Father/Daughter relationships - How close is too close?

My boyfriend is divorced and his 10 year old daughter comes to stay with us every other weekend; During the summer she stays for longer periods of time.  Before I moved in and a few months after my boyfriend would allow his daughter to sleep in his bed and if I fell asleep in our bed he would sleep with her downstairs in her bed.  This bothered me so I asked him to please give her structure in our home and I asked for 2 things: 1) SHE NEEDS TO HAVE A BED TIME and be consistent with putting her to bed at that time. 2) DO NOT SLEEP IN THE SAME BED WITH YOUR DAUGHTER AND/OR LAY WITH HER INAPPROPRIATELY. These 2 issues bother me enough that I consider leaving.  My boyfriend does not see the importance in having a bed time for a child.  In his mind its the weekend so who cares how late she stays up.  He says that he does not get to spend that much time with her so every hour counts.  I agree with this just not when the child is staying up until 3-4am.  During this time she will scream out daddy! daddy! daddy! telling him she is sick, cold, thirsty, or scared. He runs to her every time she screams for him even if it causes us both to get 3-4 hours of sleep.  She used to crawl into our room and stand above her dad until he woke up.  I think there needs to be structure and when 9:30 on weekdays and 11pm on weekends rolls around then it is lights out and time to go to bed.  I don't think this is time for one more t.v. show or a bike ride then THINK about getting ready for bed.  Or the daughter negotiating on a bed time. Am I being to harsh on expecting a bed time and the bed time not include my boyfriend sleeping with her until she falls asleep?  I work late nights so I came home one night to see him spooning his daughter.  I know there is not sexual abuse but it is weird and freaks me out knowing he lays with her the same way he lays with me.  I am a strong individual and was raised by a mother and father who showered me with love and I never once saw anything like this.  When we take naps he will lay on the couch with her either infront of him stretched out or she will lay behind him with her arms around him and sometimes her legs wrapped over his.  She will lay her head on his lap near his package when watching t.v. as he strokes her arms, hair, and back to relax her.  He took her to drive his car and sat her on his lap which I feel she is way too old to be sitting on her dad that way.  When they play around she has put her crotch in his face to hold him down and she slaps his butt.  She has her body pressed all over his and I feel this is not right for a child who is approaching puberty.  When ever I show some affection she will try to duplicate it and that is why I try not to be too affectionate towards him infront of her. Simple things such as holding hands or hugging. I will ask for a neck massage which includes oil before I go to work sometimes and if she is there she will continuously say "me next" "me next" until he is finished with mine.  I personally feel weirded out by him putting oil all over neck and back since she has to pull her shirt up for him to do it.  I just don't like it!  My mom rubs my neck all the time but I feel there is a difference in the way my mom is allowed to touch me and the way my dad touches me.  I was laying on the couch with him one afternoon and I saw his daughter come out of her room and then all of a sudden she saw us laying on the couch so she dropped to the floor and crawled back in her room thinking no one saw her.  She then pretended to be sick for 6 hours until I went to work.  I told him that as soon as I went to work she would be fine and sure enough, as soon as I went to work she was cured from her sickness!  He does not see the manipulation that she pulls on him!  I need to know if I am freaking out when I see them laying all over each other for no reason or am I the one who is in the wrong for asking these things from him?  Am I being to strict when I ask for a bed time? Do I leave if these issues are not corrected.  

[mami1323]

Is the mother with anyone?  Perhaps the girl has experienced sexual abuse from someone else and is acting out in an oversexualized nature.  But I see more of a battle between the two of you for his attention.  She never sees him, other than every other weekend and so when she does, I don't blame her for wanting some attention from him.  I don't think she sees laying her head in his lap as a sexual thing and I don't see why kids can't be affectionate with their children.  Even fathers can be affectionate and it doesn't sound that inappropriate to me.  However, I do believe kids, even on the weekends shouldn't be up until 3 or 4 in the morning.  Although, we've been known to allow it on weekends when we had my fiance's kids.  We would go to bed and they would stay up watching tv and we let them.  Now sleeping in the same bed, I would be irritated with that as well.  She's old enough to go to sleep on her own.  So that I will give you.  But perhaps you are a little jealous of the affection and time he spends with his daughter.  I understand it, I've been there.  It's not a concious feeling but I recognize it because I felt it at one time when I first began dating my fiance.  It's normal to not want to divide your time but then you have to understand that this little girl only wants to spend time with her dad and that you see him more than she does.  How's your relationship with her?

[mami1323]

I meant, I don't see why kids can't be affectionate with their parents...not children.  Sorry about that.

[Judy246]

Hi, I sense a little mutual jelousy between you and the child and on your part and a little resentment, due to behaviors that you feel are inappropriate. You don't feel that nurturing bond with her, because she is not your daughter and you are bothered at the attention she is getting from your partner.

I agree 100% with you that rules must be set for bed time and he is no longer to sleep with her. She is becoming a young lady and it's time for dad to sleep on his bed and daugher on hers.. She is to go to bed at a set time and it's natural for a parent to be nurturing towards a daughter. To outside people it looks inappropriate, but a parent and child have a bond that can not be broken.

Talk with your partner and tell him that you need his support in setting appropriate bedtime rules and she is at an age where your going to have to ween daddy from being overly protective and affectionate, but remember, this is his daugher and that is his way of showing her affection. She will always be his baby no matter what age, but seperate bed and appropriate affection. It's going to be ok.

[crystalmichelle]

thank you for your comments!  i actually have a great relationship with his daughter.  We have a lot of fun bike riding and playing board games at the house. No sexual abuse has been suspected.  When she is in town they normally have the entire weekend to spend together.  I work 12-13 hour shifts on the weekends.  I might spend half a day with them.  What I am trying to express is not a consumption of time issue, it is their behavior with each other while I am getting ready for work (laying on top of each other) or coming home from work (sleeping in the bed together) that upsets me.  Is there an age where he should back off and not have her lay on him that way.  I am not asking him to stop the connection with his daughter I am simply asking he express his love in a different way such as bike riding, swimming, or anything that does not involve them putting their hands all over each other.

[mami1323]

Some people are more affectionate than others.  I know as a mother I would be all over my son if he let me at age 10.  My 15 year old step son is extremely affectionate with me.  He lays on me and I lay my legs on him.  That's how some people show love and there is nothing wrong with that.  My step daughter only recently started being less affectionate with her father and she is 13 but at age 10 she still like to cuddle with him.  Every now and then she will want to lay on him or on me.  Why should he stop being affectionate with his daughter?  It will actually show her later in life how she should be treated by a man.  This is your issue not his or his daughter's.  I don't think you have any right to tell him he can't be loving with his daughter.  Having bed times be consistent and him not sharing a bed with her are reasonable requests.  Other than that, he may grow to resent you if you keep telling him that he shouldn't be affectionate with his child.  Do you have children?  

[Michele, Katy, TX]

I can get where you are coming from.  I was brought up in a very consevative environment, where there were very definative boundaries between males/females of any age and relationship.  So, I get what you are saying.

I have 4 daughters myself w/ another on the way.  And they are very affectionate w/ my husband and he w/ them.  It is a bit different than what I grew up with, but I know my husband's family is more affectionate than mine is.  My girls age range from ages 8 down to age 2.  Sometimes, they lay on him kind of.  But he is always on his stomach.  He never has his front to them.  It's more them hanging on him and fighting for his attention than anything.  But there are a lot of them too.  My husband falls asleep on the couch a lot.  And sometimes one of them will fall asleep next to him w/ his arm out to the side, but not spooning.  

I have to leave work soon, but I will PM you.  I have a lot more to say, but not the time to do it now.

I would def voice your concerns.  I always feel like God gave us instricts for a reason.  I don't mean that your bf is doing anything wrong to this child.  I don't mean that at all.  I just mean that if you feel uncomfortable, then you feel uncomfortable.  And I agree that the way he is w/ you and the way he touches you should not be the same as his daughter.  If you feel strongly enough, you may not be able to stay in the relationship.  I also understand how that feels also.  You can't help how you feel is all I am trying to say.

It's so hard when coming into a relationship w/ someone w/ a child because you don't know what is within your right to say.

Anyway, I will PM you soon.

[imanaddict]

I think the term "Daddy's Girl" applies to this situation for sure!! I honestly don't see anything wrong with what you described except for the bedtime and sleeping in the same bed.

The daughter is one lucky girl to have her dad in her life. A lot of men don't even see their kids when the parents split up, or at all for that matter. Do you think you would feel different if it was a boy instead of a girl? Or do you think you would feel different if he did those things if it were yours and his child?

I have 3 children of my own and a stepson (who lives with us). We certainly lie in bed with our children and love on them. That's what parents SHOULD do! Show their children how much they are loved. My husband lets our daughter nap with him and I love that they have such a strong connection. I was a daddy's girl myself and I could talk my dad into moving the moon for me if it were at all possible. I also played sick because he always babied me. Even when I was a teenager...LOL!! My dad carried me to bed until I was 13 and then I got too heavy for him to lift =)

Also, how is her mother?? Does she show her daughter any attention at all? Is she good with her? Could it be possible that the girl is trying to compensate for a lack of attention from her mother?

[crystalmichelle]

I do not have children and that is why I am reaching out to get others views on the situation.  I think we have all played sick to get our parents attention at one point in time or another! But when they do it every single night they are in town...thats a bit much.  I would like to know what the difference is between them spooning at night and them spooning during the day while lounging around.  It seems to be acceptable during nap time but not at night?!?! When I was younger I remember laying next to my dad while napping but he was never behind me curled up!  My dad was never laying on his back and I on top with my chest pressed up against his, especially at age 10.  I understand someone having this kind of relationship when the child is younger but when the child is a foot shorter than I am then it seems to be...well...time to stop and show affection in other ways.  I know the importance of a father/daughter bond and the fact that he has so much passion to see his daughter is what first attracted me to him and that is one of the reasons I fell in love with my boyfriend.  I have prayed about it and prayed about it but it still bothers me.  Her mother seems to show her attention.  She is always calling to tell her good night and she loves her.  She has mentioned that her mother drinks sometimes but i do not know too much about their home life.  I am not asking him to stop being affectionate, i am asking him to stop displaying inappropriate body language between a man and child.  I feel that a 10 year old should not be pressed up against or lay on or sit on a mans private parts!  I think this is when she is going through womenly changes she could possibly confuse the affection he is showing her.  I want them to wrestle (sp?) around and goof off together, this is what builds a stronger relationship!  When we are all together we try and show her as much love as possible.  She is a great kid and I love our family time together (even though I am technically not her family) I feel as if we have developed another family together.  She sure is a daddy's girl!  But I love that considering my dad still calls me baby girl! (half the time I don't think my dad knows my real name!) jk  It is a blessing to have a father that loves you that much.  

[crystalmichelle]

i have to go to work now but i will check in tomorrow. very curious to see what you all have to say! and seriously i do appreciate your thoughts it helps me to open up and consider another view point

[mami1323]

That's a different story from what you wrote above.  Then yes, it's his job to put a stop to that kind of cuddling.  She should not be sitting on top of him in that way.  Tell him exactly the way you told us here in your last remark and perhaps that will make him see your side of things.

[iam1butterfly]

Maybe, what could be perceived as an extreme display of affection is just a non-custodial father's attempt to compensate for time not spent with his child.  
I would have loved to have had my father show me a fraction of the love and attention that this little 10 year old girl is getting.

[zzzmykids]

Dear crystalmichelle,
Have you had children? Our kids, when ten and up to about thirteen for one, would sneak in and sleep at the end or wiggle in between us at times.  Maybe she is feeling insecure. Her dad has a girlfriend.  Do you have your own place to sleep on weekends?
It is really not your place to "parent" or set boundaries for your boyfriend and his child.
He probably feels very guilty for not being there every day. Girls growing up without the attentiveness of their fathers grow up looking for it in other places. Like teenage boys.
Maybe it is a pain for you, then get your own place or just realize it is a phase to see who her dad will pick, you or her.
Don't be insecure, just roll with it.
If it were incest that would be a different story, but just sounds like insecurity.
zzzmykids

[Lucey12]

Do be aware but I dont think you need to be too worried. I slept in my parents bed till I was about 8. my dad slept nude, my mom didnt. Id either sleep on moms side or on top of the blankets in the middle. My mom and I cuddled spooning, never in any sexual manor just a loving way. Dad and I would cuddle on the couch till I was about 10. I never felt any of it was sexual and was well aware (and scared) when people got too close and in my private space,a s I was sexually abused by a cousin when I was about 1 or 2 years old. I dint think its too big of an issue in your case, but if its still happening in a couple years when she DOES hit puberty, then Id worry. If I were you Id try to spend more time with her so she sees you as part f her family so she isnt jealous of the pair of you cuddling.

[jo929]

I feel that a girl or boy should have their own bed to sleep in, also there should be rules weekend or not, also a girl of ten should not sleep in the same bed as the dad, or brother this leads to other things, and i have seen this happen in many familys due to the mother not keeping an eye out. i agree that he should not be in the same bed day or night, I have kept this to myself for many years, but when i was growing up there was not much bed space and some of us had to sleep with our parents, and mom put me with my dad, in the middle of the night i am 6 years old but i knew that it was not right hr tried to feel of me where he should not, and my mom had always told my sis and i if anyone tried to touch us inside our panties to tell someone, i got out of bed and spent the rest of the night on the floor, and in later years, i knew he did it intentionally,also my sisters girl was in the same situation only it was the granpa i had told my daughter and neice the same thing at a young age and my daughter, and neice came to me and told me that he was feeling inside their pants and they jumped down, and i did something about it, it seems he had been doing this to both of his grandaughters, so play it safe for the childs sake I have also worked at mental places where the father had played house and raped the child, so this sleeping together is not good, the Dr all say a baby or child should have their own bed, and yes i would worry about it, i raised 3 daughters and i am a lot older that most of you. and i know that it does not take much for a certain part of a mans anatomy to react. i know a lot of people will not like my answer but i am being honest,this girl is 10 years old,and she is pushing you with some of her behavior, and if he goes along with his daughters behavior , i would get out  lots  luck  jo

[seamom]

I think the feminist agenda is working overtime on some of you here. Girls either learn about physical affection from their dads or they learn it on the street. You can be as idealistic as you want, but girls have to learn how to treat their future man from her dad. Moms cannot teach them, they don't have what it takes to know what a man wants.

So, while dads refrain from touching spots reserved for her future man, there is nothing wrong with dads doing their job.

SeaMom

[peaceinknowing]

I have to agree with what some members are posting here when they say to you that they sense a bit of jealousy between both you and his daughter. Some children and/or parents are more affectionate than others. You say that your mother and father were very affectionate with you and showered you with love, but this doesn't necessarily mean that what you experienced is what other children these days experience with their parents. I think you have some very intelligent and strong views when it comes to this, but I also feel as though you have nothing to worry about. The daughter unfortunately comes from a broken home where she doesn't see her father as much as she once used to when her mother and your boyfriend were together. I'm 28 years old and to this day, I'm the apple of my father's eyes and I know that I always will be.

Try and stay calm about all of this the best way you know how. I honestly don't feel as though you have anything to worry about right now with how your boyfriend and HIS daughter are acting around you. My key phrase here being "around you" right now... If there was something going on, would you think he'd have the odassity to do it right in front of you while you were there? Best of luck, sweety. Please stay here on the forums and let us know how everything turns out for you all!

[beautifulbritty712]

My boyfriend sleeps with and cuddles with his kids- his daughters and his son. I was never like this with my dad, we are close but were never very affectionate. The first time I saw my bf lay with his kids I thought it was weird- he laid down on the floor to take a nap and all three went and cuddled up to him. It really warms my heart to think he's so close to his kids to lay like that, and they sleep together. Just last night I was on the phone with him and his daughter woke up and got in his bed, I think it is sweet. Of course his kids are older, but 10 is still not too old. I would just make sure she realizes the difference between a father- daughter relationship and the relationship he has with you. I also understand that when daddy gets a new gf it is hard, so I try to let him spend time with his kids alone usually. I hang out with them sometimes, and more often as they get to know me. Understand, if she didn't get a chance to get to know you and spend time with you a little at a time and you were just kind of thrown into her life you are an intruder. Not really, I do understand how you feel, but this may be how she feels. She wants to know her dad still loves her most, and he should. I try to do little things, like go eat or get ice cream or invite them over for dinner. His girls saw me today and they got so excited to see me, but I know they aren't ready yet to see me every day they are with their dad, and I don't plan on being like that any time soon. Also, when I stayed at my dad's on weekends we always stayed up late and it made us really look forward to visiting our dad- it was like a party weekend or something. I wouldn't take this away from him, it must feel really good to know she looks forward to her visits so much and this probably makes them even more exciting.

[Drbumble]

I hope you've decided to move on from this relationship. Sounds awful. Part of being a parent is setting boundaries and this father is failing to set extemely important boundaries. A father Sleeping in the same bed with a ten year old is creepy and completely unacceptable. Especially while you are sleeping elsewhere. Do not justify this behavior and don't let anyone else justify it eithe. Leave him before you end up getting pregnant and having to deal with this again. No, no, no, no.... completely unacceptable behavior period and do not expect to change this behavior.  You must leave him.

[MrsHappiness]

Though this post was first addressed a year-and-a-half ago, I would like to throw in my two cents.  Some of the posts sound very naive and I don't think they are really hearing what you are saying.  This doesn't sound like "normal" affection.  It could be that your boyfriend is innocently acting the same way he always has with his daughter, unaware that as she gets older, the expressions of affection should change.  She is a lucky little girl to have a father who is so loving and affectionate.  

However, their private parts should not be anywhere near each other's at this age.  This is not appropriate and could be considered invasive and abusive.  Sleeping with her and touching her private parts while wrestling, playing or sleeping is incest.  I was a victim of incest from my stepfather, which is far more damaging than a father who is cautiously aware of appropriate boundaries when displaying affection for his 10-year-old daughter.  Please understand that my father doted on me and worshiped me.  I felt his deep love, but the affection was always age-appropriate.  

The people who are trying to tell you that you are jealous are most likely not really imagining the scenario.  If he thinks that sleeping with his 10-year-old daughter is acceptable behavior, then no wonder he lets her crawl all over him.  He has boundary issues with her and a lack of respect for you.  By not putting her in her place now, he is establishing a toxic situation between the two of you.  This little girl will manipulate him for the rest of her life and you will be left out in the cold.

True, he is teaching her relationship skills with men.  But spoiling her will only make her impossible to please in her future relationships.  She will learn that manipulation and lies will get her what she wants, which is working now.  Your boyfriend needs to get firm with her or you should probably consider leaving him, unless you don't mind these issues cropping up for the rest of your life.

I've been there, and the daughter always got her way.  I was given advice by another woman who was in the same situation.  She married the man and she said she regretted it throughout the marriage.  I took her advice and left.  From what I hear, my old boyfriend lets his daughter call the shots and he is still single.

[smokey13]

I am married for seven years to a man with a 30 year old daughter.  She is more than the apple of his eye, their relationship has caused me so much pain, it is not worth it.  She slept in our bed as early as last year when her father and I were away for the weekend.  When I entered my home, she looked up at me and stated, "i slept in your bed over the weekend, I hope you don't care."....with a smirk on her face.  I once walked in on them after they had finished painting a deck and, although no real evidence of incest, he was gently removing the paint from her elbows.  When I walked into the room, she stated, "Dad, let's go in the garage like we did lasty night."  I have lived with the suspicion that there is more than this, but I have no proof.  I have just recently found that he is paying many of her bills that have gone into collection.  I feel like the other woman in this relationship.  I cannot stand the sight of her and he treats her like she is the wife and I am the mistress.  what are your thoughts on that?

[specialmom]

smoky, this is an old thread.  You might get more responses if you started your own thread. :>)

But to answer your question, well.  Let's see.  This didn't start AFTER you married, the competition thing, right?  You married him knowing he was extremely close to his daughter.  I do believe children supercede a new relationship in our life.  

I doubt anything is going on with this 30 year old daughter of his.  Just my guess.  He was gently washing her elbows and this was sexual to you?  My guess is that it was more loving and nurturing and it made you jealous.  And her saying let's go in the garage like we did last night--------- maybe that was where they cleaned off paint from their hands and arms the night before.  Now, his sleeping with her---------- odd.  Inappropriate.

But here is the thing . . .  um, what does HE say about it.  She couldn't be pushing your buttons unless your husband allowed it.  When you ask him about the sleeping together, what is HIS response?  If you ask him to NOT sleep with her or allow this adult woman to sleep in your bed, what does he say?

Paying her bills?  Well, I don't think parents should do that with their adult children but a surprisingly large number do.  Again, do you not share finances with your husband?  Do you not discuss these things?

So what I'm getting at is instead of being mad at her or suspecting a sexual relationship, I'd concentrate on working on this marriage.  good luck (and that is just my opinion based on this little bit of info given here.  Could be off the mark------ but I try.)

[perch101]

Hi Specialmom,

In re-reading smokeys post, the father does not sleep in the bed with his daughter - she slept in their empty bed when they were away and she was housesitting :-)

Also - just wanted to let you know I love reading your posts/advise, and I'm often impressed by your insight.

Kind Regards,
Perch

[perch101]

To further re-assure you, I do not see anything that raises a red flag of an incestuous relationship.

If the worst thing you've noted is that he washed paint off her elbow, (most fathers would help with that, elbows are hard to reach) and she slept in your bed when you were away and she was looking after the house, you really don't have anything to worry about.

Perhaps you could view it as a positive thing - it's the sign of a good man if he is an attentive father and has a close relationship with his daughter - it shows a much more positive side of his personality than if he had a child he couldn't care less about.

If you tried (even if you had to pretend at first) that you enjoyed that they are close - and you stopped viewing her as a rival (which I'm sure she can sense and reacts to you about it, hence the smirk) you and her will have a better relationship - and after 'pretending' for a while you may actually genuinely get along with her.

Remember - she is not a rival for his love and attention - she's his daughter. I'm a little surprised you would suspect incest going on from what you’ve observed - it's a big accusation, it's not like they sleep in the same bed or something else that would automatically raise a red flag. (Her sleeping in your bed while you’re both away and she’s looking after the house is not concerning IMO).

I hope this gives you an outside view so you can stop viewing your husband and his daughter suspiciously. Also, if your husband finds out you've been suspecting him of that with his daughter, be prepared that he will be angry and shocked at you, and it may take him a long time to forger that you even suspected that.

Regards,
Perch.

[specialmom]

Ahhh.  I have now re read myself and see that dad and daughter are NOT sleeping in the same bed, she just slept in their bed while they were away.  Big difference.  

Thanks for the kind words and right back at ya!  You always have excellent advice!

To smokey--------  I do think I would work on making this less of a competitive situation.  For sure!  good luck

[anonymouslady]

What if the boyfriend call his daughter his queen? How do you feel that as the girlfriend, would you be able to accept that he regard his daughter more than you?

[icingqueen]

okay here is my issue~ we own a camper on a lake in a camp ground. Recently my fiance's 19 yr old daughter has moved in with us, only after he has not seen her only a hand full of times recently since she was 12, do to the mother, which is why she moved in with us. Recently they went with my 12 yr old son to the camper with out me. we have a  pull out couch and our bedroom, also 3 queen airmatresses, tents, ect.  For some reason I found out that he had her sleep in our bed with him, fully dressed both nites, instead of either using an airmatress or having my son sleep in with him and her on the couch. The week prior to this he  swated her butt as she walked past him in his chair and was being smart and joking around. My problem is when my son comes to our door at nite when we are getting ready, or I go to walk to the bathroom in a tshirt and my underwear, or even not wearing a bra and hug him good nite, my fiance gets bent out of shape and tells me I am inappropriate. I am not sure how to handle these issues, unfortunatley  I was molestaid as a child so my gut makes me kring esp with any father daughter relations of anyone. But we also have been arguing and fighting, many on how he acts to me and my son campared now to his daughter. He will ask her if she would like something yet not ask us, the things he constantly gripped about such as eating in livingroom or sitting in his chair when he was home from work, or wasteing food, do not apply to her. When I would  question why he does not gripe at her for those things he had been griping at us not to do, he would say he doesn't or that he gave up and isn't going to worry about it anymore.  He also has to apply for a parent student loan now to help pay for her college. Yet we needed to buy a home, we lease temp right now from his boss. And her phone, so we told he we would put her on my plan, his is through work, and she wants the droid which will cost an extra $30 for the gigabites that is required, I pay this bill.   i have tried talking to him, but his idea is to just go camping and forget his week, till work starts on monday. I feel that I don't know where I fit here, since he has gone here and there with her and yet we never have money, and when she needs something he does, there is no communication, yet he has made a statement to me he is is confused at how he is suppose to be to her. Anyone have any suggestions?    

[kyrusb]

Omg! Me and u have the same concerns!  At the same time,  my step daughter is extra clingy! And its very annoying!  If I wanna hold his hand,  she wanna hold his hand etc... she is 6. And she is competitive with me and her dad's 1 yr old. I think its very inappropriate for a dad to. Spoon his daughter if they aren't babies.  

[poolsnug]

in absoute agreement, just ending a painful relationship where bf was sleepign with his 10 y/o dtr "with a pillow in between them"....that should tell them they know it's wrong. Now she's 12 and plucking his chest hairs. Hog wash to children should allways come first, not all our needs get meet and we must learn to deal with that effectifvely. In a non divorced family the kids don't ALWAYS come first. Denial and Guilt are tricky.  To ask for a few rules is NOT unreasonable it's not like your asking for him to skip a baseball/or soccer game

[angelgrace77]

This thread is very enlightening considering the different views presented.  I actually posted a question on my browser and this forum came up. I read all the comments.  The question I posted:  Is it appropriate for a father to give his teenage daughter massage (foot, leg, all the way up the butt and back when she kept on urging him to go higher and needing more rubbing)?  Maybe I should start my own thread.

[ccm121810]

I understand exactly what you're saying. I've been married for 11 months now to a man who has 3 daughters ages 10, 12 and 14. They have been through a lot as a family and are very affectionate with each other. He was not in their life for about 4 years but now they have been together for the last 3 years. For a while they only had 1 bed king size and all for them would sleep in the same bed. I understand when that is all you have you have to do what you can but it was the way they laid with each other that made me feel really uncomfortable when I first came into the relationship; wrapping their legs around eachother or the daughters laying in front of their dad. By no means would he ever do anything to sexually abuse his daughters. he is a godly man that loves the Lord. However a lot of parents that go through a divorce have a void of emotional intimacy they are no longer getting from a spouse so they've reached out to their children who they have a strong bond with. that is a very natural response however it is not necessarily a healthy response. Children do not need the pressure of fulfilling what is meant for an adult companion to fill. there are certain forms of affection that are more intimate and should be reserved for a future companion/spouse. especially for young girls they need to learn at home what is the proper kind of affection that they should be receiving from like a boyfriend if they are learning to lay on top of someone at home they will think that that is okay to do with future boyfriends. There are plenty of proper ways to show affection and love to children with out it crossing the boundaries of intimate affection. there are many precautions to take involving the right kind of affection especially for fathers with their daughters and mothers with their sons. young women nowadays do not know how to properly conduct themselves in opposite sex relationships either because they do not receive any love from their father or they're showing the wrong kind of love from their fathers. I definitely agree that bothers should not be laying in bed with their daughters and vice versa for mothers with there sons. they should not be putting their heads in their laps or sitting in their lives close to the private areas. they need to be taught in the home healthy boundaries.

on another note it is very difficult with blended families for the non biological parent to have the same kind of bond with a child. the biological parents will naturally have a closer bond with their child than with their future spouse or spouse. They will naturally want to put the child first. however once you are married god's design biblically for the relationship is the because the man in the wife are now 1 they need to put their spouse first before the child, giving preference to the spouse. Many, many single dads with daughters have a very hard time with this because they are daddy's little girl. but in order for the relationship in the family to be a healthy relationship the biological parent needs to understand how important it is to put his spouse first. I am very thankful that my husband is this way it would not work if this was not the case. he has listened to my concerns in regards to healthy boundaries with affection. there are still some minor concerns but I am praying that god will continue to work on his heart this area. if he wasn't willing to work on this with me it would be a very difficult relationship. in our first 6 months of marriage these things were more as in issue I am so thankful they are getting worked out. however I am not completely sure he understands that there is a line and that intimate affection he needs to reserve only for his spouse. many times I felt almost like he was being unfaithful because there would be a special thing that he would do you like wrapping his legs around mine or laying down and holding me close and I felt special until I saw him do the same thing with his girls. bottom line a husband or a wife needs to reserve more intimate forms of affection for them alone. that is the role of the spouse and is not meant for the children to fulfill. I hope this helps you.

[ccm121810]

I have read through all posts now ...people please understand there is such an important need for healthy boundaries with parents and children. there are so many homes and families that are broken today 1 because the father is not taking the spiritual leadership he needs to in the  home but secondly they are getting out of order the priorities that god has ordained in his word and he has done those for a very good reason. again because the husband and wife are 1 they need to fulfill each others needs for intimacy in every way. they need to give preference and honor and respect to 1 another first and then the children. there are plenty of ways to show proper affection and love to children with out it being invasive of private areas, I am talking about non sexual ways. there seems to be a break down in the intimacy between a husband and wife and mostly that is because it's easier to avoid those conflicts and rather find that intimacy with the children. husbands and wives need to give priority to each other and keep the privacy of their bedrooms to themselves to encourage that good relationship. children will feel loved when they are being shown the right kind of love but also when husband and wife  love each other properly.

[cep0520]

I concur with CCM121810 and her post is close to spot-on.
While we live in a desensitized society when it comes to sexuality, there still needs to be a bright-line standard of what is right and wrong.

As a criminal justice professional with 34 years experience in dealing with sex crimes cases, from my experience and education I can tell you this is troubling.

Fathers have an obligation before God to uphold the standard of how a man is supposed to conduct himself before his wife and children.  Ephesians 5 and Colossians 3 speak to this.  Our children learn those standards not only by what we say but by our actions as well.

I believe it falls to the fathers for the bulk of this responsibility.  But I cannot begin to tell you the number of women, who were daughters, who have been sexually abused at a young age.  It is demonic and it is wrong.  And the damage is beyond comprehension.

Protect your children.  A daughter has no business being near or in her father's bed.  

[JannieNU]

Okay. I read all of the comments and I have to say I'm surprised. First of all, no father should ever be this physically affectionate with their daughter!!!! Period! Your husband's behavior is indicative of an emotionally immature man with incestuous overtones. Yes I said incestuous. Be alarmed! To Judy246, it may indeed be his way of showing affection but that in no way means his behavior is appropriate. It is quite clear both the father and his daughter need therapy. ..and NOW! Your husband needs to hear from a professional that his over protective and overly affectionate behavior is not healthy for his daughter, for him, or for anyone else in the house. Please everyone...being that affectionate with anyone other than your spouse is extremely wrong and especially with a child, male or female, and should never be tolerated!!! My advice is to immediately seek the help of a professional...not a group of parents--you aren't interested in learning what is socially acceptable. You are interested in the physical, mental, and emotional well being of everyone in your household!!! Act NOW!!!

[JannieNU]

Your husband's behavior is completely inappropriate! There is no other recourse than for you to DEMAND the behavior stop immediately or you are morally and ethically required to report the behavior to the authorities! This type of behavior is incestuous and deviant. It is extremely important that both your daughter and your husband learn this, but it is also as important that you stand up and do what is right--for your own peace of mind!!!

[JannieNU]

Are you kidding me? People...stand up and do what is right. There are children involved! And, do not listen to anyone other than a child psychologist--a doctor--who is credible and knowledgable in this type of behavior! Unbelievable!!!!

[specialmom]

Hi there ---  just wanted to welcome you but also point out that you've pulled up an old post from a couple of years ago.  

[JannieNU]

Thank you for writing. I am aware of the dates of the posts, however, consider that any and all problems that may be posted here, no matter how old, may prove helpful to those who read the posts. The information I posted is not only intended for the writer of the post but also for those seeking these types of answers today. There is alot to learn from even our ancestors, for instance. Parents and children have been dealing with these issues for generations. Many step parents write this type of behavior off as part of the difficulties of bringing two families together and we all need to be clear what is healthy for mind and body and what is clearly not. There is no gray area when it comes to children of any age. And, as women, we need to be strong enough to stand firm and trust our instincts. If it looks wrong, in most cases, it is! Thanks again!

[JannieNU]

Hi smokey. I read your post and have to ask why you would ever stay in a relationship where you are not the queen of the house? You want a husband who adores you and hangs on your every word. Don't settle for anything less. If he, himself, does not acknowledge there is a problem between you and his daughter, then this is a clear sign that he is not concerned about your well-being, disregards your feelings, and in a nutshell, has little respect for you. But, in all fairness, we need to be effective when we communicate how we feel and we need to be firm. Don't just 'wait and see how things go'. Ask for what you need, and follow up until a resolution is reached. If one is not, be prepared to resolve it yourself. The only time people take us seriously is when we back up our words with actions.

[jomarion]

Thank you for all these comments. I too have a problem with my boyfriend I am struggling with but I am unable to talk about it now.  These old posts are very helpful to me to read.  I am just so concerned.

[liicoodie]

From what i have read, the father/child need bounderies.  It's okay for a father to show affection to thier children, but not mimic the same affection he would to his significant other.

The child is clearly old enough to start understanding such bounderies.  Private areas are off guard and if he thinks differently then i see a problem (i.e. allowing her to lay her head around his privates).  Giving a young girl a massage w/her shirt off is inappropriate.  A parent can still give a child a back rub w/o taking of their shirt.  The only difference is he would explain that she is to old to be w/o a shirt infront of a male, regardless if it's her father.  My daughter is 5, and I feel it's in appropriate for her to be w/o a shirt in front of her father, brother, uncles or any other males.  

Set bed times are a must, children need sleep, and if he wanted to tuck her in and give her hug, kiss goodnight and turn off the light that's pretty common.  But to spoon a young girl about to hit puberty or even to allow her to spoon him... umm, NO!

This excuse of not getting to spend a lot of time with her is crap... because if it's the weekend you can easily be up by 8am-8pm spending time with your child and hanging out.  That's 12 hrs, and if that's not enough then maybe the pareting schedule needs to be revised to a lot more visiting days.  

I do agree w/some that say there might be a jelousy between the two of you, but the actions that you speak of are still not appropriate and would have raised concern to me as well.  

[p_rivera]

This might be way to long and I am sorry for that .... This is in 2 seperate sections i exceeded the 8000 characters.
I do agree with no matter the age of the post it is still helpful to some, I am now sitting in this situation and am now referring to something that was posted in 2009, reading through all these comments, realizing that I am not crazy because I have this same issue in my home now.
crystalmichelle: How are things going now? The daughter is now going on 13 years old since your original post, are you still with the man or no?
This is for everyone: My situation is I have been with a man off and on for 2 years now and we are now married. When I first met him he did not have his daughter she was with her mom but he has custody of her (she is not biologically his daughter no one knows that but the mother he and I)  and just happen to not have her because she wanted to go back home to stay with her mom to see if it worked out. (The daughter is 16 years old now & 14 when i first met her.) He also has another daughter who is his biologically who is 14 lives with her mother in another state.
My husband when I met him was a player and I actually thought he had some kind of issue about sex because he cheated many times, would be caught (by me) in chat rooms telling woman he wants to see there naked bodies. He would have woman send him naked photo's of there private parts and videos, I have caught him on porn sites etc.......etc etc ...... I am not OK with any of that!!! Men are men they don't see things as us woman do.
Well in the last year his daughter came back to him she wasnt doing well where she was and being with her mother, she hold a huge disregard for her mom and does not like her one bit so this leaves her with out the mother bond. Thus what I am trying to fill in when and where I am able.
I have two daughters of my own one is very loving very curious and very affectionate & 10 years old the other is 1.5 yr old and is not his neither are his by blood but the 1 yr old may as well be his. I have no problems with him changing her diaper or hugging on her or playing with her on the floor, or cuddling with her when she allows it. I don't mind that he showers with her at this age because I shower with her and I do all the same things with her and sometimes it's easier if there are two people to help with a family of 5/6 at times.
So I have had this feeling about men and woman and the boundaries when enough is enough, and you need to stop "touching" for as long as i can remember maybe it was how i was raised or maybe not just internal feelings i have. I feel there is an age limit that comes with being a father or a mother and seeing your child or walking in on your child or knocking and walking in and not waiting for a response or touching your child. So today I was trying to see what people's comments on that age limit was.
I see my husband with his daughter (16) horse playing, smacking her ***, chasing her around the house, grabbing her by the arms forcing her to hug him, him trying to touch her inadvertently grabbing her around the chest region and touching her boob, touching her chest, holding her down to "horseplay" only to grab her hips as if he were to be touching an adult woman, I notice if she wears a tank top he looks at her chest, if she doesnt wear a bra around the house i see him giving those xray eyes toward her chest, I see him watching her butt as she walks away, he makes odd comments about her beauty and how he has the most beautiful daughter and being that I am a photographer I took very nice photo's of all the girls for a christmas present this last year and framed them when I gave them to him he just stared at her photo and said she is so beautiful I can't help but stare. At the dinner table he stares at her as if no one else exist for long periods of time. She has told me stories of a time when he was drunk which was usual for him prior to our marriage that he was holding her down on the bed trying to at first play with her horseplay and it got to the point where he was hurting her and grabbing her she was yelling for him to stop he's hurting her but he wouldn't and finally his ex intervened and told him to stop and he took off squealing away in the car.  I understand he has been the only one dealing with her growing up. maybe i am being over dramatic with this but I am here now and maybe he should let me deal with this senario but we were at dinner and she mentioned that she was cramping (looking at me) his reply was are you bleeding heavily, are you using a tampon or pads, are you cramping a lot does it hurt can i do anything for you. I understand that he has been the only one, although he doesnt need to know what she is using I felt anyhow, to ask is there anything I can do for you ( in my mind meant can i give you a massage rub your back make you feel better) i could be way out of line thinking that is what he meant. Although when it comes to me and i am on my monthly cycle he doesnt ask me if there is anything he can do or doesnt bother with me, and he finds it ( this is from the adult perspective ) sort of erotic when we have sexual relations during this time... He also say's things to me about having a tampon in...

[p_rivera]

He also has sexual turn on's with boobs and *** ( as any other man ) he likes it when i show clevage/low v neck shirts so he can see a hint of that area, he tells me he thinks it utterly sexy when he grabs my hips if i am doing dishes, he smacks me on the *** if he is behind me going up the stairs, he horse plays with me the same as with her me a little more extensive at times of course... I know his sexual fantasies, sometimes the things that he does and say's i feel are inappropriate. Before we started living together I would be over at their apartment and his daughter would come out to grab a water or something to eat from the kitchen just having a tank top on no bra ready for bed he would get up from the couch with me go into kitchen and just watch her and then come back after she was done acting like he needed something from kitchen but getting nothing. Later that night after she was in bed he would tell me he was so turned on just thinking about me that he wanted to have sex.. Is that odd or a quincedence? At other times I would find that he was looking at porn after she had gone to bed and playing with himself I am curious is he imagining her and the moments he get's to catch a glance.... I still ponder that thought. The moments that his daughter is wearing no bra and in sweat pants or anything provocative but not meaning it intentionally he seems to be more turned on and interested in me.... Which I do give it up for her she does now i think realizes what he is doing she covers herself up with a zip up and or jacket if she is coming downstairs, she doesnt stay around him long she makes sure if he walks in her room and i have seen her do this that she will inconspicously grab something to cover up with or put her arms up as to cover her boobs. I do give her props for knowing what to do to make herself not feel uncomfortable. I had not said anything because I am only the "wife" and "step-mother" not had much experience in the teen area. Her and I get along great she talks to me, yet when her father comes in there is instant tension,all get's silent she stay's up in her room when he is home she chooses to not be down with us in evenings, but when it is just me all is well we talk we eat we talk about boy's/life and school,makeup and all these motherly things that she needs. Yesterday somehow his daughter and I got into conversation about her dad & that she feels uncomfortable when he touches her. i thought to my self you know what that is great that you are telling me this because i feel that way too... I said to her how or what is it that he is doing that makes you feel uncomfortable because i wanted to know if it was the same things that i was seeing that she was feeling. IN WHICH case it was the exact things that i have noticed. She asked if there was a way that i could possibly bring this up to him, i said absolutely I will have this discussion with him as soon as it is possible! I told her that I am feeling the exact way that there is a line and an age limit that he I believe is crossing with you.
So last night I pondered how am i to bring this up with out over stepping my line. He said you look like your thinking about something I said i am he said just blurt it out so I did I said i think that sometimes you tend to touch your daughter inappropriately and it needs to stop you need to not smack her on the *** you need to not grab her by the arms/hips or the chest you need to not stare her down every chance you get you are her father and she is not 8 anymore. You can't horseplay with her you need to give her her space and let her be. His reply was I am her father I can touch her anytime I want, I said NO you cant you are her father which means you need to respect her and she feels uncomfortable when you touch her and he said she does, and I said yes she does and it needs to stop he said well i don't do anything wrong i stay away from her private parts I said no sometimes you don't please don't think your the only one that notices he said well she punches me in the stomach on the arm what am i suppose to do not punch her back  I said it's play she doesnt smack you on your *** she doesnt grab your penis she doesnt lay on top of you and hold you down the things you do with her need to stop. Give her her space don't touch her just let her be. He said I appreciate what you have told me and that was the end of the conversation. What comes of it I don't know. Today is a new day maybe he took what i said and will change I dont know.  But am I at all out of line is what I would like to know about how I am feeling or the way that I went about anything? Please give me some advise here.   Thanks everyone for reading my novel sorry it was so long and kind of bounced around a bit I have a one year old that makes my train of thought off track sometimes LOL

[Derby_Mom]

My mom is having this same problem with her BC he has 4 daughters 15,19,24,&26 and 2 daughters with my mom he is this way with all the girls I think its very weird but I don't really talk to my dad I do though tell my mom you either deal with it or leave because it seems to me that when girls are treated this way things will never change. You can only voice to him what you are feeling & hope that hell make a little change at least

[hjg625]

this  thread started in 09 and is still going o.O wow....

[NettieB]

I am a girlfriend (8 1/2 years) of a divorced man with 3 kids, 2 grown and 1 almost 16 year old daughter. She moved in with him about a year ago and cut her mother out of her life. He now has full custody. Much of our relationship pretty much stopped when she moved in with him. They have always been very close and physically affectionate, but this past year, I've noticed that they act as dates when I am with them... holding hands and cuddling at movies, cuddling at home on the couch. I thought that maybe this was normal, as they are latino... close father/daughter relationship. Recently, I saw her playing with his hair and earlobe as I would, and the last time I spent the night, she came into the room and started to crawl into the bed at 1am after they had been arguing about her making noise and not going to sleep. She somehow was unaware that I was there for the whole evening. Also, he once told me that I'll never be as beautiful as his daughter. WHAT? I've been hanging in there, as I'm in my mid 40s, time spent with him, etc., but come on! BTW, I think there's a reason this thread has gone on for years....

[makeabook]

why is everyone always sticking up for the kids or the parent of the kids? i googled search to find a book for  my boyfriend on.. " how to date as a single parent" that i could give to him, and nothing came up.. all that came up was how to date a single parent. that is unfair. we always put the child in the innocent position when we forget that the significant other is human too and requires and needs certain feelings from their partner to feel secure in the relationship. the world never wants to point the finger at the parent for making their partner feel uncomfortable just because their a parent. just because you have a child that doesnt make you always in the right or the one not doing anything wrong, its always the other way around and i hate it. i would love to read a book that can help the single parent get some help to make the ones that love them feel better and not loose out on a beautiful relationship.

[watchfulwoman]

What if the affection is from a teenage girl? Meaning about 18 always following and sitting in her father's lap, holding hands...has no friends always with the father and girl friend.
Does not have a social life with "friends"
" Phrases like Daddy I will never leave you"
It is very obvious...I am reading in these posts that alot of dads allow the kids to sleep with them.
But how about a 17 year old sleeping with their dad? When he has a girl friend?
Concerned about things Im seeing.....

[specialmom]

Watchfulwoman, here is the thing--------  if a 17 year old girl is acting this way, well, dad would have to gone along with it, right?  He's the adult, he sets the limits.  How long has it been going on?  Did he do nothing to stop it ever?  Did he actually start it before you were in the picture and now just goes along with it?  Is she like this because she has been abused sexually?  I think just  blaming the child is not fair.  

The way to set limits is through the parent.  That is why WE are the parents and THEY are the children . . . even when they are 17.  
Dad could have said "cut it out." if she was acting too affectionate.  could have moved her off his lap and said "honey, you're too old for that now.  You need to sit beside me". "honey, let's invite a friend over, I'm worried that you don't seem to have any friends your own age."  "Of course you can't sleep with me dear."  See????  Limits.  

I would say that if you are dating someone that is not setting any limits no matter what things the daughter is doing, then I'd move on.  good luck

[momoftwo909]

Okay, more calmly...there is no need to bash the crystal girl. She is 50% of the relationship and her feelings are just as important as the fathers. Daddy needs to cut back his intimate behaviors with his daughter. Especially if they are striking the new wife/gf/stepmom as uncomfortable. If the daughter was walking around with boobs out, then thats a respect issue for herself that needs to be addressed. Be comfortable in your own room like that but in the common areas (kitchen, living room, outside the house) dress conservatively because that is what ladies do. Dads need to treat, touch and talk to their daughters like ladies. The weirdos aren't the moms and stepmoms who are uncomfortable, its the people who are acting like these are completely innocent actions. Relationships change as people mature. It doesn't mean that love goes away, it just takes a different form. Don't assume any position that can be used for sex, or has been used for sex is innocent just because you are doing it with your kid. Respect your partner and your child enough to back off when you should. PARENTS set the limits, that means dads and stepmoms/moms/live in girlfriends.

[niki2429]

Hi I totally understand what that young woman is going thru because I am in the exact same situation only that I'm married which makes it worse because I can't just walk away. But you need to pray about it and if nothing changes then you may consider walking away while there is no ties. I have a eight year old step daughter and she does that and more and it bothers alot because it"s like I am competing with a little girl and it's the worst feeling in the world because it's a ticklish subject to discuss with your husband or boyfriend because you don't want to offend them. All I could suggest is that you build the courage to speak to him,pray about it and if nothing works get out because trust me you'll have to go thru this for some time to come.

[niki2429]

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH U jO

[Wendillyn]

Hi ...i was looking for information on this topic and found your blog...im going through the same thing...did this behavior stop?...i have three boys of my own...7,5 ,&4.  My fiance has a nine year old daughter..i am affectionate with my boys... but noy to the extent he is with his daughter...i have so much to ask u...but i want to make sure u get this first lol. Oleaae email me if u do... ***@****

[Cookiefough22]

It sounds completely inappropriate and bad parenting to let a child that age stay up so late.  She also is definitely competing with u for attention and affection.  Which she needs to learn her role as daughter and your role as gf. He is for sure spoiling her and she sounds like a brat and will continue to be a brat.  She will also be sexually confused as far as boundaries grow when she reaches puberty and starts having bfs she will lay with them the same way she lays with her dad which is really weird and probably confusing.  Also my stepdad was similar when I was her age then when I got puberty at age 12 he did sexually abuse me and I was confused bc I didn't know what was appropriate and didn't realize I was abused till 14 when I started to understand sex and realized my dad would always rub my back and wrestle with me I knew he shouldn't have put his hands in my panties but those lines were always so blurred. So watch out I wouldn't be surprised if that happened!  A lot of times there are no signs I told my mother at age 18 she never suspected a thing

[Cookiefough22]

It sounds completely inappropriate and bad parenting to let a child that age stay up so late.  She also is definitely competing with u for attention and affection.  Which she needs to learn her role as daughter and your role as gf. He is for sure spoiling her and she sounds like a brat and will continue to be a brat.  She will also be sexually confused as far as boundaries grow when she reaches puberty and starts having bfs she will lay with them the same way she lays with her dad which is really weird and probably confusing.  Also my stepdad was similar when I was her age then when I got puberty at age 12 he did sexually abuse me and I was confused bc I didn't know what was appropriate and didn't realize I was abused till 14 when I started to understand sex and realized my dad would always rub my back and wrestle with me I knew he shouldn't have put his hands in my panties but those lines were always so blurred. So watch out I wouldn't be surprised if that happened!  A lot of times there are no signs I told my mother at age 18 she never suspected a thing

[Dott28]

I just want to say, I understand your concern.  Though I dont think you should worry right now.  I am 28 years old, my parents got divorced when I was 4.  I see my dad now, we stay up late watching tv. We even lay on the floor and cuddle with legs interlocked.  He even sits there and tics me(gives me goosebumps) on my tummy and back.  We dont see it any more then as my dad and I showing love for one another and spending time together.  It is not something that brings up the wrong feelings either.  We are father and daughter, but I did not have a relationship with my dad because my mom denied me.  But I love my close relationship with my dad now.  I see how he treats his wife and everything. He treats her great, with respect and curtousy and love.   Now I can see why a fathers role is so important to a daughter.  He can teach her how you should be treated my a male without the sexual involvement.  He is showing her how she should be treated and loved.  As long as something else dont go further, then I believe you will be ok.  Its just something your not use to.  Just keep an eye open.  I have been looking into it, It is a normal father daughter relationship.  The cuddling and spooning thing will continue though out her life.  Like I said I am 28 and I am still that way with my dad with no sexual feelings or involvement.  The sleeping in the same bed at night, I dont agree witht that.  That needs to stop.  He needs to set some ground rules on bed time and her constant wanting his attention when she is suppose to be sleeping.  He needs to be consistant on it as well or it wont work.

[RitaBH]

Thank God for jannie NU! It doesn't matter the post of the writer is old! I was also shocked by the following comments which approved this kind of excessive affection! It's wrong! Period! It's sexual abuse, full stop! What is wrong with all those who said this is normal? Were they sexually abused and are in denial? They need help. For a lot less I suspected my ex bf's behaviour. My ex  would go to his daughter's room every night when she went to bed until she was 14. He would shut the door and switch off the lights and stay there for an hour. Maybe there was nothing wrong with that, but I found it uncomfortable when she was 14 already, very jealous of me and was always in conflict with her Dad. Why would she accept this kind of thing every night 'when dad was not so cool to be around with anymore'-?.

Now having the evidence that they were rubbing private parts all over each other and people saying this is NORMAL? Ridiculous!!!!!!!!!!

[myown2]

You're right and unfortunately sometimes people don't like to think "the worst" because people are so worried about someone saying " you're judging."

There are posts that I have read on the other forums on site where young 2- 5 yr old girls are rubbing their crotch up against the couch and a concerned Mother will ask if thats normal behavior. Or that the kid is rubbing against the high chair or touching herself all the time etc..And this Mother will receive more answers that "this is normal behavior" then not. At 5 years old my private area all I knew was that is where your "pee pee" comes out when you sit on the toilet. Yet we read advice from women on site to these Mothers that they should tell their daughter thats something they should do in private. Geesh, its absolutely amazing and scary at the same time..

[specialmom]

First let me send out a reminder to be respectful please.  We can give our thoughts without calling other people's thoughts ridiculous.

All opinions are welcome here even if we do not agree and all opinions are just as valid as anyone elses.

I won't comment further as this is an old post.  If one has a question on this matter, I suggest starting their own thread.  luck and peace to all.

[avn3day]

Okay I have a question...  What happens when you have a dad who is 50 years old and is way to affectionate to his 19 year old daughter.  Do you think it's weird for her to be in his bed???  Okay, there was a death in the family.  The father had his brother stay over along with his wife and two teens (16 and 18).  I noticed that his bedroom door was shut.  When I opened the door I saw him caressing his daughters hair while she was lying next to him.  Immediately I said on purpose "Oh I don't mean to bother you both, I'll leave you guys alone.  Do you want me to shut the door"  Father, says yes.  Can anyone please give let me know if this is strange???  I feel that he is too touchy with her..

[specialmom]

You have tacked a question onto an old thread.  The best thing to do is start your own thread if you have your own question.  

Are you askinng me if it is odd for a father to comfort a nineteen year old daughter in a bedroom?  Is it odd to lay on a bed with her and carress her hair.  

Well, I don't know.  I don't know exactly what you saw.  I might be tempted to do that with my son when he is a teenager if her were in deep despair and I might even just hold him tightly as he is grieving the death of someone he loves.  It wouldn't be sexual but rather a mother comforting her child whether they are an adult or not.  Since I don't see my sons in a sexual way, physical affection is just affection and not sexual.  

However, if you feel dad was carressing her in a sexual way and was so brazen about it that he asked you to leave--------  well, I would wonder why you would want to be with such a man.  

If it was sexual, well----------  that is odd (and obviously horrible).  But some people are affectionate with their teenage children in a physical way and it is NOT sexual.  

So whether it is strange or not is your judgement call as only you know the true details.  Good luck

[avn3day]

Thank you for your response.  I am in agreement with you 100% when it comes to comforting your 19 year old daughter during a tough moment.   However, he has told me that on a few occasions that his daughter will fall asleep in his bed.  Sometimes he would tell me that they both were watching TV in his bed or they would talk.   Mind you he has a house with a living room.  Why can't he hang out there with her instead of his bedroom.  Furthermore, when she comes back from college I notice that I become the third wheel and treats me like I am a nobody.  Like their is no balance between his daughter and me.  If they go out I'm not included and he tells me that he is busy.   Please note that I've been with this man for 10 years.  Things started to change when she moved in with him when she was 15.  It is hard to explain the whole story but, all I can say is that I feel as though she is almost like his wife rather than his daughter.   I have an 18 and 21 year old.  As a mother I know where to set the limits with them.   My gut is telling me something is not right.  This is why I'm holding back to move in with him.  My fear is that when she is around he would leave me behind and I would never stand for it.  Furthermore, I would not want her to hang out in "our" bedroom. I feel that that should be a place for just me and him.  That is what my values are. What do you think?  

[specialmom]

Sounds like your values are different than his and this may not be the ideal man for you. You are not married and, therefore, I'd strongly consider going ahead and moving on.  Why be with someone you have these worries with?

But what concerns me ---  and this is just something for you to think about----  is that you say (and I'm paraphrasing) that your gut tells you this isn't right and are suspicious but what you are really worried about is that he'd pick her over you.  You said "my fear is that when she is around he will leave me behind."  

I'm just throwing it out there that perhaps his adult daughter doesn't care for you or his relationship with you and prefers to do things with just her dad.  And he sees her as very important to him and will comply.  

I think you are exaclty right.  This man values his relationship with his child (adult or not) over a relationship with you and will go along with leaving you out if it makes the relationship with his daughter more peaceful.

You me and anyone else can say that is wrong--------  but who cares what we say, that is the reality.  Why stick around for that?

No, you shouldn't move in with him.  You should move on.  good luck
PS:  If you feel he is being sexual with her, you shouldn't even have a question in your mind about what to do.  

[RitaBH]

I apologise for the 'ridiculous' I used, but I noticed the thread starter was very polite and open-minded, yet she was called arrogant, self-serving and worthless by a member here. Now that IS judgement! A total personal attack. And it got me angry, because her concerns were genuine. Hellooooo, a ten year old child with her crotch on Dad's face for playfight???...amongst other horrifying examples she gave which some people considered normal. But anyway, the post is old. Yet I agree with Jannie NU when she says it doesn't matter because other recent posts in disagreement with the 'normal' could sound like an eye opener to some in denial here who read this thread later.

[RitaBH]

I know what you're going through because i went through exactly the same. My ex bf started treating me differently as soon as his daughter came into the scene. He was only happy when she was around. He only wanted to do things and go out happily when she was around. With me, he would be miserable all the time, no matter how happy I was. As soon as the honey moon period was over and he introduced me to his daughter, things changed badly. But it could be all because separeted parents try to overcompensate for their kids. It could be your bf's case, I don't know, especailly if there's bereavement in the family.
But I could not put up with his behaviour anymore. First, he only wanted to have sex with me when she was in the house. Not in front of her, of course not, but mostly when she was in the house. He always pretended I was a naughty school girl and he was the perverted uncle.. that was his fantasy, which I went along with it until I noticed he had no interest in me unless she was present. Well, to cap it all, I did not like it when he continuously went to her bedroom at bed time until she was older with doors shut, lights off...well, nothing wrong with that? But staying an hour or so??? My parents were over protective towards me, but did not do that when I was 14! In fact, they stopped doing that when i was 7. And especially that this girl wasn't exactly the 'cuddling' type and was getting to that phase when Dad was not cool anymore. ok, beat me for this, general public, but I think this is all out of order.

[specialmom]

It does sound like you picked a really rotten partner.  Hopefully you've moved on.  We have control over who we are with and that end of things is our responsibiity.  And if we end up with a weirdo, we must own it and move on.  good luck

[RitaBH]

you're right. But it's not been easy for me. We just broke up recently and I'm in need of serious counselling because this has left me serious wounds which have not healed yet. He went from Mr Right to a depressed maniac who had no interest in me. I agree with you. I met him because I was vulnerable and on the wrong path of life. He showed no emotions and sympathy to me when my Mum died just 12 weeks ago and that was it! No more of him, the nail in the coffin was with him, mainly! I hate to think I was responsible for bringing him into my life but if I was , i was. Time to move on.

[specialmom]

I'm sure sorry about the loss of your mother.  yes, I think it is time to move on and find a better mate.  good luck

[specialmom]

Gosh, this old post is getting a lot of action in the past couple of days.  Report abuse to child protective services.

For any new questions on the subject, please start your own thread.

[RitaBH]

Are you a moderator of this forum? if you are, you know people have the right to post in a public forum, even years after the first post. The reason I joined this community is that all that's happened to me is still playing in my head. I'm deeply hurt and confused, thinking I could've done something to have helped that girl but didn't because I had no evidence and think I'm going mad. I googled the subject and this forum came up. Just like avn3day may have done and others. We don't want to judge, but when you have open wounds that are so recent, that's what you do. I agree that we should open a new thread, but having an old one extended as long as on the same subject and with respect, is not so bad after all. It just shows how serious and delicate this issue is.

[RitaBH]

Thank you. I will get more info about it. I assume you have read all of my post.

[specialmom]

Hi, I'm the community leader of the forum.  Some threads do get closed when they become controversial but the community leaders usually encourage people in general to open up their own thread for discussions rather than tagging onto someone elses question/issue.  

[specialmom]

And by the way rita, your own question did garner some responses to your particular situation.  good luck

[RitaBH]

No, just because we do not have evidence, that doesn't mean the danger is not there. I don't have any responses to my questions. Sometimes it's just good to hear from others. But I will have to move on and forget. Thanks and bye.

[specialmom]

Didn't you post your own question with responses Rita?  I'm misunderstanding.  I'll look as I'm thinking you did.  And I said nothing of evidence.  Not sure what you are even talking about.  Well, goodluck anyway.

[specialmom]

Okay, now I see Rita that you never Asked your own question.  If you want responses to your particular situation, that is the best way to get one.  good luck

[RitaBH]

I honestly don't know what you're talking about. I wish there was private mail here like in some social networks, I'm new here, so I don't know. In some funny way, I think we bonded a little, thanks anyway.

[specialmom]

I've sent you a pm and honestly, any questions you have about the forum or med help, I'll be happy to help!!  :>)

[hurtconfused650]

I just got married to a 51 yr old man with a 12 yr old daughter who means the world to him.  The daughter is mean to me and appears nice when her dad is around.  He told me that his daughter will always be the priority in the house.  One day i asked him for a movie treat and we ended up watching the movie that his daughter preferred and not the movie i wanted to see and they cuddled   and held hands throughout the movie.  I felt so out of place.  He always hug and kiss his daughter more than he do me. And he tells her more "i love you" than he tells me.  Should i get out of this marriage? We're only married last 2 wks ago.

[specialmom]

Well, he was really clear about his priority and was up front with you.  Little unfair to now have an issue with it in my opinion.  You went into this knowing the situation.  Why did you marry him?  

You've only been married 2 weeks.  If you feel this will cause you displeasure, then yes, I recommend you get out now.

good luck

[stoney1215]

it really saddens me to read a post like yours . you claim to be a strong woman , but you are threatened and jealous of his relationship with his daughter . it also makes me very angry every time a dad , like myself , is thought a molester or depraved person by people who are just sick in their thinking .
i am a father of 3 daughters . i have worked extremely hard to make my daughters feel loved , and secure with their relationship with me . all three of my daughters have slep in the bed with me at various points in their lives . i make it a point to hug them as often as i can . and to show them affection when ever i can .
for a father the worse day in life is the day his little girl no longer feels like it is ok to kiss him on the lips , or sit on his lap and just hug him . i was lucky enough to get to go in the delivery room with my oldest daughter for my first grandchild . her fiance and his family told her how it was wrong and how it was disgusting for her dad to be in there and see her private parts . she made me proud and not only defended her choice , but was absolutely sickened that they would dare say something so vile and disgusting about her dad .
there is no doubt that adults molest kids every day . it is a sad and sick person who can look at a child and see sex . but it is just as sad and just as sick that fathers have to live in fear and be looked at with sickening distrust because of sick criminals . no father can ever possibly look at his little girl and even imagine something so vile and sick .

[appletreez]

I've read all the posts and it is clearly the case that these grown women are JEALOUS.  Notice all their resentment is towards the child NOT the bf/husband.  If you feel lack of attention or poor relationship with the husband then take it up with him.  You don't get competive with a child. All their competitiveness goes toward the child.  This is sick.  You should never view yourself as a contemporary or competitor with a child.  If you don't think you're husband is giving you the amount of attention you feel you deserve--you take it up with him.  You don't resent the child.  People do awful, evil, things when they are jealous.  And it is truly scary what power a jealous grown women can do to a powerless child.  Children are powerless to adults.  They depend on adults. Receiving attention from their father is not a power over you.  If you view it as that, you need psychological help before you start taking out your resentment onto a child.  Jealousy makes mothers abuse their own children.  It is the grown adult woman who is a spoiled brat if she is fuming with resentment over a child's bond with its own father.  Jealousy of this nature is a natural thing indeed...for CHILDREN!  For siblings.  NOT FOR ADULTS!  Certainly no adult should feel jealous of a child.  Seek help if you fall in this category.  You have a personality disorder.

[appletreez]

To stoney, I agree with you completely.  Men who sexually abuse their children are just as evil as women who are jealous of children.  Such women will end up abusing a child as well, since they cannot hold their resentments inside.  Both groups of society are sick and need help. Both are pushing their own sick adult impulses onto a child (the molester his sick sexual impulses...and the women their own jealous impulses).  Both have a specail place in hell, in my opinion.

[AliciaWeenum]

Hello. I'm kind of having the same issue with my dad. Well I think my dad is too close to me, I'm 16 and my dad wants a huge when he gets home from work and when he goes to sleep. And he rubs my legs and I tell him it tickles and I don't like it but the. He'll reply with oh they're so soft and smooshy. And he'll go in my room Kay on my bed and wanna hug so he pushes me down with him and tries to get comfortable and today he like grabbed my ankles to try to pull me off the bed, as play nothing abusive, and he obviously could see my shorts were riding up. And I'm not sure how affectionate and what kind a dad should be showing. There was also this time where I told him I was uncomfortable and he got mad at me and told me what you let your boyfriend touch you(like be close and put their arms around me) but why not me and I wasn't sure how to answer that. Please email me @ ***@****

I really need answers because this has been going on for a few years.

[thatquietgirl]

If it makes you uncomfortable, then your dad should respect that.  I would be uncomfortable, too.  Anything above your knee is not for just anyone to touch unless you want them to touch you there, and his comment about you letting your boyfriend touch you in certain ways does not justify his attempts to.  He is your father, not your boyfriend.  The intimacy factor is far different in a father-daughter relationship than a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship.  If he doesn't stop the next time you tell him you're uncomfortable, then don't sit next to him, stay near another family member instead, and then if you're home alone, put something in front of your door if you can't lock it to avoid any uncomfortable behavior there.  A dad should realize by the time his daughter starts coming of age, he has to behave in a way that won't make her feel exposed/uncomfortable, and you're well past that point in life.

Be safe!

[nursegirl6572]

I completely agree with quietgirl.  Even though this may not be anything inappropriate per se, he is crossing a line YOU are uncomfortable with, and the fact that you've told him and he totally ignored you is not right.  You do not owe him an explanation, there shouldn't have to be a discussion about it...just you telling it makes you uncomfortable and that should be where it ends.

You need to be stern with him and tell him you simply don't like it.  Hugs hello and goodnight are fine....the rest of it...YOU make the boundaries.  I recommend you tell another adult what is going on as well.  Is your Mom in the picture?  A stepmom?  I really think maybe you should fill someone in...maybe someone else needs to lay it out on the line for him.

YOUR body, YOUR boundaries, YOUR rules, no exceptions.  That goes for anyone in your life, hon,

[specialmom]

Hi there.  Always okay to draw the line with someone incuding your father.  I would make it clear that you are a big girl now and aren't wanting to cuddle and such.  

I give your dad the benefit of the doubt that he is just seeing you has his little girl and is affectionate.  I'm affectionate with my little kids now and probably will always want to give them hugs.  But I think you mention things that are intrusive to a young lady.  I also think that if you ask him to stop and he doesn't, that is an issue.

Do you have a mother?  An aunt or a Grandma???  I would tell them how you feel.  Ask them to help you.  

good luck

[baishagirl81]

I have "memories" I remember showering with my adopted father, seeing him naked... my adopted mom walking about naked, doing her makeup naked in my bathroom when she had a wonderful HUGE bathroom of her own... I have vague memories of him in my room at night... he would talk to his friends in PUBLIC about my breasts... my mom had him shave my legs for the 1st time in his shower in 7th grade.. I was mortified. I hate his smell, this hot musk at 30 I can still remember his smell... he would always want me to sit in his lap in his recliner even at 19 ( that's when I left and never came back)  They were NOT affectionate at ALL, no hugs wouldn't even hold my hand in the store in public.. but home that was different... I couldn't close my door to the bathroom or bedroom EVER... I still get dressed in my closet today.... as I grow older it I think it is more and more WRONG, he would slow dance CLOSE all the time with me and I didn't want to... he made me.... it was so uncomfortable.. but it wasn't just him it was HER as well, looking at me in the shower, watching me dress, picking out underwear I wouldn't let my kid wear... it was FU&*^D up..... struggling more today as I see the wrong in it....

[specialmom]

Sorry that happened to you hon.  Your gut tells you that things were definately wrong.  So, I'm very sorry.

Hope you've found a peaceful life for yourself now that you are an adult.  good luck

[leticia710]

There is nothing wrong with a father and daughtr being affectionate and laying together as long as nothing else is happening u sound jealous

[jjenk8]

I need advice.

My fiancee's daughter is nine years old. I absolutely adore her and him and love all of our bond. We have gone through getting her to sleep in her own bed in the past year and its still hard some nights. I took over washing and rinsing her hair when she was 7. She has a tendency to not get all of the conditioner out.

Also, she loves to run around naked, which I told him I was uncomfortable with and he tells her she needs to clothe herself when not in the bathroom, but it is a struggle to this day to enforce.

She only spends every other weekend at our house. Her mom babies her very extensively. Her mom has been married for 3 years this month, and from day one her husband sleeps in another bedroom and the daughter chooses which bed she wants to sleep in while at her moms, her mothers or her stepfathers. This little girl loves to cuddle too. If she lays next to you on the couch or in a chair she wraps both arms around you, holds, your hand, and intertwines fingers. I was very uncomfortable hearing that a 35 year old man who is unrelated is sleeping with a, now, 9 year old little girl that cuddles like that.

When helping her with her hair about a year ago, she asked me if I would bathe her. I told her no and explained that she is at an age where she needs to be doing that on her own. She said, well mom still bathes me and that I was almost her stepmom and that was just like a mom. I replied with my usual response of I love her to the moon and back and am privileged and blessed to have her as part of my family, but you only have one mom and one dad, even though we may feel like extra parents Mom and Dad should always be separate from step mom and stepdad. She continued begging. I asked her what she would do if her mom wasn't home at bedtime. She said her stepdad would bathe her. He was like her dad because he was her stepdad. I told her real dad about this. He didn't do anything. His ex-wife is very aggressive and has a lot of money. Every time he brought situations up tp her in the past she hires a lawyer and they have to go back to court and she keeps threatening to take her from him.

She has gone as far as calling my place of work between undergraduate and graduate school to tell them to fire me or she was not going to refer patients to them any longer. She tells the daughter bad things about her father all the time. The first time I met her she said a negative comment about the father in front of me and the daughter. We had to meet with her because she had "forgotten" to give the daughter something  and than refused to call me demanding that I call her. The father tried reminding her I was bringing their daughter somewhere to assist them, I ended up calling her. I just wanted to give y'all an idea of that relationship to understand part of why I am struggling as to what to do.

About three months after that, she came to our house on a Thursday and I was helping her with her hair and saw she had press on tattoo cupcake on the insides of her iliac crests. Saturday when she was going to take a bath, I saw she still ahd the cupcakes and told her she needed to bathe better. She said she couldn't remove them. When I asked why she said because her stepfather "liked to eat her cupcakes."

I told my fiancee about this. He asked to see her cupcakes and made her show them to him and got upset about it,  I know that was the wrong reaction. I would have waited to tell him until she went to sleep and we could have talked about it if I would have known he was going to act like that. He talked to his ex-wife about it and she brought up and told him it was worse that I had signed the child's test paper when I was doing homework with her one night when my fiancé was getting home late and than went into going back to court.

Not long after this we were at our camp and I had gone to take a shower. About two minutes later she busts into the bathroom and jumps in with me. I was VERY uncomfortable. She still bathes with her mom in the bathtub is what she told me.

I really like her stepfather and do not imagine sexual activity, but I think it is teaching her very weird things about men and nudity and dependence and I just don't know what to do.

[jjenk8]

I know this is an old forum, I just happened to stumble upon it when searching for help and felt that the answers here were very interesting, thoughtful, and solid.

[specialmom]

Hi,  this is a VERY old thread.  If someone has a question, it is best to start your own rather than rehashing something posted a long while ago.  

thanks!

[Priscilla_5]

I have someeeeewhat a similar situation with my boyfriend and her younger sis.... Except they are not so cuddly with each other. My boyfriends younger sis tries 2 hug my boyfriend in front of me and tries to make it very noticeable. She has offended my brother and my mother and many times has been rude 2 me... Me and my boyfriend now have 31/2

[Priscilla_5]

I had a similar situation with my boyfriend and her younger sis.... Except they are not so cuddly with each other. My boyfriends younger sis would try 2 hug my boyfriend in front of me and tries to make it very noticeable. She has offended my brother and my mother and many times has been rude 2 me... Me and my boyfriend now have 3 1/2 and her sis is now 12, things have sure calmed down hugely because I talked to my boyfriend and I really tried to work with the situation.
How long have u been with ur boyfriend?? Maybe it's just a matter of time and patience.... I think the little girl is to young to understand her dad has someone else and it is totally understandable and it is totally understandable that u do not feel comfortable I wouldn't either:/ Just give it some time:)

[specialmom]

Hi there and welcome to the forum.  The original poster of this thread asked this question in 2009.  If you'd like to start your own thread, please go to the top of this forum and hit post question.  

Glad your situation is working out better for you.  

I do think that kids can be affectionate and it is okay.  When it is interfering with one's relationship, it is something to take up with the adult in the situation rather than the child.  If a child is being 'manipulative' in some way, it is for the adult to set a bounary.  good luck

[snappy11]

OMG....i am going throuh the exact same situation! Its his 10 year old adopted daughter. I cannot tell him how it freaks me out because he tells me that when it comes to his daughter,i have absolutely no Say so. My opinion forestry matter. She to stays up as late as she wants.and lately wham i get up to get a drink i see them spooning and he alwsys sleeps in his underwear. I remember growing up if i saw my father in his underwearpast age 5...eww and it was on accident. Gross. his daughter is with us more than she is with Her mother and on top of it all....he had lead her to believe that i am just s friend! We are never affectionate ever, in front of her...so no fighting for his attention on either of our behalfs. I too think of leaving because of it
snappy11

[specialmom]

Hi, welcome to med help.  I just wanted to say again that this is an old thread and would suggest starting your own thread if anyone wants to further this discussion.  

[vickisuezannea]

It is too much...spooning??  Laps and handhilding. Whho is the child and who is the girlfriend. Where is the line?  It may not be sexual but certainly inappropriate.

[Simba8nala]

Hi I'm still a teenager(16) but I never did anything like that with my father. One time we went camping and he was beside me sleeping and unconsciously rolled into a spooning position but when he woke up he moved immediately. I guess it really just depends on how you were raised and the way you think. I feel like massages with oil are very odd from father to daughter. The same with laying on top of him. Sitting on his lap seems normal to me though cause I would still do the same with my father. I have not seen him since 6th grade though but I will this month. Anyways bed time and sleeping in the same bed need to be fixed. And playing sick is probably something she does to get more attention because she does probably feel she competes with you for his attention. Start with the bed time and sleeping issue and then bring up your views on the rest. Good luck:)

[Simba8nala]

Hi I'm still a teenager(16) but I never did anything like that with my father. One time we went camping and he was beside me sleeping and unconsciously rolled into a spooning position but when he woke up he moved immediately. I guess it really just depends on how you were raised and the way you think. I feel like massages with oil are very odd from father to daughter. The same with laying on top of him. Sitting on his lap seems normal to me though cause I would still do the same with my father. I have not seen him since 6th grade though but I will this month. Anyways bed time and sleeping in the same bed need to be fixed. And playing sick is probably something she does to get more attention because she does probably feel she competes with you for his attention. Start with the bed time and sleeping issue and then bring up your views on the rest. Good luck:)

[stoney1215]

i think it is a pretty simple thing . do you think there is anything inapropriate happening between him and his daughter ? if the answer is yes then you should immediately leave him and get the authorities involved . if the answer is no then obviously you are seriously over reacting .

society has conditioned us to make every man out to be a ********* or child molester or sexual predator . as a man and as a dad it makes me sick every time someone looks at me and thinks what ever disgusting things their sick minds think of .  

trust yourself . if you think there is something going on get out and protect the child . if you do not think there is something going on find fault in society and think for yourself . dont ruin a relationship because society is sick .

[specialmom]

Hi there.  As a reminder, this post is from 2009.  It is very old.  If you'd like to ask a question or begin your own thread, please it back to community.  Then go to the top of the page and hit post question.  Thanks and good luck

[stoney1215]

so what exactly is he doing with her that is not acceptable . sleeping in the same bed ? are you saying that you are unable to sleep in the same bed as your son without molesting him ? i hope not . hugging and kissing ? a fathers worse day is when his daughter stops kissing him on the lip . to her it becomes dirty and wrong . why ? because society says it is ? why ?
it makes me sad and angry that our society is full of so many sick and disgusting people that have sexual thoughts when they see affectionate dads with their daughters . its bad enough when you have those disgusting thoughts about kids its down right wrong and dangerous when you project your filth on other people .  
does abuse happen ? absolutely . it does not happen with 99% of dads . those real men could never even imagine how someone could be so sick to think that way . you should be ashamed of yourselves . get help .

[nursegirl6572]

Who is Mrs. Happiness?  Who is your post directed to?  Did you look at the date of this thread?

Of course there is a difference between an affectionate dad and an abuser...who ever said there wasn't?  Where did you get that 99% of dads do NOT sexually abuse their children?  That figure is not correct...I wouild like to see your source for that.

Bottom line...there ARE behaviors that are just inappropriate that send up red flags...and as a mother...I would rather someone err on the side of caution to protect a child if they see something concerning rather than just "assume" nothing terrible is going on, and turn a blind eye.

You seem VERY angry, and your anger here is misdirected.  Like specialmom said...if you have a question, or would like to start a conversation, it would be better to start a new thread, instead of bumping this one that is very old.

[Emily_MHModerator]

Hi everyone -

We are closing this thread.  It has served it's purpose, and the original poster hasn't been back since 2009, and has probably resolved this situation by now.

Thanks,

Emily

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