Can you believe this?!?

[Fluffysmom]

To those of you that read my post about fuzzy brained dizziness and my physical therapist; this is the perfect follow-up.

I had my next appointment today.  I was a little nervous, but determined to have a good talk with M. and make sure that she understands how badly her last treatment affected me.

To begin with, when I was so fuzzy-headed after last week's appt., I'd written down the wrong time for today's appt., so had time t pick up my phone that I'd forgotten at home, go return my library books, and check out a new one.

I returned and checked in for my appt.  A short while later, a bunch of paramedics came in, gurney with a backboard and all.  I was called back to a room, and an assistant started to hook me up for E-stem.  Then one of the other therapists, S. came in, and said that M. was busy and she could get me started, and had me unhooked from the E-stem.  

I agreed, and explained how I felt after my last visit.  She said that it sounded like something in the treatment and irritated my nervous system, and she started some very gentle cranio-sacral treatment.

Knock on door; M. came in.  S. said, "I suppose you know that M. was busy with a difficult situation", I said "Oh, that was you that had the paramedics visiting".  M asked how I was, and I said "the question is, how are you?" as she seemed pretty shook up.

She turned to S. and said "the paramedics said that it didn't seem to be dislocated, but she can't move; she just can't move..." and started crying a little.  

She pulled herself together, S. left, and I explained (gently) what had gone on since I last saw her.

She immersed herself in helping me, and did a very good job of gently working on my neck and shoulders.  

I felt so bad for her.  I didn't want to say anymore about it, as I thought she would want to hold herself together until she could get home and cry on her husband's shoulder (he's a physical therapist at a different facility).

Stuff happens. My body has so many issues, there is no way that someone can work on it with only good results.  

I just hope that the person the paramedics took out is doing OK.  

I was going to joke about how I should have run when I saw the paramedics, but it really wasn't  a laughing matter, was it?  I think I'll think about how thankful I am that I can feel the pain in my back, my legs, etc.  I'll be thinking about how I hope this doesn't scare M. away from a job that she's very, very good at.

[Quixotic1]

Well there are dangers in manipulating the spine, especially.  I have absolute horror stories of things that chiropractor did to kids in my practice - inlcuding paralyzing one little guy with Down Syndrome.

You asked in a prior post about whether rolling your head around, even gently could exacerbate vertigo.  Absolutely yes.  There is a type of peripheral vertigo called Benign Positional Paroxysmal Vertigo that is very position sensitive.  Usually, but not always you will have an attack in the offending position.  But, there are other things like Heavy Cupola, where movement just makes everything worse.  My vertigo specialist's office staff said that they OFTEN had people describe that they felt like they head was detached from their body and floating around somewhere.

Could gently manipulation of the neck exacerbate a cervical lesion?  Yes and no, I would think.  This is an educated answer, but I cannot say it is the complete truth.  If there is a lesion that is pressed upon with neck movement, then you have a situation like L'Hermittes.  The problem you get with neck manipulation should be like the one with L'Hermittes.  A brief neuro sensation in the affected part of the body.  Would the sensation go on-and-on as if the lesion was injured more?  I wouldn't think so.  That typically doesn't happen with L'Hermittes.

It certainly could exacerbate some mechanical compression of a nerve in the neck.

You have a lesion in the pons.  That should not be affected by any gently manipulation of the neck.

Make sense?

Does anyone here get lasting problems (days and days) after a L'Hermitte's stimulation?

Quix

[Quixotic1]

I left out that rolling the head around could exacerbate central vertigo, too.  Just when someone had become accustomed to dealing with their normal movements, someone comes along and does movements they are not used too.  The whole system gets in a huff and you are left with not knowing exactly where you are in space.

Whether the vertigo is peripheral or central the effects can be very disabling - fatigue, visual fatigue, mental fog, unsteadiness in space...

Q

[PastorDan]

Re: the last post on central vertigo.  I think that's the whole idea behind the vestibular rehabilitation therapy that I just finished.  They told me it was meant to retrain my brain to deal with these sensations of being off balance as if they were normal.  Well, it didn't work for me, but in the meantime, I think it made the dizziness and the associated nausea worse.

[rendean]

My new (great) neuro and I were discussing my dizziness today. At the academic hospital where I go is a Dizziness Clinic designed to diagnose and rehab those with dizziness and vertigo problems. I went there a couple of years ago. They attributed my dizziness to migraine variant and said the UBOs were too round to be MS. Long story short, the majority of the dizziness slowly resolved and does rear it's ugly head on occasion. None of their treatments helped in the long run and today I got my tentative dx of MS, pending one more test to rule out Sjogren's. Neuro's Comment: if the situation doesn't fit their (dizzy specialists) criteria it's migraine, especially if it's not resolved.

You mentioned in another post you were going to  a new neuro. My advice, bid your time, don't toss your cookies in public(grosses too many people out) and see what the new guy has to say. Good luck!

[Fluffysmom]

S. gently pressed on the parietal ?; said that on the left side mine was stuck, as was the occipital.  After some gentle movement on each, the left side loosened up and the dizziness seemed to lighten up.

The pain I had after my last treatment, which I would have neck pain when I bent my head forward, made me think of L'Hermitte's, but the sensation down my back was more of a muscle tightness/pulling down my back.  It did clear up after a day or so, though my neck is still tender there.

The most tender spot is right above the vertebra that is almost totally filled with a hemangioma, though I've been told that isn't a problem.

That different type of vertigo is what was so strange, way beyond my usual dizziness.  Looking back, this is what my first episode of vertigo was like, back when I was a grocery checker.

If I keep having vertigo like that, I'll have to look into finding a good specialist; my otolaryngologist (sp?) just said he could do a test that would see if I get dizzy when he moved me around, but wouldn't show what caused it.  He prescribed some low-dose Xanax, which wasn't a lot of help.

Quix, thanks for the information; I appreciate it a great deal. I've been definitely "spaced out", and it was not a nice place to be.  It was difficult to find the right words to ask the questions that were floating around in my brain.  You sorted through it and gave me clear, easy to understand answers.

Pastor Dan, I'm sorry that the vestibular rehab wasn't helpful for you, that it made matters worse.  I hope you find something else that helps. I'll bet your sense of humor and faith help alot, right?  You sure have brought a lot of smiles to a lot of people on this forum.  Thank you.

Kathy