How long before stage 3 turns into stage 5?

If someone is diagnosed with stage 3 kidney disease egfr 58, how many years can they expect to have their kidney function before a transplant or dialysis is needed?

[anxiousworriedscared]

I believe the progression of the disease depends on many factors.  Personally, I was in Stage 3 for about 14 years until last year when I progressed to Stage 4.  Again like I said this was my personal journey and does not apply to everyone.

[joechan]

is there any supplement or medication for stage 3 or 4 patients?

[anxiousworriedscared]

Hi Joe

I am on meds for hypertension, hyperparathyroidism, vitamin D deficiency, B12 deficiency, iron for anemia and GERD.  Is this what you mean by supplements?

[howlonghaveIgot]

I have taken lithium carbonate every day for the last 40 years - my doctor thinks this may have brought my kidneys to stage 3 ( diagnosed last week )- has anyone has a similar experience? will stopping lthium halt the decline? - I have also taken valium for the same period and wonder if this has also damaged my kidneys

Cheers Robert (UK)

[jimgreg]

theres too manny factors to say....

[sweettea31]

My mother has stage 3 kidney disease and the doctor has her on 9 different medications to help her BP stay low but it isn't helping like it should. They have her on the highest dose of BP medication and she is really scared about what will happen to her if she gets to stage 5. I guess I was wondering if anyone would know about how long would it take for her to get to that point with out of controle hypertension? I'm scared cause my mom is my best friend and I feel helpless. I know it is different for everyone but I didn't know if someone might have a friend or family member or even themself who has had the same problem.

[chen2011]

As long as patients pay more attention on diet, keep on regular test, and follow the instruction of doctor, he can has a good prognosis. Pls don't worry too much.

[chen1988]

yes,you are right

[lindahand]

The kidney disease should quit deteriorating once the lithium is stopped. The valium probably isn't helping but Lithium is what caused the kidney issues. I have a friend for whom this happened to. You may want to post this questions on the bipolar site as well. There are other drugs like lamotrigine and the antipsychotics that aren't as hard on the kidneys so there are still bipolar medications available.

[lindahand]

I have a GFR of close to that amount (54) and am 37. I've been told that I can live to old age if the number doesn't go down and that diet will play a huge role in whether or not that number goes down or stays the same.

So this isn't a death sentence by any means. There are a lot of factors at play as to whether or not the numbers go up or down. For example if it is a disease process, you probably will have a lower life expectancy. If you got this from overuse of NSAIDS like ibuprofen, when you stop the medications the deterioration should stop as well.

Ask your doctors next time you see them to put your mind at ease.

[Carrie4335]

People keep mentioning that if you keep an eye on your diet that the progression of CKD (stages 1-3) should be okay, well at least stable. My question is, what type of diet are you following to keep your numbers stable?

My husband was just diagnosed with stage 3 CKD, and I'd like to know what types of meals to prepare so I can keep him as healthy as possible.

[lindahand]

I have had a huge increase in kidney function from diet restrictions. I went from 54% to 69% in six months. So I went from moderate kidney disease to mild kidney disease.

If you google kidney diet you'll find some good information from some of the kidney foundations.

This is what my doctor told me.

Mostly it is avoiding items high in potassium and phosphorus (if it is pre-packaged - chances are it is high in phosphorous, as well as any dark cola except rootbeer). The main culprits are tomatoes, potatoes sweet and regular(although you can have potatoes if you cube them, soak them overnight, drain the water off and boil them because that takes a lot of the potassium out), squash, lettuce and spinach, nuts, bananas, oranges. And he said to follow a low salt/low cholesterol diet. He also said to reduce red meat and pork consumption by half. You don't have to cut out these foods just reduce them significantly. An iceberg lettuce salad with a restaurant meal once every couple a weeks isn't doing to make that much difference. (iceburg lettuce has the lowest potassium, spinach the highest)

I eat a lot of baked chicken breast with things like apricot jam on top, one really tasty one is a can of cranberries and some lime juice, or sprinkled with Mrs. Dash (be careful what salt subsitutes you use because a lot of them contain potassium). I also make my own sauces using wine or sherry, a little bit of soy sauce (really high in salt. China Lily is the lowest in salt I've found) , some brown sugar and depending on my mood Worcestershire Sauce (it is a good sauce to use because it is low salt). I also make pineapple chicken. I fry the chicken and then use real pineapple chuncks and pineapple juice and some red pepper flakes. I thicken the sauce with cornstarch and serve over brown rice. Occasionally I will use a prepared sauce but they tend to be really high in salt. Don't buy the frozen chicken breasts as they are 'seasoned' and can be as high as 20% of your daily salt per breast. Another good seasoner is sesame oil. You need very little as it packs a pretty good punch. It is excellent on broccoli and I will add it instead of the Worcestershire sauce to my homemade sauce if I want an oriental taste. I would say we eat chicken or turkey for about 90% of our meals now.

There is a website called Davita that has some tasty recipes. The chicken enchaladas are really good. Keep in mind though that these are recipes for stage 4 and 5 kidney disease so you can add a little more protein to them. A good rule of thumb for protein is a little less than the size of your fist. If he is getting closer to stage 4 than I would consider a little less protein.

I've gotten so that vegetable with salt taste funny, so your tastebuds will adjust. I still add salt to some things. Oatmeal needs a little salt for example, but I cut it in half of what I used to.

It is daunting at first. For me it was giving up tomatoes. I used tomatoes in almost everything I cooked. For some things I could subsitute pineapple juice but for most things I just had to give the recipe up. I make myself a red pasta sauce about once a month and devour it. This is a long term thing so you have to 'treat' yourself once in a while, just so long as it is once a month and not once a week.

If you have access to a dietician that would be best. They can help you with meal plans and all sorts of other suggestions. I wasn't severe enough for a dietician, but I would have loved to go to one especially when I was first trying to figue this whole thing out.

Good luck. I hope his numbers go the same direction mine did. It is worth the effort.

[Carrie4335]

Thank you so much Linda for replying. I appreciate the in-depth response.

I've been researching online like crazy abou kidney diets. We have tried to find a renal dietican (or any dietician) but are having some problems with insurance - and the fact that they only offer group study classes but don't have a one on one consulatations. Today my husband and I went to see his PCP and she said to stick to whole grains, vegetables, fruits and limited protein (the nephrologist said he could have up to 10 oz a day for his weight). I also asked her about the potassium and phosphorous and she said for right now his levels are fine and he doesn't have to "limit" them. I'll still keep an eye out for how much he eats. Soda has been eliminated for a month now but I'm still working on getting him to quit eating so much processed foods - which are high in salt, sugar, starch, and chemicals.

I don't know, everything seems so confusing. I did search the Davita meal plan -- they had one for regular patients and one for diabetic patients -- but I was shocked that there was so much refined foods---even for the diabetic plan. My husband isn't diabetic but has a metabolic disorder that could lead him there if he doesn't watch his intake of sugar and processed foods.

Right now I want to have him to eat plenty of vegetables and fruits with limited grains and protein.

This is just a sample diet that I hope would be beneficial:

Breakfast: Oatmeal with blueberries.

Lunch: Big salad (using romaine lettuce) with cucumbers, peas (small amount), cheese (small amounts), eggs, carrots, turkey and salad dressing.

Dinner: 3/4 of the plate filled with some type of vegetables (broccoli, cauliflower, green beans, etc.) with some protein.

Snacks through the day: Apples, grapes, peaches

I also need to watch his salt intake as he has high blood pressure. He's never been able to get it down to the normal levels; it's usually around 130's/140's over 90's/100's. It seems like 145/95 is his norm.

It sounds like you're doing extremely well. Congrats! I am so happy that you found a diet that's helping your GFR number improve. I know you mentioned some things to stay away from and some things you're eating, but would you mind giving me a sample menu of your day --- a few days if you don't mind. It would be greatly appreciated.

I just kind of feel at a loss trying to watch his blood pressure, sugar intake, and now finding a diet that would improve his GHR levels.

[warney]

yes it does depend on too many factors to predict rate of deckline. one of the biggest factors is the cause itself. I have no bladder and so have an ileal conduit, this causes constant urine reflux and constant infection, this was the cause of my CKD and why it is dropping so fast. The underlyin g cause cannot be prevented or reduced, but in many cases the cause can, hence slowing or even halting progression :) good luck

[Wesley212]

Personally, I would rather face imamate death from kidney failure (or even being burned alive) that the utter hellish nightmare of trying to find a new drug to replace lithium. If you have ever been a medication non-responder, then you know what I’m talking about. Plus, when you start going thru the inevitable experience of what lithium deprivation can bring, you will most likely stop responding to your anti-depressant as well (if you’re bi-polar). It might take you a year or more.. Or maybe even never… to find a new drug combination that will get you back into the normal world. The only question now, 40 years down the road is… how much spunk and fortitude do you got? When you were young you could maybe deal with the change. I found 11 months and 15 days to be quite sufficient.

Leave my lithium…? Unthinkable. Lithium is God as far as I’m concerned. And He can have the kidneys for all I care. They ain’t much use to you when you have to face what comes next at the bottom of that slippery sliding pit. Know what I mean...? I hope that you do.

[lindahand]

I do understand why you would say that. I really do. And I know what it is to be alive and not live. I never tried lithium because I only have one kidney and they didn't want to risk it, but it took me years to get on something that works and I wouldn't want to go off it unless I absolutely HAD to.

Following the kidney diet though may help slow the progress down. At least it couldn't hurt. Cutting down on the phosphorus, potassium, etc.

Good luck.

[Wesley212]

There are some things worse than death. As anyone who faces the daily struggle with severe clinical depression knows, the compulsion towards suicide is a very real.. Almost living thing. It doesn't matter how much willpower you have... The only determining factor is how close will the bottom of the pit come. It is mental pain beyond description. The mania cycle only produces social embarrassment. 20 straight days of 2 hours or less sleep and a lost job or two. Maybe even a crushed professional reputation where you can never work in your field of study again. Things like that. When they're both out of whack at the same time, you might even be found on the 6o clock news. They would have to put me in a straightjacket and Velcro me to a wall without this drug, just so I couldn’t tear the top of my head off.  So anything is preferable to the eventuality wrought by that. The loss of my kidneys included. What use are they to a person if they're dead? And look what they had to go thru to get there. Like I say, dying by fire is better than living with a severely unbalanced brain chemistry. At least death is relatively quick. It all depends on how bad you have it, my friend.