Aa
I'm going insane........
So, as most of you already know, I have 2 children from a previous marriage, ages 14 & 11. They see their father every second weekend, and he is very significant in their lives. This is great, i have always wanted to see them have a healthy relationship with their father. He pays his child support to me every week, $140, on time. So, i don't know how others feel about this, but breaking the support money down into 2, is $70 a week per child, and as most single mothers will know, this is not enough money to cover school start up fees, uniforms, school excursions, food, rent, normal day to day living. My son needed braces a month ago, we both knew (his father and I) about 5 years ago he would need braces when he was older and they were finally put on a month ago. I paid the $2600 for them, private health paid $2400 bringing the total to $5000. I told him 3 months prior that this was happening, and could he go halves with me in the cost. He put on the big sob story of 'sorry i've got no money'.He asked me if i would cover the cost for him, and i said yes i would, our son needs this badly. He has never mentioned of paying the money back to me whatsoever,and i've never asked him for it. Am i wrong to ask half of the cost of our son's braces? Should i be expecting for the child support to cover this as well? I am also stressing about the costs of both our kids attending high school next year, where i'm looking at $1500 to enrol them, and this is not including uniforms or book lists, just lap top hire and student resource scheme requirements. I'm scared their father will tell me once again he has no money and can't help out. (this is a public school too by the way). Am i wanting too much or am i justified in wanting their father's help? I mean, we were married for 12 years, its not like the kids were from a one night stand or anything. And to top it all off, the kids have been downright disrespectful and mouthing off to me, to the point where tonight, i just wanted them to go, like, go to their father's, if thats where they think they're better off, then go for it. I am sick to death of being the money machine, forking out for everything, and yet 'dad' is held in the highest regard, and yet doesn't do the half of what i do for them. I know this is no competition, and i don't want it to be, but i am sick of being the one who is abused, back-chatted, and yelled at when i am the one who is providing everything. Everyone who says children remember who did what for them has got it totally wrong, kids don't get it, and i don't think they do until maybe they find themselves in the same situation, maybe as adults. Tonight i thought i was losing my mind, i just don't understand any of this, and i'm sick of it. Mums can only do so much, after all i am human too.
My whole early married/separated/divorced life played out in the above conversations.
My boys would go to their fathers and see new furniture, fine food, newer cars, fancy clothes and when they came home to me it was crap furniture, mom gone working 12 hours a day to pay for crap items, lower cost food and only a 20 year old car in the driveway. Ex man never came to a ball game, or a recital, or a birthday party but the kids adored his life and even lied on their college transcripts that I did not exist.
Today they are still mad at me for not having the finer things in life and are very vocal with each other about it, and as a mom who lived through it, I have found that sooner or later one must make peace with the way things are...In the end, there is only one person we must please, and we face that person every day in the mirror.
M
My boys would go to their fathers and see new furniture, fine food, newer cars, fancy clothes and when they came home to me it was crap furniture, mom gone working 12 hours a day to pay for crap items, lower cost food and only a 20 year old car in the driveway. Ex man never came to a ball game, or a recital, or a birthday party but the kids adored his life and even lied on their college transcripts that I did not exist.
Today they are still mad at me for not having the finer things in life and are very vocal with each other about it, and as a mom who lived through it, I have found that sooner or later one must make peace with the way things are...In the end, there is only one person we must please, and we face that person every day in the mirror.
M
I thought there was a way to have this court ordered. If you have doubts about these things it never hurts to check what exactly your rights are. Don't assume you have no rights or can't do anything about the situation.
Like I stated in my original post best to have these things court ordered and then he can't weasel his way out period.
I wouldn't even have any verbal discussions with him in front of the children period. If he starts, then you two should either: Take the discussion where the children can't hear OR delay the discussion until you both can discuss the issue without the children present.
As far as the children and what the ex is going to tell them or what they are going to say to you or think.................Hon, you did what you have the right to do. You aren't asking anything unreasonable. You are not obligated to give your children a explaination in regards to what you are doing and every move you make in order to make sure they are well provided for............they are children for heaven's sake. If they bring up something their dad said I wouldn't even entertain any convo with them. Just tell them you are doing what you think is best..........over and out. You have the control to limit or stop these convos.
I can imagine it is difficult............My husband and I went through a similar situation with his ex, so I know exactly what it is like to deal with a person who twists and turns everything around and doesn't want to work with you but against you................totally exhausting.
You are going to have to go the legal route with this ex unfortunately to make him do what he should be doing.
Like I stated in my original post best to have these things court ordered and then he can't weasel his way out period.
I wouldn't even have any verbal discussions with him in front of the children period. If he starts, then you two should either: Take the discussion where the children can't hear OR delay the discussion until you both can discuss the issue without the children present.
As far as the children and what the ex is going to tell them or what they are going to say to you or think.................Hon, you did what you have the right to do. You aren't asking anything unreasonable. You are not obligated to give your children a explaination in regards to what you are doing and every move you make in order to make sure they are well provided for............they are children for heaven's sake. If they bring up something their dad said I wouldn't even entertain any convo with them. Just tell them you are doing what you think is best..........over and out. You have the control to limit or stop these convos.
I can imagine it is difficult............My husband and I went through a similar situation with his ex, so I know exactly what it is like to deal with a person who twists and turns everything around and doesn't want to work with you but against you................totally exhausting.
You are going to have to go the legal route with this ex unfortunately to make him do what he should be doing.
I don't think you're being a drama queen at all. I think you're rightfully upset about all of this. You're being a great mom to those kids, they're just not mature enough yet to see that. I'm glad you got some info about pursuing the additional child support. Because like I said, regardless of anything else, those kids are also his financial responsibility and he's been getting off way too easily having to pay so little. That kind of thing would never fly here in the USA. The courts here tend to require larger amounts of child support in favor of the custodial parent because they have the kids majority of the time and therefore they have larger expenses. Teenagers also have more expenses because of school related activities and things like braces. You're not wrong at all to expect him to pay more. Don't second guess yourself here. You're definitely the only one in this situation who has a clue and your husband and kids are completely clueless.
..oops, it submitted before i was ready!
and i was willing to pay because i knew our son would be waiting forever if i was to wait for him to come up with the money. In 4 months, he hasn't even coughed up $50 or anything to me, and i know i will never see the money. The kids must of said something to him that weekend, like, aare you going to help mum? But he twisted and turned everything around (like he always does) and told them that i am so lucky he pays me child support every week because alot of men don't, and because he pays for that, he is not obligated to pay anything more. He even told the kids he's so poor, he can barely buy food for them when they stay. This has made our kids feel soooo sorry for him, they tell me off for not seeing how poor and desolate their father is and i should leave him alone! Go figure.
3. I also got a breakthrough this morning, i rang child support and told them the whole situation, and they said yes, i can pursue the extra costs! Its called a 'change of assessment' and they will calculate a new child support amount for him to pay the money back. Its not 100% guaranteed, but i can try.
My only problem is, even though i know i'm going down the right avenues to do this, and i have every right to pursue this, i'm scared it will back fire on me. I know he will tell the kids i 'dobbed' him into child support, and now he is even poorer because of me, and they will give me an even harder time about this.
I feel so stressed, because it seems each way i turn, it always backfires on me, whether i've said/done the right thing or not. I wish i was a stronger person to just shrug everything off and say 'who cares?' I feel like ive been whittled down to a nervous mess, i've lost all confidence as well, and i don't like being a drama queen telling people about this, so my partner bears the brunt of it all, and i know deep down he's sick of it too.
and i was willing to pay because i knew our son would be waiting forever if i was to wait for him to come up with the money. In 4 months, he hasn't even coughed up $50 or anything to me, and i know i will never see the money. The kids must of said something to him that weekend, like, aare you going to help mum? But he twisted and turned everything around (like he always does) and told them that i am so lucky he pays me child support every week because alot of men don't, and because he pays for that, he is not obligated to pay anything more. He even told the kids he's so poor, he can barely buy food for them when they stay. This has made our kids feel soooo sorry for him, they tell me off for not seeing how poor and desolate their father is and i should leave him alone! Go figure.
3. I also got a breakthrough this morning, i rang child support and told them the whole situation, and they said yes, i can pursue the extra costs! Its called a 'change of assessment' and they will calculate a new child support amount for him to pay the money back. Its not 100% guaranteed, but i can try.
My only problem is, even though i know i'm going down the right avenues to do this, and i have every right to pursue this, i'm scared it will back fire on me. I know he will tell the kids i 'dobbed' him into child support, and now he is even poorer because of me, and they will give me an even harder time about this.
I feel so stressed, because it seems each way i turn, it always backfires on me, whether i've said/done the right thing or not. I wish i was a stronger person to just shrug everything off and say 'who cares?' I feel like ive been whittled down to a nervous mess, i've lost all confidence as well, and i don't like being a drama queen telling people about this, so my partner bears the brunt of it all, and i know deep down he's sick of it too.
Thanks for all your input ladies, but just to clarify a few things............1. No, i do not want my kids to go and live with their father, that would kill me, but when they are back chatting and telling me it is so 'crap' living here with me, then yes, toying with the idea of them going to him and let him taking over ALL responsibilities does sound very appealing. In reality though, no way!!
2. I do not discuss the financial side of things with the kids, but they know i have footed the braces bill, because when their father came to pick them up and i told him when the braces were getting put on, he said to me in front of them 'oh, how much will that cost?' When i said $2600 he said to me 'sorry i have no money, can you cover my half and I will pay you back when i can?' I said thats fine, our son really needed this
2. I do not discuss the financial side of things with the kids, but they know i have footed the braces bill, because when their father came to pick them up and i told him when the braces were getting put on, he said to me in front of them 'oh, how much will that cost?' When i said $2600 he said to me 'sorry i have no money, can you cover my half and I will pay you back when i can?' I said thats fine, our son really needed this
COMMUNITY LEADER
Well, those are good points Londres. I think I'd be horribly disappointed in my ex if he didn't help pay for these things. And we have conversations at our house about what we can't do because of X bill. Helps my kids understand choices we have to make as adults to afford what we do for them. Why can't we go to Florida like so and so? because your braces cost 5,000. We couldn't afford both.
But we don't have the issue of resentment that someone else isn't paying their fair share. So, it would be that part of it that is for the poster to contemplate (or any of it, it was just some thoughts) how that would impact things. In general, kids want to know both parents and respect them both. It's good that he has a relationship with them but he's not really being a parent in my opinion, as rockrose says, they have basically a playmate and a mom.
I also was reading the poster as saying that the dad gives 140 a week and that's it. Nothing more and a history that would make her believe that will be the from now on contribution as well. But only she and he knows the full story on that. And yes, maybe he'll come around with future bills. Hope so!!
Anyway, I hope it works out for the boys and the poster. Financial stress and pressure is very difficult and I'm sure that as she is flipping most of the bills for the two boys, it adds stress to her current marriage and with her current partner.
I feel really bad for the poster. That is a tough spot to be in. I wonder what it would be like if they were under the same roof. How he would feel about his children's needs. I would give the shirt off my back for my kids.
anyway, luck to the poster.
But we don't have the issue of resentment that someone else isn't paying their fair share. So, it would be that part of it that is for the poster to contemplate (or any of it, it was just some thoughts) how that would impact things. In general, kids want to know both parents and respect them both. It's good that he has a relationship with them but he's not really being a parent in my opinion, as rockrose says, they have basically a playmate and a mom.
I also was reading the poster as saying that the dad gives 140 a week and that's it. Nothing more and a history that would make her believe that will be the from now on contribution as well. But only she and he knows the full story on that. And yes, maybe he'll come around with future bills. Hope so!!
Anyway, I hope it works out for the boys and the poster. Financial stress and pressure is very difficult and I'm sure that as she is flipping most of the bills for the two boys, it adds stress to her current marriage and with her current partner.
I feel really bad for the poster. That is a tough spot to be in. I wonder what it would be like if they were under the same roof. How he would feel about his children's needs. I would give the shirt off my back for my kids.
anyway, luck to the poster.
Agree with Chima, however, the OP stated these extra costs were at the discretion of the parents. You would think he would want to pay his part, but.................it is what it is.
The OP didn't say he didn't pay for nothing and isn't paying for nothing; he is not paying this particular medical bill. No one can speculate what he will pay for next school year as next school year isn't here yet.
I don't see anything wrong with showing the children the facts of life as far as showing them the living expenses and bills, however, I don't think you should be telling the children they can't have this and that because of "daddy." I don't think "daddy" should be painted black. If you do that then you just might be creating more problems and straining the situation further. This is totally counterproductive. Nothing good will come from this but more confusion and drama. Then the children will be grilling the dad about what mom said and then dad takes his jabs and then they come home telling mom what dad said about the money situation, etc. At that point everything is blurred.
They are 11 and 14......children who can't 100% understand the situation as an adult can.......can't fully grasp this convoluted situation, so don't expect them to.
RR made some great points.
You do what you do for your children not because they are always going to be grateful and show you praise, but because you are a mother.
It's obvious the bio father is only going to offer a limited source of financial support, so you will have to come up with plan B.
With this new baby, new partner and all this drama with the children and the ex no wonder you feel like you are going insane.
The OP didn't say he didn't pay for nothing and isn't paying for nothing; he is not paying this particular medical bill. No one can speculate what he will pay for next school year as next school year isn't here yet.
I don't see anything wrong with showing the children the facts of life as far as showing them the living expenses and bills, however, I don't think you should be telling the children they can't have this and that because of "daddy." I don't think "daddy" should be painted black. If you do that then you just might be creating more problems and straining the situation further. This is totally counterproductive. Nothing good will come from this but more confusion and drama. Then the children will be grilling the dad about what mom said and then dad takes his jabs and then they come home telling mom what dad said about the money situation, etc. At that point everything is blurred.
They are 11 and 14......children who can't 100% understand the situation as an adult can.......can't fully grasp this convoluted situation, so don't expect them to.
RR made some great points.
You do what you do for your children not because they are always going to be grateful and show you praise, but because you are a mother.
It's obvious the bio father is only going to offer a limited source of financial support, so you will have to come up with plan B.
With this new baby, new partner and all this drama with the children and the ex no wonder you feel like you are going insane.
COMMUNITY LEADER
Hm, I must have missed something. I missed that you are contemplating your kids going to live with dad. That would be out of my area of acceptability. That would, in a word, 'kill' me. Why? Because I'm a loving parent. As you have been. So, I'm guessing this is just talk and trying to figure out a way to FINALLY have him actually be a financially responsible parent.
I'd rather show my teens the bill for the braces. Show them the bill for school. Talk about how much these things cost and that you, MOM, pays it all on your own. And that means that you will have to give up other things in your home. If dad would help, then you wouldn't. Then they don't sign up for extracurricular activities that cost more money, they don't get the shoes they want, etc. and they can thank their dad for that. And then perhaps they will help you out by seeing the unfairness of this and talking to dad about it and your husband can no longer give off the façade as a great dad. He's not. He doesn't help out financially or for their needs. So, while I wouldn't interfere with their relationship, I'd let them know by showing them (they're old enough) that dad doesn't help and since he doesn't, we can't do X. No vacations, no extras because dad doesn't do his part and all money goes to expenses when it could be different if dad paid his share of what it actually costs to have two kids.
good luck
I'd rather show my teens the bill for the braces. Show them the bill for school. Talk about how much these things cost and that you, MOM, pays it all on your own. And that means that you will have to give up other things in your home. If dad would help, then you wouldn't. Then they don't sign up for extracurricular activities that cost more money, they don't get the shoes they want, etc. and they can thank their dad for that. And then perhaps they will help you out by seeing the unfairness of this and talking to dad about it and your husband can no longer give off the façade as a great dad. He's not. He doesn't help out financially or for their needs. So, while I wouldn't interfere with their relationship, I'd let them know by showing them (they're old enough) that dad doesn't help and since he doesn't, we can't do X. No vacations, no extras because dad doesn't do his part and all money goes to expenses when it could be different if dad paid his share of what it actually costs to have two kids.
good luck
I'm a real negative nancy here, because I don't think your kids will ever understand - ever even if they die of old age - that daddy is a great play mate but that he's chosen not to support them financially.
I'm in my 50's and I've seen friends my age who still don't see their parents in clear focus - they love their dads who abandoned them as children and forced their mothers to go on welfare and live in poverty and want. And then later in life the dad's return as a very respected and beloved grandpa and all is forgiven and the mother who sacrificed so much is not given the credit due.
On the other hand, I will say you are pretty quick to want your kids to go live with dad to give you some relief from their childishness, and if my kids had gone away to live somewhere else you'd have to scrape me off the floor with a spatula. Do you really not care if your two older kids move away from your house? I'm not trying to be hateful, just very surprised at your priorities, and wonder if your two older kids feel a little homeless as a result of your aggravation with them and setting up a new nuclear family that they are sort of a part of but not fully.
I'm in my 50's and I've seen friends my age who still don't see their parents in clear focus - they love their dads who abandoned them as children and forced their mothers to go on welfare and live in poverty and want. And then later in life the dad's return as a very respected and beloved grandpa and all is forgiven and the mother who sacrificed so much is not given the credit due.
On the other hand, I will say you are pretty quick to want your kids to go live with dad to give you some relief from their childishness, and if my kids had gone away to live somewhere else you'd have to scrape me off the floor with a spatula. Do you really not care if your two older kids move away from your house? I'm not trying to be hateful, just very surprised at your priorities, and wonder if your two older kids feel a little homeless as a result of your aggravation with them and setting up a new nuclear family that they are sort of a part of but not fully.
Are you saying that they don't do child support agreements in Australia? I find that very hard to believe. It's not like a third world country with no court system in place. They must do all of the standard stuff like divorce decrees, child custody and child support agreements. Did you not have court ordered child custody hearings to determine custody arrangements? I think you need to push for equal 50/50 split of child care expenses. I would not just roll over and let the ex get away with not paying for his kids. What kind of man doesn't take care of his kids? He's clearly a selfish piece of trash and at least you're not married to him anymore. But you need to fight this because they are just as much his kids as they are yours. It's not just your responsibility. Stop letting him get away with this.
COMMUNITY LEADER
You are beyond justified and he is a taker. he's taking advantage of you. He is not caring for or providing for his children. 140 a week is NOTHING. That's barely a grocery bill for two growing boys. I would not pretend he is some super dad. What would he do if you two were together still? What would he do if you didn't have income to do what is necessary for your children? Thanks to YOU they have what they need. I would let him know that this is the case and you will not pretend. You'd like him to FIND the money as you did. And I would keep track of every penny extra you spend. Yes, absolutely he should split the bills and I find myself really angry that he will not.
I'd just tell him that your kids are lucky to have YOU because you are basically financially totally responsible for them. And some day they WILL realize this.
Sorry about the situation but you sound like a good mom on track with your boys. peace
I'd just tell him that your kids are lucky to have YOU because you are basically financially totally responsible for them. And some day they WILL realize this.
Sorry about the situation but you sound like a good mom on track with your boys. peace
"I am actually ok with that, but what I don't like is the way the kids treat me and their behaviour when I tell them they're not being respectful to me. Just tonight, my 14 yr old daughter told me that I should be happy dad pays child support every week because he feels sorry for me!!!' Wtf????!! Child support is NOT a moral obligation it's the law!!!"............Are you having discussions with the children about this child support business? If so, WHY? This should only be discussed between you and your ex. If their bio father doesn't have the money why can't your second husband help you out? Or has he done that already? They are his stepchildren.
Well............unfortunately, it sounds like you are going to have to eat the costs if this is at the "discretion" of the parents.
It's good they don't see all the games and nonsense and they shouldn't be involved in the adult matters either meaning you shouldn't be discussing with them anything about the child support and what you get and don't get from him.
Are you working? Is your second husband working? You both need to come up with a revised financial plan on how to tackle this because it sounds like this ex-husband can't be depended upon to help any more then giving you that SMALL amount of child support that you are already getting.
I can understand you are upset and yes.....it is understandable you would be miffed that their father isn't really helping you out a lot financially with the children, but it is what it is............difficulties and all. Can't make someone act responsible or do the right thing.
The disrespect issue............well, that's a whole other ball of wax. It's pretty much standand and typical for children that age unfortunately in these times. Sounds like you and your ex have two different parenting styles and the children will almost always choose the more lax parent as their favorite. Just stand your ground, punish and don't be their friend. I am sure they don't like it, but hey you are the parent and you are the one in control.
Well............unfortunately, it sounds like you are going to have to eat the costs if this is at the "discretion" of the parents.
It's good they don't see all the games and nonsense and they shouldn't be involved in the adult matters either meaning you shouldn't be discussing with them anything about the child support and what you get and don't get from him.
Are you working? Is your second husband working? You both need to come up with a revised financial plan on how to tackle this because it sounds like this ex-husband can't be depended upon to help any more then giving you that SMALL amount of child support that you are already getting.
I can understand you are upset and yes.....it is understandable you would be miffed that their father isn't really helping you out a lot financially with the children, but it is what it is............difficulties and all. Can't make someone act responsible or do the right thing.
The disrespect issue............well, that's a whole other ball of wax. It's pretty much standand and typical for children that age unfortunately in these times. Sounds like you and your ex have two different parenting styles and the children will almost always choose the more lax parent as their favorite. Just stand your ground, punish and don't be their friend. I am sure they don't like it, but hey you are the parent and you are the one in control.
The thing is, there's no court settlement about this, child support is calculated on the yearly income of the father, so child support agency says he is to pay $140 a wk based on a yearly income of $58000. If I were to take him to court it would cost me thousands, money I just don't have. I mean, I guess I could look into it more and see if I could get some reimbursement for the braces, but I really don't know. Just wanted to know if I was justified in feeling the wAy I do about this , that's all.
You're not wrong. They are his kids too so he is just as much responsible for their living expenses as you are. It's there not specific language in your child custody agreement which spells out how living expenses such as braces and school fees are to be paid? If not then you need to go find a lawyer and go back to court to raise the child support. 70 per week for teenagers is laughable. Sounds like your ex got off way too easy having to pay so little. You need to take him back to court. I'm sure you've kept records of the expenses related to the kids, you can easily price to the court that their expenses per month far exceed the paltry amount your ex has been paying. Instead of getting upset about it take some action and bring him back to court. He owes them because he's half the reason why they are even here in the first place!
@londres I live in Australia, and as long as the father pays his maintenance every week, that's all that matters. Extra costs such as medical and dental are at the parents discretion. And there are no grants or scholarships for attending a public school, at the end of the day it all boils down to what thw other parent wants to do morally, help out with your kids, or see them miss out. The really sad thing is, the kids just don't see the games he's playing, he tells me he has no money to help with the extras for the kids, and yet him and his new girlfriend are buying weber bbqs, Ugg boots, and anything else they can brag about on Facebook, and yet the kids don't see what he's denying them. I am actually ok with that, but what I don't like is the way the kids treat me and their behaviour when I tell them they're not being respectful to me. Just tonight, my 14 yr old daughter told me that I should be happy dad pays child support every week because he feels sorry for me!!!' Wtf????!! Child support is NOT a moral obligation it's the law!!!'
As their father, he should be willing to at least pay for half of these expenses and you aren't wrong for wanting this so long as these things are necessities.
Unless this was specifically agreed on in court you are pretty much at his mercy. You need to get these things in writing; documented.
You can either take this to court OR incur the costs.
Is there any way you can receive additional government help? Can you apply for study grants/scholarships?
BTW: A legal document has more power than verbal agreements especially in these situations.
Unless this was specifically agreed on in court you are pretty much at his mercy. You need to get these things in writing; documented.
You can either take this to court OR incur the costs.
Is there any way you can receive additional government help? Can you apply for study grants/scholarships?
BTW: A legal document has more power than verbal agreements especially in these situations.
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