problem w/ daughter, not health related but desperate! Help!!

[nalla]

My daughter is 9 and in 4th grade. she is very smart and has always been a great student, but this year things have been different. 1, she is really getting into her friends. That is pretty much all that she thinks of. Well her school work is been sliding. She isn't vocusing in class cause she talks to her friends, doodles in her notebook etc. She even asks in the middle of class to leave and call me and ask me if she can go to her friends house. She was in future problem solvers and ended up dropping out cause she was more interested in her friends. I don't let her go to anybodys house after school and when she gets home she has a snack and then she works on her homework.but lately she has been lying and hidding her homework so I can't find it in her backpack. Then I will find it and make her do it and she complains and whines about it, says she can't do it. She is getting lazy and acts like she can't do it and tries to get us to give her the answers and every night there ends up being a fight. she tells herself that she is stupid. My husband and I started praising her about how smart, wonderful, special ect sinse she was a baby. I never got praised as a kid, so we made sure to praise all of our kids from the begining. And she is supposed to read a certain book each night and do a book report. And each week she has a newspaper (4 kids) and is supposed to write about it. She sits at the table whining that she can't do it, or she looses it, or says one of her sisters took it. It's always excuse.She doens't pay attention in class. to be cont...

get her some after school tutoring help and a counselor. before it is too late. next thing you know she will be pregnant, lashing out, throwing fists, talking back. peer pressure, hanging with the wrong crowd. Keeping it real. help her before, the wrong someone else does.

[lucylocket2]

that is so funny you said delta dawn!! I know it word for word! that's how I wake my kids up in the morning. either that or hey good lookin. they hate it! it get's them out of the bed though.lol

[JoAnnaRF]

That is friggen HILARIOUS!!! I have threatened to do that but have found that turning up the country music in the van gets their butts amovin very well! They are SO embarrassed if I crank up the Delta Dawn and sing along. I also threatened a GIt R Done sticker on the side of the van in masking tape. heehee
The things we do to raise well rounded obedient (sp) children.LOL

--J

[JoAnnaRF]

I'm sorry you are experiencing tough times with your DD on top of all of your other obstacles. I'm not sure what all your medical conditions are but I do know you haven't been well and are having a lot of pain. I can relate to this and have had friends tell me when I discussed changes in my children's behaviour that a lot of it could be related to the child seeing Mom in constant pain. Not that you can hide it or keep it from her, but maybe she is not dealing with it very well and maybe has something to do with the change in her behaviour?? Did that make sense?
Maybe she is reaching out to friends and slacking off in school without even realizing that it is because she is upset and worried about Mom. Just a thought..
--J

[nalla]

No, they DONT get 1-4, they get A-F's That is what her report card says and the papers that she does. My 2nd grader gets 1-4. Different schools do different things. 4th grade and up gets letters, not numbers. she came home just today with a math test today that said D, She has homework every night in just about every subject. Plus a book report due every week.
And I'm NOT trying to take away her friends, I just won't let her go to any friends house untill she gets her homework done. I think education at any age is more importnant than friends.

And I was talking about this girl we will call D and she is a bad influence on Johaunna, I don't like her playing with her. But I NEVER said that I don't let my children play with other kids. But in my opinion, education is WAY more important than a social life. Yes, a social life is VERY important, but if her social life is making her grades drop then I will do something about that. My daughter has a lot of friends and I let them come over or her go to their house on the weekends and sometimes after school if I know she has no homework. But School comes first!!

I'm sorry that you don't agree with that, but that is my opinion and what my husband and I are going to stick with. If you let them slide in the begining then it will be VERY hard to get them to have good study habits in the future. Just like teaching your children good manners, you teach them early and then that will be all that they know and will continue to do it for life. You need to teach your children the right things to do when they are young or they will not do it as adults. If you let your child talk back to you when they are young then they won't know any better as adults. You won't beable to get it out of them when they are teens, unless maybe councling or something.You need to teach your children the difference from right and wrong from the begining. Even when they are todlers. I tell my son (16 months)  no when he grabs something or does something he shouldn't be doing. And he understands and now won't touch the tv. If I let him touch the tv for years and then all of a sudden told him to stop he would be confused and it would be a lot harder to get him to stop. This is what i'm trying to do with my daughter, teach her good study habits from the begining.

Obviously our opinions and school systems are different, my daughter is in 4th grade but in the middle school part of the building and has a locker. I have looked at every single one of Johaunna's papers and have NEVER seen a 1-4, just A-F. Please don't asume that every school is the same.
And my concern is that my daughter is more interested in her friends than her school work. Like in math, she is learning to multiply and divide. If she does not learn these things then she will get behind and struggle all through school. THAT is what I'm trying to avoid. Johaunna just isn't interested in school at all. I DONT want to take her friends away, yes, I dont like one of her friends that she has, but I let her play with her once a month or so. Now her other friends, I let her play with them only if her school work and chores are done.
I don't agree with you saying that she is too young to teach good study habbits. You teach them from kindergarden that education is importnant and hopefuly they will carry that with them all through college. I was never tought that school was important. My parents never checked my school work, or talked with my teachers, made sure I did my homework. So that gave me the message that school was not important so I didn't try and I don't know how I even got through school.
My problem is I'm having a hard time trying to convince Jo that school is more important than a social life. And yes, a social life is very important, but that is all that she cares about. And that is not what is more important. I would like her to have both in her life.
I don't know, maybe you miss-understood me and thought that I never let her have any friends...that is just not true.

[lucylocket2]

Hey, welcome to the club mom. I have 2 girls. One is in the 5th grade the other is in the fourth. I went thru this last year and I'm startin it again. I cought my daughter hiding papers. Ones she had made a bad grade on. I was really worried my oldest had a learning problem. IT'S THE AGE!!! HORMONES ARE STARTING.  i HAVE BEEN READY TO LOSE MY MIND. I'm glad someone else knows how I feel. Fourth grade is a transitional year. The school work changes so much. It gets a lot harder. Teachers don't look at them as little ones anymore, even though we do. That has been a lot of our problems. My hubby changed job's too and I thought that might be it, but don't you all feel bad about it. I explained to my kids that if they want to eat, Daddy has to work. In our area job's are scarce. He has to travel. I have had to be the stern one in the house. My daughter has so much homework everynight. With my oldest I had the worst problem. We got started at 4, worked thru dinner (she ate and worked), we worked till bed time. she had to start bathing in the mornings all due to homework. I was at the school all the time last year. My oldest could care less about school , the only reason she went was to see her friends and what everybody was wearing. I fixed it though. I cured the fourth grade thing with my oldest. Now, I have told my youngest she doesn't have a chance - I learned it all from her sister. lol So far, so good. Not that she hasn't tried slacking, but i fix the problem fast. How did I fix it, you may ask?? I wouldn't give her anything with sugar in it. My oldest LOVES sugar!  She was worried about what the other kids were wearing - NO NEW CLOTHES!. I boxed up all her clothes. Left 5 outfit's , (I picked out). That one got her. She is so weird about her clothes. When she brought me proof she was doin better - she got something back. It was a lot of work, but worth it. No, phone calls, no friends over or vice verca. Oh yeah - I took anything fun away - games, toys, ect. I talked to her teacher. when she did good the teacher wrote me and i decided if it was enough to get something back. It worked for me. I have to go, but I will be back about 10:30. It's 6:30 now. I have to get my kids to school. If ya wanna talk, just post me- I'll answer.Sorry if this doesn't make sense. It's early, and no coffee yet.I can barely see the screen. lol

[lucylocket2]

My post is above - that is the longest one I've ever written. this is a subject i actually know a lot about. lol
    oh yeah, I forgot to say something - don't blame yourself. Kids will be kids. You could have 50 and none would be alike. I'm sure your a great mom. You'll find what works for you. Good luck!
Have a great day!!

[glad2bamom]

I'm not sure who you were responding to, but "playtime" for a 10 year old is different than playtime for a 5 year old.
Grades matter when you're 10.  Not necessarily because they go on your permanent record, but because you are establishing study habits and patterns that will last a lifetime.  If I allowed my daughter to do as she pleased, with no consequence of her action, then I'm not doing my job.

I understand this mom's plight.  It's frustrating when you see potential in your child, but yet they choose to act irresponsibly.  You are molding your child into the adult that they will be, and good study habits and being self-motivated begin in middle school.

Good luck original poster--

[foxy1220]

I actually believe tht your daughter is trying to be accepted and liked by her peers in school.  Being the "smart" kid isn't easy, you get teased, called names and basically no one likes you.  So I think she is doing this to fit in....so she does what everyone else does which is talk in class and not listen to the teacher.  I really think its peer pressure because when out of her friends company the fact that she gets upset when she is unable to do the homwork means she does care about her grades and her homework, can't do it because she didn't pay attention to the teacher in class.

I think that you may need to tell her that being smart and paying attention in class is not "lame" and it will pay off for her in the end.  And if she has to pretend and let her grades suffer just to impress them then obviously they don't like her for who she is.  Of course she will not listen to you right now, but eventually she will realise that you were right.

I agree with you not letting her play with her friends until her home work and chores are finished...it teaches her responsibility and how to prioritize.

I like your parenting technique, teaching them from young what you expect from them as they grow older.....I always considered this to be the most effective technique when it comes to raising kids.  What I do not agree with however is that you are still letting her play with "D" even though your instincts are telling you not to.  Go with your instincts, a mothers intuition is never wrong, put an end to the play dates...if she hangs out with her in school you cannot control that but you can control how much access she has to her when she is not in school.  Of course you daughter will throw a fit, but so what, you are doing this in her best interest.  If the grades don't pull up then cut off ALL playtime regardless of if the homework and chores are done, cut it all out until she pulls up her grades.  And trust me if her social life is all that impotant to her then she will try very hard to get those grades up so that she can socilize with her friends outside of school hours.  In the end you are still the parent and what you say goes.

[krickett]

It looks like you have gotten a lot of really great advice from everyone as far as dealing with the hormones and peer pressure at this age. My daughter is only 4 so from the sounds of it I'm going to have my hands full in a few years! :) Can't wait!

I wanted to ask about one thing in your post. This hit home for me and I didn't notice anyone else pick up on it. You mentioned that your daughter is having problems in math specifically. Is that the only subject she seems to really be struggling with? I have always had a hard time with math. I struggled thru the first few years of school and then in the 3rd grade it was like I just totally missed everything. I went to class, I paid attention but I just could not get it! These years are building on each other and if you miss the basics of something it is hard to go back and grasp it and while everyone else is moving on, learning, more and building on what they already know you are stuck struggling b/c you missed the foundation. It's hard being a kid, like everyone else mentioned peer pressure controls so much of their lives. I know you said you praise your daughter for doing good, that is great, keep it up! Kids are going to be hard on themselves and I feel it is up the the adults in their lives to remind them how wonderful they are. As for the math, it just takes one thing to make a kid feel "stupid", I know. You might try and see if you could get her a tutor in this subject or if there is one close by perhaps sign her up at Sylvan Learning Center or another program like that. There are people there that are trained in how to find out for sure what is blocking her learning in the subject and teach her a different and hopefully easier to understand way to learn. Everyone's minds are created differently and we all learn in different ways. Maybe this is the missing link. Good Luck with everything! :)

[QT2C]

Sometimes praise isn't enough. I don't know anyone who would go to work all day to hear how great they were. We go for the money. Try to reward her efforts in the same way. Show her why it is important to work hard. I did with my children and they loved seeing how much all the hard work payed off. I gave 5 dollars for A's, 2 dollars for B's ,1 dollar for C's ,took off 2 dollars for D's and took off 5 dollars for F's. Needless to say they never got an F. It works. Kids will be kids that is true, but thier friends will make or break them. Keep up the good work MOM.

[babybooboo]

wow, no offence, but that was almost ridiculous! i dont even know where to start... okay, your daughter is nine years old! she is not even in middle school yet. a girl her age is suppose to have friends and have play dates. i mean in school at that age, they dont even have A through F, they have 1 through 4. honestly, the more you try to take away from a child when it comes to social life, the more they are going to repel. i think its absolutly ridiuclous that you take away a nine year olds play time because of 1-4. give it a few years.

[nalla]

JoAnnaRF-- You are very right. I do feel SO guilty that I can't be there like I used to. I am a stay at home mom and it's the most wonderful job there is!! I want to be the one raising my kids, not a babysitter, (nothing wrong with any of you mothers that work, this is just what is best for me, hope I didn't affend anyone)
I have gone from doing everything for them to basicaly nothing for them. and I have a 16 month old and a 3 year old. There are no pre-schools here in this town so Isabella (3yrs) so everyday we do a little home preschool. And I miss that SO much!!!And I miss playing with my little man, Nathan. (16 months) and he has physical therapy and I'm not able to do his daily excersising with him. So yes, there is a lot of sadness and guilt. I know it's not my fault and it will be over soon I hope. but still...

krickett-- She has always struggled with math but when she is in a good mood and actualy tries she usually gets it. But we are keeping the tutor in the back of our minds. Right now  I think it's her being lazy and just not interested and she feels so selfconcience because of her younger sister. We will see though.

Thank you guys for the great advice. I'm just so worried that she will fall so far behind and be so hard to catch up. I struggled all through school and hated it and dont want to see any of my kids have to struggle like I did.Education is so important and I wish they could realise that also. I hope this is just a faze and that with these new methods will work.
I hope I didn't paint the wrong picture when it comes to her. Johaunna is a great kid! not much to complain about with her except this school issue and that she is 9 going on 17!!!!  Hormones, puberty, boys, makeup!!! Has anybody figured out how to slow down time with their girls? hehe LOL My teen years were not pretty! Scary!!!
Thanks everybody

[JoAnnaRF]

Just try not to blink! Seems everytime I close my eyes they grow a foot and time has flown at lightening speed.

[have 2 kids]

Wow. Does this ever sound familiar.  My daughter is 10 and in the 5th grade.  She struggles with reading.  She suddenly started coming home with F papers.  We immediately took away what mattered most to her.  She couldn't attend football games with friends or stay/have them overnight.  It didn't take long for her to realize schoolwork had to come 1st.  She is now getting all A's and B's.
Still struggles with reading but really tries hard.
I definately think you are doing the right thing for your daughter.

[have 2 kids]

Do you have any children?  If so, how old are they?

[nalla]

Yes, seeing me in pain is definatly affecting her and we have sat down and talked about it. but these school problems started before I got sick. Long story short, I have pain, am getting hysterectomy this coming monday. I have been posting a lot about it on the womans forum. But I agree, seeing me like this can't be helping her an it is probably making a bad situation worse, but she isn't keeping her feelings inside. We do a lot of talking about stuff. As a child I wasn't allowed to talk about my feelings so I encourage my children to talk about any feeling that they have...good or bad. And then we try and figure out how to deal with it. Right now it's so hard because I'm in so much pain right now and these pain meds seriously make me loopy, nuts, crazy etc. They are actualy starting to kick in right now, so don;t mind me if I start not making any sense. I may need to come back when I have more of a clear head. I'll try and hold on a little longer, I have other posts to read and respond and I so want to talk to you all about this. We all seem to be having similar issues and talking to other women is comforting and helps me not to want to pull my hair out when it comes to pre-teen issues. LOL

[JoAnnaRF]

Talking to her and listening is perfect!! I know we mom's tend to try to hide our pain so as not to burden them, but even then, they know. And sometimes it isn't easy to hide it. I limp and have difficulty getting up, down, all around and there is no denying it. I just don't want you to feel guilty about it. You are doing all the right things and given how much you are dealing with, you are still making time for her and worrying about her. No one could ask more of you and you WILL get through this!
I have 3 girls ages 10 (11 in Dec.) 13 (going on 27) and 17 (one foot out the door) and I have seen every mood and personality change known to man!LOL It will get easier, then hard, then strange, then hard, then finally, they find themselves and you find that they are back to the girl you raised. Just keep doing what your doing and she will eventually get back to the person you know she is.
Now I sound medicated. LOL
--J

[Aruba417]

I don't have kids, but I remember being in 3rd and 4th grade and starting to do really bad in school. At my school grades K - 3rd got grades E = excellent, S = satisfactory, N = needs improvement, U = unsatisfactory. Not 1 - 4. Then in 4th grade and up you got As - Fs.

Anyways, I almost flunked 3rd grade because of math, and 4th grade was the same. And I can honestly say it probably WAS because of the whole friend thing and trying to be accepted. Suddenly you want to hang out with the "cool, pretty" girls. You want to do everything THEY do and you could care less about school. I don't have any advice to give you, but the good news is, although I was never an A student, I stayed in school, graduated, and went to college and got a degree. So hopefully that gives you some kind of hope!!! Good luck!

[lucylocket2]

I'm glad i could help. Now, the test is to see if it works. My youngest just started the fourth grade. She has always loved school and made Straight A's. This year though she is starting to struggle more. It's a very hard year for kids.
She is still making great grades, but it's not as easy to her as it used to be. I wish ya the best of luck! I had one more thing to tell you. - I told my oldest last year if she didn't straighten up, I'd go sit with her in class - wearing my ol' paintin clothes.lol That one got her too.

I pick my girls up after school everyday. Last year she was takin for ever to come out of the school. Her sister told me she was  talkin to her friends. I was livid needless to say. I got her on that one too. I put on my old house cleanin clothes. Walked right up to the school and in my ol' time country voice, yelled - Come on baby, Come give mommy a hug. Boy, have I missed my baby today.---- I told her next time I'd say we have to go get her a new bra......... Now, she is always on time commin out! I feel like I'm so mean sometimes, but it works!!!

[nalla]

Everybody,(well almost) gave me great advice but you hit the nail on the head! Your's sounds like my 9 year old. (10 begining of Jan) She is a walking talkig little super model. She is obsessed with her clothes. She calls herself a fashion girl. She has to have her hair just right with just the right clips that matches her pants and shirt. She LOVES clothes. Of course I don't buy all that she wansts, but the stuff she does have, it's like her prized posession. I'm going to do that, take some of her fav. clothes and she has to earn them back with grades. This one is going to kill her!! but I have a feeling that it will work! I would never have thought of that! I will also try the sugar thing. She has her bucket of Halloween candy. I keep it in my room otherwise she would eat the whole thing in one day. LOL After dinner I usualy let them pick out 1 or 2 pieces...maybe I will take that away also. That will get to her too. She is always telling me that she can't find her homework or her books. So We have come up with a special place just for those where her siblings can't get to it.So she will not have any excuses. I'm struggling teaching her responsibility, but I really think you have helped me. Thanks I really think she will do anything to get her clothes back. I can't believe how great of an idea that is for her. Thank you SO much. Now the clothes thing won't work for my 7 year old, but, at the moment we are not having problems with her, but I have ideas what will work with her if this problem comes up. But Andrea (7 yr) is a total school freak!! She LOVES to learn and loves math and science and does a lot of extra credit. She isn't as into the "fashion, social" part of school. she does have friends though.

Everybody gave me great advice, but the advice you gave me I think will work the best with her. Oh, and her lipgloss. (It's clear with sparkles, and I don't let her wear it in public) that is another one of her prized posessions.

QT2C- The money thing is also a great idea. with her allowance she likes to buy herself new clothes. Great idea! Thanks!!

foxy1220- I agree with you. Over the summer she was playing with D all the time and Johaunna just became a different daughter, so we limited it to once a month...but you are right, she shouldn't be playing with her at all! I have always known that what was best, but then I feel bad about taking away her best friend, but then again it's what is best for her. Jo has lots of other friends that I do aprove of. Jo actualy dropped out of future problem solving because of D. I should have just stopped the relationship right there and then. You know, thinking about all of this, 4th grade is when I met a girl named Jennifer and we hit it off from the start, but she was VERY bad for me. She would convince me to do all kinds of bad things and even got me to smoke at the age of 11! and then gave me my first drink at 14! My attitute was different when I was with her and my parents should have made me stay away. I know now that I have to do this. She needs to stay away. It's so easy for kids to convince other kids to do wrong.

These pre-teen years are so scary and new to me and they seem to be going through everything so much earlier. I'm SO glad that I have all of you for support witj this. Hopefully we can give each other ideas and tips over the years as they grow.

[glad2bamom]

Hey-
I don't have any specific advice about your "specific" problem.  However, I can tell you that I have a 10 year old, and something crazy happens with girls when they are that age.  My daughter goes from crying to laughing and back to crying again, all within about 2 minutes.  She loves one friend one minute, and then they hate each other.  
My pediatrician says its hormones....
I don't know if I'll survive the teenage years.  All I can suggest is to try talking to her, explain that with having friends comes responsibility.  Be firm, and if her grades are bad, or if she is not focusing or trying, then the first thing to go is the privilege of hanging out with her friends.  Even the phone may have to go.  I bet it won't take too many weekends alone for her to figure it out.

[nalla]

I just don't know what to do with her anymore. Some things in her life have changed, like her dad now works nights. She see's him while they are getting ready in the morning and he gets off work at midnight, and he works weekends. She just doens't ever have any time to spend with him anymore. He got this job last June. And now,with my condition I know she is worried about me and when she see's me I'm either doped up on pain meds or in just so much pain that I can't even talk.So she isn't getting much time with me either. We sit on the couch and she reads to me or we do something simple, but these meds make me so tired that I can't stay awake long. But the school problems started a few months after school started. Now she has this friend D and we really don't like her. I won't get into why, it will take too long, but I noticed over the summer when she would play with D her attitude would change and she would just act like a brat. So we cut down the time she plays with D to like once a month, but she plays with her at school. I don't know if these problems are because of D, or a combination of everything. How do I get her to be more serious about school? Also, she has a hard time in math, she really struggles, is awesome in reading and spelling. I have a 7 year old also and she see's Johaunna's math homework and has no problem with it. She would look over Jo's shoulder and answers just like that. She is in the 2nd grade. So that makes Jo want to give up and makes her feel stupid that her younger sister can do it and she can't. By the way, we won't let Andrea near Johaunna when she is doing her homework anymore. Johaunna isn't distracted while doing homework. tv is off, no music, no eating, other siblings are in a different room. I'm so afraid that this is going to be a pattern with her and we won't be able to break it. 4th grade is when I gave up in school because I had a teacher that told me I was stupid etc. and I went down hill from there. I don't know what to do with Johaunna. Can anybody give me some idea's why she might be doing this, why she just doesn't care about school anymore, but cries when she comes home with an F because she jsut didn't try. I don't know what to do. I am so afraid for her. I'm sorry this is so long, I just wanted to paint the whole picture for you all. any advice??? I'm desperate and don't want her other sister to see this and start this. And it's not like I'm not involved. I check her backpack everyday, go through her papers with her everyday, help her everyday, talk about school, but it turns into a fight because her grades are getting worse. and I haven't been able to help her this past few weeks. We are staying with my parents house till I get better and they are helping her, but all of this started way before I got sick and moved in with my parents. Please help!!!