why has narcotics taken over?

[farbeyondriven]

I have been takin all kinds of different type of pain meds ...for pain and pleasure ...  Im 26 male with a good life great girlfriend and job...im a soux chef at acountry club and i enjoy the sport of bodybuilding ... i have been taken anything from hydro's to oxy's whatever i can find i get ..  i never exceed over 100mg's to 120mgs of whatever drug i have in body ..I feel that i need to quit cause its changing me and my life now the fun is turned into a battle inside my head ..i hate it i want to get out ... i have been takin pain meds for over 6 months know ..but not a evrytday thing only when i can get them i eat them all day long sometimes for a week or sometimes a few days ...i have experienced withdrawls to a less degree then what i have read people go threw ...i want to quit but i don't ... its causing a impact on my once perfect relationship ... and this last 2 months it has been evryday habit ... im spending all of my hard earned money on pills ... just the word it self i hate it !  i need to get my self staright ..please help me out   is there a out ???

[Rex1]

Hi and welcome.

Today as they say, is the beinning of the rest of your life. As least it was for me when i realized that I needed to quit.

So now you know if you have been reading since Aug what you are up against - it won't be easy.

But it will probably be easier than you think if you gather all the "weapons" as I like to call them, to your disposal.

First, I would suggest that you make comittment to one another that you will quit together.

Second, IMO, tapering is easier than going cold turkey. Many here say that they can't do that, so you may try both.

Admit, though, that you both are addicts and are by default then, powerless over this in and of yourself.

Come here often, and look at the thread entitled Tapering Schedule. We are running a challenge to be sober by Jan 1 2003. You can still make it if you taper starting today.

Finally, start the Thomas recipe as soon as possible. If you have been reading since August, you must know what that is and how to find it.

Good luck and the members here will give you as much help as we can.

one more thing, post your messages in the very top topic thread on the main page so all here will see it and respond.

good luck...

Rex

[Vampy]

PLease forgive me for posting the same comments on several different Questions... but this is my first time, and I wanna be sure SOMEONE sees my post. *smiles*

Hello everyone. *waves*
I don't even know where to begin... *sigh* So many of your stories have "me" in them.
I was never prescribed Vics... but when I broke a tooth once, someone gave me their scrip, and the rest... as they say, is history. *heavier sigh* Sometimes I take up to 15 11 milligram pills a day. My husband... who doesn't do any other drugs, doesn't drink, or smoke... has gotten hooked as well. We cannot believe this has happened to us. We live for the days that our "connection" gets her scrip filled... We have done no Christmas shopping yet because.. *hangs head in shame* well... you all know why...(they cost us $4 a piece) and we have two kids. My husband keeps saying that he is too smart to have let it get this far...(aren't we all!) It was just a fun way to relax and buzz at first. Now we need them just to feel normal. *sigh* I am supposed to start Nursing school this coming fall. But I dare not do that till I kick this. This has been going on with us since May of 2002. We ran out for four days and we both just wanted to die. He works but I am a stay at home mom... and it's maddening! When we run out this time.. we both agree that we are DONE, and need to go cold turkey and just suffer cause we deserve it. Forget any help from doctors... we have ZERO health insurance. Neither of us has been to a Doctor in over 5 years for anything. I have read this forum off and on since about August.... and only had the guts to post today... and only cause I am on the evil things right now. I hate that I need them. Thank you for reading my rant... any help or advice would mean so much. I think you are all VERY brave, and just reading your words comforts me... But I am soooo very, very scared..... *sigh*

-Vamp

[hippy]

everything i wrote is in the na basic text and lit.

[hellbent]

The three steps as listed above by hippee are one man's opinion, not the actual steps themselves. It's also standard that we share OUR experience, strength and hope. We don't talk for others, or suggest what "We" all need to do to get clean.

Hipee, I actually agree with your points. But, if you are going to do programspeak here, it should probably be under the same parameters that exist in the meetings themselves...

[hippy]

hey  there, hope your ok today.
i saw you mentioned the 12 steps
i have written hundred's of pages
on each one. i have been in na since
1980.
step one accept the truth

step 2 have faith in the truth


step 3 commit to the truth

step 1 is the begining , accepting the facts about ourselves.
we live to use and use to live.

acceptance is the oppisite of denile

practicing acceptance of the truth on a dayily basis
steer's us twards the fact that we need help and
alone we will perish.
3 spiritual principles  to begin with are honesty, openmindedness
and willingness.

willinness is something i pray for every day.
im honest with my wife. im willing to do anything
to stay clean. and change twards the better each day.

[hippy]

i feel your pain , it does get better.
take hot baths all night if you have too.
stay clean, and take it easy on the driving
try to take it easy on yourself if you can.
i love pop warner. i am a football fanatic.

enbrace the pain!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Rex1]

Those little yellow Norcos are tempting aren't they? When you're on a low enough dose, toss 'em in the toilet as you give em the middle finger like I did - very liberating...

Today, as well as last week, I have been in constant pain because of my back. (I drove 4.5 hours to Laughlin, Nevada and back again for a pop warner football round robin tournament. Try doing that, including sleeping in the beds these hotels put you in, without pain killers- not fun!)

My legs hurt, my back hurts, and I have a generally mild feeling of "Is this what my life will be like with no pills?"

I know at any minute I could call my doctor and just utter the words "I can't take the pain" and 30 minutes later it will be over. ....or will it?

No it won't. As a matter of fact, I'll be back at square one, having lost every single gain I have made since two weeks ago when it felt like my entire life crashed and burned.

And then it will start over, and over, and over again. I remember a dream I had - I was on a carnival ride that started out fun, but then got boring, and then got really scary, and when I looked down to ask the guy to shut the ride down so I could get off, he was gone, and the park was closed and everyone had left, except me, still on the ride from hell.

And so it goes, i think with the addiction from hell.

Unlike the dream, somehow, I found a way off the ride, but for some reason feel tempted to get back on because of all the fun I think I had.

THERE IS NO FREAKIN' WAY I AM TAKING ANOTHER NORCO!

How's that for my plan - I don't care if I live with this pain for every minute of the rest of my life. No way, because it IS NOT a SOLUTION TO THE PROBLEM!

You are welcome to any or all of my motivations for not taking those Norcos you have, I'm done. Perhaps they are of no value.

I believe though there's only one way out - zero. You can do it if you want to bad enough, and we will be here to (hopefully) lift you up!

Carnivals suck anyway.... as the song says "Back to life, back to reality..."

Rex

[I'm Done]

I read your original post about how you feel right now and asked if anyone could truly identify. Here I am! My hand is raised! Yes, I feel exactly like you do. My vice is hydro and as I decrease the feelings of lethargy and depression are almost too powerful to take. I do not mean to sound like it is something I went through at one time either, I am going through it right now! Life sucks. The life has literally been sucked out of me. I told my wife your EXACT same words... "it is like I am dying but from the inside rather than the outside". Oh, how true. The only thing you can do is realize that it is only going to get worse if you do not get a hold of your addiction. I have been tapering and I have about 30 Norco (10 mg hydro) about 2 feet from me. I am dying to pop about 20-25 of them right now. But I know I cannot. If I do then I will be one day closer to truly dying inside. I keep telling myself that the physical pain my body is in is good, and that it should tell me that I am getting better.

I'm Done

[OxyDout]

Bodymechanic:  I hope that bup works for you, however Mariposa has much experience with it so I would heed her warning.  

Have either of you given serious thought as to how you will stop using? what I mean is what YOU will do, not what drug you will use.  When it comes down to it you need to be able to say you no longer want to use, you have to be able to get through a work day without anything, and be happy about it.  

I know Mariposa has thought about this because she asked me all the time a while back, about "what will you do to make yourself happy?" and I never had an answer.  The truth is, knowing i'm sober makes me happy, I love the fact that when I wake up, my eyes pop right open and I get out of bed within 10 seconds, rather then slug around until 1pm and move from my bed to the couch......

Anyway, just wanted to wish you luck, stay strong and keep moving forward because eventually you will make it happen.  

gwh

[groovygirl]

I still haven't found the answer.  I am TRYING to work the 12 steps, because it is the one thing I haven't really tried and it seems to work for so many people.

There is what's called a "dry drunk" - this is a person who somehow managed to get clean by themselves, but hasn't really admitted to themselves that they are powerless over the drugs/drink. It's funny...you have to give up control in order to have control.  I don't understand it all, but I am learning.  I don't want to be a dry drunk.  I don't want to always feel that something is missing in my life.  For me, it has everything to do with spirtuality...I don't have it in my life, and I need it.  If I could believe there is someone/something greater than us out there who would look out for us IF we put our faith in Him, I would perhaps finally find peace.

I can work out, paint, read...do all the THINGS that I enjoy to try to not be bored, but I still feel something missing.  I haven't lost my family (yet) over this or my job, so from the outside my life probably looks OK.  The inside of me is hurting though, and I wish it was simply a matter of going to church...I desperately WANT to believe...sometimes it takes losing everything before people find their faith.  I hope that is not the case for me.  I know I'm rambling, but this is the really hard part...the after detox part...the getting on with my life without drugs part.

[Bodymechanic]

I asked myself that exact same question before I started on the buprenex. After all I have abused every other drug at some point.  There is a difference here though.  Here there is a long term goal and a purpose. There is the hope that if I simply stick with the program I will gradually get better. With other drugs there was no purpose except for the gratification that came with the moment. I always knew that the end would always be the same. With the buprenex I am taking it one day at a time and looking forward to a good ending. In that regard I have a simple purpose of not using more than 2mg sublingual a day.  It is a dose I can easily afford and psycologically I feel like a medication user and not a drug addict.

Ultimately only time will tell if I am just fooling myself.  But at this point, I think that buprenex is the end of the line for me. To abuse it, would be a personal disaster for me. I would be force to go back to being drug free. I know how to get and stay clean.  But that would mean going back to being tired, depressed and in pain. Just the thought is more than enough motivation to carry me through the day.  

Peace

[groovygirl]

About Buprenex...I just want people to know and understand that it is an opiate, and it is addicting.  It hasn't been around long enough in this country for many studies to have been done on it's long-term effects.  In Europe, however, it has and people there are abusing it.  I have detoxed from oxys, percs and vikes.  Buprenex, after abusing it, has been BY FAR the hardest to say goodbye to.  Because it makes you feel so "normal" you feel really ABnormal when you stop...and the sickness that follows is excruciating.

Also, it is like any other narcotic in that after awhile one doesn't work so well, and then two doesn't work so well...it is extremely hard to stick to a taper with it.

I know I keep talking about it, but it is the last hope for some people.  It is a ball and chain like Methadone.  If you want/need to take it forever, then it's great.  I think you need to either take it very short-term for detox, or make sure you have someone who will continue to prescribe it forever.

Bodymechanic...you said the FDA has shut them down in the past...I figured that.  What happens on the day that you go to order, and find that they have been shut down?  That would scare me.  Good luck.

[groovygirl]

Who did you speak with there?  They wouldn't waive any fee for you even if you were the Surgeon General.  They are all about the money....ALL about the money.

They told me my receptors would be back to normal in about six months...not one or two years.  Did you mean nerves or receptors?

I'm not sure what's in your bottle, but I pay about $465 per month for meds from there.

Sooner or later I'm afraid you will take more than prescribed.  What's to stop you?  You did it with your other medication, so why wouldn't you do it with this?  That is why I think their program is bull.  They send an addict home with drugs...drugs that make them feel good...hello?  They gave me a taper schedule...yeah ok why would that work for me?  I couldn't taper off oxys.  I couldn't taper off vikes or percs.

I wish so badly that I had never told you about this place.  When I read your post that you were on your way there yesterday, I almost cried.  Please, please be very careful.

[Bodymechanic]

I hear what you are saying.  I learned from your experience and I was well prepared before I went.  I was clean for 3 days before I went so I did not have to pay $1250.00 for the detox. I also explained to him that I did not need more than 2mg of sublingal a day.  I think that I could get along nicely with 1mg or less per day.  This morning I took .2mg and most of the pain and fatigue are gone. I agree that this office may be a bit paranoid.  He admitted to me that over the last 8 years the FDA has closed his office twice.  I'm not sure what you paid for your medication. I have a 50mg bottle that cost me $200.00. I cannot find it anywhere including overseas for cheaper. The "medication managment fee" is a rip off and I will try to get them to waive that fee.  Since I myself am a health care professional nearly all doctors give me some type of professional courtesy.

What do you plan to do now? I feel like I am at the end of the line and if I mess up with the buprenorphine there will be no place left to go. He tells me that if I stick strictly to the plan that we worked out that in a year or two my nervous system will correct itself. I will be able to sleep like a normal person and have the same energy as anyone else my age.

[groovygirl]

Body - I hate myself for every telling you about that place...please, please be careful!!  It cost me SO much money for one thing.  For another, they allowed me to take 6 amps per day for a long, long time...without question.  I'm not sure how they can do what they've been doing legally...they were prescribing Bup long before it was FDA approved for detox.  They will not send me my records, so I can try for reimbursement from my insurance company.  They keep making excuses...they are afraid is what the problem is.  Afraid of anyone looking too closely at what they are doing.  One of my credit cards has gone over 10K just from buying Bup from this place.  Is that incredible or what?

Each time you order the Bup, they will charge you a $75 Dr. fee, $30 for overnight shipping plus the unreal amount they somehow justify for the meds.  I went from being someone who would faint at the sight of a needle, to someone who jams the needle right through my shirt while driving down the highway.

I'm begging you to reconsider using their services.  Please never go beyond 1 or 2 amps in a day...taper by 1/2 amp each week, and then just get off the stuff.  This place will bleed you for everything you have.  

[Bodymechanic]

It's 6:00am and I am ready to pack my wife and 13mo daughter into the car for the trip from Baltimore to Pittsburg. I have an appointment today with Advanced Medical one of the few places  offering buprenex for pain and addiction.

For anyone out there who has just started to get in trouble with drugs, it's not to late to get off the merry go round.  I am not doing this because I want to. I am doing because I have to. This is the extent I am willing to go, just to be able to live, work and sleep like a normal person. I consider myself one of the lucky ones. Many, many addicts have met with a much worse fate, including 3 of my cousins who did not survive till their 30th birthday.

Peace

[Rex1]

SB,

Give yourself a break for Christmas, will ya?

It's not how you got, in, it's how you are determined to get out, which YOU WILL do!

If you are still angry, let it out and refuse to give it time and counsel if that makes sense.

Rex
-----------------------
p.s.

It could be worse, you could be hooked on Rap music.

Just think, somewhere, there's another forum like this, where people are spilling out their guts, saying things like:

"how could I ever get hooked on something by musicians who get everything they need to be a star at Walmart?

Baggy pants - aisle 5.
Drum machine - aisle 12.
Hat, on backwards, aisle 3.
Mr microphone, aisle 13.
Extra large authentic, genuine, imitation, simulated gold chain - jewelery section

I.....am now a rap star!

Now I walk around with that infernal beat in my head, and use words like cous. and ho."

I understand there is no cure.

Rex

[Rex1]

Hey man, thanks for those words. They mean a lot.

I'm in that 10-15 day what-do-call-this-feeling, craving, nutty, P-offed,  in between mood today so forgive me in advance.....

If anyone wants to feel better, go rent Christmas vacation and watch the section where Randy Quaid, aka Cousin Eddie is outside Chevy CHase's house with a cotton nightie thingie on drinking a MeisterBrau emptying the septic tank from his RV into the sewer at 7:00 am! Chevy's neighbor looks at him, to which he replies "Shitter's full!" LOL - a classic!

Well day 12 has me hating life and roaming my property screaming in a Monty Python-type voice "My kingdom for a Norco"! Back hurts, brain hurts, legs hurt, knees, ankles, heck it all hurts - what a pathetic wimp I have become.

Oh yeah, I forgot - I'm sober. Remind me that's my goal, will someone........

some sing along music for your listening pleasure...
"I'LL BE SOBER FOR CHRISTMAS, YOU CAN COUNT ON ME, BLAH, BLAH,BLAH, BLAH BLAH-BLAH, BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH.........


My kingdom for a Norco, My kingdom for a Norco!
(I'm kidding - I'm not goin back this time - no way!)

Keep pushin on folks, - it works! AND it DOES feel better everyday! Many here may never forgive me for this post - I know I wouldn't...

Rex

[southernbelle]

thank you, thank you, thank you.  i appreciate you so much.  please remember i am not selfish, i know other people are having hard times, too.  probably harder.  i will be thinking about you, too.  we all need support, we need each other.  i hope these meds work and help me to feel better.  i feel ashamed of being weak, but i guess that's another day.  first things first.  i've got two precious girls that i've got to stay sane for.  they sure don't deserve a mom like this.  love to you.

[southernbelle]

that's just what i needed.  that was hilarious!  i am smiling (laughing) right now.  love to you!

[southernbelle]

everything will be okay.  read your own post back to yourself to help you stay positive.  at the levels you are, you will definitely have to TAPER.  sit down in private and write down a tapering schedule for yourself.  and our beloved hippee is so right....take it ONE DAY AT A TIME.  just get though each day, like he said.  sit down and write it out for yourself and do the best you can to stick to it, just do the best you can.  read old posts from here and stay in touch with everybody here, it helps.  i hope your husband is understanding.  i'm fortunate to have an angel here with me everyday, my husband, but there are just as many people here who don't have much support on the homefront.  i hope that gets better for you....i will be thinking about you. love and peace to you.

[Rex1]

Sorry your having a tough time - I've been there myself this last month.

I don't think anyone here will be able to tell how those meds will work when combined in your body.

I can tell you though that the key should be using one set of drugs to get off of the other, then gettng off all of them.

If this combo of meds can put you in a positive mood so you can focus on getting off the narcos - well then, they are doing the job! Just proceed slowly, and of course we will be here to lend support.

You're in my prayers.

Rex

[Jennibean]

Thank you both so much for your posts and support. I agree I am taking alot but cannot go to medical detox again. I am not just making excuses either I wish I could I would do it in a second! My insurance won't cover it again first of all and I just did it in October the 14th actually so I was clean for a bit after that so even though I am taking 40 a day I have only been doing that for about 2 weeks. So I still have faith that I can taper myself. I think I could even taper quite a bit initially because even if I went from taking 10 at a time to 4 at a time it would be enough to keep me feeling ok and then I will stay at 4 a day for at least a week and then start a taper from there. I am going to do this. Alot of insurance isn't even going to cover opiate detox anymore because it won't kill you. Of all detox as hellish as it is,it is still the safest one. So I am on my own I really wish I could do a 28 day program but being a stay at home Mother of two in a state where I know almost nobody makes it impossible. Believe me I have heard every excuse from addicts why they can't go into treatment and it frustrates me when the argument is there "well if you die from drugs who is gonna take care of your kids" I really take it that seriously but again can't do it. I will do this on my own now while I have been on a couple week binge before it turns into 9 months again before my eyes. I am very honest and I have been extremely honest with my Dr's. I told them I went into detox, I even called and said if I call for narcotics any time soon it is because I am sick and in withdrawal so don't give them to me and yet here I am picking up scripts because I am in undeniable pain and my Dr is in a pickle saying it is not moral to not treat a patient when you know they have pain. He basically tells me to get better and then worry about the addiciton but I really think he is in denial about the fact that I am addicted and still considers it more dependant than addicted. After I wrote my last post about tapering I called my Dr and asked for my refill to be ready on Monday. I also asked for 3 bottles instead of one and they called back and said the script is waiting at the front desk. So now I know I will have enough to taper slowly. Because 3 bottles of this is equal to 360 percocet that should be enough I hope I will figure out my taper tonight, I also asked for 3 bottles so that I won't have to go to the office while I do this because I am just as addicted to going to the Dr for everything now as I am on the pills. I need to stop calling the DR and seeing the DR it is a trigger for me and makes me want to use. Then most importantly I will let my husband in on my dirty little secret that this liquid is the same thing I was on before just not in pill form, he will make sure I stay on the taper or I am pretty sure he is at the point of just leaving me. Which is extremely sad since we are soul mates and madly in love, but I have been cheating on him with pills and have become more intimate with my pills than my husband. Anyway thank you again for your support!!!!!! I hope I can continue to come here and feel as safe and as welcome as I do today.

Jennifer

[southernbelle]

soooo good to hear from you!  i treasure your activity on this forum.  please post some more, oh wise one!  i care about you.  how are things with your nephew and the new baby?
everybody -- here's the low-down from my visit with the psychiatrist today.  i didn't tell her everything....we basically talked about my depression and anxiety.  this is what she gave me and prescribed me:
Buspar, 15 mg (I'm supposed to take two a day)
Remeron, 15 mg (two a day, too)
Prozac, 40 mg once a day
I have to say I feel like i'm a certified NUT now, it's official.  i hope i'm not making a mistake by starting all this.  i've never had it this rough before though, never.  i can honestly say this is the worst time of my life i've had so far.  so i need to do something.  i wonder now what it's like to be normal. what do all of you think?  i value your opinions so much.  has anybody out there taken any of this stuff?  she also gave me valium, but i didn't get that filled.  i've heard too much about that here.  i don't want to trade one evil for another one.
you guys are the best.  i'm soooo thankful for this place.  just to know you guys are listening means so much.  please offer some insight, if any of you can.  LOVE to each and every one of you.