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High RBC's in Spinal Fluid
Hello everyone.
My neuro has pretty much ruled out MS although I have many symptoms.
He said my Lumbar Puncture was neg. That is good. But as I was looking at the
results and my RBC's were 15 the normal range is 0-12. I remember the tubes were clear.
He did not mention this. Kinda has me worrying till I can contact him when he gets back from
vacation mid Jan. I wish I had never had that test, I havent been the same since, even after the
blood patch.....still dizzy and weak.
Can anyone help with this?
Thank you
My neuro has pretty much ruled out MS although I have many symptoms.
He said my Lumbar Puncture was neg. That is good. But as I was looking at the
results and my RBC's were 15 the normal range is 0-12. I remember the tubes were clear.
He did not mention this. Kinda has me worrying till I can contact him when he gets back from
vacation mid Jan. I wish I had never had that test, I havent been the same since, even after the
blood patch.....still dizzy and weak.
Can anyone help with this?
Thank you
fudge makes the world go away.
New year.... new neuro I hope I can find a good one.
The only thing my neuro said about the white spots are that they are normal and most people my age (47) has them. It just dont seem normal to have that many that big. My symptoms dont go along with the test results. Well would like more info.
I dont always have symptoms, most of the time they go away for months or weeks.
not this time. neuro...."YOUR FIRED'.
There that felt good.
Have a great new year all.
New year.... new neuro I hope I can find a good one.
The only thing my neuro said about the white spots are that they are normal and most people my age (47) has them. It just dont seem normal to have that many that big. My symptoms dont go along with the test results. Well would like more info.
I dont always have symptoms, most of the time they go away for months or weeks.
not this time. neuro...."YOUR FIRED'.
There that felt good.
Have a great new year all.
I am looking for a new neuro, I have given up on this one. He has a baaaad bedside manner.
As I look further into my rather large file , I see so many things he did not bother to tell me. Like he didnt bother to disscuss the 17 lesions or as the record calls it (foci) if its not MS what could the lesions be. Can stress cause the white spots?
As I read so many of the other members comments I see that the neuros all approach things differently. errrr.
Think I'll go try to make some fudge,,,
Thank you for reading my story.
As I look further into my rather large file , I see so many things he did not bother to tell me. Like he didnt bother to disscuss the 17 lesions or as the record calls it (foci) if its not MS what could the lesions be. Can stress cause the white spots?
As I read so many of the other members comments I see that the neuros all approach things differently. errrr.
Think I'll go try to make some fudge,,,
Thank you for reading my story.
Hi Nissengirl,
As I read your symptoms here, all I keep thinking is you need another neuro. and you need to switch now.
Any doctor who wants to attribute your symptoms to stress, especially in light of the documented brain lesions you have, is not obviously approaching your diagnosis and care with an open mind.
You need to switch - find another doctor - preferably a neurologist who specializes in MS - and do it sooner rather than later.
good luck and stay in touch if we can be of help.
my best,
Lulu
As I read your symptoms here, all I keep thinking is you need another neuro. and you need to switch now.
Any doctor who wants to attribute your symptoms to stress, especially in light of the documented brain lesions you have, is not obviously approaching your diagnosis and care with an open mind.
You need to switch - find another doctor - preferably a neurologist who specializes in MS - and do it sooner rather than later.
good luck and stay in touch if we can be of help.
my best,
Lulu
Thank you.
I will gather some facts and let you know, I've had so many things I start to forget them.
Yes 11 foci 3-4 mm also 6 2-3 mm foci in both cerebral hemispheres..
Ive been having strange symptoms for about 3 or 4 years... It all started with brain fogs. Staring off into space. Left arm and legs just felt weak. Would last aprox 2-3 days then back to just brain fogs. Last sept I would feel unbalanced like I was walking onto uneven ground. Complete eye check all good. I never seem to have the double vision when I get my eyes checked,, go figure. Then this Oct scared me. For no reason I started feeling weak, feet felt like shoes were too tight. Left foot went almost completely numb. That lasted for two days. So back to neuro. Another mri,vep,blood test.
everything good except for the MRI. So.. here I am trying to except that maybe they wont find the problem.
I think doc thinks its stress,,,, well, I dont have stress till that happens. I am a happy person when it lets up, but this time it has not let up even a little since the bloodpatch.
Doc says my problems cant be from bloodpatch. Im not sure what its suppose to feel like, all i know is my whole body felt like one of those Thanksgiving day parade balloons.
I will add more if I can remember.
Head to toe seem to be normal except for give way weakness in left arm.
Oh,,one more thing, if I talk a little to loud it makes me feel unbalanced and weak.
Thanks for your help.
I will gather some facts and let you know, I've had so many things I start to forget them.
Yes 11 foci 3-4 mm also 6 2-3 mm foci in both cerebral hemispheres..
Ive been having strange symptoms for about 3 or 4 years... It all started with brain fogs. Staring off into space. Left arm and legs just felt weak. Would last aprox 2-3 days then back to just brain fogs. Last sept I would feel unbalanced like I was walking onto uneven ground. Complete eye check all good. I never seem to have the double vision when I get my eyes checked,, go figure. Then this Oct scared me. For no reason I started feeling weak, feet felt like shoes were too tight. Left foot went almost completely numb. That lasted for two days. So back to neuro. Another mri,vep,blood test.
everything good except for the MRI. So.. here I am trying to except that maybe they wont find the problem.
I think doc thinks its stress,,,, well, I dont have stress till that happens. I am a happy person when it lets up, but this time it has not let up even a little since the bloodpatch.
Doc says my problems cant be from bloodpatch. Im not sure what its suppose to feel like, all i know is my whole body felt like one of those Thanksgiving day parade balloons.
I will add more if I can remember.
Head to toe seem to be normal except for give way weakness in left arm.
Oh,,one more thing, if I talk a little to loud it makes me feel unbalanced and weak.
Thanks for your help.
11 periventricular lesions that are 3 to 4mm in size???! Is that what you said? Oh, dear, that is very substantial. Many MS neurologists will count any lesion that is greater than 2 mm. If your history of symptoms is suggestive I can't see at all why they wouldn't be very impressed with such a large lesion load.
Have you had more than one attack of symptoms?
Do you have any abnormalities on the neuro exam. Did your neuro do a long, head-to-toe neuro exam on you?
The blood patch should not cause anything like what you describe. this should be checked out. I have no clue. In the blood patch they inject 5cc of your blood into the region outside the spinal canal, called the epidural space. It is possible that they injected into the spinal canal. this would not likely cause any lasting damage and I would suspect you would get better over time, as the blood reabsorbed.
Why don't you tell us your story? How and when your symptoms came on, how they have acted. whether any have ever improved.
Quix
Have you had more than one attack of symptoms?
Do you have any abnormalities on the neuro exam. Did your neuro do a long, head-to-toe neuro exam on you?
The blood patch should not cause anything like what you describe. this should be checked out. I have no clue. In the blood patch they inject 5cc of your blood into the region outside the spinal canal, called the epidural space. It is possible that they injected into the spinal canal. this would not likely cause any lasting damage and I would suspect you would get better over time, as the blood reabsorbed.
Why don't you tell us your story? How and when your symptoms came on, how they have acted. whether any have ever improved.
Quix
Thank you sooooo much for the reply.
My tap was Nov 9th.. really that was not too bad, I felt really good for 2 days, then that all change with my symptoms becoming worse, baaad headache, dizzy weaker than normal. So, went in for blood patch on the 5th day and that was so tramatic, blood rushed to my head, I felt like something went wrong and I was saying my prayers. Headache went away but now Im am left with terrible sense of balance and pressure in my head,,,, weird , Im worse than ever, I cant handle anything too complacated, cant think of words, weaker than ever.
My MRI was abnormal with 11 3-4mm foci... he states they are nonspecific(periventricular white matter... I dont understand all this,,, dosent take much to confuse me lately.
Thanks again,,, your answer made me feel a bit better.
My tap was Nov 9th.. really that was not too bad, I felt really good for 2 days, then that all change with my symptoms becoming worse, baaad headache, dizzy weaker than normal. So, went in for blood patch on the 5th day and that was so tramatic, blood rushed to my head, I felt like something went wrong and I was saying my prayers. Headache went away but now Im am left with terrible sense of balance and pressure in my head,,,, weird , Im worse than ever, I cant handle anything too complacated, cant think of words, weaker than ever.
My MRI was abnormal with 11 3-4mm foci... he states they are nonspecific(periventricular white matter... I dont understand all this,,, dosent take much to confuse me lately.
Thanks again,,, your answer made me feel a bit better.
Did your neuro rule out MS because your LP was negative? If so, he is wrong. The LP can't be used that way.
Q
Q
Hi, and I'm sorry you are being worked up for MS.
The LP result of a few RBCs is so minor that most docs wouldn't even give it half a thought. 15 red blood cells per high power field is so few that it is hard to call it abnormal. It indicates that the needle poked a tiny capillary allowing a minute amount of blood to escape into the fluid and be caught into the collection tube.
You wouldn't see the effect of blood in the clarity of the tubes until there were many hundreds (or thousands) of RBCs in it. This is not even enough to call it a traumatic tap.
Sorry you are having a bad time with the tap. About 1 in 7 do. When was the tap? If you are still "having problems from having it", and it is more than a couple weeks, I suspect that the problems are from something else. It would be VERY rare for an LP to cause lasting problems. I speak from the vantage point of someone who has done hundreds of LPs.
Hope you feel better soon.
But, anyway, do not sweat the few RBCs in the fluid.
Quix, MD
The LP result of a few RBCs is so minor that most docs wouldn't even give it half a thought. 15 red blood cells per high power field is so few that it is hard to call it abnormal. It indicates that the needle poked a tiny capillary allowing a minute amount of blood to escape into the fluid and be caught into the collection tube.
You wouldn't see the effect of blood in the clarity of the tubes until there were many hundreds (or thousands) of RBCs in it. This is not even enough to call it a traumatic tap.
Sorry you are having a bad time with the tap. About 1 in 7 do. When was the tap? If you are still "having problems from having it", and it is more than a couple weeks, I suspect that the problems are from something else. It would be VERY rare for an LP to cause lasting problems. I speak from the vantage point of someone who has done hundreds of LPs.
Hope you feel better soon.
But, anyway, do not sweat the few RBCs in the fluid.
Quix, MD
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