Disipline acts on 5 yrs old

When I spank my son witch is rarely I give him warnings and timeouts first, but his actions of crying, excuses and plain defience topple my nerves and paience.  But I calm down collect myself and get myself ready for the Mr.belt. Most of the time i mention it and he calms down and behaves.  But I did actually use it on him one night. But when I do punish him this way i do it without the anger and frustration. I do it with love and concern. So he gets the point that his actions have consequences now and later in life. And the rest of the night he was a normal little boy. It was nice to have my normal everyday happy go lucky boy. He almost made me feel like he said, ( Okay I tested you daddy and you called my bluff good job). Most of the time we are buddies but sometime you have to be the daddy, hear for a reason. To raise him right.  Later on when it was bath time, he took off his shirt I noticed a welt right above his butt cheek.  A nasty red mark. I felt so bad. But the next day I sent him to school everythings fine. Then my ex wife picks him up later that evening. Around 7 o'clock she calls cussing me out. Apparantly there are bruises. 2 am the next morning I'm arrested for assault and battery. I'm not a abusive father, i love my family. What my question is, someone please tell me.  Is there such thing as accidental abuse?  I need something, the court system has taken him away and give my ex wife termporary custody. There is only one real positive to my son not being here. It Is so we can settle a little easier with my two week newborn son. Which my older one has not met yet.

[margypops]

No to your question , no accidental abuse ,you chose to hit your child so you have to learn and take the consequences.

[AnxiousGurl]

There are other ways you can discipline your son. As margypops said you have to live with the consequences. If you'd like to know how you can discipline him I know some techniques. If you're interested let me know, since I dont think any form of physical punishment is ok, by any means whatsoever.

[just1dad]

I too am going through something simular, my 5yr old is a beautiful child but when we are talking to him it seem like he does not hear us so are constantly repeating ourselves. He acts out in class by not listening,
hitting and kicking other kids at times and recently bit another child. We have talked to him, explained about concquences for his actions.
Did the time outs which have not worked. tried the progressive discipline thing and when all else failed bring out the belt and give licks. people frown the belt but it got results when we were kids. I don't like that form of discipline but I feel i have tried everything I know. So I am asking for help for me, my son and the fathers and sons to come. I love my son and I don't want to hurt him so please us. We don't have a lot of financial resources at our disposal but we will try anything to get our little boy back!

[margypops]

You wont get him back by hitting it has been shown by experts never to work unless you want your child to fear you......so you hit him with a belt because he doesnt listen to you.......it is because you got the belt that you do it, it didnt hurt you you say..yet you are doing it also.perhaps some counselling and anger management may be in order for you.,'you dont want to hurt him" ?    Focus on his positive side and praise him when you see him doing something right, perhaps leave any 'disciplining to his Mom

[Shytreasure]

I'm not familiar with the laws in VA but in CA the problem is that there are no laws that say what is ok and what is not ok regarding corporal punishment. The biggest problem with that is it leaves to the discretion of each social worker or cop, at the time of the incident, to decide if an illegal act has occurred and what to charge you with.

Generally the accepted guideline is open hand only, no more than 3 swats only on the thigh or the buttocks. There is no requirement though that a social worker or cop apply this guideline.

Being that you now have an open case, drop any corporal punishment off your list of  useable punishments. Luckily, for a five year old the list of useful punishments is long.

1) discipline actually means to teach. Out think your kid by anticipating his behaviors before they occur, discuss normal childhood behaviors with him, why they occur and what the consequences maybe AND  that he will have a turn to talk before any consequences are handed out. Discussion with an ADD child must be kept to a concise minimum as they are not able to track complete conversations.
This probably doesn't apply to your boy but it might for just1dad's son.

2) Time outs are still applicable for a 5 year old. Natural and logical consequences should become a more effective tool for a growing child. Loss of privileges for temporary periods tend to hit home with kids. Extra work projects like weeding the garden or helping to fix something is really useful as it tends to bring kids in more contact with parent, which is what they may have needed in the first place.

3) DING, DING, DING, DING, DING!! You have a two week old child in the house! Acting out behavior is totally normal and should be expected in siblings of newborns, especially siblings in a blended family.

ADDITIONALLY,

Corporal punishment teaches no skills. It does not teach self-control or problem solving or decision making or conflict resolution or emotion regulation or compassion etc, etc, etc.

Yes we were spanked as kids but our parents were often not taught any additional parenting skills beyond punish with fear. They also did not have the benefit of research that gave indication of well-balanced, adults with good social outcomes tended to come from parents that did not use corporal punishments as a behavior modification tool.

Moving on to today's problem;
Stop wasting energy in defending yourself to yourself. Social workers are used to that. What they are not used to are parents who take the challenge head on, sign up for parenting classes before they are required to do so, find out what the courts are likely to ask for and put those processes in place ahead of time. Be proactive in finding out what needs your son maybe experiencing at this time. Temporarily if you can not have contact, have the social worker keep you informed if your boy needs counseling or seems nervous because all the crazed adult activity swirling around him, his changed environment and day to day structure.

For the sake of your son's emotional well-being, now is not the time to take the easy way out because of the newborn. Get help in taking care of the baby from friends or family so you can give proper attention to your boy and these issues.

Start thinking about what you're going to say to your son when you have the chance to talk about all this. Start by not blaming his behavior, that is no longer the issue. More than likely he's already blaming himself terribly anyway. He needs to feel safe with you and assured that dad is trying to do everything to be back with him. and is learning new things everyday.

This situation will not be a forever thing a few months from now it will all be different. Hang in there.

[Shytreasure]

Lots of parents and kids go through the same ordeal. Look for educated support groups of challenging kids, talk to your doctor for leads with groups, ask friends WHO HAVE SUCCESSFULLY raised challenging kids, do research. None of these options should require money and should help to make you feel like your back in the drivers seat, at least a little.

[skepticalpeach]

Anyone from Canada can confirm this for me if it's true, but I've read that it is illegal in Canada to use anything but the palm of your hand to spank a child. It's a pretty good idea to have a law like this so something like your situation doesn't happen. I would totally freak out if someone hit or spanked my daughter, no matter how badly she was behaving. So, I don't really know what else to tell you because you can't go back and change the past. "Accidental abuse" may be pushing it...

[teddybears4ever2]

My parents didn't believe in spanking or any kind of physical discipline.  My dad always claimed that he didn't want to scare us into behaving.  Instead he wanted to teach us how to behave.   Reward good behavior.  Time outs are ok, but try not to go father than that.
When I was 14 or 15 years old my uncle wanted me to do something for him.  I refused because I wasn't his maid.  He smacked me in the face and left a mark.  I sat in my room and cried for several hours, called my at the time best friend, and refused  to come out of my room.  When my parents got home they asked what had happened, and I didn't lie to them.
They had a nice chat with him about how I wasn't his daughter or even blood related to him.  He had no right to smack me because I did nothing wrong.  My parents told him if he ever did that to any of their daughters again they would have him arrested.  To this day I still have nothing to say to him.
I don't blame your ex wife for wanting her son to be safe.  What you did was out of line.  Maybe it will teach you that abuse no matter how you see it is wrong.

[vsentz]

hehehe accidental abuse....


I like that.


How about your accidental jail time? Hope you accidentally understand that no kid should be abused, mistreated or neglected. And if by accident, you do get out of your accidental jail time, I hope your wife accidentally find another person with a brain to father that little newborn that deserves a real man as a dad.

So glad we accidentally have good laws and your ex has full custody of your accidental child.

Just a thought.

[munchkinsmommy]

Hitting a child with a belt is horrible. You were arrested because you injured your child. It was NOT an accident. You purposely picked up the belt and hit your child with it. You can't claim ignorance to the fact that using a makeshift whip on you child would leave welts and bruising. You used a weapon on your kid. Now YOU can get the point that YOUR actions have consequences now and later in life.

[sweetlilbj]

Are u a nutcase? Accidental abuse? Dude, there is not even such a thing pertaining to animals!! U kick a dog with your foot, thats animal abuse, u beat your child with a belt, thats CHILD ABUSE!!! DOWN & DIRTY! MAN, U WEREN'T BORN YESTERDAY!!! Accidental???? U sent him to school & everything was fine??? NOT! THE second it took for u to decide to use a belt, made it AUTOMATICALLY NOT FINE!!  YOU dont deserve to even be near either child!!!! Its the LAW DUDE!! U DO NOT EVER HIT/SLAP/SPANK ur child!!!  If your nerves & patience are that short with a 5 yr old thats crying who understands english, what r u goina do when that infant is wailing nonstop at the top of his/her lil lungs, u tell it to hush, no comprehende..... cuz its a NEWBORN, wtf u goina do? Grab the belt??? U dont hv enuf willpower to look before u leap! Pathetic!!  Warnings?? U mean THREATS ABOUT MR. BELT!! WTF??? U NAMED THE BELT??? Indeed a positive the older son not there, a better positive would be if u werent there! Dude, u r sorry, & would not last 2 seconds in my house, around my children. Leave ur key on coffee table & lock the knob on your way OUT! ASTA LA VEEESTA BAABY! AND TAKE UR FRKN MR.BELT FRIEND WITH YOU!! MAKE LIKE A TREE & LEAVE!!! Hav you got the message yet???? Later!

[sweetlilbj]

Are u a nutcase? Accidental abuse? Dude, there is not even such a thing pertaining to animals!! U kick a dog with your foot, thats animal abuse, u beat your child with a belt, thats CHILD ABUSE!!! DOWN & DIRTY! MAN, U WEREN'T BORN YESTERDAY!!! Accidental???? U sent him to school & everything was fine??? NOT! THE second it took for u to decide to use a belt, made it AUTOMATICALLY NOT FINE!!  YOU dont deserve to even be near either child!!!! Its the LAW DUDE!! U DO NOT EVER HIT/SLAP/SPANK ur child!!!  If your nerves & patience are that short with a 5 yr old thats crying who understands english, what r u goina do when that infant is wailing nonstop at the top of his/her lil lungs, u tell it to hush, no comprehende..... cuz its a NEWBORN, wtf u goina do? Grab the belt??? U dont hv enuf willpower to look before u leap! Pathetic!!  Warnings?? U mean THREATS ABOUT MR. BELT!! WTF??? U NAMED THE BELT??? Indeed a positive the older son not there, a better positive would be if u werent there! Dude, u r sorry, & would not last 2 seconds in my house, around my children. Leave ur key on coffee table & lock the knob on your way OUT! ASTA LA VEEESTA BAABY! AND TAKE UR FRKN MR.BELT FRIEND WITH YOU!! MAKE LIKE A TREE & LEAVE!!! Hav you got the message yet???? Later!

[Sahd]

You hit your kid with a belt hard enough to leave bruises and you are surprised that there are consequences?

You didn't discipline you hit your child with a weapon!

[DanaCarlson]

Since when did spanking become a bad thing?.children should be disciplined. Now everyone gets judged and arrested for spanking.  Crazy

[DanaCarlson]

Not saying you should beat your child. Especially with a belt etc..