sub is dope DIRTY DOPE

[slinger1]

IF THE TIME COMES WHEN YOUR TRULY CLEAN YOU WILL UNDERSTAND. IF YOUR ON SUB YOU ARE NOWHERE NEAR CLEAN!YOU FEEL SO MUCH BETTER ,YOU CAN FUNCTION AGAIN, CAUSE YOUR HIGH!! FU*KING DOCTORS GOT PEOPLE BRAIN WASHED.IS A HEROIN ADDICT CLEAN WHEN HE SWITCHES TO METHADONE .HELL NO!!! SUB IS A SEC 1 NARCOTIC NO WAY AROUND IT. ITS LIKE A PERSON HOSTING A  AA SITE THAT SITTING THERE SIPPING WINE TELLING PEOPLE YOU ARE DOING GREAT WHEN THEIR SITING GETTING A BUZZ. I HAVE BEEN ON SEC 1 OPIATES FOR 18 YEARS LIVED DONE EVERY SCENARIO ANYONE COULD IMAGINE. THEIR  IS ONLY ONE WAY OUT OF THE NIGHTMARE!! STOP AND THAT'S IT.  THAT'S THE REALITY. AND ITS HELL BUT IT DOSE GET BETTER WAY BETTER.UNLESS YOU WANT TO WAIT FOR IT TO DO WHAT IT DID TO ME. TAKE EVERYTHING YOU USED TO BE AWAY. MAKE YOU A SLAVE TO THE POINT THAT YOU CANT MAKE A . PLAN ON ANYTHING WITHOUT FIRST THINKING ,WILL I HAVE MEDS ON THAT DAY IF NOT YOU CANT DO IT. SOUND FAMILIAR??YOUR OWNED BY A PILL THEN . I PROMISE YOU IF YOU QUIT YOU WILL SEE IAM JUST TELLING THE WAY IT IS NO BS. THER IS ROOM FOR THAT HERE.THIS TO DEAD SERIOUS. AND DEAD YOU BE IF YA KEEP GOING. IF FEEL LIKE YOUR GONNA DIE. YOUR NOT!! ITS ALL PART OF IT THI.ER IS NO EASY WAY OUT. AND IF THEIR WAS .YOU WOULD NEVER APPRECIATE YOUR VICTORY.. I WISH EVERYONE NOTHING BUT LOVE ITS ALL WE TRULY HAVE.GIVE IT TO EVERYONE IT COMES RIGHT BACK

[worried878]

agree with avis...these types of discussion start a sub war with submarine torpedos or methadone missiles firing away....sometimes the sub torpedos fire at the methadone missiles...and in the end these discussions get nowhere...helping, hoping, supporting and praying for each other to get clean and stay clean is the mission of this forum    ..I think?

[NautyOne]

Just an opinion.......I think when something takes away the pain, you are not facing the issue.  Any quick fix is going to be abused.  I think suboxone is a great tool in the right person.  We see a lot of people who do abuse it out here and people who hold onto it for dear life because they can't get off it. I wish there were some statistics on it, otherwise, by exhibit we create our own opinion.......

To sub or not to sub....... that is the question?

nauty............

[TysonRed]

Of course people who are on sub recognize the fact that they are still on an opiate, if you dont then you shouldnt be on it. To say sub is dirty dope, well thats just someones opinion, yes it can be abused, but what about the people that it has saved. Theres always been this underlying opinion of replacement drugs being viewed as nothing but switching one for the other, well to me Id rather be taking something where I can see the end in sight, where there is hope at the end of the road. Its not supposed to be used for maintenance, just a synthetic opiate designed to help people withstand the w/d's of their drug of choice, be stabilized and then taper off the suboxone. If suboxone is dirty, then I'd hate to hear what oxycodone is, or what methadone is classified as. To whoever out there doesnt understand that cold turkey isnt an opiton for some people, get on with your own struggles, no need to put those down who use sub for its purpose, and will use it successfully. Of course there are bad doctors who use people addictions to profit for themselves through suboxone, but there are many doctors out there who haved saved many lives with the help of suboxone. I respect everyones opinion, but quitting is quitting, there are different methods of quitting your DOC, lets not pick on those who choose a different route than yourself. Is that really going to help someone in their recovery, I dont believe Ive read any insightful information that would sway my opinion of some people who have chosen to sub route, as myself, again and again its only a tool to be used, not a miracle...for those doctors that claim some sort of miracle, well I'd suggest seeing another doctor. My opinion remains, Suboxone is not for everyone as we all know, but I will never except the opinion that states that suboxone is somehow dirty, its helped so many people that Ive come into contact with. Yes, I do hear the occasionall people who didnt like sub or agree with its use, and that is their opinion, but they also dont go out and disrespect those who are using or have used to get clean. We are all here for the same END result to become clean and sober, if you get there by simply quitting and I get there with the aid of suboxone does that make you better than me, I think not, we would both be clean and thats the point. So instead of stating generalized disapproval of the medication, the time would be better spent by sharing information, help and support for whatever path one may choose. For those who dont agree well fine, but fact remains we're here to get clean, there are different strokes for different folks, and until people can accept that addiction is different in everyone and so are their paths to sobriety. Use caution and be knowledgable about your medication whatever it may be, but dont discount all of your options, and never allow anyone into pressuring their own opinion into your life, its all our own decisions and it is us who will have to live and deal with those outcomes. Good luck to all of you out there with whatever your struggle may be...I wish you the best!!!

[spiderman0]

I agree with you 150% quitting is sooooo hard but in the end its all worth it. no more worrying when ur down 2 your last couple pills. no more depending on a drug. the saying is what ever your choice of drug is its like its your significant other. you will do anything for that drug. the drug comes first. u love that drug more than anything . i can see that 4 myself. i've been clean from pills going on 2yrs on Nov 9. and i am so fuckin proud of myself now. honestly a person has 2 want 2 quit. sum have 2 b tired of being sick and tired.sum people have to litteraly hit rock bottom. As the addicts say " JUST FOR TODAY".dont worry about 2moro. just think of Today.

[Coolio Hernendez]

Man...this has me really feeling bad. I really thought that this low dose 2 mg's a day or 1 mg a day was going to be my way of long term treatment of CP. After reading this im wondering ????????

[HelpinUtah]

I'm thankful for our opinions, but I also think that just like the way we became addicted to the drugs differently and for different reasons, sometimes alternatives are necessary as long as they are monitored by a doctor!

[landbray]

. I HAVE BEEN ON SEC 1 OPIATES FOR 18 YEARS LIVED DONE EVERY SCENARIO ANYONE COULD IMAGINE. Hasn't everyone on this site done the same? I copied some of your post b/c it would be easier to make my point. you have 18 yrs, I have 28- 30 yrs.  THEIR  IS ONLY ONE WAY OUT . for you there is only one way out. Not the same for all of us.   THAT'S THE REALITY.that is your reality. once again not everyones. AND ITS HELL I don't feel like it's hell. I know some people that do GET BETTER WAY BETTER.UNLESS YOU WANT TO WAIT FOR IT TO DO WHAT IT DID TO ME. I wouldn't expect it to do the same thing to me. b/c I am not you.   MAKE YOU A SLAVE TO THE POINT THAT YOU CANT MAKE A . PLAN ON ANYTHING WITHOUT FIRST THINKING ,WILL I HAVE MEDS ON THAT DAY IF NOT YOU CANT DO IT. I have enough pills when I leave town b/c I don't abuse my persp. SOUND FAMILIAR?? no,not to me.YOUR OWNED BY A PILL THEN .  you may but not meI  QUIT YOU WILL SEE IAM JUST TELLING THE WAY IT IS   the way it is for you. NO BS. THER IS ROOM FOR THAT HERE.THIS TO DEAD SERIOUS. AND DEAD YOU BE IF YA KEEP GOING. I don't plan on dying from suboxine. dont think ya can.   WOULD NEVER APPRECIATE YOUR VICTORY   I have met allot of goals since I started suboxine that I have been wanting to do for years but was always to busy getting high...
that's what  makes America great, we all are able have our own opinions.
I try to keep the focus on my recovery. Will share but never advise.
good luck to you in the rest of your recovery
paaddict

[sadinmichigan]

ok everyone..these are opinions..if we were to go through every post you will find differences of opinion every where..nobody is threatening anyone or calling names, that i am aware of.....but if you can't state your opinion than what??  Some people think methadone saved their lives..I don't..some people think using trammys is a good idea to get off drugs?? it's all opinion..whats the big deal.

[avisg]

Time to agree to disagree ....... you all have said your pice this isn't helping anyone ...

[Mandapanda17]

I AM glad I didn't use sub, but now I've still been on xanax for the last 25 days I've been clean from opiates. I know lots of people don't agree with that either! just thought I'd add my story.. I'm not sure if these posts are helping everyone. some are having a HARD time right now. much love to all!! xo

[cathy5841]

ummm....i dont think  sub is for everyone, but i do think sub has its place.  my daughter was shooting up about 400 mgs of oxy per day....she is using sub to save her life....she started at 32mgs is down to 2 mgs on day 53..she is doing great....next week she will take it every other day....sub is better than shooting up oxy....ppl here are struggling to get off opiates if they use sub they are still giving up their DOC and working toward getting drug free, i dont think it is wise to discourage them and cause them to go back to using.  sorry i have to disagree with this post....for some sub is a life saver...you do not get high with sub thats just stupid....it blocks the feeling of opiates....educate yourself before you down others ways of getting clean.

[road2recovery]

Before I detoxed, I had planned on doing the sub with fladdict....But decided against it...But I do think it has it's place..Let's say for someone that has a underlying medical problem, heart disease etc...I would think under a doctors care , it would be best not to put your body through w/d's if you are on a heavy dose, and can't taper....Then again that is just my thoughts...I do agree that too many are jumping on sub like it is a magic pill....We all know how tough w/d's are...Then all of a sudden it becomes a distant memory, kind of like, well it really wasn't that bad...SO for me , staying clean is the toughest of ALL..
r2r

[ochooked]

Man, I appreciate the brutal honest of your position.   I just have to chime in on this post because I am now at day 13 since I took my last 'CRUMB' of Suboxone.   I used the Sub 21 day taper program after leaving a 14 year addiction to Oxy.  Yes, the sub immediately took away the W/D symptoms and kept me comfortable UNTIL I tried to stop taking it.  I thought at the time I took that last crumb that it was going to be really easy and I would only have a little weakness or lack of energy.   Now, let me tell all those that I believe Slinger is right in how much we appreciate being clean after we have suffered so much.   I can truthfully say that I am better than yesterday and each day since about day 7 has gotten better.   Now the W/D's are fewer and farther apart --  Sometimes they still come in waves and I get shaking, sweating, hot/cold, and of course extreme lethargy and lack of energy.   I have done and am doing every supplement known to mankind.   The single best help after I quit was told to me by a long term member of this board ---- it is prescription or you can order it on the internet --- called Provigil.   It is soon to be released, I hear, as an AD but works in a  totally different way.  Instead of targeting Seratonin or Epinephrine, it replenishes the Dopamine receptors that are depleted.   I take 200 mg twice a day and when I take it -  about 40 minutes and I am feeling a 'non caffeine' boost that last for about 5 hours -- - expensive though but insurance covers it.   Bottom line after 13 days off Sub is YES, I would still recommend it for those who are on pretty heavy doses of Opiates  -- just know that if you are not prepared to do some hard work on your own, you could relapse.  Sub is NO magic bullet ---- there is no pain free way ----  But still the single greatest thing I have ever done for myself or my family was to push through until I got the victory.  O.K. guys --   just my two cents worth ---- All the best to everyone on the road to recovery.  'The sun will come out tomorrow - bet your bottom dollar'  - how corny is that?

[sadinmichigan]

I agree with you also...it can help but I am still skeptical about it. Where does it end? Before you know it the drug co. will need to create a new drug to help people get off sub...it's all bad..10 yrs ago they never would be so free giving people methadone to get off freakin pills..I made that bad decision..I wish someone would have told me the truth then. and now people take sub to get off that..and so on..But as far as being clean..my opinion is clean means..drug free..period! thanks for the post.

[Kova]

seeing you are 107 years old i may listen to you. LOL.

[liscamdave]

Um where have you been. Can you help me over here. These new people here are all on me about this.///hop over to the Get Educated post...and HELP

[NautyOne]

WoW !!!  dang it.  I must say that I  100% agree.  Sub, was just a topic when i came out here a little more than a year ago.  Now it is a subject.  I cringe and have to bite my tongue lately ........and that is not easy for me.......but, You are so straight forward RIGHT......

Everyone is different, and sub HAS helped many, but, however, I see it doing a lot of harm too, because you really have to want to Quit !!  and, sub. can be used and abused too......It should be Mandatory that anyone on sub. must attend aftercare or be cutt-off !!

Great Post.

Luv,
Nauty..........