Maternal & Child Community
Lunch Meat and Pregnancy
About This Community:

This patient support community is for discussions relating to breast feeding, childhood disease, colic, child discipline, immunization, lactation, newborn care, post partum depression, Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS), and special needs children.

Font Size:
A
A
A
Background:
Blank
Blank
Blank
Blank Blank

Lunch Meat and Pregnancy

So-  forget smoking pot while pregnant!!  I am kinda freaking out about this whole lunch meat thing...  I have a sub from Jimmy Johns every monday, it is kinda an office thing...  how likely is it to get listeria from eating a sub with ham and turkey lunch meat on it???  I will stop now, but I had no idea I could be causing harm!  
Related Discussions
125 Comments Post a Comment
Blank
210400_tn?1325384170
I think that lunch meat is fine, they process it well enough. I eat turkey sandwiches often and my doc says its ok.
Blank
238474_tn?1192417309
Did you read my comment on the other thread?  The other problems with lunch meat are the NITRATES they use to preserve them and other bacterial infections like h.pylori or listeria.  I don't eat deli meat, pregnant or not.  I also don't eat hot dogs or bacon preserved with nitrates.  There is a chance you could get sick, and nitrates aren't good for anyone.  The other forbidden foods during pregnancy include bean sprouts (salmonella), soft cheeses like feta or brie, smoked fish (lox, salmon), undercooked meat, mercury laden fish, and raw unwashed vegetables, especially berries, because it is hard to get any contamination off.  (Do you remember when people were getting sick from bacteria covered strawberries or raspberries?)
Chances are you didn't get listeria - but you could - so I would avoid it from this point on.  It isn't that common - but it's one of those things - why take the risk?
Blank
158812_tn?1189759426
Oh please, there is a higher chance of getting in a car accident.
Make sure you buckle up instead......eat all the turkey sandwiches you want.  
Blank
184342_tn?1282592350
hi,  yeah, thanks for your comment...  I did read it on the other tread, but it was something that I didn't know about and I thought maybe other people should know about it too (and didn't think people would think they'd be reading about lunch meat on a marijuna thread!)-  it seems like such a common easy meal to eat at lunch!!  Maybe I am the only one who didn't know... and I do a lot of reading on most of that stuff!  I knew about the fish and cheese... didn't really think about berrys!  wow,  this is my second pregnancy, but it just amazes me at what we give up to have babies!! :)  I think I can go without Jimmy Johns for the next 5 months!  :)
Blank
238474_tn?1192417309
Do you think it's good that the meat is highly processed?  The problem is not with the processing of the meat - it's when it is in the deli or supermarket, and they are SLICING and STORING the meat.  It's perfectly sealed when it arrives to the vendor.  I live in the New York metro area where delis are on every corner.  When you order a sandwich - they slice the meat on the spot.  But, the slicers sit out in the open.  They aren't cleaned after every order.  That's how meat gets contaminated - the slicer.  I went to school in upstate NY where they PREsliced meat and left it in cold tables to assemble when people ordered sandwiches.  I would see flies landing on the meat.  I NEVER ate a sandwich up there.  I worked as a waitress for a few different restaurants.  Don't even get me started on what goes on in the kitchen.  If you feel that lunch meat is fine for you, here's the Mayo Clinic's opinion:
"To prevent food-borne illness, fully cook all meats and poultry before eating. Look for the juices to run clear, but use a meat thermometer to make sure. Skip medium or rare burgers and sausages. Be careful with hot dogs and deli meats, too. These are sources of a rare but potentially serious food-borne illness known as listeriosis. Cook hot dogs and heat deli meats until they're steaming hot — or avoid them completely."
Blank
184342_tn?1282592350
LOL...  I do buckle up!!!  and I don't smoke pot!! :)
Blank
238474_tn?1192417309
It's not as rare as you would think.  How about the women that have suffered miscarriages that could have been avoided due to bacterial contamination?
This is from the USDA:
  “Listeria and T. gondii cause thousands of illnesses and hundreds of deaths each year,” said Caroline Smith DeWaal, food-safety director for CSPI. “These foodborne hazards are particularly harmful to fetuses, resulting in miscarriages, mental retardation, blindness, and other severe problems. Preventing exposure of pregnant women and other high-risk consumers to Listeria and T. gondii should be a top priority for federal food-safety officials.”
"Listeria causes approximately 2,500 illnesses and 500 deaths per year. Based on CDC data, CSPI estimates that about one-third of deaths involve pregnant women and their fetuses. Listeria contaminates foods processed or packaged in unsanitary conditions."
“If I had known about the risks of consuming deli meat while I was pregnant, I might have been able to prevent my miscarriage,“ said Lisa Lee of Columbus, Ohio, who was a victim in the 1999 Listeria outbreak caused by cold cuts distributed by the Sara Lee Corporation. “I’m speaking out because I want to prevent other women from going through what I went through.”
"Mary Lenkersdorf, of West Palm Beach, Florida, also suffered a miscarriage because of Listeria. “When I was pregnant for the first time, no one told me not to eat hot dogs, deli meats, or Brie or feta cheese. One afternoon, when I was four months pregnant, I started feeling sick. By the next night I had miscarried.”
These aren't my words.  This is straight from the USDA.
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
If you had listeria you would know by now. I wouldnt worry about it, but if you want to take the precaution then stop eating the deli meat. Mabye have chicken breast instead.
The nitrates are supposed to be bad for developing fetus, however ALOT of woman eat deli meat as well as hot dogs and their babies ARE fine. I promise you that.

I believe in the What to Expect When your Expecting Book they talk about this.

Gosh sometimes I  wonder if it isnt toxic for the baby sitting in front of a computer all day.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
i dont know about that sandwich shop they dont have them here in this part of california, but most places do have veggies sandwiches, salads, hot sandwhiches.  the processed turkey isnt good, but the roasted cut off the bird kind is lol.  they say if you do choose to eat deli meats it needs to be heated to kill the listeria, so a hot sub is ok.  id say any food that is packaged or canned has icky stuff in it.  after all they are allowed a % of animal waste (hmm maybe rat poop?) in it.  the store brands are cheaper and i used to buy them, but i read that the cheaper ones are allowed more stuff to pass.  i eat oven roasted turkey from my deli all the time.  my doc said that was ok.  no balogna, salame, those kids of things. ham too is processed.
Blank
177988_tn?1266802499
I ate turkey sandwiches like it was my job in teh beginning of this pregnancy.  It was all I could digest well (had bad morning noon and night sickness).  I am fine, my baby is fine inside of me with two weeks to go.  Jimmy Johns is THE ABSOLUTE GREATEST ever and they are very clean... at least every one I've been to.  OMG now I have the worst craving!  I actually get the vegi sub from there.. not because it has no meat I've just eaten it for years because I love the ever so fattening avacado and cheese and mayo! But I also like the turkey sandwich there and wouldn't turn it down if it were offered to me!  MMMMMMMMMMMMMMM I love JJs!  We just don't have one close enough to our house.  OK I"ll shut up at JJs now haha.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
oh jesus people!! I eat subway all the time and lunch meat too!! Only someone with a HORRIBLE immune system would ever get sick or anything like that.
Blank
213426_tn?1206937938
Blank
213426_tn?1206937938
sorry about the one before, but that kinda worries me,  I eat bologna lunchables all the time. I'm starting to get really sick again and lunchables are the only thing that sound good to me.  i hope im not putting my baby girl at any risk for anyting.
Blank
218870_tn?1240259255
talk to your doctor.  when i went to my first appoinment after knowing i was pregnant for 4 weeks, i had barely eaten anything.  my doctor laughed at me.  she said there are threats of stuff in everything but the chance of actually getting it are so slim.  in her career she has never seen anyone get listeria.  basically she said anything in moderation.  like dont eat hotdogs everyday for a month, but once in a while is fine.  and as far as cheese.  it is safe if it is pasturized.  soft or not.  basically if it is bought in the united states it is safe.  just dont eat like camembert from france (as my mother in law brought to me when i was 9 weeks pregnant)
Blank
177988_tn?1266802499
I also eat subway all the time!  I mean seriously, what do you think our mothers ate when they were pregnant?  I think if you are buying from a trustworthy source, your meat should be fine.  I wouldnt buy from an untrustworthy source even if I wasnt pregnant!  If lunchmeat were bad for us, docs would tell us with out us asking I think.  
Blank
184342_tn?1282592350
Okay,  I feel better now...  I do eat lots of things in moderation-  I have shrimp and crab legs from time to time, my doctor said that would be okay...  so I will keep on with the Jimmy Johns, but maybe I'll try that veggie sub (nikkicole827 made it sound pretty tasty!)...  I'll stop worrying about everything I read on here!  :)  
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
but you have to understand this, darkest you were informed of this last time you said this, when we are pg our immune systems is suppressed making it easier to contract certain things.  what is being said is that there is a chance, the knowledge out there surpasses what our mothers and theirs knew.  they dont know what causes autism, or sids, or add, but if you look at the stats now as compared to years ago, its off the charts.  why? could it be the leaded paint? the cold cuts (ok i know that isnt likely but nitrates people), is it the mothers smoking? (said to cause adhd). what im saying is yes there are so many risks that we are informed of.  we have to choose which we want to to take and which we want to avoid.  darkest you need a bit more info on some of the info you have been dishing out lately, im sorry but i dont think any of us can have more knowledge than the may research teams out there testing different theories.  anyway saying that i have had a salami sandwhich once during my pg.  i love them and i have had a few pepsis.  im not perfect, (really!!) lol and i wont try to preach that i am, im just stating why i think this info is out there.
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
I have eaten lunch meat with all my pregnancies, not ALL the time but once in a while and it is eaten pretty quickly and stored properly. As long as you follow that guideline I wouldn't worry too much about it. My doctor told me it was fine to eat.
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
OMG...are you all for real????  Com'on time to get serious...put a bubble around yourself and everything will be just fine....pfffft
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
I agree lol. The last time I was preg was nearly 5 years ago. In that 5 years things have changed dramatically from what I can see. Apparently everything and anything is lethal while pregnant. I say pffffffffffffftttttttttt too.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
i never have said live in a bubble, i said educate yourselves with the possiblities.  there are many moms here who have had babies born with disabilities that are "rare" and not heard of too often.  
eat what you want, and if if if , your child becomes ill (its not you its the baby that can get sick people), you have known the risks and you can then decide whether it was worth it.  i think what it is that some people have never been educated in what the risks of this or that are.  this is minor there are not too many babies that have become sick, but you have to realize you arent the one, its your baby.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
im the protector mom, i  am not the "play in the street and hopefully a car wont come hit you" kind.  so pffftt yourself all you want lol, my role as a mom is to keep them safe and healthy :)
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
YES...Pertykitty, I like to tell my kids to run with scissors....get real  pffffft
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
lets not take things out of context. surprisebaby you always like to start things, i dont have time for that.
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
pfffffffffffffft....."you" have all the time in the world!!!!  when does your dh come home?  end of Sept?  that must be why you have time to pick fights with others.

That wasn't taken out of context, you believe that your children are safer than mine!!!  You say it OVER AND OVER again, ... I get it!! Think what you like, but there is a HUGE difference between keeping them safe and SMOTHERING THEM!!!!!
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
You can all say what you want, but there certainly are pregnant women who contract Listeria from lunch meats and soft cheeses.  That's why the advisory is out there.  No, it is not common.  In fact, I've never seen it.  But I know it does happen, I've read the case studies, and it is a very real threat.  

You make your choices, you take your chances.  My mother smoked 3 packs a day while pregnant with my sister and I, and we had no problems (well, many of you disagree with that).  Many, many women smoke without problems...but we still know that smoking is dangerous, and we should avoid it while pregnant (and anytime else, for that matter).

So if you are a gambler, the odds are highly on your side that you can eat lunch meat and soft cheeses and smoke, and all will be fine.  But remember, sometimes even the best odds don't pan out, and someone loses.  You have to be able to say "that bologna sandwich was worth it, by god!" I don't think I could say that if I lost my baby to Listeria.  

I'd stay away, as best I could, if I were pregnant.  It isn't forever.  I never had much luck in Vegas, anyway.  
Blank
218870_tn?1240259255
ok have you guys read any books at all?  Have you talked to your doctor?  the first thing that i learned when i got pregnant was that everything you read is contradictory!  you read one book or website and you find that a single piece of ham will kill your unborn child.  you talk to your doctor and she says its fine.  One book will tell you to stay away from nail polish, another tells you it is fine.  i have come to the conclusion that everything can cause something.  one person even mentioned berries arent great for you. so lets see, you cant eat fish, red meat, poultry, berries, lunch meat, chocolate, im sure you can find that some veggies arent good...how do you know that they are washed good enough, you cant sit for too long, you shouldnt walk for too long. on the other hand, fish has fatty acid that helps the brain develop...  Basically everything you shouldnt eat, is good for you too.  The key is moderation.  Your immune system is not that weakened that you would get listeria while you were pregnant and not if you were not pregnant.  my doctor put it to me this way.  if you get listeria while you are pregnant or not pregnant you are in a world of trouble.  if you didnt worry about it before, dont worry about it now.  if you eat lunch meat once a week for 25 years that is 1300 times.  if you didnt get listeria in those 1300 times why would you think you would get it the 40 times you ate it now?  most likely, the worrying everyone is doing about it is more traumatic than actually eating the meat.   after reading a ton of these posts, there are many many freaked out mommies to be on this site right now over one trip to subway or one ham sandwich.  think about it this way...when you called your doctor and said you were pregnant, dont you think you would have gotten a list of foods you should now avoid?   if you are worried about eating something, dont eat it, if not, eat it.  there is no sense in aruging about it.  as far as so many problems with undisclosed sources, there will always be that.  when our kids are older there will be more research that we did something stupid when we were pregnant years ago even if we are so careful now.  Basically, you have to draw the line somewhere, you can not possibly make 40 weeks worth of healthy meals with the amount of foods that you read you should not have.  Every person on  here has a different souce of information and technically everyone is right.  You will find that lunch meat is bad, but you will also find that it is safe.  Your best bet is to take the info you are getting here and ask questions at your doctors office.  Id stick with one source and accept answers you get there, otherwise we will all drive ourselves crazy.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
people id like to say that while im not hurt (id have to care about you to be hurt) this woman who claims to be the caretaker for the weak, likes to pick herself.  using the fact my dh is in the navy and gone for half a year to get to me (it hasnt, im quite content and im stronger than you could ever be) for her own pleasure.  she yells at you if you dont drive an american car, but will buy other things made in china.  she tells others to not do this or that in pregnancy but then suggests it be a great idea to ride on a motorcycle for many many miles.  is this the kind of person you want to accept advice from? lol i am really chuckling.  i never said my son was better than anyone elses. NEVER.  only a person with issues of their own mothering skills would use that EVERY SINGLE  time.

it wasnt over one ham sandwich, it was over eating it over and over again throughout pregnancy.  
Blank
162279_tn?1270604959
Peekawho said it all: it could be a gamble if you choose to eat something that has been shown to potentially be a problem....EVEN IF IT IS VERY RARE FOR THIS TO HAPPEN.
What IF you were the one in 10,000 (or whatever) that it DID happen to????
Would you say, like Peek says---"Well that bologna sandwich was worth it!!!"
I think not.
I just think it is much better to be safe than sorry....especially when a woman has lost a baby to miscarriage like I have, you better believe I won't do ANYTHING even slightly questionable during my pregnancy.
Blank
177988_tn?1266802499
KJ, I think that was well said.
Blank
218870_tn?1240259255
there are a couple of posts like this going on in different threads and one lady was upset that she had just gotten done eating a ham sandwich when she realized she wasnt supposed to eat lunch meat.  that is what i was refering to.  i understand what you are saying.  
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
You can eat ham sandwiches EVERY FRIGGIN day of your pregnancy and there still will not be any harm to your baby.  Just put some more  fear into all the pregnant ladies,  You are such a worry wart.   Chuckle all you want, you have done nothing but BASH me, when conversations were not even directed at you!  You like to make them about you, so I am just reciprocating for ya!  You have allllll the time in the world, I have a life outside of medhelp, so I disappear for months at a time, and when I come back, you are still here, putting unnecessary fears into all these mom's or mom-to-be's....perhaps you should sit back and see that there are differences in opinions, we definitly have ours (THANK GOD!!!)  as far as the cars go...yes, I am as loyal as they come, SHOOT ME...I want to support our econcomy, and, NO, I do not buy other things from CHINA, I like to support our economy, if it is manufactured locally, I will chose local over imported products ...didn't know there was a law against that..
What have I told people NOT to do while pregnant???? Nothing, because I believe everything in moderation is ok!
You should be very proud of your dh, I know I am!    :)   Give him a hug when he gets back from me too....k?
Blank
218870_tn?1240259255
what isnt questionable to eat in pregnancy?
Blank
177988_tn?1266802499
We could also be the one in a million person who walks out of our house and gets hit by a meteor.  I usually try not to get too into these debates but really, our country regulates our food rather closely.  Of course there is a chance we eat something bad, there is also a chance there are contaminants in teh water we bathe in and a chance that our child will be allergic to a bee.  We just can't live comfortably with this sort of worry.  Tator, I highly reccomend the #6 vegetarian sandwich, not because there is no meat but because it's soooo good!  And if on Friday you want that Turkey Tom, I'd go for it if I were you.  :)
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
kj , I couldn't agree more!
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
right on the money!
Blank
218870_tn?1240259255
every night when you turn on the news there is a new food threat.  right now botchalism(sp?) is in a ton of cans of green beans.  the next rebuttal...eat fresh stuff.......what about the spinach scare not long ago?  i dont know how much i believe in luck, or everything happens for a reason, but if it isnt one thing it is another.  we can never protect ourselves or our children from everything.  there have been so many contravercial issues on here lately like circumcision, buying american that really shouldnt be such an issue, to each his own...maybe we should be concentrating on how we are going to teach our children tolerance and acceptance.  (not that i have much room to talk...ill be the first to give an opinion...i guess that is something i need to work on myself.)
Blank
184342_tn?1282592350
Wow...  I really didn't mean to start all of that...  I am fairly non-confrontational, except for at work or if I am buying something and the sales person is rude...  but I like this forum, and I am sorry if any of you got hurt in any conversation related to my question...  it was really just a question.  I have to say after reading this, I am not going to worry if I do decide to have a ham sandwich, but peek is kinda right too... and I don't live my life afraid of everything and I let my kid eat food off of the ground sometimes...  but I too have suffered miscarriages, so I do want to be a little cautious...

Thanks for all of your opinions...  and I will try the veggie one!!
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
With my first pregnancy and with this one I steared clear of fish, soft cheese and lunch meats.
My in laws would of course always give me a hard time, and the good old saying "We never worried about that when we had kids".
Well here is my theory on food nowadays as opposed to 20, 30 40 even 50 yrs ago.
Alot of what we eat nowdays is processed and genetically modified. They have figured out ways to make things cheaply to feed the growing planet.
Yrs. ago people most likely tended to eat more "whole" foods.
Why do you think it is so many people are getting smart and grocery stores are popping up appealing to this idea of whole organic foods.
Yes I think there is more of a threat to pregnant woman and what they eat more than there ever has been.
One example of this food process is soy. Well everyone thinks soy is god cause Asians eat it. Well the soy we eat is NOT the same it is genetically modified  and is put in almost everything. Well anything that is not natural and you get to much of is not good for you. If you buys some items at health food stores they will have on there sometime non GMO soy.

Nitrates in meat is used to preserve it. Soft cheese if were fresh on the farm may not be as hazardous, but its not fresh from the farm its been shipped and been sitting.

I think if we are told something we should take it to heart and try and eat the best we can. Even if were not pregnant. If more people ate whole foods I think we would all be a healthier country.  

Blank
Avatar_f_tn
I like toasted sandwiches so I heat my ham or turkey first does that take care of anything?
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
No the nitrates are in there regardless.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
I will answer my own question after looking it up they say to heat it till it steams that takes care or the listeria
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
but they also say you can find listeria on veggies and some proccessed foods. In recent years, the level of nitrates contained in processed foods has decreased, and is considered safe for pregnant women. In fact, nitrates are used as a preservative in meats, often making the meat safer than it would be otherwise, from a bacterial safety standpoint. However, I would suggest that you avoid them whenever possible, as foods containing nitrates, such as preserved meats like hot dogs and bacon, are not good nutritional choices for pregnant women because of their high sodium and fat content
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
I think the listeria concern comes from the soft cheese? Not the lunch meat.
The problem with the nitrates is that it can affect the deveoping fetus brain.
So they are two totally seperate things that can happen.

When you get listeria you may start to bleed and miscarry. A real obvious affect.

The nitrates will probably not make you sick in any way, but will affect the fetus.

Of course there can be bacteria in ANY meat you eat.
Blank
93532_tn?1349374050
Listeria is a concern in both lunchmeat and soft cheeses. That being said, there are some "soft" cheeses made int eh US that actually go through pasteurization. Probably not as good as fancy french versions, but safe to eat.

Consider it as one of the few things you know enough to avoid. For years our mothers and grandmothers had no idea and the infant mortality rate was much higher. We know more now, why not use it.

Our food supply is anything but perfectly safe. Common sense and apparently a little bubble wrap will go a long way.

Blank
220217_tn?1209683277
I am jealous - I used to live in California and I only ate In -N- Out Burger!!!!  Double Double w/cheese, chili cheese fries and a chocolate shake!!!!  I miss it so bad.  We are leaving for Vegas on Friday morning for my husband's pool tournament.  I don't really care about the pool tournament - I'm going for the In -N- Out Burger!!  :)  Don't tell my husband that though.

As for lunch meat - I eat Subway all the time.  My doctor said it was fine - like it said above - I think the danger is more for those whose immune systems are damaged in someway.  

To each his own though - do what's right for you, yourself and your baby(ies).
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
Suprise baby-you can be so rude and mean. I thought you were gone for good last time after you reemed me out for not believing in circ., and here you are back being mean to ppl again...honestly, what do you have against perty? I don't get you at all....It seems all you have time to do when you are on here is pick at people needlessly. grow up.
Blank
93532_tn?1349374050
Bops-Don't you know, she hates it when people are rude to others. Ironic, eh?

I always find it funny where people will draw their lines. The same people who see nothing wrong with drinking wine while pg will draw the line at tylenol. Some will smoke and draw the line at hotdogs. Others will avoid nearly everything, but then eat sushi once a week. Perhaps nothing will happen but I could not live with myself if something did happen and I was left to wonder if something I did caused it. I went through that constantly with my oldest. As a result of the sexual assault I was suffering from PTSD and anxiety attacks. When I got pg with Jonathan I was on some heavy meds. As soon as I got my BFP, I quit cold turkey (bad bad thing) and when he was born with a VSD, I wondered and cried over whether or not the meds harmed him.

Never underestimate how much pregnancy impacts your immune system. I rarely get sick, but you can bet good money I will suffer when I am pg from every ailment that passes by ; )
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
Surprisebaby simply has to be right, all the time.  She can't entertain the idea that others may disagree with her.  She has no capacity to graciously disagree.  
Blank
93532_tn?1349374050
I think we must now change the "I heart Peek" shirts to "I fear Peek" shirt. Apparently she likes to scare the heck out of pg women for the sheer joy of it.

I tell you, I am going to start actually making these shirts. The I fear peek will only come in maternity, while the rest will be regular. Perhaps Ishould make some that are compatible with nursing so mum can quit offending passersby with her breast,
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
Remember the toxic dye, Andi.

Hey, I went to the store, got everything I need for spaghetti tonight but forgot...the spaghetti.  
*kics self vigorously*

I swear I go to the store every 5 minutes.  
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
PEEK FOR PRES!   or   peek is tops! hahaha.  surprise baby loves to fight me.  whatever, she needs meds.
Blank
127529_tn?1331844380
I'm laughing so loud at my computer secren, and my neighbour has just spotted me, he must think I am bonkers!
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
S.B will not be ordering any T shirts.  Well, maybe the I HATE PEEK ones.  We'll have to add a line of PK t-shirts, too.  
Blank
93532_tn?1349374050
I will use a non-toxic dye. Made in the USA, remember?

I am not surprised. That warm feeling must have distracted you ; ) The chicken crockpot thing smells tasty ; ) I added some taco bell mild seasoning sauce to it for a little more flavor.
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
Um, Andi...the T shirt material comes from China.  

Is the chicken/sauce pink?  
Blank
93532_tn?1349374050
It will be once i add the cream cheese.

No, my shirts are only made in the USA. As for the labor force, I cannot vouch for that. I'll grow the cotton myself if i have to  ; )
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
Ok, I really have to go to bed. I have some challenging night time cable systems to install tonight.  It will be interesting.  
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
LOL, you guys are the best...for once in a few dull, dark days, I really feel as if my spirits and mood have lifted!

I'll have a peek maternity t-shirt please...and a nursing one too... Maybe they could have the little boob flaps that fold down for easy 'flop out'. That would bring new meaning (and self explanation) when ppl ask me, what does "I heart Peek" mean? lol...

as for SB, It is sadly obvious why she chooses to pop in now and again, but hypocrites and meanies really bum me out, hehehe...
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
Lovethebops....NEVER did I REEM you for not believing in circ.  YOU WERE The one who said we COULD NEVER BE FRIENDS BECAUSE YOU DON"T BELEIVE IN IT!!!   I was waiting for you to join in, and stand up for your little buddy....aahhhh..did I pick on Perty so much she cried to you on MYSPACE?
and talk about looking for attention lovethebops??????? "Unhappy and I need some support!"  wah...you grow up!  
PEEK- I agreed with you on this post???  
ANDIJ- I don't care what people do or don't do, they can breastfeed or bottlefeed, I don't find it necessary to make them feel guilty for the decisions they make. (unlike yourself)
Pertykitty-I thought you didn't have time for this????  I knew you did!!!  muuuuaaahhhh
Blank
93532_tn?1349374050
I'll have to come up with a creative way to add flaps. Maybe when one flap is down it says "I heart peek" and when the other is down is says "I fear peek"

And i suppose despite my apparent hate for bottle feeders, I should make some with bottle pockets. Perhaps those should say 'I hate Andi because she hates me"

Blank
Avatar_f_tn
I didn't ever say we 'couldn't be friends'..I joking said I guess we will never see eye to eye, since I wouldn't circ my kid. You took it the wrong way because you wanted to start something...sorry that is not why I come here...Sadly it is obvious why you do. I didn't post my post in the need for seeking attn...I was looking for support and suggestions, which I nicely/thankfully recieved. I really don't have the time to argue. I am making a nice three bean italian soup, and I would hate for it to bubble over...you see, some of us do have lives outside of Medhelp, contrary to what you think. So go ahead and be bitter and mean to ppl, you are just sad and bitter and mean for god knows why. And have some serious issues communicating with women...really, I feel bad for you. It is obvious you are not ok...find some nice meds...happy pills, Yeah!!

Hands up...I surrender...you win!
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
I can just picture those funky shirts now! I would be sporting one of each every other day...

Blank
Avatar_f_tn
Plus, I don't even need to deal w/ circ anyways...I am having another girl! silliness...
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
sb you are stalking bops on myspace?? i dont do myspace so sorry you are wrong. bops if your account is set to private, then did you get conned into adding sb? who is she pretending to be??
i do have time today, yest. i didnt.  now i am going to go and watch a movie and relax, cream cheese? chicken? andi ill be right over!!    really muuuaaahhh?
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
No, my profile is set to private...so she couldn't get past the initial page anyways...She must have just seen the other posts or she is posing as someone else...I'll have to go back and check to make sure I l know who is who...she is sorta creepy like that though..

And I didn't do myspace either, up till 3 days ago.

I had my 3 bean soup for dinner(thankfully It didn't burn away as I wasted the time to even post anything back) and it was yummy! but the spaghetti sounds good too...ooh chicken spaghetti sounds even better...my mom used to make really good chicken spaghetti.

What movie you plan on watching?? I was thinking of popping in my Grease dvd...I could used some singing and dancing!
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
I didn't agree with you at all.  said I've never seen it, and that "probably" you could eat lunch meat and soft cheeses and everything would be fine.  

If "probably" is good enough for you, then enjoy your deli-meats and brie while pregnant.  If you are one of the 2500 people who get Listeria every year, or one of the 500 who die from it every year, hey...you'll always have the memory of that delicious sandwich.  

The CDC says that 27% of the people who are sickened with Listeria or die from it are pregnant women.  

Blank
93532_tn?1349374050
I have had some damn fine sandwiches in my life, but none good enough to die for ; )

The chicken is falling apart, the aroma is divine!! T-minus 20 minutes and counting until John gets home and we eat. I am still cursing him for using all the flour tortillas! These would have made great wraps! Oh well, served with a side of rice will have to do.

Myspace, huh? I think I am too old for MySpace. Either that or I just don't care enough to set one up. My little brother has gone bananas on his, I check every so often to see if he has added pics of my kids from his visits here. Other than that, I just feel old when I look.
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
I can't wait to hear how it was.  
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
Yeah, that is what I thought too..but I have caught up w/ a few friends from HS, so that is nice. Also It was nice to put some faces to names of some of the friends I have made on here...I don't do all that blinky, glittery stuff though, it hurts my eyes! funny, My little bro keeps his hidden, I have no idea what his looks like...he is a bit estranged right now anyway.

I made the best chicken burritos last night...wow I eat a lot of beans..maybe all the gas from them is making me so unhappy and ''in need of attention''...sheesh.

I don't care much for lunch meat anywho, so I guess I don't have to worry, now and then I'll want a club or something...maybe a potentially deadly disease would do some ppl good.. maybe then they will take the potential risk seriously. It is a possibility that is there, whether or not ppl want to blow it off or not is their ignorance...and there is no shortage of that around here lately!
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
my dh is from ohio, seems to be the chili capitol lol and he puts his chili on spaghetti!  its good, but in california its on a potatoe or a hot dog lol.  he makes a great enchilada with chicken and cream cheese and chilis. he uses flour tortillas and green sauce,,,when he comes home he is going to have to cook for me!!!   bops i eat lots of beans too, it doesnt matter what kind, must be a girl thing.

my heartburn is killing me todayand the past 3 days i burp more than any nasty man i have ever known lol.  kinda embarressing really  lol.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
Yes!! My heartburn has beenkilling me too! I just ran out of tums tonight! Speaking of going into a store and forgetting what  you went in to get, I went to Walmart today to get some more tums and diapers, and left forgetting the tums completely..I knew I was going to run out, that is why I went in the first place...I just drank a buch of water and that make my heartburn worse as well!  sometimes it burns so bad, I feel like Ican't breath...ahh, I love it all though! Its only going to get better...I can't wait to start peeing my pants when my baby's head starts using my bladder as a throw pillow:)

I'll tell you though, besides all the beans and the daily bowl of shredded wheat I eat in the morning, I have had no problem w/ constipation in pregnancy, lol! Nasty but true!
Blank
93532_tn?1349374050
The dinner was DIVINE!!! Thanks, peek for the recipe! I didn't mind being your guinea pig at all. I actually just finished a second helping as my snack this evening. I used mild black bean and corn salsa and CJ even partook in a few black beans and some rice.

When I was pg with Jonathan, they had this awesome antacid called Surpass. It was a gum and it worked wonders!!
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
lol i eat double fiber bread, raisin bran, beans.  ive only had a day or two that i had a problem, im a pretty regular gal thank goodness!  yes peeing pants, that is always fun. who wrote about that recently? was it anxious?  i have childrens malox, can you take that? i never remember tums either.  i ALWAYS leave the store without the main thing i went for  oh well.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
another site for pgers i go to has me so disturbed. the girls on there are so young and feel nothing will happen to them.  riding rollercoasters, living off hohos or fries, this , that.  its not just doing one, its the multiple things over and over and i will probably be jumped  for opening my mouth.  i did it very nicely, i know how it can be misinterpreted. they are probably the same moms i will see at the fair this year out till midnight and running around like they arent parents.  maybe its a pregnancy thing right now, but i think so many dont realize that sometimes you have to make a few sacrifices when your a mom.  i dont mean give up who you are, i mean get a sitter when you go to that kegger party, or wait till the baby is born before you hit up a six flaggs.  maybe its just me.  and no its not me thinking im better sb, its me worried for those poor babies.
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
pertykitty-I agree about rollercoasters...but being a passenger on a motorcycle is not ACTUALLY PHYSICALLY going to hurt the baby...the ride itself won't hurt the baby, no different than sitting in a car, the only difference is the outcome of an accident (maybe).  I get that,  but, IMO you can't live your life in a bubble, and as for LUNCH MEAT, TUNA, RED MEAT, SOFT CHEESE, DRINKING WATER, everytime you turn on the news it is something new to stay away from.  If you chose to hibernate for your 9months, go for it, I am just saying that people shouldn't be made to feel guilty for chosing to continuing to live while pregnant.  I have a really good friend who had a "MIRACLE" baby last year after 10+years of trying and MULTIPLE MULTIPLE MISCARRIAGES (I am talking 15+), doctors told her she would NEVER  ever have a baby.  Even though she wanted nothing more than her baby, she was horseback riding throughout her pregnancy, (probably because she was in denial that she was actually having a baby this time)  EVEN I thought that was CRAZY for her to be horseback riding, but who am I to judge what she is doing???  If she is comfortable doing it, let her do it.  As for the smoking pot, notice I stayed out of that thread (and I didnt' even comment on you calling the OP a TROLL...) because I have nothing nice to offer her.   I noticed that some people, who had confessed to smoking cigs while pregnant, were right down that girls throat, but, MJ is a NATURAL drug, where cigs are full of arsonic, tar, and god knows what else.  and when someone posts the same question about cigs, I have noticed how supportive you are,  telling them to try and quit and NOT calling them TROLLS!!!!
I agree they shouldn't be smoking or drinking ANYTHING, during my 1st 2 pregnancies, I had 0 tolerance for alcohol, medication or cigs, unfortunately  WITH my surprise baby, I was on tylenol #3 for my whole pregnancy but even still, my baby is perfectly healthy.

Lovethebops-your comment about circ was in a different thread all together, it wasn't even in a "CIRC" thread, it came out of nowhere, I was defending myself.  You attacked me 1st,  that was my first conversation with YOU! If you would like, I would gladly find the thread and direct everyone to it....There was no joke, maybe you intended it as such, but, I have a GREAT sense of humour, and it was not taken as such.

peekawho-I don't hate you, I don't hate anyone, please send me a I heart/hate Peek!!! Then depending on the day, I can cover whichever one I feel like.  Yes, you did agree with me, a sandwich "PROBABLY"  won't kill me.  and you said it yourself, you have never seen a case of it. (so it's like getting hit by a bolt of lightning)

Pertykitty-I really don't hate you either, and no, I am not stalking "BOPS" on myspace, I saw her post earlier.

Ladies- I know you are all buddies, I watched your friendship develop on here BOPS and Pertykitty, I think that is great.  

Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
From Peek's post about Listeria- she quoted  approximately 2500 people get listeria in the US in a year, and approx. 500 people die and 27% are pregnant ( works out to be 675 pregnant women get listeria and 135 pregnant women die)
well there are 301 139 947 people  (APPROX. as of July 2007) in the US, and the odds of getting struck by lightening are 576 000 to 1, to therefore that is approximately 523 people each year get struck by lightening in the US.
so the odds of getting struck by lightening are almost as great as the TOTAL amount of people who will contract listeria and the TOTAL amount of people who are killed by listeria (500) is less than the amount of people who will be struck by lightening (523)
So, my thoughts are if you are craving lunch meat , ENJOY, just don't eat it in a Lightening storm because you could DOUBLE your risk of DEATH.  
Blank
184342_tn?1282592350
I have to say...  i have been a little stressed out at some of the back and forth about this topic on here...  but THAT was pretty funny!  Your last sentence...  while I agree with you on that item-  eating lunch meat is something that you can control completely-  while getting hit by lightening is something that you can't really contol all that much-  I wouldn't judge a person for eating lunch meat after this, but I think it will be a personal decision for me at this point, and I probably will steer clear for the next 5 months!  Although, if I were going to consider Jimmy Johns today for lunch, I probably won't now, it is raining pretty hard here-  the "tropical storm erin" has hit!!  :)  THAT was very funny!
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
LOL...yes it was!  Caution !  Extreme caution!  Stay away from Tropical Storm  ERIN!  Don't even get me started on those Stats! LOL
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
Oh, for heavens sake, you are so obnoxious...come off your yourself...that is not up for debate. I'm done....You are just so silly!

I don't care if you didn't take it as joke, that is how I ment it..take it or leave and move on....
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
And once again, like I said I don't have to deal w/ circumsion anyways..I have girls...get over the circ deal....

you need to learn how to put a period at the end of a sentence and move on to bigger and better things....I don't even know how many MONTHS ago that stupid comment was...I just have to learn to not say anything to you. It really is such a small deal. I don't understand why it is so huge to you. move on!
Blank
108334_tn?1253647995
I think everything is huge to her.
Blank
Avatar_n_tn
Man there are some raging hormones on this website.lol
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
its not raging hormones, its a particular poster that likes to show up from time to time and start arguments.  it gets very tiring tomel.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
you are right!

seems to take the whole "mountain out of a molehill' expression to new extremes!

I feel for bitter, angry ppl....It is obvious they have some serious problems bugging them! it is very tiring when ppl act this way....Hormones aside!
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
Oh, I just noticed the u/s pic! You got some really nice, clear shots!
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
isnt she cute! lol.  i put that pic up the other day, i was wondering if anyone would notice.
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
lovethebops- i thought you were done with me YESTERDAY??? Why are u still ranting???  Shut up already!!!
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
from this thread.....quote from LOVETHEBOPS--Suprise baby-you can be so rude and mean. I thought you were gone for good last time after you reemed me out for not believing in circ., and here you are back being mean to ppl

I was defending myself for the outburst from "you" about CIRC again! You brought it up, not me, you haven't let it go, not me, so.. You should practise what you preach and not be so bitter!!! Let it go.....
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
not that it matters, but it was brought to my attention that i reemed someone out for their opinion on circumcision...never happened, i actually feel very strongly that this is a personal decision. (period , end of story) here's the thread...
Blank
184342_tn?1282592350
Lets all just have a ham sandwich and try to get along!  :)

All the fighting is too stressful for all of us who are expecting... which is most of us!  From reading these posts it does seem as though perty and lovethebops are being fairly light hearted about it...  I think we should only post things that are friendly to each other...  I do think that it is nasty to say things to intentionally hurt others, and it seems like surprise likes to do that-  your husband being gone for military while you are expecting is a very difficult thing, and we are here to be supportive of each other, not hurtful to each other...  lets try to only post things that will build others up...  not make them feel bad or stupid...  please...  I should have never asked about stupid lunch meat!!  
Blank
108334_tn?1253647995
And you thought it was a harmless question....     : )
Blank
184342_tn?1282592350
no kidding... this is stressing me out more then worrying about listeria!
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
more danger of dying from stress too!  
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
YEs-it is very sad that ppl are so messed up that they feel the need to drudge up things from so long ago...Honestly, I can't even remember what was said and frankly, it does not matter (basically it is similar to all the news stations that bring up previous past comments/interviews w/ Pres. Bush in the beginning of his term when he swore up an down there would be no war in Iraq...what does that matter now..Are we not there now?? Obviously those previous comments he made don't really matter now, do they?) ....nothing I even said was that bad for petey's sake! I just said "I guess we will never see eye to eye"... I didn't say anything horrible, and I'm sure if anyone saw the post from SO LONG AGO,  they would hardly think it a big deal either...For crying out oud, she'd have you think I or anyone else called her a @#$%%#@$*!@(*()), which is simply untrue...It really is not a big deal, you honeslty need to move on...It is such a non-issue.  I really can't believe how silly you are acting, if you "practiced"(learn to spell) what you preach, this post wuld have ended 2 days ago and you never would have bashed Perty for no reason)...you see I am light hearted, and I don't take any of this personally or seriously. I feel so sad for you, you have some issues that need addressing outside of this forum, which you fail to address. That is not my problem though. There is no talking/reasoning/playing nice w/ you. How sad since we all have so much to offer one another! I feel bad for those of you out ther that fail to find the positive side of this great sight! For the ladies that have been a positive force here, I truley appreciate your input, and it has been a pleasure!

Blank
Avatar_f_tn
So SB, insert your comment here- I'll let you have the last word, since that is clearly all you want. Good bye ladies, this thread is dead to me!
Blank
108334_tn?1253647995
But we will miss you- at least I will- Good job! She must have the last word...even if its over something as ridiculous as a turkey sandwich!

~gets out of the way for more poo slinging~
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
lovethebops....I live in Canada and Practise when it is a VERB...which it was...is spelled correctly, but thanks for the spelling lesson, but WULD (as you spelled it, is actually, "WOULD")  don't try and think you are better than me, cause you aren't.  Keep telling yourself that it is Surprisebaby with the issues then look in the mirror, I repeat "YOU" are the one that brought up the OH SO LONG AGO ISSUE of circumcision, not me (for the 2nd time you brought it up, so it "IS" an issue to you, it's not to me, it is personal! ) Stop trying to start something with ME!  
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
BTW you weren't even a member when PERTYKITTY was known as siren of the sea, or Sailor's Wife and  was obnoxious and REMOVED from MEDHELP!
so don't think she is the innocent victim here!
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
trying to make me some enemies are ya?  lol  sure i said a few things back yonder under a different name, i think it is funny you remember so well.  i dont even remember some of my favorites old names.  do you keep  a log book?  i told people the way it was bops, some people need that, i have calmed down a bit, i realized that stupid people will remain stupid people no matter what is said ;)
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
by the way, you are out of straws here.
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
So, ladies....that was the last word, once again brought to you by our northern neighbor.  

Stay tuned for next weeks edition of "As The World Turns Around Surprise Baby", brought to you by Citizens Against The Use Of Bubble Wrap During Pregnancy and/or Childhood.

Next week, we will feature a lively discussion of Huggies vs Pampers.  I can't personally wait to hear her views on that.  
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
EXACTLY!  
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
would you all like for me to change my name so you won't have a clue who it is????  I can put on my game face real well, and you'll be eating candy out of my hand in no time! LOL (but I have enough friends in the REAL world, this is just cyberland!)
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
If you painted dog poo pink, and handed it out like candy, I think most people would still recognize it.

Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
not a chance,...is that a DARE????  LMAO
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
You know, for someone with so many friends and such a busy, full life, you're on a lot these days.  

I, on the other hand, have no life, as everyone knows.  What's your excuse?
Blank
172023_tn?1334675884
Gotta go get ready for work, kids.  Enjoyed it!
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
never said i had a "BUSY FULL LIFE", hmmmm..not sure where you got that one?  as for the friends, we all have other commitments,  can't spend every waking hour with them, nor do I on here, I happen to be on here right now, and check my emails from time to time, and while I am at it, I pop back in here!    There are days that go by that you will go through SURPRISEBABY withdrawal, and others that you will go through OVERLOAD!  I don't understand why you think you own this forum???  I am not allowed to defend myself, In this thread alone, Pertykitty has and so has Lovethebops, but, NOT ME?   I know I am not innocent, never said I was, but, I should be allowed to explain myself without being judged on the way that I "SPELL" for crying out loud!!!!!!!  That's just immature (and bops was correcting me wrong, which was actually FUNNIER! and showing how stupid she really is!!!!!)  When I type, my fingers just go, so I am bound to make typos from time to time, as everyone is, but that one wasn't, and she had to make a scene about it...DUH!!!
I am entitled to my opinion, and IMO this is a DUMB thing to worry about, there are wars being fought, babies dying, and we are going to worry about a small percentage (less than 2% chance) of dying from something we eat!  Worry about what you want, have a heart attack from all the stress you are creating, I don't really care.
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
sb you are making a fool out of yourself at this point.  stomping your feet and putting your hands on your ears.  you dont defend yourself, you pick on others and try to make people side with you but against me.  your little private log states you want to stick up for the weak, when you are the weak one  commiting random acts of stupidity.  i was pleasantly pleased when you were gone for  a bit of time. do you get up and pace and steam after you read the next post?  seriously i think you need to be diagnosed.

peek once again you have said the funniest thing on medhelp today!!
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
you wish! I don't give a rat's   A S S about you or your little fan club you have here.  I am entitled to my opinions, and I will share them as I see fit and NOT you or anyone else will bully me into your beliefs!  If YOU  want to have a temper tantrum,because I am not going away, that's fine, no one is stomping their feet here, I thought I didn't get to you cause you were STRONGER than me and you didn't care about me???   I can see how much I "Don't get to you!"   Just because you get all steamed up by my comments  to you doesn't mean that I care about yours.  I really don't! But you insist on having the last word, so go ahead and reply, and maybe, just maybe, I'll let you have it!!!! LOL  Goodbye! muaaah!
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
im not steamed, lol, i am playing your little game.  you are screaming at me, im calm cool and collected.  i dont have a fan club, if i did i could charge dues and then id be rich!!
Blank
108334_tn?1253647995
how much are the dues?
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
Ah, it's ok, you don't have to explain yourself to me...I understand completely.

Was anyone else reminded of that old Spin Doctor's hit, "Little Miss Can't Be Wrong?"...If we had theme songs on here that played everytime we posted, I know who that would be perfect for! lol...
Blank
150937_tn?1235947480
i thought you were done with this thread....still want to put in your 2 cents...last word is yours, go 4 it, u know u can't help yourself.  btw, you should practise what you preach (learn to spell is what u told me right? ) ...dis"c"usting is actually dis"g"usting!  and there are numerous other spelling mistakes in other posts that most GROWNUPS overlook, you are a real piece of work sunshine....duh!
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
Grow up...
Blank
Avatar_f_tn
bops you are much more mature at 23 than she is at 33.
Blank
212720_tn?1304379015
Luv Babies sent me an e-mail about this thread so I had to check it out. It took me so long to get here as I was feeding Quinn moldy cheese and spoiled lunch meat.

Sarcasm..... of course!!
Blank
108334_tn?1253647995
Maybe you need some bubble wrap sent your way...
Blank
212720_tn?1304379015
Maybe, I could wrap Quinn in it after she eats her moldy cheese and spoiled lunch meat.
Blank
108334_tn?1253647995
Well, I guess if you were into the bubble wrap thing, Quinn wouldn't be eating homemade bleu cheese and rotting meat. Hmmmm...I think I need to plan an intervention.
Blank
212720_tn?1304379015
Bring it on. When you come I will prepare you a nice big lunch meat sandwich.
Blank
108334_tn?1253647995
With cheese?
Blank
212720_tn?1304379015
Of course.... I guess I better swat the flies off of it.
Blank
108334_tn?1253647995
Nah, extra protein is good for fetuses.
Blank
Post a Comment
To
Blank
Weight Tracker
Weight Tracker
Start Tracking Now
Maternal & Child Community Resources
RSS Expert Activity
242532_tn?1269553979
Blank
Emotional Eating Control: How to St...
Aug 28 by Roger Gould, M.D.Blank
233488_tn?1310696703
Blank
New Cannabis Article from NORTH Mag...
Jul 20 by John C Hagan III, MD, FACS, FAAOBlank
242532_tn?1269553979
Blank
3 Reasons Why You are Still Binge E...
Jul 14 by Roger Gould, M.D.Blank
Top Children's Health Answerers
134578_tn?1404951303
Blank
AnnieBrooke
OR
13167_tn?1327197724
Blank
RockRose
Austin, TX
4268628_tn?1375044776
Blank
Flickan
Monroe, WA
Avatar_f_tn
Blank
arlandonbloom
CO
Avatar_f_tn
Blank
Bsmom09
4851940_tn?1385441629
Blank
jemma116
United Kingdom