How to reduce elevated creatinine in very old healthy cat ?

[francoise_peace]

Hello, my cat is not sick yet, it is a female of 19yo or more (found in September 1991), and she has 23,3mg/L of CREA (<24), so still not kidney, but my two other cats dyed of kidney with CREA that went up very fast.
Veterinary prescribed Fortekor 2.5 one by day for prevention.
Her Urea is normal, although she had drink and eat before blood test, it is 0,524g/L. But she drinks a lot: each time she awakes up she wants food and water.
In veterinary there is Epakitin, there is still a lot left from the 2other cats, Veterinary says I can give her. But here they don't sell Azodyl. I don't know if it is good and if we can give without prescription. And if there is something else known there that has got no secondary effects.
And for food I have Royal Canin RENAL wet and dry, although she licks the wet but don't eat it and eats the dry. But I just read it's better to try wet furthermore she is overweight 4.05kg, has osteoporosis and takes Cosequin. Cosequin allows her to be more active and flexible when she takes it and Veterinary says Cosequin is no danger for kidney.
Thank you for all your advices.

[Robens]

Re Constipation. For my CRF Cat - if you have a human food product like Weeties or Weetbix. Sprinkle 1/2 tspn in food. And as for Fortekor or other tablets, ask your Vet for a few hyperdermic needles. (You won't need steel needle) The rest ***** up fluid well. (tablets mixed with little water & squashed petfood to remove taste). Inject into side of mouth slowly to avoid lung ingestion, little bits at time, with towel wrapped round front chest of Cat. Turkey variety has more platelet making capacity (Vit K) than chicken, & turkey was the only food my cat ate other than raw chickn sometimes, all with phosphorus binder Ipakitin. Unfortunately if you Google "Is Aluminium bad for cats, scientists say it DOES harm. I'm sure my cat was going a bit mad so I stopped. They should have a tip of a Multi B & Vit D also. And when heating Sub-Qs, be careful to only sit bag in hot water for short while (off the heat) as heating plastic too hot releases bad toxins.

[francoise_peace]

*****************************************************************************************************
*****************************************************************************************************

Please, DonnaYav and Opus88, go to my new post if you want to get news from Minou:

> After being cured from Chronic Renal Failure - convalescence and related problems

http://www.medhelp.org/posts/Cats/After-being-cured-from-Chronic-Renal-Failure---convalescence-and-related-problems/show/1341949

I'll also answer if you post here, even if this post is a lot long :)

Good luck for your cats, they are the heart and the soul of their owner, and they all deserve the best we can do for them !

******************************************************************************************************
******************************************************************************************************

[francoise_peace]

About my cat - I cannot understand blood levels - I know she is saved. But I don't know if for a while or for always. Vet said to continue treatment. Here I did a wait period, I'm waiting for her probiotics from Canada, they were sent on 4th September, and they still did not arrive. If they arrive next week, I'll have to continue treatment.

But the problem is I don't know if her Urea and her Phosphate gets too low, if she could fall sick of something else ?

I'm thinking about making a convalecense new post ?

[opus88]

Makes me very ill! I haven't read these yet Donna however I have read others as well as tv documentaries about the pet food industry and lack of regulation.

Please start a New Post and again give out these websites and comments, not all our members are following this long thread on creatine levels. So if you start a new thread and label it 'pet foods' or similar it should attract attention.

thx enjoy your w/e too
♥Opus

[DonnaYav]

here are a few websites If you want to read  on bi-products and what goes into our pets food.

Decide for yourself....form your own opinion...

www.bornfreeusa.org- put in their search box on left "pet food"

www.naturalnews.com-same, put in "pet food "

www.hugsandstitches.com/petfood.htm, this one does get into depth and some may find this sickening...not for people with weak stomachs ..however, a very good read...

Have a great weekend

[francoise_peace]

She had turkey as canned mature from Science Hills. If only they could do at least 14+ and not 7+. She didn't throw herself on it, but she ate it in the morning with Renal Special from Royal Canin. I think she'll get used to it because there is 24 and finally, it is very small cans you cannot find online. Now Science Hills only sells for vets what they don't sell online, dry was a bad surprise only because it's for 7+ not for 14+, but wet was a good surprise.

About by-products, the only one I wouldn't trust is the beef ones, because of the crazy cow disease that even vegetarians that once tried meat got, and I'm vegetarian. So I don't trust crazy cow. But other by-products, I don't know.

[francoise_peace]

Be cautious, because most vets think when phosphorus levels got high, it is almost impossible to get back. They prefer advising phosphate binder therapy before the phosphate gets high.

[DonnaYav]

The prebiotic FOS (fructoosaccharide), used in the probiotic  is a soluble , non-digestible carbohydrate that passes through the digestive tract basically UNALTERED.In the colon, this prebiotic is utilized by the beneficial bacteria for growth and proliferation .
Since it is not digested , it is perfectly safe for Diabetics..It also has been studied in "humans" to have benefits of actually lowering cholesterol levels (slightly) and studied in "humans" and animals with Diabetes and this prebiotic does not raise Blood Glucose levels..

My cat's Blood Glucose is not high, I think I posted "two years ago my cat's Blood Glucose levels were high but after putting her on a grain free low carb canned food her levels have been fine"..Sometimes just getting the animal off of dry food, losing some weight, if they are considered obese will be enough , sometimes not..
She was on a Diabetic prescription canned food from the vet, Purina D/M but easily tired of it so we went to a good quality canned food instead.

Problem is, with prescription diet for Diabetes, it was too high in Phosphorus, the Prescription diet for kidneys is too high in Carbohydrates ..

Thanks for the info , I look at the prescription diets from Hill's Science Diet, Purina, etc.. and I don't see good quality ingredients, yes they are low in Protein(that is a debatable subject whether it is good for them or not) , phosphorus and sodium, plus they probably add a bit more potassium and b vitamins, but I don't like the "by products" and the "corn" or grains they put in, that is just a cheap filler..
The Diabetic prescription diets are about the same, "by products", etc...a high quality no grain canned cat food will basically do the same as the Prescription Diabetic management canned foods...
I am NOT saying they are horrible but you would think they could skip the "by products" and cats do not need Grains, especially corn..

Phosphorus levels, my cat's level was not beginning to reach the stage of being high, last time we had it checked but who knows now so when we go on the 28th ,we will find out.
If it has gone up then I must decide which phosphorus binder to use..
I have been trying to feed her only canned foods that are equal and sometimes lower than the Prescription Kidney diet canned foods..

Thanks for the info, glad your kitty is doing well..

[francoise_peace]

You can always make a special Renalzin request at Medic Animal (UK site), their price are low for this medicine and they accept making arrangements, if I were you, I'll order 150ml and replace it instead of Epakitin, that's the one that made my cat phosphorus go lower, but Renalzin is stronger than Epakitin because it works. So your cat must eat something. Renalzin was a human medicine Fosrenol, adapted to cats, and I had read surveys about Fosrenol, end-life patients human that were going to die of kidney, did die of other disease, they lasted 2years but they were already almost dead. That's how I new it had an effect.

And I mixed it with my probiotics, so if your probiotics doesn't contain chemical, and only contains bacterias (plus sugar), I highly recommend you to mix chemical Renalzin with bacterias probiotics. In my opinion it protects stomach and bowel from lanthanum carbonate edema side effects (that are proven on humans with Fosrenol) and it creates a very efficient medicine to lower both Phos + Urea levels. If your probiotics contains chemical additive, don't mix them, because it will not create the same medicine then for mine. Because molecules are more breakable than atoms and they can change configuration if they meet new chemical molecules, so you never mix 2 chemical things. OK ?

Furthermore with all the medication, my cat that was overweight lost about 1kg, so let her/him eat at her/his want without putting powder or anything your cat dislikes on the food. Show to your cat that his food is safe and give medicine separate from food unless he likes the medicine.

I really think that a strong phosphate binder is important. Bacterias will low Urea, phosphate binder will low Phosphate, if Urea and Phosphate gets lower, Creatinine will get lower, even if your cat looses weight.

http://www.medicanimal.com

We also ship throughout the rest of the world so if you would like us to ship outside of the countries listed in the table above, please contact us by email on ***@**** or by phone on [phone] for quotes on shipping to your location.

Customs regulations for goods shipped outside of EU
You may be subject to import duties, taxes, and/or customs fees which may be imposed by your local government when you receive your package. You are responsible for paying any additional charges for customs clearance. Rates vary by country and by what was ordered so we are not able to supply an estimated cost. Please contact your local post office or customs office to inquire about these charges.

To know where to buy Renalzin in USA, please phone Bayer USA and ask them:
Animal Health
North American Headquarters
PO Box 390
Shawnee Mission, KS 66201
800-255-6517

Furthermore you should also concentrate yourself on your cat's glucose, since you said it's high. Being diabetics (I don't know if high glucose means diabets because I'm not a vet) it's not good with the sugar additives in the probiotics. You'll have to search about what lower glucose. And cat food for diabetic cats recommended by veterinaries does exists:
- Integra Protect Diabetes (Germany)
http://www.zooplus.com/ask?query=diabetes
- Science Hills m/d dry and canned (USA)
http://www.hillspet.com/products/pd-feline-md-feline-weight-loss-low-carbohydrate-diabetic-dry.html

[francoise_peace]

Yes, here there was only Ipakitin/Epakitin too :)

I have choosen Renalzin because I can't give her Aluminium Hydroxyde (phosphate binder from UK).

And because Epakitin did not work on my two other cats.

You are right, do not give corn to your cat. I just said that because I understood why they have choosed that weird ingredient. They will not speak in a non ambigous way, but long ago several labs pet thought it was the psyllium husk that made BUN go down, but for real it is the bacteria that eats it. If your cat can't eat Purina or Hills it's not a problem.

It'll be interesting to ask if a probiotics that goes in the freezer can survive without FOS (some kind of natural sugar extract that a lot of websites says it's not dangerous for diabetes) or will it die after warming (like cryogenics problems) ?

http://vegetarian.lovetoknow.com/Super_Probiotics_Aids_Diabetes
"Super Probiotics Aids Diabetes Research

Diabetes is an autoimmune disease, meaning the body’s defenses become turncoat and attack the bodily organs instead of invading viruses and bacteria. Many people speculate that foods, such as super probiotics, can aid diabetes. Because probiotics appear to strengthen the immune system, the hypothesis is that they can help correct autoimmune diseases, including diabetes.

Unfortunately, much of this research comes from nutritional products manufacturers. Many of these manufacturers have a vested interested in proving that their pills, tablets and supplements work. Many studies, such as one cited in Natural News, do demonstrate improvement in the body’s immune system after taking probiotics, so the temptation is to extend speculation that probiotics can help diabetes, another autoimmune disease. But many more rigorous double-blind studies and other studies still need to be conducted to see whether or not probiotics can indeed help diabetics."

" probiotic, unscented salmon oil and an 1/8 capsule of a very good b complex "
I hope it'll help her.

I have also found this website that compare some probiotics:
http://www.naturs-way.com/pet/Compare_pet.htm
But this one seems more for respiratory system:
http://www.healthyfoodforpets.com/mseliquidrescuesupplement.html
And there is also that one that is GMP certified:
http://www.holisticpetinfo.com/proddetail.asp?prod=Complete_Probiotics_for_Pets

I had heard about probiotics with salmon oil, but I'm not seing them on Google today.

I hope she'll be better. 28th is long... I understand you are worried. I wasn't expecting mine to be that better, I was only expecting a slighter change. She is not eating much actually. And she did not like the dry Hill's food we bought at the vet because it is too big for her teeth. I don't know what was their idea of making such big crocroc. Speaking about Hill's, they also told me in a very ambigous way, and although they do not answer from french e-mails, that in the past they thought that psyllium husk could cure kidney disease, but I think it might rather be the bacteria that eats the psylium husk prebiotics. Anyway this psyllium husk attracts the X thing that can save your cat. So Science Hills gave me a positive feedback on my equation:

Probiavi + Psyllium Husk cat food + Renalzin = Azodyl + Renalzin + other probiotics - Enterococcus thermophilus + Streptococcus thermophilus.

And probiavi think there is also an X factor they don't know what, but they are happy if it's on their product.

So I have two e-mails suggesting the existence of some mutated bacteria or virus or whatever, one saying we did not say it and one saying it's cool to have such thing in our product that can cure CRF. And I still didn't ask Azodyl.

That's all I have.

Mine is not eating much because the new senior food from Science Hill's from vet is too big for her teeth. I also ordered at vet canned from them, but I don't know wich taste will come ? It's because family can pay food from vet. Now we have too much pet food for a cat life at home. And I'll look for a job, so that I'll be able to buy other senior pet foods she might like more. Past month I spent about 100euros in medicine + food from the net, that was no good for my economy, but saved my cat, and I am very happy.

[DonnaYav]

we do not have renalzin here in the U.S., main ingredients Lanthanum carbonate and kaolin with vitamin E.
There is human prescription of the Lanthanum carbonate but that's it.

Looks like all we have is Epakitin (calcium carbonate and chitosan) and aluminum  phosphate binders, sad.....

Also I have tried Purina K/D prescription canned renal formula but my cat will not eat it and I still am careful of any renal formulas that have corn products in them simply for the fact two years ago my cat's blood glucose levels were elevated but have been under control with a no grain, low carb canned food diet..

I am trying just the tiniest(less than a 1/16 tsp) amount of psyillium husk powder, mix it in enough water to make it form a gel and mix it in her food.
She is also getting the probiotic, unscented salmon oil and an 1/8 capsule of a very good b complex.

We have an appointment on the 28th for recheck on her kidney values and to check levels on calcium, phosphorus, potassium and sodium...

Have a great day

[francoise_peace]

And I also don't know of the side effects from this miracle, if considered as whole treatment. For now I'm without my probiotics and waiting for my new ones, because the vet said to go on treatment.

I just changed my cat food to senior.

[francoise_peace]

Probiavi said they also think there is an unknow ingredient in their probiotics, but they don't know what ? Because they have several cases of " miracle " concerning kidney cancer. And all this is amazing and cannot be understood with our knowledge. What type of kidney disease does the unknown bacteria cures ?

It could also be due JUST the probiotics combination wich are ment for the cats and is alike Azodyl but stronger and without psyllium husk or the whole treatment that is maybe also used on other cats with CRF (phosphate binder are widely used among english people and psyllium husk can be found easely on kidney food) ?

I can't tell.

[francoise_peace]

Symptoms: http://www.flickr.com/photos/waterreedshimmer/4970322673/

[francoise_peace]

e-mail sent to: Gaétan Simard ; Animal Health Bayer ; Admin (VetUK) ; contactbayer; Petmeds.co.uk (even if they'll consider it as spam, maybe someone will hear me :))

My cat is cured, so I want a specialist to help us discover the real cure for CRF. This have values of millions of cat lifes and millions of human lifes. The research you must begin values more than any amount of gold on Earth ! It'll be the scientific discover of the year ! So please someone help ! We need the Einstein of microbiology, cancerology and chemicals !

Mon chat est guéri, alors je souhaite qu'un spécialiste nous aide à découvrir la vraie thérapie pour l'insuffisance rénale chronique. Ceci vaut les millions de vies félines et humaines. La recherche que vous devez commencer vaut plus que tout l'or de la Terre ! Ce sera la découverte scientifique de l'année ! Alors s'il vous plaît quelqu'un peut-il nous aider !  On a besoin d'un Einstein de la microbiologie, de la cancérologie et des médicaments chimiques !

http://www.flickr.com/photos/waterreedshimmer/4970322673/

How did I cure my cat from chronic renal failure ?
Comment j'ai guéri mon chat de l'insuffisance rénale chronique (*chronique = qu'on ne peut pas guérir) ?

It was for sure the hole treatment idea. But nothing says if there was some extra bacterias in my cat probiotics that wasn't supposed to be there and that helped my cat to cure and be saved. And nothing says that inside the wet pet food psyllium husk there is a molecule or principle that helped good bacterias winning, because prebiotics are probiotics food. Furthermore Azodyl uses psyllium husk. And nothing says the Renalzin plus the probiotics doesn't create a new medicine more efficient and painless.

C'était certainement toute l'idée du traitement. Mais rien ne dit qu'il y avait des bactéries en plus dans mes probiotiques, qui n'étaient pas censées être là et qui ont soigné et sauvé mon chat. Et rien ne dit que dans le psyllium husk de la nourriture molle pour chats il y a une molécule ou un principe qui a aidé les bonnes bactéries à gagner, parce que les prébiotiques sont la nourriture des probiotiques. De plus Azodyl utilise aussi le psyllium husk. Et rien ne dit que le Rénalzin plus les probiotiques ne créent pas un nouveau médicament plus efficace et moins douloureux.

What I recommend you to do with your cat :
Ce que je vous conseille de donner à votre chat :

Some hours of sun bath in the morning, but not when it is too strong for vitamin D.
1 Unit morning Renalzin for reducing the phosphate (UK) mixed with one 8g spoon of Probiavi for natural defenses (Canada)
Renal wet food (Hill's or Purina) with psyllium husk inside.
Low mineralised water (in France it's Mont Rouscous, but it's written suitable for kidney on it) because it doesn't went through pipe.
½ Fortekor at night.
Cat renal dry food with high taurine like Happy Cat.
Stop Cosequin for a while beecause it contains glucosamine HCL.
Suggest water to the cat several times a day without forcing it.


Quelques heures de bains de soleil le matin, mais pas quand il est trop fort pour la vitamine D.
1 Unité de Rénalzin le matin pour réduire le phosphate (UK) mélangé à une cuillère de 8g de Probiavi pour les défenses naturelles.
Nourriture molle (Hill's ou Purina) avec du psyllium husk à l'intérieur.
De l'eau peu minéralisée (Mont Rouscous) parce qu'elle n'est pas passé par la tuyauterie.
½ Fortekor le soir.
De la nourriture rénale sèche pour chat avec un haut niveau de taurine comme Happy Cat.
Arrêter un peu le Cosequin parce qu'il contient du glucosamine HCL.
Suggérer à son chat de boire de l'eau plusieurs fois par jour sans le forcer.

2 main hypothesis:
2 hypothèses:

Probiavi + Psyllium Husk cat food + Renalzin = Azodyl + Renalzin + other probiotics - Enterococcus thermophilus + Streptococcus thermophilus.

Probiotics + Renalzin = less edemas in the stomach and bowel due to phosphate binder
Des probiotiques + Rénalzin = moins d'édèmes à l'estomac et dans les intestins dûs à la chélation du phosphate

4 consequent hypothesis:
4 hypothèses conséquente :

1) Presence of some unknown benefic bacterias in the probiotics ?
1) Présence d'une bactérie inconnue dans les probiotiques ?

2) Renalzin (chemical) + Probiotiques (bacterias) = new benefic real effects ?
2) Rénalzin (chemical) + Probiotiques (bacterias) = nouveaux effets bénéfiques ?

3) Interaction between prebiotics (psyllium husk, dextrose, yeast or FOS) and probiotics + active principle inside psyllium husk ?
3) Intéraction entre les prébiotiques  (psyllium husk, dextrose, levure ou FOS) et les probiotiques + un principe actif dans le psyllium husk ?

4) High concentration of probiotics (Probiavi added 10% more probiotics for the medicine to support travelling 7 day without refrigeration) ? ( >> 12x10^9 CFU/GR).
4) Haute concentration de probiotiques (Probiavi m'en avait rajouté 10% en plus pour que le médicament supporte le voyage de 7jours par envoi non réfrigéré) ? ( >> 12x10^9 CFU/GR).

* List of supposed bacterias in Probiavi felin probiotics / Liste des bactéries supposées dans les probiotiques Probiavi félin:
Pediococcus Acidophilus
Bifido lactis
Bifido Longdum
Lactobacillus Acidophillus  
Streptococcus Thermophilus
S.Cervisiae (eng. yeast/fr. levure)
FOS (Fructo oligo sacharide)  
And a little dextrose (food grade)

She took with her veterinary acceptance:
Elle a pris, avec l'autorisation de son vétérinaire :

1/2 Fortekor for reducing protein loss (US)
http://www.ah.novartis.com/products/en/fortekor_cat.shtml
1 Unit morning Renalzin for reducing the phosphate (UK) mixed with one 8g spoon of Probiavi for natural defenses (Canada)
http://www.renalzin.co.uk/
http://www.probiavi.com/
+
Renal dry (US and Germany) : she ate a lot Happy Cat dry but too few Science Hills K/D dry because Happy Cat have salt, and although it is not good for her, she prefered food with salt.
http://www.happycat.de/
http://www.hillspet.com/hillspet/utilities/selectLanguage.hjsp
Renal wet (US) : Renal K/D canned, she got used to it and finally prefered it to dry, although she ate a lot Happy Cat. But I insisted a lot with the canned. This is where the psyllium husk comes from.
http://www.hillspet.com/hillspet/utilities/selectLanguage.hjsp
Some Royal Canin Renal Special dry, when she didn't want Science Hills K/D dry.
http://www.royalcanin.com/
Low mineralised water for low sodium and low calcium diets (France)
http://www.mont-roucous.com/presentation.htm
The sun for vitamin D but not too much for not loosing hydratation
She only ate 1 wet Sheba Chicken (UK) in 2 months only because she prefers real slices in the wet and her phosphorus was still ok. But I didn't gave more because I discovered from alike food there could be high doses of sodium and phosphate in it.
http://www.sheba.com/landing/index.htm


I'm not a vet. But here are some of my not scientific opinions on medicine. We discuss between pet owners (Fr – UK – USA). (copy-pasted)
Je ne suis pas un vétérinaire. Mais voici quelques unes de mes opinions non scientifiques sur les médicaments. On discute entre possesseurs de chats malade (Fr – UK – USA). (copié-collé)
source:
http://www.medhelp.org/posts/Cats/How-to-reduce-elevated-creatinine-in-very-old-healthy-cat-/show/1273550

((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((())))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
*******************************************************************************
*******************************************************************************

etc.

[DonnaYav]

out of curiosity , have you had a thyroid profile performed on your cat ?Usually it is included in a complete blood panel..

[DonnaYav]

what symptoms was your cat having ?? and how did you conclude it may be an unknown bacteria in the probiotics?
If this is so, I think the manufacturers of the probiotic should be notified...

[francoise_peace]

:) My cat is cured !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(could be an unknown bacteria in the probiotics...)

[opus88]

Oh yes Bless you little Guy. He lived a long and no doubt well loved life and will forever be in the hearts of the ones that were so dear to him..
RIP Guy!

♥Opus

[DonnaYav]

my sister's 22 year old cat passed away today at home, rest in peace Guy..

[opus88]

found this link on Medhelp, from dr. Osbourne DVM talking about CRF in dogs and cats...these are her views, a good read.

http://www.medhelp.org/posts/Holistic-Care-For-Pets/Chronic-Kidney-Failure/show/1260635?personal_page_id=473886#post_5968079

[DonnaYav]

Opus suggested mixing two tablespoons of water in with the psyillium husk, if you are planning to use 1/8 teaspoon. I am starting out at 1/16 teaspoon, received the probiotic(Iflora healthy pet) and psyillium husk a couple days ago, bought the Natural source brand in powder.
So I am mixing 1 tablespoon water in the husk, mix up, the probiotic, I mix in with her food and I did taste it, no bad taste but I tried to sprinkle it over her food and she wouldn't eat it, so I mix it in her food now instead .
Waiting on the unscented salmon oil to arrive by "Iceland Pure" and also the Life's abundance Natural Instinct canned cat food. I will order some Tiki perhaps next month..

I am calling the vet to set up some labs for no later than the 18th.
Would have been nice if she had been on this regimen for a month to see if it had helped any of her kidney values or not.I think her last labs were in July perhaps.

Have a great day..

[francoise_peace]

http://www.petropics.com/Koolina.htm

Very nice cat food :)
Miam miam !!!

I changed my review about Psyllium Husk, it's only wednesday that I'll know if she's better or not.

((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((())))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
*******************************************************************************
*******************************************************************************
Psyllium husk is a soluble fiber wich use is controversial, it has an effect on bowel movement and on bringing down BUN creatinine level but both effects lack of medical surveys. For digestive system, arguments for and against using it to cure constipation and diarrhea with bad side effects like inpassable stool. For kidney, as a prebiotics it helps good bacterias winning against bad toxic bacterias, so Azodyl (Vétokinol Ipakitin's) mixes it with probiotics like " Enterococcus thermophilus, Lactobacilus acidophilus, and Bifidobacterium longum " to low down urine toxin BUN in CRF. But those studies are still experimental. If you want to try blindly a future medicine that haven't been dicovered, try this equation: Canned food with psyllium husk (Hill's or Purina) + Probiotics with more then 10 billions CFU/g. But don't use the probiotics when your nose will detect mold after a month because the effect can be reverted. Azodyl had a good idea, my equation works for some lucky cats, but we don't know what work and what can be improved in the world of prebiotics + probiotics, because studies are too focused on chemicals. I think we need hydratation + chemicals + something in psyllium husk + something with some probiotics to cure CRF. It's really a futuristic thinking. (As chemical I propose a phosphate binder like Renalzin or Aluminium Hydroxide)
******************************************************************************
******************************************************************************
((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((())))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

But my opinion of Renalzin is still: Watch the edema side effects !!!

[DonnaYav]

Received e-mail from Tiki cat food, by petropics.

"I'm sorry to hear your cat has renal failure.Through our research we've foundthat alot of issues cats and dogs face are a result of malnutrition through various pet foods that cklaim they are healthy.
Our phosphorus levels range from .16-.49 for our cat flavors, so all flavors are perfectly fine for your kitty..DICALCIUM PHOSPHATE is part of our formulation and is a naturally occurring compound in nature in a crystalline form included in trace levels to meet AAFCO requirements. Again, perfectly safe for your kitty.
Furthermore, we have a "no Compromise Food Philosophy " that addresses Real Whole food ingredients, Human Consumable Quality, Impeccable Food Safety Standards, and environmental Responsibility. We use only human grade ingredients, we don't use any fillers, they are all low glycemic index, low magnesium, and low phosphate and have been approved not only for healthy adult maintenance , but also serious wellness diets for animals with CRF, Diabetes, Kidney and Liver Disease., etc.. We haven't come across one special diet we can't feed and vets across the country are beginning to get into holistic foods and treatments because of their experience with Tiki.

We are glad that there are many people like yourself who take the time to research and find a food that is not compromised..We will be adding recommended reading and articles to our website very soon. Please let me know if you have any more questions"

So there you go! Doesn't sound bad, although I would not feed EZ any of the fish but they have come out with chicken which would be more appropriate probably for her..