We need scientific experiments to prove (or disprove) PATM!
I am not a scientist. But I have a rational scientific mind and I understand business. I will try here to explain why the medical science does not believe in PATM:
It does not make sense to me that since all those years nobody had tried to prove the existence of PATM in a more scientific way...
But at the same time... I understand my situation. That weird problem drag me down so much that I don't even want to deal with it more. It a heavy burden that I just want to avoid. When I don't have the symptoms, I just try to enjoy the little moments of happiness I can get. I don't want to think about it. I just want it to disappear. So yeah. I guess it's difficult for us to want to do a proactive serious scientific experiment ourselves to prove or refute the existence of the condition informally called "PATM".
Doctors, governments, medical clinic, etc... are all businesses in a way. They are rational. They will put energy on things that give the most beneficial results.
There are so many HYPOTHESIS about all POSSIBLE diseases and conditions... PROBABLY 99.9999% OF ALL INDIVIDUAL'S HYPOTHESIS ARE FALSE.
There's a lot of crazy people and thinking about anything in the world... Doctors and scientists cannot spend their whole budget and time to verify the crazy problems and mostly end up false.
The priority will probably be on:
1. Deadly disease/condition, serious problems
2. Disease/condition that are practical, easily seen, already proven
(PATM is pretty far some those rational priorities in term of research.)
Conditions and diseases that can be seen practically are a lot easier to prove: it does not take big scientific test to show there's a problem if you cut a finger and it's bleeding. Everyone can see it and can confirm the situation.
If it's something that cannot be seen and confirmed easily by everyone, then it's abstract. THERE IS A HUGE RISK OF THE MIND'S IMAGINATION BIASING WHAT THE PERSON THINKS THE PROBLEM IS. (A lot of people are indeed crazy. It is not impossible that PATM is a delusion. However, some things are real... Science is a tool to differential what is crazy and what is real. Until it is proven by science, it is considered as not real by the modern medical science... If doctors were to believe all the crazy disease/condition, they would still use fire to cure a burn or something like that and sometime cause more harm than good to patients.)
So mostly, in the case of this kind of weird condition like PATM and that seem pretty rare, we are on our own... until we show some solid scientific evidence that PATM exist. Then the "priority level" for PATM will go higher (it will not just be one of the possible unproven condition/disease hidden in the high mountain of crazy hypothesis of disease/condition that don't exist) (In a business way of thinking, pharmaceutical companies will only get interest in research to find a cure if people buy pills to fix the problem... They have to pay the cost of the research. It's rational and normal. There are disease and condition more serious and that affect more people in the world...)
- Someone or some group of people should do some scientific research on it (see my previous post called "PATM: Let's stop this madness! We need to prove that it exists or not!" to see an example of a controlled scientific experiment to test this condition)
- I am ready to donate 500$ to make it happen. If other people are ready to pool in, it's even better. I just need someone to be serious enough to post a plan for a scientific experiment to test the hypothesis that PATM exist (and then if it's serious enough, I'll approve, send the money and hope the person will do the experiment correctly). I don't expect an extremely serious work, but I has to be done in a good enough and honest "scientific method" way so scientist and medical experts can start to think: "ok... maybe it's a real condition. maybe we can put some money to do more research on it" OR to show that we are indeed crazy and PATM does not exist OR the result could be inconclusive.
It's my proposition to "break the ice" between PATM and science... For science, PATM is not real until results from a scientific experiment show that it really exists.
I was frustrated that doctors and even my wife don't even believe me. But I have to be rational: if my best friend had this problem and I did not have it, I would think that friend is crazy... so I cannot expect other people to believe it...
Only the scientific method can really confirm or reject the hypothesis that PATM is real or not.
(Seems like my text is too long I divide it in two: part 1…)
I am really not sure of my own sanity anymore.
I am 80% sure that I have PATM for more than 10 years.
I just asked a friend today that I thought was always trying to say indirect suggestion that I smelled since a few years...
He seemed surprised that I asked and he told me that he never smelled something on me and he have a good nose and he would have detected something if he smelled something.
Every time I had that weird smell and heard him say certain things, I thought he wanted to say that I smelled bad.
I never asked for fear of more embarrassment... So I fact I was making crazy association of ideas.
So my hypothesis here is:
1. Maybe I have PATM/BO or maybe not
2. I get extremely paranoid/obsessive about PATM/BO that I make crazy interpretation that are wrong and I keep believing them because I never dare to ask if it was true or my imagination
So I am wondering if:
- I do have PATM/BO in some occasions (and let's say 1% of the time my interpretation is correct). And because of that I developed I big paranoia/obsessive delusion believing the other times I was sure that I caused the problem (99% of false interpretation)
- I am crazy 100% of the time and I have "Olfactory reference syndrome" (sorry in my other post i wrote olfactory delusion disorder... it's rather "Olfactory reference syndrome"
So before you go crazy imagining stuff. Help confirm with practical information: find a good way to ask if people smell something on you or get irritation from you or if something is wrong.
MY BIG QUESTION IS:
- Do people really say that you cause the allergic reaction directly to you?
- Is it you who concluded that you heard a conversion thinking that you cause the problem? Is it you who concluded that what the other person said was an indirect suggestion that you cause PATM?
I am not sure of anything anymore. I am desperate for some scientific experiment to confirm or refute the existence of PATM... People say they use treatments and stuff but scientifically they are not sure if PATM is real or not. (I say that but I tried many pills and treatments to fix that "possible" condition... Me too, I just want it to disappear...)
I think I have social phobia, OCD and maybe some paranoia. I wonder if PATM caused it or amplify it. Of if those conditions make me imagine PATM.
- When did someone say they were allergic to you and WHAT DID THEY SAY EXACTLY? (DON'T TELL ME YOUR INTERPRETATION, write down what they really said word by word of what YOU HEARD CLEARLY, not some part of a discussion that your mind filled with interpretations)
For the PATM: what people have TOLD ME word by word would be:
- (Nobody have ever told me anything about causing irritant reactions... I just interpreted that if in every classroom, office and other small rooms people cough/sneeze EVERYDAY/EVERY 5 to 15 minutes, then I must be causing an irritant effect)
For BO: what people have TOLD ME word by word would be:
- (Mostly nobody had every told me directly that I smell bad or that I smell like this or that.)
- [Talking to me] It smells like **** in here [while looking at me with a negative look] (interpreting as having fecal smell)
- [Classmate near me talking] It smells like sulphur in here (interpreting as having sulphur smell)
- [Relative] It's so smelly [while looking at me] (interpreting as me being smelly)
- [My mom when I was young] It smells like beer in here, did you drink beer? [I did not drink beer] (interpreting as me smelling like beer)
- [Relatively pretty often in my classrooms] It smells like cigarette/cigar in here (interpreting as me having cigarette/cigar smell)
- [Talking to me] I don't like anal people (interpreting as having fecal smell)
- Yeah there is the funny smell in here [in my hotel room] (interpreting as the person smell a bad odor before near me and still smell it in the hotel room)
- It smells like pee! [a girl in high school behind me saying that to the other girl... She said the same thing the day after] (interpreting as did smell like pee)
- [when I was young] It smells like ****! [a friend of my friend's sister] ... and then later my friend would say "It's ok for you to stay here. You should shower if you want to sleep here" (interpreting as I did smell like **** and my friend did smell a bad door from me and asked me to take a shower)
- [2 girls in a shop after I just walk in the aisle and then they went there] Ugh it's smell so bad. Someone just farted. People should be more considerate and hold it or do it at home. (interpreting as me having a constant fecal smell)
- [Janitor asking me] Do you know if there's a skunk in here it smells bad
- [Friend while I was driving] Did you smell that, it smelled like skunk
- [When I was young] (My brother sing some invented songs about smell, odor randomly all the time when we drove me somewhere)
- [Talking to my friend in high school] Ah! Your breath smells like something is rotting inside (from a close friend... that was pretty direct)
(The problem is that I did smell those odors before I heard about them... Listing all those "interpretation" make me think that I really do have body door... too many coincidence. I hate uncertainty. I hope my friend I wrote about on the top was not just trying to be nice and lie about my possible body odor...)
I am not sure if I wrote about it before but here are my history with PATM (hoping I am writing relevant information):
- Beginning of high school: my stomach would make constant noise as if I didn't eat anything
- End of high school: (I was binge drinking with friend sometimes I don't know if it destroyed my digestive system or if it did not affect PATM at all or if it's even related. On one of the binge drinking, the morning after I though I was almost dead. It was horrible. Worse than any bad morning after binge drinking I had. It hurted everywhere. I felt maybe like what a cancer patient would feel I guess... I just try some bepto bismol and drink a lot of water... i vomitted many times. i was a horrible day. the days after were bad but i slowly recovered )
- One day, I ate a pizza and then I had a severe stomach pain... I was lying on the floor alone for 1 hour and when I could I took some bepto bismol. I was slowly better after... It happened a few times for pizza and other food. I end up going to the doctors for a lot of tests and testing by myself with a lot of diets and pills but nothing seemed to make a difference. (i suspected lactose intolerance... but also so many other things... I am still not sure today... although those severe stomach pain never happened again. it was just during that year). But I always had a lot of gas and digestion problem. (i don't know if it all started when I started partying and drinking)
- Beginning of college: I would start to get some intense itchiness all over my skin. My nose would always be running, sneezing. (I do have a lot of allergies too)
- Beginning of college: my brother would start to always spitting to clear all the mucus in his throat.
- Beginning of college: in would notice my math teacher always have a runny nose. People around me having running nose, irritated eyes... And sometime, one person in the class with very red face. One day I started to think that I was causing those allergic reaction... When I started to one of the girl directly or next to her, everyday she would have a very red face (not like being shy... like red like an allergic reaction). One guy in my math class always had a red face like that too and coughing. EVERYDAY people around me would get constant cough, sneeze, irritated eye and sometime red face (specific people)
(Seems like my text is too long I divide it in two: part 2…)
- College: a girl next to my dorm would always be clearing her throat, sneezing. She sometimes left the window open in a freezing winter day when she was not there
- College: EVERYDAY IN ALL MY CLASSES people would be coughing and sneezing... It's as if 25% of the class had a cold EVERYDAY, but especially people near me. (I heard comments like: "it's weird, it's like everyone is sick here") In the classroom, the ventilation would not be running at full speed... and then when the teacher saw that a lot of people were coughing, I think they called the service to put it at full speed.... It happened VERY OFTEN! One of the classmate, when I started to talk to him, he would get that weird allergic red face too and started touching his nose as if there were some irritant getting in his nose.
- Nowadays: People near me: cough, sneeze, get itchy, have the eye irritated, some have a red face (in a allergic way), clear their throat, ... My wife clear her throat constantly, spit constantly having a lot of mucus. She has eye irritation especially on the bed. (She says she always had that problem, she never smelled anything, etc... Although I DO REMEMBER that she said at least once a long time ago (without me talking about it) "maybe I'm allergic to you", "I can smell something from you [...]".. I just wonder if she just stopped wanting to say anything about that because she knows it hurts me a lot, will make me more crazy trying to fix the problem... So yeah... I guess nice people don't want to tell the hurtful truth, but at the same time for this kind of possible condition it does not help to have certainty about PATM/BO... catch 22...)
After all those years I tried:
- Preparation H (unblock constipation, i think constipation make me smell)
- Charcoal pill
- Chlorophyl pill
- Garlic pill
- Vitamin (multivitamin, B-complex, and a lot of kind)
- Metamucil (more bowel movement, less smell)
- Probiotic (yogurt, acidophilus, etc.)
- Clorox/bleach bath (don't do this if you don't know the ratio!)
- Netipot (nasal rinse) (recently i started that... it does remove the smell for a few hours... i suspect something related with my sinus)
- Bepto bismol
- Soap (antibacterial, antifungal, different kinds)
- Tea tree oil
- Bath soap
- Allergy medication (i tried most of the OTC ones)
- charcoal pad for the underwear (...)
- Changing everything (soap, deodorant, clothes, home, get air purifier, shampoo, diet, ...)
- Diet (many tests: vegetarian, no diary, no bread, no [...])
- Digestion enzyme (for protein, carbohydrate, gluten, etc.)
- Hot pepper
- Abstinence (the weird smell would be strong after sex for a few days... First, i'm heterosexual. I think sex is the biggest cause of my bad smell. I can smell a very bad smell on me for the next few days and it's a constant correlation. It always increase my hemorrhoid and maybe causing "the end of the digestion system" to get too irritated/inflamed and the fecal things can get into my blood stream? some kind of leaky gut? it's my crazy guess. I read that some people had a muscle too developed near the anal area... Sex might trigger that muscle too much or something and messing with the lining/barrier of the digestive system... Talking in a cold scientific medical way: to be clear I am heterosexual and either I just masturbate or having normal sex... I don't think even homosexual would get a weird anal/fecal odor like I do... I think some people have thought I were gay because of the fecal smell.)
- I tested so many other pills and treatments that I forgot....
I would say the biggest correlation with my smell is:
- Sex (the problem is... as a "normal" male human, perfect abstinence is almost impossible, at least in my case. I also think that having no sex do reduce or remove the PATM irritant effect in my case... But I am not sure to remember... It's very difficult to be perfectly abstinent for a young male.) ... If in my case sex is the culprit for PATM, my hypothesis could be: leaky gut kind of effect from overdevelop muscle near "the end" of the digestive system/increase irritation/constipation/inflammation OR chemistry mix problem caused by metabolism and hormones OR someone very wrong with the functioning of my internal organs, including reproductive system... like the act of having sex triggers bad chemistry mix somehow OR I really know what... ...OR maybe it's all unrelated to PATM :(
- Netipot (it seems to clear the smell i can perceive for a few hours... I'm not sure if it just dulls my sense of smell)
I tried so many things... I did find any "ultimate" cure. I am thinking now to accept my condition and chose a lifestyle that fits PATM/BO... BUT THE PROBLEM IS: I AM NOT SURE IF ALL THIS IS JUST A DELUSION OR IF IT'S A REAL PROBLEM!!! Taking decision based on false assumption would be stupid! That annoys me a lot!
I try to live my live waking up everyday as if that problem never existed... But when people starts to cough/sneeze every 5 to 15 minutes... That hypothesis of PATM come back haunt me... And I am overwhelmed with guilt because I would cause PATM. I then come back home extremely stressed and depressed. (If I could remove my guilt feeling, I guess I would not care about PATM at all.... but I'm not a psychopath... I want to fix PATM because I like people and I would like them to like me. PATM make things very difficult.)
I wrote that I think I have social phobia, OCD and paranoia a different level... But I really wonder if this PATM condition is real... then would those mental disorder would be a "side-effect" caused by living with that very weird PATM condition?
The uncertainty of not being absolutely sure if we are all crazy or not... make me feel even more crazy!
Either PATM is real and it is a catch-22 ...or we are all crazy.
Please someone make a scientific experiment to test if PATM is real or not!
This site complies with the HONcode standard for trustworthy health information.
The Content on this Site is presented in a summary fashion, and is intended to be used for educational and entertainment purposes only. It is not intended to be and should not be interpreted as medical advice or a diagnosis of any health or fitness problem, condition or disease; or a recommendation for a specific test, doctor, care provider, procedure, treatment plan, product, or course of action. Med Help International, Inc. is not a medical or healthcare provider and your use of this Site does not create a doctor / patient relationship. We disclaim all responsibility for the professional qualifications and licensing of, and services provided by, any physician or other health providers posting on or otherwise referred to on this Site and/or any Third Party Site. Never disregard the medical advice of your physician or health professional, or delay in seeking such advice, because of something you read on this Site. We offer this Site AS IS and without any warranties. By using this Site you agree to the following Terms and Conditions. If you think you may have a medical emergency, call your physician or 911 immediately.