Anxiety and the mind

[jk1947]

I had a total  thyroidectomy in 2003 and a rough start as any increase in Synthroid sent me very hyper. My doctor at the time took me off of all meds for a month. I felt horrible, so saw a doctor who was a biochemist and was started on Armour-tsh was 34. It took months of gettibg regulated.
My Mother died in July of this year and it was many months of  caring for her and being by her bedside when she died.  So, I know that stress can play a number on you when you have hypothyroidism but had my lab done in August and tsh was <.01 with the range 0.2-5.1   T4- 1.09  range 0.73-1.95  T3 420 -range 230-420.  He sldo prescribed Metanx as I was low in B12 and folate.  About the last 2 months, I have had on and off anxiety with mind racing thoughts. I am okay at other times but this is what I went through in the beginning 2 years ago. Would my low t4 be causing this or the drug Metanx? Or does it take awhile for the Metanx to bring up the B12? Thanks

[Mark Lupo, M.D.]

Your TSH is too low.  This is the brain's way of saying the Armour dose is too much -- despite the normal T4.  I know this is debatable in the Armour World -- but it is the current thinking among thyroid specialists -- particularly as you are describing anxiety and racing thoughts (likely aggravated by your mom's passing).  The B-12 replacement will take some time as well, but it is less likely the aggravating factor.

[ArmourGal]

just want to comment..racing thoughts and anxiety are also hypothyroid symptoms, not just hyperthyroidism.  Racing thoughts were one of the most bizarre psychiatric hypo symptoms i had...and evenutally progressed to meaningless running words in my mind.  I didn't realize how bizarre it was until that symptom was gone, but later read quite a bit on this particular manifestation of hypo.  Amazing what lack of thyroid hormone can do to your brain.
Cindi

[ArmourGal]

stress can make thyroid hormone levels drop...do you think perhaps the return of your symptoms might be that those August levels have dropped due to your stress over your Mom?  some folks I know dose a bit extra during extreme times of stress and say it helps.
cindi

[jk1947]

Thanks for all the replies.  Yes, it is the frees that were tested. Also someone mentioned adrenals. I have been taking DHEA since starting Armour in Oct 2003. It was prescribed by the Dr. It has finally come up to normal.
As far as taking Armour-I tried Synthroid and went hyper when it was increased from 100 to 112.  I had been doing good on the Armour-no more pains in my feet-sleep good, and hair stopped falling out.  
I have been having these days since about Sept with days of feeling really good.  Also at different times of the day.  I wander about eating chinese food with the soy in it. I didn't think it effected people without thyroids. Or cough medicine with pseudophrene sp? in it. Maybe it does-any thoughts on this? It's just a blah feeling. I hate it!! Thanks

[jk1947]

My Dr. was going to up it and said it was up to me but that I would be taking a chance on becoming hyper.  I was afraid, so decided not to. I think I might call and make an appt. He lives in another state 3 hours away. I'd like to know how people without thyoirds are doing.

[doodlebug1]

I have a TSH much lower than yours, with my free T3 at the top like yours, and I'm not hyper in the least. Not to say that you are NOT on too much Armour--that's what you and your doc will have to figure out--but just to make the point that TSH can sometimes be a lousy way to evaluate one's optimal dose, I have observed in myself and others.

I have felt lousy twice since I got on Armour and found my optimal dose. And both times, it had nothing to do with my supressed TSH and free T3 at the top of the range. Instead, the first feel-bad was due to low Ferritin (which I corrected), and the second was due to my estrogen being high while my progesterone dropped--i.e the beginning of peri-meno. If someone had told me, based simply on my TSH, that I was on too high a dose, it would have been a huge mistake for me to decrease it!

I have also seen folks have anxiety like you, who ended up having sluggish adrenals after high stress. And sluggish adrenals mean there isn't enough production of cortisol to distribute thryoid hormones to the cells. The result is high amounts still in the blood, and symptoms result. There are labs mentioned in the natural thyroid hormones group on yahoo that do the 24 hour adrenal saliva test. I see lots of folks using them.

Also, have you ever had your Ferritin tested (storage iron)? LOTS of hypo folks have low Ferritin, for some reason, and I was one. It helped me to get it more optimal!

[ArmourGal]

soy is a no-no for most hypo folks...but for more info, just search "soy + thyroid or hypothyroidism"...the other chemicals in those foods really bother me a lot too.
cindi

[jkrl]

soy isn't good for anyone. One of the most corrupt GMO foods but also messes around with your hormones. I don't eat any would advise anyone not to.

[doodlebug1]

Hi. I am curious--are the T4 and T3 labs you gave simply T4 and T3, or are they FREE T3 and FREE T4? There is a huge difference. Also, have you ever done a 24 hour saliva adrenal test? With all the stress you've been through, perhaps you now have sluggish adrenals, which I've noticed is quite common with hypo folks.

>had my lab done in August and tsh was <.01 with the range 0.2-5.1 T4- 1.09 range 0.73-1.95 T3 420 -range 230-420.

[jk1947]

Thanks again all for replying,
I called the Dr. today and his nurse said it's no doubt the Chinese food I've been eating alot of lately. It inteferes with the meds. So, no more Chinese.

[jk1947]

My ferritin is over high but am low in iron somewhere else (but forget) where and so I take 15 mgs of pediatric iron.  I also take DHEA since Oct 2003 as mine was at the lowest end of the range.  I'll see how I feel in a few days and hope I get leveled out with the thyroid after eating too much Chinese.

[SandyKK]

I had removal of thyroid when I was 14, a little over 40 years. Went hypo and was on I think a natural drug (think from cow-- maybe proloid?) for maybe 30 years. Went into a hyper state and found out the batch of a new refill of medicine was incorrect. Since then, I have been on Synthroid. I had surgery last spring and I have not been right. Started feeling depressed, blamed it on the surgery. All of sudden in the last few months I became hyper and doc said my count is .175 (should be .35 or higher?). I feel terrible, it is lot a bad nightmare coming back to haunt me after all of these years. I am a professional and I am struggling to keep my mentality. I have weight loss, anxiety, brain fog, sweaty palms, thirsty all the time, sleep problems and headaches etc. Has anyone heard of someone after many years having problems after having their thyroid removed with their meds? Why after all these years would it need adjusting? I have reduced it but after almost two weeks I am still miserable.

[ancientmariner]

I posted to you above, but this post makes me think more strongly that it could be adrenal fatigue. You said that this started after you had surgery - surgery is VERY stressful to your body, and maybe it was enough to deplete your cortisol stores. I've read that when cortisol is low, you can get hyper symptoms, because your body needs cortisol in order to use the thyroid hormones. If your cortisol is low, the thyroid hormone just stays in your bloodstream and gives you hyper symptoms. A couple of really good books that explain the connections between adrenal function and thyroid: "Thyroid, Guardian of Health" - Philip G. Young and "The Great Thyroid Scandal..." - Dr. Barry Durrant-Peatfield

[jk1947]

I had my thyroid removed in 2003 and after what seemed forever, finally got feeling good.  But, just this past month with the death of my Mother and also eating SOY from Chinese food alot, I have gone back feeling like I did 2 years ago. I have sporadic anxiety and depression during the day. I say sporadic because at other times, I feel good. I went to the Dr. Friday, he was a biochemist before becoming an MD and he said soy interferes with the meds. It will take awhile to feel good again I guess but it is so disturbing when you had been feeling like your old self to feel that impending doom again. I know how you feel and sympathize. Let me know how you are doing? I tried synthroid, but couldn't take an increase , so this Dr. only believes in Armour. I'm on 3 grains.

[jk1947]

My tsh is <.01 and that is undetectable. My Dr. said that is what they like to see on the Armour. He also gives me DHEA for the adrenals and natural estrogen. I even now have gotten a prescription for Metanx for B12 and folate. I was very low in everything.  Before, I had my thyroid removed, after every surgery, I would have 3 months of anxiety, and depression because even then my thyorid wasn't working but doctors never caught it.