Mycoplasmas

Folks, I need direction.  About 7 years ago a lady left me a present.  Non-gonococcal urethritis.  At the time I got tested for all the standard STDs and the tests were negative.  I've been living with it ever since, until recently when I discovered that mycoplasma genitalia is now recognized as an STD.  I began to take herbs that are effective against mycoplasmas and they are dying.  A lump on the side of my head has dissolved, and a lump at the tip of my sternum has also dissolved.  Angiogenisis was taking place near the lump on my sternum and the veins are disappearing now.  Looks like I caught things just in time.

However, there is more to this.  At the same time these herbs were killing the sexually transmitted mycos, floaters that I have seen since I was 11 or 12 years old disappeared.  I watched the last one in my right eye.  As I was watching it, pop, the squiggly little shape turned into a fried egg shape, then pop, it was gone!  My God, I've been packing a mycoplasma for over 40 years!  I have had reason to take other anti-biotics over the years, nothing effected my floaters, or my tinnitus as the herbs have.

I believe I know the source of the invaders.  In 1968 we had a flood in my little town.  The Red Cross came in and gave us all typhoid immunizations.  In thinking back, it was soon afterwards that the tinnitus and floaters started, not to mention the painful joints, that are now totally ravaged.  In my youth I was mostly around older people and often heard them speak of such things, I guess I just thought it was normal!

I've contacted the Red Cross hoping to find the lot # of the vaccine and perhaps get a list of folks who received it. Most are probably dead.  Of course, even in the same lot, I may have been the only one that contracted it.  Others may have been immune, or there simply wasn't any in the syringe that they got.  I've also contacted the CDC.  Thus far no responses other than the automated one from the CDC.

I also need direction to look for any experiments that may have been done using "We the People" as guinea pigs.  Such things were not uncommon in that era, and I can't help but wonder why the Red Cross hasn't shown up to immunize people after later floods.  Any direction will be appreciated.  Quite frankly, I'm PO'd.  This stuff took a young man with an IQ of 135 and turned him into an also ran, a person so full of confusion I can't begin to describe it.  The only other possible source of these vermin lies in the fact that I've had a few ticks stuck to me when I was young.

[Garth L Nicolson, PhD]

Let me attempt to deal briefly with the several questions that you have raised.  This forum is not the place to discuss these topics, but I respect your right to ask these important questions.

1. Immunization as the source for a chronic infection (Mycoplasma species or other slow-growing intracellular bacteria).

This is a real problem that is often ignored by health authorities and vaccine manufacturers.  The contamination of commercial vaccine lots with microorganisms that can easily pass through sterilization filters and survive heat and chemical treatments can unfortunately be a factor in chronic illnesses of unknown origin.  In one publication in the peer-reviewed journal VACCINE commercial vaccines were analyzed for the presence of contaminating Mycoplasma species.  Over 6% of the vaccine lots examined were found to be contaminated—an unacceptable level of contamination.  When I asked a production manager from one of the largest vaccine manufacturers why commercial vaccines were not being checked for the presence of contaminating Mycoplasmas and other cell wall-deficient bacteria, the response was that it was too expensive to check for everything.  Thus vaccine lots are routine examined for rapidly growing bacteria but not for slow-growing intracellular cell wall-deficient bacterial forms.  I believe that this should change, but unless more people (victims) raise a stink about this, nothing will change.

2. Genetic engineering and experiments on the American population.

There is a long and tragic history of experiments with microorganisms on the American public (and military) without their knowledge or permission.  Unfortunately, few of these experiments ever see the light of day.  One exception—The syphilis experiments on poor black Americans decades ago in Alabama who were infected and then just observed throughout their truncated lives.  It is extremely difficult to document such experiments in the face of official denials, secrecy classifications and other roadblocks to exposing the truth.  We faced this problem in Texas when we inadvertently stumbled upon a massive bioweapon testing program in the Texas prison system.  Records were destroyed, health and prison officials denied the existence of the program, and as tenured university faculty we were treated as criminals and faced termination for investigating an outbreak brought to our attention by prison employees who became sick from contact with prisoner guinea pigs.  This is documented in our book “Project Day Lily” (www.projectdaylily.com), which is primarily about the Gulf War Illnesses after the 1991 Gulf War.  There are other examples discussed in our book and elsewhere.  You can also find additional information on our website, www.immed.org.

3. Your own health problems.

There are several ways to become infected with a pathogen, even one as fastidious as a mycoplasma.  These are airborne infections, and persons can become infected by close and prolonged proximity to infected people, by fluid exchange (sexual contact, blood or blood product transfusion, etc.), or as stated above by inoculation.  Most chronic illness patients have multiple chronic infections (bacterial, viral, fungal), not just one or even a few, and this has to be taken into account.

For the most part mycoplasmal infections are responsive to long-term treatments with specific antibiotics or in some cases with specific nutraceuticals or herbs (for most patients this is not as effective as antibiotics).  Short-term antibiotic treatments, such as those suggested by IDSA/CDC, in my opinion, do not work on the chronic forms of infection where slow-growing intracellular microorganisms have established themselves deep inside tissues and cells throughout the body.  However, I can agree with the IDSA/CDC that these treatment approaches have merit for recent infections that have not become systemic.  As we stress in our recommendations, however, there are several other considerations for treatment of chronic intracellular infections that should be taken into account, such as diet, vitamin supplements, immune support, lipid replacement, among other considerations.  These only indirectly address the infection(s) but are important in maintaining host health and the ability to respond to infections and repair host damage caused by infections. More information can be found under Treatment Considerations on our website, www.immed.org.

Prof. Garth Nicolson

[JackieCalifornia]

Sorry to hear about all you've been through -- unfortunately this forum may not be helpful to you.  Folks here focus on Lyme disease and related ailments, and unless someone else here has an idea, your questions, while good ones, do not seem to relate to the usual matters raised here.

You might try another forum on MedHelp, but I am not able to say which one.  

Best wishes --

[JackieCalifornia]

PS -- it occurs to me that Dr Nicholson might have some guidance for you -- see the first post in this forum -- he's taking questions currently or will be -- good luck!

[nutrinut_bob]

Yes, I realized it was a Lyme forum, but I know of Dr. Nicholson's work with mycos.   Sometimes the Lymies have mycos as co-infections.  Having recently had 2 mycos at once, I can tell you they don't get along with their relatives and they don't like others moving into their neighborhood.  Now that they are dying, I'm learning all about auto-immune problems too, but I've got a handle on it.  Hope to hear from Garth.  I'm interested in his work with veterans, I am one too.  After some thought, I had ticks on me long before my tinnitus and floaters started, and it appears they are the wrong species.  Never had the rash either.  There is some interest in my post, I'm getting emails, one from Poland, so I hope the moderators won't move it.

[JackieCalifornia]

Nah, the mods pretty much leave us alone.

re your comment on having been bitten by the wrong species of tick:  I don't think that holds.  Just because deer ticks were found to be the original vector doesn't mean they are the only vector, esp. as infection has spread throughout the country, the continent and even the world.

Mosquitoes carry malaria ... why not babesiosis (which is akin to malaria), and why not Lyme?  The standard CDC/IDSA statement about Lyme not being communicated unless the tick has been attached for a minimum of X hours makes no sense to me and I have seen nothing published to *prove* that minimum time or even to discuss it thoughtfully -- it is instead received knowledge, so obvious as not to need proof.  It's part and parcel of the standards requiring a bullseye rash to be diagnosed with Lyme.  Outdated, and worse:  wrong.

I never saw the tick(s) that gave me Lyme and babesiosis, but found the tick that gave me Ehrlichosis (and probably or possibly a reinfection of Lyme) -- and that tick was a dog tick:  big and ugly and unmistakable and burrowed deeply into the back of my thigh where I didn't see it for a couple of weeks.  I had myself tested and had the tick ground up and tested separately, and we both were positive.

Lyme has been a quiet epidemic in this country for several decades at least, so don't count yourself out as part of this unhappy but determined parade.

[JackieCalifornia]

PS you mention autoimmune issues in passing.  Are you referring to the IDSA approach that anyone with continued symptoms after 2-3 weeks of abx treatment for Lyme is no longer infected but is instead experiencing an autoimmune reaction to a vanished infection?

And you may need to post direction to Garth Nicholson -- I've not seen him post directly here in response to comments, but don't know the set up.

[nutrinut_bob]

On X-mas eve, I could feel the little vermin dying throughout me.  I know it seems weird to say that, but I felt their entry and progress upward for quite some time.  After their death, I would alkalize, and once I get above a pH of 6, my immune response kicks in.  I felt the mycos were gone, the response was to where they had been, could be little bits of their attachment organs left.   The herb I take also has some powerful anti-inflammatory action that keeps the autoimmune response in check.  The anti-inflammatory response of the herb is very powerful, had a cousin down with cancer who is taking it, the big lug isn't down anymore.  I have little worry about the sexually contracted mycos for now.  I know some are still alive, specifically in my testes, where budding reproduction is easy for them, the AIDS virus likes to live there for the same reason, easier to insert RNA in where meiosis is taking place.  They can bud all they want to, once they hit my urinary tract, they're dead meat.  My concern now is getting the rest of them out of my brain.  Things seem to be working more on my right side than on the left and I know the lymphatic system differs, right to left.  Your acronyms do me no good, I have no professionals to turn to for help, I'm unemployed, it is just me, and what the Lord leads me to.  I have a little education in the biological sciences, and herbology, but for the most part, I am on my own.  Once Garth is on, I will direct him to my posts.  Wonder if he's hiring?

I understand what you're saying about vermin such as ticks and mosquitoes.  Lost a cousin that was living down south to encephalopathy.  Also have a little girl I support in the Philippines who has dengue.  I myself don't believe that skeeters can't pass the AIDS virus.  I have a hard time understanding getting tick bit anymore, I feel the little critters crawling very quickly.  I suppose it's a matter of getting used to such things, you might say I grew up in a woodland. I often see the poor with flies crawling all over them, it'd drive me mad, but across the railroad tracks from me when I was around 5 there lived a family with 19 children.  Beyond them, another family with 18.  These 2 families made up a full 10% of the town's population!  How they ever got by is beyond me.  When it came time to cut the grass, mom gave each kid a kitchen knife and away they went.  But now, I'm rambling.  Thanks again.

[JackieCalifornia]

The posting about Nicholson says you can submit questions beginning this Sunday.  Go for it, you never know.

Sorry about the acronyms.  

IDSA = Infectious Disease Society of America, the main group for mainstream infectious disease (ID) docs, and the ones who cling to original notions about Lyme, its nature, its treatment, and its aftermath.  

ILADS = International Lyme and Associated Diseases Society, the main group for the more progressive thinking docs re Lyme and co-infections (Babesiosis, Ehrlichiosis, etc.)  Their website at ILADS [dot] org is helpful, esp the tab 'About Lyme'.  Burrascano's 'Diagnostic Hints and Treatment Guidelines' is interesting and useful even to nonMDs.

I too took to alkalyzing my diet and it helped a great deal with the systemic fungal infection I had.

Astragalus and Cat's Claw/Samento are sometimes used by Lyme patients.  My doc told me to lay off the Cat's Claw after a while, but has me continuing on Astragalus.  Also there is a fellow named Stephen Buhner who writes thoughtfully and extensively on herbal approaches to many conditions, including Lyme.  You might check him out.  I dont' know if he blogs or posts, but he publishes.

[nutrinut_bob]

You got me thinking.  On another board I had a fellow jump on the same question I originally asked.  "Mycoplasma is a contaminant of cell cultures.  Typhoid is not cultured".  Had to go after that one, where do you suppose they get them from to make A) the dead vaccine, B) the live vaccine.  Answer, they are grown.  Interestingly I discovered that in the 1940's they changed the way they killed the bacteria for use in the vaccine.  Previously it was done with heat and phenol.  Beginning in the 40's they started killing them with alcohol. alone  I can tell you alcohol would have to be in contact with a myco for awhile to kill it.  And, it would'nt be in contact at all with a myco that's inside a bacterium!  Aha, said the blind man, now I see!  A researcher could look through a light microscope, pronounce the bacterium dead. and not even see a mycoplasma, not even one on the outside of the bacteria, let alone on the inside!  Of to that other forum to present my case.  Sound logical to anyone?

[nutrinut_bob]

Yes they are grown, specifically the old dead vaccine.  Anybody care to give me odds on what the species is?  Avian, no doubt.  My God!

[nutrinut_bob]

Oops, I omitted the fact that the bacteria were grown on eggs.  That's why I'm going with Avian.

[nutrinut_bob]

Dr Nicolson,  please help me find things out, and help my people, you have the reputation, the media connections, and most importantly the lab and technicians to figure this out.

[nutrinut_bob]

Dr. Nicholson, you have the reputation, the media connections, and most importantly, the lab and technicians that can prove or disprove my theory above.  My people are sorely in need of help.  In a town of less than 500 it doesn't take a whole lot of observation, comparing what I see to what happens to chickens and turkeys infected with mycos to see the same in the people of my little town.  My symptoms are laid out above, my father has ALS/Alzheimer's, my mother has artificial heart valves, my sister has walking pneumonia. There aren't many of us left, hope you can do us some good.

[JackieCalifornia]

Bob, I think you need to click on the post about Nicholson's appearance back on the main page of the Lyme forum, then scroll down to a link inside that post to get to the 'autoimmune disorders' forum, where Nicholson will be holding court and taking questions ... I don't think he's coming here to read our comments.

[nutrinut_bob]

Yes, I was referring him to this one, from that one, and wanted to add a comment, my connection's a bit shaky, I'm a long way from the wi-fi tower, couldn't get it to take.  Thus the double, and there was another went out to cyperspace.  Sorry.

[Garth L Nicolson, PhD]

Let me attempt to deal briefly with the several questions that you have raised.  This forum is not the place to discuss these topics, but I respect your right to ask these important questions.

1. Immunization as the source for a chronic infection (Mycoplasma species or other slow-growing intracellular bacteria).

This is a real problem that is often ignored by health authorities and vaccine manufacturers.  The contamination of commercial vaccine lots with microorganisms that can easily pass through sterilization filters and survive heat and chemical treatments can unfortunately be a factor in chronic illnesses of unknown origin.  In one publication in the peer-reviewed journal VACCINE commercial vaccines were analyzed for the presence of contaminating Mycoplasma species.  Over 6% of the vaccine lots examined were found to be contaminated—an unacceptable level of contamination.  When I asked a production manager from one of the largest vaccine manufacturers why commercial vaccines were not being checked for the presence of contaminating Mycoplasmas and other cell wall-deficient bacteria, the response was that it was too expensive to check for everything.  Thus vaccine lots are routine examined for rapidly growing bacteria but not for slow-growing intracellular cell wall-deficient bacterial forms.  I believe that this should change, but unless more people (victims) raise a stink about this, nothing will change.

2. Genetic engineering and experiments on the American population.

There is a long and tragic history of experiments with microorganisms on the American public (and military) without their knowledge or permission.  Unfortunately, few of these experiments ever see the light of day.  One exception—The syphilis experiments on poor black Americans decades ago in Alabama who were infected and then just observed throughout their truncated lives.  It is extremely difficult to document such experiments in the face of official denials, secrecy classifications and other roadblocks to exposing the truth.  We faced this problem in Texas when we inadvertently stumbled upon a massive bioweapon testing program in the Texas prison system.  Records were destroyed, health and prison officials denied the existence of the program, and as tenured university faculty we were treated as criminals and faced termination for investigating an outbreak brought to our attention by prison employees who became sick from contact with prisoner guinea pigs.  This is documented in our book “Project Day Lily” (www.projectdaylily.com), which is primarily about the Gulf War Illnesses after the 1991 Gulf War.  There are other examples discussed in our book and elsewhere.  You can also find additional information on our website, www.immed.org.

3. Your own health problems.

There are several ways to become infected with a pathogen, even one as fastidious as a mycoplasma.  These are airborne infections, and persons can become infected by close and prolonged proximity to infected people, by fluid exchange (sexual contact, blood or blood product transfusion, etc.), or as stated above by inoculation.  Most chronic illness patients have multiple chronic infections (bacterial, viral, fungal), not just one or even a few, and this has to be taken into account.

For the most part mycoplasmal infections are responsive to long-term treatments with specific antibiotics or in some cases with specific nutraceuticals or herbs (for most patients this is not as effective as antibiotics).  Short-term antibiotic treatments, such as those suggested by IDSA/CDC, in my opinion, do not work on the chronic forms of infection where slow-growing intracellular microorganisms have established themselves deep inside tissues and cells throughout the body.  However, I can agree with the IDSA/CDC that these treatment approaches have merit for recent infections that have not become systemic.  As we stress in our recommendations, however, there are several other considerations for treatment of chronic intracellular infections that should be taken into account, such as diet, vitamin supplements, immune support, lipid replacement, among other considerations.  These only indirectly address the infection(s) but are important in maintaining host health and the ability to respond to infections and repair host damage caused by infections. More information can be found under Treatment Considerations on our website, www.immed.org.

Prof. Garth Nicolson

[nutrinut_bob]

I appreciate your reply Dr. Nicolson, as I stated in one of my others posts, I am now putting the bio warfare thoughts aside, because as stated above, the way the bacteria for the typhoid vaccine are killed was changed in the 1940's.  In reading a paper on mycoplasmas written by a Univ of Texas professor, I see that the first reported cases of human infection with m. pneumoniae was, tah, dah, the 1940s.  In my math book 1940s+1940s=I'm right about mycos continuing to live on inside the cytoplasm of said bacteria.  Can't get help from the Ohio Dept of Health or the CDC, or any so called physician, people getting rich by treating symptoms of the underlying cause.  They take an oath to serve mankind, serve naught but their billfolds.   May God deal with them all as oath breakers in the days to come.  I'm going back to help my own as best I can, my whole family is infected.  Millions are, solely for the simple reason stated above.  Off to the FDA with my discovery, for I am going to make a difference.  Why?  Because I am not like the above physicians, I do indeed serve mankind, despite all its flaws, they are worthy.  Take my theory and run with it if you wish, pretty easy to prove a myco can live through an alcohol bath.  You might even get that Nobel Prize with it.  You needn't try to sway me away from the mode of infection, I know when these things got into me, and how.  In reading the preview to your book I noted the reference to people trying to blow the whistle mysteriously dieing.  I've taken precautions, the information has been tucked away in a variety of places.  God be with you in the days ahead.

[nutrinut_bob]

Dr. Nicolson, I referenced this post.  Got hold of my state representative and actually received a reply!  No doubt if an investigation is initiated, they will bring in a bunch of physicians who will diagnose my people with all manner of diseases, that are only symptoms of the mycoplasma infection.  And perhaps I will be made to look like a fool.  But that's nothing new!  Here's the email I received back from the Senator:

Mr. Wolfe,



Thank you for your e-mail.  I have contacted the Department of Health on your behalf and they should be contacting you in regards to the records you are requesting.  If you have any further questions please contact our office.



Thank You

Danielle Vandegriff

Administrative Assistant

Senator Schaffer

[ewford]

nutrient bob, take a look at my older posts post.  Mine situation is almost exactly like yours

[nutrinut_bob]

I see, looks as though you did some good research, especially good was getting people pointed to where the testing is done in a much better way.  In some testing a lot of false negatives come up, because it requires that one's phagocytes engulf some of the mycoplasmas.  Mycos have defenses to prevent that.  Going to send you a personal message, it won't be there for long.

[nutrinut_bob]

Oh, how nasty!  Major die off last night and this morning!  Not going to be able to stay up long, legs are filling with their dead bodies, or lymph if you prefer.  I had no idea there was still this much of it still in me!  But then, we're talking about 7 years of growing.  I'd been reading about some cancer cells having a death receptor.  Once the receptor is triggered, starts a chain reaction.  I'm glad some of the bigger lumps went before the subcutaneous film.  I think each of my legs weighs about 2lbs more!  Any suggestions on flushing this stuff?  I know, lots of water...Better get down before all this crap gets to my feet.  Folks I know this is an old saying, but it's certainly true in this case.  There's no parasite, like a dead parasite!  Glory to God who brought this about!

[nutrinut_bob]

Well I haven't found any records of who received the immunizations in 1968, or who gave them to us.  But with a little help I discovered who didn't.  Let's see, not any Dept of Health within Ohio it seems, not the Red Cross, who might that leave?  My guess, good old Uncle Sugar.  So I'll no doubt ever find proof, since the experiment seems to be ongoing it won't be declassified until long after I'm gone.

Mr. Wolfe,
I did hear back from my vaccine rep. at the Ohio Dept. of Health.  She stated that ODH has never purchased Typhoid vaccine for local health departments to administer.  Reasons include cost and lack of need for Typhoid vaccine in the United States.  So, they have no records of administering Typhoid vaccine.
Sorry,
Kelly Taulbee, MSN, RN
Hocking Co. Health Dept.