Impending Relapse? Hiskidd

[hiskidd]

Wow guys. Today is officially day 20, and it's the worst (one of the) nights of pain I've had. It's almost 3am. I can't sleep even with a sleep aid. My diagnosis a year ago was Degenerative Disc Disease. They couldn't see enough to do surgery, but I got the oortizone shot (epidrual), the MRI, and the oxy.

Tonight had me doing some serious thinking about quality of life. I looked at so many pictures taken this past year on my phone. So many happy pictures of my kids. Of me and my family doing life. It got me thinking "What/am I addicted or JUST physically dependent." And if it's JUST (caps cuz it sounds like justification) physical dependence, should I say "so what?" in order to go back to my 45 mgs a day?

I've read stuff tonight (some on this forum) from people who say Europe has a way of doing 3 weeks on the drug/s then 1 week off to help offset the usage. I read that if you're in pain all day all the time then oxy is probably "right" for you, but not if you're going to have a dentist visit or something that will go away.

I just don't know. There's enough horror stories out there about back surgeries too, that I'd hate to leave April and 4 kids with me totally incompacitated.

I guess my question is, am I just rationallizing now? Am I close enough to work and school that I can't imagine pain all day every day. I had some "good" days, but I also just laid around. I'm really afraid I won't make it past Tuesday without trying to see my doctor about a prescription. Gonna try to sleep again. I do love you guys. Just not sure what to do????

in HIm,

David

[WantToBeNormalAgain]

Hey David...
Wow, you sound like a brand new man with your last post..such optimism and cheer and hope. I am so very very happy for you. I have been praying for a lot of people every night, and you're included in my detailed portion of prayer wishes and I've been really hoping that you'd find a little courage a strength every day. I am so proud of you and how far you've come and how much you've overcome!! This made my night to see how well you seem to be doing. Remember, it's all about baby steps now. We dive head first into our addictions without first learning how to tread the water, right? So now we've got to go back into the kiddie wading pool and start all over again. You'll be an olympic swimmer in no time! ..sorry for the cheesey analogies. They just come to me when I'm getting tired, lol...anyway, I'll continue to pray for you that this great mood and change of pace stays with you and gets even better. I know it will, but a little prayer never hurt, right??! Thinking of you, thanks for putting a smile on my face. Have a wonderful night and a great Wednesday!
ALison

[quitinoxys]

David, I just read your posts as I've been pretty busy and haven't had time to post. Anywho I know exactly how you feel about taking pain meds and quality of life without them issue. I had several spinal surgeries due to a severe spinal injury. I was started on oxys 20 mgs 2x/day which didn't work anymore so my dosage was up to 40 mgs then 80 mgs 3x/day and 10 mgs percs for breakthrough pain. Notice a trend here? My point is I felt the same way you are now when I quit. The first couple of months I was in alot of pain and asking why did I quit taking the pills that took my pain away? I started to research alternative ways of pain relief. I found acupuncture and yoga it has helped me immensley. The acupuncture took away some of the pain and the yoga and breathing exercises helped with the rest.

I just wanted to let you know that you are not alone and that their are alternatives to pain relief other than narcs. You just need to research and find your alternative and oh yes God is a great alternative as he has guided me through my journey to the other side of sobriety. So please keep on going you will find a way of dealing with your pain. God Bless---Rick

[hiskidd]

Thanks guys. I talked to April and I think I'm going to try coffee in the mornings UNLESS any of you object :) Love you guys. David

[tired_of_oxy]

Have you tried any L-tyrosine? It's an amino supplement you can get at the health food store and is said to help some people tremendously with energy and relieving that fatigue. You might want to give it a try. Start with a low dose and see how it works for you. For me I am very anxious so I found it just made my anxiety worse but I know there's lots of people who swear by it and say it helps them a lot. We're all different so who knows, it might work like a charm for you. I hope it does, I know how badly your struggling right now, your in my prayers. You're doing GREAT!

[Kuckma]

This might not be a good advice David,

but since I am back to work I drink one red bull a day. I sip it all through the day.
I am a Kindergarten Teacher so I need so so much energy. On days when I feel week, the kids "smell" it. So Red Bull saves my butt on daily bases right now.

[hiskidd]

Thanks mama and gnarly. Night and day for me are night and day. I'm so back to being exhausted it's freaky.

I wanted to ask everyone's opinion (what's new?:) ...

I'm so tired in the morning at work. What do you recommend, 5hr energy or coffee. I used to drink coffee like 1 or 2 a week. I NEVER had a problem drinking then stopping, etc. and never got jittery. I worry now, though, about the strain my heart and nervous system have just been through so I'm not sure what to do.

OR, do you think I should continue to just ride things out since I'm only at day 22, and stay hydrated with water and stuff?

Thanks!

David

[gnarly_1]

Hey David I for 1 am proud of you for not having that scripted called in you need to go 1 step farther and get it canceled for good it never good to have pills a phone call away especially with what you been going threw.....im glad your considering aftercare most of us go with apprehension only to find a sigh of releaf once where there meeting help get you threw the mindscrew of this thing if not that most major health ins covers out pacent substance abuse consoling it dosent mater how you got addicted the fact is you did and your going to need help to get out of it you seam to be thinking rashenly now sorry bout the spelling I barley made it threw school but this stuff I know like the back of my hand
I hope you get a good nights sleep...keep in mind your emotions are going to be all over the place for awile panic anxiety is common early on so just push past it leave the classroom if you have to it usually passes quickly keep posting for support good luck and God bless.......Gnarly....your in my prayers David  

[mommyoffive0529]

Thank you David and i will pray for you too...are you too suffering the mind boggling anxiety from this craziness...i hope i will be able to enjoy my kids again soon ..maybe day 21 or 22 too...all i can think about right now is the freaking anxiety....i hope to be able to paint my daughter's nails soon...Day 16 over and out

[hiskidd]

You guys rock. Had to post at night. It's 7:40, and when I got home around six (had a detour to the tax man for a bit - he's a friend), I got my love to my family, and then I got dressed for the treadmill. I'm jogging a bit, then keeping the pace up at a good walking speed for 20 solid minutes. After that, I ate a healthy dinner, and played Nintendo Wii with my boys. I saw and complimented my 2 year old baby girl's freshly painted nails and toenails, and now the kids are about to go to bed. I'll shower, put some touches on my lesson plan for tomorrow, take a sleeping aid, watch a Law and Order episode with my wife, and then hopefully be asleep by 10. Someone earlier said something about having a bad bed, and right now that's us. Our couch is much firmer. I think I'll try that tonight.

I wrote all of this because I am beyond appreciative for those of you who are still sick like me, and yet you take the time to pull for me. It's amazing. This is day 21 and tomorrow will be day 22 completely oxy-free.

Mommy, I'm praying for your anxiety. Tired, I'm praying for your big jump tomorrow. Not just "saying" I'm praying, but I'm praying. I know I have to start over tomorrow, but at least I don't have to worry about tomorrow till it gets here. That's something I haven't said to myself in a long time. With real love, David

[ImDONENoMore]

Nothing will make me stop rooting for you.  Your words are so strong.  You can do this David.  You ARE doing it.  And take some Aleve - it will help with your pain.  I will keep sending positive thoughts your way.  :)

[vicki595]

No,it's not a victory post! I KNOW so well what you mean!!  You're getting through but you haven't grabbed the demon and beaten it down yet. You're getting there. It really does take time BUT IT GETS SO MUCH BETTER every day!

Hang in there. Forget about the oxy for pain. It's over. You don't take that anymore. It doesn't exsist for you. It will kill you slowly so good thing it's out of your life!!

Keep posting...eat dinner...relax and talk with April. During these times you can only go minute to minute and that's okay.

[hiskidd]

Hi guys. I'm still at work, but leaving soon. Not long after my post, and talking to April, I started feeling incrementally better. Still back pain, but panic and super-fatigue were minimal. April said she prayed for me all day. Amazing.

I read every word you guys post. I don't yet know what my course of aftercare will be, but I will find one. I'm worried about so many things, mostly related to the future, but some of it work related. I don't say that to be redundant, but because I agree with you about the mind games, rebound pain, taking things slowly, lowering expectations, eventually getting better, and aftercare. Ironically, Vicky, I didn't bring any OTC anti-inflammatory pain relievers with me. I have Advil and Aleve and their sitting at home. Yes there is something mental about me not wanting to feel pain AND either not feeling it or not feeling it from oxy/opiates. It's like I've convinced myself IT HAS to be one or the other. I've felt accupuncture help some. I've felt a bath help some. I've felt sleep help some. I've felt stretching help some, and yet I'm still frustrated to the point of anxiety when I have pain.

This isn't a victory post. I mean it is because I didn't have my wife go get me an oxy prescription today, but I don't think because I "got through" today that it's roses here on in. Heck, today isn't even over. What I'm getting to is a big Thank You for caring and posting. I wasn't offended at all with what I'mDONE said, but I do know I would not be this far without this forum. Not I "feel," I "know." So, you guys, KNOW you are loved and appreciated. I mean it. See you tonight or tomorrow ;)

Your friend,
David

[vicki595]

David---How are you doing now?   Did you take anything for your back pain? Like Motrin or something?  Sometimes we neglect ( on purpose ) to take OTC's for pain relief,continue to suffer,and thus rationalize our return to opiates/pills,etc... Watch out for this behaviour!  It's common and addictive reasoning. It's not logical!!  

Check in so we know how you are,please. And do get involved with some kind of aftercare as soon as you can!!

I'm glad you have your faith...lean on that,okay?

[ImDONENoMore]

Okay.  I think this finally needs to be said.

Everyone is advised that the physical part of withdrawal is over in 1-4 days.  I believe that is true in many cases.  HOWEVER,

The mental/emotional side of withdrawal can sometimes takes months to pass (quite frankly, I believe this is true for most of us).  It is not reasonable to expect to be better in a matter of days.  It simply is not possible.  Most of us took these drugs for a very long time.  How could we possibly expect it all to go away so quickly?  It takes TIME to get past all of this.  And in most cases, that appears to be months (it was for me).  And when we begin to accept that, the more realistic our expectations will be.  That in itself should help ease some of the anxiety - REASONABLE EXPECTATIONS.

And please do not misunderstand stand what I am saying because it does slowly get better and the symptoms do become much more manageable.  But 100% better in a few weeks?  Not by a long shot.

I hope I haven't spoken too harshly as that is definitely not my intention - I don't know any of you personally (obviously) but I have come to care about so many of you.  But I just don't know any other way to put this.  I'm rooting for everyone here and I know it's hard.  So GO EASY on yourself and stop pressuring yourself into thinking you're going to feel better overnight.  It just doesn't work that way.  Gnarly's words - "be okay with NOT being okay for a while".  Very wise words.

[vantart]

This info confirms that all of us have different systems. I've been on 80 mgs of methadone for quite awhile and my physical withdrawals were mostly over in 10 to 12 days. The mental part is still haunting me some at day 25. not too bad. It's called post acute withdrawal. I came across a book by a guy named Terrence Gorski on relapse prevention. What an eye opener for me. He states there are 30 warning signs prior to relapse. I scored on almost 20 of them. The minimizing,rationalizing, justifing. and on & on. Turns out he's the guru on this subject, according my addiction therapist. You can pick it up at the library. He has several books out. This one is called "Staying Sober"
Are you past the physical or is it mostly mental? Your brain tend to scream "where's my stuff" for a while but that part should be close to over. Are you over a doctors care during this?

[mommyoffive0529]

You know what's funny...its not really any pain thats getting to me...its the anxiety and the fact that i still cant do much...i know im hard on myself but i am still having withdrawl symptoms after 2 weeks and they are driving me nuts...how long does this last?  I was only on 20 mg of lortab a day but for 6 years...

[tired_of_oxy]

I'm so sorry your going through this. You have a huge heart and I pray God takes that pain from you. I also suffer from a similar back condition, it's why I ever started oxys to begin with. I also saw that in just a year I went from a couple 5 mg percs a day right on up to over 100 mgs a day of oxy and eventually closer to 200 mgs a day. I used them for pain relief at first..then I crossed the line into addiction. Actually I hurtled over that line. Within 6 months I was "addicted" Had I known the immense pain addiction would bring me I would have ran as fast as I could when the doc wrote that first script for oxy. If he had told me "Here's some pills for your back..but by the way if you stop taking them ever you will become deathly ill and deal with being a mental basketcase for awhile oh and almost forgot to mention, lots of people who take these get really, really addicted. It's pretty much heroin in pill form..." well I think I might have had to pass lol. But they don't tell you that. They just band-aid the problem and send you on your way. Far easier to do that then actually solve the problem.

In my mind, anything that makes you that dependant and makes you that sick when you stop taking them is evil. The devil are in those pills I'm sure. No medicine should be that hard to get off of. Again I feel dumb giving you advice but I really feel for you and can relate in so many ways. You said yourself you had begun to use the pills for reasons other then pain. That my friend is exactly how it goes from dependence to addiction. It's very sneaky and for me by the time I realized I had a problem I was in way too deep to just "stop". I think you stopped at the best possible time. An addiction was starting to blossom and you cut the head off of it before it ever grew and destroyed your life. I wish I had stopped early in my addiction but I didn't heed the warning signs and have spiralled so far down I'm scared I'll never be "normal" again, whatever that is. I think quitting when you did saved you from a horrible addiction. God is looking out for you and He saw where you were heading and he guided you away from a life of misery and on to the right path. I really believe that. I agree with Back2Me, the mindscrew of oxy is messing with you. I remember it all too well. I made it about as far as you are both times. I rationalized my way back in and ended up where I am now. Broke, hopeless, regretful and defeated. But I'm not out. Nooo I'm coming back and fighting. And it's people like you who help give me the strength I need. I took my last quarter sub this morning and I'm ready to do this for the last time. The restless leg stuff has already started but I know I can do this as long as I get help. Please get some aftercare. I think if I had done that in the past I might be celebrating clean time today..not getting ready to brawl it out with those wd demons once again. I can tell reading your posts the urgency and desperation. This forum is awesome but cannot replace real human interaction and support so please get yourself to a meeting. The people there are amazing, just like here but in real life and you'll get phone numbers from those in the program you can call and talk when your going through stuff like this. Your a good soul who deserves peace and happiness so give yourself a break. You've done a monumental thing breaking free of those pills. Rebound pain is very real but the good news is it won't last forever. Wait it out awhile to figure what your baseline pain level is and work from there. I'm sure OTC's would never work while on oxy but now they might really help. I've also heard great things about Aleve, maybe give that a shot. Please try every other option before you ever pick up an opiate. God doesn't let us down, he'll help you get through this but just give it more time. 3 months is what I've heard it takes for our brains to come back online. We mess with our brain chemistry when were on pills and lack of endorphins cause depression and pain always feels worse when we feel like crap. So just give it time ok? But please..go to a meeting. Or counsellor, pastor..whatever suits you. Just don't try and go it alone. We need real life support to do this. It's taken me two years, two relapses and losing things I cannot put a number on to realize this. Hang in there, this is really the mindscrew you've heard so much about trying to get you. Don't fall for it. You've come so far!!  Be PROUD and know that you have a lot of people pulling for you and praying for you. You will get through this!

[mommyoffive0529]

So my body is just going back to normal then....can't believe what a painful process it it...i feel like im still in a fog and the anxiety is brutal...i want it to be Spring right now!!! i hope you are right...i can handle a little anxiety but this is for the birds...chest pains, headaches, lighthead, dizzy, tired, miserable depressed, and utter hopelessness...weird sensations everywhere...does your body get better everyday?  Why all the anxiety?

[Dadof5kids1973]

Yes, I have anxiety....not that bad though. I actually dont feel that bad right now even though i am only on dau 3 I had over  a week before that slip up and I have gone months at a time off of pills. I have come off high doses of fentanyl, methadone, and now hydrocodone. I guess the fent and methadone (3 times) makes coming off hydros not so bad as far as wd's go but still have the same cravings. Momof5 it will pass I promise you that, it may take another week or 2 or 3 but I promise it will pass. Think about this, when spring gets here you will be fine...back to your old self. Thats only a few months and I know it seems like forever right now...but it will be here be4 u know it and then you will look back at these days and think of how worth it was to go through a pain . Hang in there you are doing awsome and your almost over that hump. You do not want to give those 2 weeks away because eventualy you will have to do them again.

[mommyoffive0529]

Dear Dad of five, as  a Mom of five i think you are so right...the only real problem i have been having with the withdrawls is the horrifying anxiety.....i cannot bear it today....im obly 15 days off my pain meds and i still cannot do hardly anything..i am scared to sleep, to eat  and i feel like everythingi do is causing me anxiety...Did you suffer from this at all?  I cannot bear the thought of lving with this everyday forever...i have done the baths, the meditation, the b-vitamins, the stretching and even relaxation but its still here...today its really bad for some reason and i hate it...i don't know what is causng it...is it my body going nuts looking for pills cause it is so hard to fight..i have a lump in my throat the size of Texas and i want to get up and do so many things but my body still won't allow...everything sends me into a panic...i't so crippling and i hate to be the Mom I am right now...I don't ever want to take a pill but right now , my kids are suffering right along with me...I feel so bad..haven't been out in days...any thoughts

[Dadof5kids1973]

Think about it....You are in a fight for your life and your life as you knew it before the pills. You will one day as gnarly said have to come off of them weather its now or in 10 years. The only difference is if you do it now then you save your family,health, and did I mention your family. Do you want your kids remembering you always on pills??? Do you want them to remember you in bed a couple of days every month cause you run out of pills?? Because as they grow thats what will stick with them. The pills just give you 3 or 4 hours of "fun" with your kids that you will probabley not remember all that well due to the pills. To me even if I lost my job right now its so worth it in just a few months. You can get another job but you can NEVER,NEVER,NEVER, get these precious days with you children back nor the years you will spend in misory(sp) knowing the pills are not really helping you but the pills are killing you and one day your family life. FIGHT FOR YOUR LIFE....YOU ARE WORTH IT.

[gnarly_1]

aftercare aftercare  aftercare......did I mention aftercare?? .....David your a teacher
you need to be tought how to stay sober ...it is the very way we think that is our dimise
you need to eter get to a meeting or hook up with an addiction therapist your not going to beet this thing on your own the statistics show that less the 10% of the people will make it to 1 yr clean without aftercare right now your in the beginning of a relapse they start days ahead of time and its been on your mind for a few days now....GET TO A MEETING
your talking about survival here....I understand your in pain....pain is one of my bigest trigers but im telling you with a little time things will get better your just going to have to trust me on this stuff this ant my first rodeo....pray to God to give you strenth all things are possible threw Christ Jesus....im praying for you bro hang in there the prize is so so worth it.....Gnarly      

[mommyoffive0529]

Are you having any anxiety problems...i have a TON of anxiety and everything seems to set me off....i don't know what the hecks going on...my boyfriend just got home and i didnt hear him and he didnt mean to scare me and here comes the panic...unfreakingreal

[pcooney13]

Hang in there, I found the busier I was at work the better...stopped my mind from racing.  My pain (same sort of disc issues that you have) is much better since I have been off the Percs. (I'm a couple weeks ahead of you).  My anxiety stemmed from a lot of things, but mostly just a real jumpy feeling.  It gets better with each passing day and you will feel so much better about yourself and your life.  Don't overwhelm yourself with all of those things that you think you "otta" get done.  Getting yourself off the Oxy is the most important thing you can do, everything else will be fine.  I will be thinking of you and hope your pain stays under control.   Stay strong.