myofascial release and/or trigger point injections

[mkh9]

Hi again,
has anyone had myofascial release for myofascial pain trigger point or a trigger point injection? If so did it work and was it permanent or temporary? Also, how painful was your trigger point and how painful was the treatment for it and it is worth it?
thanks,
mkh9

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[Narcissie]

I had my lung punctured also and almost didnt make it to the hospital in time.

[amp281]

Old thread but I have had good luck with trigger point injections, my doctor is very good at finding the knots by palpation and when he injects there is a localized spasm.  Then I have my physical therapist perform dry needling, she uses a pistoning technique with the needle, then does manual work. it seems like the lidocaine injection makes the area less prone to spasm and pain and the dry needling then removes the knots.  When the acupuncture needle goes into the knot the muscle will spasm and refer pain and it is very painful, but afterwards the knot will shrink or vanish.  

I perform stretching and strengthening exercises to correct the imbalance during the days after the treatments, even when the muscles are swollen and bruised from the needles.

[mkh9]

Thanks for your info on the trigger point injections. I can't believe they punctured your lung! that is so terrible.I am sorry you have pain. Myofascial pain can be really bad even though it is "just" a muscle knot so to speak. My integrative medicine doctor is really helping me. He said for my case not to do the trigger point injection after all. I can now walk one hour a day and he said to go ahead and walk hills. Well, it took me a month get up one hill. He adviced going back to a PT but I decided not to after two PT's injured me and with  the third I got hurt because she didn't tell me not to bend and also when I did bend and hurt myself she didn't say not to do certain exercises for a while and I hurt myself again. I do have one good PT left but I'm am pretty atrophied and want to try doing more hills and some of the stretches and strenthening I already know before going back. I don't feel comfortable anymore with most PT's. Accupunture and biofeedback have helped me some and I'm on Flexeril and a plant based NSAID that doesn't hurt my stomach called Limbrel 500. It is very expensive though. I do have the trigger point injection book but am afraid to aggravate the area because my pain has gone down. I have to get the nerve up to try anything new. I'm not sure how to get my life back except to try small things and see if that hurts. This is all so hard as I'm sure you know.
hugs,
Mkh9

[ddiane719]

I too recommend "The Trigger Point Therapy Workbook" by Clair Davies. I had both PT and an injection into trigger points under my shoulder blade. The doc went too deep and PUNCTURED MY LUNG. This is a fairly rare complication but it does happen. It has been two months and I am still recovering from it plus my chronic  pain is worse than ever. I do get some relief (I''m almost embarrassed to admit this) from Miracle Balls. These little $20 balls are placed along your spine and under the hurting body part and help stretch out the tightness. My PT uses them and recommended I use them in between visits and my ROM and posture have improved a great deal.

[LazyMoose]

The problem with thyroid testing is that at least 20% of people that first test 'normal' using TSH only, but with some symptoms actually have a thyroid problem. And thyroid has a vary wide range of symptoms that seem like unrelated health issues, when in fact they can be related. Dont mean to preach, but its a growing epidemic in North America.

Free T3 is the accurate test, and it should be equal to or higher than free T4 levels.

All over body pain usually has a hidden reason if there was not a specific main injury that started it all.

"Permanent Pain Cure by Stephanie Golden which uses the Ming method for fascia pain" - I'll check this one out

: )

[mkh9]

It really sounds like we have similar problems. The integrative medicine doctor has trigger points on the list but he wanted me to try accupuncture first. I have done 5 accupuncture visits and they didn't work. The doctor said he doesn't want to do the trigger point injections unless he has to. It is too bad because I think I mentioned that when he first gave me the muscle relaxant and NSAID after two weeks my pain went down. Then I reinjured twice since then (a week set back each time or so) and the pain is back up. Maybe he will now consider the trigger points though I'm afraid of the pain after. I guess you can only have 4 per year from what I understand. But if it gives relief for a couple weeks or a month that would be great and also if I could start breaking up the knots and stuff. I want to get myofascial massage as well as I think that would help. I am encouraged that you can get better enough to ski and bike ride. I want to be able to go back to doing exercises and outdoor activities. I like to travel and would like to be able to snorkel and walk up and down lots of stairs on vacation.  No I haven't found any underlying disease or inbalance. My thyroid, blood suger, and everything else is normal. Yes the flexeril is great for sleep. I was waking up with night sweats three times a night and foot pain. I am peri-menopausal so that is why I have night sweats. It is great to sleep. The flexeril really dries me up though. I have purchased the book you mentioned it looks good. I have also the Permanent Pain Cure by Stephanie Golden which uses the Ming method for fascia pain. I can't do those stretches yet though and my upper thighs are tight too. Same problem. I feel you really understand my problem. It helps to have someone get the many reinjuries. I hope I can get through this too as my life is on hold. I can't run anymore either because I have mild osteoarthritis and the doc said no more pounding the pavement. Well, thank you again for you support I really need it.

[LazyMoose]

Your stories about re-injuring is the cycle I was caught in. Sounds like you understand and are 'intune' to what is going on - many people dont think this through. Its a lot of detective work. Yes, I found you must first release the trigger point knots before re-strengthening. It only makes sense too. Why some PT's ignore this is beyond me. But, like I said, I suspect its an insurance based reason.

Leg muscles and especially tight ,unbalance ones can pull on the back - a referred pain thing. I had the SI displacement going on too. Had a chiro keep snapping it back while I did trigger point release. I slept on my back with a partialy rolled up T shirt under the SI to keep it there during that period. I still have to watch it - its related to tight thigh muscles in my case. So I have to use the tennis ball or roller on my legs after long bike rides or skiing. Running is not on my list anymore, was always causing problems. SI's dont like running.

So  I'm not 100%, but with autoimmune thyroid , I might never be- thats what it does even with the right thyroid levels to some people. My tendons are much better though.

Flexeril, the old standby is like a sleep med!  There's a newer brand that starts with an S, not as sleepy.

So I will bring this up - do you have any other weird symptoms that can be contributing to this pain?  Low thyroid or elevated glucose both effect muscle tissue.

Never tried accupunture - thought about it back then.

[mkh9]

Ok, I will buy that book. I have been diagnosed by 5 doctors with myofascial pain syndrome but the PT's think I have SI joint. The pain is similar for both syndromes. I think since I was treated by three PT's two of three injured me (one really badly) by trying to adjust my SI and push me into strenthening when I was still weak and in a lot of pain. I have so far had the best luck with the PT that did myofascial release or massage and the new doctor I have that is part of integrative pain medicine. He says I can get past this even though I've had it for a year and thinks it is myofascial.  I keep getting "small" reinjuries that take about a week to get over. I am walking usually about 55 minutes in the morning and 7-10 minutes in the afternoon and stretching 20 minutes twice a day. Today I am reinjured from Sunday by just getting into bed wrong. I have to start over to get my walking distance up again. It is very frustrating and worrysome to me that I may not get out of this cycle. I have to and will keep trying. I too was an athlete. I was a avid tennis player and had many trophies for that too and then I stopped playing when I got tendonitis in both wrists from work. I also ran 3 miles a day and went hiking up the rocky mountains in Canada 4 years ago.  Then I got this back injury but it is not spinal luckily. But, my life is on hold. Right now I am on a plant based NSAID called Limbrel 500 and flexeril. The accupunture hasn't helped at all. I also tried accupuncture. The pills actually got my pain down to a low-moderate level then I reinjured myself about two weeks ago and my pain stayed moderate (about a 6 and 3 every other day) but I got my walking back up and then I hurt myself again. I see the doctor in about a week. I got the Ming Method for back back but I can't do any of the stretches he suggests for myofascial pain. I need to get trigger point injections and massage to help break up the scar tissue and/or bumps in the fascia. What is hard now is my body is weak and I am inflexible and not able to cross my left leg well enough and can't bend so I can't put my pants and socks on. I have weak legs but am told not to strenthen yet until pain goes down. I really hope this new doctor can get me out of this mess I am in so I can get back to living. Any other suggestions are welcome to help me get out of this. I am very encouraged by you getting back to living again and doing what you like to do. I have to believe I can do it.

[LazyMoose]

"The Trigger Point Therapy Workbook" by Clair Davies is by far , the best. Many illustrations. It was originally written by the famous Janet Travell, Whitehouse MD for Kennedy and Johnson and David Simmons, NASA MD.

PT are all different, they cost a lot per hour, more than massage therapists, maybe most insurance wont cover their cost to do trigger points? I found one that did trigger points, she taught me keeping my specific injuries in mind, what a difference. It changed my life - back to the person I used to be. But you do need a good medical (structural) analysis to understand what is messed up.

I know pain and this works. Gets to the root of the problem. I had undiagnosed Hashimoto hypothyroid for years which can be like fibromyalgia pain - it messes up your muscles. Two herniated discs as well as slight scoliosis. Before that I was an endurance athlete with a basement full of trophies. My body has been thru the ringer. I used to take a boat load of meds and sups, not anymore - those are just bandaids, but good for use at the start of a healing plan.  I chose to be pain pill free, scalpel free, and pain free, it has worked. I should say its still a work in progress, as I continue to learn.

On the other hand, I'm a firm believer in some level of fitness. Even basic walking or bike riding is something everyone can do if they fix their pain. My couch is, once again used for resting not for pain relief.

Many docs said I would have to adapt to a new life living  a sedentary lifestyle and take pain drugs forever.......total BS.  You live life once.

It warmed up to 10 above here, (yipee), time to go skiing.

take care!

[mkh9]

Hi and thanks for your suggestions. Do you have some suggestions on which workbooks are good to learn the massage method? I know you can just roll the tennis ball over the area but I don't want to make it worse if I do it wrong. Who does myofascial massage a PT? They seem to be into manual therapy without massage these days.
mkh9

[mkh9]

Thanks so much for your information. Did they do dry needling or use a type of steroid in the injection? I will try the Robitussion. That is very interesting. Anything that helps. I use a heat pack that I microwave but it would be good to have one that works better. I have myofascial pain syndrome with a trigger point that is very painful. It is weird because it is painful one day and the next low pain and varies like this every other day. I keep getting small reinjuries and having a hard time recovering. Does your pain vary or have you heard of this? My doc gave me muscle relaxants and anti-inflammatory drug called Limbrel500 (which is a new plant based NSAID) that works a little.

[MaxBlast]

I have Trigger Point Injections in my neck/shoulder (traps) and between the shoulder blades every 4-8 weeks usually.  

They use small needles, and it is no big deal.. The area feels a bit numb later.  I love the relief.

Also I use Lidoderm Lidocaine Patches or Flector Patches for relief.  

To prevent flare ups, try two Robitussin Cough GELS 30 minutes prior to any activity.  They last for 12 hours with no side effects.. The "DM" raises the Serotonin leves in the brain.  People with back pain tend to be low in Serotonin.  $4.65 at WalMart for a bottle.

I found a Far Infrared Heating Pad works great also.. It stimulates blood flow 3 cc deep in the tissue.. www.thermotex.com 30 day money back guarantee..  I suggest the Platinum version.. You can even sleep with it strapped on set on Low.  I use it in my computer chair.  I have used it also on my Bicep for a tear.  

Cheers.      

[LazyMoose]

Anyone in pain owes it to them selves to do what is nessesary to relieve it.

Myofasial massage is truly amassing when done properly. I learned it myself. Anyone can do this, if you think creativity and use tennis and golf balls plus buy yourself a "Thera Cane".

If is doesnt work for someone its generaly because :

- they luckily dont have trigger points ( a local buildup of lactic acid)
- its not being done correctly
- its not being done enough times initially the first 2 weeks

learn it yourself from the many workbooks available on this, do this 2x per day the first two weeks and you will feel the benefits.

Done before bedtime you will sleep better and wake much less sore.

In anyone that has muscle knots, its impossible to stretch them out. You only end up stretching the muscle around the knots. Can you pull a knot out of a garden hose? no, same thing. Can any fluid flow through a garden hose that has a knot in it? No, again, same thing.

There is also something very satisfying about relieving and healing body pain your self. But if you ask a chiro about this it may be difficult to get a straight answer, since they may never see you again if you learn this!

[mkh9]

did you have the trigger point injections or a myofasial massage? Did the injections hurt alot during or after?
thanks
mkh9

[Little_bird]

I just had an injection done yesterday for a muscle in my shoulder blade that just wouldn't relax.  Ive been several times for massage, and that helped but they couldnt get the muscle knot to release.  My MD suggested an injection(s), so I went ahead.  Injection itself was painful but not bad.  Today I just feel like its bruised.  The radiating pain in the front of my shoulder and down my arm is gone, but back pain still there.  He said it may take up to a week, and I do have a 90-minute massage scheduled tomorrow which he said will help, so well see how much.

[GettingOlder]

I had 4 sessions and it helped quite a bit, but after close to a month later I was
feeling some pain again, but not as bad as when I first began the sessions. My doc
is now suggesting nerve block injections which I'll start after the turn of the new year.
There are many YouTube examples of the therapy. Best wishes!