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Real drug costs
We often get asked here what the cost of these drugs run in the US. I've been discussing a balance due with my specialty pharmacy bill (it's $10 and turns out they owe me $10 and not the other way around!) and they sent me a printout of my entire account since I was diagnosed with MS in 2008.
We know that the price of the DMD's have increased again recently, but it is shocking to see the numbers in print. Now granted, my insurance is not going to pay the amount billed, but these are the numbers the pharmacy billed, I'm just listing the months when the price changed:
Oct. 2008 - Copaxone $2,125
January 2009 - Copaxone $2,335
April 2009 - Copaxone $2,567
September 2009 - Copaxone $2,564
December 2009 - Copaxone $2,536
January 2010 - Copaxone $2,787
June 2010 - Copaxone $3,063
August 2010 - Copaxone $3,108
For some reason, the statement doesn't show any charges for Copaxone for several months. But then it reappears on my statement for this year.
March 2011 - Copaxone $3,571
If we've figured this right, that is a 68% increase in the cost in 2.5 years.
I'm not sure how TEVA can justify this ........
Lulu
We know that the price of the DMD's have increased again recently, but it is shocking to see the numbers in print. Now granted, my insurance is not going to pay the amount billed, but these are the numbers the pharmacy billed, I'm just listing the months when the price changed:
Oct. 2008 - Copaxone $2,125
January 2009 - Copaxone $2,335
April 2009 - Copaxone $2,567
September 2009 - Copaxone $2,564
December 2009 - Copaxone $2,536
January 2010 - Copaxone $2,787
June 2010 - Copaxone $3,063
August 2010 - Copaxone $3,108
For some reason, the statement doesn't show any charges for Copaxone for several months. But then it reappears on my statement for this year.
March 2011 - Copaxone $3,571
If we've figured this right, that is a 68% increase in the cost in 2.5 years.
I'm not sure how TEVA can justify this ........
Lulu
Thanks guys, wow, that $million dollar olus was staggering..............egads............
As far as Copaxone's rise in cost two things may be in play Mylan's generic Copaxone may get through the FDA soon and Lanquinimod the new Teva MS drug is behind schedule, Gileyna is already on the market. Copaxone is a third of Teva's sales. The stock price is falling and they promised there investors to double the stock price in 5 years. If they are afraid as they called Copaxone the "Goose which lays the golden eggs" will have its run they need to make as much profit from it while they can. Lanquinimod was supposed to be on the market now and bringing in even more of the MS market for Teva, but it is costing more in R&D then they originally thought.
Copaxone was originally an oral but in twenty years of research it had to be scrapped and developed as an injectable.
The U.S. market will not bear these price increases much longer, simply because of the economy. Insurance and private consumers can't keep paying these kind of prices. Instead of losing consumers all together prices will have to fall.
The only other option is having few consumers and keep raising your prices.
Alex
Copaxone was originally an oral but in twenty years of research it had to be scrapped and developed as an injectable.
The U.S. market will not bear these price increases much longer, simply because of the economy. Insurance and private consumers can't keep paying these kind of prices. Instead of losing consumers all together prices will have to fall.
The only other option is having few consumers and keep raising your prices.
Alex
I'm still at a loss why there was such a dramatic increase in the cost. Any clue? Is it what the market will bear?
Yes, MS is quite the expensive disease. Our prolonged life span is surely giving the bottom line on profit to the insurance companies fits.
The generic market is pretty complex and the more you research, the more often you will find TEVA in the mix. Alex is right, there are few drugs companies left here. But the cost of the drugs here (suggested retail) is significantly different than in other countries. A really good example of this difference is the drugs for HIV .
Yes, MS is quite the expensive disease. Our prolonged life span is surely giving the bottom line on profit to the insurance companies fits.
The generic market is pretty complex and the more you research, the more often you will find TEVA in the mix. Alex is right, there are few drugs companies left here. But the cost of the drugs here (suggested retail) is significantly different than in other countries. A really good example of this difference is the drugs for HIV .
My copay for any DMD or Ampyra is $150 a month under my insurance.
All the CRAB makers could still make a profit if they paid everyone with insurances co pays.
I do not think Teva will have a generic for Copaxone. They are trying for an oral. There research is going a little slower than planned for investment purposes. They wanted FDA approval before the other orals. Their best shot is always to be ahead of the game on MS drugs.
PPMS drugs are not as profitable as RRMS simply because there are more people with RRMS and it is harder to document lack of progression in PPMS so research is slower, so I do not think Teva has much interest in a PPMS drug.
Teva is a good company. Almost every generic I am on comes from one of their companies. I admire their business model and they do a lot for the NMSS and other cahrities and research.
There are very few American Drug Companies anymore and yet we Americans still buy into the notion that we have to pay for R&D and manufacturing of drugs in the U.S. Most drugs are manufactured over seas. My generic Immitrex is made in India by Dr. Reddy ( a Teva company). Russia is the next big place for drug manufacturing. The we drugs we use are manufactured all over the world and then imported to the U.S.. I was surprised by this. More R&D is done overseas as well or done in the U.S. by foreign companies who get tax breaks from the U.S. Government. When you get a prescription you do not always know what company made the drug or where it was manufactured, especially if it it is a generic and it is not in its original packaging.
Alex
I
All the CRAB makers could still make a profit if they paid everyone with insurances co pays.
I do not think Teva will have a generic for Copaxone. They are trying for an oral. There research is going a little slower than planned for investment purposes. They wanted FDA approval before the other orals. Their best shot is always to be ahead of the game on MS drugs.
PPMS drugs are not as profitable as RRMS simply because there are more people with RRMS and it is harder to document lack of progression in PPMS so research is slower, so I do not think Teva has much interest in a PPMS drug.
Teva is a good company. Almost every generic I am on comes from one of their companies. I admire their business model and they do a lot for the NMSS and other cahrities and research.
There are very few American Drug Companies anymore and yet we Americans still buy into the notion that we have to pay for R&D and manufacturing of drugs in the U.S. Most drugs are manufactured over seas. My generic Immitrex is made in India by Dr. Reddy ( a Teva company). Russia is the next big place for drug manufacturing. The we drugs we use are manufactured all over the world and then imported to the U.S.. I was surprised by this. More R&D is done overseas as well or done in the U.S. by foreign companies who get tax breaks from the U.S. Government. When you get a prescription you do not always know what company made the drug or where it was manufactured, especially if it it is a generic and it is not in its original packaging.
Alex
I
My last visit with the MS Specialist , he wanted me to read up on the DMD'S - I've already done my home work- if I'm given opportunity to pick from the CRAB'S I would chose Copaxone. I see my MS Specialist in mid May after my new MRI'S.
Yes the annual cost is shocking, what's more shocking is the cost over a life time to be on Copaxone,
I'm 52- so if I live to 78, that would be 26 years on Copaxon, if all goes well ( fingers crossed) - with out adding for inflation or other medical complications,
Annual cost $3,571 = $42,852
26 years = $1,114,152.
Throw in office visits, MRI'S other tests -I've read its will cost $2,000,000.-$3,500,000. for just 20 years of treatment for the MS depending on the course the MS takes.
WE ARE CASH COW'S
Companies-Dr's- caregivers- medical suppliers- big Pharma must should really love us.
I understand everyone needs to make a profit, otherwise why be in business.. I don't have a problem with the profit margin. These Crabs may never have made it the market otherwise. I just hope I'm able to keep my health insurance over my life time.
take care..
Johnniebear.
does anyone have any experience with medicare D (stateside) and Humana as far as paying for thsese drugs? I hate to call them and raise a flag...............
JemmAus,
Without turning this into a political discussion, I would have to agree with you that we are being ripped off and subsidizing the worldwide cost of big pharma costs, including research. It is crazy how all of this works :-)
My insurance co-pay for Copaxone is $50/month. There is a Shared Solutions program that covers my co-pay, so the reality for me is I'm better off, because I pay $00.00 each month for my copaxone. Who knows what it would cost me if I didn't have insurance - they have plans to help with that, too.
interesting how this works, isn't it?
L
Without turning this into a political discussion, I would have to agree with you that we are being ripped off and subsidizing the worldwide cost of big pharma costs, including research. It is crazy how all of this works :-)
My insurance co-pay for Copaxone is $50/month. There is a Shared Solutions program that covers my co-pay, so the reality for me is I'm better off, because I pay $00.00 each month for my copaxone. Who knows what it would cost me if I didn't have insurance - they have plans to help with that, too.
interesting how this works, isn't it?
L
Hmmmm.....as usual, I think you americans are being ripped off. The curse of the true capitalist society, where profit always comes before people. yeah yeah, shut up, it isn't a political forum! (LOL sorry, couldn't help myself)
IN Aus:
How much does Copaxone® cost?
If you are eligible for medications through the PBS, you will need to pay a contribution fee for each month’s supply. The Federal Government pays for the remaining cost. The amount of the contribution fee depends upon whether or not you have a pension or concession card and the number of prescriptions you have had dispensed in a year. The amount of this fee is set each year by the government . In 2009 the fee for people with a Medicare card is $32.90.
The fee is $5.30 for people with a Medicare card and a pension or concession card.
Further information about the PBS and your entitlements can be viewed on the Medicare Australia website at:
www.medicare.gov.au
http://www.msaustralia.org.au/medication-copaxone.asp
Oh, by the way, EVERY Aus citizen has a Medicare card...
IN Aus:
How much does Copaxone® cost?
If you are eligible for medications through the PBS, you will need to pay a contribution fee for each month’s supply. The Federal Government pays for the remaining cost. The amount of the contribution fee depends upon whether or not you have a pension or concession card and the number of prescriptions you have had dispensed in a year. The amount of this fee is set each year by the government . In 2009 the fee for people with a Medicare card is $32.90.
The fee is $5.30 for people with a Medicare card and a pension or concession card.
Further information about the PBS and your entitlements can be viewed on the Medicare Australia website at:
www.medicare.gov.au
http://www.msaustralia.org.au/medication-copaxone.asp
Oh, by the way, EVERY Aus citizen has a Medicare card...
Just givin' you a hard time Lulu.
Isn't it kind of ironic they charge in excess of $35,000 a year for this drug and then quibble over who owes who ten bucks?
Mary
Isn't it kind of ironic they charge in excess of $35,000 a year for this drug and then quibble over who owes who ten bucks?
Mary
Sorry, Mary, to make your blood pressure rise. Yes, this is the pricing for a 30 day supply. I'm not sure who got the better "deal" on the increase - you or me.
TEVA is quite the mega-pharma organization and their business model is pretty darn impressive. Their market in generics is amazing - stop and think that when Copaxone goes generic, TEVA will probably mfg it too and still have a monopoly on this particular drug.
And I should not have labeled this REAL costs, because we all know that the insurance companies never pay the list price on anything, including the drugs.
I'm not sure about the idea that Copaxone is the weakest of the CRABs - I heard a couple weeks ago that this title goes to Avonex. Its hard to compare Copaxone to something else that it isn't -... interferons. It really is apples and oranges - both fruits but not the same.
TEVA is quite the mega-pharma organization and their business model is pretty darn impressive. Their market in generics is amazing - stop and think that when Copaxone goes generic, TEVA will probably mfg it too and still have a monopoly on this particular drug.
And I should not have labeled this REAL costs, because we all know that the insurance companies never pay the list price on anything, including the drugs.
I'm not sure about the idea that Copaxone is the weakest of the CRABs - I heard a couple weeks ago that this title goes to Avonex. Its hard to compare Copaxone to something else that it isn't -... interferons. It really is apples and oranges - both fruits but not the same.
Sounds like a good place for an investment dollar when I have one, eh?
Your research knowledge is obvious Alex. No wonder you are such a great advocate for PwMS. Thanks for the company background (and the vocab boost too - nefarious sounded familiar but I had to look it up - glad I don't come across that kind too often).
I'd hesitate myself to consider Copaxone the "weakest" DMD. It works in a different way than the interferons. Sometimes better. Sometimes not. It depends on the person more than the drug I think. (JMO)
The choices in interferons is terrific but they are basically the same therapy. It's like Nexium and Prilosec. Some people swear by one while the next person will swear at it and claim the other is best. But three options do increase the chance of finding a favorite by 200%. Is that math right???
Hoping the research finds some answers for PPMS too some day soon!!!
Mary
Your research knowledge is obvious Alex. No wonder you are such a great advocate for PwMS. Thanks for the company background (and the vocab boost too - nefarious sounded familiar but I had to look it up - glad I don't come across that kind too often).
I'd hesitate myself to consider Copaxone the "weakest" DMD. It works in a different way than the interferons. Sometimes better. Sometimes not. It depends on the person more than the drug I think. (JMO)
The choices in interferons is terrific but they are basically the same therapy. It's like Nexium and Prilosec. Some people swear by one while the next person will swear at it and claim the other is best. But three options do increase the chance of finding a favorite by 200%. Is that math right???
Hoping the research finds some answers for PPMS too some day soon!!!
Mary
"Real drug costs"
An interesting choice Lulu. (Oh, how I need an emoticon here!) Me thinks there should be a ? somewhere in there cause who knows the "real" cost. Surely research expenses aren't increasing at this point (even though research is an ongoing process). Can rising expenses for manufacture, transportation and marketing have made such a huge difference?
What I'm afraid of is the reimbursement process itself helps create this type of increase. The cost of subsidizing cost so the drug is available to as many people as possible has to be recaptured somehow. Don't hear me wrong here!!! I haven't noticed any pharmaceutical companies declaring bankruptcy. I'm sure they are raking in plenty of USDs, AUDs, CADs, NZDs, GBPs, EURs, etc., etc. While they should certainly be allowed to make a very decent profit, I just wish there were better ways to track and monitor. As consumers we are at their mercy.
I wonder what caused that little dip in your charges after the initial increase of 2009. It certainly wasn't a trend that lasted. Interesting too how fast prices will rise but defy gravity on the way down. It looks just like gas prices and exactly opposite of grade point averages.
I assume your prices are a 30 day supply? I hesitate to do this.......
but here is how 2010 went for me. Each charge is for a 90 day supply with an additional co-pay of $150 to me. (I'm told my pharmacy gets it discount. Don't they all?)
2/24/2010 $7,888.66 "Plan paid"
6/1/2010 $8,684.08 "
8/31/2010 $8,684.08 "
12/2/2010 $8,684.08 "
3/4/2011 $9,999.76 "
That done, although my life has changed forever, I am feeling and functioning better on Copaxone than I had in a very long time. For me, it is worth the effort it has taken to keep my insurance at work, make the copays (this one and for the other drugs that help), inject daily, smile thankfully at Pharma and keep my fingers crossed for the future.
Then there are the days I think it's just as well I'm on the fading end of the age spectrum.
ARG! You got me going here.
Mary
An interesting choice Lulu. (Oh, how I need an emoticon here!) Me thinks there should be a ? somewhere in there cause who knows the "real" cost. Surely research expenses aren't increasing at this point (even though research is an ongoing process). Can rising expenses for manufacture, transportation and marketing have made such a huge difference?
What I'm afraid of is the reimbursement process itself helps create this type of increase. The cost of subsidizing cost so the drug is available to as many people as possible has to be recaptured somehow. Don't hear me wrong here!!! I haven't noticed any pharmaceutical companies declaring bankruptcy. I'm sure they are raking in plenty of USDs, AUDs, CADs, NZDs, GBPs, EURs, etc., etc. While they should certainly be allowed to make a very decent profit, I just wish there were better ways to track and monitor. As consumers we are at their mercy.
I wonder what caused that little dip in your charges after the initial increase of 2009. It certainly wasn't a trend that lasted. Interesting too how fast prices will rise but defy gravity on the way down. It looks just like gas prices and exactly opposite of grade point averages.
I assume your prices are a 30 day supply? I hesitate to do this.......
but here is how 2010 went for me. Each charge is for a 90 day supply with an additional co-pay of $150 to me. (I'm told my pharmacy gets it discount. Don't they all?)
2/24/2010 $7,888.66 "Plan paid"
6/1/2010 $8,684.08 "
8/31/2010 $8,684.08 "
12/2/2010 $8,684.08 "
3/4/2011 $9,999.76 "
That done, although my life has changed forever, I am feeling and functioning better on Copaxone than I had in a very long time. For me, it is worth the effort it has taken to keep my insurance at work, make the copays (this one and for the other drugs that help), inject daily, smile thankfully at Pharma and keep my fingers crossed for the future.
Then there are the days I think it's just as well I'm on the fading end of the age spectrum.
ARG! You got me going here.
Mary
What amazes me is Teva makes more off the US market than all the rest of the countries of the world combined. It can't be research and development which makes it more expensive for the US market since that happens in Israel. I do not think it is because they sell us more. I think it more likely they charge us more. Especially since countries like Canada, Australia, and the United Kingdom buy all the drugs and have more bargaining power. Many Teva Generics are manufactured in places like India. Who knows where where Copaxone is actually manufactured or how much it really costs. I know R&D was expensive but Teva does very little R&D since it does generics. Also Shared Solutions figures into the cost.
Novartis/Mylan Capaxone is manufactured in India. Most of Tevas drugs are made all over. Teva owns well over a hundred generic drug companies like Barr and Dr. Reddy's (an Indian Company). I did a ton off research for an article on Generic Drugs. Teva buys anew drug company every few weeks.
Teva is not nefarious just have great business model they promise to double their investors profits in five years. They only go into name brands in MS and cancer drugs, which are lucrative and have less potential for law suits. Then they break everyone else's patents, pay the fines and still make money.
The US government only gives a few million dollars a year to MS research. So the NMSS Society and other groups, and the drug companies pay for the research. Teva gives money to these groups and pays for studies on Copaxone. I can not imagine a better business model.
In the end Copaxone is the weakest of the CRABs but it has the least side effects and least potential for a lawsuit for long term damages. As far as marketing it comes out on top.
Being a Drug company dealing in MS drugs is good because you basically have a captive audience. Especially for Copaxone you have no choice at the moment. At least with Intrerons you have three choices.
I do not hate the drug companies they serve a vital service and it is cheaper than wheelchairs etc. in the long run, but they are businesses.
Alex
Novartis/Mylan Capaxone is manufactured in India. Most of Tevas drugs are made all over. Teva owns well over a hundred generic drug companies like Barr and Dr. Reddy's (an Indian Company). I did a ton off research for an article on Generic Drugs. Teva buys anew drug company every few weeks.
Teva is not nefarious just have great business model they promise to double their investors profits in five years. They only go into name brands in MS and cancer drugs, which are lucrative and have less potential for law suits. Then they break everyone else's patents, pay the fines and still make money.
The US government only gives a few million dollars a year to MS research. So the NMSS Society and other groups, and the drug companies pay for the research. Teva gives money to these groups and pays for studies on Copaxone. I can not imagine a better business model.
In the end Copaxone is the weakest of the CRABs but it has the least side effects and least potential for a lawsuit for long term damages. As far as marketing it comes out on top.
Being a Drug company dealing in MS drugs is good because you basically have a captive audience. Especially for Copaxone you have no choice at the moment. At least with Intrerons you have three choices.
I do not hate the drug companies they serve a vital service and it is cheaper than wheelchairs etc. in the long run, but they are businesses.
Alex
Wow, Michelle. I am so glad to hear you could find another home for your leftovers. It is such a sin to throw these drugs away when others are begging for financial help to get them for their own use.
This is the first I have seen an itemized billling - I knew it was costly to be on copaxone, but that type of increase borders on obscene.
This is the first I have seen an itemized billling - I knew it was costly to be on copaxone, but that type of increase borders on obscene.
Lu,
Yes that is exactly right. I saw my bill from the pharmacy go up and up for copaxone as well over the last 2 years. Lots of money.
On a good note, I had almost 3 full boxes of Copaxone when I was told to stop. I found a place to donate to, and I feel SO happy about that. It was just a sin to throw out, when so so many people cant afford these drugs.
Michelle
Yes that is exactly right. I saw my bill from the pharmacy go up and up for copaxone as well over the last 2 years. Lots of money.
On a good note, I had almost 3 full boxes of Copaxone when I was told to stop. I found a place to donate to, and I feel SO happy about that. It was just a sin to throw out, when so so many people cant afford these drugs.
Michelle
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