Hello. I just wanted to let you know you are not alone. Although I can not respond in full to your post right now please know there are people out there that cares. I will respond back to you tomorrow. Best wishes. Typically pain med detox takes anywhere from 5 to 9 days. You are almost to the point ( A day or two) where you probably will start to feel a little better each day. I know how bad it *****.
Try not to be so hard on yourself. There is no way you can take pain meds for chronic pain and not get addicted. No way, no how. It comes with the prescription. Doctors don't do a very good job explaining this to their patients. I carried shame on my shoulders for a long, long time and I still do to this day but I can tell you it gets better. See you tomorrow. BD
If you want to tell me a little more detail about what you were taking, the dose, and for how long I would be happy to help.
usually the pain contracts say that they will give you the final 30 days of meds and then you are on your own. your failed test will follow you.
it may be best to just buckle up and ride this out. days 3 & 4 is usually the worst. many people take immodium in copious amounts to help, but i personally have no experience.
you will get through this. i hate that doctors do this to people,, but i realize they have to have some limits, rules because too many people just abuse meds.
just be thankful that the meds you are on are not heavier. however; i have heard that ultram is a strange, hard detox. either way, 5-7 days should be the worst.
I'm on day 4 myself I actually got out of bed as took a shower and got dressed . The day time isn't the hard part the night is when reality sets in unless u have some sleeping meds or benzo don't plan on getting any sleep ,I've been takin anti diarrhea meds religiously 4 every 4hrs and Tylenol every 8hrs . U havta stay strong minded. It's the devil and it will destroy ur life if it hasn't already . Stay strong take Immodium and drink water . Watch Netflix in bed do whatever u have to to try and keep ur mind right....
Wow, your on a lot of controlled substances. I'm really surprised your being prescribed all of those meds Physicians usually won't prescribe an Opiate (Percocet) and a Benzodiazapam (Valium) together unless you have 4th stage cancer Especially because of the risk of Respiratory Arrest. The pain management center is doing its job because you broke their rules by taking your Fathers Tylonol 3 to bump up the effect of the Percocet. Usually pain management centers will not increase the dosage of medications unless you state your in severe Physical pain from an injury or disease. "Not withdrawal Discomfort". That being said I am sooo sorry about your Son's TBI and the deseases your suffering from. I think you should look for a new pain clinic and Tell Them The Truth please do not embellish by stating you put the wrong meds in your pill box being on all of those meds is a huge Responsibility for You and especially the prescribing Physician. That being said you can try the Thomas Recipe it helps with WD you can do a google search to find it. I humbly and Honestly think you should find a Physician who specializes in Substance Abuse and pain management to help you get this whole thing under control before you end up in a Hopital like I did 14 years ago detoxing for 63 days. I will keep you in my Prayers and Blessings and light a candle of Special Intent for you. My Friend and Sister the rest is up to you to seek the Help you need and by coming on MH was a step in the right direction InDeed, Hope and Pray you stay so we can help you through this ~ jimi (little wing =0)
In reading your post, my opinion would be to NOT try to w/d from all of these different medicines at home. This is alot of prescriptions you've been taking and for quite some time. I'm not sure that it's a good idea to go cold turkey without medical staff present in your case. Maybe I'm wrong, and I'm hoping nursegirl will come on shortly and tell you what needs to be done, but I do think this one's gonna be a hard one. I'm trying to figure out how you fail a drug test where it shows up codeine if you were taking percocets anyway? Don't they both have codeine? If I were you I would start immediately looking for a detox center in your area that can take you ASAP! No waiting 30 days, you need to go now! Please be very careful with this...
I agree, Motye. The Ultram and the Valium should not be stopped cold turkey. I do not think Percocet has codeine in it, but I'm not sure.
Lovelylady, I hope you will get a doctors assistance with this. It could be dangerous to suddenly stop the Ultram and Valium, due to a risk of seizures. Take care, and keep posting and let us know how you are doing.
Percocet has Oxycodone with Acetaminophen, Tylenol (3) has Acetaminophen with a half grain of Codeine.
I'm sorry, Tylenol (3) has a full grain of Codeine and they do show up differently with a Tox Screen =0) I agree she should look at the options of going to a hospital to detox where they have Medical Professionals to help with the detox but she has to be open and honest with the staff.
Prayers and Blessings
jimi (little wing)
I agree that a medically supervised detox would be best, considering the multiple medications you're on. The Valium is especially problematic and risky, as abrupt benzo discontinuation can lead to seizures. Valium is less risky in that regard, but it is still a concern, and with the symptoms of the opiate w/d, your seizure thresh hold may be lowered.
I would really recommend doing this with the help of a doctor, inpatient would be great, but if not, outpatient with close monitoring of a doctor, preferably one who specializes in addiction. You also need to start now to find a new pain doctor/clinic. Your pain issues are still going to need to be managed, and it may be difficult to find a new doctor right away being that you were dismissed from the last clinic.
Best to you, keep posting!
Great answer to a tough situation =0)
Thanks for your support all. What's really messed up about this situation is that I feel like they forced me into this - they originally wanted me in Opana ER and I'm like ain't no way. I try to take as few drugs as possible because since having bypass surgery everything hits me 2x as hard so I usually cut my doses in half to get the effect I need. I've been working in the oncology field for 10 years and before that I was in PT/OT/ST, pediatrics and family practice so I'm very familiar with these drugs and these side effects. The only drugs I really need to take are my estrogen replacement since I had a hysterectomy at 29, and then weekly doses of 50,000 units of vitamin D and monthly shots of B12 because I'm chronically deficient in them due to my particular type of bypass surgery. I've had migraines ever since I was 12 so I take Imitrex for them and I also take ironically percocet as my breakthrough med for when the max amount of Imitrex doesn't work.
I have no money and no time for inpatient or outpt rehab because I am already in the hole with so much leave from last year with my son's 7 month coma in a different state and all the leave I took when he transitioned back down here. My company was very gracious to keep paying me but as a result I owe them by not taking time this year to get back out of the negative.
I don't feel like I need medical intervention at this time. I am actually very peaceful right now. Still don't have much of an appetite but I force myself to eat something - however that's not an uncommon thing for me because the bypass surgery made me not want to eat a lot or anything afterwards. I'm more a grazer.
I found a bottle of alprazolam 0.5 night that I was prescribed 2 years ago for flights (you do not want to be on a plane going through turbulence with me) and the night I wrote my initial post I took one of those with an Ambien to get to sleep. If I feel the anxiety coming on I take half a pill now and it works fine. I also picked up my last dose of ultram which my PCP gave me to wean from and have been taking one in the morning since that's the worst time and I'm good with half a pill later in the day if I need it. I'm really trying to lay off all the Tylenol and Aleve because I don't want to blow out my liver.
In a way, I'm glad that this is happening now because I am covering for another employee at work for two weeks while she is on vacation so I am hellabusy and it keeps me focused. I normally eat mostly organic but I've been indulging in a lot of comfort food to get by (cheesy poofs are my addiction du jour) and make sure I eat a good protein filled dinner. We put everyone here in the house on a 10 PM bedtime, and to be honest it's done wonders for all of us. As of today we all seem more rested. That could be my Ambien talking though... Which I will never have an addiction to. I would only take them when I was in school online and writing papers to all hours of the night so we are talking maybe 1-2 per week once a month.
I'm doing the shower bit but I've always enjoyed a good hot shower. I have been making sure my husband wakes me up as soon as he's done so I can start doing yoga and Pilates stretches before my shower and to mentally prepare myself for the day. I came across my mantra for this whole process the other day purely by accident - "what may feel like a disaster is actually a graduation" and I think it's just so apropos for what I'm going through.
I don't feel like I need these drugs anymore and I feel strong enough that if I had to take a Percocet for my migraine that would be it. I figure if my son could make it through Marine boot camp, survive an injury that killed him and brought him back to life despite every odd against him, and then have him be here today telling me that he's glad I've become such a wonderful parent and he loves me very much... I can do this. His injury retained me to focus on positives instead of negatives. Now I just have to apply it to me - I'm great at doing it for others but not so much for myself.
you are a HUGE inspiration and i am grateful for your post. thank you and your son for his service. he is a hero. you got this. hope he is better. he seems to have a great attitude on life, just like mom. thank you
You are an Inspiration and please thank your Son for his service may GOD bless him Always. Sorry for my post sounding a little harsh but I truly Care about you and want you to get the help and care you need to get over the demon addiction/dependency I will keep you in my heart felt prayers. Stay strong, determined, and persevere through these tough times. Thanks for your service as a medical professional I'm sure your very caring towards your Pt's. Please keep us up to date on your progress.
Prayers, Blessings, and Strength From Above
jimi (little wing =0)
When I read you initial post I was horrified-
The opiates are no problem to C/T but the Ultram and Valium and all at once? NO NO NO.
I breathed a sigh of relief as I read on and found that you have enough benzo and ultram to wean down. Please know that when you get to the end of this- it may be really rough. I hope not- but it could be, so prepare. Benzo w/d is tricky. I have been tapering for 6 years..6! And am finally, almost at the finish line. I started at 60 mg of oxazepam for sleep combined with zoplicone when I was on prednisone for my Crohn's disease. The pred made me so anxious and revved up that I never slept- and as I was on it for 4 years...Well you can see how I became so dependent.
I never took more than prescribed but getting off it has been tough.
I C/T off a high dose of opiates in 2011 after tapering for a year and being miserable. I just wanted off so I jumped. A few months later I started tapering from the benzos. I kept getting stuck at 20 mg. I just couldn't sleep at all when I hit that point. And I mean FOR DAYS.
So I finally got a new doctor when mine left and because I'm going through this horrific process of getting yet another surgery for my stage 4 endometriosis so that I can finally, hopefully conceive- I wanted to get off the benzos for good. My new doc switched me to valium and prescribed tryptophan and melatonin in high doses. Tryptophan in high doses is a natural seratonin booster and mood stabilizer. It deepens and increases the quality of your sleep. Within 2 weeks I was able to cold turkey the zoplicone (after nearly 2 decades of use) and drop down on the valium with NO side effects. I am sleeping better than I have in YEARS (and I'm in hell pain so this is a major success)
I'm telling you this because I think it would be a great natural option for you to replace both the benzos and the ULtram. It may make your transition a lot easier.
Lord woman, you've been on one heck of a rough journey and it sounds like you take care of everyone. Please make sure that you are taking good loving care of yourself.
I am so sorry this happened with the pain clinic- but maybe it is a blessing in disguise? Opiates are NOT good treatment for chronic pain. EVER.
And speaking as a fellow autoimmune disease person-
I have Crohn's, Rheumatoid Arthritis, Interstitial Cystitis, and Endometriosis- the opiates are NOT good. With the exception of the endo- they make the pain worse.
I found that proper rest, a strict anti-inflammatory diet, and a regular yoga practice were absolutely sufficient on keeping my pain levels under control.
Stress is a huge contributor to autoimmune flares (as I'm sure you are aware) I know it is near impossible for you to avoid given your son's circumstances (bless your heart, I can't imagine) So you are going to have to find ways to find peace for yourself. I would highly recommend Yoga as a regular daily practice as well as some CBT or one on one counselling to help you manage. I also had some success with Biofeedback therapy. Whatever you do, stay away from acupuncture or deep tissue massage- NOT GOOD for fibromyalgia.
I think you will find you are in LESS pain off the opiates than on. It takes about a month or so to get over the rebound pain and regulate. I was shocked to find I was in 90% less pain than I was while using.
I was basically able to manage my pain entirely without drugs until this latest endo flare wreaked absolute havoc on my life.
Opiates are wonderful and have their time and place. I would not be able to even type these words right now without them- BUT-
They are short term solutions. They create so many long term problems that it just is NOT worth it.
I would really encourage you to talk to your doctor about Tryptophan. And I really hope you find some peace. You deserve it.
If you have any questions feel free to PM me okay?
Sounds like you are doing well. Wanted to let you know that I have also gained weight and it is in fact depressing me right now. I am having surgery at the end of August for torn ligaments in my shoulder and I can't wait to stop taking these meds. Can you tell me what a TBI is? I haven't heard of that abbreviation before. you said that is what your son has. And, I am sorry about your son.
So it's been a week and while I am pretty well balanced emotionally and sleeping well, I've had the most awful migraines I've had in a long time. I actually ended up going to my PCP to get a script for Zofran and she gave me 10 pills of Percocet 5/325 to get through until I can see the neurologist. It literally feels like I have an atomic bomb going off in my head. I had a brief period of respite yesterday that allowed me to get up and do things that I've neglected for months, like clean my bedroom and put clothes away. I never realized I was such a slob - just another realization how out of touch I've been.
Am I still considered dependent/addicted now? I have been coping with the normal aches and pains well, only giving in to half an Ultram if I need it (and that's a final resort after tylenol/aleve/heat). I admit that I got a little bit of a rush that the PCP actually gave me Percocet but that was because I knew I would finally get pain relief since the Percocet is a final step before the ER. I took a full tablet on Saturday with my regular migraine meds and it made the pain abate to a level I could deal with. Today, however, decapitation seems like a quality option. I know what is triggering it - the weather which I don't have control over. When I woke up with it this morning I knew it was going to be one of those days - it is like ER level of pain where they give me morphine and benadryl and IV fluids. I'm avoiding that route since I a) will have a $300 copay along with the fact that I just don't have time for it and b) feel like if I go that route it will be opening Pandora's box and throw me off my game plan.
I feel like my body is hypersensitive to everything right now - sounds and smells are particularly nauseating. Am I perpetuating my issue by by going on/off the meds only when I need it? I haven't taken any alprazolam since last week because I am super chill and very even with my mood.
Just not sure I can hold out much longer with the migraine, though. I am doing really well with only taking meds when I need it, have zero cravings for any meds and feel like I am back at my regular pre-pain clinic level of awareness of my body.
TBI = traumatic brain injury. Son hit a deer, car flipped 5x and hit 2 trees - speed of impact was approximately 100 MPH per the police. The fact that he is alive and can walk, talk, dress, eat, and do what we do is the highest of miracles. However, he needs 24 hour supervision because he has no short term memory. For example he will get up in the middle of the night and do things and won't remember doing it. Right now I am in the midst of healing a 2nd degree burns on his neck from all of the acne medication he put on it. I am under consistent stress because he has no filter (the impulsivity part of his brain was damaged the worst) and he goes from zero to napalm in seconds. The only caretaker I have is my 73-year old dad who my son hates because he insists on treating my son like an invalid when we let him be as independent as possible. My dad also is a borderline alcoholic and a misogynist so he likes to remind me daily how I fail as a mother because I "choose" work over my son. Though my son is on Medicaid there is a 4-6k waiting list for the services he needs so all of it comes out of my pocket except the $700/mo he gets in disability through social security. Half of that goes to my dad for watching him while the other half goes to my husband for paying for the super good health insurance to cover the meds he needs and therapy.
The worst part is he was in the military but I can't get the Marine Corps to get me his medical discharge paperwork so that I can see if he's eligible for VA care through their brain injury program or even a small pension of some sort. He was only in for 9 months as of the date of the accident and you have to be in for 2 years before you get coverage unless you were hurt in a war zone, which he was not.
I am a little bit concerned for you for a couple of reasons. Can you please clarify- are you currently taking any benzos? If not, when was your last dose and when did the head ache start?
I am asking because the first time I cold turkeyed opiates I c/t benzos as well. I developed a terrible migraine like head ache that lasted days until I finally saw a doc and he said it was from the c/t of the benzos and a sign of possible seizure. He put me back on the benzos.
Another thing that can cause the headache is opiate w/d - I had a terrible migraine headache the entire time I was tapering- like 6 or 7 months. It was one of the reasons I jumped off at a pretty high dose- I could not take the misery. The headache dissipated once the drugs were entirely out of my system.
This could be why the percocet is helping your headache. A real migraine does not respond to opiates- only migraine specific meds.
Even if you are only taking low doses of Ultram- you are still not clean and the head ache is normal. It su*& big time. But treating it with other opiates is only going to set you back.
You really need to think about what you want here. If the goal is to be pain pill free- then you are going to have to be willing to go through some rough stuff to get there (trust me when I tell you it's worth it all and more)
If the C/T is too much for you at this time given all your stressful circumstances- then perhaps a slower taper is a better option. You will still experience slight w/d's but nothing like what you are experiencing now.
I would STAY AWAY from the percocet. This drug is major addictive and can easily just be STOPPED physically- mentally it is a WHOLE other ballgame.
I would discuss a slow taper plan off the Ultram with your doc and I would do the same with the benzos.
I know I am being a bit bossy but I've been where you are- and I want you to be healthy and safe...Ok?
Please talk to a doc asap.
And keep posting (:
My heart hurts for you after reading all that you've gone through! Goodness! I'm so sorry your son went through what he did, you're right, it's a miracle he's here with you today! What a blessing! Even with counting your lucky stars, it's tough to be a FT caretaker, especially with the kinds of challenges you have with your son.
It sounds like you've got a good head on your shoulders as far as your plans to detox, just PLEASE be cautious reaching for things (and combining them) to get some relief. It worries me that you've taken Ultram, Percocet, Ambien and Xanax, all within a short period of time. That can be very dangerous as I'm sure you know. People have accidentally OD'ed mixing drugs just to get some sleep, or to calm anxiety. Even people with high tolerances have succumb to mixing medications.
Also, I worry about whether you're dealing with strictly dependency or if you've become addicted. I think it's wise to keep your eyes wide open. The fact that you had the reaction you did when your doc Rx'ed the Percocet is a little concerning. It's difficult sometimes to determine if indeed you are bordering on addiction versus just dependency. There are some things you can do to give you a better idea.....
The following is a link to a self test you can take, for starters:
You can also google "addiction self test" and you will get many results.
It's really important that you DO try to honestly answer that question for yourself...because how you proceed moving forward will vary depending on what you're dealing with. Dependency would only involve the physical detox, and managing pain, while the addiction would require a much more comprehensive recovery program, that addresses the MENTAL/COGNITIVE aspect.
I wish you the very best, keep talking to us!
TBIs. Oh I have experience with that. My husband got into a motorcycle accident @ 2 years ago. 2 brain surgeries later and therapy. Oh was the first year rough. Mood swings. Anger directed at me (typical I guess) confusion, memory loss (at least 10 years), short term memory loss (couldn't remember what did earlier in day), perservation (insisting something is right even if not) and on and on. It was the most stressful year of my life ever. Things have calmed down but he is still not the same. Won't be.
So with everything I hand it to you. It is not easy. And your Dad may not be treating him as much like an invalid as son says or thinks. He just may be perceiving it all wrong. But no amount of reason will change his mind.
You are doing good. Can you be dependent still now? Even with lower doses? Yes you can in my opinion. If your body reacts to not having it, that is dependent. Are you addicted? You seem to be controlling it well. Only you can tell. The migraines should level off soon. You are getting rebound pain plus the pain from not taking so much. I had bad headaches early in my taper too. They went away.
So keep going. Stay strong. And remember to take time for yourself too in all this. You need it for your sanity. You all need a break regularly.
So yesterday morning about a mile from my office I was in a car accident. I hit a parked car at about 30 mph. I'm bruised from head to toe, think I cracked a rib (hurts to cough, lie down except when I lie on it) and am having horrible doubts about the whole thing. I was cruising along just fine - great song was playing on the radio - then bam next thing I know my car sideswiped the parked car. I remember there being a brief LOC but not sure if before or after. Had the common sense to drag my car out of the roadway despite all the pain and a broken front axle. I was beside myself after I called the police and my boss - I called my husband in tears and he came running to my aid. He got there before the tow truck and said that he said this wouldn't have happened had I gotten my car fixed last month right after I rear ended someone. Now I'm convinced I'm a menace to society and don't belong anywhere alone. I am alternating between moments of normalcy to absolute panic and doubt. I took an Ambien to sleep yesterday but no Percocet or Ultram - strictly Tylenol all day. It didn't hurt too bad until I laid down to sleep which is why I took the Ambien. Appt with the psychiatrist isn't until Saturday and I'm not sure I can make it that long. Woke up this morning nauseous but well rested, took a hot shower and was superb alert for work. Now as the day goes by I'm getting more and more depressed. I am literally hiding out in the bathroom in a different part of the building because I don't know what to do. The alprazolam is in my purse but I don't want to take it.
Not sure how to cope now. Just want this all to be over with.
Oh my hon, I'm so sorry! That stinks!
I'm worried about you! I'm concerned that the Ambien may have been a contributing factor in the accident! Ambien is one of those drugs that can really pack a wallop, leaving people confused, with memory loss, and trouble with cognitive function, especially if you didn't get a sufficient quantity AND quality of sleep after taking it.
I know this process has been very hard on you...definitely reach out to your doctor for help with this. Call the office today, explain what happened, and ask if they would squeeze you in with an urgent appointment. Hang in there!
You're certainly not a menace to society, and this WILL get better, it just takes time! Thinking of you!
I have same story. Got sick in 92. CFIDS. Had to work. In 2000 I couldn't do it any more. Started taking hydrocodone. Now 14 years later I was cut off completely. I smoked pot once and did not realize I could not. No second chances. I made so many phone calls. I went to a methadone clinic 4 am. They only maintain. I want to detoxe. Later that day I called a clinic I could check into for45 days. No can do. I live in ny and I have responsibilities. I have a young relative staying with me this summer. More phone calls and another clinics gave me a Drs name for outpatient help. I was desperate I went and was given suboxone. I'm hearing lots of bad stuff but I want to stick with it. I want off.... Yesterday I took 4 mg and up 12mg in one day. 22 hours later I had a head such jittery and sweats. It's 12:30 and had to take another 4 mg. I just hope I,m not sabotaging any recovery. What do you think.
Hi there Lovely-
Yikes! I'm with Nursegirl. Very concerned about you. You are playing with a few different meds and this could be putting your brain chemistry out of whack. I can tell that you are an overachiever who is extremely responsible and cares for others deeply. You MUST take care of yourself right now. I know it's hard but work and all that will be there when you get well. But right now you have to put YOU and your recovery first. You are in a difficult spot but know that there is a way out and light at the end of the tunnel. You need to speak with a doctor ASAP and come up with a good plan. The C/T from the Ultram is most likely the culprit of the depression you are feeling. As NG said, Ambien is a hypnotic and can wreak havoc on our brains. I'm still unclear as to whether you've C/T the benzo's as well. This is NOT a good idea. Please go talk to someone and tell them your whole saga and find out where to go from here. A plan always makes me feel better and I'm sure it will make you feel better too.
Take care of yourself, and the rest takes care of itself.