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Tramadol & Ultram Recovery Room Part 51

Jan 11, 2012 - 293 comments
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tramadol

,

ultram

,

Healing



Hello Dear Tramadol Warriors!


I am very glad to see you all. You're in the right place if you want off the Tramadol!

You can do it!

I believe in you!


Love and Healing,
Emily

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by mikatr, Jan 11, 2012
Well thank God the brain zaps have almost stopped and I am feeling a tad better.  Still will go to see the psychiatrist to make sure I am on the way to recovery.  What is sad is the main cold turkey withdrawels from lyrica and cymbalta were Dr recommendations being that I was having allergic reactions, I guess I should have reduced down slowly and I really paid the price being that I went off 4 meds in too short of a time and did not taper down.  I will say that I did NOT have dr assistance with tramadol and tizadine (muscle relaxer) and thought I would be okay because I had only taken them for 6 months, as needed and was on a small dose (max 150 mg tram per day) and would often not take them more than twice a day.....It has been 11 days since I have had anything.

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by denised1982, Jan 12, 2012
I'm sorry I have not been writing lately.. I looked back on the thread and read some people's entries.. Well, it's been 41 days no ultram for me.. I feel a bit slowed down without it and that is going to be what I miss most about it. I still hurt, but at least I was faster at work. It's hard when you work a hall (I'm a cna at a nursing home) by yourself taking care of 20 people, and having to dress them all in an hour before you get off work. I miss the speedy feeling and being awake and alert and fast. I won't go back, there's no way the doctor would prescribe it to me because he is aware of my addiction to it and there's no way in hell that I'm paying 120 bucks for them to fedex it to me. I changed my phone number recently so I wont be harassed by the tramadol pill pushers and I am so thankful of that. I would hate to have to cuss someone out for them waking me up in the day when I am asleep (I work nights). They would just be doing their job, but still, I'd have something to say to them. lol

Mikatr, hello and welcome! Isn't it frustrating how the doctors just write you anything for fibromyalgia? I haven't been diagnosed with fibro but I do have a lot of pain just about all over my body and I have to say that the doctor has written me two prescriptions and one is celexa and the other is trazodone. The celexa is more or less for depression and the trazodone is for helping me sleep (I began taking them when I quit taking ultram because I knew I would have insomnia and I knew I would be depressed, in pain, and have brain zaps.) The celexa and trazodone has helped a lot with the pain. It's still there, but now it's bearable. I figure if I tweak my diet, stop taking in preservatives and other various chemicals from my diet and exercise a little my pain would almost disappear. I'm just glad that my depression is under control, otherwise I wouldn't see it like that. I would just continue to take ultram and other drugs and not watch what I eat and drink and continue destructing myself.

It is a long road getting away from drugs. I was raised finding an allopathic solution to every symptom (my dad is a pharmacist) and doing a lot of research and reading on this forum I have learned a whole lot about other alternatives for pain control and health. I'm not 100 percent yet, but I'm trying and I can say that I am better off now than I was 41 days ago.

I hope everyone else is having a good night, I wish y'all love and strength in this enduring battle...
<3 Denise

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by JULIUS23, Jan 13, 2012
@ DENISE1982 CONGRATS ON 41 DAYS CLEAN FROM THIS DRUG.. IT IS A WONDERFUL FEELING KNOWING THAT EACH DAY BRINGS YOU CLOSER AND CLOSER TO BEING COMPLETELY NORMAL... LATELY IVE BEEN HITTING THE GYM GETTING RIPPED AND IT IS A GOOD FEEL BC EVEN AT ALMOST 3 MONTHS CLEAN IM STILL NOT A 100% PERCENT.. ILL SAY IM BOUT 70 OR 75% FEELING BETTER BUT IT IS WAYYYY BETTER THEN HOW IT WAS THE FIRST WEEK OF DETOX... MY STOMACH STILL HURTS ESPECIALLY DA NERVE PAIN I GET RITE N DA CENTER FOR NO REASON AT ALL.. ITS A SCARY FEELING!!!  BUT ANYWHO TO THE NEW PPL KEEP FIGHTING BC IT IS SO WORTH IT... LATELY IVE BEEN VERY BUSY WITH WORK N WORKING OUT IN I NEED TO POST MORE OFTEN BUT TRUST ME IM NOT LEAVING THIS WEBSIT BC IT HAS TRULY GOT ME THRU ALOT.. GOD BLESS YILE!!!  ITS WAR .....

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by mikatr, Jan 13, 2012
Per my previous posts I have gone off Lyrica and Cymbalta in November and Tizanadine and Tramadol 14 days ago.  I did the first thru per my Dr as it looked like I was having allergic reactions.  They continued so I stopped the last 2 CT without Dr help and I am paying the price.  Wanted to update, I went in and saw a counselor who has worked me into see a psychiatrist in a few days.  I am relieved to say the least as I don't think I can handle much more, you can read my previous posts.  My question is does anyone have any good recommendations on what would be a good thing medication wise to help we with the withdrawels, I am sure the Dr will be good but I am so scared to go backwards now that I am this far into this.  The only 2 things I remain on is Paxil 10mg which I don't feel is helping and Ambien 10 mg for sleep.  Thank you so much for all your care and concern, I know that this has gotten to big for me!

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by Sarabie, Jan 13, 2012
So here I am. +100 days off tram and now also down to just two cans of coke a day. Eating healthy again, drinking club soda, starting pilates tomorrow and decided that sweets are only to be enjoyed during weekends. Hope I Can stick to it. I Got an enormous craving for sugar when I went off tram. I decided it was ok. Sugar is not as bad as tram and so much easier coming off. And it really helped to stuff my Face with sweets.

Going to Copenhagen for the weekend to see an appartment. If I like it, I'm moving this month and then it's time to start my hotdog diner. I Can hardly wait.

Love and strength to y'all :-D

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by DamTram, Jan 13, 2012
mikatr - Hang in there!  You're almost at the doctor.  When you say withdrawals, can you be specific about which lingering symptoms are giving you the MOST trouble?  In terms of the brain zaps and constant nausea, those will have to be remedied with a different SSRI or SNRI if the Paxil is not working.  Eventually, you could taper down properly.  If you're referring to physical pain that is still severe, that is something that you need to see a doctor that is NOT a psychiatrist for, as it implies an underlying condition.  You cannot go backwards, no matter what you do, as you're going to need drugs to balance your internal chemicals to go forward, at this point.  Do not see taking medicine as going backwards - self-medicating would be going backwards.  So, let us know which symptoms you need help with, and if they're Tramadol-related, I'm sure we have tons of advice for you.  

Sarabie - You are doing awesome!  What is this about a hot dog diner??

Julius - Congratulations on how far you've come, and good on you for keeping up with coming back!  I know I slipped up when I started to drift away.  Thank you for leading by example!

Denise - I hope I didn't knock you out with my billion-word messages.

I can now run for 24 minutes (in splits)!  I'm hoping that these shin splints improve...I haven't felt this great in about 5 years.  If you're feeling crappy, make yourself get up, get out, and start walking - even if you haven't slept in 3 days.  I promise that you'll sleep more and better!  I survived my first week of the quarter, which started out scary since the last month of last quarter I was Trammed out of my mind.  But, it turns out that I have lots of people to talk to, etc. - even potential for friends!  I thought I was almost completely alone in this world, when I was on Tram this last time.  I thought no one liked me, and I thought I was doomed to be anti-social for the next 5 years.  I guess how you feel DOES affect a)  how people treat you and/or b) how you THINK people treat you/see you.  I only knew this in theory, but not in practice, since I've felt awful for so long.  I thought opioids made me more likable.  It was just the energy I needed.  I never knew that the energy was hiding in my leg muscles, all this time...

I am back down to 0.5mg Klonopin and am now also down to 50 mg Seroquel.  The only taper/withdrawal symptoms I've had are joint pain and some anxiety.  I was aching so badly all day and when I got home today that I took one Lyrica, and then was able to go running.  The anxiety is manageable if I stay busy during the day, and I'm fortunate enough to live in a state that recognizes that there are medical situations and conditions where a doctor's prescription of MJ is more than appropriate, and is legal.  That's what's helped me the most in coming down from the Klonopin.  I wish that everyone tapering off of a benzo had legal access to it, to survive the temporary night-time panic.  I've never taken the stuff recreationally, but I know that others do.  I'm just glad that California has systems in place so that people that need it can have it.  My dad, who can only sleep for 20 minutes at a time because of a bladder condition (which he gave to me, of course....but his prostate makes it worse), got his MML and sent me a message the next day saying that he had slept for 4 hours in a row the night before, which he hadn't done in at least 3 years!  He was so happy.  Sarabie - isn't it legal in Denmark?  

Anyway, I hope no one judges me for that.  My number one goal is to GET OFF PILLS AND NOT BE DEPENDENT ON ANYTHING ANYMORE, and suffer as little as possible in order to do that (what with school and job and research and all).  I don't drink caffeine (bladder), I don't drink alcohol (liver), I don't eat fat (liver), I don't drink coke (pancreas and liver), and I eat as few sugars as possible (pancreas).  I exercise every day.  I still smoke ~5 cigarettes per day, and they all make me sick.  Which is why I want to get off those pills as soon as possible, because cigarettes will be the last to go.  So maybe you can understand my urge to speed up this process.

Sorry for the rambles...I love this forum.  And you guys.  I'm so glad you're here.

Sending my strongest thoughts to you, fighters!  Happy Friday!

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by legaljunky, Jan 13, 2012
Sarabie- You go girl! Your life is really taking off!  Enjoy!

Mikatr- I know when I started all this I read thru pages and pages of posts and read what other warriors did for the symptoms I had.  It seems so long ago now.  I know I drank peppermint tea with cayenne and fresh ginger for the tummy problems and ate things like custard and yogurt and simple things that wouldn't upset my stomach. And drink a lot of water. When the anxiety and RLS and other symptoms spiked I took 400mg magnesium (it's a muscle relaxer so it also is good for sleep) and a sublingual B12 and I'd get on the forum and post.  In the beginning I couldn't do anything that took focus or concentration and I was so exhausted.  And I was impatient and so grumpy to my poor husband! The only thing I could accomplish was laundry!  It slowly got better and you'll get there too, you are in the battle of a lifetime and you're gonna win! It just takes time.

I am on a lot of meds because Lyme disease did a lot of permanent damage.  None of them are addictive and I assume I will be on them forever. 1 of them is Clonizepam for sleep.  I know a lot of warriors are getting off more than just Tram but I don't think that would be right for me.  I'm on low maintenance dosages and with them I have quality of life. It is all managed by my Lyme disease Dr, I have lots of blood tests to make sure I'm tolerating them.

Hang in there, Makitr, you're off to a great start!

Strength, perseverance and love!

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by mikatr, Jan 14, 2012
Damtram, the symptoms are I feel all withdrawel related.  Have had a full work up of my heart at the emergency room already.  What I still have is heart racing, high anxiety, chirping in my ear, acid stomach, lack of appetite, anger, depression and just feel zapped.  Today is day 14 without Tramadol but I am dealing with so much more because of coming off too much to fast.  The counselor said that basically I have collapsed my brain so the Psychologist will help calm things down.  I guess my question is I am so scared on what I will put back in my body because of a reaction or to feel like I have to go and start over again with the withdrawels but I can't do this on my own anymore.  Feeling very overwhelmed, not helping that my husband meaning good intentions talked about trying to lean on my spiritual being more, wth this is all I can think about, its like I have popcorn brain.  

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by DamTram, Jan 14, 2012
Mikatr - For the anxiety, etc legal is right that magnesium is calming.  I drink water with powdered magnesium before bed.  It slows your heart rate a bit.  Valerian root and GABA are also helpful supplements, for me, when I get that physical panic.  Tums would be helpful for the sour stomach, or pepcid ac if it's heartburn.  Getting angry is ok, as it should help get up and exercising.  That will help a great deal in relaxing your heart rate and calming some anxiety.  

Of course you'll question what you put in your body, now.  But I hope that you will consider what is suggested by the doctor to help your body get out of what it's in right now.  Progress is taking something that you will get off of that will allow your body to recover.  Progress is not waiting and hoping that your brain will recover on its own from the removal of so many psychotropics simultaneously.  You are doing the right thing by getting medical attention.  I only wish for you that it were sooner!  

Thinking of you and hoping some of the supplements can help a bit.  

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by Sarabie, Jan 15, 2012
Damtram you are so cool :-) it's fantastic to read that you are getting your life back!!!! I guess tram really sedates our logic sence.

I have a Masters in socialwork/social education and have been working in that area for 15 years. But I'm fed up with dealing with everyone elses s#!t so when I Got off tram, I decided to open a small hotdog diner. Hotdogs is the number 1 streetfood in Denmark and I've already got a great location. Got the license etc, I only need to find a place to live. I'm gonna be my own boss, and I'll have time to write on my novels between customers :-) so that's my plan for the future :-)

Love Susie

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by booba77, Jan 15, 2012
Hey guys! I'm 30 days today, and I feel great. I haven't posted much because I've been so busy. Susie-those pilates are tough. I did them the other  day and laid on the heating pad forever. They are great for you though. I hope everyone is doing well.

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by legaljunky, Jan 15, 2012
OK I'm sick and tired if being sick and tired.  I've been going thru all the things that Tramadevil WD entails, I suppose I'm done with 120 day PAWS, but I'm still not right.  I have this sore throat/sinus/ear/runny nose thing that comes and goes, and I think it has been so throughout WD, sometimes just awful and sometimes not so bad. I have no fever and no thick flem. But I still have long periods of time when I have no energy, sleep more, and I'm a little depressed. I was expecting my life to be normal by now. It was so much fun to see my abilities slowly come back, but lately I feel like I'm taking steps backward.  But then, I remember hearing Tramadevil can remain in my body for as much as 2 years.  Does that mean this is still WD and it can go on that long?
Anybody have any answers?

I realize my troubles are so superficial compared to brain zaps and the worst Tramadevil has to offer, I have the poor me's today while so many of you have real troubles.

I gotta get back in there with yall and fight!

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by BeenHereBefore, Jan 15, 2012
LegalJunky, I think you might be concentrating too hard on trying to feel WDs.  Anything physical after 120 days is not likely Tram WDs, you just might not feel well.  It is the flu season.  Its most likely mentally more difficult than anything else.  It doesnt even have to be "PAWS", but maybe just trying to fill a void that tram used to take care of.  

That whole 2 years stuff was a story about LSD.  After 120 days your body is clean of tram, your brain still might be healing, but you are def clean of the tram.  Its time to try to occupy your mind on something else besides tram and the WDs.  Otherwise, you are always going to feel like your not 100%.

Its a mental battle at this point, the physical battle is well over.

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by DamTram, Jan 15, 2012
Susie - That's awesome!  I wish I could come to Denmark and visit your soon-to-be diner!  Best of luck in launching it. =)  It's so nice to hear people turning their lives around, after Tram.  I'm definitely trying!

Legal - I'm so sorry you're not feeling well.  =(  It definitely is flu season, so try to go easy on yourself.  I definitely don't think that you have to worry about withdrawal symptoms hanging around for two years, and BeenHere's right that we just have to get used to feeling healthy sometimes and unhealthy, other times.  That's just life, unfortunately.  I've been sleeping a ton (10 - 12 hours/night) and I'm not sure if it's because I'm fighting off a bug or because the medications that I'm trying to taper off of are leaving me with a hangover (the Seroquel, specifically).  I'm just trying to listen to my body and give it what it needs.  You'll have your energy back, soon!  Are any of your symptoms related to Lyme?

Hope everyone is doing well!  I'm having trouble getting back into the hours and hours of readings that I need to do for classes.  I think Tramadol helped with my focus and stamina the last month of last quarter, but TOO BAD!  I did it before Tramadol, so I can do it again - even if it's not as easy.

Fight on, Fighters!


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by denised1982, Jan 15, 2012
Hey everyone,
I don't post as much as everyone else lately.. I have been feeling like crap with pain and other things going on and I haven't felt too good to post something inspiring. Just kinda depressed. I'm so tired of everything and it is pissing me off.

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by legaljunky, Jan 15, 2012
Thanks DamTram and BeenHereBefore-  I just need to get back to reality.  Everything in my life isn't related to Tramadevil. I  took an allergy pill and feel better.  And even tho I don't feel like it, I have to get back to the treadmill-  you got me there this afternoon.  It's possible what I'm feeling is related to Lyme because Lyme makes every ailment a little worse and takes a little longer to get rid of.  Bottom line, though, is I am where I am now and it will be a lot easier if I just accept it.

Thanks for being there for me!

Love, and acceptance 1 day at a time

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by misty97, Jan 15, 2012
i am almost  at 4 days without tramadol....and i only feel bad every now and then..i just have no energy and my back hurts real bad...ive been taking lyrica to help..is that ok and how long do the bad withdrawls last????

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by fightorfight, Jan 16, 2012
Hi there Misty,

4 days out is a good place to be--- it gets better from there, at least as far as the acute stuff is concerned.   The back hurting, as well as maybe some gut trouble is most assuredly from Tram WD,  the opoid part of the drug primarily binds in your lower back and gut opiate receptors.   Very normal--- it takes some time for those sites to settle down, and the back seems to be one of the last to do so.    Depending on your time on it, and dose, it can last a few weeks or so.    It'll go from pain to just restlessness, where you'll feel the need to get up and move around every so often.    I still do that at work, but more a force of habit rather than feeling restless.  

Taking Lyrica to help abate some of your symptoms isn't terrible.   Gabapentin and Lyrica have a place in terms of pain reduction and nerve stability.   I'm not sure of your exact case or how it is that you started taking-- but Lyrica is sometimes offered as an alternative to Tramadol for nerve pain.    Gabapentin worked wonders for me whenever I had shingles, and Lyrica seems to be even more potent.   I would say that it may amplify the "no energy" feeling--- but to be honest, you'll have that feeling regardless of whatever you'd take as an adjunct right now.      Any sleep you could get will help, but don't fret if you're not getting much right now.    

I actually forget what day I'm at, but I'd say I'm doing pretty well.   Lots and lots of family stress right now-- so I'm just trying to ride the tide.    School starts back up for me again tomorrow, and then I work my normal shift until midnight, so its back to busy days and nights.    Things have a weird way of reminding you that it'll be normal again.     Just stick with it guys and gals.

FoF

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by misty97, Jan 16, 2012
thanks fof   i really needed the advise...and it really helped..i know its gotta get better and it already has i have not had it as bad as some people the only symptoms i got were sweats, back and legs hurt, everything runnin through me, and tired. but ive been taking the lyrica and tylenol so maybe thats helped.. thanks so much..ur greatly appriciated..

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by DamTram, Jan 16, 2012
Welcome, Misty!  It sounds like you're doing very well.  I remember that Lyrica helped me through my cold-turkey withdrawal last January.  I eventually got off of that, too, and now only take it when my pain is unbearable - only every once in awhile.  Congratulations on getting off of Tram!

FoF - I'm sorry things are so stressful right now.  School will be an excellent distractor, I hope.  Stay warm out there, and congratulations on 81 days!

Legal - Good on you for exercising!  I swear by it, now.  I'm glad the allergy medicine helped out, too.

Denise - Hang in there, lady!  If you fight back, things WILL get better!  Stay strong!

I have been so tired the last few days...I even stayed in bed until 2pm, today.  I don't know what's going on, but this does NOT bode well for the start of the quarter.  I wonder if you get MORE tired when coming off of a benzo or Seroquel?  Hmm.  I have a late night, tonight, to see Portlandia the Tour.  I hope I'm not a wreck tomorrow. =/

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by DamTram, Jan 17, 2012
Everyone okay out there?

Going down to 0.25mg Klonopin has me feelin iiiiicky.  I haven't finished my readings for tomorrow, but I also haven't been running, yet.  Physical well-being comes before school, right?  I'm a bit confused about my priorities, now that I have them, again.  I'm hoping that I have enough energy for 80 more pages of reading after running...

Yes, I would like some cheese with this whine.

I saw a friend last night that I hadn't seen since October, and I told her about my relapse, etc.  When I would refer back to it, she would laugh.  She said I was talking about it like it was nothing; like it wasn't some traumatic event.  I can't decide if it's a good thing or a bad thing that I can joke about what an effing wreck I was.  I think it might be a good thing - I don't want to be the bum of my own jokes, again.

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by DamTram, Jan 19, 2012
Hello?  Anyone out there?

I had an 8 hour migraine yesterday, and my neighbor offered me Tramadol (he'd just come back from Mexcio...where you can buy it at the pharmacy without a script, of course).  He sprained his ankle, and thought it was as good as Vicodin.  I took two.  I still had a migraine - the only thing that helped was sleep.  I won't be taking any more.  Do I have to restart my tracker?  I don't think so, since I won't be taking any more.  I'm not even angry with myself, or having any desire to take more.  It's like I was blacking out from pain and had taken everything else for it, and I tried something else.  It didn't help, so I won't be trying again.

It did, however, totally disrupt my precious sleeping last night (was up for 3.5 hours in the middle of the night) and gave me terrible sweats this morning.  So...all in all, a medication with very little therapeutic effect for migraines (I know I need to see a neurologist, but I am SO SICK OF GOING TO OLOGISTS) with really stupid side effects.  No, thanks!  You can keep your beastliness to yourself, Tramadol.  I see right through you, now.

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by Gizmok, Jan 19, 2012
Okay guys, here I go again. I called the doctor the other day and told him that I am yet again sick of the pain meds, so today is again day number one for me with no meds. I'm in some pretty rough pain, but I am happy about this. I have a handful of clonidine and my determination. I know with my faith and determination I can do this again. Keep me in your thoughts. I read your posts every day but have not felt that I deserved to post anything. Now I can be proud of myself again. Day one is always the easiest it's the next couple of days I am not looking forward to. :-) DamTram, I am really proud of you, taking just two, and not jumping back in feet first is a hard thing to do. Hope you are all doing well, I will try post often. The hardest part is being alone and in pain.
Peace and love to all. <3

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by denised1982, Jan 20, 2012
I am sick and tired of being in pain. I want to take ultram again. I know all this hard work for nothing, and it wouldn't be in my best interest to start up this crap once again. I just don't wanna hurt all the time and the doctor isn't too concerned about it. I guess I have to just take the pain. I'm so sick of it. My mind is not on the right path. I miss the energy that I don't have anymore. I guess I was expecting all my pain to go away just because I'm on antidepressants.

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by DamTram, Jan 20, 2012
Gizmo - Congratulations!!  Which pain meds have you stopped?  What doses?  Thank you for your kind words...I was worried about telling about that night, but you're right.  I didn't jump back in.  But I DID sleep for 12 hours last night, and woke up with sick sweat. =/ Tramadol is SO GROSS.

Denise - I'm glad to hear that you are NOT going to start up again!  Remember how Tramadol stopped helping with pain, and you had to keep taking it and taking it if you were going to have the energy you needed?  I'm sorry that your pain is bad and that you're feeling fatigued...I hope you're making those first steps to make your body feel better.  It's not immediate, like a pill, and you do have to work through the fatigue and pain...but you will feel so much better, in the end.

Best of luck, Warriors.


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by denised1982, Jan 20, 2012
You know what? NO! I do remember what a hot mess I was on the tramadol. I will not take that sh*t again. It would be just INSANE. NO NO NO NO! I will keep fighting! I never been the one to back down to anything, and I'm not about to start backing down now! Not with my life. Eff OFF, Tramadevil! The power of Christ compels you!

Sorry all. I am having some crazy temptations going on with the tramadevil itself. I need to see my ticker to remind me of how far I've come. Like damtram told me once, I'm not the type to take sh*t lying down. Thanks, girl!

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by DamTram, Jan 21, 2012
Woooooooo, Denise!! That means that today is DAY 50!! I'm so inspired by your continued fight, and so glad that someone finally made an Exorcist reference in relation to this flippin pea soup.  You're HILARIOUS!  And it's true...you're a bad a** b! =)

It's true...Tramadol would've been an easy, easy way for me to for myself to sit down with my computer and the excel file that I need to fill at 9am on a rainy Saturday morning.  Would it have been worth it?  HARK NO!  I've FINALLY stopped sick-sweating from the two trams that I took to try to start the migraine 3 nights ago.  BLECH.  I started to get another migraine last night, so I forced myself to go running (despite collapsing from exhaustion).  I hadn't been running since I'd taken the 2 trams (they slammed me on my butt the last couple of days), and I finally met my ultimate goal of running for 30 MINUTES total!  I was only supposed to run for 27 minutes (I've been increasing one minute per day so as not to break myself), but I couldn't stop running!  It felt really great.

Also, if I had stayed clean...this week would've been my one year anniversary of going cold turkey (I c/t'd on January 19th, last year).  So, I'm EXTRA angry.  I should've been celebrating!  I'm still celebrating.  Not being on Tramadol will ALWAYS be cause for a celebration.  Especially since I was NOT able to run for 30 minutes at 42 days LAST year.  

Woohoo, SURVIVAL!  I hope you guy are all quiet because you're out there enjoying your lives. =)

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by Sarabie, Jan 21, 2012
Damtram I'm glad you aren't going back once again. It frightened me a bit when I read that you took two trams. Not that I don't understand. I would have been tempted too. But I have some very strong non opiat painkillers in my drawer just in case.

Denise - stay cool girl. You are doing so great!!!!!!

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by Appeljack, Jan 22, 2012
First, thanks to everyone for sharing their experiences.  Since doctors don't seem to know what to tell us, having these shared experiences is invaluable.  So, after perusing these posts going back to 2008 over the last few weeks, I will SHARE my experiences, which are similar and different to many here.  I will also try to SUMMARIZE some of the important information I've learned from the posts and other sources, and some things that seem to help (not just me, but what I've read).  I am trying to include as much as I can remember so that people don’t have to read through so many posts (this is nice to do, and I recommend it—the comradery here is amazing, but sometimes folks are desperate and they want answers/suggestions/information fast).  However, I know I won’t have everything here, so folks should post updates/corrections/suggestions and maybe we can keep a running tally of all this invaluable information for future folks that find this site.  I will make a long post COMING ASAP with all of the information I have collected; I will repeat this post, too.

In the meantime, I would like to ASK the good folks here a question, which I will do first:

QUESTION
I am on day 33 and I am doing much, much better (I was on a low dose, about 100 mg/day for about 5 years and I quit cold turkey; I am a 38 yr. old male).  A major symptom for me has been the anxiety.  It seems that after I do certain activities, my heart pounds and skips some beats: exercise (at first just a short walk would trigger it, but now more, like a long walk and an hour of shoveling), after I eat (especially overeating, which has been great since the first two weeks I lost my appetite and lost weight), and other things that are supposed to make me feel good, like a hot shower.  I am wondering if anyone else has had this experience?  I think my body is fine: I had an EKG, blood work, and a thyroid exam—everything was good.  The doctor thinks I am depressed/anxious for other reasons and prescribed me Atenolol and Zoloft.  Atenolol is a beta-blocker (usually used for high blood pressure, which I don’t have) and Zoloft is an SSRI.  It has been almost 2 weeks since I saw the doctor, but I haven’t taken either of the drugs.  I don’t want to take the Zoloft, because I don’t want another SSRI.  The Atenolol seems ok temporarily, but at this point, I don’t want to take anything!

Does anyone else experience these symptoms—hard pounding heart (not necessarily fast) and skipping some beats, mainly after certain activities such as exercise, eating, hot shower…?  Also, I noticed that after a fast walk, my pulse is about 100, which is fine.  But it takes hours for it to slowly and gradually come back to normal, which is 60-70 bpm for me.  Granted, things have been getting better, but I am a little worried because 33 days seems like a long time.  I still feel “funny” at certain times of the day, and some days are worst than others.  I’m sure I am still having withdrawal symptoms, but I am wondering how long these anxiety-like symptoms might last…maybe I have other issues?

(As I will discuss in an upcoming post were I will try to summarize a ton of stuff, I know Tramadol affects norepinephrine, serotonin, dopamine, and endorphins.  Does anyone know if the pounding and skipping heart beat, mainly after "feel good" activities, such as walking, eating, shower, etc...could be due to the havoc that was caused by the Tramadol?)

Thanks EVERYBODY for all your posts,
AJ

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by DamTram, Jan 22, 2012
Welcome, AJ!  I remember wanting to collect everything helpful to me and type it all up...last January. =)  That will be VERY helpful to any newcomers.

Congratulations on your freedom!  I can't wait to hear your story.  33 days is a great place to be.

In answer to your question(s):
1) Emily refers to re-noticing that she HAD a heart-beat.  You were desensitized from your own heartbeat for 5 years, so I would put a LOT of money down on the probability that you are having a psychological reaction to a physical sensation.  For example, when we are in danger, our heartbeat will increase in rate and intensity BEFORE our brain CONSCIOUSLY is aware of danger.  But you, like many of us, who hasn't had the physiological input of DANGER for 5 years, is now recognizing any heartbeat more intense or rapid than resting heart rate as ANXIETY.  So, if you could somehow recognize this...and not have a psychological anxiety reaction to the feeling of your heartbeat/rate, I think you'll be able to self-regulate and calm yourself (and your heart rate) faster.  100 is a perfectly normal heart rate for a fast walk.

2) To HELP with your heart rate, the answer is: MAGNESIUM, in powder form, put into water.  When I first started exercising after starting the magnesium (but when I was still on Tram), I COULDN'T get my heart rate up to 100!  At first I was worried, but then I realized that it was the magnesium.  I take it at night now, a bit before bed, and it keeps me calm throughout the day (aside from the fact that I've just tapered off Klonopin, which I've been on from months...so I still sometimes feel like someone is squeezing my sternum).

I hope those 2 answers help.  It's been pretty quiet here, lately, but hopefully someone (Legal, I'm looking at you!) will come in with some good advice.  I think you're doing the right thing by waiting to take those medications...it sounds like they were prescribed as shots in the dark that will be helpful if your symptoms go away, but I'm glad you are waiting to see, first.

Best of luck and, again, welcome!

I have finally finished my Klonopin taper (I think)...tonight will be the first night of 0!  I'm also past my first 24 hours as a NON-SMOKER.  I relapsed on cigarettes because of medications, so now I am finally free to quit.  It feels great.

AND I finally met my goal of running for 30 minutes; 21 without stopping!  

Thanks for keeping me going, ya'll.  All my love.

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by mikatr, Jan 22, 2012
Hi everyone, I wanted to say thank you for the wonderful support.  I went to see a psychiatrist a week ago, yes thats how evil tramadol is.  He said that all that I am feeling is ALL withdrawels from Lyrica, Cymbalta and Tramadol so would like to encourage AJ and others out there that I felt alot of what you are feeling including the heart things (you can read my past posts for all the things I experienced).   I went off too fast and went off to much at once, never had the Drs tell me to go slower.  What he has done for me may be helpful for some of you. He put me on a temporary antihistamine which I can take 1-3 of every 6 hours.  It has helped tremendously even though the most I have taken is 1 every 6 hrs.  He also put me on a temporary blood pressure medicine as my blood pressure is high.  The recommendations of Magnesium was also something he put me on, 2000mg per day and Gava which is a natural seratonin builder.   I could feel a difference right away although am still feeling alot of the withdrawels, am so exhausted and am going back and forth with depression and really being angry right now.  Be encouraged out there that it will go away.  I still don't have it all in my head and in my body that I will get all better because it was so recent and so scary but I am beginning to see the light at the end of the tunnel.  Blessings.

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by legaljunky, Jan 23, 2012
I've been away for 4 days and I see we have a new warrior in our ranks, welcome AJ!

I was traveling with artist friends and was very apprehensive about whether it was gonna be too much for me. I was not sure I was gonna be able to hold my own in conversations, I don't always feel the whole me is back.  I did have a couple hours when I just couldn't talk, I think I was tired, and I don't think anyone noticed- everyone was talking so much!  It was wonderful and my self confidence is building!

Strength and love!

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by mikatr, Jan 23, 2012
legaljunky....I can so relate!  hang in there.


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by jessica038587, Jan 23, 2012
I just joined this room because I have an addiction to Tramadol and it's ruining me. I have explained my own story about this medication and how I was taking almost 175 mgs a day. I have went from 90 a month to 30. I'm trying one day at a time and I'm very grateful to have found this room because it's dedicated to just this. Hello everyone and congratulations on all the successes from most of you. I need to know how you all did this. I've been on Tramadol for 6 years and 1 month. Any help will be greatly appreciated. I really need.
Thank you so much!

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by Sarabie, Jan 24, 2012
Hey Jessica and welcome :-)

Well all of us have individual stories and ways we quit. Some go cold turkey and others a slow taper. I was on tram for five years and ended up taking 24 pills a day (50 mg each). I tapered for five days and went cold turkey. I was sick like I had the flue for a couple of days and had serious moodswings, but I was so aware of this being my chance to start over, that I was mostly happy during these days. But it's more common to be depressed than happy as your brain doesn't get the serotonin it's used to get. I was very weak for 3-4 weeks afterwards. I could only do one thing a day for about two weeks. Oh and I had a huge craving for sex, sugar and to talk about my CT.

Whatever you choose, use the forum as much as needed. We are all experts on the subject and know what you are going through :-)

Love Susie

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by DamTram, Jan 25, 2012
Jessica,

Welcome!  Good for you for making the decision to live life without this medication.  When you decide to clean out your closet, it makes a mess all over the room or hallway before it will be neat and organized.  Yes, getting off of this is difficult and painful.  Life afterwards, though, is one with much less pain and much more control and peace.

Like Susie said, we all came off of it differently.  I was on high doses, as well, but went cold turkey immediately.  I was only on it for a month, this time, but for 5 months last year.  My withdrawal this time was much less horrible and long than last time.  Withdrawal is different for everyone, but I think that we can say that the length of time on the drug trumps the doses you were on...and this varies by your age, activity level, body fat percentage, etc. etc. etc.  But we ALL felt like we were dying those first few days.  What is very, very important, though, is that someone else is with you/can check on you.  Some people end up needing to go to the hospital, but most don't.  We probably all FELT like we needed to go to the hospital, so that's why it's important to have someone else helping/watching you through this to help make decisions when you're not a) sure if you're getting worse or better or b) cannot think or act for yourself.  I live alone, so my mother came to check on me every day.  When I withdrew last year, she lived too far and I was expected to call every 1 or 2 hours during those first 4 days.  After Day 2, there should be a general trend of what I call "undying".  You start to feel like you're dying a little bit less.  Some people get worse, and these are the people that should and do end up seeking medical attention.  

Did you want advice about what to stock up on/what helped with withdrawal symptoms?  I think we can't, legally, give advice on how to taper or get off.  But we can tell you what helped us.

You should be excited and hopeful about your new life after Tramadol.  You should also get ready to be REALLY ANGRY that you're in this situation.  Anger will help you get through the early days and then begin to EXERCISE, which will help you to get this out of your system faster and to help with the things that withdrawal will take away (i.e. sleep, energy, mood, and focus).  Tramadol made us weak, and exercise helps to make us strong, again.  Even if it's just walking around the block, at first.  I didn't do this last time, and I can see why I relapsed.  I never truly took my power or strength back.  Now I am.  Last night, I ran for 33 minutes!  I've also FINALLY, successfully tapered off of Klonopin.  That was a monkey on my back for more than 6 months.  So, get psyched up to take your power back!

Let us know what specific advice you need! =)

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by denised1982, Jan 26, 2012
hey all..
It's been 55 days clean from tramahell. It was hard as hell for me, I was on at least 600 mgs per day. I quit cold turkey. It was my life, it was all I thought about. As soon as I woke up, I popped 4, two hours later, I'd pop 4 more and went to work, popped 4 at a time once or twice per night, sometimes more. When I ran out, I had crying fits, insomnia, brain zaps, fatigue, nausea, diarrhea, restless leg syndrome, suicidal ideations. It was hell. The depression and brain zaps were the worst part. Everyone always could tell when I ran out. I was a mess. I am glad to not be on this drug anymore. I am not perfect, I have done many different drugs in my time, and I never thought that something as stupid as tramadol would be the thing that gave me the worst withdrawals in my life. This sh*t will eff you up. It's been 55 days, and I can say I have come a long way, and I don't want to go back. I wish I still had the energy that I had when I was popping all those damn things, but I can't, and I just have to accept that. When I came off tramadol, I had a lot of help by going to the doctor. I told him I was addicted to tramadol, and I was almost out, and I don't want to take it anymore, I told him I would get them off the internet because I was in pain, and I would go through a bottle of 180 tablets in about 2 weeks. I told him that I was depressed and I was put on antidepressants. I took the rest of my tramadol and started on a low dose of antidepressants at the same time until I took the rest of my tramadol. When I ran out, I had less withdrawals, the antidepressants helped, but I still sneezed a lot, had rebound pain and had GI issues. I was also put on trazodone for sleep, sometimes it worked, sometimes it didn't. The first couple of days I had periodic brain zaps, but not as bad as when I ran out and had nothing. From my experience, the antidepressants helped out a lot, but there are other supplements that will help, too. GABA helps, amino acids, multivitamins, valerian root, controlled breathing and meditation, peppermint tea, all kinds of things. I do controlled breathing, stretching, antidepressants. Everyone has there way, you just have to find what's right for you. I don't know if the antidepressants are working out for me. I haven't taken them in four days because of the GI issues it comes with.. So.. DamTram, Fightorfight, anyone else, any suggestions? Oh, I've been relying on Benedryl for sleep now that I'm 55 days out. If you're just coming off tramadol the benedryl makes your pain and restless leg syndrome worse. So, be careful.
<3 always,
Denise

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by DamTram, Jan 27, 2012
Denise,

Get off the benadryl!!  No wonder you're in pain!  I took it for 5 months, once; my fibro pain lessened sooooo much when I stopped taking it.  Antihistamines are NOT good for your joints and muscles.  OUCH!

I wish you could see a psychiatrist so you could get the right antidepressant for you.  Your GP only knows so much.  But I promise the Benadryl is making your depression even worse.  I tore up and threw away the additive-free cigs last night, so you can throw out that benadryl!  Listen to the insomnia book man! :). And find a pdoc!

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by denised1982, Jan 27, 2012
I dunno if I even wanna go to a psych they kill more people than gp

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by DamTram, Jan 28, 2012
Psychiatrists kill people?  People kill themselves.  People that are already feeling suicidal end up at the psych more often than the gp.  We call that selection bias.

I hope that you decide to get the help you need, or at least stop taking the medicine that is most likely making you feel this way.

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by denised1982, Jan 29, 2012
I'm not even sure if that is true its the meds that psychs put on people like seroquel and all that other crap that causes death.. trazodone... I read it on mercola.com but i'm not so sure if dr. mercola isn't a quack or not. never been to the guy, i sent you that article on the peak 8 exercises DamTram.. So... I just don't know what to believe anymore.

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by DamTram, Jan 29, 2012
My psychiatrist saved my life.  That's all I can say.

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by denised1982, Jan 30, 2012
Yeah.. I believe that.... In my family members case and my friends case yes, psychiatrists saved their lives.

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by denised1982, Jan 30, 2012
I'm feeling the 60 day PAWS... I hate tramadol.

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by legaljunky, Jan 30, 2012
I'm beyond Tramadol and Tramadol WD and my ordinary life is so good!  We had a houseful of guests for 5 days and I was able to manage and enjoy it!  
The 2 years I was on Tram I didn't recognize how it was changing me. Then taper and WD became a full time occupation as I clawed my way out of Tramahell and into the peace of mind I live with today.

Emily and all of you on this forum have given me back my life

Love and strength!

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by DamTram, Jan 30, 2012
Yay, I'm glad you've debunked the psychiatrist theory, Denise!  I hope you got some sleep.

Congrats, Legal!  Keep enjoying life!

I have the flu.

Fight on!

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by brighterdays, Jan 30, 2012
Have just found this blog...weaning off tramadol...on since 11/2010  post bilateral knee replacement.  Most I ever took was 50mg. in am and 25-50mg in pm.  Am now taking 25 mg 2x daily and having great difficulty sleeping and HORRIBLE nausea and hyper-peristalsis with loose stools from about 5AM to 4-5PM  All of a sudden in the evening I will feel fine and be able to eat a little.  I try to take the tram doses 12hrs apart , so I don't understand why my symptoms are so bad during the day.  I am responsible for the care of my two 87 year old parents, one with Alzheimer's, so I can't keep lying around in bed trying  not to throw up, and I'm weak and unfocused when I am like this.  I know my dose was small, but I only weigh 94#  ( and dropping)   Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.    I have never had a problem like this with a med and I'm a medical professional and think the doctors are tossing this stuff around WAY too cavalierly.    Thanks    

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by denised1982, Jan 31, 2012
I am def feeling anxious and I want something to calm me down. I feel like I need some tramadol or something but I don't know about going through all that again. I feel like I am about to lose all control and I feel like I just can't breathe. I wish I was no longer here so I don't have to deal with this bs that I have done to myself. I don't even feel like looking at anyone at work, let alone speak to them. I dont know what to do anymore. I am depressed and feel like bawling my eyes out, but with the celexa that they put me on, I can't. I just want to put an end to all this ****. I hate the way I feel. I go to the therapist later. I want to die and I need a fukkin break.

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by legaljunky, Jan 31, 2012
Denise-
I remember when I was hurting so much with depression (and the physical pain that went with it) that I wanted to be dead and it didn't help to tell me "this too shall pass" because it hurt too much right now and I wanted to end it.  I'm so glad I didn't do myself in because it would have been a permanent solution to a temporary problem.  Please just keep putting 1 foot in front of the other, stop thinking, and I know how hard that is but don't give up.
My depression was due to Lyme disease. I had a nephew who committed suicide in Lyme depression.  I just wish I could have known what he was going thru and could have talked to him- I think of him so often.

Welcome, Brighterdays!
When I found this life saving forum I read thru pages and pages of posts and found other peoples' solutions to what I was going thru and did what they did. I too was on a low dose of Tramadevil for 2 years.  When my Dr. took me off it I found I was addicted, went back on it and began a slow taper.  It was hell but I got thru it thanks to these wonderful people on the forum.
Fight like you've never fought before!  Life is such a waste while you're with the Tramadevil

Love, strength and perseverance!

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by brighterdays, Jan 31, 2012
Denise,  Hang in there and talk to your therapist about what you just said.  Also, how long have you been working nights?   I did 7P-7A since the mid 90's, and that alone can really screw you up because it fools with your circadian rhythm.  Between side effects of withdrawal and sleep deprivation, it makes ANY challenge to your body  more difficult.  ( also, more prone to depression).   You've come a LONG way so far.....you can do it!

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by Japheth, Jan 31, 2012
Hi Denise,

I hear you.  

I'm only 6 days into recovery from a ~16 Tram-a-day addiction that I've been carrying for the last couple years, and the depression is really eating me up.  I see that you've been clean for months, and that really scares me, as I'm more concerned with managing my depression *after* I finish this damn detox, and you're still struggling with yours.  

You mentioned that you are taking Celexa, can I ask why that particular drug?  The reason why I'd like to know is because I'm operating under the theory that I abused Tramadol for so long because it helped intensely with my depression, and part of my program for stopping this madness is by getting an anti-depressant that works for me.  

I know everyone is different, but from what I've read (wikipedia, others) the anti-depressants that most closely mimic Tramadol are the SNRI class of drugs, since both they and the Tram both effect the brain chemistry in a similar way.  I'm going into to see a therapist tomorrow, and I'm going to explain to him about my research.  I hoping beyond hope that I can find some way to correct the possible imbalances in my brain without resorting to substance abuse, but I'm terrified that I may just have to accept the fact that I will never be happy (I was never happy before taking any drugs at all, not even as a kid).

I just don't want to live my life unable to enjoy the simple things that normals take for granted, and carrying on a relationship when I'm this way is simply cruel.  In fact, I just ended a three year relationship not long ago because I could see where it was going - her basically taking care of and enabling me to go on being an unproductive, miserable *******, while she stagnated and missed opportunities because of my condition.

Anyway, it does help to see that you are struggling and still clean after 60 days.  If you can do it, then so can I.  I'll just keep repeating that for a little while if you don't mind =)

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by brighterdays, Jan 31, 2012
legaljunky,

What helped you the most with GE issues?   I see a GE doc Feb 1st but feel he'll focus on  GE issues that were from a while back( NSAID use with knee issues ....resulting in gastritis) and I don't know if he will really have much of an idea about the WD issue...that's what can happen with "specialists"   Feeling GREAT so far today, and have NO idea what I did differently !!!

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by legaljunky, Jan 31, 2012
Brighterdays-  GI issues? I hope so!
I hardly know where to start, but here goes- Probably the best thing you could do would be to go back in the thread to Sept 9, '11.  That's about when I came onto the forum after I had tapered to 0 Trams.  I threw up once, had diarea for a while and had a lot of tummy aches.  I ate only things that were easy on my tummy like chicken soup and custard. I drank peppermint tea with honey and cayenne in it, I think that as for tummy and other things too because I had flu symptoms (Tramaflu) and I know the cayenne soothes my throat.(It's a natural antibiotic.) When my symptoms spiked I made the tea, took 600 mg magnesium (relaxes muscles and does other things too) a sublingual B12 and got on the forum and ranted.  That really helped a lot.

I had GI issues before Tram that must play a part in all this.  Most of my health issues stem from Chronic Lyme Disease that went undiagnosed for 10 years and left damage..  I had been on NSAIDS for arthritis until I developed Lupus Anticoagulent, had to go on Coumadin, off NSAIDS and therefore on Tramadol.  The Lupus went away (all related to Lyme), the Dr. took me off Tram, back on Voltaren.  Throughout all of this (except for immediately after I got off Tram) I have been constipated and now that I've brought all this up, I'll say my constipation is probably worse than it's ever been and I'd love some answers!

I hope the really knowledgeable warriors will respond to us, some of these people have studied all this in depth and have helped us all so much.
Stick with us, life will get much better after you get thru Tramahell!  Keep posting, we want to be there for you!

Welcome Japheth!  You've come to the right place! There's love and support here!

Love, perseverance and strength



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by Japheth, Jan 31, 2012
I have a question for you guys, and I really apologize if this is in any way offensive to anyone:

Has anyone ever quit a Tramadol addiction for a period of time (months, years), relapsed or decided to take Tram again, and then decide they were better off on the Tram then when they were off it?

I know that's a weird question but to my knowledge, I've never heard tell of anyone who continued to use Tram in an abusive way after having stopped for a time, and were happy with being on the drug.  Plenty of people who started and regretted it, though =)

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by Sarabie, Jan 31, 2012
Hi Japeth and welcome

If you read back in this journal you'll see several people who have been off tram and for different reasons got on them again and - getting off once more. I understand why you worry about the depression. It must be pure hell to be in the dark like that. I got of easy. A five year use and abuse of tram. Peeking at 24 pills a day. Went CT and wasn't depressed even for a day. I realize that's rare, but I really Think you should read the old posts in here. There are lot's of people who were depressed for only a short while, so don't give up :-)

Also a big welcome to you, brighterdays. Even though your dose is so small compared to mine, the problems are the same. I hope you'll keep fighting :-)

Denise I'm so sorry. You'll be in my thoughts!!

Love Susie

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by brighterdays, Jan 31, 2012
Sarabie,

   Thanks for the words of encouragement.....today I have been feeling GREAT all day/ woke up that way and have accomplished a lot  (also was 50 degrees in the mid-west the last day of January so was able to get out for a walk )  Presently taking 25mg every 12 hours. due to go to 25mg a day tomorrow, but am considering going a bit longer until I have a few more good days in a row.   Taking care of my folks, I just can't have those days where I'm knocked down feeling "green" all day.    Just NEVER want to go backward

  

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by brighterdays, Jan 31, 2012
Legaljunkie,

    GE=gastro-enterology so can be used like GI / more used to dealing with the docs than the symptoms.  For your increased constipation:  1) Increase fiber, fruits and veggies as tolerated, or you can try some of the fiber supplements as metamucil or others, also high fiber bars (Walmart has some tasty ones, inexpensive, though they can make one a mite "malodorous")  2 )  lots and lots of water or juices  (caffeine and colas dehydrate you, so watch those, tea can also if it contains caffeine )

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by legaljunky, Jan 31, 2012
Thanks brighterdays, I will make some diet changes.

When I began my taper off Tram I was on 200 mg a day and tapered very slowly, reducing my dose once a week.  I would feel awful for 4 days and then not too bad for 3 days.  When I had been at 40 mg daily for 1 week I stopped taking any Tram and then the WD was awful.  I wonder, if I had continued to taper slowly down from 40 mg, would my WD have been easier?  Who knows.  It really doesn't matter now, I did it and I'm glad!  

Japheth- I've been off Tram long enough to realize how much Tram changed who I was while on Tram for 2 years (on a prescribed dose) and during WD. I slowly got my whole self back and I wouldn't like to lose that again.  If I had to take it again, post surgery or something, I would ask for a different drug, even if it also was addictive. My doctors do not know the truth about how addictive Tram is.

I'm free!  Life after Tram WD is wonderful!







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by denised1982, Feb 01, 2012
Sarabie, japheth, legal junky, brighter days: thank you all for your kind words. I did speak to my therapist because I'm just over hurting physically and emotionally. I have been working nights for six years. I believe the only reason why the doctor put me on celexa is because I used to be on lexapro and that is the closest thing to lexapro and a heck of a lot cheaper. I'm burned out working nights and being an aide. I don't know what I would want to do anymore. I'm stuck here for a lot longer it seems and it truly is sucking the life out of me. On my days off I don't do anything and I used to want to do things but now all I want to do is sleep. I have been numbing out my past from my drugs that I don't know how to change or go back. I wish I knew. I wish for the courage to do so and I'm afraid of doing anything. I'm somewhat fearful of doing positive, negativity is my norm. Has been since I was a child. I know that I am an adult and I shouldn't still have these feelings but I still feel like a kid inside and don't want to face my fears. I don't even want to think about it.

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by denised1982, Feb 01, 2012
Ahhhhhhhhhhh! I was at work and my back and leg was KILLING me and I was in the bathroom and I kept tapping hard on my head saying "this is not real, you're okay, the pain is not real, you have to work, you're okay..." over and over again as I was tapping kind of hard on the top of my skull, under my eyes at the top of my cheek bones, under my chin, on my clavicle on both sides and inside both of my wrists. I took some long, deep breaths and got to work. I forgot about my pain and it went away, after I was hurting all day and all night. The only thing that's bothering me now is just my feet from being on a hard floor with old shoes. Hey, whatever works, right?

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by denised1982, Feb 01, 2012
DamTram--- FEEL BETTER SOON!!!! The love is in Mississippi!

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by denised1982, Feb 02, 2012
Good Morning, everybody... It is so quiet, everyone must be enjoying their tram-free lives. Thank you to everybody for putting up with my pessimistic attitude lately. I don't want to be a "Negative Nancy," but I try to express how I feel and be open, I've grown up not learning how to communicate effectively and I felt like I couldn't express my emotions in an effective manner, I bottled everything inside and suppressed them for so long, and as a result I've become an angry person. I felt like my parents and my siblings would kind of gang up on me and ridicule me a lot, and I learned to not trust them, or a lot of other people, for that matter, and I have always been a loner. I was loved as a child, but emotionally and sometimes physically abused, emotionally abandoned by father. It was like everytime I wanted to get love and attention from him he would push me away, like I got on his nerves. My mother was oblivious to the situation with taking care of 4 kids, and my brother who has special needs. I am the youngest of the family and I wanted to feel loved too. I always wanted to seek my father's approval, and I don't feel that I will ever get that, and truthfully, I gave up. I was an unhappy child and an unhappy adult. I know, I know, who's childhood wasn't messed up? It certainly could have been worse, but when you act out just to get some sort of attention and have your head beaten into a wall or getting your head punched in by your father just to get some attention, it resulted in me having resentment and raw anger in my life. I have had abusive relationships, but my current relationship I'm in is a loving one, and he has a five year old child who seeks my love, attention, and approval, and I give it to him. He doesn't call me mommy, he calls me Denise, but that's fine with me, because he can call me whatever he wants. I love my parents, but I never forgot what happened in the past, and it has caused me to withdraw from my family. I have had depression for well over half of my life, and I am not a stable person, I am an honest person and I try to be a good person. Things like working jobs, I get burned out and quit and get my job back, my last 3 jobs I have quit and came back. I feel like it's hard for me to embark on new adventures, and I am not stupid, I'm afraid to do them. I'm afraid of going to school. What if I fail, what if I succeed? What if I get burned out and lose my passion and waste what little money I have? My brother got all the attention, and he had to and it wasn't his fault. I'm just saying, look at my life, I haven't accomplished much but a drug habit, and he has succeed in having his Masters degree and won a lot of awards and has a fulfilling life. I'm happy for him, and I could do it if I put my mind to it, but I don't know how to even start. I would like to have an interest in something, for starters. I know there is no "job mecca" but I want to do something that I can enjoy for the next 30 years of my life. I want to look forward to waking up and have that zeal and spark, I want to be a positive influence on my step child and be a role model, because it's not about just me anymore. I want to be able to say, "Look at what I did, I worked so hard and it finally paid off and I am so happy and proud of myself." I am so buried in this rut that I don't know what I want in life, because I wanted out of it for so long, so I numbed myself as much as I could. Physical pain probably manifested from my emotional pain and probably from an injury from 10 years back. Plus all the lifting and pulling I do at work doesn't help either. It's hard for me and I am becoming more and more aware of this as I progress in my counseling sessions, and it really makes me think. I still feel alone, like I'm so f*cked up and I didn't realize that I was and still am self-destructing myself. I have a hard time communicating, I can't find the words a lot of times. I can write my feelings better than I can say them. I am forgetful too. I guess it's from working with my Alzheimer's folks, I feel like it can be contagious. I dunno, I'm just putting myself through a lot of emotional stress. I feel like I want to be a kid again, but on my own terms. I don't know why I am even writing this. I hope some folks out there can relate. Maybe that could be a factor in my addiction(s) and I am constantly having these triggers to make me want to use trams again. It's a tough road. I also like as well as I'm used to taking the easy way out. I know life is hard, but I feel like the pressure is always on, and it's not healthy to unwind by being out of it. I love y'all and I'm glad I have the opportunity to write on this forum, and I feel like I really get listened to for once in my life, like my life matters. Thank you all.

Love,
Denise

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by Sarabie, Feb 02, 2012
Dear Denise

Thank you for sharing your story!!! I'm really sorry that you have to deal with so much. Life seems so unfair sometimes. It seems that some folks are going through life without a single problem while others are constantly up to their necks with problems.

I myself had the perfect childhood. I was/am loved very much and I woke up singing with joy every morning. Like your brother I also have a Masters degree. And a bachelor degree actually. I had every opportunity to be one of those people going through life with no problems. But I was prescribed tram and in 5 years I managed to f*ck everything up. So there aren't any garantuees in this world. But I acknowledge that it's easier for me to get over it. Because I have lot's of support. And because I don't have all the "bagage" you have. I deeply hope that your therapist Can help you. You also deserve happiness!!!

Lot's of love to you.

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by denised1982, Feb 03, 2012
Thank you Susie... I know I deserve better but I have to learn how to help myself sometimes. I'm thankful that I'm in a loving relationship and I have my own family with his five year old son, this morning he said "you're my mommy." Joey and I had a HUGE fight last night and I said some words that I shouldn't have said to him and we almost broke up. I told him what little Joey said and I started crying and told him that I was so sorry I said it and I couldn't just walk away from our family. I've been hiding my whole life and do  things in anger or in fear so I have to grow up and accept responsibility.

Love,
Denise

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by denised1982, Feb 04, 2012
So I am camping right now. We went to a waterpark and brought our boat and a bunch of friends rented cabins. It's nice to finally get out of the house and breathe fresh air and were on a big beautiful lake and it's quiet and peaceful and a change of scenery. I'm glad Joey dragged me outta the house and made me go because I am having a great time and the only time I leave the house is to go to work or therapy, mainly. Have a great weekend, everybody!

Love,

Denise

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by denised1982, Feb 06, 2012
wow, is everyone ok? did y'all go to a secret forum that i am not aware of? lol. i just feel all alone :(...
i need to see my ticker...

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by EmilyPost, Feb 06, 2012
(((denised)))

I do know the discussion ebbs and flows around here :D  Nice ticker!

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by legaljunky, Feb 06, 2012
It is strangely silent around here!  Hi Denise!  Hi Emily!

I have just begun reading "Magnificent Mind at Any Age" by Daniel G. Amen, MD.  Another warrior suggested it, I can't remember who.  I'm reading it because I have memory problems from Lyme disease and since Tram I still feel very confused at times, I think when I'm tired. The book suggests I give up my last vice, coffee, or at least cut back.  Another hurdle!  But at least it is something simple that I will be able to do.  

I want to see my ticker too!

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by DamTram, Feb 08, 2012
Hi, Gals and Guy:

I'm just wading through the mud, here; I'm sorry I haven't had time or energy to read or post.  I got the flu, and then ended up in the ER, twice, because silicone from my ear plugs had lodged itself against my right ear drum and I'd lost all hearing in that ear.  The ER docs kept refusing to page an ENT resident, even though they couldn't get it out, and ended up stabbing me in the ear until I bled and cried.  They finally called an ENT, who was able to suck it out, but then I ended up on Vicodin for 4 days for the ear pain.  

I fell very far behind in school and work from being sick and at the hospital last week, and I haven't had time to run since last Wednesday.  This means that I'm not sleeping well, so I'm just extra tired all of the time.  I'm down to ~12.5mg of Seroquel, after already tapering off 2mg's of Klonopin, so natural sleep is harder.  That's why I need to exercise so badly.  My fibro is acting up from being sick, the Vicodin, and not sleeping, so I'm taking 1-2 75mg Lyrica per day just to get through what absolutely has to get done.  I just really need a break.  But it's Week 5 of the quarter, so things only get worse from here.  So, I'm sorry if I don't come around here often enough.  I won't relapse on Tram, ever, no matter how hard things get.  There are other ways to survive.

Sending strength for your personal journey, Denise.  Welcome, our two new fighters.  I wish I was in a position to advise right now, but I don't think that I can answer your questions.  I'm a big proponent of seeing how you feel AFTER withdrawal before choosing to go on an AD.  If you find that you cannot cope with your life, then it's time to see a PSYCHIATRIC professional and discuss options in ADDITION to therapy.  Drugs will NOT be enough to live the life that you want.  I'm so proud of Denise for working through all of the stuff at the root of her sadness, anger, and desire to cover it up.  Let her be a model to all!  And there are people who stay on Tramadol for the rest of their lives, but NOT FOR DEPRESSION.  It's prescribed for Rheumatoid Arthritis, and generally in older individuals.  And from what I've heard from friends whose parents are on it long term, they are not experiencing the ill-effects that we did.  If they did, their rheumatologists would not keep them on it.  

It's a solution for a VERY SPECIFIC disorder, it seems, but for the rest of us...it has, is, or will ruin our lives, bodies, and minds.  Not for good, though.  I like to think of Tramadol withdrawal as electric shock therapy.  It is horrible and painful and hurts our bodies and brains, but we come out more awake and more ready to deal with our lives.  We learn how strong we really are, and learn how to lean on that inner strength to fight our emotional and physical demons instead of using pharmaceuticals to do it.  

I guess I can't help but give advice, even when I'm just barely scraping by.  Other than being exhausted, not able to exercise, and stressed, things are mostly fine.  My Quervain's tendonitis came back, so I can't really use my right hand without pain.  Luckily, I got an appointment with an orthopedist in a few weeks and will hopefully get a cortisone injection.  

Just keep swimming!

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by DamTram, Feb 08, 2012
I would like to believe in 60 day PAWS (even though I'm pretty sure that I don't), and attribute my total exhaustion to that.  >.<

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by denised1982, Feb 10, 2012
Good morning, Tram Warriors!
Well, my therapist isn't going to be available for a few weeks, so I hope I don't go crazy until then. :)

My stomach has been out of sorts the past two days, then again, there is a GI virus going around at work, I'm always the last to catch it and it seems i take the longest to get rid of any sickness. I can tell by the smell of it that there is something wrong, not just your typical runs. I know that sounds putrid, but hey, I'm used to it, sorry if you're not... :)

My hip has been on a pain scale of like 8-10. I don't know what's up with that, but when I asked Joey to rub it he got cussed at and I was crying. When he rubbed my back with the same pressure, it didn't hurt so bad. He was like, are you serious? I was like, screaming, crying, cussing. I'm sure my upstairs neighbors thought I was getting the hell beat out of or something, oh well. I've been limping a lot, lately. The bad pain started the day after I came home camping. There are a whole lot of hills that little Joey and I were running up and down. When I was 18, I injured my back/hip area running on a treadmill, leading me to have a limp for a while. It felt like it did when I first injured it. Ouch. But I'm sure like the first set of X-rays taken, nothing will show up, and I'll get a crazy look from a doc. I've lost my faith in doctors.

I feel like my Celexa hasn't been working quite as well as it did when I first started anti-depressant therapy. It's only been a little over 2 months. I have also dc'd my trazodone, as it gave me crazy side effects.  I wonder if I can get prescribed a very small dose of prozac along with effexor. I have pain everyday, and I'm so not happy about anything, don't want to do anything, hate my life, etc. My depression symptoms are not resolved.

I wish I could just get an energy surge. I'm dying over here. Yes, night shift is killing me, too.

I wanted to badly order some trams because of the hip pain. Then I decided I am not willing to pay for it. Then I tried talking myself into "being able to afford it". It's a scheduled narcotic in this state, so then I decided it isn't worth the risk having the DEA kick my door in. So, I decided to take the pain like a woman.

Still s*cks, still hurts. Still tired, still tired of it. Good times. F*ck.

Love yall.
Seriously.
-Denise



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by denised1982, Feb 10, 2012
{{{{Emily}}}}}

I love you for your sheer genius and beautifulness of starting this forum. It is a vital key in my therapy. I just wanted to thank you, love.



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by peterovski, Feb 11, 2012
Hello I finally found this post after having posted in a much older thread.
So because I wrote down quite the wall of text, I will copy paste. That's a pretty general introduction, I will conclude with how I am doing now. :)

Hi, first off I'm glad I found this website. I am currently at the end of my ropes and I have concidered suicide more often in the last couple of days than I have in my entire depression (Which pretty much started after I quit the my amphetamine habit -> see below) I have been on tramadol for the past year or so.. I have NEVER been completely honest on any site or forum because I was afraid of getting flamed, or being called a weakling or whatnot. The positivity in this blog inspired me to go ahead and post my problems with tramadol aswell as with benzodiazepines. (Though bzps are not the topic, I am addicted to high doses of both so this evidently has an impact on how I will manage the withdrawal)

What began as a pain management quickly became a habit. I have a very addictive personality, and have been addicted to speed for several years. I was able to quit that nasty stuff about a year and a half ago, all by myself. But then again it just wasn't fun anymore. And since there was no physical withdrawal it was quite easy to kick it once the negative effects completely overpowered all good effects one might get from using amphs.

Onto the present. Besides being hooked on a high dose of tramadol, I am currently also physically dependant on benzodiazepines.. And in high doses too.
(10mg xanax mixed with 50mg diazepam is nothing uncommon,  and will only make me a little mellow Not something I do every day but you get the picture.) I also frequently (almost daily) use clonazepam, lorazepam and bromazepam because otherwise I have to take monstrous amounts of one benzo (like 100mg of diazepam to feel anything at all) and that scares me. Self manipulation can be a ***** because i'm basically doing it anyway, just with a cocktail.. :( I am a terribly anxious person and I have severe social phobia aswell as a mild form of GAD.. The addictive personality does not help with the meds used for that.

Now onto the tramadol part, I have a scolliosys of the spine (sp?). Which basically means my back runs in the shape of an S. This leaves me in constant pain in my lower back, neck, shoulders and When I first started tramadol (I acquired some from a friend who didn't use them and had them prescribed for a broken thumb.) They worked extremely well for my back aches aswell as my RLS that I have also developped during my speed habbit.. (It really is a nasty drug, speed that is... Well tramadol too ofcourse. :D  ) So soon after I asked the doctor for a prescription. I told him I took about 200mg per day and that it worked perfectly for my back aches, aswell as helping with my anxiety issues and my depression. The doctor wrote me a script for 2x100mg XR/day.

I currently use about 700mg daily, and I basically feel like **** all the time because I worry alot about all that pill  popping and hurting my family by doing so. On top of that I take (when I'm not so impulsive to take more) 6mg bromazepam, 20mg diazepam and 2,5mg lorazepam. My parents know of this problem and they have me on lockdown, which adds to my depression since I can't go see friends, or even go to the store without them being extremely suspicious. I have free access to my meds, and I can easily acquire any type of benzo (except flunitrazepam) and tramadol at pharmacy prices (legally). Though it's gotten harder recently due to the "nazi regime" at home. ( I know, they're doing it because they care, but atm it's driving me INSANE, I hate it when people are breathing down my neck constantly. )

I plan on going cold turkey tomorrow and I will wait to see what happens. If the w/d's get too bad I might concider going back on and using 400mg/day for about a week. (Though I don't like the idea of going through hell twice; the big acute dosage reduction & then the c/t withdrawal.) I hope I won't have to succumb to that. I reckon the benzos I take will help quite a bit, but I am afraid I will have to take even larger amounts to deal with this. Again, something I will do my very best to avoid. Lately I'm pretty steady on the benzos.. Or atleast that's what I'm telling myself.

I sincerely want to get off this stuff. Aswell as the benzos, but I'm having a really hard time. And at home everyone is telling me to "man up" or that they "dont understand". Well I believe them when they say they don't.

Anyhow I took my last dose (300mg) about 3 hours ago and decided shortly afterwards that it'd be best to get off the tramadol first, then the benzos. Not the other way around as I had initially intended to do. I also decided that a gradual taper wouldn't work due to my impulsive nature and my ability to lie without raising the least bit of suspicion. I don't concider this to be a good trait but o well.

I hope I find the strength to keep away from the little sneaky bastards. I am prepared for the worst and I have a cleared schedule for the upcoming weeks as I just got fired. (Wasn't drug related, I got fired for calling in one too many times.. I was actually on my way to work and got hit by a car, LOL, the bastards..)

I am pretty terrified of what will happen going c/t on such a high dosage. But I will not give in easily. That much is certain.

--

So far so bad, but what could I expect. I have been able to cope, but it hasn't been easy. The benzodiazepines I take help a LITTLE (since im not increasing my dose alot I'm basically not feeling them. Today I took some clonazepam (2mg) instead of diazepam (10).. And 12mg of bromazepam instead of 6

Just noticed I didn't mention that in my initial post, another great habit of mine is smoking ALOT of mj, I live in Belgium where it is soo easy to acquire, and a quick visit to the netherlands takes about an hour and a half. This I have been doing for about 5 years and really didn't cause any problems for me. The **** started when I got involved with speed.

Another bit of my glorious past and present that will eventually need to be dealt with, but now back on to the present.

Im at day 2 without tramadol and the craving is starting to set in. I have aches all over, and chills run down my spine way more often than I'd like. Im experiencing the "hot flashes" that I so often read about but never really understood, well now I do.
My skin is crawling asif I have a bad flue. I'm glad I'm able to relieve some of the anxiousness with my other meds but this is still a mayor pain.

I'm very afraid that it might get worse (days 3-4 are the worst?) and tbh the thought of relapsing already occured to me a few times today. But then this agony will have been for nothing and I really don't want that to happen. Yesterday I took only 6mgs of bromazepam total because I wasn't really feeling withdrawals yet. Which I evidently made up for today by taking 12mgs and 2mg clonazepam. As I stated before benzos have become barely noticable to me and I'm sure a high dose would relieve even more. But I don't want that to escalate even further either so I'm sticking to the lowest dose I feel it takes me to cope..

That's pretty much the latest news.. So time to conclude.

I have alot of respect for people who have done this, and I'm hoping I will have the strength to continue this painful endeavour. Currently my tunnel is pretty dark but I hope with all my heart that the next days will be kind enough show me some light.

Love and respect to all of you. And to those that are going through the same hell as I am, you're not the only one. I'll suffer along side you. ;-)

Peter

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by legaljunky, Feb 11, 2012
Welcome Peter-

You have come to the right place- no judgment, only support and love!  Compared to you I had an extremely easy time of it, I was getting off Tramadevil only.  I was taking 200 mg a day (prescribed) for 2 years and when the Dr. took me off it  I went into horrible WD.  My Dr. was no help, the drug company had told her Tram was rarely addictive. So I found this forum, read pages and pages of posts and decided to go back on it and did a slow taper, using all the suggestions from other Tram warriors for things to help with the agony.  I am also on low doses of Clonozipam, Elavil, Lexapro and now Voltaren, prescribed for the permanent damage Lyme disease did.

I started posting when I got to 0 Tramadevil on. I took my last Tram on 9/10/11.  I remember every time my WD spiked (a few times a day) I took 600 mg Magnesium, a cup of peppermint tea with honey and cayenne, (I learned to like it because it helped my tummy) a sublingual B 12, and got on the forum and posted.  It all helped.  I know there were other things I learned to here, but with memory problems (from Lyme) that's the best I can do right now!

I realize you are dealing with a lot more than I was, so what I have to say may seem trivial to you, just know that I care.
Having beaten Tramadevil, I now know I have the strength to do other things to feel better, like I have eliminated sugar because it causes inflamation on the cellular level, and I'm exercising every day.  I'm limiting caffeine to 2 cups of coffee a day, my favorite thing in the whole world, and drinking lots of water.  I feel happier (I tend toward depression) and my husband says I'm not so grumpy anymore. My life is so good now.

Keep posting and I hope some of the really knowledgeable warriors will show up here with thoughts for you!
You are now in the fight of your life against Tramadevil. Fight like hell and you can defeat it like so many of us warriors have!  Life on this side of Tram is wonderful!

Strength, love and perseverance!

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by legaljunky, Feb 11, 2012
Forgot my ticker!

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by peterovski, Feb 11, 2012
Hello thank you for the swift reply. :)

I regret to say have already given in to make those horrible pains go away, but that doesn't mean my fight ends here. I took 200mg because I litterally thought I could drop down dead at any second. (Well, not really but it damnwell felt like it)
I think I'm gonna keep steady on 200mg for a week and then go again.. Thoughts?

I'm disappointed but I must and I WILL eventually beat this thing, my life needs to get back on track. Urgently.. I was really thinking I could do it. But a 700mg/day habit is no joke, I figured out that much by now. The 200mgs alleviated ALOT of the wds , as expected.. They are still there, but alot less severe.

Also in what increments did you taper down? And how long did you keep up a dose before lowering further?
And what was the dose you eventually tapered down to before quitting?

The upside of this agony I've been through and am going through, it's making me HATE tramadol more than I ever have. And I think that's a good think when getting off it. :)

It didn't work out as planned, which i very much regret.. But what's done is done and can't be helped now. But as I said I'm not giving in to my old habits. By tapering atleast I'm doing something. And it's a pretty mayor dose reduction too. 500mg less than usual. I'm certain I'll be able to keep it up at this much lower intensity of w/d.

I know I'm prolonging my misery, but atleast now I find it tolerable..
I'm still a wreck mentally. I hope I regain some confidence, which I didn't have for so long by doing this. Eventhough it didn't work out as I initially planned,

Thanks legaljunky for your advice. This blog is great and I will most certainly continue to post here. As often as I have to.

Kind regards and again thanks. Some kind words to boost my spirit are definitely something I am most grateful for. Since no one else seems to believe (in) me anymore lately. =(

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by GA_need_help, Feb 11, 2012
Peter,
Persistence with some planning and endurance is going to help both of us overcome.  I am in the battle too.  I am really tired right now (didn't sleep well) so forgive me for being brief.  I understand that the intense pain of withdrawals!  Do not make the mistake of getting discouraged! And I will take that advice too.  I believe that God is going to show me how to make the next decrease, give me a window of time when my physical pain isn't too great. I am sure my pain includes some hyperalgesia and withdrawals too.

I have been tapering off a different drug, a very strong opiate, Opana for over 3 months!! (A while back I asked if it was ok for me to still post here.  Emily, this thread is great.)   I am doing the tapering as quickly as my body will allow.  I must stay encouraged.  I am down from 40 mg Opana ER to 10 mg Opana ER (plus some Opana IRs daily).  I have heard both extremes -- one guy went to tx for just 10 mg Opana ER and had a difficult time --- yet another person said that 10 mgs isn't much at all.  My experience is what I have heard a lot of people say--the lower the dose, the harder it is to decrease.
But, I am going to stay encouraged.  I have an 8 year old daughter, and I am going to get to the other side of this, and be such a stronger mother and woman for this experience!  

Again, don't get discouraged.  I smoked for 10 years and quit! I was an heavy smoker.  I have quit alcohol, xanax, clonazapam and soma -- each of these I was intensely  addicted to.

More to come.
Marie

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by GA_need_help, Feb 11, 2012
As far as what I have done so far, if you want to private message me-- I will be happy to share with you, if you think it will be helpful.  We can't post tapering specifics.  Also, there are some recovery resources I know of that you can access from in your room if you think doing an Anonymous program (AA or NA).  I love, love love my AA group.  It IS frustrating that I still have this remaining issue though.  But, I have info for chats and phone meetings, if you are interested.  

I am going to rent a place called Florida Detox this summer (I believe).  Every Tuesday night the doctor there does a webinar that really explains a lot about addiction.  I pray I am through with Opana by then.  If I am not, I will let the good doctor do a rapid detox on me.  If you can't do this yourself, please, please, please ask your parents to take you to tx -- whether close to your house or anywhere.  Your parents would not be able to carry on without you, no matter if you think so at this time.  Also, read some of the posts from people that have already had victory over their drugs.  You will see how happy  a lot of them are, after through with their drugs.  We will have good lives, I know it.  Please be encouraged.  Also, if you are open-minded, ask God to come and comfort and guide you.  And, use your 6th sense to feel His presence.  You never know, it could work (if you haven't experienced this).  I am really allowing this to happen in my life.  Tapering can make us mentally and emotionally challenged.  We need ALL the help we can get.

Anyway, sending my love to you from outside Atlanta, GA.  I am here for you.  And the other tram warriors are also.

Big hug,
Marie



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by legaljunky, Feb 11, 2012
Hi Peter-

Reading Marie's post reminded me how very difficult it was to get off Tram.  If you read a few pages of posts, you will see that what you are experiencing is what most of us went thru, no matter how much Tram we were taking when we decided to make the attempt to quit.  I made the decision to lower my dose by 40 mg a week (beginning at 200 mg) which gave me 4 days of hell and 3 days of not so bad.  There were weeks when I had to function and for that period I stayed at whatever level I was at  till I could continue my taper.  After 1 week at 40 mg a day I felt so awful, couldn't feel any worse so I stopped taking any at all and never turned back.  From then on I had all the awful physical, and emotional problems that come with Tram WD for most, not all people, including depression, and a sense I didn't know who I was.  We are all different and your experience may be different from mine.  Some have gone cold turkey from high doses and not suffered as much as I did.

I don't know enough to know when we belong in the emergency room,  I've read posts of some warriors having suicidal ideation and others who got into very sick from detoxing off Tram.

And I'm sending you love and a high 5 from New Jersey- It's snowing and so beautiful!



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by gunitbot6, Feb 11, 2012
peter even though you failed your first try , at least you know what to expect next time and you will be more likely to succeed. I'm no doctor but i would recommend you taper a little bit every week, this means cut down 50mg's each week.
Start at 300 mg's (6 pills) a day then the next week 250mg's (5 pills) then 200mg's (4 pills) 150mg's (3 pills)  and finally stop completely. This would be an option that i think would work.  

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by Sarabie, Feb 12, 2012
Hi Peter and welcome :-)

It's a tough journey you've started but it will eventually be worth it. I won't advice you, as we're all so very different, but just tell you that I was on a high dose too. 5 years addiction that ended up in taking 1200 mg a day for almost a year. Had enough one day and tapered from 1200 mg to 0 mg in five days. Then CT. It s*cked big time and I'll never do it again but both my mind and heart was convinced this was my big chance so I was happy during the whole wd period as I kept focus on all the good things I am about to accomplish now where tramadol is out of my life.

You too Can be clean one day. Your journey will be longer than mine as you also have to fight the benzoes, but one fine day...

Stay with us and see this as a chance.



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by fightorfight, Feb 13, 2012
Hey guys and gals,

Its been a while for sure--- I apologize that I haven't been as vocal as I've been in the past.   I suppose I am getting caught up in Life as I know it again, and while its a good place to be, its also harder to make some of the people in my life understand just how much life can take out of you.    The sudden return to cold weather doesn't help much either.

For those reading or coming in, getting free of Tram can be done--- and it may take a few attempts.   As despondent as it can make you, its only that strong a voice for a very little bit of time.    The physical W/Ds are also short lived, but a general malaise can hang around for a while.    Its still worth it, and will always be.  

Stay strong, keep fighting.   Keep thinking.  

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by peterovski, Feb 13, 2012
Hello again and thanks for all the great support and love I'm getting. I'm going to be very brief as I'm REALLY depressed right now. I got kicked out of the house because my mother found out all about my benzo abuse, old speed habit, and huge doses of tramadol. Not to mention that I experiment with hard drugs ever so often.. Yep I'm close to a hopeless case. This drug use goes from cocaine to lsd to ketamine. Another thing I was afraid to mention here actually...

Anyway the only way they will let me back in is if I seek professional help.. Namely they want to send me off to a clinic. I first tried to argue, as I always do initially. But the thought of not being able to go home has caused me to crack under the pressure.

I reupped the dose of tramadol to 400. Which still is a 200mg drop.. The situation at home has caused me to relapse, but inside I'm still motivated. Though my parents would never believe that after all the lies I've told.. Still steady on the benzo dose. Not taking extras.

So if I get admitted to a clinic I will most likely not be able to post, which stings because this blog truely gives me hope..

Love to you all and so sorry that I'm not offering any support to anyone myself. I'm just in too deep at the moment... :(((

Peter

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by Sarabie, Feb 13, 2012
Dear Peter

Being admitted to a clinic could be your big chance to get everything sorted out and your life back on track. At a clinic they'll also deal with the depression and you'll be both tramadol and benzo free. Plus your parents Can see you are trustworthy and willing to quit. I would definately do it if I was you.

Love and support, Susie

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by denised1982, Feb 13, 2012
Peter,

I know how you feel. I have been there. I have done more than my share of hard drugs, I have family members that don't trust me, and I want to cave in a lot of times because I have depression and my thoughts are "Why hurt when you don't have to?"

I am not perfect and I am not on a high horse. I too have an addictive personality. I have more denial, still thinking that "I won't get addicted again, it won't happen to me." It's dangerous to think that way.. Everyone is different and since I have an addictive personality, it was easier for me to just quit. I use the term easier loosely. I would try treatment if I had a benzo habit as well, as I hear it is horrible getting off of them.

I don't believe that you are a hopeless case. I know you're going through hell, and you have to go through hell to see that maybe the drugs aren't worth all the trouble you're going through. I know it *****, believe me, but I believe that deep down inside you, you really do care and that you can pull yourself out of this. You were strong enough to pull yourself out of a speed addiction, you can pull yourself out of this. I know that it's a different type of withdrawal as I quit a 1-2 year daily cocaine habit cold turkey in my early 20's. I did it by myself, too. I figured that if I got through that, then maybe I didn't have that "addictive personality". Drugs can make you believe any bull$hit. I never really knew what withdrawal was until CT off of tramadol. Close to 3 year daily habit 5-700 mg.

I am going through counseling and I am trying to dig up my demons and figure out how to cope with my addictions and my problems as well. I, too, have had suicidal ideations at times and feel like I am not worth saving and I feel like a failure and a piece of sh*t, but I keep one foot in front of another and try to keep fighting another day. It is not easy, but anything that is worth having is not going to be easy, including peace of mind.

I'm telling you if I can do it, you can, too. You are worth saving and you can live a wonderful life. You may be at your worst, but it can only come up from here. Wishing you the best.

Denise



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by legaljunky, Feb 14, 2012
Hi Peter-
You may not think you are supporting us, but you are. You remind me what I went thru and make me so grateful that I'm free and happy. I hope you get into a clinic and stick it out, you are dealing with so much more baggage than I had.  During my taper and WD I had nothing else to deal with, my husband pretty much ignored the whole thing, which made it easy for me to go thru what ever I needed to do.  The support of my beloved warriors made it possible for me to claw my way out of the hole I was living in. So accept the help you are offered for as long as it takes. You will be in my thoughts and prayers, and when you are free you can come back to us. It's tough but so worth the battle.  I remember being so depressed that the fight seemed pointlless but the warriors kept me fused on the goal, even when I didn't believe there really was one.

Fightorfight-  I think it was you who recommended the book "Magnificent Mind at any Age". Thanks so much!  I'm reading it and making dietary changes, exercising, and making other changes suggested in the book.  My Lyme Disease Dr. has other suggestions as well and I'm hoping to improve my short term memory and end the difficulty I have finding nouns. That all came from brain damage of Lyme Disease.  Since Tramadol I still have times when I can't keep up with conversation and I am looking forward to overcoming that too.  Beating Tramadevil has made me feel powerful, like I can hold to decisions and make things happen. So exciting!

Love and support!
Lorraine


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by JULIUS23, Feb 15, 2012
WOW IT HAS BEEN OVER A MONTH SINCE IVE BEEN ON HERE.. HOW IS EVERYBODY???/ I SEE WE HAVE ALOT OF NEW FOLKS WHO ARE IN DA BATTLE FIELD.. KEEP FIGHTING... ITS SO WEIRD BC EVEN AT 120 DAYS CLEAN FROM DIS DRUG I STILL HAVE IRRITABLITY WITH MY BODY N IN SUM WAY I DNT FEEL COMPLETELY NORMAL N I THINK ITS JUS GONNA TAKE A COUPLE MORE MONTHS... I HAVENT TAKEN ANY ANTIDEPRESSANT MEDICINES IN TWO MONTHS OR ATIVAN FOR ANXIETY... I HAVE BEEN TAKING ALOT OF B VITAMINS AND EXERCISING BUT I STILL DNT HAVE THAT ZIP BACK YET BEFORE I STARTED TAKING THIS TRAMA CRAP LOL... OH WELL EVENTUALLY IT WILL COME BACK OR IS IT JUS ALL N MY MIND...ONE THING DAT ***** IS IF U DNT HAVE NUNTHING TO KEEP YOU BUSY THEN IT WILL SUCK EVEN MORE WITH THE (P.A.W.S) SYNDROME... LOVE YILE, GOOD LUCK!!!

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by gunitbot6, Feb 15, 2012
wow julias your at the same place as me, i'm at day 107 and i feel like you, not 100% , but from about a week ago ive been having my good feeling moments, not whole days but moments. the moments where i feel 100% percent. i though by now i would be completely better, but i guess it is going to take another month or two. well good luck and hang in there.

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by TRAMMAN999, Feb 16, 2012
The posts by JULIUS23   &  gunitbot6, above are related to my question/problem !!?
I have relapsed many times - gone through the 'agony' of cold turkey many times. Been on Tramadol for 4 years.  People will recognice me !
Anyway to get to the point I have gone through the c/t and am now at 35 days clean  -  of course, I am very pleased to here  ........     BUT   ......   I still feel rotten  -  I am " shut down ". I am not interested in anything/anybody  -  in fact I would tick all the boxes for 'depression'. I am soooo disappointed because I have suffered and tried so hard. It has passed through my mind that at least I could function in a manner when using Tramadol - (I know this is silly/dangerous thinking !)
People say it gets better  -  but it isn't. How long is this going to go on
Thanks TRAMM

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by denised1982, Feb 16, 2012
TRAMM-- I know what you are going through and I have felt exactly like you. I have contemplated relapsing because I am depressed and a lot slower and not 100 percent, but  there's this little voice that reminds me, "how many more times will you relapse before you decide to quit again? how many more times are you willing to go through withdrawals before you're sick of it all? why don't you just try being clean again, for a while?"

I feel if I went back to taking tramadol, I would be giving up on myself, that I didn't give myself the chance to feel like a normal human being. I have good days, and bad, good moments and bad, but at least I don't have horrible mood swings and going crazy like I did while on the trams.

Yes, your body feels shut down, yes you feel slower, but please, give yourself a chance. You've been on tramadol for 4 years. It's going to take a while to rebuild your brain and get back into the swing of things. Don't be surprised it takes most of the year before you're 100 percent. That is not a fact at all, but don't be surprised, because it all depends on how long you've taken it and how much of it you have taken it. Everybody is different, you may feel better in a few days, you may not. Just be patient with yourself, breathe, and take it one second at a time if you have to.

You may feel like relapsing, but just imagine how good and satisfying it would be to not give in. Imagine how good it would feel to have nothing stand in between you and your mind and body getting better, to know that you're better than a stupid f*cking pill (which you are, by the way!) and you don't need that stupid f*cking pill to function.

It's a hard choice, because if you're anything like me, you are not patient and you love instant gratification. The thing that is stopping me is that I got tired of going through agonizing w/d's and I don't want to go through that again and prolong and ruin what I had going for me, it's not worth it to me. Life s*cks and it's hard enough without having to deal with that problem, in my humble opinion.

I hope everyone is fighting the fight and is at peace with themselves. I love y'all, warriors!
-Denise

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by gunitbot6, Feb 16, 2012
tramman im sorry to say but it can take anywhere from 3-5 months for you to feel 100% percent again, but do expect to see changes at the 3 month mark. just make sure you don't take  a single pill of Tramadol because that will set you back a few weeks, just by taking it once.

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by legaljunky, Feb 16, 2012
Tramman-

Please stay the course, it finally gets better and then what I never expected- It becomes spectacular and I felt triumphant!  I remember the PAWS every 30 days, the depression, and feeling blank, and thinking everything was pointless and still not being able to remember who I used to be.  I think I finally felt like me at around 130 days and I knew I was done with Tram forever. Then came a feeling that getting off Tram was such a huge accomplishment that I was ready to tackle all the other things in my life that I never before had been able to control.  I feel like I can do anything!  My life is finally my own!

Stay strong!

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by Sarabie, Feb 16, 2012
Tramman I'm totally myself again and have been for quite some time. I'm 150 days clean from a 5 year addiction on huge doses. Just keep clean and eventually you'll notice the sunshine. But if you are so depressed that you nothing makes you smile, you should consider professional help.

Love Susie

I have just finished a week long "absolutely no carbs" diet. Managed to get off my beloved cola. The first day with no sugar was almost as bad as the first day without tram. I was dizzy, shivering etc. But SO worth it. Lost 8 lbs in a week and is able to continue life with no sugar coke. Didn't cut coke intirely as I've switched to coke zero. But two cans of zero a day compared to a year ago where it was 6 cans of sugar coke + 24 trams a day. What an improvement. I'm really proud of myself :-)

Hang in there guys and gals. It's worth it!!

Love Susie

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by TRAMMAN999, Feb 17, 2012
Thank you for your kind words of advice and support -  denised1982,   gunitbot6,  legaljunky, and  Sarabiend.
Your words are very encouraging  -  I do have thoughts (obsession) of taking Tram just to relieve these miserable days. I have sort of lost hope of getting any life back. Thoughts that I may have done something irreparable to my mind and body. My back and legs are still aching day and night and I have absolutely no energy. As I said, it's like  " Shut Down " !

Your words of encouragement mean a lot  -  I WILL continue the good fight.
Thank you.        TRAMM  

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by legaljunky, Feb 17, 2012
Tramman- In my last post I forgot about and forgot to mention the physical pain I also had in taper and WD.  They pain will lessen slowly too!  I remember huge amounts of magnesium helped, like 600 mg every few hours when the WD spiked.  Magnesium is a muscle relaxer, and I just learned it will help my brain recover too.  I'm sure other warriors have more
suggestions for you.

Better days are coming!  Stay strong!

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by denised1982, Feb 17, 2012
Sarabie- congrats on your weight loss! I hope that I will get to a point where I feel good enough to give up sugar and lose some of this extra weight I've been carrying on myself! Im happy for you working up the courage to get on with your life and gaining your life back, too!

Well today I have been offered 100 mg tramadol because of my leg and back pain and I said no, because although I wanted to feel pain free and feel good, I don't want to go backwards and I don't want to go through painful withdrawals of that nasty drug again. I stretched for a good while and took a muscle relaxed and took a hot bath with Epsom salts. Not 100 percent better, but even if I did take the trams I would wind up hurting again later. So, I chose to keep my sanity somewhat intact. Yay, me! 77 days ago I would have given in to the tramadevil! Im hard enough on myself without having to worry about relapsing!

I wish everyone love and peace in this battle!

Love,

Denise;)

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by Sarabie, Feb 18, 2012
Denise I'm so proud I have tears in my eyes now. That is fantastic news. Saying no really shows guts!!!! You are SO cool. And of course you'll get to the point where I am. Probably sooner than you think. i just suddenly realized that I'd actually gained 10lbs after my tram stop. Mostly because of the coke cause I've never been a big eater. Quitting tram gave me a huge sugar craving and I kind of used it as an excuse to keep drinking coke and eat cheesecake etc.

Tramman - you are doing great!!! Seriously it took my body at least six weeks to settle. My legs hurt like h*** in that period.

I went out yesterday with friends I've known since first day of School 31 years ago. It was SO fantastic being with them and not one of them mentioned that I had been abusing tram. To them, as well as to myself, it was a bad period of my life, it's over and I'm back :-D we just had so much fun like we always have when we are together.

Love and strenght, Susie

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by gunitbot6, Feb 19, 2012
Great job denise of not giving in, quitting tamadol is a VERY hard thing to do because of the horrible withdrawals and how long they last, i would bet a very small percentage of people that come to this sight succeed. You are one of them so that's a big accomplishment.

Sarabie are you 100% now? im at day 111 and im not there yet.I

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by Sarabie, Feb 19, 2012
Gunibot - I've been 100% for some time now. But even though I was on tram for five years and on very high doses (peeked at 1200 mg a day), I got off without any depression. Had some moodswings during the worst w/d's, but I was and am still, so incredible happy and relieved that I finally had the guts to come clean and quit. I wanted to stop for a long time but couldn't face having to tell anyone about my addiction - was so convinced that people would think mé weak or judge me or whatever. But when I finally found the courage and told the world, it was like a huge burden had been taken off my back and I felt and feel free. It took my body longer than my brain to settle to a life without tram. I realize that I am very lucky. I have lot's of plans for the future, a loving family and many great friends. So now it's like - it was just a bad dream I had to wake up from.

You'll get there as well!!! 110 days is great!!

Love Susie

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by gunitbot6, Feb 20, 2012
this place is dead! lately

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by EmilyPost, Feb 20, 2012
Most places are dead in Feb ... It's just beginning to look like Spring will come again.  It's pretty rare for people to try to quit during this period of time.

Tramman ... you asked ... when will you care again? For me? It was about 65-70 days.  And I was still on Klonopin then also.  So ... just a bit longer.

Peter there's no hopeless cases. Ever.  They just don't exist.  Humans are amazing creatures.  We can and do heal given time and enough chances.

Love you guys!  Stay the course

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by DamTram, Feb 21, 2012
DENISE, I'm so proud of you!!!!  I was so scared reading that sentence, but you DID IT!  Tears in my eyes here, too. :'')

Peter - I have watched enough Intervention to say: GO TO TREATMENT!  We are all on here because our loved ones were not, as you are, recognizing our need for it.  That's why we have helped each. If you have the option: go. You deserve to live the life you've dreamed, and this is the way to make it happen.  Show your family you love them enough to go, AND recognize that you'll be treated for your anxiety issues, too.  It would change your life.  Even your family would be counseled on what's best for you. Win-win-win!  I hope you're already there. :)

Tramman, stay strong.  You've come too far.  Have you considered treatment for depression.  That has helped many on here in their recovery.  I believe in you!

Sarabie, I'm supposed to kick the sugars! Congrats!! Hopefully I'll feel like you and Legal, soon. :)

I am taking 1 lyrica per day, and seroquel or klonopin if absolutely necessary (sleep). It's crunch time for spring quarter, so I can't do the insomnia right now.  I did get down to 0 of both, though! It was a major triumph.  Next: no more taking anything intermittently. Just me and my dang brain and body. And tapering the lyrica.  

I've been feeling crappy and tired and have stopped exercising.  I can't ever finish all my work. I'm not depressed (not sad), but my energy is nil and I'm always falling asleep and having sore throats.  I think the cold weather is exhausting.  Hopefully tomorrow will be a good day.  I'm going to class for a book I didn't read, that's how tired I've been.  When will this pass?

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by gunitbot6, Feb 22, 2012
damtram how many days clean now and is this your first time? The pure exhaustion lasted about 2.5 months for me now after 114 days i still have days where im tired for no reason, that is like the last thing that gets better, to bad because it is high on the list for worst.

Looks like we lost trammann and peter?!

Im 114 days clean and still not 100% Still feeling tired at times, sleep  is weird.



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by DamTram, Feb 22, 2012
My second and a half time.  73 days out.  At least I'm not the only exhausted one this far out!  I'm sorry you are, too, though. :( I don't think I ever fully recovered from my first wd last January, even though I was only on it a month, this time.  I hope to feel fully recovered, eventually!  Stay strong. Do you have insomnia, gunitbot?

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by TRAMMAN999, Feb 23, 2012
TRAMM is still around !        Getting the days behind me. But, they are pretty miserable days. I tell myself  'it is to be expected after all this time living on 'Jet Fuel' as part of my daily nutrition'.At the same time I fill my glass up a little by looking at my Ticker.
Here it is.

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by gunitbot6, Feb 23, 2012
damtram, its weird, i cant fall asleep every Friday and i always wake up in the night at least 2 times. I will be 4 months clean in 5 days! I am hoping i will be 100% better within the next month, but at 2 months i though i would be 100% by the end of 3 months, then at three months i though i would be 100% at the end of 4 months, so my hopes aren't high right now Seriously how f*****g long is this going to take!!!!!!!!!!.

damtram why did you relapse the first time? is it because it was taking so long, and now you are ready and informed on how long this might take?

Tramman what is the worst part of your withdrawals right now?








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by DamTram, Feb 23, 2012
No, my relapse was a very conscious decision to get me through moving across the country with a hurt back.  I saw no other way, given what needed to happen and the state I was in, physically and emotionally.  It was only for a couple of weeks.  The second time was an accident that involved menstruation + dysmennohria (sp) + no NSAIDS allowed + 36 hours of colonoscopy prep + colonoscopy.  I tried to reschedule the procedure to avoid taking tram, but the Gastro said it had to be done immediately.  I thought he would prescribe a few.  He prescribed 30, and the drug convinced me I wouldn't be able to complete the rest of the quarter without it, and I started ordering online.  I was on for about 5 weeks.

I have never relapsed because I thought I wouldn't get better.  I know it will eventually get better, and I refuse to withdraw a third time (I didn't have symptoms when I was only on it 2 weeks), and I don't trust myself to take it ever again without a full relapse.

Is it hard for you to go back to sleep after you wake in the night?

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by TRAMMAN999, Feb 23, 2012
  gunitbot6, You asked   What is the worst part of your withdrawals right now?
If a psychiatrist ran through the check list for depression  -  I would tick all the boxes. I can't get interested in anything. I can't/don't do anything. Best description  =  "Shut Down" !  
I have pain in my back and legs (especially after walking). This is, I guess through lack of exercise  -  my back muscles have become weak. I can stand the pain, but the inability to do things drags me further down.
I don't want yet another pill (antidepressant) . To be honest I don't have much faith in medication helping me. I want my body & mind to get it all together.
This is dangerous,        .........     but I do know that the medication called Tramadol would put me right within 2 hours  -  how difficult is that  !!!!????
I'll go on & on  -  unless, I get to a point that where I think I am unable to recover without medication.
I can do it  -  I can go on  -  the problem is, it greatly affects people around me. And they are unable to understand what's wrong with me. (I look OK !!) And they have seen me go through the horrendous w/d, so now I'm clean why aren't I showing signs of being clean and better now that I am not 'addicted'. This puts a lot more pressure on me.
Because of this I don't really have understanding support    ..........    " that is why I come on this site; to be among people who have (or are) been though the journey and do understand."
Many thanks to all those people who do give me advice and support.


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by gunitbot6, Feb 23, 2012
i'm bored so here's a short list of withdrawals symptoms

mood swings

crying spells

increase sneezing  

insomnia

chills

night sweats

Brain zaps

Resless leg syndrome

Diareah

No appatite

Depression

nausea

headaches

anxiety

Hypotension

seizures

Dizziness

Constipation

Vomiting

Dry Mouth

Fatigue

palpitaions

sore throat

ringing in the ears

nightmares

tinnitus

skin rash

shallow breathing

weak pulse

drowsiness

Hallucinations




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by gunitbot6, Feb 23, 2012
Its ironic the ones that love you bring you down tramman

maybe exercise will make you  feal better, i know its a big task and it doesn't seem like it will work but when your dopamine will go up you will feel better

I know how bad depression is, i was depressed also for a week and it sucked. i hope you feel better soon

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by denised1982, Feb 25, 2012
Tramman... hang in there buddy.. I know it's horrible, and you feel slowed down, but you can get through it..

I have been so sick this past week, it started with a sore throat, then coughing, now I think I have bronchitis, I have rales when I wake up in the morning and intermittently throughout the day, and when I lay down at night. I don't have a fever, probably a bad sinus infection. I am taking mucinex dm and claritin d, but when I cough, nothing seems to come up. Oh well. Can't afford to go to the doctor. Thank God I am on vacation this week, shame I am sick through it, but it's murphy's law.

The other night I watched one of my drunk neighbors hit my car as she was pulling in next to me, I ran up to her and told her she ran into my car, she said "no I didn't" and quickly walked away and hid in her apartment. I had to call the police because she did that, and they took her out in handcuffs and charged her with a DUI. I hated to do that because she could've said "Im sorry and Ill take care of that" and it would have been okay, but she ran off and denied it. Must've been wasted. She's like 62 years old, old enough to know better, and works at the same hospital as my dad works. Crazy. I feel bad, but what can you do? I just got my car out of the shop for body repair and paint a couple of months ago so I was ticked off that she was oblivious to the situation.

Anyways, I'm kind of down and out today. I am hurting, still. This is making me want to drug seek. I'm so tired of the pain in my back, hip and leg, and it starts throbbing, and nothing I do helps it to get better, and no one else (doctor) seems to care. I work at my job lifting and pulling people who aren't alert and oriented at times and sometimes they have full body dementia and they go limp on my a lot and I have to hold them to keep from going to the floor because I know if they go to the floor it will be extremely hard to get them up. I yell for my nurse to get me a wheelchair and it seems like it takes forever for her to retrieve it, and I am using up all of my strength to try to hold this person up to keep them from being on the floor. This does happen quite a bit or when I try to turn them over in the bed to change them they push on the bedrails when they're on their side trying to make it harder to turn, and I am in a slightly awkward position holding them as I am bent over their bed. A lot of people are combative too on my hall. All of these things add up and I feel like I suffer, like it's inadvertently killing me, I'm up all night, I sleep all day, don't eat right, depressed, and hurting. I wish I could find something else I really like, but jobs are sparse here and I have to stay here for a little while. I meant for it to be only a temporary job, but life happens.

This job has affected all aspects of my life, I feel. I used to be social and outgoing, I'm not anymore. This is my social time, here, and when I go to therapy, and when I talk to my fiance and his son. It's hard for me to get the energy to go anywhere, and I get a little anxious about traveling, as sitting in a position too long hurts me, and the bed I'll be sleeping in might hurt me, etc.

I essentially feel trapped here, and I have no life. It's sad.

If I relapse, I relapse. If not, then another day, another dollar.

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by gunitbot6, Feb 25, 2012
denise don't relapse, you will only have to go through this all over again, and the relief will only be temporary. Think why you quit in the first place. Your almost there, you will start to feel better and the depression will lift, work wont seem so hard once your 100%. Im sure you know all this, but the more you remind your self the better. if you take just one pill it will set you back alot. How much money have you saved by being of this drug?

i'm at day 117 and feeling better then day 85. 3 more days and you will be at the three month mark, that's awesome.

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by gunitbot6, Feb 25, 2012
denise don't relapse, you will only have to go through this all over again, and the relief will only be temporary. Think why you quit in the first place. Your almost there, you will start to feel better and the depression will lift, work wont seem so hard once your 100%. Im sure you know all this, but the more you remind your self the better. if you take just one pill it will set you back alot. How much money have you saved by being of this drug? Try excersizing when you are having a bad moment, it will be daunting  until your in it. take a walk or a jog it might make you feel better

i'm at day 117 and feeling better then day 85. 3 more days and you will be at the three month mark, that's awesome.

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by angel187, Feb 26, 2012
Hello.. I am not sure if I am in the right place or not but I just found out my husband has been sneaking Ultram behind my back.  He was involved in a pretty bad car accident almost five years ago leaving his whole right side crushed.. He has had numerous surgeries and been on a slew of pain medications.  He was on Ultram for a while but he had to take more and more of it for him to get the same "relief" So he told me he had quit.. Last July, we were on our way to a wedding and he was driving.. He suffered a seizure.. with the grace of GOD it was as he was approaching a red light so minimal damage to cars.. and we had just exited the highway going 75 MPH.  We get to the hospital and they do all these tests.. all tests come back normal.. Dr. said it was common to suffer a seizure and have it unexplained.  I couldn't let it go. He was prescribed Keppra XR so that he could get his license back.  Lately, I knew something wasn't right.. moody etc.. Well He broke down and told me that he was getting Ultram through two different online pharmacies. *(&&^%^%&^*&& I lost it.  he said he was tired of living like this and that he threw the pills out and is going to do this cold-turkey.  I am so upset because I truly believe the Ultram caused his seizure.  Now I am scared with him stopping cold-turkey it could happen again.  Any advise would be great thank you for sharing your stories.. I have read a lot of them.

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by DamTram, Feb 26, 2012
Welcome, Angel.  Your husband is VERY lucky to have you, as evidenced by your reading through our stories for help/guidance.  With this drug, it doesn't seem that cold-turkey or not has anything to do with whether or not someone relapses.  As you've probably read, even for those that taper down, their withdrawal is often just as terrible as those of us that came down from extremely high doses and went straight to 0.  I don't know when your husband stopped taking them, but you'll know that he really stopped if he's very, very sick.  As you've read, the first 4 days are the worst, and he should begin to see the light around day 7.  After that, life becomes about re-learning how to sleep, exercise, re-build relationships, and find the energy to get through each day.  

Please let us know how we can help.  I know we've all made lists of the things that helped us survive the worst of withdrawal, which I'm sure we could hunt down if you need them.  If your husband has chosen to fight this beast and be clean, then use your anger at him and turn it on the drug and help him fight.  He's going to need it.

DENISE, girl, I feel you.  But I will not take that poison, not ever, ever, ever.  I don't care how much I hurt, how sad I get, how intense my nervous breakdown is (yesterday was a doozy)...that will not be the pill that I turn to, no way, no how.  AND NEITHER WILL YOU.  Gunit is right; you're five million times better than you were 30 days ago, and you'll be five million times better in 30 more days.  One foot at a time.

How are you doin, Gunit?

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by Sarabie, Feb 26, 2012
Welcome Angel. I understand your concern. I'm pretty sure he'll be able to quit without seizures. Anyways, perhaps you should direct him to this place as well? Let him know he's not alone. Lot's of us in here, hid our abuse and lied and f*cked things up for ourselves and people we love. Cause we couldn't think and act straight. I would have loved to know I wasn't the only one going through tram w/d's when I quit. He needs to tell people about his w/d's and even though you obviously love him a lot, he'll need people who knows what hell it is to quit tram. Well just a suggestion. But I think he would benefit from being part of this forum.

Love, Susie

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by angel187, Feb 26, 2012
DamTram & Sarabie... Thank you so much for responding.  He last took medication on Friday.  He took two pills and ditched the rest. He said he was tired of lying to me.  Well I took him to the ER tonight because I literally could not take what he was going through.. He is a 6'4 man.. not a little man by any means.. Well, we get to the ER and there is a wait.  Meanwhile, he looks like he is going to have a heart attack... He is sweating, cold chills, Dry-heaving, Yawning.. etc.. His breathing was labored.. I was just scared thinking he was taking 20 pills a day and then 2 and then nothing.. Well, before they call us back he looks at me and said I need to be completely honest.. Okay my heart sunk to the floor.. I was thinking he was going to tell me he was on something else.  He said he was taking 40 pills a day.. WHAT.. How does this happen?? How did I miss this?? I suck as a wife because I should have known when I saw him throw-up several times (now thinking about it -- it was because of the amount of medication)..

Once anyone knows what the real reason you are in the ER is .. They change their attitude.  We waited for 4 hours and the doc came in and said oh well you look okay.. aaarg.. Really, He just suffered an hour long episode and they didn't see it ..

Took blood work, ekg, urine.. etc.. gave him Ativan  1mg at ER and a script for 5 pills ..We have an appointment on Monday at his primary care to see what we need to do.. So I am saying he is probably 48 hours without meds..

Thank you for listening and taking the time to respond.. xoxoxooox

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by EmilyPost, Feb 27, 2012
Angel the danger with Ultram/Tramadol is that sudden changes in doseage, like going off it and then going back on can cause the seizures.  

If he stopped on Friday, by Monday he might be thru the worst of it.  Maybe. If he tells the MD that he was on 40 pills a day .... you have the problem of him being forever labelled an addict to pills.  Which is an insurance problem.  

The Ativan will probably help.  Did he really get rid of all of the pills? There's no secret backup or drawers full? It's not your fault Sweetheart.  No one can see this coming.




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by EmilyPost, Feb 27, 2012
Of course, since it is Tramadol/Ultram the word "addict" may never come up.  Since they all insist it is not addictive.

The things that helped me the most when I was in  the beginning of withdrawal. Liquids, broths, emergenC and water. Honey ... honey was an amazing tonic.

Baths in Epsom salts.  ESP Lavender scented. Batherapy makes one bu Queen Helene ... if he can soak in a bathtub it helps.  

Just the fact that you now know is helpful.  So you can help him.  

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by Sarabie, Feb 27, 2012
Wow 40 pills a day. That's something... I was on 24 pills a day and that was bad. He must have been in hell the last couple of years. But the thing is... You can't really quit anything unless you re absolutely certain and determined. I'm pretty sure he has been thinking about quitting for a looong time, but knew he had to tell you and couldn't. So one pill led to another and tramadol gives you a feeling and sence that everything is ok. But then you found out and that was probably the Best thing that could happen to him. With you knowing, he doesn't have to worry and I totally understand his reaction. CT now!! I did the same - when the decision was made I just couldn't get off Them fast enough.

But he is going through very bad W/D's now. And it will probably take several weeks before his body gaines strengh again. So - browse through Emilys journals. Read about how the hundreads of us came through and find what's best for him. We are all very different but with All this expert knowledge on these pages there's bound to be something that'll help him. The doctor won't know about the pain, brain zaps etc. He will however be able to give him another drug. So be carefull.

The Best of luck to the both of you!!!

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by legaljunky, Feb 27, 2012
Angel- Welcome!
I don't have to tell you  your husband is in the toughest fight of his life.  My Dr. prescribed Tram for me saying it was not addictive.  2 years later when she took me off it I realized I was in withdrawal.  My symptoms were not as bad as your husband's, I was taking a lower dose.  I figured no Dr. was gonna be able to help me because they refuse to see it as addiction. I found  this forum and got what I needed to get thru withdrawal. Peppermint tea with honey and cayenne helped with the tummy problems and flu symptoms and whenever my withdrawal spiked I took 600 mg magnesium (up to 6 a day) and 1 gram of sublingual B12 and the tea.  Magnesium is a muscle relaxer and helps in other ways too (can't remember what!) So many tram warriors exercised during withdrawal and I think it gets you thru it faster but I just couldn't.  I've only recently started using my exercycle and my strength is back.

My husband knew what I was going thru and kind of just let me go thru it. I was extremely impatient, disrespectful and grumpy and he just took it.  I wasn't capable of being civil to anyone at times in withdrawal.  Of course I always apologized later and I know I put him thru a lot.

But the end result is I finally feel free and for the first time in my life I feel I can make my mind up to do something and actually stick to it- a powerful feeling

I love everyone here who helped me thru this battle I never expected to be faced with.  Emily has given us this wonderful, healing, loving forum.  I don't know where I'd be without it.

You are your husband's angel, not responsible for any of this, he did what so many others did with Tramadevil.  He was blindsided till he couldn't find a way out of what Tram caused.

We are here for you with love and support!



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by angel187, Feb 27, 2012
Thank you all... I just got home from having my husband admitted to the ER for a Medical Detox.  His heart rate was 171 and climbing.  Since had a seizure last year (which I completely believe is from his Ultram use) they said he was at a risk for another one coming off of the meds.  He took his last dose of 2 50 mg pills on Friday Morning.  (Thursday and prior he was taking 40 pills a day).  I literally could not look at him and watch him go through this.  I understand he took the pills but I do not agree with anyone having to go through that hell.. No matter what the issue.  We tried to enroll him in a chemical dependency program but once they saw him they said he needed medical attention.  I am both physically and mentally drained not to mention adding two puppies and two children 5 & 7... But this will pass and I hope today is a new beginning for our family.  I want to thank you all for sharing your stories it really helps me as a loved one understand the depth of destruction of this medication.  I will keep you posted ..

Love,
Angel

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by DamTram, Feb 28, 2012
Angel,
Thank you so much for the update.  I'm so glad your husband is getting the care he needs, and your positive outlook is laudable and inspiring.  I hope now you can take care of yourself and the rest of your family, while your husband is being treated.  We are here for you both!

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by angel187, Feb 28, 2012
I DamTram:
May I ask you a few questions?  
I was told that my husband might be released this weekend.  I know he will be in therapy after that but my concern is that he wants to do the out-patient therapy.  Do I push him to do in-patient therapy?  I don't know what to do.  I really want him to get the help he needs as this medication has really messed him up .. as many others I have read.  I literally want to go after the manufacturer of this medication.  I am furious.  I am sure everyone else has the same frustrations.  He has called me several times today and he sounds a lot better but I am not sure.. I fear I will have this doubt in my for a long time.. ??

Any suggestions to me from anyone would be greatly appreciated .. I want to understand from others who have suffered because of this horrid medication.  

Thank you

Angel

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by noone510, Feb 28, 2012
Hi all, Don't think i'm on this site because i wrote on one on Monday night as i'm on 20mg diazipam a day with which i am trying to withdraw from, i only started last thursday by reducing them by 2.5mg. I have been on these for 12 yr, but i am also on 400mg of tramadol a day of which i did'nt think were doing me any harm, but reading some of these messages and what was in the paper's yesterday i am getting very concerned. I hope i'm not boring anyone but iv had depression for a number of years and even been on Lithium in the past but i'll list the med's i'm on now because i really don't know were to start. I'm on 20mg Diazepam  7.5mg Zopiclone  30mg Mirtazapine  400mg Tramadol  4000mg Paracetamol that are for depression and pain as i have Rheumatoid Arthritis and a year ago had an operation for two slip discs and narrowing of the spine. Other meds are 5mg Bisoprolol  75mg Asprin  10mg Ramipril  40mg Simvastatin and have a Glyceryl Trinitrate spray for a heart attack i had in June 2007. I also have Buccal' s which i sometimes sleep with between my gum and lip if i.v had a bad day and go to bed thinking the worse.I'm on 17mg Methotroxate one a week also for the rheumatoid. I know i hit rock bottom after the christmas period due to many things and had thoughts of suicide etc when a relation got in touch with the mental health and now i'm visited daily by the mental health crisis team

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by noone510, Feb 29, 2012
sorry it' me again as you can see im not very good on the laptop as i could'nt find a way to carry on writing in the same space or figure out how to get back on this site and did'nt give an exact account of what i am on and the real information. Hope some of you can help me as it look's a hellof alot harder than i was assuming, by the way i am a female and don't no how to change my settings. Leaving it for now as i no i'm rambling on about nothting

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by DamTram, Feb 29, 2012
noone - I am going to have to look up most of the medications you're on, but because you are on so many at so high of doses and you want to get off at least one of them, you MUST do this with your doctor.  I don't think that anyone on here can advise you about what to do, given all of the other pharmaceuticals you are working with.  Does the mental health crisis team have any advice for getting off of some of these meds?

Angel - When I first came off, there was no such thing as an inpatient option.  After detox, it sounded like everything was outpatient.  It's intensive, as he would spend most of his time there, but would sleep at home.  I think it should be his decision, but wish you giving him bottom lines.  Does that make sense?

I am feeling crushed by the weight of everything that I need to do in the next two weeks, all of my worries about my family, and all of my physical issues.  I have thought about ordering Tramadol to get through the next two weeks more times in the last few days than I'd like to admit, but I haven't.  That can't be the solution.  But I don't know what is, either.  I had a nervous breakdown at school today, and my mother had to come pick me up because I didn't want to cry on the bus.  I took 1/2 of a Klonopin when I got home, which was a terrible mistake because then I haven't been able to do anything of the work that is crushing down on me because I've been half falling asleep since 1pm.  I hate that Tramadol temporarily solved all of my problems in the past.  I hate that I can't cope on my own.

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by denised1982, Mar 01, 2012
hey everyone,
I have taken some tramadol.. again... but i'm not swallowing gobs and gobs of it like i was at one time. I was in a lot of pain, and I know thats no excuse, but I was taking oxycontin , valium, xanax bars, opana and vicodin before I resulted to taking tramadol again. I called this mental health place yesterday afternoon because as some of you know I am taking celexa. They accept patients who have drug problems and its a walk in clinic and you see a therapist first (my regular therapist stopped working at the place that I was going to ) and then you go see a psychiatrist.  The celexa is not helping me with my pain, and I want to see a psychiatrist to be put on an snri and neurontin. I'm not bad off on tramadol again, I'm not going "crazy" like I once did before I stopped. I'm not even having withdrawals, because I am not taking it everyday like I used to. I hate tramadol, but I'm tired of being in pain in my sacrum and my hip and my left side of my leg throbbing. I've been set back a little bit, but I havent given up on myself totally yet, either. I am trying to be extremely careful because I don't want to go through all the bs again. I'm sorry that I let yall down and Im sorry that I let myself down. I wish that I wouldn't hurt all over again, and I am not not restarting my ticker, because I've only taken it for 2 or 3 days and it was not 'round the clock like I used to take it. I'm just so tired of being in pain. I just want to find a means to an end for this. I can honestly say this, that I dont hurt near as bad as I used to before quitting the first time, which makes me happy. I might go in tomorrow and talk to the therapist and see what we can do to help me. I also would like yall to pray for me, I know I'm not a hopeless case, either. And no, I'm not restarting my tracker!

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by DamTram, Mar 01, 2012
Denise, I'll always hope for the best for you.  You haven't let anyone here down - that's not what we're about.  We'll be here for you when you decide you want off, again.  

My greatest achievement these days is not relapsing.  Every day is a struggle.  The quarter ends on the 21st, so I need to survive 20 more days of panic before I'll feel I'm in the clear.  

I hope you guys and gals are hanging in there.

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by gunitbot6, Mar 02, 2012
denise every body has a breaking point, but i suggest you stop taking the stuff again so you don't build tollerence and so you can finish your withdrawal. Don't do it for any one but your self.

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by Sarabie, Mar 02, 2012
Denise - don't apologize to us. You didn't cheat us. All that aside, I'll say something that I'll probably get slappes for. I actually don't think tram is so bad. If people can control it, only use it for a bad pain once in awhile (like it was probably meant to) there's no harm in it. My first couple of years with tram were great. No abuse, no addiction. But a great pain relieve. As it turned out, I wasn't able to control it in the long run. But there are loads of people who live perfect and healthy lives, taking 50 mg of tram a day. Personally I'll never take another tram. Not because I'm afraid that I'll relapse, cause I won't. But because to me, tram is the symbol of how I managed to f*ck everything up. My job, my friends, my relationship and myself. So no more tramadol to me. You know how dangerous it is. You know what it can do and you know how your family will react if you relapse.  So I'm pretty sure you won't. But if you do, you know where to find us.

Love, Susie

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by denised1982, Mar 02, 2012
Thank you everyone, I kinda relapsed as in a took a couple one day... and then a few days later I took a couple again. I didn't want to go through that whole withdrawal process, but I was hurting very bad where Ibuprofen, Muscle Relaxers, and hot baths wouldn't touch the pain. I wasn't taking it just to take it, I was actually really hurting. It helped but it made me sweat profusely and I got agitated and I used to love the way it made me feel, I don't so much anymore. I feel like I'm going through a manic phase when I'm on it I guess one would say, I get sweaty, uncomfortable, agitated, panicky, speedy kind of clean the house like a mad woman type of deal. I don't know if that's a manic phase or not, but I felt bad like that.

I don't know where my future lies, because I'm probably going to be the type of person who may have to take something for an extended amount of time. I just hurt everyday. If I am lucky enough to take a pain pill and it kill off my pain, I may be pain free for two days.

On a good note, I got married on Monday. I am glad that I found a loving and supportive husband and that he, my stepson and I are a loving family "officially". They are the best things that have ever happened to me, and I am blessed that someone loves me. I never thought that would happen. I've been engaged a total of 3 times. Guess third time's a charm. I just never thought the day would come. I thought I'd be the old lady with 30 cats.

My husband understands the hell I go through and I don't hide anything from him. He is such a wonderful man. He knows how to sympathize and empathize. He knows that if I am in pain, it's very real and very intense and he will do anything for it to stop. That being said, he knows when I just want some pain pills just to get high off of too. So, he can tell when I'm really hurting and when I'm not.  He is a good man and a loving man, and I am lucky to have him in my life. He is not an enabler, he was the reason why I quit trams to begin with, he knew I hurt, but he wanted me off that sh*t too. He has totally supported me through my battle, so I wasn't totally alone (yall are included, too).

Trams have a good side and an evil side, in my opinion. They do help with pain, but, just like all opioids, tolerance can build very quick. They are not meant for anything long term. They turn evil when you have to take 8 at a time to get relief. Then it spirals downward from there. Y'all know how it goes. That's when it turns evil.

I'm glad that when I did decide to take some tram, that it didn't backfire on me with the brain zaps and everything like that. I don't ever want to be full blown taking it all day everyday like I used to, and I'm not. I'm also glad I didn't take 4-10 trams at a time, either. I used the minimum necessary, and I did not order it off the web. I will not be doing that anymore. Ever. My friend had some and offered me a few, because he knows I hurt, we both injured our backs when we were 18 and we're both 29 now.

Anyway, I am doing good, thumbs up here. I got my hands on some neurontin (gabapentin), although I don't have a prescription for it. I took 2 at night or before bed, and it really seems to help with the nerve pain and the throbbing down my leg. Does anyone have any experience with neurontin and is it addictive? Should I steer clear of it only using it when I'm having the nerve pain and not take it all the time? I just want to know if it is addictive, really. That way I will only take it when necessary.

I wish everyone the best in this battle. It can be hell, but the battle can be won.

Love, Denise

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by mgriff, Mar 02, 2012
I need someone to talk to about tramadol and the effects on a person's personality. Can you help me?

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by Sarabie, Mar 02, 2012
Mgriff - of course we'll help you if we can. You just go ahead and ask :-)

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by angel187, Mar 02, 2012
Good evening all..

Well, my husband is due to be released from the hospital tomorrow.  I am terrified.  He sounds great.. and has a positive attitude but my fear will always be will he do this again.???  I do not want to suffocate him.  


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by legaljunky, Mar 03, 2012
Denise-  I'm so happy for you, that you have found love and marriage with an understanding man!
I have been praying for you, I know you are in a really tough spot. Is there anything more that Drs can do for you besides pain meds?  I don't have to tell you Tramadevil is a slippery slope.  I had bunion surgery on both feet during the period I was on Tram and now, off Tram and on Voltaren, my back pain is reduced because I am actually walking differently which affects my back. I pray you find answers.

Mgriff- I don't remember having a personality change on Tram, I was on prescribed 200 mg a day for 2 years.. But when I went off it and into withdrawal, I became someone else- bouts of depression, impatient to the point I was horrid to my husband, times when I felt blank- like I didn't know who I was, couldn't think straight to hold a conversation, and lots more stuff I can't think of right now. The old me finally came back and I was able to function but I didn't feel totally like myself till around day 130 of withdrawal.  Everyone is different, you can see it in reading all the posts.

Angel- I don't know what someone is like after a medical detox but I can't imagine he ever wants to be in the clutches of Tramadevil again. I'm sure he will have after-care and beyond that I don't know if there is anything you can do.  Maybe a 12 step program for you?  My 1st husband was an alcohol/drug addict and I went to Alanon- it was a great support system for me and helped me find my place in my situation.

DamTram- Hang in there!  Life gets just gets better 1 day at a time!

I'm free- just dealing with normal every day goods and bads!  Normal life!

Love to all my warrior buddies!

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by DamTram, Mar 03, 2012
Thank you, Legal!  I don't think that my life gets better one day at a time, but I do believe that the better days come in waves.  I just haven't caught one of those waves in awhile, and have backslid, instead.  After my panic attack, I started taking 1mg Klonopin at night, again.  I've been calmer and am trying to manage my work, and wrote myself a reminder that I don't need chemical substances to succeed in school/life.  Last quarter, Tramadol wrote my papers for me.  This quarter, I have to believe in myself so that I can do it.  This is not the easy path, but I'm hoping that it will make similar paths easier in the future - if I can show myself that I do these things without speedy/numbing Tramadol.  

It helps so much to check in on here.  Congratulations, Denise!  All of my best wishes.

Angel - I would think that couples addiction counseling would help.  He owes you the work it's going to take to re-earn your trust.  Is that an option?

mgriff - Tramadol totally changed my personality, yes.  I would isolate myself and not push myself to socialize.  I just wanted to be alone.  I was also very paranoid, and fragile to conflict or criticism.  I would cry when faced with a difficult situation, but wouldn't have emotions the rest of the time.  I also hated myself and had suicidal ideation.  This was on prescribed doses and, later, on higher doses.  

Fight on, Fighters!

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by gunitbot6, Mar 03, 2012
regarding a persons personality on tramadol, for me it made me very out going as i am a shy person. But my emotions where not there, now that i am of it my smile and laugh feel real.

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by denised1982, Mar 04, 2012
Gunitbot- everyone is different and drs are now coming into light about how bad tram really is. I was going to therapy until she left where she was practicing at and she had never heard of tram. I sought counsellng with her and when she said she wasnt schooled in pharmacology, I just cried, but she did help me to get in with a doctor quickly. I believe it has changed the chemistry in my brain, and my brain is evolving again and that holds a potiential of changing your personality. But that's just me and what I am experiencing. Thank you all for your kindnesses and understanding and prayers. I need them because I'm hanging in there hurting not sleeping AGAIN. No more tramadol and hopefully I will remember this experience and to not repeat my cycle of insanity and addiction.

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by Sarabie, Mar 04, 2012
My personality changed big time. From being very loving, outgoing, patiened, fun etc, I became greedy, unreliable, lazy and just wanted to sit alone with my labtop and cigarettes. Somethings didn't change though. I still shared my last dime if I had to and gave my steaks to the stray cats if possible. I guess some things aren't possible to change. Have seen people in deep hypnosis and it's not possible to make them do stuff that's totally against their personal believes. Guess it's the same with tram. I really didn't like the woman I turned into. And I'm thrilled that I'm back to being me again.

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by gunitbot6, Mar 06, 2012
I am experiencing what i think is p.a.w.s now that i am 127 days clean, i have some night of insomnia, some nights of restless back, and most days of being tired easy. Has any one experienced this at the 4 month mark and came out 100% better at around the 6-12 month mark. Iv'e read that it can take 6-12 months, and some where else i read it can take 1-2 years. Any body have the same experience?  

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by denised1982, Mar 06, 2012
Gunit-- I'm wondering if there's an end in sight too.  

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by legaljunky, Mar 06, 2012
gunitbot-  I remember not feeling great around day 120- tired, flu-like, other minor symptoms, and then at day 130 I finally felt like my before tramadol self.  And I continued to feel better and better.  At this point I am anemic for the first time in my life and I don't know if that could have anything to do with tramadol.  Since beating tramadol I have the feeling I can do anything I set my mind to, I never felt that way before.  I have made the decision to totally give up sugar and I'm sticking to it, never could do that before!  I stay in touch with this forum because I don't want to lose the momentum and  self control I feel. This wonderful forum is so powerful!

Thanks to Emily and all my fellow warriors!

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by TRAMMAN999, Mar 07, 2012
MESSED UP   !!!!  I am angry and ashamed of my weakness. I thought I had it cracked after all these days clean.
I guess I was at about 48 days clean. But, every day was just an existance  -  people on here said it takes time  -  one day at a time and all that ! But I just had to test the water and see if it was Tramadol and nothing other sinister going on.
In short, my wife was away for the week. I took the opportunity to take some Tram (just a couple of days) I did have relief from my rottenness  -  I functioned ! A couple of days became more [see Tracker]. My wife was due back in 3 or 4 days; ample time to get myself clean again. Wasn't that easy  -  like going through c/t again. How naive I was !! Now I am back where I was, only worse  -  I am really " Shut down " and I have to pretend I'm reasonably ok when I'm suffering so much. Takes a lot of acting. Hopefully I will get back where I was, even if I was miserable-depressed-exisiting.
Certainly a hard lesson (for me & others out there - don't do it  -  I mean treat yourself to a couple of days of indulgence).
I won't do it again  -  the few days gain wasn't worth the hellish few days I've had and still more to come, I know.
I (am reading the posts above and I am getting the message that ....   " It takes time " !. For some people harder and longer than others.
I'll just have to stick it out like the many of you have done and keep coming back to this forum  -  where I have always found help and support.
One thing I know (& it's not nice to admit)     .........     I AM AN ADDICT.   -  and that's from a clean living man who has never smoked and doesn't drink.          No Justice !! My ticker & tracker will show that that I am ' back to clean '.

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by gunitbot6, Mar 07, 2012
tramman , i always tell people don't even do it once, i have done that before and  by just doing it one time it sets you back alot, the withdraws come back to being worse then when you where clean at day 48, and stay that way for a while. It basically kills all the neurotransmitters that you built up staying clean.

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by Sarabie, Mar 07, 2012
Also it shows how different we All are. Neither Denise nor Damtram got w/d's after a little tram. So I'm pretty sure it affect our brains on different levels. Probably not depending on dosage but on where we are in our life. Like I had no mental problems after quitting a five year habit. But that doesn't mean I won't get a deep depression if I have to do it over in 10 years from now (which I won't since I'll never allow another tram in my mouth). I'm no Saint though. I do catch myself in yearning for a little tram, when I just can't figure out what to do. Then I have to remind myself that I didn't make any good decisions on tram and that helps.

Keep fighting trammann. We are here for you.

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by Perk7, Mar 07, 2012
I have had a helluva fight with this 'safe' drug over the past ten years.  I am a professional and  known in my community.  and have had this secret addiction for 10 years off and on but now the time has come to quit after my addiction has gotten me in legal trouble manipulating a prescription.  I knew this was coming...I have been off tramadol for a week but after two days of  ct, (last Wednesday)  I had a dental surgery which gave me me oxycodone which I have tried to use sparingly to deal with the withdrawals of tramadol.  I'm using less than 40 mgs since last week 20mg in the a.m. and 20mg in the p.m I was taking 30 to 40 trams per day (yeah I know)   Is this helping me or prlonging the problem?  I only have a couple left and the all ready anxiety sets in....which has been bad enough off the tramadol.  I have no refills and don't want any....Has anybody come completely off pain meds using another one like this?  Tramadol is very evil, that little AD trick they put in there should be disclosed. I also heard of an herb called Kratom, anybody got any opinions about it?

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by Perk7, Mar 07, 2012
By the way I am new here and probably didn't do a good job of introducing myself.  Everywhere on the web I have been leads me here with accolades of great support.  I need all I can get...



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by Sarabie, Mar 07, 2012
Hi Perk and welcome amongst us :-)

Unfortunately I can't help you, cause I did the CT thing - from 24 pills a day. I remember someone talking about kratom, but he is in Afghanistan now. But if you browse through some of the other journals from the last six months, you'll probably find something helpfull.  His name is Beenherebefore and he knew about kratom. I read in the news that oxycontin/oxycodon is being taken off the market. Wish it was tram...

Well I can't help with your questions, but just tell you that you aren't alone. I think there's several of us who have done some nasty lying and perhaps some illegal stuff to get tram. I know I have.

Good luck with your CT and post post post all you need.

Love, Susie

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by DamTram, Mar 07, 2012
I only took 2 and it was only one day, but the sick sweats of wd came back and my sleep was ruined, and I think said she's having trouble sleeping now.  I don't know anyone who has gone back, even for a minute, without payback.  Maybe it's time for another layer of support, TramMan?

It's not that 'this' isn't getting better.  It's that each of us had depressive or anxious tendencies, and/or chronic pain, and/or chronic fatigue BEFORE tramadol, and now we are left to deal with all those feelings/pain/exhaustion.  No, they aren't going to go away if we don't work on them.  Yes, we will always have to work harder than others.  We may have to sleep more and eat less sugar, exercise more often and less intensely.  

But, no, even after 120 days, 'this' won't just get better.  Feeling good takes work, and that work has to come from us.  Only belief in your strength of self will get you through the work that will make 'this' better.  

After those first weeks of withdrawal, we are each left with the self we had before.  It's up to is to decide if we are going to fight for our well-being, for better ones, or if we are going to wait and hope that they'll one day just happen.

So, fight.  Every single day.  Eventually, it doesn't feel like fighting anymore, because it becomes winning.

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by gunitbot6, Mar 07, 2012
128 days clean....p.a.w.s *****

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by Perk7, Mar 08, 2012
Sara Thanks for responding. ..I feel so alone and lost and just your general response helped alot  I dont how to wake up withoit a handful of pills and the mornings suck  I will post later when I feel better  meanwhile I'm  holding  losely  

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by gunitbot6, Mar 08, 2012
any body out there

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by legaljunky, Mar 09, 2012
Yup, we're here!
gunitbot- at 128 days clean you are just about to the point when I thought I felt like me again and I remember that last PAWS.  I continued taking sublingual B12 and magnesium and still do (along with a lot of other stuff for what Lyme disease did to me). I'm still aware that I become more and more emotionally "alive" as time goes on. It's a long hard battle but I have felt like I've won the war against Tramadevil for a long time now.

Welcome Perk7, you've come to the right place!  We're here to listen and try to help you.  I took prescribed 200mg Tramadevil for 2 years and when the Dr took me off it I realized I was addicted,  I went back on it and did a slow taper.  It made me useless a lot of the time and when I got to 0 tram the hard WD hit me.  I wonder if it would have been easier to just quit CT, but what I did worked.  Your story is so different from mine, others will have more info for you.
All I can say is keep posting- It helped me and as there was no one I could talk to about what I was going thru.

I wish all of my warrior compatriots love, strength and perseverance! My life is great on the other side of Tramadevil!

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by DamTram, Mar 09, 2012
Legal, do you still eat fruit?  I've cut out sugar, but I'm still eating fruit.  I'm still very tired. =/

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by legaljunky, Mar 09, 2012
DamTram-
When I say I don't eat sugar I'm referring to cane sugar, corn syrup solids and stuff like that.  I'm now eating more fruit than I ever did before, not fruit juice, and sometimes I use a little honey or a little real maple syrup but not often.  I'm also eating more veggies than I used to. And I still take supplements.
Here's the thing I can only discuss because this is an anonymous forum!  Ever since I started Tram and in recovery I've been very constipated.  So that is another reason this diet change is so good for me- no more constipation.
But now the next problem- I've become anemic, the hematologist told me to take iron pills and they are making me constipated again!  She told me to call if I had a problem and I will on Monday.
I still have days when I'm tired all day, like today, and I guess that has nothing to do with Tram anymore. So everything is  easy compared to the fight against Tramadevil.  I imagine we'll get all our energy back eventually.... right?

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by gunitbot6, Mar 09, 2012
legal u still feal tired, i have a feeling that is just the paws and it is tramadol, because im at day 130 and still tired, so why cant it be tram makin utired if it is me

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by denised1982, Mar 11, 2012
hello everyone.. i've taken a few days off. last week was hell, it was probably a week or so later after i took the tram and we had a cold snap in the weather that i really really was hurting in my legs, deep in the bones, and i took some oxycontin and it still friggin hurt, i wound up having to take like 60 mgs of OC, still hurt, took some aleve, then said screw it, not taking anymore. i think i went through another withdrawal off the tram, because i had a couple of brain zaps, erratic behavior and panic attacks and a nervous breakdown. i also only took my celexa once in that week too, so double whammy. I definitely do regret tramadol again. It does set you back some. I had diarrhea, and malaise, the whole withdrawal bit. I haven't taken any oxycontin in 2 days, i feel fine, no withdrawals, im okay. Weird. Why would I not have withdrawals with oxycontin, and have a whole sh*tload of them when I take a few ultram? Maybe im bass-ackwards. I think I'm close to 100 days. Too bad I tarnished the clean.. oh well... lesson learned.

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by DamTram, Mar 11, 2012
Tramadol is a completely different drug than the opiates.  The only thing they have in common are that opioid receptors get activated - only with tramadol, it's a random, partial activation.  The rest of the drug is mechanically similar to MDMA. So that's why taking oxycontin for a couple of days doesn't send your brain and body (which are now all too familiar with tramadol from past use) into a tailspin.

I'm so glad you're feeling better, Denise.

Gunit - PAWS supposedly ends around 90 days, so you're most likely dealing with something other than tramadol withdrawal.  That's what me and Legal were told.

Legal, thanks!  Maybe I should eat more fruit.  I'm glad the changes in diet have made you more regular!  I feel like it's made me worse, but we will see.  I lost 5 pounds in a month, so I do believe in the negative power of sugar, now.

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by legaljunky, Mar 11, 2012
Hi DamTram-
I'm off sugar for a lot of reasons.  I've been hypoglycemic (pre-diabetic) so I may as well get off sugar before I have to. I tend toward depression, even before Tram, and sugar can cause depression. I have arthritis and sugar causes inflamation on the cellular level so I have less pain off sugar. And with constipation fruit is a no brainer. I lost 35 lbs. in the 2 years I was on Tram and then I think in WD I gained some weight. Now off sugar I think I have lost some- this is a good thing!
During the first days of 0 Tram I had diahrea and threw up once and eventually went back to constipation.

I'm not so sure when PAWS ends, I sure felt like I had a 120 day PAWS and then stopped counting.  Since I still have some very tired days, I'm gonna pay attention and see if there's a 30 day cycle. I think I'm probably older than most people here, 68, and the older you are the longer it takes to recover from most things, right?  Who knows.

All I know is I love this forum, I'm thrilled to be over Tram, and I will stay in touch to keep me away from sugar.

Denised- I'm pulling for you!  You are still stuck in the confused torturous muck.  Fight like hell!  

Love and support!!



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by TRAMMAN999, Mar 12, 2012
Dilemma!!??

I mentioned above that I had tested the water (taken Tram) after 48 days. Eight of those days were hell (as we all know) the other 40 days were spent in misery, pain, depression, constantly sore back, sore legs, ‘ill cold’ every minute despite wearing thick clothing, totally fatigued, and one of the worst effects cold/aching/sore feet every minute all day long (which on feeling them weren’t all that cold (guess, something to do with nerve damage from Tram?)

Yeh, it has been miserable !!

Yeh, I did test the water to see if Tram made a difference. It did. I was able to function and to be honest, I had “ relief “from my every day torture.

I did that for a few days and knew I had to get rid of the Tram quickly before I really got into a downward spiral  -  and we all know what that is like.

" I suffered withdrawal even after a few days "  ......    Very nasty but not like the c/t after large doses for long periods of time.

Now, I’m back to about where I was at after 48 days clean  -  no better  -  no worse.

Reflecting on that 48 days and now being back to all the adjectives I mentioned above I really am losing hope.

The title “ Dilemma “ means I am going to Spain for 2 weeks, where I can get Tramadol over the counter  -  I am thinking of controlling intake of Tramadol to 100mg per day –ONLY– no escalation. I would, of course, have to be extremely strict on myself  -  and I know that is difficult if one is " an addict ". But, I have proved to myself that I can at least function and have some quality of life on 100mg per day.

I have read that Tramadol has been used as an antidepressive. (am I using that to justify the use) ?

I long for “ Quality of life “.

So, this is the Dilemma.



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by ImDONENoMore, Mar 12, 2012
As an addict, we know we can't trust ourselves to only take really small amounts of this drug.  It doesn't work that way - DON'T do it.  And remember everyone, this takes TIME.  I mean a lot of time.  A few months wasn't enough for me, and typically isn't for long term addicts, even at 6 months I still had symptoms that would come and go.

It wasn't until I hit my one year mark did things truly start to turn around for me.  I had to remind myself that I was taking this poison for years and could not expect to be better in a short amount of time.

Trust that time will help because it does.  I continue to wish you all good luck.  Life is so much better without this crap, my problems didn't disappear, but my hope returned.  Hope for the future.  And that was good enough for me.  Good luck everyone!

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by legaljunky, Mar 12, 2012
Hi Tramman-  
I think you already know the answer to your dilemma- Tram is a slippery slope and the only way is down unless you don't take the first step onto the slope.  Quality of life on 100mg a day doesn't last long, the addict in you will quickly pull you to the amount of Tram you were taking when you quit.
Thanks for reminding me of the hell I went thru- I had forgotten how cold my feet and ankles felt, I cut a pair of socks in half and wore the top halfs on top of my socks and shoes!  Great until I got the hot sweats!
The pain, the blahs, depression, feeling blank, inability to hold a conversation, went on a long time- 48 days clean didn't get me where I wanted to be, It took longer.  Quality of life comes at a hefty price- time.  It helped me to post a lot.

I'm hoping you will wait it out!

Sending you love, strength and perseverance!

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by denised1982, Mar 12, 2012
Tramman--

This is for you. I know about the quality of life bit because I am in constant pain more often than not, and it, in turn, is depressing, but with tramadol, the quality of life is short lived, and going back just one time will send you back into withdrawals, your sleep will get killed, your pain will come back and it will feel like you will need more. It really isn't worth it, and it will take days to recover from the horrible pain. You may not feel like you have quality of life without tram, but when you take it for days and then try to quit, the pain that you will feel will really remind you that you really don't  have quality of life, which, in turn, will cause you to take that crap again.

I'm not the smartest person in the world, and I'm not the bravest or the best example of anything, but I know that when it comes to tramadol I need to stay away. Like what DamTram stated, tramadol is mechanically similar to MDMA, and I trully do believe that, because I have taken MDMA before(like I said, I am not the smartest person in the world). You feel GREAT when you're on the drug, because it releases so many chemicals in your brain like dopamine and serotonin, but with the release, there is nothing that is replenishing the chemicals, which, afterwards, gives you days on end of feeling like crap. You hurt, you want to cry, you get upset and depressed easier, that whole bit.

It really does take days on end to feel better. It takes time to rebuild and replenish what's missing from your brain. It's very important to take care of your body, to take in more fruits, vegetables and protein, and make sure your protein is not coming from an overly acid source, such as red meat. Take in a supplement of digestive enzymes, you need that to get the good protein to break down better to get to the neurotransmitters to your brain. You don't have to do this, but you may start to feel better sooner. If it doesnt work, you can always go back. Exercise lightly as tolerated too. Walking, swimming, stretching, yoga etc. Use relaxation techniques so when you are exposed to stress, you learn not to internalize it and cause more pain for you...

You wont feel the biggest difference in the world, but every little bit does help and once you feel better, you will be free and you will have a better quality of life. Maybe you may need to go on an antidepressant for a bit, it may make all the difference in the world, maybe not, it depends on the person.. Just take it easy on yourself, and make small changes at a time so you dont shock your body and put it into overdrive or overkill..

Be good to yourself and take care, because you are responsible for your own health and you need to take extra care of yourself in this hard time. I hope you return to normal and I wish you a speedy recovery. Let us know how you're doing. It is so hard to change, I know. Like I said, if you do try this out, and if it winds up not working, you can always go back to your old ways. Be careful and take care of yourself...

Love,

Denise

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by TRAMMAN999, Mar 12, 2012
Hi  ImDONENoMore, legaljunky, denised1982.

I am just having a quick look before I head to the airport, off to Spain. You people are so kind  -  I can't thank you enough for your advice & support.

I know that you are so right in all you say. I am just suffering so much that I'm looking for anything to help me in this misery.

Maybe the warmer weather will help me in Spain !!??

Whatever, I will be back posting, so expect me back.

You have, of course, really made me think & think again   !!!!!!     ??????

Once again, I am so grateful that somebody, somewhere cares. I am struggling on my own, nobody knows I have this problem. I have totaly isolated.

Off to sunny Spain   !!!     Wish you were here !!!!!     (I'll be in the internet cafe)  .............            TRAMM

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by Sarabie, Mar 12, 2012
Hi Trammann

Have a great trip to Spain!!! I looooove Spain and I really hope the sun, nice people and relaxed atmosphere will help you. Like the others said, please don't buy tram. 48 days isn't a very long time even though it seems to be while in the middle of it all. It took months for my body to be at full strengh again and months untill the pain in my legs disappeared. You are on the right track now so please stay on it. You know how quick our bodies and minds develop resistance, so it would only be weeks before the dosage would increase.

Try and enjoy your holiday. I'm so jealous. I have family in both Malaga and Valencia and I wanna go too. So thanks for reminding me and giving me something to work towards.

Love Susie

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by TRAMMAN999, Mar 12, 2012
Thanks very much for your support Sarabie. Spain is the wrong place to go because one only has to go into a pharmacy and ask for Tramadol  -  6 Euros for 60  -  what a temptation !!!???
I appreciate your advice and "! I know you are right "  -  I just want  ' relief from this misery '.
Hope the sunshine helps !?
I'm flying to Malaga  -  I'll say Hello to your family. Then on to Estepona.  See you there !!!!
Thanks again      ................     TRAMM

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by ImDONENoMore, Mar 12, 2012
Remember tramman, relapse starts LONG before we use again.  I sense you're in that place right now..thinking when you get there you can justify buying the trams because of your pain.  PLEASE find the warm sun, some OTC NON-NARCOTIC pain relievers and perhaps a spa visit while you're away to help with your pain.  You know when you return, if you do take them, you're going to be more miserable than ever.  I PROMISE you with time things will get better.  It can be frustrating because it's almost impossible to tell someone and get them to believe, when they're in the thick of it, that it will get better (believe me I used to be that person).  But keep reading - you'll find a ton of stories here from members who come back to tell us just that.  That they were ready to give up but decided to move forward and run on blind faith for a while.  And they are grateful and relieved that they waited.

Most importantly enjoy the trip.  And stay OUT of those stores where they sell this poison.  Save the money and buy a few things for yourself.  And you'll get to bring home those new purchases too.  You can't do that with the trams.  The only thing you'll bring back from this trip, if you take them, is regret.  DON"T DO IT.  :)

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by gunitbot6, Mar 12, 2012
day 133 p.a.w.s **** this bull ****

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by TRAMMAN999, Mar 13, 2012
ImDONENomore
Just tried to send you a note. Just wanted to say you have made me think over & over again. I know you are right. But, you also know where I am at  -  looking for at least some respite. I'll be posting  -  watch out for me.
Many thanks

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by denised1982, Mar 13, 2012
Tramman, get some good non narcotic painkillers and maybe a muscle relaxant too.  If it doesn't help with the pain of withdrawals, it might help with RLS and sleep.

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by ImDONENoMore, Mar 13, 2012
Yes I do know where you're at - and that's why I'm saying please don't do it.  I don't want you to return home with nothing but regret.  It could be a great vacation and lots of great memories.  You want that right?  I think you do.

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by ullr, Mar 14, 2012
Just wanted to say hello.
I dont miss tramadol (well, sometimes...). Feel as normal as I can.

Have started with another pain killers, though. (not as addictive)
In the beginning, after stopping tramadol, I didnt feel as much pain as i had thought.
Was even thinking i could live without anything. But as time went by pain came back,  in great amount,
and i have to use something to ease it.

Forgot about my tracker update when a year had past, but here it is.




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by ullr, Mar 14, 2012
here it is

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by DamTram, Mar 14, 2012
Hi, Ullr!  Congratulations!  What are you taking for pain?

I'm so proud of the discussion going on and advice being given, here.  Denise, you are EXTREMELY intelligent and your post proves it.  Legal, thank you for sharing and I'm so glad you've found what's working.  ImDONE - Thank you so much for coming back and being real.  You are right, as addicts we are unable to just take a few a day and keep it that way.  TramMan, I hope you have a sober trip so that you can enjoy it and remember it for years to come.  Tram will make those memories blurred and confused.  Best of luck!

You guys should check out the article on Wheat in the Huffington Post, today.  It's killing us, and I've felt so much better without it.

Thinking of all of you.

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by peterovski, Mar 14, 2012
Hey guys & gals.

Sorry I haven't been posting, but I was feeling so depressed lately that I couldn't even be bothered to post here..

I have been completely off tramadol for about 2 weeks now and I must say it's starting to get better. I also took control of my benzo habit, which is down to 1,25mg lorazepam(Ativan)/day, just to be able to get some sleep.
I also quit smoking pot about a week ago, and I must say that's starting to pay off too, as I am regaining some of my energy because of it. Not much, but some.

It's been very hard, both physically and mentally, but I'm glad to say I was able to do all of this by myself. My parents have agreed to let me back in the house aswell which lifted my spirit a little. I'm still not doing alot, I'm trying my best to help out around the house when I feel up for it but to be honest that still hasn't happened very often due to my depression. I don't wanna turn to pills again for this, so I'm trying to manage without.

I also got rid of ALL my pills except for the ones I need to detox to zero (benzos that is, I threw away all my tramadols too ofcourse).
I found this extremely hard to do since they cost me a bunch of money. I threw away over 1000 pills.

The zaps, the crawling skin and hot flashes have all subsided. I do get bad tension headaches but I suppose that's because of my rapid benzo taper. Initially the benzos helped alot, but since I'm not very patient, and I wanted to show my parents results, I quit tramadol while tapering benzos at the same time. Which was quite the pain. I kept a journal where I wrote everything I took down. Without lying to myself or to my family. I'm done lying. :-)

Now my biggest obstacle is staying clean (and not just off tramadol) since all my friends are heavy pot smokers and most of them use harddrugs frequently. So my parents won't let me go see any of them. It's very hard to stay positive while I don't feel ready to work or to finish my studies on top of which I cannot go see any of my friends. Even the ones who are concerned about me and would NEVER drag me back down.

I learned my "best friend" whom I've known for over 14 yrs isn't at all concerned since I haven't heard from him once since I started my detox. When I do talk to him (sometimes he is online on a game we both play) the only things he can talk about are 'lsd' and other drugs. I didn't want to see this because I had known him for so long, but honestly I'm done with that guy. Even his little brother has been more supportive than himself.. Really not what I would've expected but hey.. There are worse things I suppose.

Good luck to everyone who's going through this. This blog really helped me when I needed to hear I wasn't the only one going through this agony.

I wish you all the best and I will post when there are updates. :-)

Love and kinds regards,
Peter

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by legaljunky, Mar 15, 2012
Hi Peter-
  SO HAPPY to see you're back with us.  I hope you have read lots of old posts here, there are so many things you can do to help with the horrors of WD.  Fight like hell!  Tramadevil is the strongest enemy but once you've beaten it, the rewards are so worth it.  I feel stronger in my ability to make tough resolutions and stick to them than I ever have before.

Come home, Tramman!

DamTram- Thanks for the heads-up for the article about wheat. I know it makes me gassy and makes me crave sweets and bread. I've eliminated sugar from my diet which also eliminates a lot of wheat.   Now I'm determined to come up with a recipe for bread made with no wheat flour.

Love, strength, support and perseverance to all my best buddy warriors!

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by DamTram, Mar 15, 2012
Peter,

You are a SURVIVOR!!  I'm sure that I wasn't the only one worrying about you, but I'm so amazed by how far you've come.  You and your family should be so proud of you.

I also found out that my best friend of 15 years turned out to be anything but, just this last December.  I hadn't heard from her much since I told her I was detoxing from tramadol two Decembers ago (she's the one that showed me how to order them online), and then when I moved across the country and was now living only 3 hours from her, she wouldn't return my calls, texts, emails, whatever.  Eventually she took the time to tell me she would NEVER respond for some pretty crazy reasons, and that she didn't want me in her life and was perfectly happy with only her boyfriend of two years being (the one who started pushing pills on her).  Her e-mail made me realize how distorted our minds become on Tramadol, and we have no idea how crazy we sound.  It's sad, but you don't need anyone in your life that isn't going to support the REAL you.  I hope that your parents start to let you make friends with other people and that they see the importance in connection.  Post often, and stay strong!  You are doing amazingly.

Legal - Yea, gluten-free breads are the only ones you could make.  It's frustrating, the whole thing.  But I'm glad there are beginning to be answers to why we feel the way we do, and what to do about it!

Fight on, Fighters.

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by peterovski, Mar 15, 2012
Thank you legaljunky, I have been reading alot here the past few days, and it made me alot more determined to stay off tramadol and continue my benzo-taper as planned.

Perk7, I also used another analgesic painkiller to ease out the initial SNRI withdrawals, and then I quit that. (Not as strong as oxycodone, but still a pretty potent painkiller.)

The name of the drug I used is pentazocine (brand name fortal). I used as little as I could, (50mg 1-2x/day)
I really hated the side effects this pain medication gave me (namely confusion and stupidity), but it eased the withdrawals a lot, in particular the flue-ish symptoms which I suppose are normal when coming off mu-agonists. I say it eased the withdrawals, but it must've prolonged them too, while making them easier to manage. Since I really didn't like how Pentazocine made me feel, I had no problem throwing these out when the worst tramadol w/d symptoms had subsided. (abt. a week ago).

Hang in there everyone, I know I will. :)

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by peterovski, Mar 15, 2012
Woops now I have to double post,

Thanks alot damtram for your message, too bad about your best friend. It really ***** when people who are close to you push you aside, but indeed if they can't be positive you don't need them!!

The number friendly and understanding people I keep finding in this blog continues to amaze me, and I really love everyone here for their support. :)

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by Sarabie, Mar 15, 2012
Peter - I'm so glad you are back with us. Been thinking about you. I'm also really glad that you solved things with your parents. Home is the only place to be while getting off this poison. A big up to you for being two weeks clean. I understand your frustrations about your best friend. But you need to keep in mind that hé hasn't moved on and therefor doesn't think like you. He probably doesn't know what's going on. To him you are still his buddy to whom he can speak about drugs etc. I think he'll come around when he realizes you are serious. Perhaps he won't - but if that's the situation then remember how drugs can become more important than people. Like Damtram said. It really messes with us.

Damtram I'm sorry about your friend too. It sounds like she's the one with issues. Perhaps she'll wake up one day like we did.

I amvery blessed with my friends. I'm 37 years old and I've known some of my best friends since the first day of School 31 years ago. It makes things easier. I posted on my Facebook Wall that I've been abusing tramadol for years. That I had been lying to loads of people, been a selfish b**** and not myself for the last two years. I Got so much support from near and far. And now it's like it never happened. Even though it was a big deal to me, it was just a five minute drama for everyone else and all is forgotten. No one treats me differently than before. I'm still the smart, funny and sweet Susie to them and that means the world to me. I wonder why it scared me to tell...

Well lot's of love and support :-)

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by Icandothis10, Mar 17, 2012
Hi everyone....I'm back.....I'm still in the middle east and still doing well.  Down to 3 a day....I actually feel pretty good....this place *****....but I feel good because for the first time in five years, I am running low on these, and not panicking about it.  Has anyone heard from BeenHere?

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by legaljunky, Mar 17, 2012
Icandothis-
It's so good to hear from you!  I've thought of you often and prayed you were OK.  It sounds like you are doing great- down to 3 poison pills a day !  Congrats!!
As you've probably seen, Been Here hasn't posted for a few weeks.

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by Been_Here_Before, Mar 18, 2012
Hey everyone,

I forgot the email account I used and couldnt find my password to my old username BeenHereBefore. So I started a new one.

I see lcandothis is still around and down to 3 a day, that is awesome.  Its so hard to tackle this problem in a rough spot like that, I know first hand.  I was trying to figure out my old email account the past week to get in touch with you.  I was wondering how you were doing over there.

About my situation..
I finally came back after being over in Afghan for about 7 months.  I posted on here before awhile back.  I tried and tried to taper off this stuff out there but it was so difficult.  The depression just got to me, I had no one there to talk to and I just lived a secret everyday.  I have been overseas for a little over a year, so once I got a job offer to return I took it.  I knew I had to get back here if I was going to successfully tackle this addiction.  It was only a matter of time until something bad happened over there.

My addiction started about a year and a half ago.  A "friend" who is an oxy addict told me about tramadol and how easy it is to order and that it gives the same euphoria as regular opiates.  I had always been a fan of painkillers although never chased them, only took them if I happened to have a prescription.  Well when I tried tram I was hooked.  I couldnt believe the feeling it gave you and how easy it was to access.  I took them purely for recreational use.  

Since then it has been a snowballing problem that just created more problems.  I successfully went CT after the first 3 months I was taking them (while still in the US).  I was taking 12-15 a night.  It sucked but I made it for 3 weeks until I relapsed.  Because of the mind altering effects of the drug it led me to poor decision making.  I took a job overseas that I immediately regretted but had to deal with it for an entire year.  I was able to get tramadol shipped out there so I never had to force a withdrawal which would of been hell.  

As with everyone else, my tolerance level just kept growing and growing.  I have easily taken over 30 a day many many times.  I have never had a seizure, I dont know how I have avoided it, I guess I am a bigger guy so thats why.  I used to be a workout fanatic, I would easily workout 4-5 times a week for the last 10 years.  Over the last year I think I worked out 4 times a week once.  I would take 2-3 months off at a time.  I just sunk into this depression state.  I would go to work and then just come back to my room and sit there completely depressed, no motivation to talk to anyone or do anything.  The drug no longer had a euphoric effect, I was taking them to avoid withdrawals.

So I have been back for about 1.5 weeks.  I start a new job on Monday, and I am trying to find a place to rent/buy.  I have done overseas contracting many times, and when I came home I was always ecstatic.  This time I wasnt, I feel really ashamed of the past year and the person I have become.  I think my family and some friends can tell a difference in me, its not like me to just quit working out like that, to be bummed out all the time and completely unsocial.  Its tough to hide after awhile, it really can get you down if you let it.

It is going to be rough tackling this taper while starting a new job but it is nothing in comparison to starting a new job 7k miles away in the armpit of the world like I already have.  I have already begun to search for substance abuse counselors.  I figure I will let them give me a taper plan and go to sessions with them to help me through it.  I am still around that 20 pill mark.  I also take adderall (prescription) and have managed to score every type of prescription medication to help in the withdrawal process.  However, I had to dispose of it all over there, I didnt want to try and smuggle valium, clonidine, ambien, xanax, etc. through international airports without a valid prescription.  All I did with that stuff is just take it with the tramadol anyways, so I was just getting addicted to more pills instead of eliminating them.

Anyways, its good to be back and this whole situation doesnt seem as severe as it did just a month ago.  Being overseas isnt bad, I have actually enjoyed my previous jobs over there. However this time I regretted the decision the first day I got there, I realized it was not a decision I would have made if I wasnt on Tramadol.  So to live with that regret for a year was so incredibly hard.  I left my GF behind without even telling her until I took the job.  I was a horrible person and there wasnt a day that went by that I didnt think about that.

Ok I am rambling, I apologize for that.  I havent posted in so long there is a lot to let out.  This message board really helped me out while I was there, as did Icandothis.  Knowing someone else is dealing with this while in the Middle East was comforting.

You will all have to deal with some more long, rambling posts from me over the next coming weeks.  :)

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by DamTram, Mar 18, 2012
Welcome Home, Been_Here!

You've made it!  It's so great that you have made recovery an equal priority to finding shelter.  There's something profound in there, I just know it. =)

I remember being around that 20 pill mark, and I'll tell you what you already know: life is SO MUCH BETTER without Tramadol than how you end up feeling (and not feeling) on that high of a dose.  In addition, I was just having a discussion with someone from my first recovery (2 Decembers ago) about the nostalgia we sometimes feel about those first 2 weeks of cold turkey.  I am NOT SAYING that it would EVER be worth it to take Tramadol, again, but the euphoria of having a second chance at life and the returning of your senses (enjoying music, food, literature, etc., again) was an experience worth remembering.  I'm just saying: although acute withdrawal will do lots of ugly things to you, physically, at least you have some aspects to look forward to.  You know, aside from no longer being addicted to pills and regaining control.  I hope no one gets mad at me for saying this.  But I termed Tramadol withdrawal 'the undying' last year, and I'll stand by it.  It hurts, it *****, I never want to go through it again, but there's something to be said for 'meeting' the 'you' that you have lost.  Please keep us updated!  

I think I'm at 100 days.  Let's see!

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by DamTram, Mar 18, 2012
100 dayyyyys!  Hurrayyyyy!

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by Been_Here_Before, Mar 18, 2012
DamTram, I know exactly what your talking about.  When you go through the detox and its about day 5 when you wake up and are 10 times better than day 4.  You still feel like garbage but day 4 was such hell that you are just happy that the worst is over.  I remember each day so vividly (probably because I wasnt on tram which makes you forget everything).

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by gunitbot6, Mar 18, 2012
damn tram how are you , do u have paws? restlessness insomionia feeling tired alot. im at day 139 and my sleep is not right, and i have alot tired days. althogh the last week i think i might be seeing improvements in my energy.

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by peterovski, Mar 19, 2012
God will this agony ever end?? - Reading about how everyone still has so much side effects after like 100 days is making me restless. I'm at day 19 and I'm taking acetaminophen for pain (1000mg/day), and am still on my dose of 1,25mg ativan. Sometimes I take an additional 10mg valium when I feel like the tension headache is going to cause my head to explode. I only have 13 valiums left, and only 2 and a half ativan 2,5mg (I take one half each night).

I'm very afraid of what is to come when I run out of valium & ativan as I don't have any more scripts I can fill and I'm sure my dr. won't prescribe me more pills because of my benzo addiction. I catch myself 'waiting' all day to be able to take my ativan and get some relief.

Tomorrow I have a meeting with addiction care. But I don't want to be submitted to a clinic. I did this twice and I left the next day, twice.. Because I didn't feel like it was a place for me at all, and they basically let me sit in my room all day while not even paying the slightest bit of attention towards my tramadol addiction. I felt I could do this at home too.., they labeled me benzo-pot-harddrug user rather than tramadol user. While I (still) have had no problems quitting pot and the other illegal drugs.. That seems to be their main concern, and the tramadol is hardly even mentioned, only when I bring it up.

I'm going to ask them if there's a possibility for meetings and outside care, but I don't have high hopes for that place to be honest. Every time I went to a place like that I felt like they labeled me as a junkie the first moment I got there, and I couldn't help but feel like they thought 'less' of me as a person. Maybe I'm imagining that, but well I really can't help it. (While I'm struggling so hard to get rid of my bad habits.) Also the company didn't really help - there was no-one even close to my age, all alot older, and all heavy users of drugs like heroin, cocaine, speed. I do not think less of these people because hell, I've been there. (Speed.. And I played around with alot of other drugs. Never touched heroin though thank god.) But it's not really stimulating to see since I haven't been addicted to an illegal substance other than pot for a long time now. (I have still used them on occasion I'll admit, but addction? No.. Not anymore since I quit my chronic use of amphetamines about a yr and a half - maybe two yrs ago.)

I'm constantly walking around the house like a zombie, and it hurts my parents to see me like this. That's the last thing I want to achieve, but I really have NO ENERGY to do anything besides lay around, and maybe watch some movies or listen to some music when I'm not in too much pain.. I feel so worthless.

There I go rambling again.. Though I'm glad I have this place as an outlet. I really need to spill my guts every once in a while and I thank you all soooo much for reading, and supporting me when I need it most.

Writing something down really is alot easier than talking about it. But now that I've written  it all down, I think it'll be easier to remember what the biggest problems are when I have to explain myself tomorrow.


Love you all so much and sorry again for my eternal nagging..

Peter

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by legaljunky, Mar 20, 2012
Peter-
You are going thru what we all went thru.     IT    TAKES   SOOOOOO    LONG!!!................
I can remember posting "I accomplished nothing today but not taking Tramadevil and I guess that will have to be enough."  My husband was oblivious to what I was going thru which made it easier for me.

Post and ramble as much as you want, posting helped me a lot.  We're all here for you.  And I'm so relieved to see you posting, that means you're still with us, you haven't stopped trying.

Fight like hell!  We're all pulling for you!



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by DamTram, Mar 20, 2012
Gunit - PAWS does not continue beyond 90 days in the 30 day patters that you saw at 30, 60, and 90 days.  Whatever you're feeling now is simply how you're going to be feeling for awhile.  Energy will wax and wane, especially relative to what you've eaten and how much exercise you've been doing.  Tramadol sticks around in your fat cells, so of course you're probably not fully recovered, but you are no longer experiencing PAWS.

I am re-tapering down from 1mg of Klonopin after my nervous breakdown 2 weeks ago.  I am down to 0.5mg, but my transition from 0.75mg was very, very rough.  I'm back to walking several times per week, but no running for now.  Cigarettes are being smoked for another 5 days, until finals week is over, so that saps my energy and makes it hard to breathe.  I had the flu over the weekend, so maybe that was my 90 day PAWS, but I really think that I just had the flu.

Staying away from sugar and fat has really helped me.  So...that's my two cents about energy.

Been_Here: Thank you for understanding!  I swear, I'm even nostalgic for days 3 and 4.  That reawakening.

Peter: Don't be discouraged by us.  I'm doing wayyyy better than I was 2 weeks ago, and then I was doing wayyyy better than the 2 weeks before that.  It's all uphill.  I'm still withdrawing from benzos, and it supposedly takes 6-12 months EVEN AFTER TAPERING.  So, I don't care WHAT doctor or clinic you need to see, but do NOT go cold turkey on the benzos.  

I wrote that yesterday, so I hope it is still current. =/

Hoping everyone is as well as can be.

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by Sarabie, Mar 20, 2012
Damtram that's not quite true. Some people experience  paws for years. Try and Google the term.

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by Tramadoc, Mar 20, 2012
Hello all!

I posted some entries back in Feb/Mar 2011 and again in late August and early September.  Tried pretty hard during those two periods to get off of the stuff but to no avail.  

Then I realized all I had to do was ask God and it would happen.  I just gave up trying to do it.  Then, right after the holidays, I just quit.  It wasn't hard at all.  

Such a blessing but also a concern because I still think I can take that stuff and be OK.  Since it wasn't that hard last time, why not just take some for the "really bad days?"  

Reading my posts and all of the posts since reminds me that I'm much better clean like I am now than when I took Tramadol.

Thanks to all for reminding me.

Tramadoc

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by Tramadoc, Mar 20, 2012
So glad to see you're still around, Legaljunky.  I admire you for staying with it and helping all of the others here.

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by denised1982, Mar 20, 2012
Good evening ladies and gentlemen,
How is everyone? I am feeling pretty darn good. I was hurting SO bad last week, my neck was hurting and had a bad tension headache all week, along with my leg and back pain. I was so stressed out last week, it was a bad week for me, I guess. Yesterday I felt fantastic, and today, eh.. my legs hurt, but I'm going to stretch and take a hot bath.

To everyone on benzos, I must say, you never, ever, EVER cold turkey off of benzos (or barbituates, for that matter) because the withdrawal CAN KILL YOU (especially if they are short acting benzos, like alprazolam and lorazepam), not just make you wish you were dead, like opiates. You want to do a slow and steady taper, or go to treatment if you no longer have access to these meds. You don't want to have tonic-clonic seizures and keel over.

If you are addicted to benzos, try to get on valium or klonipin, their long half-lives will make it easier for you to detox off of them, then taper from there. If you cannot get access to these, then go to treatment, so you don't put yourself in any danger.

I hope that everyone is having a good week, I will try to post often again, I have been so busy and stressed out in life, in general.

DamTram, you're right about wheat. They say that it can tear holes in your gut, give you diverticulitis or leaky gut or whatever. It is also an anti-nutrient. It's bad stuff. The only safe carb is probably brown rice (no gluten). It hasn't stopped me from eating wheat though. It's so hard to change.

Everyone else, hang in there! Fight on, warriors!

Love,

Denise


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by gunitbot6, Mar 20, 2012
damn tram i got paws still it an last 6-12 months some  cases 1-2 years

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by DamTram, Mar 21, 2012
I'm saying that you will still have symptoms, but it's untrue that they will continue to come at 30 day intervals.  I'm by no means 'recovered', either.  I wait for the day that I can say that I feel 'normal'.

Some quotes on PAWS:

"Symptoms can sometimes come and go with wave-like reoccurrences or fluctuations in severity of symptoms. Common symptoms include impaired cognition, irritability, depressed mood, and anxiety; all of which may reach severe levels which can lead to relapse."

"Symptoms occur intermittently, but are not always present. They are made worse by stress or other triggers and may arise at unexpected times and for no apparent reason. They may last for a short while or longer. Any of the following may trigger a temporary return or worsening of the symptoms of post acute withdrawal syndrome."

"The condition gradually improves over a period of time which can range from six months to several years in more severe cases."

See?  We're all saying the same thing. =)

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by DamTram, Mar 21, 2012
Sorry I didn't see your post, Denise!  I'm SO HAPPY you had a day of feeling good, and that you're taking care of yourself so well on a day of feeling badly.  Yeah, I was warned about leaky gut...I'm hoping it's not too late for me!  I swear, after a week of avoiding wheat, I can't even touch the stuff.  Even when faced with pizza!  All rice products are gluten free, but you're right that brown rice is the healthiest.  I'm still confused about oats.  I like oatmeal. =/

I'm hoping that things don't get too horrible for me when I finally go from 0.25mg Klonopin to 0.  I read that GABA can really help, and I think it's made me feel better since going from 0.75mg to 0.5.  I'm so mad that I was kept on them for so long. =(  None of my doctors ever told me the consequences of long-term use until I came to California.  UGH.  I could've looked it up, myself, I guess.

So tired.  I hope my fellow warriors are feeling energized!

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by DamTram, Mar 21, 2012
Tramadol burning!  If only the U.S. would catch on.

"Dependence on tramadol has been reported to be a major social problem in the Gaza Strip. The Hamas government has attempted to cut off supplies of the drug, and in April 2010 burnt 2 million tablets which had been intercepted while being smuggled into the territory."

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by gunitbot6, Mar 21, 2012
day 142 here, i feal like i am improving slightly for the past week, my sleep is **** but that will probably be the last thing that gets back to normal. its weird , i cant sleep on thur, fri and sat, i can only sleep on sun, mon, tues, and wed.

i feal like im on track to feal better by day 180 the way i think i have been improving lately.

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by ImDONENoMore, Mar 21, 2012
gunibot's right - paws can continue for up to 2 years and I have yet to read any definitive patterns with it.  It can happen to anyone during their recovery but the symptoms should become more manageable with time.  Always best to see a Dr. if you think something more is going on or to put your mind at ease at the very least.

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by denised1982, Mar 22, 2012
Yes, PAWS CAN continue for up to two years (wikipedia Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome). It does depend on the situation, the person, stress and other contributing factors.

Definitely the statement holds true,"take it one day at a time."

DamTram- Oatmeal is iffy. Oatmeal is one of those things that, by itself, doesn't have much gluten, but the plants that process them often process wheat and other allergens as well, causing cross-contamination. I guess it depends on your brand of oats and where the processing factory is, etc.

Still, I eat the wheat. It is my "crack".

Everyone continuing feeling like they've been hit in the proverbial nuts, fight back, kick tramadol back in the nuts.

Love,

Denise

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by DamTram, Mar 24, 2012
Yes, all those quotes were from Wikipedia.  We all agree that PAWS can continue up to two years, and in the case of benzos, sometimes longer.

Thanks for the info, Denise! I've lost 6 pounds without wheat (and other sugars), if that's any help.  And my tummy is happier, too.  

I am going to go to my first NA meeting today.  I've always resisted because of the religious bent, but I don't care anymore.  I haven't made more than one friend in the 8 months since I moved to a new city, and I'm hoping that it will be easier if I can bond over the struggle of addiction.

Hope you are all well!

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by gunitbot6, Mar 26, 2012
this is crazy dead in here for the past few days. why aren't we seeing new people, how many people don't know about this sight.

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by legaljunky, Mar 26, 2012
I don't get it either.  This incredible forum got me off Tramadol last fall.  I remember that the holidays were awful times when I was a child and my alcoholic father and uncle would make everything so stressful, and then it was the same with my first husband.  I wonder if the fall brings addicts out in the open and some try to get clean for the holidays?

I watched this forum for a couple months while I tapered and didn't start to post till I took my last Tramadevil.  If you are out there doing what I did, don't wait. Post.  It brings so much support, love and strength to stay strong and beat Tramadol when you are not alone in the struggle of a life time.

I love all my Tramadevil fighting buddies!

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by DamTram, Mar 26, 2012
Emily said that few people quit in the springtime.  

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by denised1982, Mar 26, 2012
Why do you think that few people quit in the springtime? It's crazy. I hear that withdrawals are a lot worse in the wintertime, which is when I quit (which is pretty much, Dec. 1).

Well, now I know for sure if I use Tram again, I WILL get violently ill and be in a world of hurt.

It's all psychological warfare from there.


Addiction can happen to anyone. It's a sneaky little b*tch. There are very few people who say, "I want to become a junkie".

It all starts so innocent. Then the monkey jumps on your back, and digs his claws deep into you.

Then he has the stranglehold on ya.


Your mind f*cks with you, bigtime, you numb down your stresses, pain, guilt, thinking you'll work or be better after you have

your fix. Like a stupid f*cking pill is capable of making you a better person.


The only way that you can quit is for you. You have to be ready. You have to realize what your in for. It's hell, but you can't

crack, even if you slip up, don't break down. Keep moving, keep one foot in front of the other, keep your head up.




Fight on, warriors!

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by gunitbot6, Mar 26, 2012
day 147 and im still in p.a.w.s mode, its draining me mentally. when will it end, this is ridiculous. im pretty tired most days, and my sleep is shyt. i know sleep is the last thing that comes back. i figured 4 months in i would be better , then figured 5 months ill be better, now im figuring by the end of 6 months i will be all better. i don't want to live like this forever.

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by DamTram, Mar 27, 2012
gunitbot, what does your doctor say?

i think emily gave some reasons about why people don't quit in springtime, if you read up a bit.  i can't remember.

denise, your post spoke to me (who is trying to quit smoking)...but it still remains a fact: i think that i need cigarettes to get through the anxiety of my benzo taper, even though i'm WELL AWARE that cigarettes actually CREATE the anxiety.  i makes me feel sad that i could quit tramadol, but i can't quit nicotine. =(  

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by gunitbot6, Mar 27, 2012
tramadol will mess up your life, ciggerettes wont. that is one big reason mentally ciggerettes harder to quit.

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by DamTram, Mar 27, 2012
You are so right!  All the ruining that cigarettes do is less devastating in the short term.

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by bethwillprevail, Mar 27, 2012
Hi tram warriors....

I have not been here for a long time.  I am so glad to see so many new faces here who are kicking this cr*p in the butt.  I have relapsed, but getting back off the trams now.  Bad news is this is day one.  :(. You would have to go back to 2010 to read my old posts.  My story is that my husband and I have been on trams for 12 yrs now.  I have stopped several times, but he has not.   But our "shipment" for the online pharmacy did not come.  At that point we both decided to stop.  He has been shocked at how bad he feels.  I think the times before he thought I was exaggerating the withdrawal symptoms.  He now is seeing for himself what a mess it is to get off this stuffd.  You would think I would kow better after relapsing several times before, but the "stash" was always in reach, so it made it harss to quit.  I did stop for 5 mo in2010.  It is scary, the hold this stuff has over you even if tou have at tamped to stop in the past.  It is vary difficult to understand the amount of rationliarion that goes in in my mins to keep taking the stuff.  I am so hopefully the we will be successful tis time !  It does seem a lot easier if someone else I'd doing if twitch you.  Suynptonds top day|. Brain zaps, haadaxhe, and more.  Hoping for a better day tomorrow.  

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by legaljunky, Mar 28, 2012
gunitbot-  I am still feeling so tired and wondered if it was still Tramadevil causing my trouble.  Turns out I am anemic and working with a hematologist to get my iron level up.  Next I have to get a colonoscopy, she thinks I have internal bleeding and this has nothing to do with Tram.

Welcome back, bethwillprevail and husband.  You know you are in the right place!

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by denised1982, Mar 29, 2012
Hey Beth.. I was looking at some of your old posts..

I was reading through some different addiction forums on medhelp and a lot of different people said that you can't quit tramadol cold turkey. I was amazed. I am an all or nothing type of girl, so I was shocked as people were stuck in their tramadol addictions because they feel they can't go cold turkey. I know not everyone has the option to go cold turkey because of health reasons, but I was amazed at a lot of people thinking that there was no way it could be done (CT).

I'm glad that I am not hooked on alcohol, benzos, or barbituates, because I probably would've killed myself CTing off of them!

There are ways to combat the W/D's, and a thing that I have come to realize is that Immodium is a godsend. It is like OTC methadone. It takes away cravings of opiates/oids, and it can take away most of the withdrawal symptoms. You have to take a bit more to combat these withdrawals, but it does help. And when you're at the peak of withdrawals, anything will help.

I will post a little bit later...

Love,

Denise

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by DamTram, Mar 30, 2012
Denise, isn't that frustrating?  People will get into all out battles about whether or not you can stop tramadol cold turkey, even though people clearly have.  Why can't everyone just agree that, at least with this drug, everyone is different?  You're right about the benzos, though.  No ways.  I went from 0.5mg to 0.25mg a few days ago, and I literally thought that I was dying and/or the world was ending, yesterday.  I can't even imagine what would've happened if I'd gone from 0.5 to 0.  Barf.  The day that I never have to take another fragment of a Klonopin and don't have a panic attack will be the BEST DAY EVER.  Then, hopefully, I can deal with the panic attacks of smoking.  NO WAY, until then.  Barf, again.

Good news: I'M NOT ADDICTED TO TRAMADOL.  I'm following Legal's lead.  It's still something to be proud of.

I was worried that I wouldn't do as well in school, since I was messed up on Trams fall quarter and got good grades.  But, it's ok - I wasn't messed up on Trams this quarter, and I got all A's!  This time, without the crying and procrastination.  

I went to an NA meeting, but I don't think I can buy in to it.  The prospect of going through life with a monkey on your back that you can never get rid of seems awful, to me.  Yes, I'm an addict.  Yes, everyone on this forum is an addict.  Am I going to go through life feeling vulnerable because of it? I refuse.  Am I going to go through life, always fearing another relapse? No.

Instead, there's something here called Recovery International and it's free, group therapy for people with anxiety disorders.  THAT is something that I actually need to deal with, and I'm really excited about trying it out.

Anyway, sorry for the blabs.  It's my last day of spring break, and then it's back to crazy town.  Hoping you're all feeling well!

Welcome back, Beth.  I hope that you and your husband stick this one out.  You're right; it would be very hard to stay off if your partner was still using.  I relapsed all on my own (medical procedure), but now I make sure all of my records state that I cannot have tramadol under ANY circumstances.  Sending strength your way.

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by denised1982, Mar 30, 2012
DamTram--- I know what you mean about not knowing about NA.. Kinda has a culty theme going on to me.. Not to say it doesn't help and not to talk bad about people who have been through it and it worked for them.. I have always preached about everyone finding their own way and if NA helps, great, but I don't think NA or AA works, the person works hard at abstaining. I also don't feel like I'm "powerless" over a particular substance, I feel like I have made a choice in taking the substance, either a good choice or bad.

Congrats on your kick-*** semester! I knew you could do it! You're very very smart, and anybody can do anything if they put their mind to it. I love it!

Legal-- good luck on your colonoscopy, I hope your GI bleed gets resolved. I will pray for you and send positive vibes your way..

I haven't taken my Celexa in a few days, and I am not sure if I want to take it anymore. I haven't thrown it away or anything yet just in case I have a freak out reaction from discontinuing it, I just want to see if I actually need it. I kind of  just want to do the herbs and vitamins for a change. I haven't taken any narcotics for over a week, and I feel good, I get minor pains, but once I go to bed and wake up, I feel better. I want to try something different and healthy for a change. I'm tired of feeling like a victim and being afraid of everything. I want to do something about it! I haven't gone to therapy in about 2 months and I am looking into yoga for beginners, walking, and weight lifting. I am still strong, I haven't bench pressed in YEARS and I went to a friends house and benched over 120 pounds, I did it 6 times, and I could never do that a long time ago. I thought it was pretty good for an out-of-shape-fat chick. Even though I'm fat, and I am, I can still kick ***. And I'm awesome. :)

I thank all of you for being here. It really does help me stay in line.
I love yall.

Denise

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by Sarabie, Mar 30, 2012
Denise - just another example of people not knowing anything about tram. It's a non addictive drug but you can't quit CT. It's all BS. Like you I could never have tapered. When I decide on something it has to be now. Ct was the only solution for me.

Damtram - I understand your feelings. I don't believe that people are addicts for life. I don't see myself as an addict. I'd never done any drugs. I was prescribed tram and didn't realize what was going on untill it was too late. Circumstances in life, pain and fright of what was going on, made me continue. But when I came to my senses, I quit on the spot and that was the end of that chapter and a new beginning could start. I wouldn't be able to continue my plans, my life and my happiness if I should carry a monkey on my back.

Also congrats with the A's :-D great being able to think again he?

It seems everyone is doing great. Springtime rocks !!!

Love Susie

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by Sarabie, Mar 30, 2012
Wow just realized it's 200 days clean Sunday. Cool :-D

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by denised1982, Mar 30, 2012
congrats on 200 susie!

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by gunitbot6, Mar 30, 2012
I think people are saying you SHOULDNT quit cold turkey because of possible seizures, there not saying you CANT. i for one quit cold turkey. i also hear quitting cold turkey may result in a longer p.a.w.s period. i think a taper just makes the whole process at least a month longer then it should take , and that alone will make people relapse.

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by denised1982, Mar 31, 2012
Well they stated you cannot quit bentos, barbiturates, alcohol and tramadol cold turkey. I read it a couple of times to make sure I was reading it correctly. Crazy, huh?

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by legaljunky, Mar 31, 2012
Denise- Thanks for the kind thoughts.  I am actually looking forward to the colonoscopy and believe it will solve my problem!  At this point I refuse to think otherwise!

Damtram- What do you mean when you say you are following my lead?  I'm curious. Congrats for your 4.0!

I just have to put my 2 cents in-- I watched my first husband become addicted to alcohol- he was a nasty person in the process. At that time Alanon (for the families of alcoholics) helped me. Then he smoked pot because he said it isn't addictive.  It lead him back to alcohol and to every other hard drug.  He was addicted to everything.  He finally got tired of being rotten to me and left me to marry his latest druggy girlfriend. So looking at his story, I consider myself an addict and think I could become addicted to other drugs as well.  I choose not to drink alcohol because I think I would become addicted and I want to prevent another disaster. (I don't really like it anyway.)  My family history is full of alcoholism and mental illness so I think I probably have the predisposition to be an addict.  I know how hard it was for me to get off sugar before- (and this is a secret, don't tell Emily!) I used my experience from this forum to get off and stay off sugar.  With Emily's miraculous forum anything is possible!  

Life isn't perfect but it sure is exciting!  Every time I get on this forum I feel so strong and positive- my new addiction?
I love all of you, my tram fighting buddies!

Stay strong!



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by DamTram, Mar 31, 2012
Legal - I meant that you were always saying that, even on the bad days, you would tell yourself: At least I am free of tramadol!  I apologize if I wasn't clear.  And thank you for your congrats. Your attitude about your colonoscopy is great, and I'll be sending positive vibes your way, regardless. =) I'm so glad that Alanon helped you, and that the perspective continues to work for you.  I wish that I could convince my brain that it would help me, but everyone is different.  I am going back in to therapy so that I can work on the issues that led me to addiction, so I hope that I find a way that works for me, too. =/

Denise - You go, girl!!  That's some really impressive lifting, and that's awesome that you're looking into other things, too.  I think that you will LOVE beginner's yoga.  I'm glad that discontinuing the Celexa hasn't had any adverse effects, and congrats on the week without narcotics!!  Your spirit sounds strong and powerful.  Very inspiring to me.  And thank you for the congrats, too. =) Keep up the great work!

Susie - CONGRATULATIONS!! That's so many days! And you are doing so great.  So impressive.  And thank you to you, too, for the congrats.  How did you get through the scary part of quitting smoking?  I swear, I cannot get through the panic attacks.  It's like cigarettes distract me from a lot of my negative thoughts, and when I quit, I'm stuck with them.  I know you were successful, and was wondering how you did it.

Gunit - Seizures are a danger when ON tramadol, but no one has reported a seizure from withdrawing.  It's so strange that the myth continues.  What makes you think that quitting cold turkey increases the length of PAWS?  Did you read that somewhere?  I know that Legal did a slow taper, but it seems that we all experienced the same PAWS, no?  I just can't wait for the day that tramadol becomes a controlled substance EVERYWHERE, and that people can no longer pay an arm and a leg to buy it online.  At that point, the truths of what tramadol actually does will hopefully have been discovered.  It always drives me nuts that it's been FOUR YEARS since Emily started this forum, yet very little has been done to understand this drug and alleviate its mass destruction.  

Anyway, it's been two days since my total nervous breakdown from the combination of trying to quit smoking, the Klonopin taper, and a sever case of PMS (sorry, gentlemen).  I've taken promethazine (anti-nausea) the last two nights to combat some of the symptoms of the Klonopin taper, but it's got me sooooo tired.  I have so much work to do today, but can't seem to wake up enough to focus (yet, here I am, typing away).  I've been having some of the sick sweats and burning/freezing, like those from tramadol withdrawal, but am so relieved that that's mostly it.  I feel like I've been adjusting to getting on medications and tapering off of them for the last 5 years, and I just want this cycle to end.  I'm worried my new psychiatrist will try to encourage me to take more medication, but I'm hoping that she'll understand that I want to work through my issues without chemicals.  I hope that's possible.

Sorry for the blabs, again.  Thank you for being here, guys. =')

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by DamTram, Mar 31, 2012
That was supposed to be a tear-drop, but it kind of looks like a booger.

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by denised1982, Mar 31, 2012
damtram- will kava root help you with your anxiety and stress problems? will it help you with your taper? i've only tried it a couple of times, and it helped me to sleep.. you are your worst enemy (as I am) and i feel if I'm not stuck with a lot of pain, then I tend to have more positve thoughts and emotions. I definitely feel more even keel, especially since i quit tram cold turkey. For a while after I quit (as you could see from my old posts) that I had erratic and negative behavior. I am trying to taper myself off the Celexa, I'm going to start taking it every other day, then half every other day, etc.

Today is the first day in months that I slept without the help of any sedatives. I slept for a full eight hours! I woke up without any pain whatsoever! It was a great day!

I love all of you!

Denise

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by bethwillprevail, Apr 01, 2012
Hi Tram Warriors!

I can't believe I am here writing about WD from the evil trams again!  I will say it's different this time.  My WD have not been quite as bad.  This time I have forced myself to stay totally busy and to exercise.  There has been some mental torture involved, but it's there anyway in WD, so if you are super busy, it helps to just not think about how totally insanely cr*ppy you feel, and just pretend you are ok. Done a lot of that the last few days.  Also I saw the post about the immodium- too funny since I am doing the same thing.  It does help!  But the exercise is the main difference between the last time I stopped taking trams.  It totally helps to force yourself to at a minimum just take a walk- even if you feel so so tired you want to lay down- go exercise or get busy doing gardening or something physical.  I believe I have slept some better too due to the exercise.  the other thing that has helped more this time me is to listen to music.  I put a bunch of Christian pop music on my iPhone and put on my headphones- somehow it just gets me moving.  Really has helped.

I like the me off these pills.  And my husband- he is a different person!  He is really struggling with the WD even more than me.  I am praying for him to be able to get thru this and stay off.  I am so afraid of having those pills in my house.  Just one little bit hooks me back in.  I know that.  So if he does not go off, I will have them in my face everyday, again.  I think he will do it for me though.  The thing is, the trams dull your feelings in a weird sort of way. They make you less emotional and more detached from others.  It is a very subtle but BAD thing for relationships of any kind.

The last time I had more depression along with the WD.  Again, I think the exercise has really helped reduce that, and probably being Springtime has also helped.

Stay strong on your journey to freedom from the bondage of pills- counting, searching, getting refills, waiting for the FedEx guy....be free!!!

Hope you all have a wonderful day!

Beth

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by DamTram, Apr 01, 2012
Denise and Beth - You guys sound FANTASTIC!!  Denise, that is so amazing that you slept so well without the sedatives!  I teared up when I read that.  Now you know it can be done.  I know I'm my own worst enemy, but I don't really know how to stop myself, you know?

I'm doing my taxes right now...anxiety is high.  I have tried Kava in organic mixtures of sleep aids, but never on its own.  I will look into it.

So proud of everyone!!


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by denised1982, Apr 01, 2012
DamTram-- Oh yes, I know about not being able to stop myself, it's been taking me years to learn that I am only human, and when you give yourself enough credit where credit is due, and stop thinking bad thoughts about yourself, and just "be", then you're really onto something. I used to be so mad at myself, now, I just accepted that if I want something bad enough I will go for it, if not, then I won't. A lot of time I was in limbo, arguing to myself of what I want to do with myself. I feel at peace now. It has taken almost 30 years to feel that way. When you feel it, you will know. It is the greatest feeling in the world. Roses smell better, the sky is more blue, the birds chirp prettier. It's a great feeling. You don't hurt as much when you see things from a positive perspective. I don't know what brought this change, it just happened.

Oh.. make sure you get the kava root, that's the safest part of the plant, (I think). I think it's the leaves and stems that cause liver problems. Better look that up to make sure though.

Beth--keep up the wonderful work. It was different with me because my husband was not on tram. He did take some when he was hurting, but he said he felt like he was rolling on exstacy. Then the two pills he popped he stopped feeling that way, so he stopped taking them. He encouraged me to stop, and when I was ready to do it for myself and be free from it's chains I did it. It is so wonderful when you don't need anything to get by. You will also find that your pain level will go down the less you take opiates/oids.

Everyone else have a fantastic day!

Love,

Denise

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by Sarabie, Apr 04, 2012
Hey guys

Just came home from the hospital. Been there for 5 days. I shattered my kneecap last week and needed surgery. The day after the operation, the nurse gave me tramadol. But I recognize that poison pill from miles away, and even though I was a bit blurry from the anestethics, I told the nurse that I'd been addicted to tramadol and don't want it ever again. They wanted to give me something stronger then - I think it was oxycontine, but I saw no need for such strong meds and we agreed that I would try voltaren and aspirin at first and if it didn't help then oxy. But it did help. I'm not afraid to be addicted again, cause I know the signs now, and I've never been a fan of strong meds and always been carefull of what I put in my mouth. That was actually why I got addicted to tram in the first place - I was told it was a very mild drug and nothing like opiats - and I needed something for the constant pain in my kidneys, so there you go. But I've learned my lesson. They did however give me morphine when I came to the ER, cause they didn't know how long I would have to wait for the surgery and at that time the pain was extreme. There's a time and place for everything and there's no question morphine was the only drug that helped at that time. But I think the doctors are a bit too gentle with the opiates after the surgery too.

Well I'm very tired and going to sleep now - just wanted to brag about saying no to tram LOL.

Love, Susie

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by denised1982, Apr 04, 2012
Sarabie-- I'm so sorry about your knee and having to go to surgery. I wish you a speedy recovery. I can't believe they tried to give you tramadol even though it was in your charts that you never should have it again. I know all too well that it can be tempting to take it when you just got out of surgery. You really showed guts. I must say that since we all became addicted to tramadol we probably cannot take it again. It will reverse everything that we worked hard for, and put us back in withdrawal. I'm so glad that you didn't give in. Oxycontin would have been better, shorter withdrawal, takes a little longer to get hooked with it. I think you did a courageous, wonderful thing. There is a time and a place for narcotics. Just know if you do take them, you will hurt worse. It always happens that way! Voltaren is a good drug. It helps a lot. I would keep the oxy at hand and only take it if you can't stand the pain. You are taking the pain like a super soldier! I love it! keep up the good work! Take care of yourself!!

Love,

Denise!

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by DamTram, Apr 04, 2012
Susie - What happened to your knee??  I'm so sorry you've had to go through this, but how you've dealt with it is truly inspirational!!  I'm so glad that you came here and shared it with us.  CONGRATULATIONS!!  And I will also be wishing for your speedy recovery!

Denise - You sound so great!!  YOU keep up the good work! =)

Love you guys. =) Get better soon, Susie!

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by Sarabie, Apr 04, 2012
Thank you guys :-D

Well I actually fell over my big fat cat. Went to the bathroom in the middle of the night, didn't bother to turn ón the light and there he was :-D. I landed on my knee - not hard actually, but in an akward position. I just crawled back to bed and managed to fall asleep. But when I woke up I knew it was time for the ER. If I'd known they kept me for almost a week, I would have brought my laptop hehe.

I turned the oxycontine down. Didn't want a prescription for anything else than voltaren and it's perfectly fine. No need for strong drugs. It doesn't hurt that bad anymore. But 6-8 weeks in a cast with crutches *****!!! But I enjoy being tampered hehe :-D

And dear damtram - I never quit smoking. I LOVE my cigarettes. Quit coke (the drink) and tram, but the cigs stay with me forever. I'm 37 years old, been smoking since I was 13 and two years ago my doctor saw X rays of my lungs and Said it was nice to see I don't smoke. Hehe I just kept my mouth shut :-D

Happy Easter everyone (don't know about the States but Easter starts tomorrow in Denmark and I intend to eat several chocolate easter eggs :-D)

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by Icandothis10, Apr 05, 2012
HI everyone, glad to see everyone still here.  I'm still stuck in the armpit of the planet but will be headed home soon.  Oh yes, since this base is closing, the first thing to close - the post office.  I have my absolutely LAST supply of Tram and only took two today.  will probably take one more and just keep on keeping on.  Oh, I started smoking again over here but after the crap I went through for the past 5 years w/Tram, I'm not complaining.  I have plenty of pills, but REFUSE to overuse them....and that means taking like 5 of them.  There's NO way I'll run out before I get on that plane.  I'm going to be very smart with these last 100 pills.  I'm so glad everyone is doing good. Remember all of those who are struggeling and yes, it's a VERY serious struggle, that day will come when you wake up in the morning and realize how beautiful life is when you're popping 30+ of these things and putting yourself into a nasty stuper.  Trust me...if I can feel that good over here in this hole, you can do it at home!  

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by peterovski, Apr 05, 2012
Hello people

Checking in to see how everyone's doing.

Sarabie- nice job on denying yourself the tramadol. I wouldve said yes to oxy in a heartbeat if i'm honest, but never tramadol.
Must be meaning my cravings are still there (which they are). But I know better than taking tramadol EVER again. (the withdrawals are just way worse than those of oxy or any other opie i've used.) The junkie inside me still lives.. Though I'm starving him to death, hope that works. Hehe.

It really ***** about your kneecap. I hope it heals well and you'll be up and running about in no time! :-)

Icandothis- good job on the limited use. When I was going c/t off of ~800mg/day I had 2 boxes of 90x200mg lying right next to me. Talk about temptation. I also had every benzo I liked on hand. If I had all that stuff now I don't think I'd be as strong as I was back then. Guess it was comforting to know I COULD take them if I REALLY wanted to. But I didn't wanna feel like **** for relapsing, which ultimately seemed enough of a reason for me. Good luck with your taper!! And it's nice that you can return home soon.

Onto my story.

The cravings have been terrible these last few days. For opiates and pot especially. But instead of going overboard again with those I've been using an ambien on top of my 10mg valium at evenings and it somewhat eliminates the cravings. (Not completely ofcourse but it's something.) I still feel bad about doing that. But atleast it's in the same class  (somewhat) as the valium so I feel I'm not creating a new addiction. My valium is running out so I'm gonna have to make a full switch to ambien soon anyways. My parents don't know I have this ambien, but if I told them they wouldn't understand the complexity of a benzo taper. I tried and they simply say : "stop, and if you can't, get help." Problem is, I can, but not with this limited amount to taper down with. I have like 15 left. Gonna hop to 5mg soon.
Some more sleepless nights inc. Wish me luck. :D (Actually tonight I'm gonna try to sleep without a valium and only an Ambien. Would be a massive improvement should it work!)

I'm gonna have to go easy on the ambien aswell since I have 27 of that to work with and no refills whatsoever. Infact it's not even my ambien. :-/

Last week I smoked some pot with some friends. And unlike what my parents thought it didn't lead to a "full-blown relapse". Now I know how easy it is to quit that stuff, and how unnecessary it is to get baked all day every day. Not to mention howmuch it slows me down when I'm high. Though I still miss it from time to time, evenings mostly.

I still haven't got a job. I want to finish my studies now that I'm clean and tbh none of the jobs that I could possibly get are appealing to me since my back is crooked and easily hurt. But my parents insist I work at least part-time meanwhile. (I study at home and just go do the exams, it's a system we have here in Belgium for school deserters like myself.)

On a more positive note, I'm quitting smoking. I still have this disgusting rolling tobacco, so it won't be long before I give that up.
I smoked 4 cigs today, instead of 30. Have to say that's an improvement. :-)

Btw, day 36 off tramadol. I can't believe it but it's actually starting to get better!!!
Should get me a ticker next time I make a post. ;-)

Oh before I forget: The magnesium was a good tip legaljunkie and others who posted it. Thanks, it helped,. Been taking vitamin D aswell because my bloodwork showed I have a big shortage. Other than that my cholestorol was too high. (shame on me) But the rest of my bloodwork was all healthy and normal.

Love you all

Peter

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by DamTram, Apr 05, 2012
Peter - Congrats on 36 days!  And it sounds like you've been cutting out a lot of benzos.  But benzos need to be tapered verrrrry slowly, and not just sleep.  I know Denise has mentioned it before, but long-term benzo use (even at small doses) alters your nervous system.  I have read that a 10% decrease in dosage every TWO WEEKS helps, but that it's still 6-12 months until you feel normal again.  You are going much faster than that, so I'm a little worried.  Ambien is a sedative-hypnotic and will help with sleep, but it won't so much help your system recover from long-term benzo use.  Do you have a doctor?  I would feel so much better if you had a doctor to help you get off this ****.  I was on 2mg Klonopin and am down to 0.25mg, but it took months.  And the drop from 0.5mg to 0.25mg led to a total nervous breakdown.  I'll be seeing a psychiatrist, finally, to help me get off that last 1/4mg.  I hope you see a doctor, so you can get all the way through this.  I'm pulling for you, Peter.

Susie - I'm so sorry!  My cats are probably plotting the same fate for me.  I don't know why I thought you quit smoking!  It must've been someone else that said, "If I can quit smoking, I can quit anything!"  I wonder who it was...I hope you've had a pain-free day and are recovering speedily!

ICan - I'll be wishing you a safe trip home!  I'm glad you're so excited to be rid of this monster.

I'm hangin in there.  The first week of spring quarter is almost over, and my energy has been pretty good.  I hurt my back over the weekend, so have gone back up to 1 Lyrica/day.  I also saw my new psychologist on Tuesday, and will be seeing him every week.  I'm hoping to work through all of my issues without adding more meds, and to finally be able to deal with my own thoughts so that I can quit smoking.

Hoping all of you have a wonderful Friday! =)

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by peterovski, Apr 06, 2012
I realise that benzos need to be tapered very slowly, but I simply can't get my hands on any more. I have a doctor but he knows that I've been abusing very high doses of benzos and therefore he's reluctant to prescribe me any. If I even mention the fact that I need more benzos to taper, my parents get angry and simply tell me "You need to stop after these so you better start tapering". I used to take bromazepam, lorazepam, clonazepam & diazepam with an equivalent dose of about 200-250mg valium every single day. I tapered that down VERY quickly. (In about two weeks I went down to 2,5mg lorazepam) That leaves me to think I can do this too.. I guess I need to look for a psychiatrist because another doctor is pretty much out of the question. And my doctor doesn't seem to know alot if anything about a benzo taper.

I already went out to buy a pack of cigarettes. *sigh* Having no cigarettes made me even more anxious than I already am so I reckon I'll try again later.

  

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by peterovski, Apr 06, 2012
Oops forgot Ticker. :-D


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by DamTram, Apr 06, 2012
Peter - It's been my experience that the doctors that helped you stay in this mess are the ones that don't want to help in getting you out of it.  I think it would be great to see a psychiatrist, at the very least to deal with a) all of the issues that led to such high usage and b) the trauma you've experienced as a result of it.  You have come SO FAR, you should be very proud of yourself.  It's great that you recognize that you may need some help to get the rest of the way.  I know you tapered very quickly from high doses, but you still have benzos in your system...so I don't know what the drop to 0 will be like.  I am worried about it for myself, too.  And like I said, there's no way that I'm going to be able to quit smoking until I deal with all of the underlying issues of anxiety that keep me smoking.  This is what psychologists and psychiatrists are there for. =)  Congratulations on another day tramadol free!!

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by honorbounddane, Apr 07, 2012
hello all of my old and new faces,
no i didnt drop off the face of the planet, not did i let the devil pill get me again. just been real busy with trying to get two externships done for MA and phlebotomy. that and i dont have a computer where i live, so i make do with what i can. i honestly cant believe how well i feel, if i had known how this would have turned out awhild ago, i would have done it awhile ago. im so happy to see that sooo many of you are still here, alot of you guys and gals, started the "big quit" around the same time. nice to see you are still hanging on there. im not sure how long in actual days its been, i just know its been over 6 months, but im sure when i post it i will see my ticker. good luck to you all and ill still check in from time to time. love you guys for all your support and strength.
jason

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by gunitbot6, Apr 07, 2012
jason did u experience p.a.w.s?

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by DamTram, Apr 08, 2012
Do you think there are so many less people than last year because doctors are finally prescribing this drug less, and people are less likely to even know to start a drug they can buy online?  I'm taking this quiet as a possible triumph.  If the PDR was revised in November 2010, maybe doctors are finally catching on.  I wonder.

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by DamTram, Apr 08, 2012
4 months!  I did not celebrate this milestone, last year.  In fact, it was around the time that I took tramadol for a few days.  Which eventually led to a 3 week relapse.  I'm freeeeee!

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by peterovski, Apr 08, 2012
Congratulations on 4 months DamTram!! Certainly celebration-worthy!! :-)
I'm not sure about doctors prescribing it less, probably it's being taken a bit more seriously already. I think it's still being used very often as a first choise of an analgesic painkiller though. If addiction care noticed/notices alot of people have problems with addiction to tramadol, it's bound to get even stricter sooner or later. I hope sooner for everyone's sake. I honestly believe there's less harm in prescribing hydrocodone or even oxycodone as an analgesic. Though I absolutely don't advocate those drugs either since they're also extremely addicting.

I've agreed with my parents to call a psychiatrist this tuesday so finally I'm going to take some action. Even if it is only a once a week thing, it's way better than nothing. I hope this'll help me regain some energy and willpower, because I've seriously been lacking that lately.

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by bethwillprevail, Apr 08, 2012
Hi tram warriors,

Happy Easter to everyone.  Had the stomach flu and fever Thurs, and still made it thru a big Easter dinner at my house today.  Shew......

I am at day 12.  Very tired, but I am also recuperating from being very sick.  I will persevere thru this WD.  I am trying to just push thru it without thinking about it so much.  That helps. Just be busy.  

Great job Damtram.  Just keep the trams out of reach.  You are doing a super great job.  I also relapsed but am not back off.  You can do it!  Four months is a good amount of time.  You are well on your way!

Peter- a psychiatrist is a good option for you.  You want to successfully be able to get free of all this stuff.  They can help best- esp an addiction specialist.  It will change your life.

I wish the best for all of you!  I understand the battle going on within your body and mind.  It is equal, really.  Just set your resolve and don't look back!  The battle is worth it!  To be free is worth it! You are worth it!  

Blessed Easter to you all

Beth

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by DamTram, Apr 08, 2012
Peter, I think making the step to go to a psychiatrist is WAY MORE cause for celebration than four months of sobreity!!  That totally made my day, that you're going to go!  The general goal that the psych and I set in our first meeting last week was to help me learn how to feel strong and empowered.  I was honest about my addiction and relapses, inability to quit smoking, trouble making friends, poor sleep quality, and also my desire to deal with all of those things without ADDING more medications into the mix.  His opinion was that I am UNDER medicated, which he then amended to 'mis-medicated'.  He's a psychologist, and I don't see a psychiatrist until the 17th, but he said to listen to what the psychiatrist has to say.  I loathe to continue the pattern of the last 5 years of being put on medication that I end up wanting to taper off of, but I'm trying to keep an open mind.  I have a fatty liver (from before tramageddon) that I believe was caused by Cymbalta, so I'm extra worried about adding more chemicals.  In any case, I wholeheartedly believe in psychotherapy and I'm so happy for you!!  Especially that someone will be helping you get off the benzos.  Freaking out about the end of my taper (I don't know if I can cut 0.25mg in half) is what drove me to finally make the appointment.  So I can't wait to hear how it goes, for you. =)  And thank you for the congratulations! Make sure you gives some to yourself, too. =)



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by DamTram, Apr 09, 2012
I don't know if it's PAWS or eating carbohydrates over the weekend, but today my body felt like it had a terrible hangover.  And all I wanted to do was take a hot bath, but my hot water only works sometimes, these days...rarely in the evenings. =(  I've been really down in the dumps, too.  Everyone has bad days, right?  Tomorrow is a fresh start?  

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by Ptowngirl, Apr 09, 2012
my first step -  
Well I am at the tapering point - down to 2 pills a day (was taking 10-15 a day). I am almost in tears wondering how I got here but hopeful that I am on my way out of "here". 3 years ago I ruptured my L5, they prescribed me vicodin and muscle relaxers to ease the pain thinking it was just a strain. After 3 months I was referred to a Physiatrist who immediatly got upset with me and told me to get off all that "junk" and that I was too young to be doped up all of the time. After the MRI results this is the same doctor that prescribed me that fateful first script of tramadol because it was "SAFE". I have substantial pain during flare ups which led to the increased dose, I never really felt high taking these. In all honesty I thought of them the same way I do Tylenol just a little stronger. My wake up call came when I had my gallbladder out and they could not get my pain under control. I was told by the nurse that the tramadol interferes with the pain receptors and can actually make me hurt more. Last month I ran out before my refill had been called in by the doctor and thinking about what the nurse had said I went cold turkey having no clue what I was in store for. I handled it for about 24 hours and could not get that prescription picked up fast enough when they said it was ready. When I started to feel "normal" again I realized it was time to be done with this! I have never been a drug user, drinker or compulsive in anyway so this is still a shock - sports mom of 3 and an addict. So here I am down to 2 with the intent to be done over the next 2 weeks but I have been having the withdrawals at about the 16 hour mark. Severe anxiety and panic, restless legs, crawling skin, insomnia, sneezing, upset stomach and headaches. I just got my authorization for MMJ as a natural option for my flare ups and to help with the weaning. I am taking the Kava Kava as well to help with the anxiety. I did find that the neurontin substantially helped with the crawling skin and RLS. And BEWARE - there is a new drug out called NuCynta - my GI gave this to me as I have splenic flexure syndrome as well - guess what? It is a stronger version of tramadol!!!! They refer to it as tramadols big brother. He didn't even really know what he was giving me but told me the rep had just been there and handed me the script with 2 refills and coupons. The pharmacy just laughed and said that federal law prohibits refills. I am so frustrated with the doctors for not being more responsible. I am making an appointment to talk with my family doctor and see about a short term anti anxiety like the xanax to get through the first week.

Thank you for having this outlet!!! I have been so disappointed in the situation and finding this forum has helped so much.



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by Aeiko, Apr 10, 2012
Hello everyone,

I've never in my life posted to a website such as this, but reading about people in the same situation as myself is comforting.  I figured it's time to do more than just lurk in the background reading everyone elses stories of recovery and start my own.  

I have been taking Tramadol for about 3 years now.  I was prescribed this medication for my lower back and was assured by the Doctor that it was not habit forming.  Even when I told him I had developed a dependency on it, he looked at me as if I was crazy and simply brushed it off as ridiculous and tried to convince me that it was all in my head. I'm sure most of us could prove otherwise.

I've had no problem obtaining Tramadol over the past few years, but this week I ran into an issue with my refill. Normally I get a refill at the beginning of the month, but this month they are wanting to wait until the 18th for my visit to refill my medication.   Upon hearing this news, I obviously fell into a panic.  Then I stopped and looked at myself in the mirror and asked myself "What have I become"?

It's seems that I have become nothing more than a slave to an unforgiving medication.  It's practically robbed me for my life over the past few years.  I exist merely as a droning automation going through the same simple routines day after day. I've finally had enough.  I had a total of 12 pills remaining.  I called a friend up and had them to visit and told them about my situation.  I took two of the tramadol and requested they dispose of the rest.  I knew it would be impossible to taper with only 12 pills.  So I contacted a friend that I know that gets prescribed Suboxone.  I understand that Suboxone is generally for more potent opiates such as percocet and oxycontin but it was the only thing I had access to that would mitigate the withdrawal symptoms.  

I have one 8mg Suboxone film strip which I cut into 8 equal pieces and will take one of these for the first 8 days, after than I hope that I at least have the SSRI withdraw effects in order.  I know it'll be a hard road from there, but I'm willing to endure whatever comes if it means I can have a life again.  I am thankful that there are websites such as this for people to communicate and share what they are going through.  It makes it a lot easier to know you're not alone and you have people fighting the same fight as you.

I'm looking forward to my own and everyone else here's success!

Take care.

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by legaljunky, Apr 10, 2012
Hi Damtram-  I have had sugar (and simple carb) hangovers for years.  I have had low blood sugar so often that I figure I was eventually gonna be diabetic so why not try to prevent it.  Beating Tramadevil gave me the strength to get off sugar as well.

Welcome Ptowngirl and Aieko!  This forum is 1 powerful place!

The Dr. who prescribed my Tramadevil did not know it is addictive but she is very open minded.  I wrote up my whole Tram experience for her and I will be giving my paper to any of my Drs who are interested.

We are so lucky to have this life changing forum!  Thanks, Emily!

Love, strength and perseverance to all my Tram warrior buddies!

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by DamTram, Apr 10, 2012
Thanks, Legal.  I have been doing one 'cheat' day per week with carbs, but perhaps I've learned my lesson.  

Welcome, Ptowngirl and Aieko.  I'm so glad you've found this place.  Please let us know if you have any questions left unanswered!

Aeiko - The SNRI withdrawals are the part that takes the longest, which is what makes Tramadol withdrawal so much worse than withdrawal from regular opiates.  Usually, you would never discontinue an SNRI abruptly.  I hope the suboxone works.  There was a woman on this forum last year (I think her username was Sydney something) who wanted to avoid the withdrawal as much as possible, and was looking in to subs.  I can't remember if she did it (I think she did), but I remember some of us were concerned that she would miss the part of withdrawal that KEEPS us clean - the total reawakening and the regaining of personal strength and perseverance that comes out of the gradual recovery.  I relapsed (twice), so I'm not one to give advice, but I still believe there is something to be said for the positive side of tramadol withdrawal.  That sounds so horrible, as no one should have to go through it, but for those of us that had lost touch with everything and ourselves, it can be an integral part in taking your power back.  

Ptown - Thank you for the info!  I hope the authorities are more honest in their prescribing of NuCynta than they have been with tramadol.  That's so horrible, all around.  This drug should've become a controlled substance - not ended up with a monster of a brother.  Blech.

Good luck to our new friends! I hope everyone, new and old, has a wonderful day.

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by Aeiko, Apr 10, 2012
Thank you legaljunky & DamTram!

DamTram - Yeah, I know it'll take a long time for my chemicals to level out but if I can get past the first few days of vertigo and brain tingling I think I'm good to go.  I understand it's dangerous to abruptly stop taking them, especially since seizures run in my family.  I have a good friend as well as family that's on stand by that is willing to help if a problem pops up.

I understand what you mean as far as going cold turkey.  I guess like most people, I want the easy way out, that that's probably not the best attitude to have at this point.  But now I don't really have much choice.  I had an appointment at the 18th which I canceled so it will take at least another month to get any more Tramadol.  I know it's not so bad at the moment, but as soon as take my last suboxone square, it'll be a rough road from there.  I've been honest to myself, my friend, and family about the situation, which makes me more determined and to not let them down.

If it gets unbearable I had requested that my friends take me to a detox facility nearby.  At this point, failure is not an option.

Thanks for the warm welcomes :)  I hope everyone has a great afternoon. :)

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by denised1982, Apr 10, 2012
ROLE OF NIGELLA SATIVA IN OPIOID DEPENDENCE
Author(s)--Sibghatullah Sangi
Department of Pharmacology/ University of Karachi
Session 2004
Subject--Pharmacology

Abstract
Opioid dependence is a chronic disorder that produces changes in brain pathways that remain long after the patient stops taking the drug. These protracted brain changes put the dependent person at greater risk of relapse. Detoxification can be successful in cleansing the person of drugs and withdrawal symptoms; it does not address the underlying disorder, and thus is not the adequate treatment. Maintenance with methadone or naltrexone is the usual practice in the long-term management of opioid dependence but both drugs have their own disadvantages because no single medication is appropriate for every individual for treating their opioid dependence, it is important that clinicians have a variety of the therapeutic agents available to them.

Calcium channel blockers, such as verapamil, diltiazem, nifedipine, nimodipine, and felodipine are useful drugs being used in cardiovascular disorders, such as hyper-tension, arrhythmias, and ischaemic heart disease. Research on calcium channel blockers has proved their therapeutic potential in a variety of disorders such as asthma, diarrhoea, premature labour, and diseases of central nervous system such as epilepsy, and opioid dependence. Modern drugs are not only expensive and beyond the reach of majority of the population of world but also have multiple side effects. Hence there is a need to explore such drugs from indigenous sources and to observe if combination of desired therapeutic efficacy exists in nature.

Nigella Sativa is in use for the treatment of variety of ailments since ancient times. Research has based its many effects on their efficacy of blocking calcium channels. As calcium channels have been tried for the treatment of opioid dependence, so Nigella Sativa was used in this study. This study was carried out on 50 patients who were divided into two groups. Patients were admitted for 12 days and then weekly followed up for 12 weeks.

Each patient received placebo orally during day-1 and day-2 of admission. Thereafter Nigella Sativa was given to the patients from day-3 of admission to eighth week. Then the dose of each drug was tapered off during 9th and 10th weeks and then no treatment was given during last two weeks.

It was observed that Nigella Sativa showed a rapid improvement in signs and symptoms of acute opioid abstinence. It was also observed that Nigella Sativa prevented the development of significant craving and relapse. It is concluded that Nigella Sativa is effective in long term management of opioid dependence and it is suggested that further long term follow up studies may be designed with greater number of patients.
I have read several accounts on other forums where this plant is cultivated in the home and the water or oil-based extract is reported by some opiophiles to be quite potent at stimulating 'nods' and opiate effects.

only thing is that apparently there is a negative effect on the heart with too high of a dose. I thought I remembered it being an increased heart rate... according to these literature, the oil is active as a calcium-channel blocker. and that makes sense. here's why:

calcium channel blockers are used to vasodilate in the periphery and they cause a decrease in cardiac muscle contractility at the same time. This decreased blood pressure (if the BP gets low enough) will cause something called 'reflex tachycardia' which is an elevated heart rate. Although this wouldn't be something to play around with willy-nilly if you have a heart condition (angina, history of m.i.), it should be noted that even though the heart rate increases, the heart is under much less stress. This is the kind of drug you could give someone who is actually HAVING a heart attack and it will decrease the stress on the heart muscle.


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by Ptowngirl, Apr 10, 2012
Thank you for the welcome DamTram and Legaljunky. My plan to taper has gone to going ct instead. Called my GP today and she has agreed to give me something to assist in the anxiety but it won't be ready until tomorrow - cannot remember the name. I would rather just get this done than keep having a few hours with symptoms starting and then taking a dose only to go through the same thing the next day. I am agitated (understatement) and have a horrible headache already and it is just starting - I am almost 24 hours from my last 2 pills.  

Aeiko - good luck, hopefully the subs have helped a bit. As much as it ***** I am glad to know I am not alone in the process.

Fingers crossed I don't crawl out of my skin tonight.

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by Aeiko, Apr 11, 2012
Thank you Ptowngirl, I need all the luck I can get.

I've gone 24 hours without any tramadol.  So far it wasn't been so bad aside from slight soreness and a bit of vertigo here and there, but I'm maintaining.  I'm sure this is mostly due in part to the Suboxone, but considering at how low the dosage I'm taking is, I thought today would be way worse.   But I'm sure the worst has yet to come, but I am determined to remain optimistic.

I thought it might be a good idea to keep a journal to keep myself motivated, and to activate the ticker to monitor my progress and keep me motivated.

I hope you manage to get some rest Ptowngirl.  Take care.





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by peterovski, Apr 11, 2012
Ptown, aeiko - welcome to this blog and I wish you both good luck. Judging from your stories you really want to tackle this evil drug, and if you really want it, you'll do it!
For me too, the only way to go was c/t or I'd still be counting pills or drops from the liquid formula.
I tried it with the oral drops, so that I could reduce it very slowly, but I always ended up taking more in the end.

Have you read some of the tips? In the first few days what really helped me was taking hot baths. Also magnesium is a muscle relaxing supplement that could be a nice aid to have too. (Thanks again for that tip legal & others)


Aeiko - A journal is definitely very useful to keep track of your progress. It always helps me to look back at how bad things were, and where I'm at now. I've kinda made this blog my journal now though. :-) You could do the same, if you like. You didn't mention what your daily dose was, but it is possible from any dose. I think I'm living proof of that since I went c/t on 800. It was horrible though, so I really hope you were on a lower dose. I also used another analgesic at first so I could handle the initial SNRI withdrawal first, and then after that the opioid part. The drug I used was pentazocine. It's effects are not fun -at all- but they did alleviate half of the withdrawals (for a week) so all in all it was useful.

Ptowngirl - Frustration about (certain) doctors is something that most of us share I think. Thanks for the warning about NuCynta. I had heard about it before it got approved, and was interested in it back then. Thank god it didn't fall into my hands before I realised the truth about these medications. Good warning!

To the both of you: Stay strong and fight it with all you've got! A month and a half ago I thought I was hopeless, and I've come so far I can hardly believe it myself. You can do it too!!

Today I went to my old doctor (The one I visited frequently when I was still hunting and popping pills like crazy) and got a prescription for .. 100x 2mg clonazepam, 100x 5mg diazepam & !!!90x 200mg tramadol!!! (I didn't tell him I was struggling with addiction because I didn't want to get sent home without diazepam.)

I got the diazepam script filled and flushed the delayed prescriptions of clonazepam & tramadol down the toilet, before I could change my mind about those.

I really didn't know what else to do since I don't expect the psychiatrist to be available very quickly. I take it there's a waiting time. Now I won't have to worry so much about the diazepam, and I'm proud that I kept myself from filling the other prescriptions.
I'm gonna stay on 10mgs/day a little longer because I still don't feel really comfortable with this dose. And I've decided to listen to my body for once.

I called a place today that offers help with recovery and rehabilitation. I asked for a psychiatrist which they sadly didn't have there (I really thought they did.) but I got a number of a psychiatrist who specializes in these problems. I can call him tomorrow. Hope I get an appointment soon.

By the way, i just looked back into my old taper-journal (aeiko inspired me to go check it ;-) ) and I'm really shocked at what I used to take. Enough to sedate an elephant!! Thought I'd share what I did on an almost daily basis back then. (I take 10mg diazepam daily now and that is all.)

From feb 5:
60mg diazepam
8mg clonazepam
36mg bromazepam
7,5mg lorazepam
800mg tramadol
5 joints

Jeez, talk about overkill.

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by legaljunky, Apr 11, 2012
Denise- Mighty interesting- the drug companies have it in for us.

Aeiko and Ptowngirl- Keep going, you're on your way to beautiful days after the clouds clear!

Peterovski- I'm so happy for you.  You still have tough times ahead too but you are full steam ahead on the right track!

I thought I'd mention again what I did on those early horrible days off Tramadevil.  I was never on a high dose of Tram, 300 mg daily at most, but the first few days were excruciating and here's what I learned from other warriors-
I got nothing done but staying off Tram.  For the tummy problems I drank lots of peppermint tea with honey and cayenne, about 800 mg magnesium for the anxiety and restless legs and a lot of 1000mg sublingual B12.  A heating pad helped wherever my muscle pain was worst.  When my WD spiked I had some tea, cayenne and honey, 200mg magnesium, a sub B 12 and got on the forum.  Reading posts and posting were very comforting.
So post, post, post!  We're here for you!

Today I'm staying close to my facilities- colonoscopy tomorrow.  I have free Netflix for a month so I'm gonna be watching movies and doing nothing else.

Love, strength and perseverance!


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by Ptowngirl, Apr 11, 2012
Legaljunky - hope the colonoscopy goes ok - boy the prep really is the worst part. I had one just over a month ago, was thankful they said not another until I am 50. Sending lots of good thoughts your way. Thank you for reposting the helpful things.

Aeiko - sounds like your first 24 has started off hopeful, that is probably a relief! May the next 24 go as smoothly for you, one day at a time.

Peterovski - You are amazing. Truly inspiring to know that you have made it so far in what (in the scheme of things) is a short period of time. The fact that you can hear what your body is saying is a huge thing - instead of hearing what the meds are saying.

Made it through the night with 800 mg magnesium, Tylenol PM, MMJ, 800mg of Kava Kava root, 600mg gabapentin, tension tamer tea and peppermint tea. Feeling pretty fidgety, the buzzing in my head has started and at this point the panic attacks are creeping in. Haven't taken anything yet this morning. I sure hope the doc gets the promised prescription called in. Have an appointment with my physiatrist today to make a plan for the ruptured disc. I am in a place now where I don't know what to do for the pain. I feel like the opiates caused less of a problem for me but I guess it is truly about moderation. I have tried everything I can for pain relief that does not come from a bottle - acupuncture, massage, physical therapy (almost 20 months worth), traction - I just don't know what a safe choice would be at this point. I seriously have lost all faith in the doctors having my best interest in mind. Maybe that is the depression from the w/d. One day down, a lifetime ahead of me. I am done with these nasty little pills.

Find the good in today!

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by legaljunky, Apr 11, 2012
Ptowngirl-
My most painful, sickest year was way back in 1987 and I figured life was only gonna get worse from there.  After lots of Drs, chiropractic, physical therapy, drugs, you name it, I got better and got my whole life back.  I couldn't give up because I have kids I love so much. Healing came from where I never expected. I just kept searching.  And as you know, it's all 1 day at a time- be present and enjoy the good days and just get thru the bad ones, 1 minute at a time.

Sending love!

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by peterovski, Apr 11, 2012
Legal - I hope all goes well tomorrow, my thoughts will be with you. And thanks for the words of encouragement. :)

Ptown - Thanks, I'm very glad to hear my story served as an inspiration to you. :) The flueish/sick feeling & crawling skin was the first symptom that went away for me, after about a week. Then the zaps and the buzzing went away too shortly after. When I was still in full blown withdrawal I combatted the symptoms with some acetaminophen/paracetamol. It didn't do all that much, but did help with tension headaches and slightly with the flueish feelings. As soon as I read about the magnesium, I decided that might help, and it did.
The anxiety, panic attacks, tension headaches and depression still linger, but it's not nearly as bad as in the beginning - don't let that discourage you though, because in my case the benzo's must've played a big role in that.

I really hope you will find a way to manage your pain without analgesic painkillers. You're right that moderation is key should you do decide to use them. And ofcourse, tramadol should be out of the question. Unfortunately I'm not strong enough to just take it sometimes. Whenever my back pain or headaches spikes I still take an acetaminophen. (max. 2x500mg/day because I want to spare my liver.) It doesn't really help all that much but it does something. And that will just have to be enough. Never again will I use a medication that screws with your brain chemistry in such a terrible manner. No matter how "safe" it is in the doctor's eyes, I will research it thoroughly before even concidering it. (When I finally get completely rid of the benzos that is.. :P )

Let us know if the prescription helps, I bet it will.

Stay strong, don't give in, I know you can do it!

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by DamTram, Apr 11, 2012
Peter, you're like a new person!!  I guess you're probably just "you", now. =)  I know Legal said you still have tough times ahead, but if you've come as far as you have in 2 months...you can do ANYTHING!  You will serve as an inspiration for many more to come through this forum.  I know you have inspired me to survive the end of my benzo taper. =)

Ptowngirl - So proud of you!  I hope you're doing okay...I know things get pretty difficult after the first 24 hours, so I'll be thinking of you.  You WILL eventually sleep and you will SOON start to "undie".  Keep it up!

Aeiko - I'm so glad that the subs are helping and that you have such a great perspective.  You keep it up, too!

I am going to have to stop taking Lyrica if I'm going to survive the rest of my benzo taper.  I literally feel like every body part attached to a joint is being ripped out, like the migraines are ripping out my brains from my sinuses, and that I'm going to attack anyone around me who makes annoying sounds.  I HATE DRUGS.  I thought that the Lyrica would help with getting off the last 1/4mg of Klonopin, but I think it's just making my system crazy.  It has a half-life of ~6hours, so that's probably why I'm suffering for 12 hours.  I see the pdoc next Tuesday, and I hope to all that is good that they can help and not hurt me, more.

Fight on!

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by Aeiko, Apr 11, 2012
Hello everyone!

peterovski - I never thought I'd be the type to keep a journal, but looking at EmilyPost's journal inspired me.  It's nice to have a record of how things play out and as a reminder of the things I had to endure as well as looking at how I accomplished what I thought at the time was impossible.  There's just something gratifying about posting Day 1 and then knowing there will be a day 50, or a day 365 and etc..  

I indeed forgot to mention how much I was taking, which is probably important to know. :)  When I originally started taking Tramadol, I only took 100mg  a day.  I did that for about a year, then was upped to 120 pills a month, which then I started taking 200mg daily.  After some time later I was upped again to 240 so I started taking 400mg daily, which is generally how much I've taken for the last 8 month up until my last month or so where I wasn't taking a definitive amount daily.  I would take approximately 400mg - 800mg daily, possibly more on the weekends.

Today wasn't too terrible, but definitively not as great as yesterday.  I'm starting to get the infamous brain zaps.  I have practically no energy and would have to sum up today as unproductive (outside of me ridding this poison from my body).  With that said, I'm sure it could be worse.

I had a question regarding the tracker.  I took my last two tablets on Monday.  Today is Wednesday and it isn't showing any days clean.  I'm assuming I've entered something incorrectly, could any one help me with that?  As small and ridiculous as it sounds, the numbers, even one day is inspiring to me.

I appreciate all the kind words ptowngirl, DamTram, legaljunky, and peterovsky.  I really appreciate the support and know that I am here to support each of you in the best way I can.  Stay strong!

I hope everyone has a great evening!





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by Ptowngirl, Apr 12, 2012
48 hours tram free. Felt pretty discouraged and growly this morning but I had a full day of things to get done so I started the day with 800 mg of magnesium, 800mg of kava kava and a little bit of breakfast. Staying busy helped today and I fit in massage therapy which helped for a little bit with the restless legs. I have found that telling my family members what is going on is also helpful - I am fearful of offending someone that I love because of what I am going through. I also saw my physiatrist and he is giving me Tylenol3 with codeine for my bad days but only enough to use a couple of days a week and he has promised to never give me the tramadol again. I also have gotten the referral for the neurosurgeon I have been asking for over the last 3 years - big win for this girl. The last 2 days I walked 4 miles each day which helped with all the things I had going on - temporarily. I did finally get the prescription promised yesterday (today... at 5) it is for klonopin .5mg but only got 14 tablets as I made it very clear with the doctor that I do not need another issue. I took 2 over the last 4 hours and they helped the anxiety and panic attacks but the flu feeling is creeping in and the headaches are relentless but I plan on using plain old Tylenol for those.

You guys are so great, it is just nice to have people who understand. Aeiko, hope you are hanging in there.
Legaljunky, DamTram, Peterovski, thank you for all of the insight and encouragement.

We got this!

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by peterovski, Apr 12, 2012
DamTram - It's really great to hear that =) Thanks for the kind words. You know in the beginning it was you, legal and denised that were my inspiration to get on this blog in the first place. ;)

Aeiko - Believe me I didn't think I'd ever keep a journal either. It's all because of this blog! No one "blames" or "accuses" anyone here. I absolutely love it! Don't worry too much about not being able to get things done. It's perfectly normal when coming off that high a dose. It'll come, in time. Trust me on this one. :)

Ptown - It's GREAT that you're able to keep yourself busy. I wasn't able to do that the first few weeks, but like everyone including you says, it helps tremendously to keep your mind occupied. Also don't be discouraged and know it'll ONLY get better from here on out.

Anyway I wanted to post some more but I gotta go right now, will be back later to check.
Hope you all have a nice day!

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by Ptowngirl, Apr 12, 2012
The klonopin has been really helping - I was pretty on edge this morning and just the .5mg helped make it tolerable. I got a little stir crazy and there was a break in the rain so I made myself get out for a bit. The neausea has really started up so I had one of my "special" brownies and it is taken away a lot of the upset stomach. I also have been taking slippery elm, 3x1200mg each day and I have not had any diarrea troubles as of yet (really hope it stays that way!) but the headaches and buzzing brain are stinking at this point.

I have three boys and my husband travels a lot (3-5 days a week) so I have had no choice but to keep going. I am very confident this is a blessing in disguise because otherwise I would be curled up in bed waiting for it to be over.

Aeiko - sure hoping today has been treating you better!

Peterovski - thank you for the encouragement. DamTram hope you make it through the next few days!

I know it is going to get better!!

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by legaljunky, Apr 12, 2012
Damtram, Ptowngirl, peterovski, Aieko,
It's great to see so many warriors toughing it out together, it's exciting!
Thought I should report on my colonoscopy since I had brought it up. It went fine, no pollops, bleeding or anything wrong. The most interesting part was that my anesthetic was propaphol but I guess I didn't get as much as Michael Jackson had!
I'm still a little loopy


Stay strong!

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by Aeiko, Apr 13, 2012
Hello everyone!

So I've got three days down, no telling how many more to go, but I remain optimistic.   It's getting harder by the day.  The brain zaps are getting really intense now.  I have 0 energy at all, and I cannot sleep to save my life, but I understand it can be worse.  I'm hanging in there.

legaljunky - Glad to hear everything went well.  Propaphol? lol wow, scary stuff :)  But glad everything turned out alright.

ptowngirl - I actually got some klonopin as well.  I haven't gotten to the point to where I need it yet, but I know it's coming.  Glad to hear it's helping.  

peterovski - Yeah, this is a pretty awesome place.  Prior to coming here, I had given up on the idea that people were rational on the internet :P  I'm glad to be proven wrong.  You guys (and gals) are great :)

Take care everyone!

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by peterovski, Apr 13, 2012
Aieko - You should try to use the clonazepam, I'm sure it will help quite a bit. Ofcourse I also recommend you use it sparingly and only when w/d's are worst. And I can so relate to not being able to get up and do ANYTHING at all. It's what the first weeks will be like. Not taking tramadol will just have to be your only goal right now.

Ptown - I'm glad the klonopins are helping. Try not to use them too often (if you can manage that) though. A benzo addiction is a really nasty thing to have. Just a heads up since I'm paying the price for it now.

Legal - I'm glad the colonoscopy was without any complications. I'm excited too, it's great to see some new faces and being able to support eachother.

Oh yeah I called that psychiatrist today.. And he had a waiting list of over 3 months. I'm gonna call a few others tomorrow. I'm a bit disappointed because this one specializes in cases like myself. I hope I can find one soon.. But my mother suggested that I go to this doctor that I mentioned in an earlier post herself, lol. I guess she understand my problems a bit better than I thought. :) (I got a box of 100x5mg diazepam prescribed already so now I can tell her about it. I'm gonna say it's a 50x5mg box though because: see below)

I've given some of my diazepams to a friend who is also struggling with a benzo addiction. He had to go cold turkey off 1,5mg xanax and 2mg clonazepam. I gave him 30 pills of 5mg because I felt bad for him, and he'd do the same for me. (He just like me had problems with tramadol, and benzos too and decided to get clean from them a little after me.)

A little later he went to see his dr. and got a prescription for clobazam to taper. So that worked out okay. :)

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by peterovski, Apr 13, 2012
PS:
Aeiko: About your earlier question: At some point when creating the tracker it asks for the date you last used. You should check it that it set correctly. (to april first in your case if I'm not mistaking.) Normally the tracker will update itsself when done correctly.

Don't know what else it could be.

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by Aeiko, Apr 14, 2012
Hello again everyone!

peterovski - Yeah, I believe I will start taking the Clonazepam tomorrow and like you said I will take it sparingly.  Also, thanks for the tip.  I found out what the problem was with my tracker:  I set it to update weekly instead of daily.  I simply changed the setting and now it's working as it should.  Thanks!


I have four days down.  Not feeling too terrible.  The brain zaps seem to be dying down.  I'm cutting the Suboxone down to 0.5mgs tomorrow.  I originally was just going to take 1mg until Monday, but I think I feel comfortable enough to cut it down.  I hope everyone is still hanging on and going strong.  

I had a very eventful day today, and for once since all of this started, I'm actually sleepy.  I guess I'll have to skip a journal entry for today :)

Hope everyone has a wonderful weekend.  Take care!

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by DamTram, Apr 14, 2012
Ptowngirl - thank you so much for your support. =) I feel dumb, because I'm so many months out, but still struggling with a) finishing this clonazepam taper and b) the physical and psychological facets of fibromyalgia that I covered up with Tramadol.  It's so nice to still be able to come here for strength from you all, and to make sure that I don't ever turn back to those evil, white footballs.

I found my 5-htp yesterday, and I'm sure it was a placebo effect...but it totally helped with my mood.  I also took a half dose of Adrenal Stress End (which contains a small amount of L-Tyrosine, since I can't handle the real dosages), but wasn't sure if it made me feel worse (I had a crying fit, but I had also been sitting in soaking wet clothes from the rain for 3 HOURS and couldn't get warm or go home).  I took the 5-htp again today, and again...I was able to do a bunch of chores and not feel worthless.  I just took the Adrenal Stress End a few hours later, so I can figure out if it ends up making me feel worse or even better.

I am so happy that you guys (Aeiko and Ptowngirl) decided to get clean with us. =) Your stories are inspirational, and Peter's transformation from getting clean to helping others get clean is, as well.  You can see in a post from the day before you guys joined us that I was wondering if the lack of new 'faces' was a result of doctors finally regulating their prescription of this medication.  Although that may not yet be the case, it is very comforting that people like you keep finding this journal and joining the fight to be free from this drug.

I'm very nervous, since I'm a few days late to go down from 1/4mg clonazepam to 1/8mg clonazepam and I plan and starting tonight.  My drop from 1/2 to 1/4 went very badly, so I may be coming on here for support. =)

I hope everyone has a wonderful day!

Thank you for being here. =)

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by peterovski, Apr 14, 2012
Don't worry damtram - we'll be here if you need us. :)
I hope the dosage drop goes smoothly.

I'm thinking of chaging my diazepam dosing from 10 @evenings to 5 in the morning & 5 in the evening. Maybe even up it by 5-10mg again if 5-5 doesn' work out (so 10 in the morning, 5-10 in the evening). The reason I was (already) on 10mg was because I simply didn't have any more pills. But now that I do, I think I should avoid any unnecessary uncomfortableness. I'm planning on dosing twice a day, stabilizing and then dropping the evening dose by taking off 2,5mg, then 2,5 of the morning dose, and so on. I never liked having to take my meds at night because it left me anxious and nervous during the day. I'd rather feel "ok" during the day and miserable at night. Not sleeping well happens whether I take it in the morning or the evening so that's not really the issue. I've actually told my parents I visited that old doctor, and they were happy I told them and I think they understand a bit better now. They didin't even complain when I said I was going to up my dose a because I feel miserable. I think they're finally starting to accept the fact that I have social phobia, phew.

I want to stop feeling so nervous, by it artificial or not. Atleast until I get an appointment with the psychiatrist (Which is going to take a while it seems. :( ) I'm gonna take 15-20mgs daily again. Decreasing dose and sticking by it has never been my problem. Just getting off them seems to be near impossible. Can't wait till I get help with that.

Stay healthy! :)

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by Aeiko, Apr 14, 2012
Hey everyone!

Just checking in with everyone.  It's getting better by the day.  I pretty much have stopped taking the Suboxone because I haven't really been needing it.  The brain zaps are fading to almost nothing.  I'm starting to feel good :)  I started taking Clonazepam tonight so we'll see how that goes.  

Sorry for the short reply but I'm actually out of town with a friend.  So please forgive me.  

I hope everyone is having a good weekend.

Take care!

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by denised1982, Apr 15, 2012
Peter- keep up the good work, you really sound like you have it together and you're ready to be free from everything. You have a hell of a lot more strength than you really think, and I am very proud of you.

Aieko- it's so wonderful that you're out with friends! On day 4? Damn, you're awesome. It's like you looked tramadevil in the eyes and said F*** you! On day 4, I was at work but I really wasn't up to being out with friends or talking to anyone! I stayed on the computer, A LOT. On here.  Be careful with the suboxone too... The withdrawals are horrendous and long lasting, too.

Ptowngirl- How are you doing? I hope the k-pins are helping..

Y'all be careful with the benzos, not only are they a b*tch to get off of and potientially life threatening to get off of, but, for people like me (predisposed to depression) they kind of made me have rebound depression, if that makes sense? I dunno. They helped me with my back when my sciatic nerve acts up, but after I go to sleep and wake up, I get aggravated and depressed. Valium was the one that did it to me, specifically. I like them, but I don't. It's a double edged sword.

Tomorrow my black seed oil will be coming in the mail (nigella sativa). I can't wait to try it out. It's supposed to be very beneficial to your health and it's supposed to help with pain, and it also helps with opioid dependence. So we will see how it goes.

DamTram- :( Sorry about you being left out cold in the rain. :( That *****. I would have been p*ssed off too. I hate being wet in clothes, especially my feet in wet socks and shoes. Ugh, it's on up there in one of the most miserable feelings in the world, in the top ten. I hope your taper goes well. Try not to think about it. I know you're a smart woman, but you think too much about these things. Don't try to let that pill rule the way you feel, you're too awesome for that. I love you and you kick @ss and I know you don't deserve to feel like that. So don't, because you're not going crazy, but you think too much about how you might feel. So what? You might feel it. Feelings go away, right? It's the more intelligent people in this world who are plagued by their own thoughts. For what? Perfection? No. Nobody's perfect. I've been there, done that, got the t-shirt. Learn to recognize your triggers that you have numbed with your medication and learn how to stop the cycle of feeling your anxiety, it's just a feeling, and it will be okay. It's easier said than done, but with time, I think you'll be okay. Breathe. I love you and I want to help you, even though I'm across the damn country.

Legal- I'm so happy that your colonoscopy came out okay, so they Michael Jackson'd you, huh? Lol, that ain't right. Hahaha. At least you have a good sense of humor about it.

Sarabie- How's that knee baby? I hope you're doing okay...



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by Sarabie, Apr 15, 2012
Hey guys

I've just been back in the hospital for another knee surgery and I see some new "faces". So a big welcome to you guys :-D

Dear Aeiko and Ptowngirl - please please please be carefull. Getting off a drug by using another is a dangerous way. And from what I've heard, benzoes are even worse than tram to get off. I just read about clonzepam (klonodine) and it's a "hard" benzo that get's you addicted faster than tram. 4 weeks tops. However for you Aeiko it's much better than suboxone which in my country is used for heroin addicts - like methadone. I'm not judging you at all - I'm just concerned. I know how awfull it is to get off tram. I went CT after 5 years of tramadol - the last year with 24 pills a day, so I really understand why you are gasping for something to ease the pain and w/d's. I just really wish you can find the strenght to do it without benzos. You are both doing great and in just a week from now, you'll be feeling a 100% better than the first days without tram.

Well bedtime now. Take care all of you :-)

Love Susie

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by Sarabie, Apr 15, 2012
Oh Denise - you posted while I was writing, so didn't see your post.

Like I told Legal - faith is cruel sometimes - I actually fell over the exact same cat once more - landed on the knee (in a cast though) again, and had to get another operation. Thank God hospitals, doctors etc. are free of charge in Denmark - or I would have been broke now :-D

I can see we are both concerned about our new buddies taking benzoes. Dear Ptowngirl and Aeiko - please know it's only out of love and concern!!!

Good luck with your black seed oil Denise - let us know how it's working :-D



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by denised1982, Apr 15, 2012
Sarabie-- again?! That cat must have it out for you...  Did you forget to feed her one time? Lol.. j/k...

I hope you heal again! I can't believe that happened!!!! AGAIN!!!



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by Ptowngirl, Apr 16, 2012
Holy Hot Mess - today is not going as well. I just got a call from the scheduler for the neurosurgeon.... from the wrong hospital. I am so desperate that I was all like yes Thurday works until my husband shot me a look that spoke volumes (we previously agreed the University was the best option) so I said I would call her back after checking our schedules.... and then had a major melt down.I mean Thursday is so close to start the process to no more pain - but if it isn't at the place I wanted to go then it isn't going to work - dang. I am ok with letting my emotions win some days. Thank you guys for the benzo concern... I have the same one. I was only given 14 0.5 mg pills with no chance of a refill per my request to my doctor. I only wanted to use them during the roughest parts. I did stay busy all weekend! I did a 5k on Saturday morning with my neice and on top of that we are looking to buy a new house so we went to see a few, and my boys are in baseball so it totally helped being out and about. I see today as just a rough patch that will pass.
Sarabie - what a mess! You are so fortunate to not have to worry about the cost of the surgeries but the pain and recovery is such a set back! Hope you are feeling alright and maybe have given the cat it's own room to stay in at least until you recover.
Denise I am really interested to hear how the sativa works for you!
DamTram I hope the step down has been easier - but I am starting to realize nothing about this process has been easy.
Peterovski you are taking such intentional steps to getting better and it is great that your parents are seeing the changes in your efforts and most likely personality. The fact that you are communicating with them and they are actually hearing you without judgement says so much. Possibly a therapist for all of you to openly discuss your needs from them would be helpful.
Aeiko, good to know things are improving, one day at a time!
Legaljunky great news on the colonoscopy results! Well I am sure that is a double edged sword because having nothing show up doesn't solve the issues that lead to it in the first place.

Today is humbling, a reminder that I cannot side track or ignore the way this process is affecting me and I need to have days of reflection of how far I can come in one day. So I will grab the tissues and give in to the overwhelming emotional things that are bubbling out. Thank you all for being a part of it!

Big Deep Breath!

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by DamTram, Apr 16, 2012
Hey, Guys...I've been lurking but not posting, due to time constraints.  Thank you for ALL of your kind words!  Last night I finally made my drop to 1/8mg and I survived!  So you were right, Denise. =) Did you see that recent episode of The Big Bang Theory?  Amy tells Sheldon that it's the less intelligent people that deal better with their emotions because they don't overthink things - it was like you were quoting the episode =)  

I actually had a devastating interpersonal experience last week, so I was in a very bad place.  But out of darkness, light.  I can finally move on with my life after more than 15 years of pain and have accepted that I will make friends when I make friends, but I will definitely not make them if I'm not already enjoying life.  So, I've turned a new leaf in that department.

Also, I was put on Phenargen (anti-nausea, sedative) after my last Klonopin drop ended up in a nervous breakdown (since I was also trying to quit smoking) and was told it wasn't an antihistamine...except it was.  I took it for TWO AND A HALF WEEKS!  No wonder I was depressed, lethargic, full of migraines, and it total, full body pain!  I haven't taken any since Friday night (I figured out it was an antihistamine on Saturday), and I feel like a new person.  I can't wait until I'm completely benzo and Lyrica free!

Legal - I'm SO glad the news was good!  Hope you are feeling well. =)

Susie - My cats are ALWAYS trying to trip me, but I am going to be SO CAREFUL since hearing your stories!  The thought of falling on an already broken knee makes me very nauseous...but I am certainly jealous of your healthcare system!  The US is the only first world country without universal healthcare, but I will not get further into politics in this safe space. =)

Ptown - a 5K???  Aeiko - out of town???  You guys put me to shame!  I think I would've died if I'd tried to do either of those things during week 1.  You guys are amazing.  Ptown, I'm glad the Klonopin helped and that you won't be taking it after this.  

Peter - I'm so glad you're taking care of yourself.  Do NOT beat yourself up about taking a higher dose.  We're not supposed to give taper advice on this forum, so I encourage you to do an internet search for "************".  You will LOOOOOOVE their forums and advice, and you will feel much less lost.  I know seeing a psychiatrist to help you is the best option, but since it's not possible, please check them out.  You will learn so, so much from and about people that have been on them long term that struggled with getting off.  I stumbled on them by accident when trying to figure out how to best get off the tail end of my Lyrica, and I'm so glad that I did.

You guys are all doing so great, and you played no small part in helping me to start enjoying life, again.  I even started reading for pleasure for the first time in 3 months, and I'm about to go walking for the 3rd day in a row (which I had completely stopped).  

Fight on!  We are wiiiiiiiiiiinniiiiiing!

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by Icandothis10, Apr 17, 2012
Hello all my old friends and new ones.  I have three days left in this hole and I get on the plane.  I cannot even go into how proud I am of myself for going through this and here of all places.  I'm making it on two pills a day, sometimes, I'll pop another but I have enough until I get home.  I'm telling everyone, you just have to go with it.  I have confided in one person here and they've been WONDERFUL in checking on me and making sure I'm ok.  I've been popping Advil like it's PEZ though.  I can't even imagine doing what I've done before and popping 20-30 of these things a day.  I'll go home, I get two full weeks off for R&R and I'm thinking about jumping ship on these things.  I've not decided yet.  Our R&R time is pretty important to us and I don't want to suffer but I think since I've come this far, maybe a couple of days of laying on the couch while the hubby is at work will work wonders for stabbing this demon for good.  I can't believe I made it this far.  I realized just how awesome life can be when you wake up in the morning refreshed!  Not depressed.  I really hope you all are doing well.  I'll be back in the states next week and be able to chat w/everyone some more.  See you all on the flip side - of the planet that is!  hugs!

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by Lynnae80, Apr 17, 2012
Hello.
   I am glad I found this support, I am 3 days into withdrawal. this is the first time I have went without Tramadol in at least 1 and a half year. I have chronic pain in my legs. The Dr. I was seeing was giving me 240 tramadol and 120 loritab a month.
this Dr left and I went to a new dr, who is more worried about my anxiety than my pain. He cut off the loritab, which I had no problem not taking them, no withdrawals at all. He cut my tramadol down to 80 a month. I ran out in two weeks. I honestly do not know how much longer I can take this. I go back the 26th and will be able to refill, but I now I will be back in the same condition. Does anyone now how much longer it will be before I will be able to stand myself. I feel like I am crawling out of my skin.

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by jessamy88, Apr 17, 2012
I got messed up with this junk the second time around because l was in the hospital and my "pain pill" ended up to be that! I can't do cold turkey and have no problem weaning off slowing. But I am hoping someone can answer this question. I am down to half a pill a day and in a few days they will be gone. This is exactly how l weaned off before and l had virtually no withdrawal symptoms. This time it is kicking my butt. Why? When l weaned off so slow? Maybe nobody knows the answer to that but l just thought l would ask. I don't know why it would be different the second time around. ? So confused.

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by Aeiko, Apr 17, 2012
Hello everyone!

I apologize for the delay in posting anything, but I've been keeping myself busy so I can keep my mind occupied.  Today is a week I've been clean from Tramadol.   It's been fairly rough, but got increasingly easier towards the weekend.  I am no longer taking Suboxone and only take Clonzepam (0.5mg) once a day a few hours before I'm ready for bed.

I can say that I feel I'm at about 75%.  My mind isn't as clouded as it once was when I was taking the Tramadol.  I'm in a far better mood.  I do feel a little weak and sore at times, but I generally just make myself do things when I start feeling that way.  The only really annoyance I have now is the brain zaps.  They come and go, but they are still annoying :P

denised1982-  Thanks for the kind words :)  I really wasn't up to doing much in all honesty, but then I asked myself:  "What is better for me at the moment?  Mope around and lay in bed, or try and get out and get my mind off of things".  Obviously I choose the latter.  It was somewhat difficult in the beginning, but it got easier by the day.  I appreciate the warning about the benzos.  I personally hate them, I've never liked anything that would make me feel tired and based on past experience with Drs, I'm extreamly sensitive to them.  A half a peach Xanex practically knocks me out.  Because of this, I've never taken them since.  If it wasn't because I needed them for sleep, I wouldn't be taking them now.  I started out with a total of 9.  I have 6 remaining, and once those 6 are gone that will be it.

Sarabie-  I appreciate the concern and totally understand.  Like I mentioned above, I have 6 left.  I've been taking 1 a night before bed.  Once those are gone, that will be the end of it.  But with that said, I have been sleeping a lot better that past few months.  Last night was actually the first time I laid down and went straight to sleep forever.  I ended up sleeping 14 hours! O.o

Ptowngirl- Hello there!  I hadn't seen you post in a few days and was starting to worry about you.  It's good to see you are still hanging in there.  I know it may be hard now, but it gets easier.  I guess the only reason I'm having such an easy time is because I've dealt with this before.   I am a System Analyst as well as a PHP Web Developer by profession.  I've had to sit at a desk for 10+ hours a day for over 10 years now.  I didn't have the most ergonomic accommodations  so naturally I had problems with my back.  The first DR I had ever went to in my life prescribed my Roxicontin which is a generic brand of Oxycodone. I took it for about 6 months and developed a dependency on it.  My family could notice a lot of bad changes occurring in result of that medication so I flushed it all.  My family will always come first.  But I was ignorant to medicine.  That was honestly the first time in my life I had taken anything aside for OTC medication.  Well needless to say I was terribly sick and had horrible withdrawals and went to a local detox center which taught me how medication effects you and things you can do to prevent relapse.  I really hated to go to a detox center, but I did not hesitate at all to go because I knew it was in the best interest of myself and my family.  I came out with a new perspective and never relapsed on any sort of narcotic pain medicine.  

What was interesting about all of this however was while I was in the detox clinic, I had spoken to several to the nurses and explained my problem of having legitimate back pain and sought out what they felt would help ease my pain.  Every nurse I spoke to always said either Naproxen (Aleve) or Tramadol.  So once I got out of treatment I found a new doctor and requested Tramadol and I had taken it ever since.  Little did I know I'd be enduring the same issues AGAIN 3 years later.   It goes to show how little educations there is on this medication and how the FDA needs to do more research before allowing medications to be put on the market.  

DamTram- I think the better term you're looking for is "Hard Headed" :)  Because I can be hard headed at times.  My body definitely was not up to it, but I had to put those thoughts and emotions out of my mind.  I wouldn't accept defeat, because defeat is not an option.... plus I'm hard headed, I just wanted to mention that again if I haven't mentioned that enough ;)  

Icandothis10- Hello!  I hope you have a safe flight back home and you're able to get some R&R, it is important!

Lynnae80-  Welcome to the board!  This is an excellent site with tons of valuable information and awesome people that can help you!  If you're looking to live your life without Tramadol it isn't easy, but very possible.  I've been off of Tramadol for a week and I already notice a LARGE positive difference in my personality, so it's definitely worth it. If you don't feel you can stop cold turkey I would recommend weaning yourself down.  You could also try and talk to your doctor and just be honest with him and hopefully they will help you quit with the Tramadol.  Unfortunatly I didn't have that option, when I told my Dr that I had a dependency on Tramadol he looked at me like I was crazy.  But there are several people here that could give you better ideas but most people here are willing to help you in any way you can.  Good luck!

jessamy88- Hello there!  I can't really give you a scientific explanation as to why, but I know through experience that most things are harder to quit the second go around.  That's pretty much for anything, drugs, smoking, etc....How long have you been taking and what dose did you take per day the last time and now?  That would allow us to give you a better answer.  But hang in there. You'll make it!






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by Aeiko, Apr 17, 2012
I almost forgot!  Today I have been clean for a week!  And I feel great! :D Woohoo!

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by jessamy88, Apr 18, 2012
Hi there,

Thanks for the input! To answer your question, the first time l was at ten pills a day (50mg) at peak and this time l was at 6 at peak. That is really the only difference. I did the taper the same way, which was cutting the dose by one pill a day every five days. And then eventually ending up at a half a pill for five days and then nothing after that. Last time l felt virtually nothing with regard to withdrawal. This time the creepy crawly sensation at night, which l guess is restless leg syndrome, was pretty bad and l also had a lot of chills and mental sluggishness. But if it is commonly more difficult the second time around that may be all it is. I was not aware of that and it's good to know. Its getting a little better but it is still a drag because l was so sure l would feel nothing. I have been taking a half a xanax at night which seems to be helping a little. l have used those occasionally for the last twelve years for panic attacks and have never in the whole of my life been tempted to abuse them because l get no benefit from them other then their intended use for panic. I know that's not the case with some people. But there's nothing enticing to me about them so l am not worried about that and they do seem to help the creepy crawly feeling. Other than that, the hot showers and vitamins do seem to help. And an herb called rhodelia rosea. I know a lot of people do well on St. Johnswort but that herb has an adverse effect on me for some reason...I get more depressed. And l tried it on three separate occasions too, to make sure I was right and it was not just other factors. But the rhodelia seems to do for me what l think St. Johnswort does for most other people, so all's well that ends well with that experiment l guess. LOL Thanks so much for the input, I really appreciate it!

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by gunitbot6, Apr 18, 2012
jessamy88 how long where you taking the pill the first time and what dosage and how long the second time and what dosage?

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by gunitbot6, Apr 18, 2012
never mind i see the answer to that,  

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by fightorfight, Apr 18, 2012
Hey guys and gals,

Just a quick hello, and hope that everyone is doing alright.    Keep on keeping on, it gets better, it really does.    Trust me.    It may take a few tries-- but it can be done.   :)

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by DamTram, Apr 19, 2012
Everyone sounds great!  You especially, Fight. =) It sounds like things are finally coming around.

Jessamy - Nothing was as bad as the first time that I withdrew.  I relapsed twice, but the withdrawal was nothing compared to the first one.  I would venture to guess that general health (whatever else was going on with you, physically, chemically, mentally) plays a huge part.  Something might just be different, in general, since last time.  My other hypothesis is that you probably still had some tramadol hanging out in your system (it stays around in your fat cells for quite awhile), so when you started taking it again...things were compounded.  I have no idea, but no more tramadol, ok? =)

Lynne - The pain and crawling and h e double hockey sticks you are experiencing now will continue for your whole life, if you continue to use.  As tolerance builds and builds, withdrawal symptoms will start sooner and sooner after your most recent dose.  This will be your experience every time you run out of pills early.  If you don't refill your script, the horror starts to get better after 4ish days.  But it will last much longer if you don't actually want to be off the drug.  Sending you strength, whatever you choose.

Aeiko - Congratulations!!!  Now it's been more than a week!  You're freeee!

Ican - Welcome home!!  I hope you decide to get clean.  Life is so much better on the other side.

My benzo drop has been going well (at 1/8mg clonazepam, now), but yesterday morning I forgot to take my 37.5mg of Lyrica until I started having a panic attack in class because someone was eating potato chips (I have sensor processing disorder, and certain sounds lead to a panic reaction).  I made it to the bathroom before I started crying, but it was just another reminder of how excited I am to NOT have to keep these pharmaceuticals in my life.  I forced myself to stay for the rest of my classes, and came home and took my GABA, Kava Kava Root, the full 75mg of Lyrica, and the 1/8mg of clonazepam.  At that point, I really felt like I was dying but once that stuff digested, I felt better than I have in months.  On such low doses of those 2 medications, it made me realize how close I am to being able to feel that way WITHOUT them.  I don't mind continuing the supplements for a little while, though.  They've helped so much.

Anyway, sorry for the ramble.  Thank you for all your support.  Fight on! =)

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by EmilyPost, Apr 19, 2012
This thread is closed.

Please post on part 52 ...


http://www.medhelp.org/user_journals/show/353222/Tramadol--Ultram-Recovery-Room-Part-52

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by losmo, Jun 06, 2012
Hi Everyone. I am so proud of the people who have taken such a healthy road. Well my story is I have digenerative disk but I don't feel pain lately. I'm thinking about coming off Tramadol. I take a half of a 50 mlg in the am and the other half in the late afternoon. Sometimes a half to go back to bed at 3am and another half when I wake up. I feel really tired and I want more energy, so i want to stop taking the tramadol. In can't get through the withdraw pain or the chaos of being off it or sometimes the pain, so I feel stuck. I feel sad I miss appointments sometimes and I get tired and overwhelmed. I can't keep up with a busy schedule without getting tired. This is no way to live. I am taking such a minimum dose but I'm getting such negative affects mostly I'm always tired. Please help!!! Thanks

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by losmo, Jun 06, 2012
I'm taking basically 50-75 mlg a day so tired can't keep up with everything.

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by ImDONENoMore, Jun 06, 2012
Hi losmo and welcome!  If you look above your post, you'll see a post from Emily with a link to the next page of this thread.  Post there and you'll get a ton of support I'm sure - again, welcome and good luck to you!  :)

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by BJP123, Jul 11, 2012
I recently had to detox "cold turkey" off of Tramadol (300-500mg/day), Clonazepam (3-4mg/day), and Subutex (2-8mg/day). I was arrested and put in jail for three weeks and it was three weeks of hell. I have cold turkey'd Tramadol before and had awful hallucinations but luckily not this time. I was, however, shaking so bad I couldn't hold a spoon, couldn't even hold water because my stomach was so upset, had awful diarrhea (and there was 1 toilet for 12 men!) I had never been so uncomfortable in my life, I thought to myself I would either have a seizure or stroke or both. After three weeks I still felt bad but I believe it was because I was taken off Clonazepam. My depression was gone so I think the Tramadol w/d's were done with. I believe that withdrawals from this drug is different for everyone, depending on how good your liver enzymes converts Tramadol into the narcotic. I switched to Norco for my pain but only take them as needed and I don't feel any w/d symptoms. In my opinion, Tramadol really messes with your brain function horribly. For those of you who are currently tampering or going cold turkey off of Tramadol, just remember, it could be A LOT WORSE, as in stuck in jail feeling like you are a crazy person. I would recommend just walking or running as much as possible.

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