Is anyone here taking more than 5 grain NDT?

[copi2k]

Hello,

is anyone here who is taking more than 5 grain NDT? Im actually on 7 grain since a few days.. but still tired... my last labs showed that i can go higher.. cortisol is good, ferritin also.. so im wondering why i need such a big dose?! Is it because i'm a male?
Sick since 5 years and monitoring VitD,VitB etc.. supplementing these etc.. Last time my salvia cortisol showed normal mid-range with no abnormalities.. so.. STTM is writing that if you have still hypo symptoms with a normal/high fT3 then you have cortisol or ferritin issues... but i don't have these issues.. my rT3 is good also... I dont want to pull out all my labs now but i checked the levels..when i was on 5,5 grain my labs showed fT4 22% and fT3 51%... Pulse is 66/minute, Temp axiliar is in the morning 36°C, at 16:00 36,7°C

greetz

[flyingfool]

Rule of thumb as stated above by Barb for people who are symptomatic of Hypo.  Need to have BOTH of the following or at least to be working towards.

1) FT4 to be 50% of the range or a bit higher

AND - this means inaddition

2) FT3 to be in the UPPER 1/3 of the range (66.7%)

You are testing well below those levels!

That high of dosage you are taking sure does seem to indicate a possible absorption issue.

Are you taking your ARmour in two separate doses?

Are you taking your Armour at least an hour before or an hour after eating?

Are you taking your Armour away from taking any vitamin supplements.  And in particular Calcium?

All of these things can affect your absorption.  Taking it in 2 doses helps keep the T3 blood levels a bit more even since T3 only takes HOURS to be get into your blood and used up.  so taking some later in the day will help you not get a huge blast of T3 in the morning and then wear off over the day.

[Red_Star]

I was taking 3 grains of Armour and having major breathing issues and was back onto T4 (50mcg) quick smart!  I thought it might be a potency issue but my pharmacist almost had a heart attack hearing how much I was taking lol so clearly it was an absorption issue. I take 50mcg of synthetic T4 now.  I just wrote about this the other day actually so I'll copy and paste my other answer...

My stomach acid was very depleted when I started Armour. I believe I wasn't breaking down the outer capsule (I was taking compounded Armour) so I dissolved the powder in water but still wasn't working well.

I have no problems absorbing synthetic T4 regardless of stomach acid and pancreatic enzyme levels. Stomach acid signals the pancreas to produce digestive enzymes to further break down food; proteolytic enzymes are secreted by the pancreas.

Excerpts from the book: Thyroid Diseases: Clinical Fundamentals and Therapy by Fabrizio Monaco, Maria A. Satta, Brahm Shapiro, Luigi Troncone...

"There is some differences in the rate of absorption between animal and synthetic preparations. After a single oral dose of synthetic L-T4, the absorption is approximately 70 - 80%, 20 - 30% being recovered in the stool.  It is absorbed rapidly, mainly in the distal small bowel, reaching maximum plasma levels in 2 to 4 hours."

"Variability of absorption also occurs with desiccated thyroid, dependent on proteolytic enzymes of the gastrointestinal tract. Since desiccated thyroid and thyroglobulin preparations contains T4 and T3 incorporated into thyroglobulin, to release thyroid hormone the crude preparations must be hydrolyzed by gastrointestinal proteolytic enzymes, which indirectly influence the absorption of T4 and T3."

[Barb135]

I don't know of anyone on that high a dosage, but if there is, I'm sure they will chime in.

Is fatigue the only symptom you still have?  There are a lot of things that can cause fatigue, other than thyroid.

The site you mentioned is a competing site and is not allowed on this one. We don't necessarily agree with what they write and they are quite often incorrect.  I'm surprised it even posted without getting x'd out.

I'll have to ask what your actual labs are, with ranges since the best way to assess your situation is by what your actual results are with their ranges.  This includes vitamin B12, vitamin D and ferritin.  51% of the FT3 range would not be considered "high".  Rule of thumb is for FT3 to be in the upper half to upper third of its range and for FT4 to be mid range. While your FT3 is, barely, in the upper half, it's a long way from the upper third.  We don't need a whole history of labs; just the most current will suffice.

Has anyone considered adding a source of T4 to your med dosage?  We often see that those on Armour or other desiccated meds have low FT4 and have to add a source of T4.  One would expect to have conversion from higher FT4 which would increase the FT3 level.

Have you researched resistance to thyroid hormone?