Aa
adrenal-florinef treatment
Hey you guys,
My endo was going to put me on prednisone yesterday but I suggested the florinef instead. He was very apprehensive but said he was at a loss as to what else to do. He gave me the 0.1 mg dose and I took it and 12.5 ug of levoxyl. I can give it a tentative thumbs up. We'll give it a few days and see how it goes.
Another interesting site I found is a yahoo group called adrenal recovery. They are mostly people with CFS or who are having problems discontinuing glucocorticoid therapy, however I threw up a post sort of outlining what we have been going through (sorry for any errors) and I had a couple of people pop up and say that they couldn't tolerate thyroid meds without a low level hydrocortisone dose.
I am confused about what is going on here. If this is such a rare thing-none of my endos recognize it-then why do I keep finding people on the web who are having problems with it. Are the docs who see it just ignoring it? How many people leave the drs and are like Juanita, suffering through hell till thier own system kicks in. I am alomst lucky as I get to go to the ER, otherwise I am afraid they would tell me just to "keep taking the meds" and "that I'll get used to it" when there in a seriuos problem underlying the whole ordeal. That was the approach of the first endo I went to. She could have killed me given the severity of the symptoms I was showing.
Just ignore the problem till it goes away?
I actually got a littlewebpage but it isn't set up yet. We only have a mac at home and the yahoo site builder works on PCs.
I'll keep you guys updated
My endo was going to put me on prednisone yesterday but I suggested the florinef instead. He was very apprehensive but said he was at a loss as to what else to do. He gave me the 0.1 mg dose and I took it and 12.5 ug of levoxyl. I can give it a tentative thumbs up. We'll give it a few days and see how it goes.
Another interesting site I found is a yahoo group called adrenal recovery. They are mostly people with CFS or who are having problems discontinuing glucocorticoid therapy, however I threw up a post sort of outlining what we have been going through (sorry for any errors) and I had a couple of people pop up and say that they couldn't tolerate thyroid meds without a low level hydrocortisone dose.
I am confused about what is going on here. If this is such a rare thing-none of my endos recognize it-then why do I keep finding people on the web who are having problems with it. Are the docs who see it just ignoring it? How many people leave the drs and are like Juanita, suffering through hell till thier own system kicks in. I am alomst lucky as I get to go to the ER, otherwise I am afraid they would tell me just to "keep taking the meds" and "that I'll get used to it" when there in a seriuos problem underlying the whole ordeal. That was the approach of the first endo I went to. She could have killed me given the severity of the symptoms I was showing.
Just ignore the problem till it goes away?
I actually got a littlewebpage but it isn't set up yet. We only have a mac at home and the yahoo site builder works on PCs.
I'll keep you guys updated
see above comment
tina, there is a book called feeling fat fuzzy and frazzled. it answers your main question about why there are so many of us and the doctors don't know what to do. the author dr shames is awesome and explaining why. he also has many labs he recommends and tests recommended for doing home testing and he will help you through the process through consulting over the phone. i am telling everyone on here about it. it is an awesome groundbreaking book. he talks about the hormone imbalance being an epidemic. i never had any clue there were so many people going through what i am going through and we are all listening to the doctors. it took me getting really sick and home a few days to start doing research on my own. i also found an awesome doc that is known for helping w/thyroid issues. i stumbled on this website today and am thrilled to death to see i am not alone and crazy.
Now on 2 1/2mg Cortef 4x a day
To all of you in here;
On top of thyroid meds throwing me into shock, I was on NasacortAQ for months with allergies from hypoT. In july 27 I stopped the NasacortAQ and have been deathly ill ever since and didn't know about steroids and had no problem in the past with Nasacort.. I figured this all out last nite and started using my Nasacort last wednesday and started getting better to the point I was no longer depressed and my joints stopped hurting so much. Very shocking. Writs, knees, shoulder blades, ankles, neck...much better in 3 days on Nasacort nasal spray. Nasacort is 8xs more potent than prednisone so I have read..There is 55mcg in 1 spray at 8 sprays a day. There is allot all about adrenal insufficienly in the warnings about stopping abruptly and not to stop especially if you have a prexisting medical condition.
In less than 15 minutes I had Cortef, a referral to a Internist MD, a B12 shot and was out the door. This FNP knew exactly what I was talking about, and said this is related to interferon tx since my thyroid went south from it. I have been sick since I started Armour due to lack of adrenal normal functions looks like I am getting some where at last. Thank you all for your continued efforts to keep me learning and going. What I need to know is how to take this cortef an does it interfere with thyroid meds or what. Do you think my dose is too much? Knowing the circumstances.
Thats a good idea i was thinking of a naturalpath dr. as well. Monday I see primary care and going to insist they refer me to a endo. How are you doing on the florinif? I hope ok. If you dont take it your a mess and all this stuff of tapering off is scary as well. We do what we have to do and it will all work out in the end. Juanita
Hey Juanita,
I am so sorry they are ignoring you. Evry ER doc I saw told me to up my dose of synthroid. Well except for the one who said I was having a panic attack and wanted to sedate me. I would explain that the synthroid was the cause and taking more was going to make me worse but they can't open up and listen as it is so outside the norm. Even the first endo just said to keep taking the synthroid. Even though she initially diagnosed me clinically as adrenal insufficient. Just her pile of diagnosis sheets tells a contridictory story.
I hate to suggest this but... Are thier any natreopathic style drs in your area? You would need to see one that is an MD so they could prescribe. You will also have to pay out of pocket for the visit. However they make all thier money from listening to you so are much more likely to work with you. You need interventions of conventional medicine but may have to step outside of it to get the help you need. If they are also willing to consider some sort of adrenal fatigue diagnosis then they will be more willing to help.
The online guys like Dr.Lowe seem okay at first but the problem is that you pay a huge chunk of money out of pocket and then you still have to find a dr in your area who will work with that guy. They also want you to buy special books and supplements and follow special diets. I need facts and specifics myself.
The last suggestion will reserve me several years of torment in hell according to most drs however it might be a possibility for you as you live in CA. My mom bought prednisone over the counter in a small town in mexico right over the TX border. The pharmacies are pretty open like that there. If you know the dosage and the correct name for the med you need they will sell it to you. It is unfortunate to have to resort to that but when you know the problem and know what you need and drs can't recoginize it .... At the very least the florinef keeps you kicking.
That is a very last resort however as Ar's story shows how sometimes the glucocorticoid withdraw can be disasterious. That is the reason you need to take these meds under the care of a dr. In thory they know what the risks and side effects are, and the best way to wean from the meds. That said please emphasize the In theory part.
It took me three visists and an ER trip to convince my new endo what was going on. However he is very young and may have only been practicing a month at the most so hasn't gotton burnt out yet either. I can only hope my case has clicked a switch in his brain and he'll recognize it the next time it walks in the door.
Try the foo foo hippie natreopathic dr first. In northern CA there has to be a ton of those.
I am so sorry they are ignoring you. Evry ER doc I saw told me to up my dose of synthroid. Well except for the one who said I was having a panic attack and wanted to sedate me. I would explain that the synthroid was the cause and taking more was going to make me worse but they can't open up and listen as it is so outside the norm. Even the first endo just said to keep taking the synthroid. Even though she initially diagnosed me clinically as adrenal insufficient. Just her pile of diagnosis sheets tells a contridictory story.
I hate to suggest this but... Are thier any natreopathic style drs in your area? You would need to see one that is an MD so they could prescribe. You will also have to pay out of pocket for the visit. However they make all thier money from listening to you so are much more likely to work with you. You need interventions of conventional medicine but may have to step outside of it to get the help you need. If they are also willing to consider some sort of adrenal fatigue diagnosis then they will be more willing to help.
The online guys like Dr.Lowe seem okay at first but the problem is that you pay a huge chunk of money out of pocket and then you still have to find a dr in your area who will work with that guy. They also want you to buy special books and supplements and follow special diets. I need facts and specifics myself.
The last suggestion will reserve me several years of torment in hell according to most drs however it might be a possibility for you as you live in CA. My mom bought prednisone over the counter in a small town in mexico right over the TX border. The pharmacies are pretty open like that there. If you know the dosage and the correct name for the med you need they will sell it to you. It is unfortunate to have to resort to that but when you know the problem and know what you need and drs can't recoginize it .... At the very least the florinef keeps you kicking.
That is a very last resort however as Ar's story shows how sometimes the glucocorticoid withdraw can be disasterious. That is the reason you need to take these meds under the care of a dr. In thory they know what the risks and side effects are, and the best way to wean from the meds. That said please emphasize the In theory part.
It took me three visists and an ER trip to convince my new endo what was going on. However he is very young and may have only been practicing a month at the most so hasn't gotton burnt out yet either. I can only hope my case has clicked a switch in his brain and he'll recognize it the next time it walks in the door.
Try the foo foo hippie natreopathic dr first. In northern CA there has to be a ton of those.
I saw a MD today and she said the reason I am having these problems is I need to take more thyroid hormones how frighting. I told her that my symptoms of losing salt, eating salt, dizzy, weak, tingling arms, losing water, shaking and my thyroid meds put me in ER twice, so on and so forth. I filed her labs sheet in the garbage, she had no desire to check anything but tsH FT4 and FT3. I see primary care monday and going to request to be refered to a ENDO even if it is 200 miles away since no one can address this problem. I am getting so tired of it all, I feel like quitting my thyroid meds and go to sleep forever as I was getting cose to being in a colma with out them, I could no longer drive a car safely and could barely aim a fork of food in my mouth without spilling it from being so uncordinated from hypo. sick & tired
Juanita
Juanita
Hi, when I read how bad your symptoms were, it makes mine look a lot less serious! I'm sorry you have gone through this but cannot believe symptoms this severe were not taken more seriously by the Docs, ER people etc... It's obvious you are having severe reactions to thyroid med, due to other endocrine imbalances. Dr. Lupo, mentioed human growth hormone levels might need checked. Have you had this? I'm think about this too, didn't know it could be a factor.
Yours does sound like the mineral-corticosteroid regulating hormones giving you the problem and if you have real success with the Floinef, this would seem absolute proof!
Yours does sound like the mineral-corticosteroid regulating hormones giving you the problem and if you have real success with the Floinef, this would seem absolute proof!
Hi Dr. Mark,
I do want to apologize if I come across too harsh. I recognize that most drs really want to help people, however the way the health care system is structured really gets in the way and vastly shortens the amount of time that can be spent with each patient.
I have spent some time lately reading a blog by an internal med dr named db's medical rants. It has given me a lot of perspective on the pressures that the medical community is under and why sometimes the drs respomd the way they do. Google it and it will come right up.
My aldosterone was measured twice.
Once a two days off 75 ug of synthoid, the day after my first ER trip. It was 4 ng/dL at 1:30 pm with a range of 5-25. The range is questionable given the time of day.
The other time was my ACTH stim test at which aldosterone went from 6-29-30 at the 0, 30, and 60 minutes time points. I was off meds for two days at this point after five days at 25 ug then three days at 50 ug with two ER trips. It was at 1:30 in the afternoon as well.
No one ever tested my aldosterone while I was taking the T4. However within 30 minutes of taking it I begin to exhibit all the symptoms of someone with Addison's disease-specifically an aldosterone shortage. Profuse dilute urination, nausea, anorexia, headache, for a day or two, followed my extreme weakness, fatigue, and tremor, salt cravings, then loss of peripheral circulation as my blood volume falls leading to no feeling in my extremities, and on three different days I was delerius and had severe cognitive impairment. I was eating large amounts of salt and had reduced my water intake to try and compensate. My GP would not see me and my endo wouldn't return my calls.
All I can figure is that it is an "induced adrenal insufficiency". My adrenals are fine off the meds but on the meds they are being downregulated somehow.
I am an weird patient anyways as I am tall, skinny, feel okay off thyroid meds but have a TSH of 100-200. However the last three days have been *wonderful*. I am such a T4 junkie. I feel fantastic. The 0.1 mg florinef eliminated all the side effects.
My plan is to take the florinef till I reach near a euthyroid state then titrate off. I guess I'll cross that bridge when I get there!
Again, thank you for offering your time and advice to help the people here. It is a sign of your generosity and a measure of how much your care.
I do want to apologize if I come across too harsh. I recognize that most drs really want to help people, however the way the health care system is structured really gets in the way and vastly shortens the amount of time that can be spent with each patient.
I have spent some time lately reading a blog by an internal med dr named db's medical rants. It has given me a lot of perspective on the pressures that the medical community is under and why sometimes the drs respomd the way they do. Google it and it will come right up.
My aldosterone was measured twice.
Once a two days off 75 ug of synthoid, the day after my first ER trip. It was 4 ng/dL at 1:30 pm with a range of 5-25. The range is questionable given the time of day.
The other time was my ACTH stim test at which aldosterone went from 6-29-30 at the 0, 30, and 60 minutes time points. I was off meds for two days at this point after five days at 25 ug then three days at 50 ug with two ER trips. It was at 1:30 in the afternoon as well.
No one ever tested my aldosterone while I was taking the T4. However within 30 minutes of taking it I begin to exhibit all the symptoms of someone with Addison's disease-specifically an aldosterone shortage. Profuse dilute urination, nausea, anorexia, headache, for a day or two, followed my extreme weakness, fatigue, and tremor, salt cravings, then loss of peripheral circulation as my blood volume falls leading to no feeling in my extremities, and on three different days I was delerius and had severe cognitive impairment. I was eating large amounts of salt and had reduced my water intake to try and compensate. My GP would not see me and my endo wouldn't return my calls.
All I can figure is that it is an "induced adrenal insufficiency". My adrenals are fine off the meds but on the meds they are being downregulated somehow.
I am an weird patient anyways as I am tall, skinny, feel okay off thyroid meds but have a TSH of 100-200. However the last three days have been *wonderful*. I am such a T4 junkie. I feel fantastic. The 0.1 mg florinef eliminated all the side effects.
My plan is to take the florinef till I reach near a euthyroid state then titrate off. I guess I'll cross that bridge when I get there!
Again, thank you for offering your time and advice to help the people here. It is a sign of your generosity and a measure of how much your care.
MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL
I apreciate your reply - very informative. We do have a lot to learn and the practice of medicine in the current environment makes it difficult to think outside of medical evidence (ie, it's a liability in the current sue-happy US culture). That being said, it's an imperfect practice - not something that most docs admit.
Mineralacorticoid (aldosterone) deficiency exists - but it is not common -- should be suspected in cases of elevated potassium, malaise, dizziness, etc. Usually it's not isolated - but there are exceptions - what was your aldo level? Glad the florinef is helping.
Mineralacorticoid (aldosterone) deficiency exists - but it is not common -- should be suspected in cases of elevated potassium, malaise, dizziness, etc. Usually it's not isolated - but there are exceptions - what was your aldo level? Glad the florinef is helping.
Tina Thats Great you summed it all up to a pea. I think the reason there is nothing called subclinial adrenal fatigue is just another way for this sorry *** Medical Establishment to continue to keep people sick for the $$$$$$ they get to keep people sick. Thats why it is not in text books getting us well would take money out of their pocket. Look how much $$$ has been made in the last month at ER and endless dr. visits with people like us for a problem that is easy to figure out and we did'nt need no Dr. to figure it out. LOL Cures cost like interferon tx cured me of hep c it sells for 250.00 a shot, standard tx is 48 weeks at 1 shot per week. I joined a clinical trial Schering drug company spent well over 12,000.00 $$ on me. Now look how their making $$$ right and left with HCV patients insurance companies. Roche has a interferon as well the new interferons hit the open market in 2001 in the U.S. Comparied to the old interferons at 3xs a week that didnt work as well. Big Buckes for dr.s and Drug companies so if their going to really cure you there is going to be a big chunk of change in it for them. So glad your cure is working. isnt it just amazing. Juanita
Keeping the population sick is profitable. Juanita
Keeping the population sick is profitable. Juanita
Hi Dr. Mark,
I want to thank you for taking time to help the people who come here looking for help. Being a patient in today's HMOed medical enviornment can be difficult and your contribution is a blessing.
Your post reminded me of a paper I had to present in a biochem class. Since the early 40's it has been neuroscience dogma that all the protein synthesis in a neuron takes place in the cell body and then the proteins are transported down the axons and dendrites to the synapses and terminals of the cell. The trasnport takes minutes to days and had been observed by several techniques and was absolute. The ends of a nerve cell make no protein whatsoever.
So about a year ago these cell microscopists do a bit of genetics and see the axon making its own protein. They use seven or eight different methods to show without a doubt that the axons and dendrites of brain cells can make thier own protein. Dogma was disproven. I guess they presented the paper at the neuroscience meeting and had to deal with really angry upset people. How could this be that what had been accepted as absolute could be questioned..yet it was true. Very quickly a large number of researchers confirmed the results and doublechecked that all the sequences they had been working with were still valid. It totally changed the way a whole group of scientists thought about the model they had been studying.
Now the sad part was that in retrospect the evidence was there all along but it was ignored or written off as abnormal, sloppy science.
I do not suffer from "adrenal fatigue" I suffer from adrenal insufficiency. I will not survive if I take T4 and do not supplement with florinef so by definition that it adrenal insufficiency. I have been to the ER 6 times in a month and been doing everything Addison's disease sufferers do to survive that. I do not have primary adrenal insufficiency. I do not have secondary adrenal insufficiency. I DO have adrenal insufficiency-specifically aldosterone. What this means is that there is a catagory of adrenal insufficiency that is rare enough or misunderstood enough not to have been characterized. Just because it isn't in a med text or paper doesn't mean it isn't real. I do believe that there may exist a more moderate version of this problem that qualifies as adrenal fatigue but that is not my problem.
Refusing to treat someone with symptoms of adrenal insufficiency because you might cause adrenal insufficiency seems well....illogical. They suffer terribly and are turned away as being fine or hypochondriacs. That is cruel. I have spent the last month reading everything I can to understand what is happening to me. Your are right that it is totally unrecognized in any text I have found. However I have found several more basic cell biology/phisiology papers that discuss alternate pathways using dopamine and ANP to downregulate the production of aldosterone. In theory This downregulation could represent an alternate activation/deactivation pathway for steroid hormonal synthesis that is currently not understood. I found another paper discussing upregulation of cortisone by enkalphin possibly, in ICU patients. I found a paper in JAMA that discusses in depth adrenal disfunction in the context of glucocorticoid withdrawal and admits that you can pass an ACTH stimulation tests but still have adrenal insufficiency.
There are holes in the current idea of what adrenal insufficiency is and and how steroidal synthesis is regulated. To ignore those holes and pretend they don't exist just because it isn't written in a textbook seems a very bad idea to me-exceptionally poor science and potentially costing the lives of patients.
Endocrinology seems like an exceptionally complicated field to work in. Human biology is the ultimate complex system with thousands of biological reactions occuring simultaneously. To stop at a test result and ignore the symptoms that are presented is insanity. Yet that is what a number of people I have encountered have been going through. I am a very tough person. I gave birth naturally, drove for three days across country with a kidney infection, worked 60 hours a week at a horse farm while in high school. Worked two jobs while as a single mom while finishing my BS and then got my MS in biophysics. Yet in the last month there were days where I thought I was going to die...nights where I was afraid to go to sleep as I felt so bad that I didn't know if I was going to wake up again. I went to the ER over and over again mentioning it might be an adrenal problem and they treated me like an idiot. Now I am taking florinef and guess what-IT WORKS. I WAS RIGHT. I didn't need an MD. I found my answers myself because the MDs couldn't get past the test results and the textbooks. They would have let me die for thier test results while ignoring my clinical symptoms.
Sorry, umm.... I am usually pretty laid back but this whole ordeal has really pushed me to the edge.
I want to thank you for taking time to help the people who come here looking for help. Being a patient in today's HMOed medical enviornment can be difficult and your contribution is a blessing.
Your post reminded me of a paper I had to present in a biochem class. Since the early 40's it has been neuroscience dogma that all the protein synthesis in a neuron takes place in the cell body and then the proteins are transported down the axons and dendrites to the synapses and terminals of the cell. The trasnport takes minutes to days and had been observed by several techniques and was absolute. The ends of a nerve cell make no protein whatsoever.
So about a year ago these cell microscopists do a bit of genetics and see the axon making its own protein. They use seven or eight different methods to show without a doubt that the axons and dendrites of brain cells can make thier own protein. Dogma was disproven. I guess they presented the paper at the neuroscience meeting and had to deal with really angry upset people. How could this be that what had been accepted as absolute could be questioned..yet it was true. Very quickly a large number of researchers confirmed the results and doublechecked that all the sequences they had been working with were still valid. It totally changed the way a whole group of scientists thought about the model they had been studying.
Now the sad part was that in retrospect the evidence was there all along but it was ignored or written off as abnormal, sloppy science.
I do not suffer from "adrenal fatigue" I suffer from adrenal insufficiency. I will not survive if I take T4 and do not supplement with florinef so by definition that it adrenal insufficiency. I have been to the ER 6 times in a month and been doing everything Addison's disease sufferers do to survive that. I do not have primary adrenal insufficiency. I do not have secondary adrenal insufficiency. I DO have adrenal insufficiency-specifically aldosterone. What this means is that there is a catagory of adrenal insufficiency that is rare enough or misunderstood enough not to have been characterized. Just because it isn't in a med text or paper doesn't mean it isn't real. I do believe that there may exist a more moderate version of this problem that qualifies as adrenal fatigue but that is not my problem.
Refusing to treat someone with symptoms of adrenal insufficiency because you might cause adrenal insufficiency seems well....illogical. They suffer terribly and are turned away as being fine or hypochondriacs. That is cruel. I have spent the last month reading everything I can to understand what is happening to me. Your are right that it is totally unrecognized in any text I have found. However I have found several more basic cell biology/phisiology papers that discuss alternate pathways using dopamine and ANP to downregulate the production of aldosterone. In theory This downregulation could represent an alternate activation/deactivation pathway for steroid hormonal synthesis that is currently not understood. I found another paper discussing upregulation of cortisone by enkalphin possibly, in ICU patients. I found a paper in JAMA that discusses in depth adrenal disfunction in the context of glucocorticoid withdrawal and admits that you can pass an ACTH stimulation tests but still have adrenal insufficiency.
There are holes in the current idea of what adrenal insufficiency is and and how steroidal synthesis is regulated. To ignore those holes and pretend they don't exist just because it isn't written in a textbook seems a very bad idea to me-exceptionally poor science and potentially costing the lives of patients.
Endocrinology seems like an exceptionally complicated field to work in. Human biology is the ultimate complex system with thousands of biological reactions occuring simultaneously. To stop at a test result and ignore the symptoms that are presented is insanity. Yet that is what a number of people I have encountered have been going through. I am a very tough person. I gave birth naturally, drove for three days across country with a kidney infection, worked 60 hours a week at a horse farm while in high school. Worked two jobs while as a single mom while finishing my BS and then got my MS in biophysics. Yet in the last month there were days where I thought I was going to die...nights where I was afraid to go to sleep as I felt so bad that I didn't know if I was going to wake up again. I went to the ER over and over again mentioning it might be an adrenal problem and they treated me like an idiot. Now I am taking florinef and guess what-IT WORKS. I WAS RIGHT. I didn't need an MD. I found my answers myself because the MDs couldn't get past the test results and the textbooks. They would have let me die for thier test results while ignoring my clinical symptoms.
Sorry, umm.... I am usually pretty laid back but this whole ordeal has really pushed me to the edge.
No need to apologize Tina this whole thing would and should push anyone over the edge. I'm not far from the edge myself and have been suffering since Mid June with adrenal fatigue especialy since no one would treat my subclinical hypothyroid for over a year.Refering to the GI that cured me of hep c, interferon did my thyroid in with a TSH of 150. he refered me to the Endo he works with and they told me in 02 I would most likely have a thyroid probem after tx was over and treated me with synthroid back then. Now they all act like I am fine and the Endo said it was lab errors because there is no such thing a normal TSH with barely any FT4. This was at UCD in Sacramento.
What you said is true and we dont need any stinking badges either.
Glad your feeling good and snapy its about time girl. I go tomorrow to see some dr. and will continue the crusade to fight for the right to health. Why settle for a grade D life when we can have a grade A or at least a B.
Cheers Juanita
What you said is true and we dont need any stinking badges either.
Glad your feeling good and snapy its about time girl. I go tomorrow to see some dr. and will continue the crusade to fight for the right to health. Why settle for a grade D life when we can have a grade A or at least a B.
Cheers Juanita
Meling333, I'm glad you posted that info from the Dr. Lowe site, that's yet another confirmation about the interactions between our thyroid meds and cortisol levels, very good!
Thanks
Thanks
What did it say on the hypochondriac'c tombstone?
"Do you believe me now?"
"Do you believe me now?"
Hi, I just wanted to add that I was diagnosed with Hashimoto's last october. I was experiencing, heart palps, chest pain, blurred vision, lightheadedness, brain fog, vision problems, headaches, weight gain, hair loss, dry skin, rash, insomnia,etc.... If this list was not enough, Once I started my synthroid, almost all of these symptoms disapeared but I started to have joint pain and stiffness, almost immediatley, and to this day, it is one of my major complaints, but I too, did not even have the symptom until starting meds for my disorder. So strange. Also, on days when I have forgotten to take my meds, the joint pain almost is totally gone, sure other symptoms appear, like being fatigued, but my joints feel wonderful when I don't take my medicine. My TSH is in normal range, last test 1.3. Weird how so many of us, share the same concerns.
Cat
The reason the aches and pains go away when you dont take your Armour is your cortisol level comes up and the demand for support is gone. I read this in Dr. Lowe site on Adrenal. As a patient was blaming Armour meds for the pain she was having. Dr. Lowe said it was decreased cortisol level causing the aches and pains. Juanita
The reason the aches and pains go away when you dont take your Armour is your cortisol level comes up and the demand for support is gone. I read this in Dr. Lowe site on Adrenal. As a patient was blaming Armour meds for the pain she was having. Dr. Lowe said it was decreased cortisol level causing the aches and pains. Juanita
I didn't have my joint pain or swelling until I had been on Synthroid for a couple of mo.My dr. switched me to Armour Thyroid, but I still have pain and swelling.I didn't take my half pill of Armour last night and didn't have as much pain this morning.I'm not trying to cause trouble. I just want to know what's wrong and why the pain would begin when I started taking hypothroid meds.I am going to ask my dr. to do a RA test though. Thanks for all the info that I'm reading.
Cat
Cat
Hi Tina,
I'm glad you found a Dr that's at least willing to try and admits there might be another way to treat this problem. I guess this problem is not that uncommon but we can only guess, I wish researches would undertake more research on this arena. It'd help us all.
Anyway, good luck with the florinef, let us know how you feel and thanks for the article!
I'm glad you found a Dr that's at least willing to try and admits there might be another way to treat this problem. I guess this problem is not that uncommon but we can only guess, I wish researches would undertake more research on this arena. It'd help us all.
Anyway, good luck with the florinef, let us know how you feel and thanks for the article!
Tina, your having come across SO MANY PEOPLE with same problem of adverse reaction to thyroid med, possibly indicating what is described by the makers of the meds themselves as "untreated adrenal cortical insufficiency", echos the very same question in my mind. Why are there so many, if it is not a common problem???
I don't know if you came onto the forum after my post about the Mary Shomon "Quality of Life Survey" of thyroid patients but let me repeat that info again because is very revealing. In 2003 results were released and nearly 1000 patients submitted the following results; Despite treatment and having TSH ranges between 0.05 to 2.0, these percentages of patients still had the following symptoms; Fatigue/Exhaustion-"91.74%", Joint Pain, Aches, Stiffness-"50.81%", Depression-"45.35%", Mind Fog-"58.26%", WeightGain-"53.02%", Loss of Sex Drive-"57.91%", Difficulty Losing Weight-"64.53%" etc........
The above survey tells me that a large number of thyroid patients on replacement, retain symptoms to varying degrees. It could be that mild adrenal insifficiency or other endocrine embalances, are interacting with thyroid med, causing decreased effect or even aggravating other hormonal imbalances. Regardless, we need the replacement meds, or risk much worse consequences. It is not the Dr's fault or the thyroid med-makers fault, it is just a very complicated problem. You would never believe there are possible problems though, when reading many of the websites about thyroid replacement, they simply state to the effect; "Once on thyroid medication, you will feel better within a few weeks." I just don't believe it is that simple for many people!!
If you go to "www.thyroid.about.com" and type in "Quality of life Survey", in their search bar at top page, you can read that entire survey results. It shows we are not alone!!
I don't know if you came onto the forum after my post about the Mary Shomon "Quality of Life Survey" of thyroid patients but let me repeat that info again because is very revealing. In 2003 results were released and nearly 1000 patients submitted the following results; Despite treatment and having TSH ranges between 0.05 to 2.0, these percentages of patients still had the following symptoms; Fatigue/Exhaustion-"91.74%", Joint Pain, Aches, Stiffness-"50.81%", Depression-"45.35%", Mind Fog-"58.26%", WeightGain-"53.02%", Loss of Sex Drive-"57.91%", Difficulty Losing Weight-"64.53%" etc........
The above survey tells me that a large number of thyroid patients on replacement, retain symptoms to varying degrees. It could be that mild adrenal insifficiency or other endocrine embalances, are interacting with thyroid med, causing decreased effect or even aggravating other hormonal imbalances. Regardless, we need the replacement meds, or risk much worse consequences. It is not the Dr's fault or the thyroid med-makers fault, it is just a very complicated problem. You would never believe there are possible problems though, when reading many of the websites about thyroid replacement, they simply state to the effect; "Once on thyroid medication, you will feel better within a few weeks." I just don't believe it is that simple for many people!!
If you go to "www.thyroid.about.com" and type in "Quality of life Survey", in their search bar at top page, you can read that entire survey results. It shows we are not alone!!
Congrats on getting some help Tina. I am amazed you got some. I dont know it is a more common problem not recoginized at all with quite a few of us suffering. It is unreal. I have had this swelling problem since before i started thyroid meds but the thyroxine sure brought it to life big time. I see a new dr. tomorrow and see what can do. It would be nice if he knows something about this as he dose see a large population of patients in Sacramento unlike the mountains of no. calif.I am still consuming salt to feel normal and keep my knees from hurting. I have no desire to raise my dose again for a while. Do let us know how it goes I bet it helps big time. At lease he gave you the pill but says he knows nothing about this illness, so messed up. We should have studied medicine. It dose not take a rocket scientist to figure this out and now I really do think the majority of dr.s are pretty stupid these days. Juanita
MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL
It's not clear what your question is. Adrenal fatigue is not currently recognized in traditional endocrine, only adrenal insufficiency. The treatment is steroids - if you are truly adrenal insufficient, you cannot live without glucocorticoids (prednisone, hydrocortisone, etc). The florinef is a mineralacorticoid ("salt steroid") that may help in cases of dizziness with standing or in cases of fainting that are not directly related to adrenal. Patients with destruction of the adrenals also need florinef. The reluctance to treat adrenal fatigue is putting a patient on steroids when they do not absolutely need it and in turn risking complications of chronic steroid treatment. This tendency may change, but I don't see anything in western medical literature that makes me think we will anytime soon recognize a "subclinical adrenal" disorder in the same way we do thyroid disorders.
You are reading content posted in the Thyroid Cancer / Nodules & Hyperthyroidism Forum
We tapped the CDC for information on what you need to know about radiation exposure
Endocrinologist Mark Lupo, MD, answers 10 questions about thyroid disorders and how to treat them
A list of national and international resources and hotlines to help connect you to needed health and medical services.
Herpes sores blister, then burst, scab and heal.
Herpes spreads by oral, vaginal and anal sex.
STIs are the most common cause of genital sores.
