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PATM: Let's stop this madness! We need to prove that it exists or not!
LET'S END THE UNCERTAINTY ABOUT PATM ONCE AND FOR ALL!
Ok the big problem with PATM is YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW IF IT'S REAL OR NOT...
because...
NO ONE HAS MADE A SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH OR EXPERIMENT IN A CONTROLLED ENVIRONNENT!
PATM is still an HYPOTHESIS in the eyes of the medical science. After a serious experiment, the hypothesis will then be accepted or rejected.
If PATM is REAL then:
- It's condition that medical science misunderstand, has not researched yet and did not find a cure yet.
- Probably, having that condition, you end up becoming paranoid and thinking you are causing 100% of cough and sneezing, which is not the case (and you will make yourself more crazy and you will look even more crazy), but in your mind the uncertainty probably make you think that you could possibility be the cause of the cough and sneezing every time, hence making you paranoid in that regard... although you cause some cough and sneezing.
- If you the kind of people who never care, then you would probably never came to this forum and researched about it. You would have PATM and not know about it.
If PATM is DELUSION then:
- We are all a bunch of crazy people with a mental disorder. Psychiatrists will have to update the DSM... Maybe PATM is already OLFACTORY DELUSION DISORDER.
- All the people on this forum are just crazy people trying to cure something that does not exist by using desperate treatments, pills, vitamins and a lot of things that maybe can cause more harm, be very dangerous or other problems. The cure would really come from the psychiatric science in that case.
We need to prove that PATM exist first!
Here is a proposition at relative minimal cost:
MAKE A CONTROLLED SCIENTIFIC TEST: (I'm not a scientist so someone else can probably make a better plan)
- Rent a small room for a day
- Have 4 computers in that room
- Pay like 3 persons to assist the experiment saying that it's a scientific research to test computer skill on some random program for 3 hours
- Have the person with PATM sit on one of the computer (faking to be a participant)
- The host/"scientist" should in reality note down how many times the participants cough and sneeze in 2 scenarios:
-- First test: in the "normal" group, the person with PATM should never have entered the room (or even the building to be sure...). During the 3 hours, the host will note down how many times the participants cough/sneeze in a "normal" environment.
-- Second test: in the "PATM" group, the person with PATM should be a participant on one of the computer (the other people should not know about it). During the 3 hours, the host will note down how many times the participants cough/sneeze in a "PATM" environment (do not count cough/sneeze by the person with PATM)
- Finally, compare how many times the people cough/sneeze in the first test and in the second test.
- Do both tests many times again with difference participants to reduce error margin. Also, if you have a big budget, hire a lot more people to do the test with many computers. It will reduce the margin of error.
If you can make a serious work and publish it here, then medical science will start to get some interest about it... (Of course, the scientific tests can also conclude that we are all crazy). If there is no serious experiment in a somewhat controlled experiment, then the medical science will ignore PATM and will probably put most of the energy and budget on things that have been proven and have more serious consequences like cancer, etc.
If you don't have the budget to make a small experiment then try to record your classroom, office or something showing how everything is fine before you arrive and then how a lot of people start to cough and sneeze every time you come after a while. (Do it very discreetly only for the PATM's desperate scientific test sake... or people will think you are some voyeur and go to jail. LOL. yeah there's a risk...) You might need many recordings to reduce the margin of error. If someone else can help you record the "before" and "after" then that could help.
What this forum needs is SCIENTIFIC PROOF that PATM exists.
Right now, either:
- WE ARE CRAZY
OR
- WE HAVE A WEIRD CONDITION THAT NO ONE BELIEVES
I am not sure myself.
However, I also consider this:
- If it's proven real and a cure is not found yet, then we will get discrimination. Who wants to hire someone with PATM or have a student with PATM?
- If it's proven real, then medical science will be able to put some budget on it to try to find a cure.
I tried some very informal tests before but they were inconclusive... I hope one day I can do a more serious test to be sure once and for all... Or I wish that someone else can do something and publish the results here...
So what do you think about this? Does it makes sense?
Ok the big problem with PATM is YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW IF IT'S REAL OR NOT...
because...
NO ONE HAS MADE A SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH OR EXPERIMENT IN A CONTROLLED ENVIRONNENT!
PATM is still an HYPOTHESIS in the eyes of the medical science. After a serious experiment, the hypothesis will then be accepted or rejected.
If PATM is REAL then:
- It's condition that medical science misunderstand, has not researched yet and did not find a cure yet.
- Probably, having that condition, you end up becoming paranoid and thinking you are causing 100% of cough and sneezing, which is not the case (and you will make yourself more crazy and you will look even more crazy), but in your mind the uncertainty probably make you think that you could possibility be the cause of the cough and sneezing every time, hence making you paranoid in that regard... although you cause some cough and sneezing.
- If you the kind of people who never care, then you would probably never came to this forum and researched about it. You would have PATM and not know about it.
If PATM is DELUSION then:
- We are all a bunch of crazy people with a mental disorder. Psychiatrists will have to update the DSM... Maybe PATM is already OLFACTORY DELUSION DISORDER.
- All the people on this forum are just crazy people trying to cure something that does not exist by using desperate treatments, pills, vitamins and a lot of things that maybe can cause more harm, be very dangerous or other problems. The cure would really come from the psychiatric science in that case.
We need to prove that PATM exist first!
Here is a proposition at relative minimal cost:
MAKE A CONTROLLED SCIENTIFIC TEST: (I'm not a scientist so someone else can probably make a better plan)
- Rent a small room for a day
- Have 4 computers in that room
- Pay like 3 persons to assist the experiment saying that it's a scientific research to test computer skill on some random program for 3 hours
- Have the person with PATM sit on one of the computer (faking to be a participant)
- The host/"scientist" should in reality note down how many times the participants cough and sneeze in 2 scenarios:
-- First test: in the "normal" group, the person with PATM should never have entered the room (or even the building to be sure...). During the 3 hours, the host will note down how many times the participants cough/sneeze in a "normal" environment.
-- Second test: in the "PATM" group, the person with PATM should be a participant on one of the computer (the other people should not know about it). During the 3 hours, the host will note down how many times the participants cough/sneeze in a "PATM" environment (do not count cough/sneeze by the person with PATM)
- Finally, compare how many times the people cough/sneeze in the first test and in the second test.
- Do both tests many times again with difference participants to reduce error margin. Also, if you have a big budget, hire a lot more people to do the test with many computers. It will reduce the margin of error.
If you can make a serious work and publish it here, then medical science will start to get some interest about it... (Of course, the scientific tests can also conclude that we are all crazy). If there is no serious experiment in a somewhat controlled experiment, then the medical science will ignore PATM and will probably put most of the energy and budget on things that have been proven and have more serious consequences like cancer, etc.
If you don't have the budget to make a small experiment then try to record your classroom, office or something showing how everything is fine before you arrive and then how a lot of people start to cough and sneeze every time you come after a while. (Do it very discreetly only for the PATM's desperate scientific test sake... or people will think you are some voyeur and go to jail. LOL. yeah there's a risk...) You might need many recordings to reduce the margin of error. If someone else can help you record the "before" and "after" then that could help.
What this forum needs is SCIENTIFIC PROOF that PATM exists.
Right now, either:
- WE ARE CRAZY
OR
- WE HAVE A WEIRD CONDITION THAT NO ONE BELIEVES
I am not sure myself.
However, I also consider this:
- If it's proven real and a cure is not found yet, then we will get discrimination. Who wants to hire someone with PATM or have a student with PATM?
- If it's proven real, then medical science will be able to put some budget on it to try to find a cure.
I tried some very informal tests before but they were inconclusive... I hope one day I can do a more serious test to be sure once and for all... Or I wish that someone else can do something and publish the results here...
So what do you think about this? Does it makes sense?
Hello to all from Russia. I apologize in advance for my speech, I do not know English so use a translator computer. I'm from Russia as already wrote. I have exactly the same problem. People cough, sneeze, RUB their noses in my presence. To describe all the nuances will not you already know all about it. We have a group same as you, but we can't achieve a result, doctors don't believe us and you principle. Suggest to join in the announcement of this problem, about it should learn all to help us. Read your proposal to make a video with proof, we can do it too. A joint video I think will produce more resonance. Can contact me by mail sadchikova-***@**** or find in Skype Privet all from Russia. I apologize in advance for my speech, I do not know English so use a translator computer. I'm from Russia as already wrote. I have exactly the same problem. People cough, sneeze, RUB their noses in my presence. To describe all the nuances will not you already know all about it. We have a group same as you, but we can't achieve a result, doctors don't believe us and you principle. Suggest to join in the announcement of this problem, about it should learn all to help us. Read your proposal to make a video with proof, we can do it too. A joint video I think will produce more resonance. Can contact me by mail sadchikova-***@**** or find in Skype live:sadchikova-l. Let us cooperate!the
I'm not sure if all PATM is related to Morgellons, but the posters ITT describing the floating filaments are certainly Morging out.
There is no uncertainty about whether PATM is real or a delusion when it is full-blown. That's like doubting that the earth is round or that the the sun brings light to the day.
Nevertheless, your test is an excellent idea to show non-sufferers/docs the reality of the issue.
There is no uncertainty about whether PATM is real or a delusion when it is full-blown. That's like doubting that the earth is round or that the the sun brings light to the day.
Nevertheless, your test is an excellent idea to show non-sufferers/docs the reality of the issue.
ITS REAL. of course its real if it isnt real none of us would be here. duh duh u dont need a science experient. look man your not crazy or paranoia. we all have it. why do docs or anyone believe us cause there dumb and not educated about it. docs and there degree or anything else in this world is just for show. show and tell. to cure patm diet, execrise, no stress, fibe, water alot of it. and maybe single mutli vitamin. none of that quick fix shengans crap thing. i tell u do this for a year and your bound to see improves. pm got any questions just wanna chat . bye
I find that spraying Comet removes it from surfaces or clothes, and that keeps the dust from floating around as much when I move. Recently I filled a little spray bottle with Apple Cider Vinegar and I have sprayed that in my mouth, in my hair, or even - although this stings horribly! - up my nose. That also helps. I started adding tea tree oil (1 T) in the laundry rise cycle, and this has helped the clothing a lot. I see less little fiber balls, and I now see oddly kinked thin, thin fibers... as if something was not able to form tightly wound balls. It helps, but only cuts down on it.
The fuzz are kind of bugs and we are the host. try sulfur ,olive oil and little ammonia and you see it coming out from your skin. I am suffering for 2 years , I make people itch around me and it's contagious.
What kind of tests did you do??
I first started personalising the coughing 3 years ago. I even tempted myself it was an 'overlord'. It look a lot of time and travelling to get my head around it and firmer in reality. I also think it comes down to the fact we're all very sensitive to sounds and we personalise everyone's reactions. So it's a form of social anxiety just like people who personalise others' laughter, but like Pavlov's bell - it's peircing to us, the sound of a cough or sneeze, we condition the sound with intense feelings about the social environment. The peircing sound conditioning our social paranoia is so effective as to make us literally jump ship into delusional fancy.
Yes - in the end we just look more and more crazy. Especially when we think all coughs say the same thing and especially if we move around thinking the world is out to get us. The main thing is, we personalise them and condition the sound with our feelings of alienation, fear and sensitivity.
It does exist among certain individuals a lot more than others. But it's being done in public spaces more than usual, for comfort, hostility, slightest irritation, slightest shift of emotion, mainly to assert themselves.
Even a friend experiences it all the time but knows they're not directed at him. They're just assertive coughs - to prove a harder edge in the office. He's noticed 'grunting' as a new bizarre phenomena. In meetings where people literally butt heads in confrontation, they 'grunt', 'cough'. Or rub noses, urgently snifff or urgently toss hair along with other displacement body language.
I will try to do an experiment like the above somehow and will pass on to a couple of others.
I first started personalising the coughing 3 years ago. I even tempted myself it was an 'overlord'. It look a lot of time and travelling to get my head around it and firmer in reality. I also think it comes down to the fact we're all very sensitive to sounds and we personalise everyone's reactions. So it's a form of social anxiety just like people who personalise others' laughter, but like Pavlov's bell - it's peircing to us, the sound of a cough or sneeze, we condition the sound with intense feelings about the social environment. The peircing sound conditioning our social paranoia is so effective as to make us literally jump ship into delusional fancy.
Yes - in the end we just look more and more crazy. Especially when we think all coughs say the same thing and especially if we move around thinking the world is out to get us. The main thing is, we personalise them and condition the sound with our feelings of alienation, fear and sensitivity.
It does exist among certain individuals a lot more than others. But it's being done in public spaces more than usual, for comfort, hostility, slightest irritation, slightest shift of emotion, mainly to assert themselves.
Even a friend experiences it all the time but knows they're not directed at him. They're just assertive coughs - to prove a harder edge in the office. He's noticed 'grunting' as a new bizarre phenomena. In meetings where people literally butt heads in confrontation, they 'grunt', 'cough'. Or rub noses, urgently snifff or urgently toss hair along with other displacement body language.
I will try to do an experiment like the above somehow and will pass on to a couple of others.
Did you have the floating filaments? That, and the infernal sensations caused by them are my only symptoms I'm aware of at this time.
Sounds like very good advice,I have taken probiotics and the glutamine powder on advice from a herbalist,whom I had confided in, and she also advised it might be a yeast that has grown and taken over my system. I didn't follow the diet very well because I didnt think there was any change, but maybe if I stuck with It long enough there might have been.Your advise is greatly needed and I will start with those supplements also. . I am glad to have found this forum, I have suffered with this alone for years. Maybe collectively we can beat this.
God Bless you always ! The pain of the stares and whispers behind our back, the sneezes and coughs is very real my friend - and we have all experienced it unfortunately !!!
through this forum we have all helped each other to find a cure on our own, without waiting for science, doctors or blaming others !!!!
u can start with oregano oil capsules (with p73 on the label) to relieve the symptoms of the smell - however u must do much more if u want to STOP the patm
for me what has CURED my PATM reactions from people is : eating and/or jucing/smoothies a majority plant based diet, probiotics, L-glutamine powder, whey protein powder, water, vitamins and minerals (calcium, magnesium, zinc, vitamin c, vitamin d3, b6, b12, chlorella) , chia seeds, sleep, exercise, going to the sauna about 3 times a week to get toxins out, no dairy, no sugar - yes to Stevia, coconut oil, probiotic digestive enzymes
U can do it too, if u choose to take action in improving your health
always know that God is with you each step of the way !!!!!!
through this forum we have all helped each other to find a cure on our own, without waiting for science, doctors or blaming others !!!!
u can start with oregano oil capsules (with p73 on the label) to relieve the symptoms of the smell - however u must do much more if u want to STOP the patm
for me what has CURED my PATM reactions from people is : eating and/or jucing/smoothies a majority plant based diet, probiotics, L-glutamine powder, whey protein powder, water, vitamins and minerals (calcium, magnesium, zinc, vitamin c, vitamin d3, b6, b12, chlorella) , chia seeds, sleep, exercise, going to the sauna about 3 times a week to get toxins out, no dairy, no sugar - yes to Stevia, coconut oil, probiotic digestive enzymes
U can do it too, if u choose to take action in improving your health
always know that God is with you each step of the way !!!!!!
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