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pvcs/pacs/runs and hormones

Many thanks for such a great site. it really helps to put my mind at rest!
Some background-23F, healthy, not overweight, smoke occasionally,don't drink huge amounts, no family history. A normal 20 year old I would say!All started some years back, would notice the odd heart flutter as a teenager and think nothing of it. As the years have gone on its started bothering me more and I went to the doctors and had all the tests-24 hr tape, echo, blood works, numerous ecgs etc. all came back normal with 25 ectopic beats(mainly pvc's) in 24 hours which nobody was alarmed at.Currently on Propranolol 40mg once a day (can take twice if really bothering me). I don't seem to get many of these during the day but as soon as I lie down or relax my heart starts jumping around. Sometimes I get a big flutter and then after the flutter my heart does three or four quick beats and then back normal. I'm not sure if this is just my heart reacting to the ectopic or if its v-tach or something? Obviously, i'm terrified of having v-tach. I don't feel dizzy or unwell during these episodes, just worried. Although sometimes my body feels 'buzzy' and that's when I know i'm going to get ectopics.
I really think that these may be hormone related. I was on the pill for 5 years& never had heart problems then.As a result, I've just today gone back on the pill to see if this regulates my hormones and stops the funny beats. Do you think this may help? What about the flutter and quick beats is this ne thing to worry about? Is propranolol okay with oral contraceptives?
Many thanks!
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Avatar universal
A related discussion, palps was started.
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Avatar universal
I am not a doctor. I have been taking many herbal supplements and I have done several body detoxes all while taking Toprol.I know not to think just because it is natural that it can't hurt me, but you can either look up interactions on the web or talk to your doctor. If you use a combination product, look up each herb or ingredient individually and see what the side effects or interactions are. I know there are no interactions with hawthorn berries. It takes a while for it to start working as does the Nervous Fatigue Formula so you shouldn't expect instant results.One of these days I am really going to start researching pvc's and figure out what's going on, but my Toprol is working well and once the initial side effects disappeared, I have been doing fine.I have also found that chiropractic and trigger point massage therapy REALLY helps. I hope the Toprol works for you, and good luck with your supplements.
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Avatar universal
Is it OK to take natural remedies with Toprol?  I'm going to have to go back on Toprol and I take lots of supplements and am interested in some of the ones you mentioned.  Do you know if it's OK to mix these with Toprol?
Thanks!
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Avatar universal
I started experiencing pvc's over a year ago. It was constant and very worrying as you all know. My doctor put me on Toprol XL 25 mg. It works very well for me. The pvc's were exhausting me. I found that coughing sometimes helps regulate your heartbeat. Natural remedies for the heart can include hawthorn berries which are a wonderful heart tonic used for centuries. CoQ10, of course. Fish oil supplements, folic acid,and many amino acids help the heart. One thing you need to strengthen is your adrenals. Licorice root is good, but there are many combination formulas which are better, such as Nervous Fatigue Formula by Nature's Sunshine. The up and down feeling you get in your stomach during pvc's is actually an adrenaline rush, that's why they are so exhausting. I have to say that I am a HUGE proponent of natural medicine, but I am so thankful to my Toprol for helping me.
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Avatar universal
This site is great. When I asked my cardiologist where all the others were with this problem, he assured me that there were many of us out there. I am 44 and have had them for over 30 years. At 17 they gave me valium, for anxiety, little did they know and coincidentally they went away. Pregnancy was a wild ride as someone else has said. PMS forget it, you can always count on them getting worse. About 12 years ago I had an episode that lasted 6 weeks. I was always able to ward them off with Propranolol. ONly 10 mg.This past Fall they lasted 8 weeks. I was feeling good for 6 months and now they are back and it's coming up on 6 weeks. I am also followed by a cardiologist who is very nice as well as being very kind and knowlegdeable (I HOPE). It's very hard not to be concerned about this condidtion when it's YOUR heart you are talking about. For those of u taking propranolol, my DR assures me it is a pretty harmless drug that will lessen the severity of the PAC/PVC, with minimal side effects. Since they are going on so long, I can take as much as 100mg a day, more if needed. I feel like an elderly person who is dependent on these pills. I am glad that they help but it is still always so scary.
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Avatar universal
Does sotalol help with pvc's ?
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Avatar universal
I'm a PAC, PVC and anxiety sufferer, too.  It is SO nice to know I am not alone.  This site keeps me sane sometimes!  About natural remedies, I take magnesium glycinate (which is more absorbable that other forms) and calcium which seems to help.  I also take L-carnitine, taurine and am going to start Co-Q-10 which are all advised for palpitations.  I'm young, exercise a lot, am of normal weight, healthy and seemingly have my whole life ahead of me. It is SO frustrating to have to live with these stupid palps that make you think you're going to keel over dead at any time!  I try anything that even MAY help them!  I tried birth control pills and they actually helped my palps a lot but I had to go off them because they made me nervous.  I'm going to try them again now that I hear other people have had good results with their palps while on them.
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Avatar universal
I am a 43 year old female who has had high blood pressure for over 10 years and have been taking lopressor for 4 years. Over the last few months I have developed these palpitations, I have had echo, ekg, 24 hour holter and echo stress test, all have come back normal. I am not sure if I have pacs or pvcs just that they are coming from the top of my heart? Last week I had palpitations so bad for 8 hours straight every third heartbeat, they almost drove me crazy. once again echo and ekg are normal, then my doc took a new test he has in his office called a CVprofiler (checks the elasticity of your arteries). My small artery fell into the abnormal level. Which is really making me nervous, even though the doc assures me that it is not too severe and can be reversed with exercize,diet and keeping the blood pressure down. Has anyone else ever had this test.
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84483 tn?1289937937

While beta blockers are not for everyone , they are the only line of drugs that have proven to reduce the mortality rate in persons with heart disease or that have suffered a heart attack.

I take 100mg atenolol( in divided doses) not all at once, they work better that way, the cardiologist I seen a week ago agreed with the way I take it ,he says it not as long acting as once thought.

If I wasn't taking it I'd probably having a resting hearrate of about 85-95 most of the day (not at night) at night it would still be normal and it keeps a my PVCs from triggering a rapid heartrate, beta blockers are very safe drugs, though they have some unwanted side effects for some , I am lucky not to have any side effects from them at all.

I am not a doctor , but worked with pharmaceuticals for nearly 20 years and I am also a memeber of the PVCs sufferer/palpitation/fastheartrate/anxiety RETREAT.:-)
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Avatar universal
Hi all,

Has anyone got any advice about how to reduce the frequency of PACs and PVCs using natural medications? I've tried magnesium, but can anyone reccomend anything else?

I haven't been on any meds now for about 6 weeks after being on an incerdibly powerful drug called tambocor. It helped a lot with the palps, but induced shocking side efects. Also, does anyone know if beta-blockers are more helpful in reducing pvcs or pacs? Or do they just reduce your heart rate?


I reccommend you all spoil yourselves and go get a massage! It helps!

Thanks everyone.
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Avatar universal
Thanks for all your replies. It's good to read others comments about these damn palps!
I started my 'pill' this morning, so to all the women-i'll let you know if it makes any difference, though I guess it may take a month or two to start regulating my hormones (if that's the problem)
I've got another appointment to get my second 24 hr tape next week and I really don't know whether to go or not. I've waited three months for this after my gp referred me-i think he's sick of the sight of me to be honest-and i guess i should do it, but at the same time I just want to get on with my life and not worry about tests/test results etc which take weeks on the nhs...I guess even if when my heart speeds up after an ectopic they say it is non-sustained vtach, they won't do anything different anyway. So maybe I should just live with it. One thing I know for sure,is that knowledge isn't power. I wish to god I hadn't researched so much into the heart, and didn't know things such as vtach, long qt, svt etc etc. then I would live like I used to, carefree, and that I was going to live until I was 100....i'm on a rant now, aren't I?!
Anyway, all take care, keep me updated (not sure when this thread closes, but its so good to hear peoples stories and experiences)
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21064 tn?1309308733
At one point or another, I have taken propanolol (Inderal); ace-butolol (?); tambacor (flecainide); and, propafenone (rhythmol) for ectopics.  While tambacor and propafenone were effective in suppressing some of the pvcs, they were not used until it became medically necessary.

As for the beta blockers, I found Inderal to be the most effective in reducing the occurence of pvcs.

My magnesium and potassium were always normal, and I chose not to supplement.  

I can understand your frustration with the tambacor.  While it definitely served to reduce the frequency of my ectopics, the side effects were not so great.  The propafenone had fewer sides effects for me, but I still didn't want to take the meds forever.  Ablation took care of my persistent pvcs.

Good luck in finding a natural remedy that works for you.

connie
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Avatar universal
It's easy to get yourself stirred up into an anxious state and start thinking the worst. But you shouldn't be looking for a zebra in a herd of horses.

That is to say, don't be overly anxious about something that isn't there, for example, people who get lots of freckles and moles on their skin--and have been told they are benign by a medical doctor, shouldn't be worried about CANCER.

Sure, if there are changes, then maybe they should get a more detailed test, a biopsy to check it out. That's just like us, if we notice changes, we should get it checked out. Maybe have a follow-up in a year or two. But in the meantime, continue to read and research and try the things that should help reduce stress and keep ourselves healthy.

Someone else wrote about quitting smoking which is THE very best advice on reducing the PVCs but more importantly may help you live to 100, if that's what you really want to do!!
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Avatar universal
Tickertock-I can see your point. However, i've found the doctors get quite annoyed at me when I press them and say 'but are you sure it can't be this or that..etc etc' I think they think I'm questioning their qualifications or their expertise, when all I want is reassurance. If I hadn't ever heard the term 'Sudden Cardiac Death' I would definitaly be feeling a lot happier now! But, I do see your point too.
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Avatar universal
I don't know about natural remedies, but when I was having alot of "heart hiccups" which is my name for the PAC/PVC's, my Mom told me to quit drinking diet soda with aspartame.  I did and the frequency of hiccups went down considerably!  I'm sure it also helped that when I quit the diet soda the caffiene intake went down as well.  I still have PSVT, doesn't seem like anything affects that, but I don't have nearly so many, nor as noticeable heart hiccups.

I was put on 12.5 mg of Atenolol, and had HORRID side effects from it.  I was so depressed and tired I could barely function.  If you find out any natural remedies that might work, I'd be glad to hear about them, and even try them!

Hope you (all) are having great days!
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84483 tn?1289937937

While I agree that knowledge can be detrimental in causing more anxiety and ignorance is bliss, knowledge is power and can save your life, also when doctors know that you know you a little about what your are talking about, they are less likely to give you the run around and be more frank and open with you, my experience only!!
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21064 tn?1309308733
Upbeat,

A "normal" stress test result is usually good, but I know what you mean about "NORMAL"....seems so subjective.  Glad to hear your test results were good.

I've read that many people here have found ways to lessen the frequency of their ectopics. HOORAY!!  For me, other than eliminating caffeine, I never really found any way to reduce their frequency.  They were just a part of me...for over 20 years.

Although I prefer NOT to take medicine, I have taken Inderal (beta blocker) and found it to be very helpful in settling my "irritable" heart.  However, after several years, it eventually lost its effectiveness.  Interestingly, for the past 6+ years, I have taken it on an "as needed" and it works great.  Since my ablations in 2003, I have only reached for it a few times.  Some of you who prefer not to take medicine may want to ask your doctors about using it "as needed."  I am not a doctor, just a former member of the "pvc frequent flyer" club : )

connie
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Avatar universal
Last post was actually to all.

And I'm really not trying to minimize any one's situation, or discomfort, I really mean it when I say they suck, even one PVC or PAC, or other irregular beat, when you feel them you can't help but wonder "what the heck"!?!! And why me. but if you keep reading, you'll understand these beats don't care about age, or gender, or activity.

Actually they seem to come most at rest. I think I'll have to keep more busy!
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Avatar universal
Yup, I'm one of those who get thousands per day, let's see, at last holter monitor (48hrs) it was over 24,000/day.

Did you say you might get 25 per day? I know they suck, but it would be nice to have 25/day.

I was in your same situation at age 18, getting fluttering in my chest etc. The doctors thought I was depressed. It wasn't until I was 30 that a doctor actually took it more seriously. But still after all the testing, it was "benign" PVCs (about 450/hr then).

I guess my point is, now that I'm 42 and lived with them this long (without beta-blockers) I'm sure you will have a long and wonderful life too. They don't always bother me, sometimes it takes more effort than other times to ignore them.

And I'm not on beta-blockers. At age 30 the cardiologist said the BB's may or may not lessen the sensation of PVCs, but BB's probably would not change the frequency, in fact might increase the frequency. I trusted him then, and even though I have a new MD who prescribed Toperol, I still trust that earlier recommendation even at triple the PVC frequency.

And Jeff, I don't know if I've spoken directly to you before or not, but I have been talking to Momto3 and Smeltzy and I think Tickertok. Well, anyhow, to update, I just had a stress echo done, and even though they *refuse* to give me any specific measurements, they say everything is normal, normal, NORMAL!! (except for trivial aortic insufficiency). Doctors can be so, uhm, arrogant. Anyhow, my worry that the high frequency might lead to a cardiomyopathy is stilled for at least one year and maybe more.
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Avatar universal

Hi,

I am also similar to you.  Not to diminish the impact that this has upon you, but one way to look at this is you actually get a lot less ectopics in a day than most people.  Some people who post here get 10,000+ PVCs a day every day!  Why did you get    put on a beta blocker when you have so few ectopics (excluding those days after you have drunk the night before since you know the best way to stop these is to stop drinking)?

All the best ...

Jeff
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Avatar universal
Hi how are you! I am have the same problem and I am 23 years old. Mine started when I was really stressed at the job I use to work at but I would only get em maybe a few times a month. When I got pregnant they reared their ugly heads. I definately think it is hormone related. Some days I get them and some days I do not. I just live with them. I have had ECG's, two 24 hour holter monitors, an echocardigram which only showed trace aortic regurgitation and 60-65 percent EF ( all normal )...the cardiologist said that BB's are usually worse than the heartbeats itself because of the bad side effects...so I choose to live with em and I have. When I get an ectopic it feels like a hard heartbeat and I can feel it in my throat and its like a rush goes through my chest. My heart also races following an ectopic but nothing came up on the 24 hour holter monitor but everything normal but a few PVC's and a couple PAC's. I didn't even feel the PAC's just the PVC's for some reason. Excercising for me helps to get my mind off of them or doing something I enjoy and they go out the window and I do no feel them. Maybe you could try the same?!?!
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Avatar universal
Hey again,

Yeah we're pretty much similar in every respect... I too noticed an increase in frequency and worsening of symptoms when I went off the pill about 10 months ago. I haven't had my hormones checked out, that definitely might be a contributor. Unfortunately I went off the pill for fear that the palpitations may increase my chance for clotting, so when I started getting chest pain I stopped taking them immediately which probably wasn't necessary, but that's how anxiety over this goes.

The frequency of my palps vary about the same as yours. Some days there won't be any, some days I'll get 1 or 2 minor ones that are easy to tolerate, and then there's the days where I get the longer flutters that seem like runs and several single palps throughout the day. Alcohol will provoke mine as well, but like you I don't drink much, and even less now. I also don't smoke, rarely have caffeine, and am in good health although I should exercise more (started getting them during exercise so it's been hard to get back into it).

My heart often does start to race after I get a flutter for a little while. I'm not sure what that is, but hopefully it's not v-tach. I often get a racing heart that's not precipitated by flutters as well though. I assume that's either stress or atrial tach, but they haven't caught that on a monitor.

Have you found anything that helps you stop the palps when you get a run? When I get one I freak out and instinctively make a jolting movement and change my breathing pattern and that generally stops it, but on the rare occasion that I let it go without trying to stop it, it continues on... kind of like it starts out as a run and then goes into bigeminy or something. It's weird because I thought changing breathing patterns and stuff only worked as a solution to certain kinds of tach, and not PVCs/PACs. I dunno!

You said you sometimes feel "buzzy" - I wonder if that's the same feeling I get like my body is vibrating internally. It does feel like it's vibrating so fast that it's almost a buzz. On most occasions this feeling doesn't drastically increase my palps, but one night when it was really bad I couldn't even get to sleep because it was causing so many palps. Blah.

Ok this is a long post - just nice to find someone in a similar situation!
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Avatar universal
hey!

I know, I could have written your comment yesterday! Isn't it such a pain to be going throught this at such a young age? I can't understand it. I'm relatively healthy, I don't do drugs, I don't excessively drink (apart from the odd Saturday night!)I tried to work out in my head what could have triggered these damn things as they've definately got worse over the past year. The only thing I can think of is the pill and like you, i'm a big-time worrier. I also suffer from panic. But the weird thing is, I've had much much worse episodes of worry and panic in my younger years and never had these, so why now? Unless all the stress has damaged my heart in some way? I don't know. I've had all the tests, and apparently I have to 'cope with them' and if I was say 60 I might be able to do that, but when you're 23 it seems mad to be going through this. Absolutely none of my friends can relate!
Regarding the propranolol the other name for it is inderal and it's a beta blocker. I didn't really want to take meds, but it got to the point where it was really depressing me and I had to control it somehow. Been on three different BB's and propranolol works best for me. I can take one or two a day. However, it still hasn't stopped them, and I don't think it can, it just makes you not feel them as much. How many do you feel a day? Mine ranges from none to about ten. Although if I haven't had enough sleep or have drunk the night before I can get them all day. The runs scare me the most. I get quite a lot ventricular beats so I'm scared when i get a big flutter and then my heart speeds up it could be v-tach. But it may be an atrial run or an svt, or maybe two PACS in a row. Does your heart ever speed up for a couple of beats after a skipped beat/flutter?
Anyway, hope you haven't had a bad day of them today. Take care, Emma

ps have you had your hormones checked? I'm having blood tests soon as i'm sure its hormone related, its def. worse at certain times of the month.
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