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I want to get married, boyfriend doesn't
I am 27 and my boyfriend is 34.  We have been together for 2.5yrs and have lived together for 2 yrs.  I love him very much and know that he is right for me.  He treats me like a queen.  Every morning we wake up he showers me with kisses and hugs, among the many other things he does and says that makes me know that he loves me dearly.  

Early in our relationship we used to joke about marriage sending mixed messages about how we eached really felt about marriage.  I know he has some complex feelings about marriage because so many in his family have failed.  But looking at the stats, there have been a lot of successful ones also.  My family has not been lucky in marriage either but for some reason I can look past that and see that we have something different and I am willing to give it my all to make it work.  

A couple months ago I brought up the topic and wanted to discuss it seriously with him but it ended in a big fight because he said he wasn't ready for marriage and didn't know if he ever would be.  After a lot of tears and almost breaking up he told me that he didn't know that I felt so strongly about it and that maybe in a few years he might be ready.   I have a lot of problems with this "resolution" because there is still so much uncertainty.  I didn't know if he just said that because he didn't want to loose me or if he really meant that he was going to think about it.  We still can't talk openly about the topic without him getting defensive, and God forbid we see anything wedding related on tv, he changes the chanel immediately. The deeper problem is that because of the doubt i have that maybe he just doesn't want to marry 'ME', I have now started to pull away from him emotionally.  I feel rejected.  I feel as though I can't talk to him openly anymore, so as to not push the issue and yet there are so many unresolved concerns that this may never happen and that I might just be waiting in vein.

I just don't understand.  Our lives are set up as a married couple as it is.  We share a house, bank accounts and every aspect of our lives together.  One could argue that if it aint broke don't fix it, but my arguement is that if it is so much like the real thing already then nothing should change if we make it official, so why not? He's got front row seats to what our lives would be like after marriage so why is he so scared? I don't need the big party and the rings and the dress and everything, in fact, I don't even want that.  I believe that marriage is a symbol of the committment two people make to each other that no matter what, they will try to work it out and be there for each other.  

Based on this, my only conclusion is that his reservations have a deeper meaning and I don't know how to get to the truth.

Should I wait around to see if he will stay true to his word and maybe in a few years we can move forward with our relationship or should I take the risk and start over with someone else, which might take just as long if not longer. Seems like I am stuck between a rock and a hard place since neither decision will be easy. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
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1972958 tn?1325916819
i think if he doesnt want to marry u... he probably doesnt want commited so for now just stay as dating not marrage
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I understand what you are saying and how guys can see it that way. I work with all older (40's and 50's) guys who are mostly married for 2nd or 3rd time. Most don't like the idea of marriage. Very few are "romantics" and want to get married and be with the same woman forever...this is what movies and society tells us: "grow old together" stuff. One of my coworkers, who had a really bad divorce 5 years ago, just fell in love with a girl about his age and after 9 months of dating, he is proposing...

My situation is different. My boyfriend is the type who has always wanted to get married and have kids and have family christmas and all that...so, the fact that he hasn't proposed *only* means that he doesn't want *me* forever. (been together 2 years and 4 months)

And I don't take it as "I'm not good enough." I'm awesome actually: I'm pretty and wild, very smart and a very decent human being.

I don't want anyone's money or even sperm (I can adopt)...I just want love and stability (own house and family) because I need a feeling of belonging to something. I get that I can have that without marriage.

I guess this whole thing comes down to the reasons why the guy doesn't want to. If it's to be free to date other girls, then you are with the wrong guy...

Now I'm confused...this is a good discussion though...thanks :)
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Bonsoir,

  I certainly believe you Gloo.  The way I understand how things work between men and women is more like; when all is said and done men and women cannot trust each other anymore.  Look at pre-nups, willingly signed they are still routinely put aside by the courts for the flimsiest reasons.  Obviously just prior to a wedding no woman will say to her future husband that when they divorce she will make his life a living hell and he will end up broke living in a 1 1/2 apartment paying her alimony for life!  But it happens fairly regularly.  A woman's word, however sincere she is, nowadays means very little.  Actually the courts now have the last word regarding private matters between 2 individuals, grown adults!  A judge will decide, regardless of what the 2 spouses have willingly agreed to in writing!  Of course women are favoured now by the courts, at the expense of men.  No man should get into that type of arrangement, the state should stay the hell out of private matters like marriage and pre-nups.  Sad state of affair now?  Maybe!  However women stand to lose more than men under such circumstances.  Indeed women care much more for traditional marriage than men, bological clock and all.

  Let's see what happens in the coming years.

  Best,

  Arthur.
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Arthur and Bobol,

I agree with everything you say except that you seem to think only men get screwed around in the courts / financially.  If you have read my posts you would see that women do NOT get favouritism in the courts.  Whoever can pay more money to their lawyer gets favouritism.  It's that simple.  I paid over $100 000 in my straight forward divorce back in 2000, but my husband paid more and would have driven me into the ground if the judge didn't finally give him half custody of our toddlers (I had to wean my 6 month old child to give her to him for a week of visitation -- without prior notice --- even though he had admitted to beating our three year old... He agreed to go to psychiatric treatment and give me evidence,  but he never went and for ten years the courts refused to follow up on it....  Oh, and when he returned my 6 month old from the first week of visitation,  he mocked me and pointed out that she was buckled into the car seat but he purposely didn't attach the car seat to the car --- he sneered that she was a perfect projectile ---  and he laughed, saying he did that to horrify me... how could I prove that to a court later on?  He would deny it all)  

Women are not given priority for child custody because "50 50" is the politically correct, en vogue standard these days.  Child support is very, very seldom awarded. Likewise I do not know one mother who has "sole custody" -- it is always joint (custody meaning the legal power to make decisions for the child such as baptisms, what school to go to, how to be raised etc.)  I do not know any woman (or man) with sole custody because it is always joint (50 50) now, or at least some fractional variety of shared time.  

Likewise with the living arrangements for the children of divorce -- as I have told you, my ex beat the hell out of our three year old, and he was a teacher, but he retained his job and got 50-50 residence with the kids (aged 3 years and 6 months, ) because he paid the lawyer a fortune and our three year old was too young to testify.  Ten years later he is now re-married with two new kids, breaching the court order, refusing to see the kids when ordered, not increasing his payments, not willing to pay for university.  He was able to sell his home and make a $100 000 profit by moving to a small town, but my kids don't get a cent of that money even though he didn't even tell them he was moving.  He has yet to undergo the court ordered psychiatric treatment and the court could care less.  How is this in the woman's favour?  It is clearly a situation of "money talks" in the courts, rather than "women are favoured".

I know your friend was screwed around terribly but so was I.   Think of my second relationship -- when I lived with a man for 7 years.  We had a  cohabitation agreement but I still had to spend $50 000 just to have a judge say "Oh, you have a Cohabitation agreement... so I guess your ex has no claim".  I will never get that  money back because the guy quit his job, filed bankruptcy and asked all of us to pay his legal fees (Legal Aid).  You don't seem to acknowledge that.  I know of so many men who file for Legal Aid after quitting their jobs to avoid child support.  In this situation, both men in my life got off scott free by manipulating the courts.

Marriage is a scary thing though and I agree that the legal ramifications are downright terrifying.

I guess I'm crazy though, because I still think I would marry my current beau.  The fact that we are older is reassuring. Neither of us has the interest or energy to deal with that courtroom drama BS.

We have chosen a 2ct diamond engagement ring (yay!!!!!)  but we are not planning any wedding.  It will just
be a commitment ring.


Good luck to all.
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Bonjour,

  I believe you blueeyes2157.  Also your situation speaks for itself.  No comment needed.

  No doubt the courts have behaved in a very very bad way towards you.  The way I see it, yours is somewhat of an exceptional situation, however bad it has been.  In the majority of the cases it's men who get shafted in family courts, I have given a few examples of what can happen to men regarding child support/alimony in my previous posts.  Yes, women can get shafted in family courts but the vast majority are men.  Part of the problem is based on the fact that women can say one thing prior to marriage and act the opposite once married, at the expense of men.  The double standard is obvious to me. By the way, if a man loses his job he is still liable to pay child support, hence debtor prison.  The debt then accumulates until he get out, hopeless really.

  To the best of my knowledge, joint custody is still not the default option.  At least not in Canada.  Women get priority, man gets discriminated against but...he has to pay.

  Your very situation can be seen as one nice example that shows why marriage should be avoided at all cost.

  I wish you the very best with your current beau, a long and prosperous future.

  Best,

  Arthur
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i cant believe this thread is still going,,, i just watched my sister get married the other day she is 23 i am 27 this year been with my bf for over 4 years, i have been enagaged b4 and he broke my heart,,, deep down i new i was not in love with him, luckily it ended...i keep dropping hints to my current b4 but he seems to ignore me on the subject, i joke around and say im not going thailand if we get married and he replys with " well u might have to marry someone else"... he didnt even ask me to dance at my sisters wedding i was the only one at the bridal table by my self and he came and said "hows it going to me"....

im scared,,, i really really am scared... i am scared we r not meant to be together, he said he will not ask me to marry him for a long time yet, and i feel i just cant wait that long,,, maybe im not fussy? or impatient... but i have watched on FB all my friends get married or have babies,, and i can say that i am the only one left out of my high school friends who has not taken a leep... maybe im different??? im so confused... my parents are relegious and have said please dont have a baby b4 u get married,,, times have changed,,, but after watching my sister get married and to see how happy she was has actually made me i wouldnt say jelous of her but jelous of what she has and acheieved....i feel like im getting no where and just getting older by the minute..,..
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973741 tn?1342346373
Hi.  Well, the truth is that is not about getting married but about finding a solid, good partner.  I would think that his being inconsiderate and not wanting to dance with you at a wedding and not communicating with you there so that you basically attended the wedding without a date is a sign that this current boyfriend might not be a great partner in the long run.  

I would try to find someone that is really great to you and makes you feel incredibly special.  That is the kind of person  you want to marry.  

The wedding is just one little day out of a lifetime with someone.  How a person treats you is so much important than when that day will happen.  There are lots of weddings . . . and lots of miserable marriages.  So, spend more time searching for the best partner that puts you on cloud nine and makes you feel like you are the most important thing to him.  That is your ticket to happiness.  Peace
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I know how you feel...been there...

Your boyfriend is resisting you, after all these years. Major red flag!!

You are at the PERFECT age because you are more mature and you are still young. You gotta ditch your boyfriend and do the things you love and meet the right guy and you'll be married before you are 30, which is I believe the ideal way.

Look at the statistics. Girls who get married in their late 20's or early 30's have better marriages than girls who get married in early 20's. I wish your sister well, but statistics are against her.

I knew a girl who got married at 22-23 and she is getting divorced right now...wasted her 20's.

I hope you take a day and spend it doing what you like and figure out what you want to do. You will gain back your strength if you do the breaking up...it will feel powerful, like you have the power in your hands. Unlike now, where you are sitting waiting for him: he has all the power.

Don't waste more time! Guys don't have to worry about these things because they don't have to bear children.

If he hasn't proposed to you by now, it's most likely that he won't ever. Unless you ask him, which I wouldn't do knowing how he is about the subject.

I sound like I know it black and white, but it's just that saying "He is just not that into you"

Good luck.
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I've been with my partner for 12 years now and we have 3 children together. I also have an older daughter from a previous relationship. He proposed to me 6 yrs ago but we still haven't got married. Sometimes we discuss it and he agrees that we should do it within the year but then he is totally disinterested in any of the planning even though I don't have any family to help me. We are both shy and want the event to be tiny, for me its just about us and the children. I'm confused. He says he wants to but then doesn't want to know or says we'll have to see with our finances. When our children mentioned one day about us getting married he said he was waiting for a princess. I knew he was joking as he does like to tease but I keep thinking maybe he won't make that commitment because maybe i'm not his Mrs Right. If I tell him how I feel and he does say ok lets do it, how do I know he isn't just doing it because I want it and he doesn't. What is wrong with me that he wouldn't want to marry me. I cook, clean, look after the children and am very close to his family so what's wrong? He's hurting me but is unaware I think.
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my name is samson sebastine from united kingdom i had a problem with my wife
sometimes ago but never knew what the problem was,i tried to asked her but
she refused to tell,me what it was as time goes on i discovered she was
having an affair with  a friend of mine that happens to be my best friend,i
was so sad that i never knew what to do next,during my search for a way out
i met a friend of mine who had similar problem and introduced me to a man
who helped him with his situation,on getting to the man i discovered he was
a spell caster i was shocked because i have not had anything to do with a
spell caster in my entire life so i tried to give this man a chance cos i
never believed in spell casting as i thought it will not work for me but to
my surprise i got positive results and i was able to get my wife back from
him even after the spell caster did all i discovered my wife fell much more
in love with me on like before so i was so happy that i never know what to
do for him so i am using this opportunity to tell anyone on this blog having
similar problem visit ***@**** am sure he will help you.
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Bonsoir,

  Why on earth should your boyfriend take responsabilities, as a man, that you will not be taking, as a woman?  See my previous posts.  It is now well documented that marriage is a raw deal for men (at the very least financially) and that they should avoid it at all cost.

  Maybe if the laws are fixed marriage may become a good thing for men, but in the present context men should avoid any type of business contract with a female.

  Best,

  Arthur
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Dear Bobol ,
I do not want to offend you but I think you have many issues. From the advice you give, it seems like you have not had any luck with women in your life and you ve met the wrong ones and your advice/perspective is so biased and skewed. There are women b****** out there and gold-diggers just like there are abusive or cheating husbands or dumb ppl, that doesnt mean that ppl have to lose all hope and never try again. Marriage is a huge step and ppl should have their eyes fully open before it and half open after but that doesnt mean that you are going to have a divorce because statistics say so. You can choose to be coward and leave a marriage when things get tough or just cos you are a gold-digger but that doesnt mean that this is what you get when you get married. *Note here ladies: Im not talking bout cases of abusive spouse, in that case get a divorce right away!! I think that every wise person (not some light-headed dumb young/old person) should get married only if they feel their partner is a good person with respectable intentions that loves them and puts their needs and desires before their own not someone marrying you for the wrong reasons. There are not many reasons why men should not marry women unless of course the obvious ones "he's not that into you" or "why buy the cow when you get the milk for free" and this all goes by for as long as we women, myself included, dont have any control over our feelings...As soon as that happens,when it reaches the boiling pt, unfortunately, we sweet and loving creatures turn into cold b******* that tell our dear bf to f*** off cos they didnt deserve us and that we will find someone that does...posts like the many above are to comfort us women until we get to that stage... It`s a shame men are not smart enough to understand whats going on and try to prevent all this... so yeah, Im sorry for your situation of the divorce, cos Im fully aware that there are plenty of women out there that misbehave and make men suffer but its not for everyone so the reasons men give shouldnt be generalized either!!
Good luck to all!!!
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Bonjour lovefool,

  Definitely no offense taken.  In fact I am a bit amused by your post which is typical and which is refered to among men as "a chick logic based argument".  You ignore the main point of discussion and focus on the messenger himself, in other words you make an ad hominem attack.  That is typical of women who argue and, consciously or not, act as if they are short of reasons or arguments.  Answer the following;  what does the fact that I may or may not have been lucky or not with women have to do with the fact that marriage is a losing proposition for men and should be avoided at all costs?  In my opinion there are many reasons (for a man) for not marrying, I state one verifiable fact; a married man is responsible for the children his wife brings to this world, regardless wether he is or is not the biological father!  What's more it would be illegal for him to control his wife's behaviour by warning her not to do it or opting out of fatherhood of a child that is not his!  Just for the heck of it, try and reverse the genders, as in equality thinking, do you think that a wife is held responsible if her husband has a child, during their marriage, for which she is not the mother?  Of course not!  Then why the double standard at the expense of men?  I bring forward a fact, the messenger's status has little relevance per se.

  There are many more reasons for men to avoid marriage, to name a few; lifetime alimony after 10 years in some states, quasi automatic custody of the kids to the woman, no fault divorce (meaning you could be cheated upon and still have to lose 50% of your assets even if you are a victim), 50% chances of divorce with roughly 70% of the divorces initiated by women, etc.

  Oh, so women have no control over their feelings?  Then would that not be one more valid reason for men for not marrying?  Why should a man put himself at the mercy of a woman's feelings/emotions/moods?  

  As for you being sorry for my situation of divorce, where the heck have I ever stated that I have been married?  Wrong person!

  There you have it.

  Have a nice day,

  Bobol
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1962649 tn?1332448451
I have read that more couples divorce after years of living together than the ones who do not. Still, I think it is important to live together before marriage. But no woman should move in with a man without a commitment to marry--if that is what she wants. Get an engagement ring and set a date BEFORE moving in together. Never give any man 100% of your time, attention & love unless he is committed to you and only you.

But gals--more women are dis-satisfied with marriage than men are! Women have to carry & birth the children and most mothers are the primary caregivers of children. Many young women think marriage and children is a fairy tale way to live and that it's all sunshine and lollipops! Then they have a rude awakening. It's a lot of hard work!
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Well I guess my situation is just like so many on this forum but I still want to hear whatever advice anyone has for me. My boyfriend and I have been very happy together for almost three years and have lived together for almost two of those years. We have never had a major fight and have a great life together.

Many of our friends are getting married and we'd never discussed the topic. I finally brought it up and found out that just as much as I'm for it, he's against it. We both cried and cried together and said we didn't want to break up but know we should. We both agreed it's not fair for me to be in a relationship that's actually keeping me from meeting someone who will want to marry me. He was so sweet even during this conversation but would not change his feeling on the marriage thing.

I've never been in a relationship this serious and the thought of losing him makes me want to just forget marriage. Being that this all happened within less than 24 hours ago, I am in a state of shock. I feel like my insides are being ripped out and I can't stop crying. I just want to stay with him forever and give up on marriage so that I don't have to feel this way. I don't want to end up with no one.

What should I do? Forget about marriage and be in a loving relationship or end it in order to possibly find someone who wants to commit?
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1962649 tn?1332448451
Your boyfriend? Your profile says you are a MALE. Is same sex marriage legal where you live?
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haven't updated my profile yet, I'm a female.
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1962649 tn?1332448451
You haven't updated your profile? So you used to be a male but now you are a female? I'm confused. Ok whatever --!! First of all, why do you want to get married? Do you have to have a child? Marriage is not really a good deal for women.
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1962649 tn?1332448451

Get the book called "Why Men Marry *******" by Sherry Argov.
Read it cover-to cover.

You need to move out and get your own place. You should never
live with a man if you want to get married until you have a ring and a commitment.
After you get those things, ok move in. So you need to get out. And never give any man
who is not committed to you 100% of your time, love & attention. You have made yourself
too available and he doesn't VALUE you. Have some standards for yourself.
Do you know that Dr Phil's wife of 33 years--Robin--walked out on him after they had
been dating for 2 years? Yes indeed - she wanted to get married and he said he wasn't ready. So she
broke it off. A few months went by, he realized he missed her and they got back together
because Dr Phil WOKE UP. Your boyfriend needs a wake up call honey.
Give him one. MOVE OUT.
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Thanks, that is good advice.
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You already know that you will not be able to forget about this; it will poison your relationship with him from now on. You can stay with him and pretend it doesn't matter and paper over the crack it's caused because you love him, or you can walk, suck up the pain and then cry it all out and in some months or years meet the man who will want to marry you so badly that he will not be able to contain his excitement about it. If you were only a few months into your relationship this might all be different, but after a year or more into a relationship, a guy's feelings are not going to change and you will be sad and uncertain of the relationship forever if you stay with it. It also simply hurts too much when we know that the person we'd give the world to does not feel us at that same level. I hope you're OK.
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Regarding genders on profiles; when you first join this site it seems to automatically go to a "male" default setting. Mine automatically went to "male" too until I updated it a couple of hours after opening the account. This may clarify your query.
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My boyfriend of 1 year just told me (WHILST AT A WEDDING) that he didn't see the point of getting married.

This is from a man who when he first met me, couldn't stop telling me about our future as husband and wife with a family etc...not to mention up until that moment, he had been throwing the 'wife' term to me as if to give the hint that it may happen soon (I assure you that he isn't diverting me away from him surprising me with a proposal)

Anyway, back to the wedding. When he told me he didn't see the point in marriage, I got upset and said 'I thought you said I was the one' and he walked off on me. I later spoke to him about it in the car on the way home from the wedding and he said he would marry me to make me happy. He said he loves me and knows he wants to spend his life with me but doesn't see the need in formalising it.

It's a few weeks later now and I brought it up for the first time since the night of the wedding. I tried to tell him all of the reasons why marrying him was important to me and again he said he'll marry me to make me happy. This just doesn't sit with me well. I asked why he changed his mind about not having the need to get married and he went on about how marriages end in divorce and questioned why if two people are in love and happy they need a piece of paper.

I'm so confused.
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I feel more sad and frustrated when i found this site, why many mens doesnt want to be married?
My bf and I got the same issue we are dating for more than 2 yrs now we are in a longdistnce relationship,he is 45 yrs old and im 35 yrs old, i never been married and he lived with someone for past 10 yrs without marriage. My problems is exactly with all your problems, my bf doesnt want to get married and i really want to get married i am very family oriented woamn and i want family,. Like all of you girls i really love my bf and its very difficult to break up with him i also dont doubt his feeling with me but he is a marriage phobic, he keep explaining to me that marriage is not a good idea bcoz of his experienced his parents are divorced, aunt, uncle. He is willing to have a child with me and build up family and we already put up a biz that he financed but whatever i do i cant convince him to get married i thought if i do good to im i can change his mind but not. Im also not sure if my family will accept that if i live with him without marriage i came fom religious and family oriented family. I am not eager to have a nice and expensive wedding ring also not a wedding i will be contented in marriage also not an expensive wedding, i just want his 100% commitment, i am also not interested in what he has ii already told him that i am ok with pre-nup. I kow he appreaciated how good i am with him i also appreciated him but i am not satisfied to be a forever gf i want to be a wife and i still beleive in marriage..for those who moved on and broke p with your bf i admired you for your being tough..
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973741 tn?1342346373
Hi there.  You've posted your reply on an old post.  Often these go unnoticed.  You can start your own thread by going to the top of tis page and hitting 'post question".

don't be sad as there are many many men out there that DO want to get married.  You just have to be open to making choices that put you in a position to finding them.  

If marriage is important to you and your current boyfriend is saying he does not want to marry, he is not a good choice in boyfriend for you.  I hope you are able to see that and move on.

We date in order to find the right person for us.  When there is a fundamental difference in lifestyle, that is a reason to break up.  When a man says he doesn't ever want to get married, believe them the first time they say it and move on if it is our desire to be in a married relationship.

You are still young and maybe you want children????  Leave now and look for someone that values marriage as you do.  I have a gazillion married friends (meaning all those men WANTED to get married) and have been married for 12 years myself.  There are plenty of men that view life the way you do.  

so, take care of yourself and get what you want in life.  Move on and find a man that will want the same things as you do.  peace and luck to you
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Hi all,

I hate to say it, but reading all these posts made me feel a little better. I have been with my boyfriend for over 4 years and lived together for over 3 years now. We have a blended family, I have 2 children from a previous marriage and he has 1 also from another marriage. I think we have a happy relationship, we strive to make a happy healthy home for our kids and we have blended quite successfully. Unfortunately he seems no more motivated to marry me now than he was on our first date. This is a huge heart ache for me because not only have I invested my heart, but my children are quite attached as well. I want to be married, I want to feel like he thinks I am worth marrying and I have the most unpleasant feeling he doesn't feel I am. He says he loves me, but sometimes I wonder if he only keeps me around for financial reasons and because I (if I must say) am a fantastic mother and his child is very attached to me. I want to be with someone who loves me and is proud to be with me, I want to be "Mrs. ------" instead of just "the girlfriend". I want the world to see we are committed to one another.  
I have cried a lot, I have choked back so much disappointment, and I am so sick of it all. Maybe he's happy living like we're married without any real commitment, but I am not. Also its not that I just want to be married to just anyone, I just want to be with someone who loves and cares about me enough to make the commitment to me. I'd rather be alone than strung along. He says "but where am I going?" well maybe both our names are on the lease but our relationship certainly isn't "going" anywhere. That's another thing, he'll sign a lease with me, buy a car with me, financially tie himself to me, he's fine with the idea of getting a 30 year mortgage with me, but I'm not worth the commitment of marriage?!?!? THE HECK?
I could go on and on and on. What it all boils down to is I'm going through all the motions of being married but I'm not worth the damn slip of paper.
I have been through the whole range of emotion in regards to this issue and all I am left with is despair. I am a good person, I am honest, I try to do everything right, I follow all laws, rules, regulations and I feel I am entitle to be happy. I feel I deserve to having a partner who loves and values me enough to make the commitment to me. I just wish he felt I was worth the commitment, but apparently I'm not.
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  Just a few words regarding this discussion.  Lets's face reality.  Marriage is NOT a sign of commitment.  If it really were, there would be no divorce possible.  In other words, you would be married FOREVER, regardless of what happens.  Nowadays you can get married and then file for divorce the next month without so much as having to justify or prove anything.  Just claim irreconciliable differences.  Remember, it's called no fault divorce and women asked for it!

  More and more men are seeing that marriage is a losing proposition for them and walking away.  If women really want to get married, it is them who should petition to have the laws changed in order to make them fair to men (see my previous posts).  As an example, alimony forever to a wife after 10 years of marriage is not all that attractive to men.  Ditto for false domestic violence accusations that go unpunished, false paternity claims, etc.

  Seems that men are freeing themselves from the provider's role, gaining their freedom.  Some people apparently do not like it.

  Best,

  Bobol
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Im 44 my bf is 43.  We were both in marriages that were over 14 yrs.  He has 2 young teenage kids, I have three independent adults and 1 teenage daughter. His ex took him for a lot financially and gets a whopping check, most alimony and lives with her fiance.  He tells me he loves me so much and he believes he would do anything for me.  I take that monitarily, since money is his prize savings and my income is null compared.  

After well over a year and me being the one doing over night stays at least 3-4 days a week, he finally stayed over 2 nights because my car was in the shop.  He helped repair it, and gave me 15 for gas when it was $4/ gal.  I have also given cash when he had no pocket money.  I have helped him replace and make his house look like a home, helped his kids see reasons for making good grades, yet the ex and his kids tell him what a useless dad and always emotionally blackmailing him, just because he has to work or Im there, even though I incorporate them and love them.

I told him he needs a wife and I need a husband (it would be nice to have a fixer, but he doesnt fix my stuff), but that means nothing unless you want one.  I can no longer participate as his playing house wife.  I over stepped my boundries and it hurts when he wants me to scadaddle while helping him, before the kids arrived if the kids wanted to come home instead of stay over at a hotel and have a family nite.

He rarely kisses me deeply and I brush several times a day.  He says he loves me, but love is an emotional investment.  Ive known it would be a mistake to move in with him, but this strand validated that.  Id sign a prenupt, but for a man as traditional as he is, he sure wants a claus in his traditions because Ive been filling his needs.  Marriage is a risk, but so is Love and the Sex.  
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973741 tn?1342346373
Hi there, welcome to the forum.  Honestly, I think it sounds like you may need to release yourself from this relationship.  The practical issues aren't working for the two of you I'm afraid.  Love is but an emotion in my opinion.  

I would move on and find someone with less baggage.  good luck
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I was in the same situation with a man, I stayed with him for 15 years in his "unready" state of marriage... he made a lot of excuses as to why he wasn't ready.  In the end I hated him for it, I thought it was disrespectful and mean.  I did leave him and he begged me to come back, he even said ok we can do the marriage and family thing if that will make you happy, but by that time I was so angry at him for denying it to me for so long (and mad at myself for accepting his excuses when I knew I really did want to be married) that I said no.   6 months after we broke up, he got engaged to someone else.  and married her and still calls me to reconcile with him.
It made me realize that I don't think he really loves anyone, he loves whomever will put up with him and make him not feel so alone in life as his current wife isn't as "caring" as I was with him (basically she doesn't put up with his garbage).  It did a lot of damage to my self esteem to stay in that relationship for as long as I did, I wish I had been smarter and stronger and left earlier on to date other guys and figure myself out without the pressure of having to make someone else happy.  
I would honestly recommend leaving this guy.  I'm sorry, I know that's harsh but I'm in my 40s now, I don't have children which I do wish I had had, and I've seen this happen with quite a few of my friends.  Men actually really like security, they like a woman (ANY woman) to be there for them.  I have a hard time deciphering whether men who want to date me actually like me or just don't want to be alone.  
I am dating someone now who totally confirms that, he's been married a couple of times because he doesn't like to be alone!!  He realizes this about himself and we have nice boundaries and both trying to figure this thing out, and he's a million times more affecionate, more loving and respectful and caring than my long term ex ever was so I don't regret leaving at all.  Sometimes its the fear of being on our own and facing the big bad world alone that makes us stay in unhappy situations.  Consider your life and what you want for yourself.  You only have one life.  
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get a career, a fabulous place of your own, the car you want, have a great group of fabulous and trustworthy friends and trust me you will have a ton of men begging to marry you.  
be fearless
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5343865 tn?1366683771
Dear
At first I want to wish you have a best life. I am a man and I want to tell you that history tells that every man needs a women, someone to complete him. Men need women. I am in love to a dutiful girl. I want to live, work and do everything possible to satisfy her needs, I want us to have babies and raise them well.

I have never seen that girl. But I know she is there somewhere. I believe in destiny and I prayed to God to grand me my wish. So I am waiting and I believe that when the time is right then I will propose to her without to wasting time. It is west of time if you believe that you have to spend time with people to get to know them.

If it is the beginning of a relationship then the man can cover himself with a beautiful mask.

And if you try him and wait for a long time then he might change.

Men do get angry sometimes and so does women. But if you are married then you can stand each other before just leaving each other.

At the end I want to advice you that every man need a specific key for him to give himself to you. So find out which key it is.
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Hi

I must admit reading this thread has made me feel better that I'm not the only one out there with this problem!

My boyfriend and I have been together for almost 2 years now, lived together for 9 months. We have a really good relationship and are very much in love tho life can get us down sometimes we help each other through, we bicker more now we live together and we're quite opposite personalities but I wouldn't change a thing, he puts up with my **** and I put up with his because no relationship is perfect, and most of the time we're really happy. He's sensitive, he make's me laugh and we can talk about pretty much anything. I spent a long time being single dating and he is the first person I have really connected with.

It may seem a little early to be panicking about marriage and kids but the subject has come up, I never used to dream about marriage but I'd always thought I would get married as I wanted a stable background to have a family. My boyfriend tends to rebel from anything traditional and sees marriage as a piece of paper that would just be expensive if anything ever went wrong with our relationship...this really hurt me at first, but after considering long and hard how I felt, I thought that I could come to terms with not getting married after all it really is just a piece of paper I know he loves me and wants to commit to me in other ways, why should I throw away something so good just because of tradition and because it's society's norm... We are honest and open with each other (maybe too honest sometimes!) I'm not scared he's going to walk out the door and leave me, I trust him to be honest with me.

The real blow for me came when the subject of children came up recently, we've skirted around the issue before, but I've been struggling lately not knowing how he feels, one of my friends is lately married and pregnant, all my other friends talk about marriage and kids a lot so it's very much right under my nose atm.

The final push for me to ask exactly how he felt was the other week we had gone to a friends for dinner - an older couple with a little girl - they asked us if we ever thought we'd have kids, again we skirted the issue that night. But I felt like I needed to ask how he really felt the next morning...he explained he'd always felt that he didn't want to contribute to our already massively expanding population (he is very environmentally conscious something I've always loved about him...though I'm starting to feel a little different about atm!) he says he wants a family and would love to adopt, something I've always wanted to do but he is not sure how he will feel about having a baby of our own when the time comes. He's just not sure how he feels about it all, he doesn't know how he will feel a few years down the line, but where does that leave me?

As I have said I would love to adopt, but I want the experience of having my own child too, just once. I feel very upset and uncertain about where we are heading, I talked to a friend and got some outside perspective which helped, and told him after where I felt I stood which is that I would like to get married but I feel I can live without it, but not without a family I need children in my life and I couldn't forgive him if we just carried on and never had a family. Adoption would be great but there are no guarantees you'll be accepted.

He says he needs time to think and I suggested he should talk to someone and get some perspective on the situation too. I want to make us work but I feel if I'm compromising shouldn't he too? I know this is difficult for him as he feels very strongly about it, but he loves me and wants to please me too... The sad thing is neither of us want to break up we're not angry with each other. Do I give it time? We're still young I don't know how he'll feel in the long run, I'm just scared that I won't be able to just wait see where we end up as it's very much on my mind atm. I can't stop myself from bringing it up when what I should do is leave him to think about it, and not pressure him into making a decision.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.
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Hey Kittykat :)
I honestly think there is a big issue here, I think it's amazing that you are thinking of adopting but I also think you should never give up wanting your own child. And saying he doesn't want your own because of over population is a bit of a tough one. clearly he has thought about a future if he wants to adopt but it will not be the same experience and like you said if you are willing to compromise why shouldn't he. Maybe explain that if you're giving up your dream of a wedding and are willing to adopt as well then why is he holding back the prospect of having your own child? Personally I do not want children but Ii know if I did and my partner would not accept this after all that I would be doing for him I don't think I would be able to stay with him, because then it's not compromise but it's you caving in to all his wants and you getting nothing in return!

As I said I don't want my own children but I've also been with my partner for 3 years and he doesn't want them either. the issue we face is that he wont commit, as in at all!! We don't live together only see each other on weekends every time I've brought up living together he says it would be impossible as we would clash to much in his ideal world we would 'Live close by to each other in our own apartments and be able to pop over' to me that's nothing stable and I also have never seen my self wanting a wedding and all that crap but for the last two years it's all I have thought about and he says he doesn't believe in marriage, its just a bit of paper. How do I explain that it's not it's something I need.. I know he seriously loves me and I do him before each other we had never lasted more than a couple of months with anyone else and he tells me he cant imagine life without me.. So why can't he be with me? Fully? We've been together 3 years not 3 weeks.. And I keep telling my self if he loved me, I mean like I know he would never cheat on me and would never do anything to hurt me, but I don't think he realises he is doing it now. And like he has said he is not a traditionalist when it comes to relationships and stuff and I get that.. hence why I have just been a weekend girlfriend for the last 3 years :/ .. I'm always good at giving the advice, never one to take it.. but now I need to! HELP (Please) xx
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me too :( my bf doesn't want to get married.we have been in a relationship nearly 4th and not live together, but the daily routine feels like we are  married couple (except intercourse).we spend time together, like studying, cooking, watching film, he also pay for my regular needs like food for breakfast, shampoo, etc, he also pay for our lunch and dinner mostly.on next february we will graduated from college.He told me that he isn't ready, he said that he isn't ready financially and mentally,i answered that i will go to work to on my career, so i will not depend on him until he financially stable, so at but lately i found that his sister doesn't want us to get married first before her.his sister still doesn't have any bf and i'm so sad.i don't know how long I can wait till her get a bf and also wants the marriage.
Why does she act like that? :( wht can I do????pls help
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This guy is not the center of your world. You desearve better. Do not ever compromise that far with a guy. There are plenty who want to get married and have a family you will find one for you. There is no need to be scary to be alone. The grass is always greener. Love yourself more. Thanks
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My bf and i are 3.5 years dating now its a long dstnace sow e just meeting twice a yr when he is coming in my country. Its so depressing bcoz we are now fighting the marriage and to have. Baby for more than 2yrs. So i also dont know what will i do bcoz i dont think he will change his mind to marry ke and ta have a family with me. So i dont know if i will give up, i want to have my family and i wanna be married.
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i´ve been with my boyfriend for two years, we used to talk about marriage at first, but now we don´t have that conversation. He financially supports his family, as his father has been unemployed for the last three years and this is an issue that unfortunally is very present and will not allow the relationship to go any further. I´ve been depressed about this, but i know i can´t change it and it would be selfish of me to demand something else from him, because at the end is his family and they are the most important thing in his life.
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I'm in a similar type of relationship as some of you ladies. But I’m a guy so I just thought i'd post from a male point of view since it seems like mostly women posting here...

I have been with my girlfriend for about 3 years. I'm 32 and she is 28. I've been married before and it ended badly. I'm divorced now and in the happiest relationship that I could imagine. I love my girlfriend and she loves me and I really feel right now that I've met my soul mate (if there is such a thing) We live together and are genuinely extrememly happy.

recently she has been pressuring me about marriage and I feel that if our relationship is so happy and we are so in love now, then why should we need a piece of paper to validate it?

She says because she wants a "committment"
I say we are already in a committed relationship.

We even wear rings and call each other Mr. and Mrs.

She says because she wants to spend the rest of our lives together.
I say “I want that too but don't need to get married in order to do that”.

We seem perfect for each other physically and emotionally. We have the same since of humor, the same taste in music, books, and movies. I really feel like I’ve met the love of my life. So why change things? We’re in love, isn't that enough?

She says things like "I want to know where this relationship is going".
In my mind, the destination (if there is such a thing) should be to be happy and in love and faithful... if you already have that then why is there a need to be "going" anywhere?

She says that she wants to guarantee that our love lasts forever.
It would be nice if marriage could guarantee everlasting love but marriage doesn't do that.

Marriage doesn’t keep people from falling out of love; it just adds penalties and punishments for falling out of love If you love someone you don't need an official document to make you want to stay together. People stay in relationships because they love each other and like being around each other, why isn't that enough?

Are women who INSIST on marriage trying to guarantee something that cannot be guaranteed? Why not just be happy and in love and together?

Ladies: If your man loves you and you are happy with him then why isn't that enough?

And for all those women who commented with statements like "leave him if he's not ready"... I think that it is hypocritical for a person to suggest that if they claim that they are in love.

How can you say that "if a man loves you then he wouldn't let you walk away over a piece of paper" and in the same breath assert that you love your man and would leave that man unless he signed the very same piece of paper?

It seems like some women are confusing selfish with content.
For some men it's enough just to be in love.

If your man treats you well and you are in a happy loving relationship and committed relationship then stop looking for something that you already have. Marriage doesn't add love or commitment, it just adds paperwork.
It breaks my heart when i hear of good, loving and committed relationships ending for something a superficial as a legal title.

Ladies: if you find yourself in a situation in which you are with a man that you love and who loves you and he is committed to you and is faithful and it STILL isn't enough then maybe you should ask yourself  this:

is "commitment" the right word for what you are looking for, or are  "obligation" "guarantee" "penalty" more suitably terms.

If you are already in a committed relationship with a man that loves you then Just be content with sharing your life with the man you love and stop pushing for something you already have.

Marriage doesn't guarantee commitment or love, it only financially punishes people who are miserable in their relationship for breaking up.
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973741 tn?1342346373
The bottom line is that your girlfriend is clear that she wants to get married.  Whether you agree that her goal is worthy or not, she is upfront about it.  If you don't think you can do that, then you should let her findd someone she can make the kind of committed (legally) relationship she desires.  

I wanted to get married as well.  I also wanted children and would never consider having kids with someone I wasn't married to.  She's 38, that is probably going through her mind.

So, let her go find the man of her dreams that wants to marry her.  You can find someone that better matches your stance in life that marriage is simply a paper.  Neither opinion on that is right or wrong----  it's a matter of what people want.

You'll never be able to convince someone that marriage is meaningless that wants to get married (as a married woman of many woman like myself could argue that) and I know that I'll never convince you that marriage is a true commitment and a sign that a couple signs up to go through the hard times with each other and hope to be together forever.  We don't see it the same----  so you just have to look at the practical issue that your girlfriend and you want different things.  good luck
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My uncle didnt want to marry his gf. 20 years down the line and three children they're still perfectly happy together.
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3060903 tn?1398568723
So your wife (by common law) is out of her comfort zone without being married, which is considered the "norm" and steeped in rich tradition, something that she's had her heart set on since her first tea party,
she's embarrassed out of her mind with what her friends and family, dead or alive are entertaining as to your respect for her, bottom line, she's got to be thinking that you just don't care enough about her to marry her.

You're deadlocked and at an impasse, and what you're saying is that chivalry is dead. That you're not willing to step up and take the bullet. That you'd rather leave your poor girl without peace of mind and pride. Personally, I think your girlfriend deserves a man that would put her happiness first. A man is supposed to protect their women and their children. (have you stopped any moving forward in that area too i wonder). To be a man is to lay down his life for his women and family if need be and you're stuck on what it's going to cost you if it doesn't work out?  Your position taken is about $$$ when it should be about respect.

I'm wondering what your views are about having kids? Do you mind telling us whether your wife wants kids, and  whether you don't? I think that most people want to be married for the children's sake.
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Yes,
My girlfriend is clear that she wants to get married and I am clear to her that past experiences -both personal and anecdotal have lead me to have different views on marriage than she does.

Fair. We have both been upfront with each other.

To be honest, we didn't really discuss it when we started dating and by the time the subject of marriage became a serious topic of discussion we were already head over heels for each other. It's possible that had these issues came up before we fell in love we may have gone our separate ways figuring that we were not compatible, But now that we are in a happy, loving, committed relationship it's not as simple as just breaking up because we've already seen how compatible we are in every other way. We love each other and neither of us wants to break up anytime soon.

Your advice for men in my situation seems to be “If you don't think you can [Marry] her, then you should let her find someone who can make the kind of commitment (legally) relationship she desires"

This suggests that I am somehow preventing her from doing this. I'm not.

I love her and i want her to stay with me forever but I'm not holding her against her will or keeping her captive in the relationship.

We are together because we are happy together and because we love each other. If she felt one day that someone else could make her happier then I wouldn't stop her from finding happiness.

We have this fundamental difference in regards to how we see marriage and yet we are still together despite that because we love each other, are happy together and would rather be with each other than with someone else. I believe that's what should hold a relationship together. I know she would rather be married than girlfriend or boyfriend but i'm hoping that it's not enough to break us up.

I am saying to my girlfriend: "I want for you and me together forever".

Is it more important for a woman to find a guy who will marry her or for her to find a guy that she wants to spend the rest of her life with?

It's selfish to want to obligate someone to be in a relationship if they feel that they would be happier single or with someone else. I would not want my girlfriend to be with me if she thought that someone else could make her happier. I would want her to be honest with me and be free even though it would be painful for me.

That's one of the issues I have with Marriage...

Marriage says that people should be penalized for not staying in unhappy relationships.  I believe me and my girlfriend should stay together because there's nowhere else we'd rather be. Not because we're obligated to not leave.

If my girlfriend thinks that the lack of a marriage certificate trumps all of the positive things in our relationship and that she would be happier single or in another relationship then she should go end this relationship and follow her heart.

As a poster said several comments above:

"love should be like a butterfly in your hand".

speacialmom, "It's not an issue of me letter her go or not... it's me leaving the door open for her to leave if she wants and hoping that our love is strong enough on its own merits that she wants to stay.

Your advice for men in my situation seems to be " If you don't think you can [Marry] her, then you should let her find someone who can make the kind of committed (legally) relationship she desires"

This suggests that I am somehow preventing her from doing this.
I'm not holding her against her will or keeping her captive in the relationship. We are together because we are happy together and because we love each other. If she felt one day that someone else could make her happier then I wouldn't stop her from finding happiness.

My girlfriend and I have this fundamental difference in regards to how we see marriage and yet we are still together despite that impasse because we love each other, are happy together and would rather be with each other than with someone else. I believe that love should be the force that holds a relationship together.

It's selfish to want to obligate someone to be in a relationship if they feel that they would be happier single or with someone else. That's what marriage does. It's a series of penalties and obligations. It is an attempt to guarantee something that is impossible to guarantee even with the best  of intentions.

I would not want my girlfriend to be with me if she thought that someone else could make her happier. I would not have her in a situation where she wants to leave but can't because she fears legal or financial repercussions.

If irreconcilable differences were to surface between us I would want her to be honest with me and be free even though it would be painful for me.

That's one of the issues I have with Marriage...

Marriage says that people should be penalized for not staying in unhappy relationships.  I believe me and my girlfriend should stay together because there's nowhere else we'd rather be. Not because we're obligated to.

If she thinks that the lack of a marriage certificate trumps all of the positive things in our relationship and that she would be happier single or in another relationship then she should go end this relationship and follow her heart.

As a poster said several comments above: "love should be like a butterfly in your hand". It's not an issue of letter her go or not... it's leaving the door open for her to leave if she wants and hoping that she wants to stay.
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973741 tn?1342346373
Whew, long post.  Well, I still stand by the fact that you two want different things.  One or the other would be compromising on something very important if you give in to the other.  To me, I'd not have stayed with someone no matter how much in love I was if they didn't want to marry me.  Marriage was something I wanted and needed.  Wouldn't have worked for me to give that up.  I'd always hold a bitter place in my heart and resent it a little no matter how much I thought I loved the guy at the time.  I'm practical about relationships and love.  

so maybe it doesn't matter that much to your girlfriend if you don't marry.  But if you've been up front with her and she still mentions it----------  she'll deep down harbor resentment because of this throughout the duration of your relationship.  

So, if she wrote her side of things, I'd tell her to leave you and find someone that better matches what she wants.

And that is my advice to you as well.  You two are not compatible.  

Butterflies and love have nothing to do with each other.  But then I've had a successful long term marriage-----  so the floating away thing isn't something that I really believe in or even get such an analogy.  But then again, I was practical and broke it off with men that I dated that I found didn't have the same goals as me  

I'm definitely not saying you are wrong for how you feel.  But your girlfriend isn't wrong either.  You both should be with people that want the same things when it comes to something so fundamental and foundational in one's belief system.  good luck
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A wise man once said: "The person you marry is never the person you divorce".
There are no provisions for common-law marriage in my state.
My girlfriend and I both have a child from previous relationships. I have a son and she has a daughter.
My previous marriage was followed by a bitter custody battle and a costly divorce.

At the time when I got married, it would have been utterly impossible to convince me that I wasn't marrying my soul mate and that my marriage wouldn't last forever. Like most newlyweds, I was completely sure that I had found "the one" and the thought of a prenuptial agreement or anything like that was for couples who didn't trust each other. My ex wife and I had complete trust in each other and faith that our relationship would stand the test of time.


I’m divorced now and happy with the love of my life (My girlfriend). Of course, If I had known then what I know now I would have stayed single but I was young and in love and didn't know any better.

Even though it can be argued that an approximate average of 50% of marriages end in divorce, almost 100% of marriages begin totally happy with both bride and groom utterly convinced and totally determined to be together "'till death do them part".

Nighthawk61,
In your post you say:  that not wanting to get legally married is saying
That “chivalry is dead”,  
That I'm not “willing to step up and take the bullet”
That “I'd rather leave my poor girl without peace of mind and pride."
That "my girlfriend deserves a man that would put her happiness first".

What I’m really saying is:
That “Chivalry” is a medieval term (This is 2014),
That Men and women should both put each other first in order to keep a relationship alive.
A relationship built on love should not necessarily equate to “taking a bullet” in the form of a legally binding contract.
A man should wake up every morning and do his best to make his woman fall in love all over again. If a couple stays together it should be because there is no place else that either person would rather be.

Marriage as it is today invites complacency.

Couples should not rely on legal penalties as the incentive to remain together. The incentive should come solely from a desire to keep their feelings of love strong and alive. There should be a daily push to want to make your partner forsake all others. The penalty for neglect or infidelity should be separation and if you really love someone then that should be incentive enough to keep the other person content.

Women should stay with men because those men give them a love that is like no other. A love that makes them forsake all others.

Men should strive to make their women fall in love again and again every single day. The commitment should come from a desire to remain together.

Love is not a legal union it is an emotional one.

Couples should strive to keep each other content.

If one or both of the people in a relationship aren't not content in the relationship or if someone is unfaithful, neglectful or emotionally abusive then the penalty should not come from a court of law it should come from a breakup of the relationship. Period.

Nighthawk,
You are right when you say that a man should support his child but there is already a legal framework in place that deals with custody and financial support issues. I fail to see what this has to do with marriage when those issues exist independently and regardless of marital status unless you think that unhappy married couples should be forced to stay together if they have children together.

You say that my position taken is about money and not about respect... I disagree. To respect someone is to regard them as equals. Marriage invites complacency by providing financial incentives to one person in the relationship while at the same time providing penalties to the other person in case of  a dissolution of the relationship. Marriage creates an unequal distribution of risk and reward.

A poor man who falls in love with a woman with millions of dollars and does nothing to better his own financial situation should not leave the relationship as a millionaire. The same goes for women. When two people are committed to each other they share equal responsibility for the upkeep of their relationship. No one should get any type of financial benefit for failing in a relationship.

Love and Law are two separate things and just because something was a tradition doesn't make it practical or reasonable in this day and age.
It is unfair to say that a Man should marry a woman to give her “piece of mind". Because marriage doesn’t say "we will be together until death do us part" it says: "if we are not together until death do us part, someone will be punished".
If two people love each other and want to be together forever, then the relationship should be its own reward.
As far as risk is concerned:
It seems odd to me that women condemn men for worrying about “what if the marriage ends in divorce” when part of the reason many women push so hard for marriage is because they are worrying about “what if he leaves me”.
Both Men and women are guilty of considering the “what ifs”. That doesn’t mean that don’t trust each other.

The truth is:
No Man can predict what his woman will do in the future, he can only trust and hope.
No woman can predict what her man will do in the future, she can only trust and hope.

At least without legal paperwork, love and commitment are the only factor to consider.
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Specialmom,
Sorry for my long posts and i appreaciate your thoughtful reply.

In response, I can say that if you are married happily then he is with you because he loves you and not because he is married to you.

Marriage and Love are two seperate things.

It sounds like you have a happy husband who loves you but hypothetically speaking: if he was unhappy in the marriage for some reason that couldn't be reconcilled would you want him to stay with you anyway just because he was married?

If one of you found yourself unfulfilled in your marriage, would you stay out of obligation?

Should people stay together out of obligation or because they are happy?

If happiness is not enough to keep two people together then i question whether or not they should be together at all.  All i'm saying that "In love" is not the same as "in loyal" and love should be the tie that binds.

Something tells me that your current husband would have stayed with you all this time anyway even without the documents. Because he loves you. :)

I love my girlfriend too...

her and I are at an impasse about the marriage thing. i truly hope that it isn't enough to break us up. I'm hoping that she and I can get past this and remain happy andI love her enough to listen. If she truly decides that the paperwork is more important than our relationship than I'm willing to let her go but i'm hoping that we can stay as we are. Only time will tell.
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I'm sorry but you are wrong. There are obviously plenty of us women on here and it comes up when you search in safari. This thread is helping me GREATLY right now and it's all in one place. Let people post what, when, and how they want.
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973741 tn?1342346373
Hi.  As the Community leader of the forum, I try to tell people what works best for answers.  Posting one's own story at the tail end of an old post means that it will get missed by many.  Great to read and that is always available but if someone wants to discuss their own issues, then they should start their own post.  It also drags old information up to the top of the forum which bogs down current posts.  Works best to post your own question rather than posting on an old post. Med help even gives designation to these old posts with an hour glass symbol to help people identify them.  

Best to post your own question when you see an hourglass.  good luck to all
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I am with you honey! I got the same raw deal. There has got to be a club for girls like us. The only thing left for me to do is move out. My kids are attached to him but they are older and can deal with it. What really burns me up is that he is ok with me leaving, it's absolutely no big deal.

I wish you luck in finding your happiness.
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973741 tn?1342346373
Hi ladies. please start your own posts as most who have been on this thread are no longer around.  good luck
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