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Herpes from genital to mouth to genitals of other.
Hello, and thank you in advance for answering my questions below. I had a single instance of visiting an escort. This was not a drugged out street walker, as she took appointments, asked that I shower (which I did in advance), and then asked that I wash my hands prior. She performed felatio without the use of a condom. Then she put a condom on me, she slathered lube over the condom as well as on her vaginal area, and we had protected sex for only a few minutes. I promptly washed up, then showered 20 minutes later at home, with lots of soap, drank tons of water so that I could urinate alot to flush my urethra further. 4 days later, in the morning, I had some white discharge that was similar to semen in color & consistancy. Throughout the day I found that I had a beading up of clear slick precum. This was present even after urinating. The following morning (Day 5), prior to urinating, I squeezed the shaft, running up to the tip, and a milky discharge came out (No longer clear, but puss like in consistancy). There was a slight stinging when peeing, not much, the feeling didnt linger, but it was a slight stinging nonetheless. There was/is no redness, no other symptoms, other than the discharge. On the 6th day I went to see my general practitioner. I explained the situation, gave a urine specimin, and asked that I have a full battery of STD tests (which included Chlamydia/Gono, HSV, and HIV for good measure). So far (2 days later), all results except for the HSV tests came back. Everything was negative, and Im still waiting for the HSV test. A couple of years ago I had a similar discharge, though it did have alot more burning when peeing, and the tip was red and irratated. I went to a clinic, they did a swab, test was negative for Chlamydia/Gono, and suggested it was an infection of some sort and gave me Zpak. I followed up after with a full STD panel of tests and all were negative (last year). Thats the backdrop.
From what I have gathered on this forum, you state that unprotected Oral sex performed on a man, by a woman is considered "Safe sex" (your words). My questions are:
1. Based on your experience, and the patients youve seen, do you see many/any cases where a man contracts Genital HSV from oral sex performed on him? Especially where the other partner/woman has HSV? ( I dont know if the escort has any STD/STI)
2. If the escort had unprotected oral sex with a previous client, just 2 hours earlier, Im curious what the odds are of transmission of an STD from his genitals, to her mouth, then 2 hours later to my genitals?
3. Building on the last question, how long does the HSV virus live if it transfers to someones mouth, where its in a moist invironment?. Mouthwash was used between her appointments, but can the virus live and be passed around like a hot potato? I felt this question was a good one especially where escorts are involved.
Thank you.
From what I have gathered on this forum, you state that unprotected Oral sex performed on a man, by a woman is considered "Safe sex" (your words). My questions are:
1. Based on your experience, and the patients youve seen, do you see many/any cases where a man contracts Genital HSV from oral sex performed on him? Especially where the other partner/woman has HSV? ( I dont know if the escort has any STD/STI)
2. If the escort had unprotected oral sex with a previous client, just 2 hours earlier, Im curious what the odds are of transmission of an STD from his genitals, to her mouth, then 2 hours later to my genitals?
3. Building on the last question, how long does the HSV virus live if it transfers to someones mouth, where its in a moist invironment?. Mouthwash was used between her appointments, but can the virus live and be passed around like a hot potato? I felt this question was a good one especially where escorts are involved.
Thank you.
Fleetwood20, I wanted to say thank you for the time you've given, and for the answers. There is a dizzying amount of information online. Some sites paint pictures that would have one convinced their symptoms are something that are not what they have. Ive since learned that transmission orally is far more prevalent than people would think. As for me, I finished my course of Zithromax and I'm fine. Back to normal.
As others view my post, and see your answers to my questions, perhaps some of them will find some similarities between their symptoms and mine. I can tell you that all of the tests were in fact negative. Thanks again for helping me better understand many things.
As others view my post, and see your answers to my questions, perhaps some of them will find some similarities between their symptoms and mine. I can tell you that all of the tests were in fact negative. Thanks again for helping me better understand many things.
My main message is that there is nothing in your tests that could indicate a herpes infection.
Further your symptoms are not those of a herpes infection.
I think we can be very confident in saying that these symptom and test results in no way point to herpes.
IgG antibodies are not usually detectable until around week 3. IgM antibodies are not reliable, meaning they may not be actually detectable even with an infection.
I'd say you're fine for sex once you're feeling normal.
Further your symptoms are not those of a herpes infection.
I think we can be very confident in saying that these symptom and test results in no way point to herpes.
IgG antibodies are not usually detectable until around week 3. IgM antibodies are not reliable, meaning they may not be actually detectable even with an infection.
I'd say you're fine for sex once you're feeling normal.
I forgot to ask. Once Im cleared up when can I engage in having sex? Even thought my symptoms seem as if they will be gone prior to finishing the Zithro, I will finish the entire 5 day course. Should I wait a further week? more?
Is it fair to say that your objective assesment is:
9. that my research has yielded a classic case of hyper sensitivity to website research, with mild paranoia.
10. That you are pretty confident that Herpes is NOT what I have.
11. That its a classic sign of a bacterial infection, and that even though Chlamydia and Gono were ruled out, there are many other forms of bacteria that are not part of any standard testing, which could explain the absense of bacteria in my urine test. Stated differently, the lack of finding bacteria only means it was lacking the specific Gono and Chlamydia they were looking for, and only those. It DOESNT rule out bacteria as a category.
This information is based on something I read from another post.
http://www.medhelp.org/posts/STDs/Non-std-penile-discharge/show/962043
If you could expand on your answer to #4, I think I may be missunderstanding you. When you say "The tell tale lesions are present" are you saying that MY pictures indicate what you suspect are tell tale Herpes lesions? Just want to make sure.
You say "The vast majority of people in these circumstances have no ambiguity upon infection.". Can you elaborate?
I know that blood tests alone, if taken too early (6 days after exposure), are only seeking antibodies and that the body hasnt had a chance of building up enough to show a reliable positive reading. However, if someone IS having an initial breakout at 6 days, wouldnt there be even SOME reading above <0.91? Wouldnt there be minimally something in the Equivocal range?
I can tell you that I just took the 3rd day of 5 of my Zithro, and as of this moment I only had a momentary itch, but i seem to be fine. This mornings discharge was very very very small.
Lastly, It sounds that youd bet this simply isnt Herpes, based on all the details Ive shared, and that the antibiotics are doing their job in killing off this bacterial thing. Am I correct?
Thanks Fleetwood20
9. that my research has yielded a classic case of hyper sensitivity to website research, with mild paranoia.
10. That you are pretty confident that Herpes is NOT what I have.
11. That its a classic sign of a bacterial infection, and that even though Chlamydia and Gono were ruled out, there are many other forms of bacteria that are not part of any standard testing, which could explain the absense of bacteria in my urine test. Stated differently, the lack of finding bacteria only means it was lacking the specific Gono and Chlamydia they were looking for, and only those. It DOESNT rule out bacteria as a category.
This information is based on something I read from another post.
http://www.medhelp.org/posts/STDs/Non-std-penile-discharge/show/962043
If you could expand on your answer to #4, I think I may be missunderstanding you. When you say "The tell tale lesions are present" are you saying that MY pictures indicate what you suspect are tell tale Herpes lesions? Just want to make sure.
You say "The vast majority of people in these circumstances have no ambiguity upon infection.". Can you elaborate?
I know that blood tests alone, if taken too early (6 days after exposure), are only seeking antibodies and that the body hasnt had a chance of building up enough to show a reliable positive reading. However, if someone IS having an initial breakout at 6 days, wouldnt there be even SOME reading above <0.91? Wouldnt there be minimally something in the Equivocal range?
I can tell you that I just took the 3rd day of 5 of my Zithro, and as of this moment I only had a momentary itch, but i seem to be fine. This mornings discharge was very very very small.
Lastly, It sounds that youd bet this simply isnt Herpes, based on all the details Ive shared, and that the antibiotics are doing their job in killing off this bacterial thing. Am I correct?
Thanks Fleetwood20
To your questions.
4. Your tests reveal no herpes as a baseline before the episode. This is significant. The vast majority of people in these circumstances have no ambiguity upon infection. The tell tale lesions are present and readily swabbed.
5. This is no indication of a viral infection. A count of what you describe may not even be an infection. You most probably have not been tested for many forms of bacteria. Plenty of micoplasmas around!
6. I doubt there is an issue.
7. Yes, a persistent bacteria, not well targeted by the antibiotic, will continue.
8. No reason at all to suspect herpes on the basis of symptoms or tests. The answer is that everything is irrelevant to the determination of a herpes infection.
4. Your tests reveal no herpes as a baseline before the episode. This is significant. The vast majority of people in these circumstances have no ambiguity upon infection. The tell tale lesions are present and readily swabbed.
5. This is no indication of a viral infection. A count of what you describe may not even be an infection. You most probably have not been tested for many forms of bacteria. Plenty of micoplasmas around!
6. I doubt there is an issue.
7. Yes, a persistent bacteria, not well targeted by the antibiotic, will continue.
8. No reason at all to suspect herpes on the basis of symptoms or tests. The answer is that everything is irrelevant to the determination of a herpes infection.
Fleetwood, thank you. I have a few more questions since my post a couple days ago, partly due to a need to clarify on my end, the development of a new symptom, and questions that came as a result of further research.
When I said that I went to see my doctor and "Explained the situation" I should have said that I told him about the symptoms but did NOT tell him anything about the sexual encounter. I told him about the discharge, its color, and that I wanted to be checked for STDs. He asked if I had any reason, and I said I just think it would be a good idea. It was a snap decision based on embarrassment and shame thinking that no more info was really needed. What he would have done differently if I told him, I dont know. Again, my Dr Appointment, and lab visit were 6 days after the incident. I have since learned that different infections and diseases should have a certain period of time to pass before being tested for them, otherwise you wont know with any reliability whether you are positive or not. I did NOT know that. This makes all the difference in the world as to any solace I can have in the results, or if I truly need to go in for tests at a later date for everything. The panel of STD tests I took 18 months ago were all negative and were taken long after any incident, so I know I was STD free prior to this. I have never had a cold sore, and never tested positive for Herpes 1 or 2.
My Doctor put me on a 5 day supply of Macrobid (twice a day). The discharge was still there on my 4th day so I told him this and he prescribed Zithromax for 5 days (2 pills first day, then 1 pill the remaining 4 days).
NEW SYMPTOM: After my first post I noticed some redness on the shaft of my penis in two areas (On the 9th day). It was "Slightly" sore, no itching, You could say it stung, but wasnt in the burning category yet. I say yet because the following day, for a period of about an hour it burned slightlly. This stung like from friction (though there wasnt any friction going on at any point). I am sending you a message seperately so you can see the area the day it happened, and how it progressed (slightly). There were NO clusters, no sores, no blisters, just a couple raised bumps in one of the red areas. 2 days later it was a little rougher to the touch, somewhat like exema, and by the end of the 3rd day (today) Its noticeably better. I can hardly see anything. It was on the 2nd day that I started the Zithromax. The discharge is less, but still there, yet I only have the first does of Zithromax in my system.
Questions:
4. My labs showed Negative for Chlamydia, Gonorrhea, Syphilis, HIV, and HSV 1&2. The Herpes test consisted of the HSV-1 IGG, HSV-2 IGG, & HSV 1/2 IGM. Each of them had a value of <0.91 (Negative). Are any of these tests something that I should retake, and if so, when?
5. My urinalysis came back showing a "Small" amount of LEUKOCYTE ESTERASE, and a White Blood Cell count of "11-30". I know they are related and are signs of having an infection, but there was no Bacteria found. That would indicate either its a viral infection, or something else. Im worried that this leaves Herpes (viral) as the only possibility as to why I show I have an infection, yet no trace of bacteria to be found. Can you tell me what you would conclude from this?
6. When I gave my urine sample I had already pee'd right before my appointment. I hear that "The first void of urine" is the best, and I dont know how much that makes a difference. Is this a big deal? Does this sound like it could tie into my previous question as a viable culprit to the results of the test?
7. If I was still having discharge after 5 days of Macrobid, does that indicate that im fighting something that I wasnt tested for?
8. I know that having symptoms 4-5 days after the encounter is a likely sign of an STD, Im at a loss. Tests were taken at 6 days (presumably too early for some), my symptoms dont sound like Herpes, yet I tested negative for Chlamydia/Gono, My urinalysis shows im fighting an infection, and the lack of bacteria has me thinking it MUST be Herpes regardless. What do you suspect, deduce, rule out, etc?
Ive got myself convinced of having Herpes and id reallllllllly like to be wrong.
When I said that I went to see my doctor and "Explained the situation" I should have said that I told him about the symptoms but did NOT tell him anything about the sexual encounter. I told him about the discharge, its color, and that I wanted to be checked for STDs. He asked if I had any reason, and I said I just think it would be a good idea. It was a snap decision based on embarrassment and shame thinking that no more info was really needed. What he would have done differently if I told him, I dont know. Again, my Dr Appointment, and lab visit were 6 days after the incident. I have since learned that different infections and diseases should have a certain period of time to pass before being tested for them, otherwise you wont know with any reliability whether you are positive or not. I did NOT know that. This makes all the difference in the world as to any solace I can have in the results, or if I truly need to go in for tests at a later date for everything. The panel of STD tests I took 18 months ago were all negative and were taken long after any incident, so I know I was STD free prior to this. I have never had a cold sore, and never tested positive for Herpes 1 or 2.
My Doctor put me on a 5 day supply of Macrobid (twice a day). The discharge was still there on my 4th day so I told him this and he prescribed Zithromax for 5 days (2 pills first day, then 1 pill the remaining 4 days).
NEW SYMPTOM: After my first post I noticed some redness on the shaft of my penis in two areas (On the 9th day). It was "Slightly" sore, no itching, You could say it stung, but wasnt in the burning category yet. I say yet because the following day, for a period of about an hour it burned slightlly. This stung like from friction (though there wasnt any friction going on at any point). I am sending you a message seperately so you can see the area the day it happened, and how it progressed (slightly). There were NO clusters, no sores, no blisters, just a couple raised bumps in one of the red areas. 2 days later it was a little rougher to the touch, somewhat like exema, and by the end of the 3rd day (today) Its noticeably better. I can hardly see anything. It was on the 2nd day that I started the Zithromax. The discharge is less, but still there, yet I only have the first does of Zithromax in my system.
Questions:
4. My labs showed Negative for Chlamydia, Gonorrhea, Syphilis, HIV, and HSV 1&2. The Herpes test consisted of the HSV-1 IGG, HSV-2 IGG, & HSV 1/2 IGM. Each of them had a value of <0.91 (Negative). Are any of these tests something that I should retake, and if so, when?
5. My urinalysis came back showing a "Small" amount of LEUKOCYTE ESTERASE, and a White Blood Cell count of "11-30". I know they are related and are signs of having an infection, but there was no Bacteria found. That would indicate either its a viral infection, or something else. Im worried that this leaves Herpes (viral) as the only possibility as to why I show I have an infection, yet no trace of bacteria to be found. Can you tell me what you would conclude from this?
6. When I gave my urine sample I had already pee'd right before my appointment. I hear that "The first void of urine" is the best, and I dont know how much that makes a difference. Is this a big deal? Does this sound like it could tie into my previous question as a viable culprit to the results of the test?
7. If I was still having discharge after 5 days of Macrobid, does that indicate that im fighting something that I wasnt tested for?
8. I know that having symptoms 4-5 days after the encounter is a likely sign of an STD, Im at a loss. Tests were taken at 6 days (presumably too early for some), my symptoms dont sound like Herpes, yet I tested negative for Chlamydia/Gono, My urinalysis shows im fighting an infection, and the lack of bacteria has me thinking it MUST be Herpes regardless. What do you suspect, deduce, rule out, etc?
Ive got myself convinced of having Herpes and id reallllllllly like to be wrong.
The question that you should be asking is whether these symptoms suggest herpes. They don't!
Further, if you already get oral cold sores then you were not at any pragmatic risk of a genital HSV1 infection.
Just to answer the questions in this context.
1. Yes this happens, infection rates without a sore present are about 1 in 1,000 at best, probably much lower and only if you do not have HSV1 already.
2. No the virus does not live off the skin. You must come into contact with an infected area for any pragmatic chance of infection.
3. It doesn't, the elements are harmful to most viruses, particularly oxygen.
Further, if you already get oral cold sores then you were not at any pragmatic risk of a genital HSV1 infection.
Just to answer the questions in this context.
1. Yes this happens, infection rates without a sore present are about 1 in 1,000 at best, probably much lower and only if you do not have HSV1 already.
2. No the virus does not live off the skin. You must come into contact with an infected area for any pragmatic chance of infection.
3. It doesn't, the elements are harmful to most viruses, particularly oxygen.
Have an Answer?
You are reading content posted in the Herpes Community
Herpes spreads by oral, vaginal and anal sex.
Herpes sores blister, then burst, scab and heal.
STIs are the most common cause of genital sores.
Millions of people are diagnosed with STDs in the U.S. each year.
STDs can't be transmitted by casual contact, like hugging or touching.
Syphilis is an STD that is transmitted by oral, genital and anal sex.
