannabis to sleep. Okay, here we go again. Cannabis in post transplant patients can cause lung fungus. Hector told me, but I was unsure of it until my doctor's assistant said the same thing when I asked if I could renew my Medial Marijuana card after my transplant. So what are you to do? Stop?

You see my point? I feel to each his own without a barrage of criticism or even unwarranted medical opinions. Otherwise, what's the point of doctors? Obviously I wish you and everyone here well. I wanted to renew my card after my transplant for the same reason you use it. Now what? I would love to have a couple of hits before going to bed. If this keeps up, pretty soon we'll be criticized for the air we breath, which in itself in California is not the cleanest.

I'm not the type of person that wants to go out with a bang like others who indulged in heavy drinking after transplants, which eventually put them in their grave, such as Larry Hagman and John Phillips. Let each person create their own path through life. After all, it's no one's influence that will determine their destiny anyway...

Magnum

[hepcandme]

I must concur with Hawk. I also noticed that you posted about a glass of champagne on your birthday and now a glass of wine? It seems that you want validation for something that you are feeling like you are getting away with

I am cirrhotic and fortunately may never need a liver transplant if I can get rid of this virus but one of the things that I have learned on this journey is that little things like a glass of wine are not really that important in the grand scheme of things

I don't drink when others do at family events or when out with friends. I can go to the diveyest bar and enjoy myself with my soda and cranberry juice or enjoy a trip to a winery where I can still enjoy the bouquet of a lovely pinot noir and the ambience of the grapes on the vine

It's an odd thing with tranplantees though since, ostensibly your liver is as good as new. I attended a support group once where there was a gentleman who was post-transplant who basically said, hey, this is a new liver so I can start drinking again, right? Everyone in the room was aghast - including an 18 year old with a MELD score of 38 who was in a wheelchair and a breathing tube stuck in her nose

It also may be a factor in the strict guidelines to determine who gets a donated liver. I'm guessing that if you had asked about drinking then, you may not have gotten that liver

But, in the end, it is your life and your decision. I am very happy for you that you seem to approaching SVR and you have made it this far on a remarkable road to continue on this unpredictable buy joyous ride we call life

[Magnum]

I appreciate very much your concern, but Hector, a good friend of mine is not a doctor. When a very experienced Gastroenterologist/Hepatologist says it's OK for me to have a glass of wine with my dinner, there has to be some sort of consideration about what he's stating.

What is the point to have a new liver if you have to worry about every little thing you ingest? I have to reiterate and again say that the chemicals I'm ingesting to prevent my liver from being massacred by my immune system is worse than a glass of wine. For example, both doctors, as well as Hector have told me that Prograf, the anti-rejection pills are in the long run, going to have a negative effect on my kidneys and could eventually in the long run cause kidney failure.

I get the feeling that I’m being ostracized for even mentioning that I could have a glass of wine with dinner. Whose advice should I follow?, a doctor who has had 12 years of training, including four years of residency, or someone who is alarmed at the thought I will destroy this wonderful gift with a glass of wine, even occasionally. To me, I have to follow the rule of logic.

When I was putting down the margaritas on a daily basis and I had Hep C, I decided to try and not drink. I drove an hour from Las Vegas to Mesquite and checked into a motel for the two days I had off, just to get away from the temptation of the Las Vegas scene of gambling, partying, drinking, etc.

While in the motel room, I was watching TV. It was a Sunday and there was nothing on but religious programs, so I turned it off and looked around for something to read. On the night stand, there was a Gideon’s bible. I’ve heard of them but never read one. Out of curiosity, I opened it. Inside the front cover, someone wrote in very neatly “if you have a drinking problem, call 921-1256". So I did. It was the liquor store just down the street...

Magnum