Schizo Subtypes

ILADVOCATE you got me wondering, when they diagnose schizoaffective disorder do they also designate a subtype of the schizophrenia portion of it like paranoid, disorganized, etc. while giving the schizoaffective disorder it's subtype on top of that and using it as a moniker for the surface?  Was wondering because I got to thinking and I know John Forbes Nash was diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia and major depression which I also know thanks to your expanse of knowledge is schizoaffective disorder and also wondered because of how schizoaffective disorder is defined as schizophrenia and a mood disorder at the same time.

[ILADVOCATE]

No schizophrenia is a seperate diagnosis. I was originally diagnosed with that but they rediagnosed me with schizoaffective disorder. Schizoaffective disorder has two seperate types, either bipolar or depressive. It is seperate from schizophrenia and it has a higher recovery rate and in current thinking may be thought to be a severe form of bipolar. Diagnostic criteria from the past may no longer exist. My natural father was diagnosed with "borderline schizophrenia" which now no longer exists as a criteria. Judging from what my mother told me of his mood variances he probably had schizoaffective. From what I learned the spectrum ranges from bipolar to bipolar with psychotic features to schizoaffective disorder in severity and intensity.

[paranoid_cataclysm]

Yeah speaking of past criteria, DOCTOROFMIND mentioned how schizoaffective needs updated because the "affective" was an old terminology for I think he said mood disorders if I remember right and now it's only used for that.  Makes me wonder what they would come to when trying to sort out the scale if they took my case into account because I started out with everything in the mental illness I have today in some form or another but with no mood disorder at all although I was still emotionally numb then but I read PTSD can do that to you which it seems like my entire earlier half of my life comes back in that to haunt me and then when I turned 15 is when I started feeling more and more depressed as the years passed.  When I think about it just now actually, the depression started when every single f*cked up thing that happened to me in the past came back vividly and hit me all at once that day and it made me realize how f*cked up things really had been because as a kid I was somewhat oblivious to the big picture of it all and more lived in the moment trying to scrape by through every horrid day.

[paranoid_cataclysm]

It's like people say I just have to think happy and positive or something to feel happy but I tell them well I don't think it's possible to do that if you don't have any happy memories where you learned to be happy.

[ILADVOCATE]

I always said the opposite to myself before my current recovery and my psychiatrist didn't disagree "there is no such thing as a bad thought". Psychotic thoughts are always hateful and unpleasent by definition. I always informed my psychiatrist about them and still keep him up to date. Recovered of course doesn't mean cured. Action is another thing of course and I knew to gradually not avoid things because of phobias as well but it takes treatment to change how a person thinks if its part of the thought disorders that are schizophrenia. People did, usually in stores say to me "don't worry, be happy" but during episodes of depression or mixed states it literally wasn't possible. If I was manic they assumed I was friendly and easy going but it was an unnerving experience where I was out of control. People tend to simplify experiences they themselves have not lived through.

[paranoid_cataclysm]

Yes!  People do tend to simplify them that's like the best thing I've heard all day because you just made my day actually portraying the idea for me in words to say I couldn't come up with.  I remember this one guy who I'd be better friends with if he wasn't so busy had a don't worry be happy musical button thing and I instantly hated it and then he came out from his store when we first met and was like man you look like you need a hug and was moving in to give me one and it was weird and I of course backed off but made me lol and his personality intrigued me with him being this friendly and charismatic towards total strangers so I got to know him better.  I read before how people with mania at first seem fun to be around and such.  I sort of have an effect like mania on people because I can get hyper sometimes but that kinda runs in the family and I apparently have a lot of charisma but of course I don't truly understand what it's like to be manic having never been it.  It just ends up being harmless fun when paired with someone else who likes to BS anyway since I obviously don't have the spending sprees and stuff like that.

[paranoid_cataclysm]

Uh actually I'm going to ask my psychiatrist next time I see him if he's one of them who doesn't even believe in schizoaffective disorder as I just read some psychiatrists and researchers don't even believe in it and I read something about how they want to get rid of the Kraepelinian dichotomy which I don't find any information as to why but I guess it would be a step towards the making of the bipolar/schizaffective/schizophrenia scale.  NAMI's website says most people agree schizoaffective is a form of schizophrenia which I guess.  I'm honestly all for the combining of the three as a scale because I believe it's all the same thing but in different presentations.  I was telling my mom about all the specific schizophrenia diagnoses like schizophreniform and she was like jesus christ.

[paranoid_cataclysm]

I'm going to also ask him if he only considers it schizophrenia if the person started out with only that for years but then went on and developed mood disorder later in life due to their life being horrible and it finally getting to them or if he would change their diagnosis to schizoaffective disorder.

[paranoid_cataclysm]

Damn it I hate how I keep thinking or more only after I hit post.  Finally, I wish psychiatrists would all agree on the same things of this matter... it would make me feel more like the disorders are a bit more definite even though I know they're subject to change or even disappear in the future.

[ILADVOCATE]

Psychiatrists have certain guidelines to treat a person but some are more oriented towards medication. Some towards talk therapy. And many other differences. Specific uses of medications and dosage guidelines are determined by the FDA. As for future understanding of what specific classifications are that will continue as in any other branch of medicine. The DSM-5 is being written now. One criteria under study for example is "schizo-obsessive disorder" that being schizophrenia with obsessive compulsive disorder as an aspect. There is research not just into new treatment modalities but new ways of approaching and understanding specific psychiatric disabilities as a whole.

[paranoid_cataclysm]

Interesting.  I wonder what it'll be called if the person has OCD and also mood disorder with the schizophrenia.