Please give me your defination of clean...

[motye51]

Honestly, I would like to gather a general opinion of what people on this website consider clean?  Just looking for the differences of opinions....trying to form a decision (if that's ok)...

[gnarly_1]

HI well clean to me is not using any kind of mind alerting substance now the big question her is where does sub or methadone come in...
after being on methadone for 7years I considered my sell as normal however after quitting it I realized just what control it had on me I was living in a fog that I did not realize so now I don't count days until I was totally clean  always remember 1 is to many and 1000 never enough also if you start meeing people at the meetings you will see people with 20+ yrs and they still dont pick up and also go to meetings  recovery is a choice it is up to you to do the next right  thing
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;Gnarly...........................................

[ActingBrandNew]

Clean to me is not abusing mind altering substances. For example, if you have surgery and take some narcotics for a few days as prescribed, you dont ruin your clean time. Also, if your taking a psychotropic medication used to treat mental disorders you are still clean so long as you dont abuse it. Alcohol is a drug and if your an addict than total abstinence is necessary. (In my opinion)

[jleeflcntrygrl]

This is my opinion I think soberity is diffrent for everyone and you have to do what works for u. For example I have someone in my family that was an alcholic for many yrs but she is schedophranic(sorry about spelling) she quit drinking ten yrs ago but has to take pills so she doesnot hear voices or hurts herself. She takes them as ordered and also still attends AA regularly. To me this is soberity for HER. My backstory is I had cancer takin out of my uterus several times was in 2 car wrecks and was on roxies and morphine for 13 yrs of course I was abusing them and in the end was shooting them up and almost died! Now for almost 13 months I have been on methadone slowly tapering off, attending NA groups counseling and even goin to a pschologist. I have been working on my recovery 100 percent and have slowly gotten my life back. I have been growin so much emotionaly and learning new things about myself everyday. This is soberity for ME. I HAVE put in the WORK so I get VERY aggrivated when ppl say I doesn't count! I am not EVEN a shell of my oldself! This is MY STORY

[jugglin]

I agree with ABN, "Clean to me is not abusing mind altering substances."  There are those of us out here who are prescribed anti-depressants and/or anti-anxiety who do not abuse them.  I have been on and off AD's for years and they were not prescribed for any kind of WD symptom or to ease WD's - I've just always struggled a bit with depression and the occasional anxiety attack.  Vicodin, however, I abused.

[jugglin]

Also wanted to add Mo, thank you for asking cuz I was personally a little offended by the response earlier. Not like pi$$ed off at you, just a little hurt. I know we are all here with our own journeys and opinions,  but I also know that the proper AD and dosing saved my life. Thank you girl and stay strong! (I did not in any way mean to offend you, K?) xoxo

[takingmylifeback2014]

I Agree with ABN and Juggs! BUT I do think that being on methadone and suboxone does not count for being clean.
I believe certain ppl need Anti-Depressants for depression/anxiety/bipolar etc. If you have a mental illness and need meds I feel that is different, But if you are getting high from the meds I don't feel that is staying clean. Hope this makes sense lol

[VICourageous]

Nice Subject for Sure!!!!
It is not the Drug (Any) it is what WE want the drug to do for us.

If someone has to take medication for Medical purposes, and they use this right and not for any other reason (like getting High or Buzzed) then I think they are OK. However, I do have to agree that any Mind Altering drug that is used for any other purpose other then what is was intentionally prescribed for then that is where the Addiction comes to play.

As a Addicts point of view..I do think being Clean means staying away from any Mind Altering Drugs or Alcohol that can cause a Addiction.. Addiction is a Brain disease.

OK! I still have a Addiction and that is my Cigs. This will kill my ash quicker then anything else. BUT I am working on it..lol

This subject is a good one and has LOTS of different views.

[motye51]

I'm so glad were talking about this b/c it IS a touchy subject and I DON"T want to offend anyone, so here is my question:
If putting all of these chemicals into our bodies alters our chemical state (which we all know it does), and we do change the makeup's of our brains, then how do we know that we have an actual disorder and not just the "damage" that will heal itself?"  I guess that's where I'm getting confused?  I went to lunch with a large group of women from my N/A meeting the other day and 8 out of 10 of them are taking ****....Wellbutrin, Paxil, Bipolar meds ( I don't know what they are) but as I was sitting there I was like, damn, some Wellbutrin sure WOULD help with this depression and loss of energy.....?  Maybe if it's something you've suffered with your whole life, I could understand that, but maybe we should wait 6 months, 8 months, and THEN see how we feel???  Does that make sense?  
And quite honestly, we have quite a few people in our meetings on subs and methadone....and I'm sorry, but NO, I don't feel that that's clean?  It's not to take away from any progress that you've made, at all, but your still using a mind altering substance?  I don't know, maybe talking out of my ***, but I know it's a touchy subject and everyone's journey is different.
SORRY, if I offended anyone, that was not my goal, at all!

[nonights]

So where does this put weed?

[VICourageous]

I did wait many months before I even thought of any 'other" pills that you have described. In about my 8-9 m I tried a AD and gave it up. I did not like to feel "Flat Lined" with my Emotions.
I have a few at Both AA/NA that are against any med at all!!! We are Not the Drs nor should I be the one to judge who needs this pill for this or that. This is said when we open the meetings.
NO I did not want anything in my Brain as I was healing. It just take so much time to know which direction to go if you do not have a history for depression. The Brain is Balancing out on its own with time..lol There are MANY natural ways of building up the brain Chems and so on and so fourth. Again some people DO needs certain types of Meds.
As far as using other Meds to get you off your DOC.. I have changed my opinion on this one to be more in favor now.. As long as they use this under a Drs Maintenance program and for a short period. Clean or not Clean, that is up to the person.
Do not worry about "Offending" any body..Heck we all have our own opinions, and if I do not like what someone says...Then I will just skip it..Ha!
Bless

[IBKleen]

Clean for me is void of all mind or mood altering substances, including alcohol.

[IBKleen]

Again, and this is just for me...that also includes Suboxone and Methadone. I was on Suboxone and did not begin my clean time until the day after my last dose. That is just for me.

[motye51]

I would think weed smoking would be considered "using", don't you????  lol, if not, let me know b/c I must not be up to date on what's considered using and what's not????  
I DO realize as well, that many people WITH true disorders often self medicate.  I've seen this over and over, so again, I'm not trying to take anything away from these people.  You need it, you need it.  But doesn't it seem like "LOTS" of people seem to need it nowadays?  Or maybe it's just the area I'm in?

[VICourageous]

You are toooo cute. Like I said this is a touchy subject.  I stopped for awhile and thought about this..I would say WE are not clean if we have to put a Synthetic Substance in our body..Now does this mean Coffee??? Ha!! I know it sure does mean those nasty Cigs!!!!
I like to watch my Westerns..Right? So back then women were not aloud in the Bars. They had to grow there own food and in some parts they could only get meat. Now there are many cultures that used Opiates, like the real opium plant or like when they smoked the peace pipe and so on. I offended wonder if they had control of this or was there such a thing as them getting Addicted. You usually only see one drunk in them towns too..hahaha LMAO..Now you have me going!

[takingmylifeback2014]

Ut Ohhh you got VIC going LMAO

[IBKleen]

Again, just for me. I do consider smoking weed as using. Why do people smoke it? Because they like the feeling. they like the high. So they are doing something to give them a "feeling" that they think they cannot get naturally. that being said, I am not against it being legalized if it is controlled. But it is just not for me.

[vicki595]

I'm strict with my definition. No mind altering drugs; no drugs that have potential for abuse.  A diagnosed medical situation would be the exception for me; excluding Sub, methadone, or pot. My opinion about Sub, methadone and pot is that they're unnecessary for any medical treatment.  We all have our standard to live by and that's mine but I try not to put my standard on others.

[jleeflcntrygrl]

Also I think it has to do with behavior. When I was sticking a needle in my arm I would steal lie and do other RISKY behaviors such as sleep around etc just for excitement. I'm sorry to say this- just tryin to be honest. But now I have no idea who that person was, its very scary to think about! A lot of addicts have more problems than just the "using" that's why we have to take care of the physical AND mental. Thanks for listening.

[weaver71]

I think clean is a subjective and idealistic idea. To me, mood altering chemicals like sugar, caffeine and tobacco, habits like gambling or compulsive sex, all these things are addictive and make us impure. My definition is based on progress, as long as a person is working their hardest toward purity, then their heart is clean, on or off maintenance drugs. I don't care about time, people are what are important to me. I stopped counting my sub use, after several months. I used it as prescribed, actually took less for a shorter time than suggested. My heart was getting clean, even on subs. I figure I'Il be as clean as I can be just before I die, a life of progress is my plan. Only I could chose when I actually got clean, it really only matters to me anyway. So that's my opinion and am open to being totally wrong, but I feel good about it, I think that is why it matters. Am I pure and clean, nope, still have more work to do. Progress over perfection, that is the root of my recovery.

[jleeflcntrygrl]

Thanku weaver everyone else made me feel like an ***hole and I was crazy!lol

[dominosarah]

Reminds me of the "dry drunk".  The person isnt drinking but their behavior is still the same as when they were drinking.  I personally enjoy crazy!!  lol

[weaver71]

The funny thing is, I am a methadone addict, the only person my doctor knew that was their original DOC. I count methadone as my active addiction and subs saved my life, see how I find this all subjective. I'm certain my opinion isn't popular either, but people know we mean well, even if we are crazy.

[takingmylifeback2014]

Ok now I'm confused are you still taking suboxone?

[weaver71]

No, I am not on subs. I only used them 20 days, but now I realize I should have taken them longer. I think my time on subs and working a strong aftercare, I was sober, but not clean.