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274858 tn?1267749912

Questions????

05 Double vision R eye. lesion on my optic nerve
Mar and Jul 07 full bladder cant empty. Left eye froze hurt to move, pain
Sept. Numbness R toe, ache R leg. R pinky, arm, burning
Twiching in eyes and my arm heavy
OCT pain L arm. weak,burns from elbow to my fingers. tingleling in fingers. Hospital 5 days.  
Burning feeling flowing from my head down my left side body, tingleing, double vision on outsides of L eye,  numbness in face lip, no balance, drag L leg, Echo ,ringing, woshing Ear
Dizzy and vomiting
MRI 1 Lesion, Bloodwork Normal, LP Normal
Please help RAE



I agree with the workup thus far.  The LP and MRI should be able to detect cases of MS.  Evoked potentials can be considered if the diagnosis continues to be inconclusive.  

If central neurologic causes have been ruled out, you can rule out peripheral causes with a nerve conduction study.  Metabolic diseases like diabetes or B12 deficiency should be tested for.

A neurology referral needs to be made.  If the diagnosis continues to be elusive, another opinion at a major academic medical center can be considered.

Followup with your personal physician is essential.

This answer is not intended as and does not substitute for medical advice - the information presented is for patient education only. Please see your personal physician for further evaluation of your individual case.

Kevin, M.D.
www.kevinmd.com

Diabetes and B12 tests were done and came back Normal.

I was treated with 100 units of Acthar Gel and 2 bags of Solu-Medrol.  Another Mri of brain was done with contrast (1.5 Tesla) and nothing changed. EEG came back normal.

Neuro is treating me with Neurontin  (100 mg 3 x day), Naprosyn (500mg 1 x day), Phenergan (25mg 1 ev.6h), Ambien (10 mg ea. night)

See Neuro next week for follow up.

Can someone have MS symptoms and have eviedence not be seen until years down the road?
Rae
23 Responses
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274858 tn?1267749912
Wow.  I went to my family doctor today with numbness in my fingers. He agreed that I have nerve problems. He thought it might be caused by carpal tunnel and ulnar nerve damage. He didn't think this was any kind of brain troubles. He was ready to just send me out of the office with a spint and told me to not rest my elbow on anything. When I said wait a minute, I came to see another doctor this weekend because you were not available and they thought I needed nerve conduction studies done.  He left the room upset then came in and agreed that I need the tests done.  I then told him I have other things going on.  My left big toe and my heel go numb and I also noticed that they look pale pink or white when this happens. He didn't think anything was wrong with my left foot. He thought I was just paying too close attension to my body.  I also told him about my eye, left eye is fine, right eye is biege like. Things are not as bright.
He said, " I am starting to get nervous here. The nerve damage and the eye problemsmake me worried that I might have been correct in thinking MS but, I do think you are staring to become too knowledgeable of a patient and I am affraid that some of my problems are figtishus. Then he closed the office door and left me there. After a couple minutes I opened the door and asked am I done, can I come out?  The sec. said come on out. They will call me with my appt. for the nerve testing.  I couldn't believe the next thing. He is sending me back to the first Neuro. for the nerve testing. I had switched from him because I did not like him. Can you believe he is not going with the new Neuro I choose for the testing?  Can I ask for this to be changed? I am going to feel wierd going to the old neuro when I left him.
Can you believe that! Oh, I am sooooooo mad. I am definately changing my primary doctor.
Rae
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Hi!  Hang in there.  Yes, the carpal tunnel affects the right side of the hand [thumb and pointer fingers].  Neck problems, etc. affect the ring and pinky fingers, generally.

You can have both carpal tunnel and other problems.  I agree with Quix.  Keep investigating.  Neuros kept dismissing mine to anxiety.  I could not get an immune test or MRI test run so I had to really take some initiative.  I had been seeing a Hopkins trained neurologist who kept dismissing the abnormalities I (not the radiologists) was pointing out on the MRIs.  Everyone kept dismissing them until the fifth MRI.  Then, the radiologists started stating what I have been saying all
along without them even knowing that I had said it.  They decided I had lesions in the same locations
that I had been saying all along.

Then two more MRIs and now diagnosed.  However, the original neurologist still keeps saying that it is poor placement on the MRIs causing lesion-appearing artifacts:  after three different imaging centers and  approximately seven different techs.  One lesion has been present on the last five MRIs and another on at least three MRIs.  Possibly more lesions.  Also, the lesion locations are consistent with some of my symptomology.  

That is just over part of the cervical area.  Full spine not scanned for MS yet.  Asked again without avail.  I will ask again in two weeks.  Another neuro said psychological as I had too much medical knowledge...Well, I worked in diagnostic clinical areas and/or research and/or with patients for over twenty years and it took me about seven years to get diagnosed.  I ought to try and know a little something by then with all the diagnosis that were passed onto me--(at least eleven).  New neuro gave me diagnosis on second appointment.  When the new neuro reviewed the MRIs and the history I was diagnosed right away.  (My primary agrees.)

For grins went back to old neuro and did not tell about my diagnosis.  Old neuro says definitely not MS, but not to worry as they have many, many patients with severe pain and similar neuro symptoms and tremors with MRI abnormalities similar to mine--that the determined abnormalities were not important.  When I asked what those patients diagnoses were the neuro stated that they did not know--but that it was not MS.  (Of course not, that neuro kept saying artifacts and then very deep spinal cord damage and now nothing important at all.)  As I walk out of the office the neuro says, "But, you know I would have to do a lumbar puncture to be sure it isn't MS.  

That same neuro told me they could not believe that I allowed them to do an LP to me two years ago in the ER...[and without any anesthetic or x-ray guidance, I might add.]  I begged them to have it analyzed for MS or lupus or infection, etc.  But, the sample was discarded.  I felt I was just a pin-cushion for them to practice on.  I am so relieved to have a diagnosis.  Not happy; but, validated.  (And yes, the old neuro still believes it is just anxiety and migraines--even with multiple lesions in my spine.)  Old neuro still would not order a spinal MRI and never did...Amazing, huh?

New neuro tells me that I can tell him anything.  Recognized that others do not want to hear or understand or believe...states that the other physicians probably knew it was MS but did not want to tell me.  Amazing, huh?  

Anxiety can cause a lot of problems.  However, I believe that anxiety is often used as a catch-all for an "I do not know " dismissal by the physician.  Perhaps, the anxiety is secondary to the disease or the invalidation.  The other neuro who stated psychological finally admitted that the truth was that "He just did not know".  Truly amazing ego.

Another thing that I have learned is that at least twice when other radiologists dismissed my lesions, I insisted that neuroradiologists read the films after I left.  Both times, the neuroradiologist agreed that there was something going on.

So, I did not mean to ramble on except to point out that you have to  "just keep being true to yourself."  Only "YOU" know what has been a normal sensation/reaction by "YOUR BODY" in the past.
Helpful - 0
274858 tn?1267749912
I came down with a cold on Sunday last week. Then For 3 nights I woke up with numb pins and needles in my left arm. They went away after like 30 minutes in my r hand, but stayed half the day in my left hand.   Also, I noticed that my thumb could not touch my pinky. Now I can barely touch my ring finger.

I finally got to go my family doctor today. My left hand was stiffing up and would become numb and tingley sometimes. They dx me with carpal tunnel. Also, this is more the ulcer nerve area. The problems I am having are with my pinky and my ring finger.   I am going for a nerve cog, test next week. Carpal Tunnel I read effects the Thumb point and middle finger. When they did the test on me they made me flex my fingers down towards the ground and they hit my wrist on the outside by my thumb and it did cause my pointer, thumb and middle finger to get the tingles. But, the numb feeling I get in my other fingers without bending my wrist. Now I am starting to have the same feelings in my left foot and my right arm. Both arms ache pretty badle and a buzzing feeling in my feet.

I guess what I am wondering is could this be MS and not carpal tunnel?
Is this another attach? Or could this still be caused my the attack I had in September?
Everything really went away in October except for the tingles here and there and the really bad ringing in my ears.

Please let me know what you think. Thanks !
Rae
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274858 tn?1267749912
Just wondering if anyone has had this happen to you.  Rae
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274858 tn?1267749912
Hello, went to my family doctor and he gave me referrals to a psychiatrist I guess he does'nt know any neuropsychiatrist and a optical specialist. Has anyone had this happen to you?
Rae
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Avatar universal
I can understand you not wanting to push,but,if this is indeed MS the earlier the treatment the better the outcome in the future.

I had to fight to get a DX,many Drs and specialist. My GP knew from day one it was MS and my electro-muscular Dr also stated MS.It took 4 neuro's to re-evaluate all my test results and put it all together it took over 2 years.

Your not stuck,I look at this way not knowing causes stress,stress intensifies symptoms,then anxiety sets in do to the intensified symptoms and then depression occurs because of dimwitted Drs want to blame stress on everything.I hope that made sence.

Go for the psyc eval. try to comprimise with your GP.You know how you feel.I have had ON and I know that it hurts like heck and  it hasn't been brought on by stress,anxiety  or depression.

You deserve the best.Get a new GP if that is what it takes.

T
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274858 tn?1267749912
Thank you for your response. I am not scared anymore, I am frustrated and feel stuck. I am going to get another primary doctor just not right now. If anything happens again I will get a second opinon.

I have twins that are 3 and a 7 year old, all boys.  I use to do daycare also of 6 extra kids. Different days. Lost my job 3 days after twins were born and had regualr problems, financial, no sleep, busy busy. They put me on Lexapro in 2005 after my first problem double vision and wierd visual things, while driving, vehicles looking like they were in my lane, the houses were in the road and then when I would get up to them they would go back to the side of the road. All lights were double, everything to my left was double. Lots of pain in and behind my eye. Blaaablaaablaaa So,after lots of dr. visits tests and MRI, they said Possible MS we will keep an eye on you BUT my neuro really thought it was just depression and anixety.

I want to push but, they think I am stressing too much about my problems that I am causeing these things to happen to me due to stress.  See stuck!!!!!
Rae
Helpful - 0
305544 tn?1197997610
Hi,
If you don't mind me asking, why do they have you on Lexapro?  I was put on that years ago and it really made me depressed.  Can you get a second opinion?  Most insurance companies will cover that.  If you find that your doctor isn't taking you seriously, can you get a new primary doctor?  I hope you are not sill scared, just keep pushing for the doctors to "find" out what is wrong.  You know when something is off in your own body.
Take care & know we are all here for you, Terrie
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274858 tn?1267749912
I also have ringing in my ears alot and popping sounds.  A really bad stiff neck painy ache in shoulders and neck.

Rae
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274858 tn?1267749912
Thanks, I will try all that.  I am still having things come here and there. Now, I feel like I cant tell anyone (doctor, husband, family) because they will think I must be stressed and its just me complaining.  

After I took a shower yesterday in the bottom of my left eye I keep getting this wierd thing in my eye.  Hard to explain but, like a lighted jaggy line that wiggled all around.Only when I looked down to the left.  It went away after like an hour.  

I keep getting stabbing, burning, tingles in my face, my lip, arm, leg, wrist, back. Feelings of like a bug on me so I get ichy in that spot. They come and go and dance around the place. I get this everyday or every other day.  

I also get really bad pain in the left side of my back.  I have usually a full bladder. It gets alittle better when I go to the bathroom but it stay there for the day and night.  Then I wake up fine and it slowly comes back.  What is this?

I am trying to deal with them and tell myself its ok, it must just be stress. Is it?  
My neuro said to call him only when I have something major happen. Like I cant walk for acouple days or I have a major change in my vision for days.

Rae

Helpful - 0
147426 tn?1317265632
Ask your primary for a referral for neuropsychological testing.  These tests are elegantly able to distinguish primary anxiety (your are anxious therefore you imagine bad symptoms) from secondary anxiety (you are having bad symptoms that make you anxious).  And it can show the same about  depression.  I think this is a very good option.  If there is some basic anxiety or depression, that can be treated and then you can see what symptoms are left.

At the same time ask for a 2nd opinion from a better neurologist.  You can use the agreement to see neuropsych as part of a negotiation to see a second neurologist.  Momzilla did this and it worked to her advantage BIGTIME!

How does that sound?

Quix
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274858 tn?1267749912
Please help!

I am going to see my family doctor to get a refill on the Lexapro and the Neurontin. Also, my neaur wants me to go to see a phychologist fot Anxiety and depression.  I think they are writing this off. I am affraid to keep pushing my family doctor for another referal to another neruo because I am affraid they will think that I am being anitious.  My insurance makes me have to have a referral.  I feel stuck.

Right now as I talk to you my left arm is shaking and my eye is twitching so bad. I had a really relaxed day, NO stress, no aniety and No depression. I think they are wrong but I dont know what to do.

Rae
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147426 tn?1317265632
Too late.  I'm sorry again.  What did this "neurologist" say?  100% not MS, but he doesn't know what it is?  That is self-contradictory.  

Give us the report on the neuro visit.  I agree that you need evoked potential and you need serial (repeat) MRIs.

This is DEFINITELY 2nd opinion material.  Quix
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Avatar universal
  Push them to find the cause. It's not in your head. They need to either continue testing, and I would have a serious discussion with your neuro about what it is that he thinks is causing this, and if he has no answers take the wonderful advice offered above and seek out a referral to major medical center.

  Johnny
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274858 tn?1267749912
Just moving this back up for help.
Rae
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274858 tn?1267749912
Can you help me ask the right questions at my appointment?
Thanks, Rae
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274858 tn?1267749912
Thanks grannyhotwheels. It is just so hard because everyone heard the doctors say 100% no MS and when I have symptoms now and then and start talking about MS, they all kind of yell like," But, you don'thave MS!" What should I do?
Rae
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199882 tn?1310184542
I'm sorry you are having such a hard time right now.  I'm sure there are several of us who understands what you are going through.  I hope that there is some way we can help you.  Even if you just want to blow your stack a little.

I'll be praying,
Carol
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274858 tn?1267749912
I am glad to see you are feeling better.  I am sooooo glad you responded to me. I was starting to give up hope.

Yes 1 Lesion on Optic Nerve.

Yes, I was in the hospital for a total of 4 days.

My left arm would sag down when I had to close my eyes put both arms in front of me. Arm was heavy and weak. 3 Days( 1 day at home and day 1 and 2 in hospital)

Had horrible pain in the center of back. Day 1 in hospital

I had weakness in left leg, heavy and dragging it Lasted 2 days. ( day 2 and 3 in hospital) Some of my reflexes in that leg were off.

Left Pinky and ring finger numb. Left side of foot and toes numb. When they touched them with tools. Different or the same. They were different.

Double vision in my left eye on the outside. They put fingers up and I had to follow them, eye movement was good but I saw 2 fingers on the left side. 3 and 4 Days

On the 4th day everything seemed better. Then kind of returned softly.  

Yes they are dancing around. Like 5 minutes in left arm bicept muscle then nothing then 5 minutes in right wrist. then nothing for acouple hours then 3 hours left foot weakness heavy and limping. Then just burning here and there, in face for acouple minutes and head and leg.It has been 4 days now of it dancing around and coming and going. My hands and fingers are shaking like parkinsins constintly since i got home from the hospital.

My new neruo I go see on OCt. 15th. He said 100 % no MS. But, said he did not know what was causing the weakness and other symptoms. Could it be MS just not showing up on tests? What questions should I ask? Should I try to be refered to a specialist for MS?

Thanks for helping me here. I feel like you are helping me more then anyone else out there. Thank you for filling in the blanks.

Thank you!
Rae
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147426 tn?1317265632
Hi, again.  I read about your episode in the hospital and the mega (negative) work up.  When you speak of the one brain lesion on MRI (if I remember correctly) it is the lesion on your optic nerve - is this correct?

No, this isn't stress, but I am sure you are maximally stressed because of it!  There is a big difference.  When you were in the hospital, did you have an abnormal exam?  weakness, reflexes, anything?

Do you still drag the left leg?  what do the doctors think is the reason for this?

Also, in your second post you mention small things moving around.  How long are the symptoms lasting?  Do they dance around within one day?

Much of what you are describing sounds like the more severe manifestations of Chronic Fatigue, Immune Deficiency Syndrome - CFIDS.  The older term Chronic Fatigue is being abandoned to include the obvious manifestations of defects in the immune system.

If you would answer the couple questions I posed, I would appreciate it.  there is so much going on with you, but it is not clear that it is MS.  Quix
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274858 tn?1267749912
OK.

I am having some small things happen again, but it is coming and going in different spots. Numb pain in left arm muscle area, then in my right wrist.  Then in my left anckle and my legs burnned and ached, startted limping. Really tired and memory is acting up,I try to tell someone something, I forget what I was talking about.  Or I tried to say medical and I could'nt I keep saying mental.  

I am scaried, and alittle depressed. The doctors and the tests are all saying NO MS. Then what is this?  Stress ?

Rae
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147426 tn?1317265632
Hi, you're on my list of people to answer.  I have a small family reunion going on, and it's taking my time and energy.  You are not forgotten. Quix
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Avatar universal
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