What's so wrong about a med that works ???

[SBoat]

I guess I'm writing for opinion or validation. I have an anxiety disorder. I have been treated for about 9 months with Klonopin. I currently take .125mg two to three times a day for a total of no more that .375mg daily. When I initially went on it, I researched. I found ALOT of negative information and decided it was going to ruin my life and I had to get off of it. Well, the "ruining" happened when I SLOWLY tapered from an initial .5 mg total to nothing. Did the tapering correctly. Have been in therapy... all the recovery things to do. Well, I felt awful after getting off. I went back on and have done well. I feel functional and it keeps me "normal". It IMPROVES the quality of my life. I feel issues with "addiction" are not present for me... I don't eat them like breath mints and have no "seeking" behavior. I simply take it on a routine daily... sometimes do skip a dose !!! Phyical dependence is there, I'm sure. I tried SSRI's with terrible results, they were my first line of treatment. Klonopin came after that. I do well on this. The dosage is low. I equate it with a person who does all the right things for a body aliment and still has to use medication (B/P, lower cholestrol...etc). I get overwhelmed by all the negativity. I do still struggle with conflict over using it at times. I know there are issues. I know some persons should not use benzo. It works for me right now and it's been a while !!!!! I guess I want to know... What's so wrong with that ?????

[Roger Gould, M.D.]

Personally, and professionally, I don't see anything wrong with what you are doing.  It is certain that some people have side effects( you don't) and some people over use it like an addiction( you don't).  As long as you are functioning well and facing the problems in your life as they come up, there is nothing wrong with what you are doing.

[shubunkin]

I too atke benzo's. I take Xanax .25 mg 3 times a day. I was taking .5/ 3 times a day. I myself do not want to be addicted to this the rest of my life, that is why I am cutting. But if it improves the quality of your life that much then I personally do not see a problem. The only problem I see is that in the future youo may have to keep uping your dose because the dose you are at does not work anymore. At least I know that is how it is with Xanax. It is NOT easy quitting. You have to be TOTALLY dedicated to doing so. But from what I have read they are reatively safe if used correctly and I do not think anyone should have to live a life of hell if they help them that much. Good luck in whatever decision you make and remember, you do not have to justify you taking this drug to anyone! If it helps you that much and you are under doctors care and do not abuse it then you should think of what YOU really want to do. I know myself it is hard to think that someone may "label" you as an addict as I ahve done myself. I want to be strong enough to live without these drugs. But it is hard! God Bless! Danielle

[SBoat]

Thanks for the kind words of encouragement. I needed to hear them !!! I really do well on my current plan. So, for right now.. "Stay the Course" is the motto... and stay away from negative influences. Fortunately, I have a "Benzo-supportive" doctor. I do respect everyone right to do what is best for them and make knowledge based decisions individual to them. If you have an anxiety disorder, I really believe it is all about "management" and balance, not a true "cure". I wish there was a cure, but I simply do not think it exists for me. Thankfully, good management does exist !!! And that's OK, I know I have learned alot about me and my ill utilized ways of coping at times. None of us will ever be free of stressors and strains that happen in our lives. If a little 1/4 of a pill 2 or 3 times a day helps me (along with other healthy interventions) then, I can make peace with that. God bless you all for your words of support !!!!

[lucylucy]

Hi there,

I have also had these dilemas, and have come to the conclusion that the benefits of taking my medication, paxil, outweigh by far any problems.

Its interesting, that over my worst phase of illness a few years ago i was needing 60mgs per day for a period of over a year or so, but now, I am able to do well on 20mg's per day and have managed this regime for about six months.  

I manage this medication with my doctor according to my needs, and have found that over the last six months, I can survive well on 20 miligrams, so its not necessarily that u need to constantly increase  the dosage over the years.

best of luck,
Peggy

[Skizo]

The best medications for your problems are the SSRI. Some times by begining with small doses and increasing slowly you can prevent side effect.

Did you try all SSRI?

Buspar (buspirone) could help you, alone or combined with benzo

[SBoat]

Yes, I tried EVERY ONE of them. I had a horrible time and alll my health suffered. Maybe a SSRI or other AD med or other atypical med is the answer for others, not for me. I have no desire to argue the issues with benzo's vs "other" meds. There is PLENTY of that information to be found !!!! I have my own opinions about the advertised lack of withdrawal, dependence, tolerance, etc.... with meds other than benzo's !!!! I respect the right of others to make that decision regarding the treatment they use. I hope all would feel that way !!!

[shubunkin]

Hello, I posted earlier about also taking benzo's. I take Xanax. Very low dose. You are exactly right. Nobody knows what works for you, but you. I also take Paxil which has done wonders for me in the over compulsive, social anxiety department but I can not say it has improved my regular anxiety much where the Xanax has made a world of difference. But like I said, I am trying to quit but if it helps you that well then stay on it. You do not need anyone's justification. From what I have read as many people have trouble trying to stop the SRI's than they do from the Benzo's so it is what works for you. Who knows I may end up staying on a low dose. If I do than so be it. If that is what it takes for me to lead a more normal life than o well. Life is to short, live it up. Danielle

[Skizo]

Richard42

There is nothing wrong with what you are doing. I know of people who had taken high doses of benzodiazepines for many months and then come down to minimal doses. Anyway, if that keeps you functioning, who cares what(ignorant)people say?.

The SSRI are still the first line of treatment combined with cognitive therapy.

There is an art in prescribing and guiding the patient in the initial states of pharmacotherapy. I know of people that say that "nothing works for them" and a detailed review of past trials showed mistakes.

I don't doubt for a second that you had side effects and I agree that medication don't work the same with everybody.

Would you mind describing the adverse effects with the doses and kind of meds you were taking?

Only trying to help

skizo

[SBoat]

I was kinda having a "burnt toast" morning this morning and a little sensative, sorry if I came across a little strong. The story goes.... Prozac, Wellbutrin, Zoloft, Paxil : Very anxious, panic attacks -worse than ever, no sleep, severe sweats, nausea, no appetite, the ever fun diarrhea, no drive or motivation for anything, including sex and with Zoloft a 12 lb. weight loss in 2 weeks (didn't need to lose any weight). Not all with each, but several with each. I had 2-4 week trials with all and various dosings up and down. I simply couldn't tolerate it !! I couldn't work or engage in life while going through that !!!! I guess I haven't tried everything... I haven't done Celexa, Lexapro, or the MAOI's or Tricyclics. I was scared to try anything else. Klonopin was introduced. Prehaps a combo would work and maybe would have, in hindsight, but what happened, happened. My main presentation is anxiety with panic. The mono therapy is working for me. Klonopin isn't prefect, it still sedates me at times and that sometimes contributes to lack of motivation. I don't consider this a depressive feeling, just lack of drive... which I had a little of prior to all the difficulties. I deal with this and am not going for a perfect life, just a good one. I really thank God, the Klonopin has never made me feel "high", just gets the anxiety down to a level at which I feel "normal" and I can function as a person. I do thank you for your support and didn't mean to offend if I did !!!

[SBoat]

P.S. Forgot to add Buspar to the "I've tried it" list

[Skizo]

Quite an ordeal. These medication can really screw things up.

Some time the old meds, like desipramine, in low doses work well for anxiety. SSRI are highly overrated and oversold, literally.

Since your problem seems to be with motivation and getting 'off the ground' for the day you may want talk with your doctor about Provigil (Modafinil. It was recently approved for patients with excessive somnolence, but is being used to help with with motivation which seem to be a problem that SSRI don't do too much about (Wellbutrin is suppose to help). I know some people whose life has been changed (for the better) by Provigil.

[SBoat]

Thanks for the info... I have noticed I can actually use weak caffeine (coffee) on occassion. It does seem to help get me vertical. It's still a bit of a "fine line" with "dosing" in terms of what alerts and what alerts too much !!! I had given caffeinated anything up entirely when the real anxiety, panic "meanies" were just awful ... what would be the difference in terms of a stim. like caffeine and the Provigil ??? Does it basically work the same ??? Thanks for your help !!!

[Skizo]

Provigil is not known to cause habituation and is devoid of the effects of cafeine on stomach, heart, breathing etc.

Some of the people I know who take it report a calming effect without sedation. What seems to be most commom is  increased in drive and motivation as well as improvement in cognitive functions (attention, concentration).

It is given up to 400 mg daily in divided doses. Most people take 100 once or twice daily

Some people concerned with possibility of initial anxiety is started with small doses of 50 mg.

I have seen it work nicely in those who after treatment with SSRI don't feel depressed anymore but can get off their couch.

[Skizo]

(correction)

I have seen it work nicely in those who after treatment with SSRI don't feel depressed anymore but can not get off their couch.

[moozie]

I feel the same way, I can't take SSRI's, I seem to be able to manage my anxiety with a very small dose of ativan.

I take .5mg to 1mg of ativan a day.  I had severe anxiety in the past and got well on ativan. I never abused it and I never had trouble getting off it either.

Everyone is telling me I NEED to take SSRI"s to get well. All I have to say about that is I'm still alive and I haven't taken any.

Thanks for making me feel like I can do without it.


Moozie

[SBoat]

My guess is you probably will opt not to answer this but... my observation is you are really knowledge about psychpharmacology and speak with a voice that rings with experience "in the field". I'm guessing you are in a practice of some sort in the mental health field or research ? Or is this a hobby you have ?? (insert smile) I do appreciate all the help. I am sorry I was a bit "blasting" in a previous posting. If you choose not to answer, I understand, but know your knowledge is appreciated. The Provigil is certainly worth a thought and a talk. Kinda got me to re-evaluate my situation,too... good job !!!

[Skizo]

Thanks

I am semiretired
Hobbies: Neurosciences, Psychopharm
         Researching Parapsychology (i am a skeptic)

[Skizo]

The reason that people may be telling you to try SSRI is that this medications cover a lot of ground: depression, anxiety, control of impulses, migraine, premenstrual tension, chronic pain etc.

Ativan is a long acting benzo that works only on anxiety and has some "addicting" potential. SSRIs do not.

Those cases in which people have a hard time stopping SSRI may be due to a too quick discontinuation (specially with Paxil) or
(more often)  the patient is in partial remission and actually needs longer treatment.

[Skizo]

Addendum



Another reason: There are cases of anxiety that are hard to treat until we realize that there is a subclinical, chronic depression in the background. Ativan won't do the trick.

[SBoat]

Interesting interests !! I'm fascinated by those subjects but fear developing whizzing over my head as the information went completely beyond me !!!  Thanks for answering.

[moozie]

I am wondering then, should I take Zoloft at a small doseage? I feel that I am not getting better, just like you said. I am just funtioning. I worried of the side effects of Zoloft like I had with the Paxil. It was a nightmare.

Would you give the zoloft a try ?


I'm really scared skizo !!

Please reply,


Thanks

[Skizo]

Although all the SSRIs work in similar way they do differ as to some of the adverse effects.

A few side effects are plain nasty, to anybody, but others depend on the particular situation.  Case in point: weight gain, loss of libido and delayed ejaculation (in particular the latter) may be welcome by some.

How much Paxil did you take and for how long?
Was the medication increased? And if so, how fast?
Which were the side effects?

People unable to take Paxil sometime tolerate Zoloft and vice versa.

But, remember, your physician is the only one who is (or should be) aware of all the dynamics in your case, including physical issues, that may be contributing to the problem.

[shamrock75]

Hello there. I was diagnosed w/severe panic/anxiety disorder, clinical depression and bipolar II back in October 02.  I was originally prescribed Paxil CR 12.5mg and Xanax .25mg (smallest doses available) by my General Practitioner.  The Paxil CR gave me diarrhea, nausea, shakes and headache. I think all it amplified my symptoms and added to the weight loss which I really did NOT need (I've always been a skinny person). He took me off Paxil CR and gave me Lexapro, which was less harsh, but still causing a little problem.  I finally went to a psychiatrist that took me off the SSRIs completely and perscribed me 100mg of Wellbutrin SR (an MAOI), increased the Xanax to 1mg per day (.25mg as needed up to 4 times a day), and added 300mg of Neurontin (an anti-convulsant also used w/depression cases).  Other than the increased drowsiness and clumsiness that comes with the Xanax, and maybe a day or two of stomach adjustment, this "cocktail" worked well.  I'm now up to 2mg of Xanax, 900mg of Neurontin and 200mg of Wellbutrin SR due to the severity of my case.  I, too, was/am concerned about addiction due to family history.  My therapist and psych both told me the people that are concerned about it usually do NOT get addicted..it's the ones that say they won't that do.  I, too, skip a dose of Xanax if I'm able too.

I can tell you this much, if I was at 1% functional at the beginning of my treatment I'm at about 75% now which is better than nothing (just gotta push myself out of bed sometimes).  Bi-weekly therapy sessions continue and my quality of life is getting back to normal.  I hope this gives you another point of view, and yes, you have the right to go with what works for you.

Good luck buddy!

[Kelp]

I have found reading this forum most interesting. It is quite unique that many (if  not all SSRI you have such serious side affects. I have almost total intolerance to tryciclics and have had awfull side affect with them but I respond usually quite fine with the SSRI with the exception of Zoloft. Also I cannot handle the so callled "Mood stabiliser" drugs so I know what it must be like. Regarding the benzos, they are a very effective group of drugs particularly Xanex. I take Xanex but unfortunately i have built up such a tolerane that it has very little affect except in large doses. My body seems to build up huge tolerances to just about everything. In reading this forum I have noticed a lot of drugs mentioned that I have never heard of namelyWellbutrin, Provogil,Buspar,Ativan,Lexapro and neurontin.I there anybody that can tell me a bit about these drugs and what group they belong to

[STARLA GRRRL]

Sorry, I can't answer any questions about what those medications are like, but I can answer your original line of questioning.
Why the negativity about meds in general? Probably because it is true that many of these drugs are horribly over-prescribed, and probably because it does tend to feel like these professionals are making money off of telling you that you are not okay the way you are, and in turn too many people end up suffering on these meds because they are not told the whole story. Also, medications are only SURFACE helpers, in that they do help the problem at hand...but they don't offer any permanent solutions...usually those have to come from therapy alone. A lot of people also have issues with the "quick fix" mentality.
What is so wrong about a med that works??? Nothing at all. If it works for you, and if you have done your own research, then nobody can really critisize you for your choices. I'm glad you are happy with what you have.

[woollielamb]

I have been on Zoloft 200 mg for about a year, for anxiety. Since I have been on it my cholestrol has doubled and is in the danger zone. My diet consists of high fibre absolutely no fast food or processed food. My diet consists of Fruits, veggies, grains, nuts, yoghert and very little red meat.A friend of mine who used to be a dietitian told me that zoloft will sometimes give you a fake high cholestrol reading. My doctor has me going through intesive liver testing and scanning, before he wants to give me cholestrol lowering drugs. What is your opinion on this.

[satellitesister]

I tried Paxil once and had a horrible experience years ago. Since then I've been diagnosed with anxiety and depression and was given Zoloft with a low occasional dose of Ativan if needed. This has worked wonders for me. I was on the Zoloft for about a year and thought I was ok and weaned myself off it. I was off for nearly a year and fell into the worst depression I think I've ever felt for about a week. I just wanted to die and didn't know why, it was horrible but I think I was sliding into it slowly for a while. Anyway the Zoloft has made a HUGE difference. It was originally given to me by a regular doctor who really didn't monitor me at all but now I'm going to see a psychiatrist to get monitored. All I can say is the two weeks of crappy side effects (nervousness, upset stomach, trouble sleeping) were well worth the long-term effects and the Ativan helps me big time when I'm very anxious and struggling with impulse control.

[summg]

my goodness!! more adventures in tis drugged out society of ours(no offense--me too!)  Well, Zoloft pretty much saved my life... and I am thankful. But I am DONE with these CREEPY side affects and withdrawal!! YUCK-- go figure, not addictive, just don't try to get off it! I am just thankful to know these reactions weren't a brain tumor acting up, or cancer or what?? !  I am soooo bugged by the amount of people on the amount of drugs, and the amount being charged for these very ill-represented and undisclosed drugs!! What kind of place is this??!

[Jax77]

Hey guys,

I've been very interested in all your stories.  I am new to this world of depression and anxiety (lucky me) but it's so wonderful to know that I'm not alone.  I was recently put on Zoloft and had the WORST experiences of my life.  Not a good drug for me so I just decided to come off it.  This reason was probably because about a week ago I broke down with the worst panic attack and actually ended up in the ER.  They prescribed me Ativan (1mg as needed) and it has made me feel the closest to normal in a really long time.  I believe SSRI's work for some but I prefer benzo's any day of the week!  I'm a little (alot) worried about becoming addicted, but right now I'm taking it one day at a time and will cross that bridge if I ever get to that point.  Good luck to all of you!