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Hashimoto's patients, are you TH1 or TH2 dominant?
Hashi patients, do you know if you are TH1 or TH2 dominant? I'm TH2 dominant. Coffee and green tea make my neck swell. I've given up caffeine and I take my Echinacea and Golden Seal each day and the flareups are gone. (Well, except when I eat chocolate). Which are you? Do you know if what you're eating could be causing auto-immune flareups?
Below is a part of the TH1/TH2 transcript taken from a video by Dr. Geronimo. Here's Dr. Geronimo's website:
http://www.powaychiro.com
I don't have enough room to post the entire transcript.To read the full transcript see my journal entry below:
http://www.medhelp.org/user_journals/show/182243/Hashi-patients--Are-you-TH1-or-TH2-dominant
:) Tamra
"An autoimmune condition occurs when one branch of the immune system over dominates another branch. This is called an either a Th1 or Th2 dominance. A dominant TH1 response means that the natural killer cells and cytotoxic t cells are responsible for attacking the body, while a TH2 dominance indicates that your bcells and antibodies are mounting the attack. A blood test is needed to find out which branch is dominant. Thus to treat an autoimmune disease, it is critical to find the dominant branch and to balance the seesaw by stimulating the other branch. For example, if a patient’s autoimmune disease was TH1 dominant, treating it would require that we strengthen the Th2 side to balance out the immune system. If the patient were Th2 dominant, we would stimulate the Th1 side to regain balance. It’s a pretty simple solution, but so many people suffer needlessly because the immune system has been ignored, until now.
This is where clinical nutrition and natural medicine comes into play. It is well documented in clinical research that Th1 stimulants are Echinacea, maitake mushrooms and golden seal to name a few. Th2 stimulators are caffeine, green tea, and grape seed extract. So in the example I gave in the previous slide, if a patient with an under functioning thyroid is TH1 dominant, then I would prescribe supplements containing caffeine, green tea, and grape seed extract to stimulate the TH2 side to regain balance. If they were TH2 dominant, then Echinacea, mushrooms, and golden seal would balance out their immune system. Since most people with autoimmune conditions have no idea which branch of their immune system is dominant, they can actually make their condition worse by taking over the counter immune boosters. Lets say for example you were Th1 dominant and you catch a cold. A friend tells you that Echinacea helped them so you take it yourself. Unknowingly you would be flaring up your already dominant Th1 response and cause even more destruction to your thyroid gland."
Below is a part of the TH1/TH2 transcript taken from a video by Dr. Geronimo. Here's Dr. Geronimo's website:
http://www.powaychiro.com
I don't have enough room to post the entire transcript.To read the full transcript see my journal entry below:
http://www.medhelp.org/user_journals/show/182243/Hashi-patients--Are-you-TH1-or-TH2-dominant
:) Tamra
"An autoimmune condition occurs when one branch of the immune system over dominates another branch. This is called an either a Th1 or Th2 dominance. A dominant TH1 response means that the natural killer cells and cytotoxic t cells are responsible for attacking the body, while a TH2 dominance indicates that your bcells and antibodies are mounting the attack. A blood test is needed to find out which branch is dominant. Thus to treat an autoimmune disease, it is critical to find the dominant branch and to balance the seesaw by stimulating the other branch. For example, if a patient’s autoimmune disease was TH1 dominant, treating it would require that we strengthen the Th2 side to balance out the immune system. If the patient were Th2 dominant, we would stimulate the Th1 side to regain balance. It’s a pretty simple solution, but so many people suffer needlessly because the immune system has been ignored, until now.
This is where clinical nutrition and natural medicine comes into play. It is well documented in clinical research that Th1 stimulants are Echinacea, maitake mushrooms and golden seal to name a few. Th2 stimulators are caffeine, green tea, and grape seed extract. So in the example I gave in the previous slide, if a patient with an under functioning thyroid is TH1 dominant, then I would prescribe supplements containing caffeine, green tea, and grape seed extract to stimulate the TH2 side to regain balance. If they were TH2 dominant, then Echinacea, mushrooms, and golden seal would balance out their immune system. Since most people with autoimmune conditions have no idea which branch of their immune system is dominant, they can actually make their condition worse by taking over the counter immune boosters. Lets say for example you were Th1 dominant and you catch a cold. A friend tells you that Echinacea helped them so you take it yourself. Unknowingly you would be flaring up your already dominant Th1 response and cause even more destruction to your thyroid gland."
My biopsy did state that No psammoma bodies are identified. Hurthle cells with admixed lymphocytes to suggest hashimoto's thyroiditis are not identified. The findings are most consistent with nodular hyperplasia. Clinical follow up is recommended.
Ultra sound: Neck...She has 2 cm soft nodule that appears to be on the superior pole of the right thyroid. It moves when swallowing. There is no vervical or supraclavicular adenopathy.
As of now that is what I have...I am seeing him tomorrow for the mouth thrust, as a work in...but hope to get some questions answered, like why 6 months? Will he order FT3 and FT4. Also could he order labs ongoing for every 6-8 weeks until I see him again...Hopefully this visit will get some questions answered.
Thank you, for caring, and your suggestions.
Ultra sound: Neck...She has 2 cm soft nodule that appears to be on the superior pole of the right thyroid. It moves when swallowing. There is no vervical or supraclavicular adenopathy.
As of now that is what I have...I am seeing him tomorrow for the mouth thrust, as a work in...but hope to get some questions answered, like why 6 months? Will he order FT3 and FT4. Also could he order labs ongoing for every 6-8 weeks until I see him again...Hopefully this visit will get some questions answered.
Thank you, for caring, and your suggestions.
Sharon, I hope you never have to go to that doctor again. Also, please write him a letter so that he doesn't do this to another patient. Starting at 100??? Most patients start at 25. If they are young and relatively healthy, then 50.
Most people with Hashimoto's have nodules. And if the docs are putting you on Synthroid, then you most likely have Hashimoto's, not Graves.
If the nodule is over 2.0 cm, then the surgeon will recommend removal because it is too big to biopsy. If it is under 2.0 cm, then the Synthroid should shrink it if it is benign. Thyroid nodule cancer is slow growing and has a high success rate because it takes forever to spread. Don't worry too much about the nodule. Just find out how many you have and the size of each. You can read it on the radiology report. Get the report printed from your doctor's secretary. It is your right as a patient to have this information as well as your lab results.
Get your TPOab and Tgab tested and post results here on a new thread. Those are the Hashi antibody tests. Also, get your FT3, FT4 and TSH results and post them here. Those are your thyroid levels. FT3 is particularly important as it is the most active level. TSH, a pituitary hormone, not so much, but most doctors will have a fit if you leave that off the test.
:) Tamra
Most people with Hashimoto's have nodules. And if the docs are putting you on Synthroid, then you most likely have Hashimoto's, not Graves.
If the nodule is over 2.0 cm, then the surgeon will recommend removal because it is too big to biopsy. If it is under 2.0 cm, then the Synthroid should shrink it if it is benign. Thyroid nodule cancer is slow growing and has a high success rate because it takes forever to spread. Don't worry too much about the nodule. Just find out how many you have and the size of each. You can read it on the radiology report. Get the report printed from your doctor's secretary. It is your right as a patient to have this information as well as your lab results.
Get your TPOab and Tgab tested and post results here on a new thread. Those are the Hashi antibody tests. Also, get your FT3, FT4 and TSH results and post them here. Those are your thyroid levels. FT3 is particularly important as it is the most active level. TSH, a pituitary hormone, not so much, but most doctors will have a fit if you leave that off the test.
:) Tamra
Actually, my Dr. has not said, I have either graves or hash...but I do have a goiter, and nodule...my previous Dr. started me right away on Levo 100mcg oh my gosh, I was so sick for a good 3+ mo. my psychiatrist ask why in H---did he start you on 100mcg? I said, I don't know, maybe he was trying to kill me...every time I went in with more symptoms I would loose 3# a week...I basically lived on my sofa...couldn't eat...etc...it was awful, the thrush in my mouth was so thick and disgusting tasting...I would brush my teeth and tongue many times a day, only to have it come right back....more than once I felt like I did not want to fight anymore...I was so so miserable....so got a new Dr. and he got me down to 44mcg and called me normal after about 8 weeks, and told me to come back in 6 mo. I so disagree with him, I feel like I need a few more "normal" blood draws, before being released to wait 6 months.....I kept bugging him, until he finally gave me a 30 day sample of Synthroid to try...I told him, I think the Levo. is a big part of my mouth and lips problem...as I taste the Levo in my mouth immediately, and within 20 min..have wretched heartburn...he said to wait 2 weeks, now figure that one out....today was my day to start the synthroid...I could be all wet, or ? but I think I am feeling better, my mouth is feeling like I have a tongue in it, instead of it being all smooth and taste like Levo...even my lips are seeming to feel some better...Maybe I am wrong...but I was so sure that Levo. was part of my problem....certainly not all...but part...now of course, I want to be right, so that I can tell him...it was not all in my head. I'm even feeling all the sores in my mouth, on the roof etc...before I could see them, also the coat on my tongue and inside my mouth, roof of mouth and throat was the color of the Levo. pill. I've very drug sensitive....and I always use a smaller dose than most...
As for the eyes, I think the thyroid played a role, as when on the 100 then 88mcg...I would get these awful headaches starting on the bone behind my ear, and it would go up the side of my head on one side, and concentrate on the back of my eye, and it would switch eyes...for several days...I now have one eye lid that droops down to where my pupil starts...so many weird things....What a blessing it would be, if the Synthroid would work for me...also I did not get the heart burn or taste with it, and I just started it today...I'm hoping...You may be able to relate, I want it to work so much so that I can say...without using the exact words, I was right, see I told you so!!!!
Thank you, for the avoid iodine tip, I'll try that...just in case...also, my eye Dr. told me that I had the kind of nodule that is usually cancer, but that it is slow...Lovely...So much to learn....I also just read that in older patients you start them with low does and work up, not the other way around...I'll quit for now...I'm just blown away by how different my mouth is feeling...in just one day, or a different pill....unbelievable...not totally gone but so much better...And, I have an appointment with him Friday to let him look at my mouth......I'm going anyway if it gets better...I have questions about the length of time before my next blood draw...and do I have graves...etc...so many he did not answer....Sorry, I said, I was going to quit and didn't. Thank you, so much....SK
As for the eyes, I think the thyroid played a role, as when on the 100 then 88mcg...I would get these awful headaches starting on the bone behind my ear, and it would go up the side of my head on one side, and concentrate on the back of my eye, and it would switch eyes...for several days...I now have one eye lid that droops down to where my pupil starts...so many weird things....What a blessing it would be, if the Synthroid would work for me...also I did not get the heart burn or taste with it, and I just started it today...I'm hoping...You may be able to relate, I want it to work so much so that I can say...without using the exact words, I was right, see I told you so!!!!
Thank you, for the avoid iodine tip, I'll try that...just in case...also, my eye Dr. told me that I had the kind of nodule that is usually cancer, but that it is slow...Lovely...So much to learn....I also just read that in older patients you start them with low does and work up, not the other way around...I'll quit for now...I'm just blown away by how different my mouth is feeling...in just one day, or a different pill....unbelievable...not totally gone but so much better...And, I have an appointment with him Friday to let him look at my mouth......I'm going anyway if it gets better...I have questions about the length of time before my next blood draw...and do I have graves...etc...so many he did not answer....Sorry, I said, I was going to quit and didn't. Thank you, so much....SK
People with Graves goiters typically can have eye problems. It can also happen with Hashi goiters as well. Last summer, before diagnosis, it felt like someone had punched me in both eyes. My ears would hurt as well. No fun.
I don't know if your RAI caused this, but sometimes you'd be amazed at how many of our ailments are connected. I'm convinced my issues began in the gut. 80 percent of the body's immunity comes from the gut, and yet we bombard our guts with sugar, starch, dairy, artificial sweeteners, artificial preservatives, etc. No wonder auto-immune cases are on the rise.
People with Hashi should generally avoid iodine as it can cause the immune flare up to become worse. I use sea salt without added iodine. You can find it in the salt section. Since you had Graves, right? I have friends who've had Graves who use iodine with no ill affects. Try to avoid kelp based iodine as there have been a few reported deaths linked to kelp.
This is a learning process. I've had to adjust my way of looking at food, especially what is put into food. It seems anything can be put in food nowadays and the FDA just turns the other cheek. Just do a Google on Bromide, found in Mountain Dew and many breads. Nasty stuff. Look at how many foods marketed toward kids have high fructose corn syrup and artificial flavors.
I'm totally back to basics now and my body is responding. Organic lean chicken baked in olive oil with roasted garlic and natural spices like Rosemary and Thyme with some sea salt. GF brown rice. Organic, natural salad dressings. No soy. No dairy or corn. It takes some getting used to, but it's fun creating new recipes, and luckily, hubby wants to eat healthy as well.
:) Tamra
I don't know if your RAI caused this, but sometimes you'd be amazed at how many of our ailments are connected. I'm convinced my issues began in the gut. 80 percent of the body's immunity comes from the gut, and yet we bombard our guts with sugar, starch, dairy, artificial sweeteners, artificial preservatives, etc. No wonder auto-immune cases are on the rise.
People with Hashi should generally avoid iodine as it can cause the immune flare up to become worse. I use sea salt without added iodine. You can find it in the salt section. Since you had Graves, right? I have friends who've had Graves who use iodine with no ill affects. Try to avoid kelp based iodine as there have been a few reported deaths linked to kelp.
This is a learning process. I've had to adjust my way of looking at food, especially what is put into food. It seems anything can be put in food nowadays and the FDA just turns the other cheek. Just do a Google on Bromide, found in Mountain Dew and many breads. Nasty stuff. Look at how many foods marketed toward kids have high fructose corn syrup and artificial flavors.
I'm totally back to basics now and my body is responding. Organic lean chicken baked in olive oil with roasted garlic and natural spices like Rosemary and Thyme with some sea salt. GF brown rice. Organic, natural salad dressings. No soy. No dairy or corn. It takes some getting used to, but it's fun creating new recipes, and luckily, hubby wants to eat healthy as well.
:) Tamra
No Kidding!
Thank you, for all of the great sites you sent....
I started Synthroid today, as the Dr. two weeks ago, when he said, I was stable, blah, blah, blan, gave me to try, but said, wait 2 weeks...Go figure....although he had given me an RX for prilosec...it only takes a few days if that, for me to have reactions and or side affects to a med...so I a ASSUMING, that is why the 2 week wait...I'd called his office to phone in an RX for Tagament the only one that I have ever been able to take without side affects...(wish I didn't have to use any) He wants me off of it because my breasts were tender the day of my visit, and I mentioned it...I figured it was from the hormone imbalance in my system...I know my testosterone and progesterone are very low, and estrogen is high. I learned that from my gynecologist....I have severe vaginal atrophy, not fun...He didn't even check those..to my knowledge...
I have some new issues....unrelated, I think to the thryoid...saw my eye Dr. 2 days ago, and have lost more vision, with my glaucoma, he said, more than he thought...so he said, we have got to get aggressive, now about your glaucoma treatment...so have laser surgery on the 25th. he said, sometimes it works, sometimes not...he need to relieve the pressure in my eyes...and the goal is to lower the pressure and preserve the L eye that has not had any optic nerve damage, yet...Yesterday that got to me emotionally, as my vision is blurry anyway, and has been for the past 4 months..also need both cataracts removed. Now I did not sign up to be the actress in the old morton salt commercial...if you are younger, there was a very cut commercial years ago, with a little girl holding and umbrella, advertising Morton Salt, I think that was about the time they added iodine...not sure though. The commercial said, when it rains, it pours.
Have a great day....again......thanks for the sites. SK
Thank you, for all of the great sites you sent....
I started Synthroid today, as the Dr. two weeks ago, when he said, I was stable, blah, blah, blan, gave me to try, but said, wait 2 weeks...Go figure....although he had given me an RX for prilosec...it only takes a few days if that, for me to have reactions and or side affects to a med...so I a ASSUMING, that is why the 2 week wait...I'd called his office to phone in an RX for Tagament the only one that I have ever been able to take without side affects...(wish I didn't have to use any) He wants me off of it because my breasts were tender the day of my visit, and I mentioned it...I figured it was from the hormone imbalance in my system...I know my testosterone and progesterone are very low, and estrogen is high. I learned that from my gynecologist....I have severe vaginal atrophy, not fun...He didn't even check those..to my knowledge...
I have some new issues....unrelated, I think to the thryoid...saw my eye Dr. 2 days ago, and have lost more vision, with my glaucoma, he said, more than he thought...so he said, we have got to get aggressive, now about your glaucoma treatment...so have laser surgery on the 25th. he said, sometimes it works, sometimes not...he need to relieve the pressure in my eyes...and the goal is to lower the pressure and preserve the L eye that has not had any optic nerve damage, yet...Yesterday that got to me emotionally, as my vision is blurry anyway, and has been for the past 4 months..also need both cataracts removed. Now I did not sign up to be the actress in the old morton salt commercial...if you are younger, there was a very cut commercial years ago, with a little girl holding and umbrella, advertising Morton Salt, I think that was about the time they added iodine...not sure though. The commercial said, when it rains, it pours.
Have a great day....again......thanks for the sites. SK
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