Suboxone

[PAULY7951]

Good evening everyone, i was on 40mgs. of methadone and did not take any for 4 days after the 4th day i started to take suboxone i ook a total of 8mgs.I thought i was going to die.My upper part of my body was seemed to be burning on the insides.I had the chills, i felt like things were crawling on me. I never felt like that, even when i went c/t. Can any one tell me why? Should i try subtex? Please help. Thank you  
To:

[laladee216]

Hi there,

I am currently on 44mls of Meth (in the UK), and I have a 13 month old Son.  I have been clean from heroin since July 10th 2013 and although I don't get any type of 'hit' from the amount of methadone and going to the doctor once a month then picking up my script once a week isn't much of a hindrance to me, but I'd really like to get myself clean soon so that I can do things like book a family holiday or even just go somewhere for the weekend without having to plan ahead first if you know what I mean.

I've known about Suboxone and Subutex for a year or two now and have heard a lot of different stories about it.  A good friend of mine tried to stop her 30mls of methadone and move onto Suboxone a few weeks back.  She told me it felt like the worst speed rush she had ever experienced coupled with hallucinations, profuse sweating, hyperventilation with extreme dysmorphia.  The poor girl ended up on her front lawn in the sunshine fully clothed with her bath robe on also and a wooly hat, trying to sweat 'the situation' out.

On the other hand, I've heard many success stories, people who managed to have a 'textbook transition', and are now happily back at work and some, even living overseas now.

I'm so scared.  Would it be better for me to go lower than the reccommended 30ml (in your opinion)?  My Mother is going to be taking time off of her work so that she can help look after my Son.  I guess I'm just looking for a bit of advice as to how best to prepare myself for this.  I've fkd up EVERY single detox attempt before and I don't want to do that again and risk losing my Son.

I hope it was ok posting here, I've never been on a forum before.  

Many Thanks,

LAD.

[ksnizzo]

Precipatated w/d....happened to me too. It goes away though and subox has been great. Not nearly as tired or out of it as methadone. The hard part is getting off the sub which i am still working on....hopefully this summer

[Laurie4391]

I would like to ask any one that is taking suboxone if they have had any trouble with thier urine test showing they have no suboxone in them. I have been on suboxone 2yrs and 2months, 7days. I started out with 16mg a day, to 12mg, to 8mg, to 6mg then 3months ago to 4mg. i just started today taking 2mg. when I went down to 4mg a day my urine test came back that I had no suboxone in my body. this has been going on for 3months. my doctor has asked me if I am giving it a way or selling it or taking it all the first two weeks I have it. I say no. I am not doing any thing other then taking it ever day as you tell me to take it. I take it the same time ever day. I have even taking to urine test at the same appointment with some one watching me. If some has had the same thing happen to them if they could please help me to understand why this is happen to me. I have worked so hard to get where I am today, why would I mess up now.. I thank god for this medication, If we did not have this medication where would some of us be today? It dose work as longs as you want it to work and be a new person.. well I hope some one can help with this. I could go on for ever about this medication and how NA has helped me these last couple of years, but I will save it for another day.. Good luck to all the addicts out there..My you find what your looking for. God bless you all*****IT DOSE WORK*****

[tlsaints24]

DO NOT DO A VERY LARGE DOSE IF YOU DO 32 MG YOUARE GOING TO BE VERY SICK..... everyone has that really sick i am going to die feeling the first time they do suboxone well everyone i know even 8 mg is to much for the first time i dont know why dr give that much for one dose anyways after i made the mistake of doing 8mg i tried just a quarter of the 8 mg pill and it was much better to tell you the truth its like being high on an opiate after awhile of just doing a small piece for a few weeks i coulld do a half (4mg) to doing the whole thing. and i have done suboxone a about 4 hrs after doing a doner or an oxy and many other things suboxone is an opiate blocker but if the opiate is already in your system it obviously cant block it and it can make you sick

[kitkat907]

I am soooo frustrated with this so-called miracle drug.  I have been on heroine for several years and was on methadone for awhile and it didn't make me feel 100%, but it didn't make me feel like I was going to die either.  I tried siboxone 3 times, the third with doctor suporvision and each time went through severe withdrawals, I'm talking like hide the guns I wanted to seriously end my life.  Each time I returned to heroin cause I couldn't handle it.  I also have sever panic attacks that I brought on each time I attempt to get clean.  So I am dealing with several issues.  My doctor I felt was very procrastinating and would laugh at me when I would tell him with each siboxone dose I felt worse and felt very near death or suicide.  He would say I promise you your not going to die, it will be rough for a couple days until I stabalized, which contradicted everything I've been told and read about siboxone prior to trying it.  I even made certain that I hadn't taken methadone for a whole month prior to trying siboxone.   Had no effects, still went into sever death withdrawals, each time having to risk arrest and accident to get to my drug of choice to pull me out of this down hill spiral.  I just want everyone to know prior to trying siboxone, just know its not the "miracle drug" that everyone is saying.  And, I will die using my drug of choice before doing that again.  I have legal issues going on right now, which was my whole reason for wanting to get on siboxone cause I heard it doesn't show up in drug tests, and meth does.  So I'm not sure what to do at this point, I guess I will never get free from heroin and will end up bankrupt and homeless if I can't get the help I desparately need.  If anyone has and first hand advice I would greatly appreciate it.  Please help, I'm helpless.  My email is Elkins.***@****.
Thanks, and good luck to those that have found relief from siboxone.  I'm happy it works for some.

I send all my support and love to all the addicts out there desparatly seeking freedom from this hell.
God bless and good luck!

[krati]

I'm on my 3rd week of suboxone.  switched from methadone.  I got down to 40mg for a week.  Took my last dose Wednesday then took my first suboxone Friday.  BIG MISTAKE!  I got sicker then i've ever been.  The think you have to do, I know am finding out, is you have to start with a VERY LARGE dose.  go up to like 32mg the 1st day, then the second, then the 3rd take 8mg less and then the next day take another 8mg less and taper down till you get stable.  I am on 16mg. 2 - 8mg pills a day.  Lord yess it is expensive.  I have wonderful insurace but it still doesn't pay for the pills.  So I kind of thought I was going to be saving money by doing this, it's turning out to be more expensive.  

I just have to say this.  The good thing is:  I can see the light at the end of the tunnel.  Although I do feel pains and stuff that I haven't felt in a loooong time (because i'm been completely f*ed up on pain pills for years)  Now I feel like myself again, I can feel GOOD things too though ,that I could NOT feel on methadone.  Although I don't walk around with a buzz all the time anymore I actually have a sex life now, I don't eat my whole refridgerator in one sitting, and I can cry over mushy love movies.  Being on methadone numbs everything.  I liked the buzz, but hated the NOT feeling.  

Soon I'll be off of this too, and free from all this addiction that's been holding me back all these years.  Good luck to you guys.
~Krati

[krati]

get on methadone...if you're hurting that bad...i've been on methadone and suboxone - the reason i switched ...i wanted the doctor's office setting..insurance to cover it, and i wanted fewer withdrawals coming down...which suboxone is supposed to do
sounds like you really need methadone...it kind of gives you a buzz...it also is prescribed for pain...and it is less dangerous on your body then oxy's dilaudid and morphine and all that jazz (which i've dabbled in all of the above as well)
in your situation, you could probably get methadone perscribed to you without having to deal with all the crackheads at a clinic.  
good luck in your endeavors

oh yeah..and thank you for the info about soma
i was googling suboxone and soma..debating wether or not to take it..lol
i'm glad you wrote that or i would have been sicker then a dog at work tonight

[wait2long]

sorry hun, dilaudid is about the ONLY drug i could never get my hands on, so i dont know much about it other than i have heard its a rough one to get off it.  and you are right about the other drug in suboxone, its called naloxone? (i think) and its purpose is so it cant be abused by I.V. drug users, i too was concerned about about the naloxone?, but my doctor and numerous sites about suboxone have stated that it does not effect you at all whatsoever if put under your tongue and used the proper way, but at the same time i also heard of people having ultra sensitivity to naloxone and were unable to continue on suboxone for that reason. and by the way i am new to this site too...i used to take anything i could get my hands on for fun and for pain also, i started on strictly methadone in sept. of 2006,  and used only methadone until end of may, been on suboxone since. i would have to say for myself and my experience methadone was what worked best for me and i hope if i am unsuccessful with sticking to the suboxone , i really hope i can get my methadone back...i might be screwed on that one. my advice to you would be to go back on oxy for 2-4 weeks and then try suboxone again, its only really difficult to switch from long acting opiod like methadone that stays in your system for weeks compared to oxy that is gone in under 24 hrs...  good luck and i hope you find what you need and works for you

[PeaceSeeker]

Hey There -

I am new here - but I just wanted to let you know that I went to detox in January - before entering the program, I was asked if I had been Methadone free for at least three months.  Luckily, and I say that lightly, I had switched back to Oxy like six months before.  It was explained to me that they would not even take Methadone users due to the fact that they used Subutex.  Subutex worked great - I never even hadc much withdrawl.  I did not realize it at the time, but now it makes sense in reading these letters.  I had been clean for about a month and the back pain was worse than ever.  I was put back on Soma and continued to take the Subutex with no problem.  However, when that Subutex ran out, I went to an "addiction specialist", (I also use that lightly) Pfff - more like an flipping idiot.  Anyway, knowing I was taking Soma he stated that he would continue the Subutex - something happened when they called the insurance for pre-auth and they got Suboxone.  I was not happy and phoned them back to ask if they could get the pre auth on Subutex as it worked very well for me and did I did not want to go to another med.  The jerk said no it was too much trouble to have his staff call again.  I got the Suboxone in desperation and it put me into an immediate drug withdrawl like I had never experienced before.  There is an added drug in Suboxone which is not in Subutex that if you have even the slightest amount of drug in you system - including Soma - it sends your whole body into a spin.  I thought I was gonna die.  Then a couple of months later I read an article in the paper regarding Suboxone andf it basically said that some doctors are insisting on this as opposed to Subutex because they get a bit kick back and that it is not the miracle drug that some are trying to sell.  I don't mean to be neagative; however, I just want everyone to be careful with that one.

To make a long story short, I ended up going back to OXy as I had been on it for so long I did not even know what my pain level was without it prior to detox.  I ended up having two back surgeries in April and May - I was given Oxy and Dilaudid in the hospital, which did not work well due to my tolerance.  I thought I was gonna die from the pain when I came home - I went through 185 OXy's in 8 days.  

Then at the end of his rope as well as mine the doctor agreed to switch me to Dilaudid which I have taken since that time.  I am now trying to wean myself off - I still have Suboxone - but I would not take that stuff again if HELL froze over.  I am not sure how to go about weaning off of Dilaudid - if anyone knows, please let me know.  I have been taking 4 to 5, 4mg tabs q. day since the second week of May and have been trying to do 2 tabs a day for the last few days.  I feel okay - not great but okay - I plan to use Dilaudid through the month of August to get off it then hopefully - the pain will not be bad enough to require Rx drugs.  

Anyway I really hope that my experience with the new "addict drugs"  helps someone and if anyone has any experience weaning off of Dilaudid please help.   Take care everyone.

[wait2long]

yes the reason you get so sick from the switch from methadone to suboxone is the fact it can take up 30 days for methadone to free your body and if you dont wait long enough, then when you take the suboxone it is combattive with the methadone that is left in your receptors. so an easier way to understand it is the methadone and suboxone "fight" each other to fill your receptors (and neither one can win) so you are in a sense put into immediate withdrawals(look up preciptated withdrawals) (and it is similar to rapid detox, its bad but not forever..) because nothing has entered your receptors and you will experience a good dose of "cold turkey" for 3-4 days, longer for people who are on a higher dose of methadone, like i said i only took 20 mg. of methadone daily, so the doc. said i was a good candidate, it is not recommended for people who take more than 30 mg of methadone a day, i am no expert, this is just what i have learned and been told in my own experience, it could be different for all of you wanting to try it... for me i just want my methadone back.. and please, please do your research before switching, i did and i knew what i was in for, but committed to try to make it work for me....  i have also heard some people say they actually get a sort of "buzz" from suboxone,and it hasnt happened for me and i was on 28mg-32mg for about2 weeks, i cant even sleep at night anymore,  IT SUCKS!!!   sorry for the negativity, i just hope someone finds this info helpful.   love to all and thanks for listening...

[wait2long]

no i took nothing else, i took my last 20mg. dose of methadone on a sunday morning, and took nothing else until friday late morning when i took my first dose of suboxone, and i was put into precipitated withdrawal immediately, and was severly sick for 4 days, all i can say about suboxone is that i am exsisting... i am not "physically" sick, but i am so mentally screwed up i wonder if this is even worth it, (never mind the cost of suboxone $170.00 for 30 8 mg pills (and i take 16 mg - 20 mg.) compared to $25.00 for 100 10mg. methadone pills) somehow that doesnt seem fair to me...but anyway i promised myself and family i would give it a good 6 month trial period before giving up...4 MORE TO GO?!   i sure do miss the security of methadone, and also being able to function was a definate plus...and all of my phobias and panic/anxiety disorders and agoraphobia have  been 10 times worse since stopping methadone...does anyone know of anyone who has been successful switching from methadone to suboxone?   and if so ..how long has their success lasted??  thank you for listening...

[bdoon]

Youse got sick because methadone stays in your system much longer than you think...for days and days. I was using oxy and had to stop for 12 hours prior to the bupe. Still got a little sick but oxy leaves the system quick (it was 30 mg oxycodone...I had stopped the oxycontin 3 days earlier). The second day I used the bupe I felt normal (it was 8 mg bupe). The third day I actually felt a little loaded. The 4th day they cut me down to 4 mg and I felt a little rough. The 5th day it was 4 mgs again and I felt great all day. I am on 2 mgs now and tomorrow is my last day. The drug is incredible but if you take it for maintenance it will string you out just like oxys, morphine or methadone.

[serenitysaves]

Wow, I'm so scared.  I'm down to 49mill. of methadone from 95mil.  I'm planing on  starting suboxone when I get down to 30 or 20mill.  Do you know if it's like a rapid detox or because of the long half life of meth, that theres some still in your body when you take suboxon that gets you so sick.  I hope the question makes since.  Basically, why do people tend to get so sick after there first dose?
any feedback would be great.
thanks, Robin

[Oneofus]

Well...I woke up this morning feeling pretty crappy.  I didn't take anything after I last wrote, because, as I said, I was worried the bupe would block it.  I took 30 mg of methadone about an hour and a half ago, and...just as always...sweet ol' dones...carrying me back home.  I'm starting to feel calm and good.  So that's what happened to me when I tried to switch over from dones to bupe.

I've read many testimonials from those who say bupe was a huge improvement (for them) over methadone.  Even in those cases, however, the changeover wasn't usually without turbulence.  In the final analysis, my experience doesn't bring anything substantial to the scene.  Most certainly, if you are going to try it, for God's sake, put a couple of weeks -- at least -- between your last hit of methadone and your first hit of bupe.  Since I'm no fan of flopping like a fish, I would definitely have plenty of something else to take (oxys, hydros, morphine, diduadid, etc...) while I lived through the wait.

As FLaddict confirmed to me in one of her letters of support, and as it seems Wait2long is experiencing, some of us simply have chemistry that will never extend an invitation to bupe.  In response to those who after changing over to bupe from methadone have said, "Thank God for bupe," I say God bless you.  As for myself.  Thank God for methadone.  I continue to feel better.

One Of Us,
Rider

[Oneofus]

You've been fooling with suboxone for 8 weeks and still haven't learned to love it?  Wow!  THAT is VERY informative!  Evidently some of us will never be good candidates for a bupe program.  Maybe that includes you, PAULY and me...

Incidentally...the 5 days you waited before taking any subox -- were you taking anything else during that time?  Same question to you PAULY...did you take anything during your 4-day wait?

Thanks for the info.  Very helpful.

Rider

[Oneofus]

There's a wealth of information online as to the difference between Subutex and Suboxone.  Without getting into all the information you can find pretty much anywhere, Suboxone contains naloxone along with the buprenorphine; Subutex does not.

Rider

[wait2long]

Switching from methadone to suboxone is the hardest route to go, my doc. said it would have been easier if i had been shooting heroin 20 times a day... it takes 30 days for methadone to leave your body totally (so i was told) and if you take suboxone before your time WATCH OUT! i too waited almost 5 full days off methadone before taking my first dose of sub., it sent me thru the roof, i started with 8mg, waited 2 hours, doc said to try another 8 mg, i did that until i had taken a full 32 mg, at that point doc told me to only do 8mg-12mg the next day and prescribed clonidine, which did help (the more suboxone i was taking the worse i felt), i have now been on suboxone for almost full 8 weeks and still waiting for the releif to "kick in", waiting to feel like it "might" save my life???  i really dont know how much longer i can wait...i am now taking 16mg-20mg.  and i was on a very low dose of methadone (20mgs daily), i heard all the stories of how suboxone helped so many people, but it doesnt seem to be the people that take a long acting opioid like methadone, my suggestion  (my doc said so too)  would be to get back on short acting opioid for 30 days, then switch to suboxone. i havent given up, still waiting. good luck to you, and dont give up, you will find your way.

[awakan]

Sorry about the mistake and hope that it did not make you feel like a target. I am interested in this stuff since I know a lot of people personally who could use whatever information anyone is willing to give up..So subatex is that kinda the same or is it a completely different drug. Well good luck anyway hope you find the right combination for the slammer of addiction..personally I just have to quit the stuff if im still taking something I am still f**ked up...a-waken

[Oneofus]

My post just before PAULY'S last one should answer your question "...how is the subox doing you?"  If not, as I said, I am happy to answer any specific questions.  One minor (but significant) point -- the "sub" is not suboxone in my case.  It is in PAULY'S.  You may already have noted that.  My script is Subutex.
:-)
Rider

[PAULY7951]

I fell asleep after I took the 30mgs. But when I woke up 5hrs. later I felt OK. I am back to my 40mgs, and I feel great. I am scared **** to try suboxone again. I will call the Dr. on Monday and see what he has to say and what my options are. Thank you for the info.

[awakan]

Rider how is the subox doing you? I just read your post from earlier and thought I would ask..I thought about trying it cause I did not want to wrestle with the gorilla again but every thing I take seems to make my life worse..If I like it presto i'm strung out like a sugar mill jackass in no time..So I have to go cold every time or risk my mind playing tricks on me, It is just like me to go back on methadone after being off for years I am so good at lying to myself telling myself that this time will be different well I was partly right it was not the same this time it was harder to stop. What makes people like us all of us here on this site so good at bullshitin ourselves..Were dope fiends and it's our job, I need a new occupation.. well all I am off to a meeting to carouse with my fellow addicts, I hope you all are around later will talk then. Hang in their..pauly, oneofus,serenity,fish and everyone I did not have time to mention but you know who you are....till the wheels come off a-wakan

[Oneofus]

Hi Bro.  Well, I did try it.  I'm somewhat okay, not nearly what I/we went though last time, but definitely nothing to hold the presses for.  I started after I was kicking pretty hard (about 12 hours after my last dose of oxy/hydro) and increased gradually taking 2 mg, an hour apart, for three hours.  I'm not going to go into a lot of detail (unless there's anything specific you would like to know, and I will be happy to answer any questions).  I'm about 10 hrs into it and have taken a total of 22 mg.  About the only thing positive I can say about it is it is definitely better than kicking -- no question.  

But...It comes on lousy.  I had moments when I thought, "OH God no!  I've done it again.  I'm going to have a serious reaction."  Upper body heat, horrible anxiety, spaciness, sweats.  And you know the fear that brings.  But, after about 10 or 15 minutes, suddenly, all at once, it all stopped and a feeling of calm came over me.  Each time.  But not enough to bring me "home."  Methadone is always so cool (to me).  No matter how strung I have been, no matter what I have been taking, no matter how bad I feel -- good ol' methadone comes and gets me, spoons me gently up, carries me all the way back home, puts a smile on my face and gives me my life back all wrapped in beautiful cosmic energy.  Not this stuff.  I can see that, if you want to put in a few days -- four or five days -- maybe a week -- it will probably "grow on you," and maybe work quite well.  

But it ain't me now.  I can tell that if I take more it won't help, and I don't feel particularly well right now.  If I had to function, I could, but my heart isn't into anything.  Were you able to feel the 30 mg of dones you took when you got back home?  I think what I am going to do is -- at least for now -- go back to methadone.  I am just wondering how long the 22 mg of bupe I have in my system right now is going to prevent it (methadone) from taking effect.  Anything you can offer me as to how long I should wait?

How are you right now, and what have you been taking?
Yer Bro,
Rider

[awakan]

Serenity knowing your going to use before you even leave is the very mind game that defeats us but I do understand it. Yes do what you feel you have to do I was not aware you also were on psyc meds..And sometimes our best thinking can be good if we temper our own truths like in your case your truth in treatment was you knew you were going to use when you got out..Knowing that truth put you in a position to either give in to that or say since I know I am going to want to use when I get out I will protect myself by doing?? So if your doctors are helping and that is the truth only you know and have to base your treatment on that truth..I wish you hope and a vision of who you want to be.................Still crazy after all these years...a-wakan

[serenitysaves]

I hate when I do this, I just wrote out a post then pressed "back to forum" so there goes my post.
anyway, yes meth to sub might sound crazy, but where I'm from its somewhat comman.  I have'nt seen to many people do well in the end though.  I will continue to listen to my doctors and take in their feedback, because my best thinking got me here.  I'm scared because last time I thought I did everything right, but I was'nt on my psych med's so this time I'm working with my psycholist.   That's the one thing I did'nt do last time.  I was clean for a year before my taper, involed in N/A (it really was my life) and finally went into treatment to be in a safe environment I was there 21 days, I left a week early because I talked a good game, but I knew I was going to use before I left.

anyway I just pray this time goes faster and well.
take care