hey nate i so understand , we all want to be us before all hell broke loose. i have anxiety on and off, i dont take anything right now for it , but last year 4 months i was going nuts and on meds klonopin helped me to get my life back buti could not got it back if i had myself not made me get up off my butt and start living, it was so hard but i did it and now am med free. yes i still have anxiety from time to time ,like to day but i got up went out and now its good, not all can do that ,. my mom has it to and shes on meds but she cant seem to leave her house lots times and the meds help some, not sure why they helped me so much but not helping her as much ,shes taking same as i did , but we all have to live it and its so scarey sometimes. i wish you the best but keep trying to be yourself you will get to it , it took me 4 months and somedays am not me but most the time am me . good luck
eventually the ativan has to go bro! you know it, so my adivce would be to stick with a dr. known taper schedule. it sucks, but you can do it. you really can. the mind and body is capable of so much. we are stronger than we ever think we can be. concentrate on the end goal! being off ativan and reestablishing the efficiency of the klonopin. it will end. it will go away. in times likes these words may be of little help. but remember SURVIVOR! not victim! SURVIVOR! it's a little pill and doesn't control your world. you will be better off and get back to yourself faster if the ativan is gone!
i think we all have agreed on this including your dr. and ryan and yourself. maybe make a post for him to add some words of advice. he's pretty knowledgeable about these things as you know. he might know a trick or two to make it a little easier. ryan/RCA
anxiety,antisocialism has been my shadow so many days..i feel u
You have got to get a taper schedule and determine what drug you are going to be taking to help you. Have you read the Ashton manual? I find her advice right on and very helpful!
As you may know, I have been weaning off xanax now for 5 MONTHS!! And, it has not been an easy ride, but I just keep going with knowing that it's going to be hell - that it's all part of the withdrawal process. That it is a normal part of the process.
What makes it so tricky, is that people believe that while they're going through the hell, the withdrawal is so painful, they see their original symptoms return, so they believe that they HAVE to take the benzo to feel better.
But - you have to get your brain to stabilize on the new, lowered amount, and it takes time. It is not a 5 , 7, or 10 day process. You have to listen to your body. If you feel like ****, you just ride it out....do whatever you can to distract yourself......and if you can't do anything, don't dwell on that.....try to tell yourself that this is only a temporary situation....
Please read the info. on Dr. Ashton - it really will help you understand this process. This will get better....you will get your BRAIN BACK!! Just know that the ride is going to be a bumpy hell but there is definitely a flicker of light coming....
And.....I hate the part of being antisocial, too....I have lost several close friendships during this as I've been judged harshly as they simply do not understand the isolation and wonder where the ole "xan" is.....she's still here...... just like the ole Nate is still there...he's just under a cloud of Ativan right now.....
keep the faith....it will get better....
i don't want to discount what anyone else says on here or degrade their posts...but ryan has VERY informed taper schedules. i would listen to him. he's even going to be a dr. now. he's reseached and deals with facts. i would STRONGLY AVOID!!!!! READING ANYTHING ABOUT BENZO'S ON THE INTERNET. stay away from the benzo bashing sites. the pro benzo sites etc...this will just get you all amped up created more anxiety....talk with your dr. and keep him informed. tell him about ryan's taper schedule....ride it out like weaner said...but lurking on the internet makes things worse. all the uk antibenzo sites and this ashton stuff. i'd stay away from it. i'd stay away from anything that will effect you negatively emotinally. you know what needs done. it's just it's hard right now. it will pass.
benzo's are one of the most prescribed meds in the world. Millions of prescriptions are filled a day in the U.S. alone. right now there are 30 horror stories on the benzo.org.uk the percentage of people that have problems with benzo's are are under 1% way under 1%!!!!! as i state and i believe ryan stated or i'm sure HE WILL BACK ME UP! the reasons for these stories are:
1. miss prescribed....YOUR CASE
3. taper wrong
4. the underlying illness has not been delt with and returns.
yes there will be some withdrawl when using a benzo but NOTHING like you are going through. you WERE in a bad spot and are taking the right steps to freedom. don't blame the drug, blame how they were prescribed. bad things happen to good people and life isin't fair always. you will be fine, you will grow and learn and appreciate life even more after this. i know you will make it through. your a fighter. i can tell, you have courage.
i also doubt any so called dr. that sells her info. book on the internet for a few bucks a pop. if this was really that relevant of information it would be published for FREE by medical sites....so to me ashton is a quack. that's my personal opinion. she might have some good ideas, premises or methods, but as for ethics.....haha.....and that tells me all i need to know about a person. especially one that is there to supposedly "HELP" people.
the most famous story of klonopin addiction....ahhhh stevie nicks!
her dr. prescribed her klonopin to get her off her "raging cocaine habit"
nice doc huh? this is insanity! ever heard of NA (narcotics anonymous) or is it suppose to be easier for superstars????? you see where i'm going with this bro.
do you see how this falls into one of the 4 categories i stated above?
keep the faith...pray....eat right...think positve as you can. keep the taper schedule. try to exercise, try to meditate or do relaxation. watch movies, play video games. write, there's magic in writing. then pray some more!
i will pray for you also!
God Bless Jay!
i just read up on dr. ashton's ideas. she has some credible information, but i can really see a bias towards benzo's in her work and especially in longterm treatment. the entire UK/Great Britan has this issue also. she leaves out alot of studies, studies of people that have been on benzo's for 30 or more years with no problems at all. tolerance, withdrawl etc....
studies or personal accounts like PAM, who posts here that was a complete agoraphobic, housebound and took klonopin and for 11 years and went from her house to being a FLIGHT ATTENDANT! after 11 years our dear pam had a few problems with panic again recently and i believe she's back on track now. dr. gould here supports stories like pam's. when she asked if 2mg a day is considered a high dosage and he flat out said NO. i believe that dr. ashton deals with numbers and not people. nate you can agree. QUALITY OF LIFE, is the most important factor. that is what everyone wants for you! and you want the same! so it wll happen! that's what we all want..
God Bless and i didnt' mean to bash anyone, including you xan....i just like when people tell both sides of the story and let people decide on their own....it's more that anti benzo site then the ashton broad ;) but hey...they are from the UK so what can you expect? haha j/k
i looked around their site, after xan was telling nate to check it out. pretty much on the same capicity you did. i took it for what its worth. leaving all bias aside. ashton has some legitimate studies in her work, but she seems to disregard this and go toward the "darkside" when it comes to benzo's. 2 weeks and that's all or you will suffer HELL! she doesn't even mention nor does the site any of the postives of benzo's longterm and seems to think that NO MATTER WHAT, you will develop a tolerance. that no matter what if you are taking a benzo for more than 2 weeks you will end up in trouble. she and the site, disregard the fact that, they are well under .05% of the population. to be honest i read a few stories and these people seem like they have other MAJOR disorders besides anxiety/panic. like being schitzprenic, bipolar, severe thyroid problems and also have chemical dependencies issues NOT related to benzo's....all major issues that should have been delt with before a diagnosis was made and a benzo prescribed. citing as you said the UK health system being at fault. she also puts down "north amercia" like our docs don't know what they are doing...again citing your reference....some arab prince has a heart problem, where does he go? certainly not to the UK. haha. if my doc says it's safe if taken properly, tells me it's a good longterm drug and i research and weigh the pro's and cons and i also come to places where people like you are and deal with facts. i make my own decision. like i said quality of LIFE! that is the issue here. there claim is laugh now but FOR CERTAIN CRY LATER. once again a cognitive distortion, black and white thinking. no good can come from this sort of approach.
come one now...i mean i'm living proof, that this isn't true. i've never had the urge to take more of my klonopin, never had the urge to up my dose unless, it just simply wasn't giving me the results that i hear the drug is suppose to. AND i'm a full blown alcoholic in recovery! i'm approaching a year on this medication, so ashton's 9 week study that K loses it's hypnotic and antioxolic properties is a fraud! i'm attacking my panic disorder from all angles. simple and plain. i must admit that looking at those stories, was a tad bothersome and i see how they can create hysteria. i will stay way, but most are flawed and fall into one of the categories i mentioned. but some people just happen to have a paradoxical effect to benzo's. just the way it is. this isn't my case or nate's or yours. i agree it's best to stay away from those sites and urged nate to also.
when it's time for me to get off my klonopin will i have some withdrawl effects? maybe so. it's part of the trade off for a quality of life. but i can't think of those things in the state that i'm in now. i will be much better of emotionally then. lots of progress will be made. i will handle it, my dr. is competent and knows how to taper of such medication, we've talked about this and he knows, what to do and is open to anything i bring up. willing to work with me and help me out. any patient should have a say in there therapy. i think alot of people just walk in to a pdoc's and swallow anything they give them. they want the magic cure, there is none, you must "cure" yourself as you said to me in another post. my only true worry is that when the time does come, no matter what i've done, that i will have to start all over with agoraphobia, without meds. but this is black and white thinking also, some of the cause of the actual disorder, i'm working on this also. just simply not true. there are too many gray areas and changes that will be made for me to be 100% argoraphobic again. i have dreams and things i'm persuing in my life....so when it comes to it. i leave it up to God....i'll do all i can, he'll do the rest and i'm sure i'm not gonna end up in a pscy ward thinking bugs are on me and seeing pink elephants haha. a real taper will stop that, and the rest is up to the work that i'm putting in NOW! people don't want to work for it, they want a pill to do i for them.
ashton states that the relapse rate of panic and agoraphobia is 80% or more after the discontinuation of benzo's. BUT she doesn't even factor in, the help of therapy, CBT and other lifestyle changes. when i said quack, i stand by that. i just didn't want to really offend xan as a poster on this board. (they kicked me off healingwell dot com, for my strong convictions and telling people the truth!, even though i was helping ALOT of people there, on that site, your posts would be removed immediately, they would label you as acting as a dr.)
some people have breakthrough panic attacks. some people haven't found the right dosage, gotten any or enough therapy, delt with some root causes. made lifestyle changes etc....i have a distinct feeling that if all those things are done, the breakthough panics will disappear over the next 6 months or so and then it will be time to wean myself down from my klonopin and use it on an as needed basis. but i'm not saying in 6 months i HAVE to be at this point. i will take life as it comes.
do i have worries? yes, who doesn't in life and those of us with panic disorder have way more than the regular population. hysteria is the word. i again urge nate and all other to stay the f*** away from those sites and after me checking it out i will also from now on.
also i just went to the site to count the stories to back my statements that compared to millions upon millions of users, there are 30 stories. i did that research last nite then snooped around a bit and wasn't impressed. as i stated before, those 30 people, including stevie haha had some horrible medical advice, abused there drugs, tried to go cold turkey and went about everything in the absolute WORST possible way. i must admit reading them did put me in a mood. everyone is suseptible to these things. i myself will stay away! as per my own observations, my docs orders and also cuz of your suggestions and most of all because it's rubbish. i'd love to see an international conference on benzo's and have our leading dr.'s that have worked with patients over the longterm be there and then have ashton be there. she'd be the person who was scared to speak, embarassed that every single thing she sites, is outdated, wrong and misinformed. call a spade a spade and a duck a duck....QUACK!
ryan...your not gonna be able to stay away from this site....it needs you....that's just the way it is....you will drop in from time to time....that's part of you that wants to help people, part of you that also wants to be a doc. the part of you that knows there are people on here and other sites being misinformed...hate to say it bro...but till med school gets really tricky and time consuming...you are still gonna be a poster here and i thank God for that! it's where you belong! haha life's crazy that way..we all appreciate you!
Great thread.....very informative.
That was all very useful info. in your posts. I guess I didn't interpret her info. the same way, but in all, everything I read has helped me - both the good and bad.
The important thing is that this site has been a great source of info. for me as well as the supportive comments that I receive. It's been instrumental in my weaning process.
Thanks for your feedback - doesn't offend me if any of it's critical of my postings.
But more importantly, where is Nate right now and how is he doing?
I am actually feeling substantially better.... I started a program called Label Me Sane and, at first I thought it was probalbly a hoax but I have to tell you after taking one of the supplements for a day I felt a little better... the second day I felt even better.... Now I am on the third day and I have to tell you form not being able to hardly move at all to being able to walk around the house and do housework astounds me we wil see it's still early but alot of my symptoms have subsided.... Shaking gone... Numbness gone.... Antisocialism gone.... I am still feeling some of the effects but like I said it is still early...
Thank You all for being there I appreciate that and I know I haven't been on in a while but I am slowly getting me back..... I am still in the Pre-taper phase and will be on it for another week and then I will start tapering my Ativan by 5% per week.... Not to Omit any of the suggestions that Ryan, Jay or any of my other dear friends have put forth but I have found a program that seems to work... . Which I am happy about...
If anyone would like to check it out I encourage you too www.labelmesane.com
their products include: Protect(GSH Builder) Glutathione buider which is your bodies master antioxidant.... This stuff has helped alot...... Sleep: which addresses Insomnia and also detoxifies the brain while you sleep.... Works in conjuction with the Protect to detoxify the brain and body.... Calm which has been used for over a thousand years to promote relaxation when Anxiety erupts.... It is Milk Peptide(Acts like a natural benzo) no side effects.... and MOOD pharmaceutical grade Omega3 which helps with obviously mood.... So for anyone trying to get off benzos with little withdrawl or side effects I strongly recommend Label Me Sane... IT Works God Bless... I am feeling better day by day... Nate()