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Why don't they discontinue IgM test fro HSV?
I've learned a lot about these tests from reading the comments of the Doctor on this forum as well as Terri Warren's handbook, And also from reading as much of the blood lab literature out there as I can understand. The prognosis I gather from all of it is the IgM is NOT a good test to conduct for detecting Herpes simplex virus 1 or 2 antibodies. And I tend agree if for no other reason than because it does nothing but confuse and scare the patient and produces doubts in the mind about the results which apparently are misleading.
My story
I recently got tested because of single pimple and pencil eraser head sized rash around it that appeared at the tip top of my butt crack near the tail bone. And because I had recently had oral sex performed on me by a woman I didn't know and suspected she might be high risk, I went to have it checked out at a primary clinic. Right away a nurse practitioner looked at it, set off all kinds of alarms and proceeded to jump to the hasty conclusion that it must certainly be Herpes. She kept saying, well it's so small and doesn't look like typical herpes (no blisters with fluid, just a single small pimple) but... I just think that's probably what it is so I think we should do a blood test and even though their's no fluid or blister, I'll get it cultured. Well, by this time I was so worked up and frightened by her adamant conclusion I had herpes that I agreed to let her order test. .She ordered only the IGG blood test specific for HSV2 and did a little scraping of the skin.
While I worried myself to death the next few days, something told me to go see a dermatologist while I was waiting. He got me in on short notice the next day and took one look and said, no, you do not have herpes. This does not look like what I seen with herpes. But he said go ahead and wait to see what the primary clinic comes back with on the blood test. Well, it came back came back a couple days later and was negative. The skin scraping of the rash and little pimple was negative as well. (Great news, even though by that time I was a nervous wreck. By the end of that few days the small irritation was gone as well)
Then a few weeks later it started tickling again on and off and I scratched and scratched and then another little pimple came up. So, I went back to the Dermatologist I had seen while waiting on the first test. He took a look at it again and said, this is nothing more than a dermatitis irritation of some sort and still think it is not herpes. I mentioned to him however, that I had had oral sex performed about a moth before all this had happened and was not satisfied in my mind completely that maybe the HSV2 test was not what should have been done by the primary clinic but rather an HSV1 test should be done. And if just for my own peace of mind to eliminate that possibility I wondered if we should test for that. He said ok,
This is where the IgM come into the story. He ordered the tests for HSV1 but it was for both IgM and IGG and then sent me off to the blood lab. Well, I wasn't expecting the IgM on the blood order sheet, so, it caught my eye because I was not familiar with it up to that point. So after I went to get the blood drawn, I immediately went home started googlng info on IgM. That's when I started reading about how it's not recommended and is a faulty test for all intents and purposes regarding testing for HSV specifically. (There are possible Cross reactions with Herpes Zoster (Chicken Pox), Mono virus etc and that it can't distinguish between any of these viruses including the HSV1 & 2)
So I'm already wondering at that point, what's the point of this test? Other than the stated reason of detecting an early stage infection of HSV which is a mute point imo considering the faults with the tests and it's inability to distinguish, I couldn't understand why it was ordered. And it could give a false positive. Well, now I started worrying again about that.
Anyway, when I did get the results later that week, here's what they said for the HSV1 test.
The IgM test using the EIA method showed "Detected" , But then the followup confirmatory IFA method showed negative IgM. (Can it get a little more confusing?)
Finally, the IGG test also showed negative. So, overall diagnosis based on all that according to the Dermatologist?...negative.
So, after all of that, I'm under the understanding that I do not have herpes 1 or 2, despite that one little confusing "detected" result using the EIA method. And I'm not sure why they bother with that method if they have the confirmatory IFA which from what I read is more specific. It just makes things confusing and plants that little biitty doubt in your head.
My story
I recently got tested because of single pimple and pencil eraser head sized rash around it that appeared at the tip top of my butt crack near the tail bone. And because I had recently had oral sex performed on me by a woman I didn't know and suspected she might be high risk, I went to have it checked out at a primary clinic. Right away a nurse practitioner looked at it, set off all kinds of alarms and proceeded to jump to the hasty conclusion that it must certainly be Herpes. She kept saying, well it's so small and doesn't look like typical herpes (no blisters with fluid, just a single small pimple) but... I just think that's probably what it is so I think we should do a blood test and even though their's no fluid or blister, I'll get it cultured. Well, by this time I was so worked up and frightened by her adamant conclusion I had herpes that I agreed to let her order test. .She ordered only the IGG blood test specific for HSV2 and did a little scraping of the skin.
While I worried myself to death the next few days, something told me to go see a dermatologist while I was waiting. He got me in on short notice the next day and took one look and said, no, you do not have herpes. This does not look like what I seen with herpes. But he said go ahead and wait to see what the primary clinic comes back with on the blood test. Well, it came back came back a couple days later and was negative. The skin scraping of the rash and little pimple was negative as well. (Great news, even though by that time I was a nervous wreck. By the end of that few days the small irritation was gone as well)
Then a few weeks later it started tickling again on and off and I scratched and scratched and then another little pimple came up. So, I went back to the Dermatologist I had seen while waiting on the first test. He took a look at it again and said, this is nothing more than a dermatitis irritation of some sort and still think it is not herpes. I mentioned to him however, that I had had oral sex performed about a moth before all this had happened and was not satisfied in my mind completely that maybe the HSV2 test was not what should have been done by the primary clinic but rather an HSV1 test should be done. And if just for my own peace of mind to eliminate that possibility I wondered if we should test for that. He said ok,
This is where the IgM come into the story. He ordered the tests for HSV1 but it was for both IgM and IGG and then sent me off to the blood lab. Well, I wasn't expecting the IgM on the blood order sheet, so, it caught my eye because I was not familiar with it up to that point. So after I went to get the blood drawn, I immediately went home started googlng info on IgM. That's when I started reading about how it's not recommended and is a faulty test for all intents and purposes regarding testing for HSV specifically. (There are possible Cross reactions with Herpes Zoster (Chicken Pox), Mono virus etc and that it can't distinguish between any of these viruses including the HSV1 & 2)
So I'm already wondering at that point, what's the point of this test? Other than the stated reason of detecting an early stage infection of HSV which is a mute point imo considering the faults with the tests and it's inability to distinguish, I couldn't understand why it was ordered. And it could give a false positive. Well, now I started worrying again about that.
Anyway, when I did get the results later that week, here's what they said for the HSV1 test.
The IgM test using the EIA method showed "Detected" , But then the followup confirmatory IFA method showed negative IgM. (Can it get a little more confusing?)
Finally, the IGG test also showed negative. So, overall diagnosis based on all that according to the Dermatologist?...negative.
So, after all of that, I'm under the understanding that I do not have herpes 1 or 2, despite that one little confusing "detected" result using the EIA method. And I'm not sure why they bother with that method if they have the confirmatory IFA which from what I read is more specific. It just makes things confusing and plants that little biitty doubt in your head.
Well, it appears I'm about to possibly have some problems with Quest diagnostics. At the time I went to the lab to have my blood drawn for HSV1 tests back in August, I asked them to tell me what my total charges were going to be for the tests. They printed off an estimate and I paid that in full while at the lab. (This was the time when the Doctor ordered both IgG & IgM tests and I found out later from this board and other research that the IgM test was a waste of time and not recommended).
Now it turns out they sent me a bill for an additional fee for the IgM test. I showed it to the Lab today and they said that extra charge should not be on there and to call the 800 number to try and get them to remove it.
Case in point, remember I mentioned that the IgM test was done twice, using two methodologies. EIA (which ofcourse came out positive) which then "called for" a confirmatory test using IFA.(which was negative)..So, how convenient is that for the billing department?! Does that allow for a double charge.
If they bring up the confirmatory method as a reason for the extra billing, (which I'm guessing they will) then I'm going to point out that I was never told there was a possibility of additional test procedures and in addition to that, the lab person i showed the bill to, pointed out that the code was duplicated which would indicate a double billing. So, I would assume that means that even a different methodolgy would have to have a different code just like a different test would.
So, it goes to show. People should just be wary when dealing with these labs and doctors etc. Corporate greed mentality always seems to seep it's way into everything nowadays with more of the same ol dirty tricks. Not unlike what the 'for profit' insurance companies had been doing for years.
This should also just reinforce the advice that people are giving here, to try to avoid letting the clinics suck you into letting them order the IgM test when testing for herpes. And as Grace mentioned earlier in this thread, the medical community have no incentive to stop using the IgM test even though it's not reliable, simply because if they can make a little extra money, they will.
Now it turns out they sent me a bill for an additional fee for the IgM test. I showed it to the Lab today and they said that extra charge should not be on there and to call the 800 number to try and get them to remove it.
Case in point, remember I mentioned that the IgM test was done twice, using two methodologies. EIA (which ofcourse came out positive) which then "called for" a confirmatory test using IFA.(which was negative)..So, how convenient is that for the billing department?! Does that allow for a double charge.
If they bring up the confirmatory method as a reason for the extra billing, (which I'm guessing they will) then I'm going to point out that I was never told there was a possibility of additional test procedures and in addition to that, the lab person i showed the bill to, pointed out that the code was duplicated which would indicate a double billing. So, I would assume that means that even a different methodolgy would have to have a different code just like a different test would.
So, it goes to show. People should just be wary when dealing with these labs and doctors etc. Corporate greed mentality always seems to seep it's way into everything nowadays with more of the same ol dirty tricks. Not unlike what the 'for profit' insurance companies had been doing for years.
This should also just reinforce the advice that people are giving here, to try to avoid letting the clinics suck you into letting them order the IgM test when testing for herpes. And as Grace mentioned earlier in this thread, the medical community have no incentive to stop using the IgM test even though it's not reliable, simply because if they can make a little extra money, they will.
Still can't get those greater than and less than arrows to print right even when I copy and pasted from another post. Oh well, the bottom part was supposed to be the index/interpretation general numbers guide for negative, equivocal and positive. For some reason only the positive printed so don't be mislead by that., But anyway, the two < 0.90 values listed above in the Observation description are my results.
Ok, today got up the nerve to go pick up my second round of tests results today. Confirmed negative on both types, same as 2 months ago. No exact numbers provided on the results page but observation description shows the value on both was less than 0.90. Doctor interpreted it for me as well and said negative on both types. I've really had no more suspicious stuff happen with me in the last 4 months, so, I guess I don't have herpes. I still get a very slight on and off urine burn occasionally. Nothing bad. I'm going to go ahead and have other STD tests and a PSA test done as well just to cover all my bases. Glad to just get it clear in my mind once and for all so I can stop worrying. And I appreciate all your feedback you've given me this past 4 months Grace
Results for HSV 1/2 IGG, Herpselect Type specific A
Observation Description Value Ref Range A* Site **
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HSV 1 IGG Type Specific AB < 0.90 Index
HSV 2 IGG Type Specific AB < 0.90 Index
-- Index Interpretation
-- 1.10 Positive
Results for HSV 1/2 IGG, Herpselect Type specific A
Observation Description Value Ref Range A* Site **
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HSV 1 IGG Type Specific AB < 0.90 Index
HSV 2 IGG Type Specific AB < 0.90 Index
-- Index Interpretation
-- 1.10 Positive
Went to the clinic this morning. Was seen by a PA that I've seen numerous times before and have a pretty good repore with and I consider him a pretty knowledgable guy and never over reacts to things . I told him the history and showed him the bumps on the back of my thigh (which had not changed from the night before).
At first he said "where are they?", lol. He seemed to think it was nothing but a heat rash. I told him, but there was an aching feeling in the muscle before and during the outbreak and just a little slight burning. I asked him if he could de a culture. He refused, Said that unless they were fluid filled blisters, he didn't want to risk damaging the skin by scraping one of them a risking possible infection or staff. I said, but I've read that herpes can be just little small bumps rather than blisters. He shook his head yes but said he still would not culture these little tiny bumps. He did say however, "now if you get some kind of blisters in the future, then come in right way" and we left it at that. He sounded pretty final and sure of himself about not doing a culture, so, I had to respect his decision on that. (Strangely, that actually made me feel a little better about the bumps that he didn't think they merited any kind of culture.)
So, I asked him about more IGG tests, he said he would do that for me, but he said the thing about these blood tests is the production of antibodies (IF I even have herpes) might would take awhile to develop. You just don't know. 1st time could be negative, 2nd time could be negative and 3rd time could be positive. He said that's why you have to get them done every three months. He honestly did not think it was herpes based on the bumps but he said we'll go ahead and do the blood tests because of course, can never be 100% sure just based on a visual either.
Anyway, they drew the blood and are sending off to Quest Labs for type-specific IGG on both types. We'll see what shakes in about 3 to 5 days. This will be almost 4 months since the risky encounter with the girl.
The bumps are not bothering me today and no muscle aches for the most part or burning at this time. I feel they are probably healing already although they are still visible. I will be glad to get some kind of resolution to all this. If these next round of tests come back negative, I'll just have to try to put it out of my mind, even if some other little strangeness with my skin comes up again. And I'll probably never figure out what was up with the painful urination I had thee months ago. (That's what's still stuck in the back of my mind too.)
At first he said "where are they?", lol. He seemed to think it was nothing but a heat rash. I told him, but there was an aching feeling in the muscle before and during the outbreak and just a little slight burning. I asked him if he could de a culture. He refused, Said that unless they were fluid filled blisters, he didn't want to risk damaging the skin by scraping one of them a risking possible infection or staff. I said, but I've read that herpes can be just little small bumps rather than blisters. He shook his head yes but said he still would not culture these little tiny bumps. He did say however, "now if you get some kind of blisters in the future, then come in right way" and we left it at that. He sounded pretty final and sure of himself about not doing a culture, so, I had to respect his decision on that. (Strangely, that actually made me feel a little better about the bumps that he didn't think they merited any kind of culture.)
So, I asked him about more IGG tests, he said he would do that for me, but he said the thing about these blood tests is the production of antibodies (IF I even have herpes) might would take awhile to develop. You just don't know. 1st time could be negative, 2nd time could be negative and 3rd time could be positive. He said that's why you have to get them done every three months. He honestly did not think it was herpes based on the bumps but he said we'll go ahead and do the blood tests because of course, can never be 100% sure just based on a visual either.
Anyway, they drew the blood and are sending off to Quest Labs for type-specific IGG on both types. We'll see what shakes in about 3 to 5 days. This will be almost 4 months since the risky encounter with the girl.
The bumps are not bothering me today and no muscle aches for the most part or burning at this time. I feel they are probably healing already although they are still visible. I will be glad to get some kind of resolution to all this. If these next round of tests come back negative, I'll just have to try to put it out of my mind, even if some other little strangeness with my skin comes up again. And I'll probably never figure out what was up with the painful urination I had thee months ago. (That's what's still stuck in the back of my mind too.)
As it's only oral you describe, it's most likely if anything it's HSV1, no big concern if so.
Thanks Dend, I appreciate your words of support!
If I do have it, it just makes me angry at myself for being such a damned fool and taking one too many risks. This disease is the one thing I've always been concerned about and made a point to look for any symptoms with anyone I was with. But I was stupid and knew that a massage place where girls do unprotected oral every day was just a little riskier regardless if she was showing no symptoms. And yet I went with it anyway. I know that if I have it, that last event is where I got it because I had no symptoms like I've described before and I tested negative for IGG antibodies at less than three months. So, that means the infection was still new if indeed I have it. It's friggin' sickening. Oh well, that's right in line with how everyone else is feeling, so I'm no exception. I can only hope and pray I don't have any symptoms any more serious than this or hopefully less long term.
I'm not married, never been, don't date or have girlfriends cause I normally work all the time and am generally loner. So, every now and then over rthe years I would step out to a massage place maybe once every couple of months out of boredom more than anything else. I normally would 'only' let them do hand jobs. I admit I've gone to those places (like an idiot). And not proud of it by any means. Maybe I don;t have the best self image, but I'm also not a bad guy...and I'm not a dog. I had tapered off considerably over the last few years and then decided to go out to one three months agao and wha-la. Wrong move at the wrong time.
It's just depressing to realize, I can't undo it. None of us can. But, As a few others have said, if it's true, I got a get my brain wrapped around it eventually and move forward with it. Yuck! Can only hope like everyone else, that it won't be too bad and will get easier with time.
If I do have it, it just makes me angry at myself for being such a damned fool and taking one too many risks. This disease is the one thing I've always been concerned about and made a point to look for any symptoms with anyone I was with. But I was stupid and knew that a massage place where girls do unprotected oral every day was just a little riskier regardless if she was showing no symptoms. And yet I went with it anyway. I know that if I have it, that last event is where I got it because I had no symptoms like I've described before and I tested negative for IGG antibodies at less than three months. So, that means the infection was still new if indeed I have it. It's friggin' sickening. Oh well, that's right in line with how everyone else is feeling, so I'm no exception. I can only hope and pray I don't have any symptoms any more serious than this or hopefully less long term.
I'm not married, never been, don't date or have girlfriends cause I normally work all the time and am generally loner. So, every now and then over rthe years I would step out to a massage place maybe once every couple of months out of boredom more than anything else. I normally would 'only' let them do hand jobs. I admit I've gone to those places (like an idiot). And not proud of it by any means. Maybe I don;t have the best self image, but I'm also not a bad guy...and I'm not a dog. I had tapered off considerably over the last few years and then decided to go out to one three months agao and wha-la. Wrong move at the wrong time.
It's just depressing to realize, I can't undo it. None of us can. But, As a few others have said, if it's true, I got a get my brain wrapped around it eventually and move forward with it. Yuck! Can only hope like everyone else, that it won't be too bad and will get easier with time.
Also, I'm very sorry about not following the posting rule. Thanks again for all your help!
Yes, I'm in the same place as you.
This thing is scary, its so insidious and variable. It is however not a big deal if you do in fact have it. Get the bumps scraped today, it's the only way you will know for sure. A blood test after 16 weeks is also conclusive.
Time will tell us all my friend...
This thing is scary, its so insidious and variable. It is however not a big deal if you do in fact have it. Get the bumps scraped today, it's the only way you will know for sure. A blood test after 16 weeks is also conclusive.
Time will tell us all my friend...
we don't look at pictures here. this is explained in our read before posting post which is under the important announcements tab on the new format.
nothing I can help you with at this point. follow up with your provider whenever you have symptoms you are concerned about.
nothing I can help you with at this point. follow up with your provider whenever you have symptoms you are concerned about.
I don't know Grace, I've got a bad feeling now.
Last night before bedtime, I felt some on and off aching in the back of my thigh. This morning I went to urinate and felt just a slight pain/burn in that same area of my penis as I descriobed before. It was just a a couple of instances during the urination. Was out and about all day today. Then on my way home around dinnertime I felt a slight irritation on the inner back of my thigh. Not bad but I could feel it. Got home, dropped my pants, sat down and got a mirror and looked and there's these tiny bumps no bigger than a pin head all in the area I was feeling the irritation. They are not blisters, and not in connected clusters, but rather all spaced out about 1/4 - 1/2 inch apart. I was thinking it could be irritation from the loose pants but I've never had that problem and it's only on one thigh in that one place. It's not real painful or uncomfortable but there is a very very slight cold/burn sensation to the area. 'VERY' slight, but it's there. I got a little sick feeling looking at them. They just don't look right. Here's a link to a picture. (No nudity) Don't let the little bit of shine on a couple of them fool you, thats the camera light shine. They are not fluid filled blisters. Literally the size of pin heads.
http://i1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc456/IDTB123/Bumpsonbackofthigh.jpg
I had mentioned that in the last several weeks I was getting a random pimple here and there on the inside of my legs/thighs. Just puss bumps was what the Dr said, Thing is, I've never gotten those before either.
I have just felt there 'had' to be something to that original 2 week long period of urinary pain that occurred two weeks after the massage girl gave me unprotected oral back in the first week of June. Geesh, what are the odds? All it takes is just one wrong person, I guess even though I've read here that the odds are low of that happening. She had NO sores on her mouth! None! And I've been with no one else since. And it had been a very long while before her. And I'd had only one protected intercourse encounter several months prior to that last encounter at the massage place.
Damned! This has been so misleading. The IGG tests I had done may have indeed been too early even at 2 /2 months for the HSV1. And yet, it it's really strange to me that I'm just now having this group of tiny bumps almost a month after the negative HSV1 IGG test and almost 2 months after the negative HSV2 gGG test.
I need your input Grace! I don't know what these will look like by morning. Maybe this is all they are. But I'm almost temptrd to go back in and have them looked at and cultured as tiny as they are and have the IGG tests done once again. The thing I don't understand is this slow speread out time of what seem to be symptoms. First I had the Urine pain, but no out break, no fever, no body aches etc. Then a few puss pimples over the next month or so. Then tonight these small bumps all grouped in this area on my thigh. I never had the one single outbreak that many experience it seems. I don't get it!
I have read that symptoms are different for people and some have mild symptoms to none. But I haven't read anything about the possibility of symptoms coming on slowly and gradually and different each time. Kinda scary the way this seems to be sneaking up on me.
Please talk to me. And also tell me what you make of the pic I linked.
Thanks!
Last night before bedtime, I felt some on and off aching in the back of my thigh. This morning I went to urinate and felt just a slight pain/burn in that same area of my penis as I descriobed before. It was just a a couple of instances during the urination. Was out and about all day today. Then on my way home around dinnertime I felt a slight irritation on the inner back of my thigh. Not bad but I could feel it. Got home, dropped my pants, sat down and got a mirror and looked and there's these tiny bumps no bigger than a pin head all in the area I was feeling the irritation. They are not blisters, and not in connected clusters, but rather all spaced out about 1/4 - 1/2 inch apart. I was thinking it could be irritation from the loose pants but I've never had that problem and it's only on one thigh in that one place. It's not real painful or uncomfortable but there is a very very slight cold/burn sensation to the area. 'VERY' slight, but it's there. I got a little sick feeling looking at them. They just don't look right. Here's a link to a picture. (No nudity) Don't let the little bit of shine on a couple of them fool you, thats the camera light shine. They are not fluid filled blisters. Literally the size of pin heads.
http://i1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc456/IDTB123/Bumpsonbackofthigh.jpg
I had mentioned that in the last several weeks I was getting a random pimple here and there on the inside of my legs/thighs. Just puss bumps was what the Dr said, Thing is, I've never gotten those before either.
I have just felt there 'had' to be something to that original 2 week long period of urinary pain that occurred two weeks after the massage girl gave me unprotected oral back in the first week of June. Geesh, what are the odds? All it takes is just one wrong person, I guess even though I've read here that the odds are low of that happening. She had NO sores on her mouth! None! And I've been with no one else since. And it had been a very long while before her. And I'd had only one protected intercourse encounter several months prior to that last encounter at the massage place.
Damned! This has been so misleading. The IGG tests I had done may have indeed been too early even at 2 /2 months for the HSV1. And yet, it it's really strange to me that I'm just now having this group of tiny bumps almost a month after the negative HSV1 IGG test and almost 2 months after the negative HSV2 gGG test.
I need your input Grace! I don't know what these will look like by morning. Maybe this is all they are. But I'm almost temptrd to go back in and have them looked at and cultured as tiny as they are and have the IGG tests done once again. The thing I don't understand is this slow speread out time of what seem to be symptoms. First I had the Urine pain, but no out break, no fever, no body aches etc. Then a few puss pimples over the next month or so. Then tonight these small bumps all grouped in this area on my thigh. I never had the one single outbreak that many experience it seems. I don't get it!
I have read that symptoms are different for people and some have mild symptoms to none. But I haven't read anything about the possibility of symptoms coming on slowly and gradually and different each time. Kinda scary the way this seems to be sneaking up on me.
Please talk to me. And also tell me what you make of the pic I linked.
Thanks!
Thank you Grace! I guess the undiagnosed urine pain I had and the timing of it after the encounter with the girl just has been sticking in the back of my mind and wouldn't go away. As if there's got to be some connection there that was overlooked and because even though I have no OB's or symptoms, maybe I actually did contract something and the urine pain was the sign but that I'll never know for sure. Those kinds of little fears can eat away at you and stress you out as much as anything, lol. I just hate things like that being a mystery because I generally have no "mysterious" ailments. Perhaps time will eventually lessen my worries if I'll just give it a chance. And you are right, I should not feel I have to convince myself I contracted something.
Thanks again for your input and help!
Thanks again for your input and help!
nothing you've said changes my advice at all.
don't convince yourself you had to have contracted something.
don't convince yourself you had to have contracted something.
Hi Grace,
I haven't had any problems since I posted this thread over a month ago. But there's one thing that still sticks in the back of mind about this that is probably nothing but I still would like to get your take on it.
A little review in addition to a few details I neglected to tell in my first. At the time I first went to the doctor about all this (the last week of June), it had been probably about two weeks since I had the encounter with the woman who gave me oral sex. (The encounter was about June 4 or 5 I'm guessing). She was a a sex provider working in a massage bath house. I did not have intercourse with her, I only received oral from her (unprotected). I knew she was a high risk person simply because the girls there provide unprotected oral on a regular basis from what I understand. However, I was careful to look for any sores or blisters on her mouth of which I saw none. (I've always been a little paranoid about Herpes anyway which is why I make a point to look despite the fact that I was engaging in risky behavior at the moment which I know is a contradiction and I know better as many of us guys do, but I've decided no more of that.). I also did not ejaculate. She performed oral on me at about a moderate pace but not too terribly rigorously for about less than 2-3 minutes before I finally made her stop and finished myself off with my hand.
So, getting back to the doctor visit I made two weeks after that encounter. I went in to the clinic initially because the evening before I had awoke from a nap and out of nowhere started experiencing some pain when I went to urinate. I also mentioned to her that I had some initial bloating & felt a little constipated when the urinating pain began. I had eaten Chinese buffet just a few hours before which was not that great but it did not make me sick. The Doctor took a urine test and said that it was all clear. They however, also took a standard blood test. She said that my white cell count at that time did show that I had contracted some kind of virus. She asked me if the urine flow was strong and I told her it was but at the same time it felt like something was hurting inside about in the lower left portion of my penis but it was not a burning sensation perse. The pain was ONLY when urinating. (I had no knowledege at that point about the possibility of a sore inside my urethra). But anyway, the urine issue was 'never' resolved. I had also mentioned to her about the pimple and itching that I discussed at the beginning of this thread. She suggested it could be a number of things including herpes but said since the pimple had cleared there was no way to tell. She said if I had any more problems come back, and so I left.
Fast forward exactly one month later, (and about a month and a half after the encounter at the massage place) I go back to the clinic again because the on & off itching at the top of my butt crack has again culminated in another little pimple in the same place as before after I had been scratching it repeatedly the day before. So, I'm worried more at this point. On this visit, I saw a Nurse Practitioner who immediately thought it must be herpes for sure. She takes the scraping of the pimple (no fluid) and draws blood for a Type 2 specific IGG test. The test and the scraping both come back negative days later. And as I mentioned, this is at least one and half months after the oral contact with the massage girl and one month since the painful urination began. (BTW, the urination pain gradually disappeared after about 2-3 weeks.)
So, I'm assuming that one and a half months was plenty of time for antibodies to have developed. And I felt that type 2 was not as probable as type 1 in this instance of receiving oral anyway.
After that visit, I decide to go see a dermatologist almost another month later about the itching. The skin is dry and chapped in the area but no pimple or rash. Just dermatitis. While I'm at the Dermatologist I discuss with him that I felt a Type 1 test shopuld be done in lieu of the earlier type 2 which was negative. So, he orders the Type 1 test done. The type 1 IGG test also comes back negative. (So, this would be 2 1/2 months after the encounter with the massage girl.) Although there was also a IGM test that he also ordered was positive (EIA method) then negative with a confirmatory (IFA method). Of course, I've since learned from you and others that the IGM test is to be disregarded in light of the IGG results.
So, bottom line here's my question. The HSV2 IGG test was negative at one and a half months and the HSV1 IGG test was negative at two and a half months. I would like to know if you think that was enough time for both and considering I had no diagnosed herpes related OB and no other problems since. (other than a few solitary pimples on my inner thighs, one on a calf and one on my shoulder and one on my chest which the Dermatologist said were just puss pimples. )I personally have never noticed having those before but maybe they were just stress, I don't know. Nothing in the last few weeks)
But the thing that still kind of bothers me is the unresolved cause of the urine pain that I had experienced a few weeks after the encounter with the girl and that lasted for a couple weeks. Based on all the other stuff I've described that turned out to be nothing and not having any issues since then, Do you think it is even worth my time and worry to get IGG tests done one more time or do you think those I already had were done were sufficient after the amount of time I described, and that the urine pain was possibly something just unrelated? Could I have maybe gotten some other kind of infection from the girl's mouth that cleared up even though the urine test showed nothing?
I just would like your opinion. Sorry for the long story. Just felt I had to explain in order to fully give the picture of what I'm concerned about. Admittedly, I'm a little afraid to get another test done for fear of some misleading result. Although I understand the IGG is supposed to be dependable. Since I don't have any symptoms and the pimple issue was figured out, I don't really worry about it much. But the urine thing still puzzles me a little. Is it worth worrying about?
Thanks!
Again, I apologize for the long post and sincerely appreciate your input.
I haven't had any problems since I posted this thread over a month ago. But there's one thing that still sticks in the back of mind about this that is probably nothing but I still would like to get your take on it.
A little review in addition to a few details I neglected to tell in my first. At the time I first went to the doctor about all this (the last week of June), it had been probably about two weeks since I had the encounter with the woman who gave me oral sex. (The encounter was about June 4 or 5 I'm guessing). She was a a sex provider working in a massage bath house. I did not have intercourse with her, I only received oral from her (unprotected). I knew she was a high risk person simply because the girls there provide unprotected oral on a regular basis from what I understand. However, I was careful to look for any sores or blisters on her mouth of which I saw none. (I've always been a little paranoid about Herpes anyway which is why I make a point to look despite the fact that I was engaging in risky behavior at the moment which I know is a contradiction and I know better as many of us guys do, but I've decided no more of that.). I also did not ejaculate. She performed oral on me at about a moderate pace but not too terribly rigorously for about less than 2-3 minutes before I finally made her stop and finished myself off with my hand.
So, getting back to the doctor visit I made two weeks after that encounter. I went in to the clinic initially because the evening before I had awoke from a nap and out of nowhere started experiencing some pain when I went to urinate. I also mentioned to her that I had some initial bloating & felt a little constipated when the urinating pain began. I had eaten Chinese buffet just a few hours before which was not that great but it did not make me sick. The Doctor took a urine test and said that it was all clear. They however, also took a standard blood test. She said that my white cell count at that time did show that I had contracted some kind of virus. She asked me if the urine flow was strong and I told her it was but at the same time it felt like something was hurting inside about in the lower left portion of my penis but it was not a burning sensation perse. The pain was ONLY when urinating. (I had no knowledege at that point about the possibility of a sore inside my urethra). But anyway, the urine issue was 'never' resolved. I had also mentioned to her about the pimple and itching that I discussed at the beginning of this thread. She suggested it could be a number of things including herpes but said since the pimple had cleared there was no way to tell. She said if I had any more problems come back, and so I left.
Fast forward exactly one month later, (and about a month and a half after the encounter at the massage place) I go back to the clinic again because the on & off itching at the top of my butt crack has again culminated in another little pimple in the same place as before after I had been scratching it repeatedly the day before. So, I'm worried more at this point. On this visit, I saw a Nurse Practitioner who immediately thought it must be herpes for sure. She takes the scraping of the pimple (no fluid) and draws blood for a Type 2 specific IGG test. The test and the scraping both come back negative days later. And as I mentioned, this is at least one and half months after the oral contact with the massage girl and one month since the painful urination began. (BTW, the urination pain gradually disappeared after about 2-3 weeks.)
So, I'm assuming that one and a half months was plenty of time for antibodies to have developed. And I felt that type 2 was not as probable as type 1 in this instance of receiving oral anyway.
After that visit, I decide to go see a dermatologist almost another month later about the itching. The skin is dry and chapped in the area but no pimple or rash. Just dermatitis. While I'm at the Dermatologist I discuss with him that I felt a Type 1 test shopuld be done in lieu of the earlier type 2 which was negative. So, he orders the Type 1 test done. The type 1 IGG test also comes back negative. (So, this would be 2 1/2 months after the encounter with the massage girl.) Although there was also a IGM test that he also ordered was positive (EIA method) then negative with a confirmatory (IFA method). Of course, I've since learned from you and others that the IGM test is to be disregarded in light of the IGG results.
So, bottom line here's my question. The HSV2 IGG test was negative at one and a half months and the HSV1 IGG test was negative at two and a half months. I would like to know if you think that was enough time for both and considering I had no diagnosed herpes related OB and no other problems since. (other than a few solitary pimples on my inner thighs, one on a calf and one on my shoulder and one on my chest which the Dermatologist said were just puss pimples. )I personally have never noticed having those before but maybe they were just stress, I don't know. Nothing in the last few weeks)
But the thing that still kind of bothers me is the unresolved cause of the urine pain that I had experienced a few weeks after the encounter with the girl and that lasted for a couple weeks. Based on all the other stuff I've described that turned out to be nothing and not having any issues since then, Do you think it is even worth my time and worry to get IGG tests done one more time or do you think those I already had were done were sufficient after the amount of time I described, and that the urine pain was possibly something just unrelated? Could I have maybe gotten some other kind of infection from the girl's mouth that cleared up even though the urine test showed nothing?
I just would like your opinion. Sorry for the long story. Just felt I had to explain in order to fully give the picture of what I'm concerned about. Admittedly, I'm a little afraid to get another test done for fear of some misleading result. Although I understand the IGG is supposed to be dependable. Since I don't have any symptoms and the pimple issue was figured out, I don't really worry about it much. But the urine thing still puzzles me a little. Is it worth worrying about?
Thanks!
Again, I apologize for the long post and sincerely appreciate your input.
Grace, thanks very much for your response. Your comment helps reassure what I feel also. I agree that it is unfortunate that some providers still order the IgM test and I totally agree with you about the possible money making aspect of it. (Seems we can't escape that motive in all kinds of things in life that should instead be based on helping people regardless of the profit aspect).
unfortunately many providers are behind on their herpes testing knowledge. Current cdc herpes guidelines are pretty specific about not using the igm test on adults but unfortunately many providers don't read them.
nothing you can determine by a + igm result unfortunately.
igm testing is helpful in newborns so it is still offered by labs. Also bottom line is they make a lot of money off of the test so they have no real incentive to stop offering it :(
the dermatologist doesn't feel this looked like herpes at all. Continue to follow up with them. typically when you contract hsv1 genitally, it presents with a very "classic" presentation, not just a pimple. It's not likely your symptoms are hsv1 related .
grace
nothing you can determine by a + igm result unfortunately.
igm testing is helpful in newborns so it is still offered by labs. Also bottom line is they make a lot of money off of the test so they have no real incentive to stop offering it :(
the dermatologist doesn't feel this looked like herpes at all. Continue to follow up with them. typically when you contract hsv1 genitally, it presents with a very "classic" presentation, not just a pimple. It's not likely your symptoms are hsv1 related .
grace
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Herpes spreads by oral, vaginal and anal sex.
Herpes sores blister, then burst, scab and heal.
STIs are the most common cause of genital sores.
Millions of people are diagnosed with STDs in the U.S. each year.
STDs can't be transmitted by casual contact, like hugging or touching.
Syphilis is an STD that is transmitted by oral, genital and anal sex.
