a year ago I had my thyroid ablated. my blood numbers came back perfect for 4 months following ablation.I started to notice discomfort in both ankles, swelling and a sensation of burning. after 4 months I was put on synthroid. my weight gain has been constant, my eating habits are normal. due to pain in ankles it's hard for me to walk distance, or put any pressure on ankles, bending, walking,reaching etc. No pain pill has helped, elevating does not help. I've been to every 'ologist' in the book, and not one of the doctors had a solution. I've taken a zillion blood tests, cardiac tests, vascular tests etc. all came out perfectly fine. Everyone is flummoxed. I am still under the care of my endocrinologist. I'm taking synthroid 150, and cytomel. recently I have been diagnosed with pernicious anemia, so I'm on B12(2000 a day) and Vit. D (2000 a day) My weight is off the charts, and my ankles are still swollen and burning. Is there anyone out there that has these symptoms? I'll keep the weight if I can just get rid of the pain in my ankles and lead a normal walking life. HELP PLEASE
If you have Pernicious Anemia, simply taking 2000 mcg of B12 isn't going to help, because it won't be absorbed once it hits the stomach. Standard treatment for PA is weekly injections for one month, thereafter, monthly injections for life, though some of us need more. I inject weekly, in order to feel well.
My ankles swelled terribly when I was hypo. They weren't really painful, although, as you said, there was a burning sensation when the skin stretched enough. Mine went away once I was on an adequate dose of thyroid hormones. That's why I'm wondering if your levels are adjusted properly. Just being "in range" is often not enough to relieve all symptoms. Many of us find that FT4 has to be about midrange, and FT3 upper half of range.
If you'd like to post your labs and ranges when you get them, we can help you interpret them.
Again, if you really have PA, it's not temporary. You could be deficient in B-12 from not eating enough foods that contain it, such as meat, eggs, dairy, etc and in that case, oral supplementation could help; however, that's not PA. PA is an autoimmune disease, in which the body is lacking a substance in the stomach that allows for absorption of B-12. If you don't have this substance, no amount of oral supplements will bring your levels up.
I get swelling in my ankles/feet periodically, for no apparent reason. I can't specifically, link it to, either, hypo or PA. My heart has been checked out and my kidney/liver function is good. In my research, I discovered that dandelion root is good for reducing swelling, so I bought some dandelion tea.... it worked; then I got some dandelion root capsules and have been taking them as well. The dandelion root works better for me than Lasix does. You might want to talk to your doctor and see what s/he thinks.
Hello, Years ago, my cousin was injured, had surgery for a broken neck. He was all black and blue. His wife was advised to use Arnica on him and it worked for the bruising, and the swelling.. that's the only treatment she used. He's much better now. It might be worth a try. Good luck.
This is from Google:
Medicinal Uses and Indications
Arnica is used topically for a wide range of conditions, including bruises, sprains, muscle aches, wound healing, superficial phlebitis, joint pain, inflammation from insect bites, and swelling from broken bones. More recent studies suggest it may also be helpful in the treatment of burns.
Homeopathic preparations are also used to treat sore muscles, bruises, and other conditions caused by overexertion or injury. Homeopathic doses are extremely diluted. They have no detectable amount of the plant in them and are generally considered safe for internal use when taken according to the directions on the label.
Arnica is available in topical creams and ointments. It is most commonly found as a tincture, which can also be used as the base for compresses and poultices. Arnica oil may also be used in topical preparations.
Source: Arnica | University of Maryland Medical Center http://umm.edu/health/medical/altmed/herb/arnica#ixzz2ZEeffhsJ
Have you heard of Emu Oil ? Its oil from Emu bird, originated from Australia used since the Ancient times. This is what I use for any pain, burns, rashes, moisturizer, anything on the skin. No side effects, it makes bruises disappear in few days instead of weeks. Its true that you need your B12 to build up your blood , but Emu oil is for comfort. I sometimes have heel pain, and in my searches, I read that heel pain is one other sign of hypothyroid. I never knew that before. Anyways, I apply liberal amounts of Emu oil, rub it in very well and I forget I have the pain. Emu oil penetrates several layers of the skin and so they use it for arthritis, swollen joints, heal woulds, bee stings, etc. I love it. I carry it in my purse always. I worked in a hospital, my co workers and I buy it by the gallon which is cheaper and share. :) More uses on Google and You Tube. I get it on line, Amazon or Ebay. Good Luck, I wish you well..
Thank you so much.at this point of desperation I will try anything that might help.I am exhausted from continual pain.I want and need my life back!
Don't know if it will elevate the swelling or burn sensation. But will look for it in health stores. I will say with everything I've tried, to no avail, I'm running out of money and patience.
Is that T3 that's 3.5, with a range of 0.47-4.68, or TSH? Are both FT3 and TSH on your lab report?
Anything you type on this thread, we can all see, no matter if you address it to any one person or don't address it to anyone at all. It's all avaialable for anyone to read.
Your FT4 is at 64% of range, and the recommendation for FT4 is midrange (about 50%). So, your FT4 is actually a little on the high side. I'll comment further after you answer my question above about whether that's TSH or FT3.
B-12 looks good. Glucose is a little on the high side. Was that a fasting blood draw? Vitamin D is dreadful! LOL Is your doctor suggesting supplementing that?
Your TSH is 3.5, which is within range for your lab. However, 10 or so years ago, AACE recommended changing TSH range to 0.3-3.0. Using that more updated, but not widely used, range, you are hypo. We don't know what your FT3 is doing, unfortunately. You don't see anything on the report like "triiodithyronine, free", do you? FT3 should be tested at every draw, but once you are on T3 meds (Cytomel), it becomes a hundred times more important.
Glucose isn't my specialty, but I believe the range of 65-105 is a fasting range. You would expect yours to be higher if you hadn't fasted. You might ask your doctor about that, but be sure he knows that you hadn't fasted.
How long have you been taking 2,000 IU of vitamin D? Unless you just started very recently, you are not nearly on an adequate dose. Has your level gone up since starting the supplement?
Since you're just taking oral B-12, it looks like you don't have PA because your level is very good right now. If you had PA, you wouldn't be able to absorb the oral B-12.
I don't know what your vitamin D level was in March before you started, but it's just at the bottom of the range now, and many people with hypo have to have it close to the top of the range to feel well.
I don't know if it might be causing your ankle problem DIRECTLY or not...if you go to the blue bar at the top of the page and click on "Forums", then on "Health Forums", you will see that MH has a new Vitamin D forum...they might be able to give you more info.
Your very low D level might be having an indirect effect in that thyroid hormones aren't getting into cells like they should be. I can't tell you how much you ought to be taking; you should ask your doctor. Some of our members have started out taking 50,000 IU per week if they are severely deficient, but you should ask your doctor before doing that. Also, all supplements are not the same, so you should ask your doctor for a recommendation or a script.
Yes, insist on FT3 next time around. Our hands are really tied without that. Your doctor really should not be prescribing T3 meds without it. In the meantime, the increase to 10 mcg twice a day might help you to lose weight. I'm guessing (because I haven't seen your FT3) that this was probably a good move on your doctor's part, but he's guessing, too (since he hasn't seen FT3, either).
So, that's an OTC vitamin D, not a script? Did your doctor give you any guidance at all about how much to take? It doesn't seem that your vitamin D level has changed at all since you started the supplement. You are still at the "bottom of low"! LOL Do you get out in the sun at all?
Vitamin D, which is actually a hormone, rather than a vitamin, is necessary for the transport of thyroid hormones into cells. If your vitamin D is low and you're not transporting T3 into cells, you could have hypo symptoms even with adequate levels of both FT3 and FT4.
Will your doctor help you with your D level? Has s/he commented on it at all?
I understand...I live in OR...it seems either too hot or too cold to be in the sun for long. 20 minutes in the sun with just face and forearms exposed should be enough to convert the vitamin D that you need. I'd try increasing your dose if your doctor will go along with that, but I'd also suggesting keeping a very close eye on vitamin D labs. If your level refuses to go up with oral supplements, you may have to look at another delivery system.
Don't forget, FREE T3...very important to specify FREE, otherwise you get total T3, which is virtually useless.
Has your iron/ferritin ever been tested? That''s another one that's necessary for the proper metabolism of thyroid hormones.
I really don't know how much D you should be taking. As I said, we see people with severe deficiencies taking up to 50,000 per WEEK until levels work their way up a little, then backing off a bit. You'll have to ask your doctor what he thinks. I know they tend to be somewhat conservative on D depending on other health concerns. As with all these things, they try your patience, and you can't do them in a day.
Have you increased to 10 mcg Cytomel twice a day? How are you feeling with that increase?
Your T4 meds weren't changed at all, correct? If not, it might be a good idea to get labs sooner rather than later if your doctor is cooperative. Cytomel acts pretty fast, so there's not a delay in levels rising like there is with T4, although there still is some "building".
That's all I can think of at the moment. Once we know what your FT3 level is doing, there might be more suggestions, but until then, it's all just a guess.
Not really, my ankles still are swollen and the burning sensation sometimes radiates over the top of my foot, however it subsides and just initial problem area remains.
Still not losing weight, is there a specific time I should be taking 2nd dose of cytomel? 1st is in the a.m. when I wake, with synthroid, I try to take 2nd 10mcg about an hour before dinner.
When you take the second dose depends on a little experimentation to see what time works best for you. Most people avoid it after about 3:00 pm (on a "normal" sleep schedule) because it can interfere with sleep). However, some people can take it right before bed with no ill effects on sleep. After your morning dose, if you start to feel tired or get any other symptoms consistently at the same time of day, you want to take the second dose 2-3 hours before that time to avoid that "crash". You don't have to fast before and after taking Cytomel like you do when taking Synthroid. Even though Cytomel is fast-acting, it can take time to relieve symptoms that have been persistent.
Weight loss takes time, and even once your FT3 and FT4 are optimal, you might find you still have to make an effort to lose weight. Optimal levels ALLOW you to lose weight, but they don't make you lose weight (at least at a pace that you'd notice).
Have you done anything about the D? The more I see, the more I think that might be a culprit.
Seems dr. Is being conservative. He feels since I am within the range he doesn't want me to go toxic.
He feels that maybe the rheumatologist will recommend a higher dose or something else.
I go on Monday 29th.
I have little to no faith in them, but will keep an open mind. He best not tell me I have fibromyalgia, which is their key diagnosis to whatever ails ya!
There are those who think that fibro is not a disease at all, but untreated hypo when people are in the lower ends of the ranges for FT3 and FT4.
I'd say your doctor is being ultra-conservative. With a range of 30-100 on D, you have a long way to go to be "toxic" with a result of 31. A range on any test ought to be interpreted as the playing field within which the doctor can adjust meds/supplements, and he should be using the whole playing field.
I hope you have better luck with your rheumy on Monday.
Vitamin D deficiency ofen goes hand-in-hand with hypo. Maybe it's just that once hypo, vitamin D (among other things) has to be a little higher in the range than for healthier people.
I agree and increasing D on my own, not crazy a ounts, but jumping to 6000 a day. Untreated hypo, hmmmm.something to bear in mind for Monday visit.
If you have any more brain storms, I'm here, if not have a great weekend.
Don't forget to try the EMU OIL for you pain. Its on Amazon.
I also read from Dr Cayce's book : his treatment to reduce edema, other than using Lasix and other diuretics is by drinking watermelon seed tea. I posted it here for you but I mistakingly had the website included so they took out my post.. but you could google it..Watermelon seed tea.
Edgar Cayce was a Psychic Healer in the 20th century.
Did you look into the dandelion root, for the swelling? You can do either tea or capsules.
The burning/pain is quite likely caused by the swelling. Mine get that way, too, when swollen, because it stretches my skin. Weight can also play a role in this, because excess weight can put extra strain on feet/legs.
I've been a fan of Edgar Cayce since the 60's, still have his books, including THE SLEEPING PROPHET.
Will definitely look into the tea, and go back and research the rest of his wisdom. Lasix etc. Never helped. Thanks for the Emu reminder.
Can I make my own tea from fresh picked dandelions?
My pain and swelling are 24/7, my weight is high due to hypothyroidism,
Will be going to rheumatologist on Monday, hoping he says to up vit D and that will be key to helping me.
Friendship invitations are legit on this site. Some people don't seem to like to respond on this public a forum. Some send friendship invitations, some prefer to send PMs (personal messages, which are just avaialable to the two people involved). If you don't know the person who sent the invite, you can just delete the notice...
I hope these other suggestions will give you some relief.
The dandelion tea is made from the roots; I'd have no idea whether or not you could just go pick them and make your own. It may or may not be safe. I buy both the tea and capsules at my local health food store; neither are that expensive and I'd rather be safe than sorry.
Well the rheumatologist lives! He didn't mention the F diagnosis, lucky him.
He listened, asked questions and had me go across the hall to get x-rays of both ankles. Eliminated RA, and arthritis, and any bone defect. All great news.
He said he could give me stronger pain meds, or high powered anti-inflammatory meds, or, which I opted for, a quicker acting steroid shot. Only did left ankle, as a test.
He ordered different blood work, after those results maybe MRI to check for stenosis in my back, last and hopefully NOT an EMG,..
He was, I think, quite thorough.
He said 2 days to see change, I was uncomfortable from the injection yesterday, today a bit better, but still feels like he left part of the needle in my ankle.
I did mention D, he didn't put too much weight into it, so I backed off and will continue on my own.
Interesting to see results of his ordered blood work, takes a week.
Also glad I'm responding from home, not jail.
Had right ankle done, Very uncomfortable, like last time.just sitting it out.Dr. Said if I continue to feel better & pain, burning doesn't return I can get shots every 4 months. Still don't know what it is, but know more what it isn't from bloodwork, definitely not RA, whew!
Don't know if I'm still connected to this site.keep writing but it doesn't show up?
Im not having great luck with 2nd injection, bummed!
However, I did see the scale move in the right direction, just a tad, but better than up!
How much cytomel should I be taking to actually see quicker results,
Taking 10 twice a day.also is there an optimum time of day to get better results?
Hope to hear back and all is well with everybody.
Anything's better than up when it comes to weight! No such thing as too thin or too rich...
Cytomel isn't something to play with to get quicker results. It's fast acting and much more potent than T4 meds, so you can get yourself into trouble real fast with it. Your FT3 was already a little on the high side before the increase to 10 mcg X 2 of Cytomel. I would be very leery of messing with that before seeing how the increase has already affected your FT3 level.
Most people take part of their Cytomel first thing in the morning with T4 meds. The second part can be taken whenever works best for you...most people do late morning or early afternoon. After about 3 pm (on a "normal" sleep schedule), it can interfere with sleep. The best thing to do is learn to time it so that you avoid a lack of energy in the afternoon. If you take it at 1:00, and your energy lags an hour or two later, move the time back a little to avoid the energy dip. T3 peaks about 3 hours after you take it.
Is the first ankle still good? I wonder why the second didn't respond the same way...
Wonderful to hear from you again.
Gave blood today, appointment and results Monday, then decide about cytomel. Will post results.
As for rt.ankle that's the zillion $ question. Since no diagnosis, hard to know anything. Think maybe it will just take longer?
Thanks for info
Only meds I take are for thyroid. Pinning him down, might not get answers, but might reduce some stress IF I use real pins!
As for eating something wrong, I have no idea what would cause poor absorption?
Glad fun, but there's always Something unfortunately.
I just don't know where those meds are going. Between the last two blood draws, you increased your T3. However, your FT3 took a significant dive, and your FT4 took a little one. One thing that can happen, if FT4 is too high (and I don't think you qualify for this, but I'm running it by you anyway), is that during conversion, more T4 is converted to RT3 than to T3. This could be lowering your FT3.
Let me explain. There are only two ways for your body to get rid of T4: It can convert it to the biologically active T3 that your cells can use, or it can convert it to RT3 (reverse T3), which is inert. RT3 can block receptors in cells and stop T3 from getting in. RT3 kind of has the reputation of being the "evil twin", but in fact it's your body's defense in hard times...famine, starvation (including dieting), certain diseases, trauma, etc. RT3 induces a kind of hibernation state.
So, it could be that, for some unknown reason, the FT4 that you're taking is being converted less to T3 and more to RT3.
There is a test for RT3. However, the whole subject of RT3 is controversial as far as mainstream medicine is concerned, so it can be hard to get a doctor to order it.
Neither should affect absorption of thyroid meds, but to you take your B and D at least 4 hours away from your thyroid meds...grasping at straws here.
Does this (PA) condition cause the swelling and burning in feet and ankles? If so, did the B12 injections help with the paini?! Please please let me know! I know this was an old post but I came here looking for the same answer!! This is driving me crazy!
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